Saturday, January 12, 2013

Bob Thiel: Is He Really Following In The Footsteps of Polycarp?



Poor Bob Thiel.  He is in such a conundrum right now. He is talking today about the apostolic secession of the leadership of the Church of God and how the men in church through the centuries were ordained and carried on with the "truth."  It seems to be really important to prophet Thiel that this link back to the apostles is noted. The reason being is that prophet Thiel claims he is now the only one carrying the mantle for the 1st century Christianity he claims is valid.

He starts his daily missal stating that he had to cease affiliation with the Living Church of God, of which, he will not name.  How stupid is that?

As most readers now know, it became necessary for me to cease my affiliation with a group based out of North Carolina and form the Continuing Church of God.
 He then tries to defend the silly name he called his personality cult.

So, since the word “continuing” is part of the title, the question to be briefly addressed today is:  Continue what?

First, it needs to be understood that according to Jesus, the church itself would continue and the gates of Hades (death) would not prevail against it (Matthew 16:18).
The prophet uses Hebrews as the scriptural justification for the name of his personality cult:

Let us look at what Jesus and the Apostle Paul taught on this matter:
22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved. When they persecute you in this city, flee to another. 23 For assuredly, I say to you, you will not have gone through the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes (Matthew 10:22-23).

14 For here we have no continuing city, but we seek the one to come (Hebrews 13:14).
Since Christians have no continuing city, it is the Church of God, not some city such as Rome or Alexandria that was supposed to continue to lead Christ’s church.

Prophet Thiel traces the lineage of his new personality cult down through the ages to Polycarp.  The main problem with this is that false prophet Thiel is NOT ordained and cannot be the legitimate heir to the legacy of Polycarp.

Notice that Irenaeus is claiming that Polycarp was appointed bishop (pastor/overseer) of the Church in Smyrna by the apostles in Asia (which would most likely have been John and Philip and perhaps some others) and that Polycarp continued the faith and practices of the original apostles. Notice that Irenaeus is claiming that there was a list of men who have succeeded Polycarp until the late 2nd century and that they held to the teaching of the apostles. Thus the only universally accepted apostle to “bishop” transfer of leadership for the 1st and 2nd centuries that continued until at least the end of the 2nd century was through Polycarp of Smyrna 
Prophet Thiel claims his small personality cults doctrines are exactly like Polycarp's in order to give his little group legitimacy:

So, Polycarp realized that the true church was called the Church of God and that he placed a high priority on the scriptures and the doctrines in them, including the commandments and love.

This is what we in the Continuing Church of God also are striving to do.

Now, here are some of the beliefs that Polycarp and others in the early Church of God held to that we in the Continuing Church of God also hold to. (which I am not listing)

 Prophet Thiel's arrogance continues to grow stronger.  He and his small personality cult are now the only ones that best represent the true remnant.

We in the Continuing Church of God are striving to best represent the most faithful remnant  of the original Church of God that began on Pentecost in Acts 2 (c. 31 A.D.) and we believe and teach the doctrines of the original apostolic and faithful post-apostolic Church of God, and in particular, the Philadelphia-era of the Church of God.
There is nothing original, apostolic or Christan about false prophet Thiel's personality cult.  A personality cult is exactly all his group is.  The few people that have agreed to follow him are obviously weak in their faith, so much so, that they still need a "strong figure" tell them what to believe.  These people have been through at least 3 splinterings to reach Thiel's group (which makes 4).  Worldwide to Global, then Global to Living, then Living to Continuing.  Whats going to happen in 4-5 years when someone stronger than Thiel comes along and discredits hm?  Will group 5 then start?  Then how long till splinter group 6?  Joining the Church of God 7th Day makes far better sense than joining up in another impotent little personality cult.

13 comments:

Anonymous said...

You keep calling it a personality cult. That depends on why people join. If they join because they think it is the closest to the truth, it is not a personality cult.

How much is Meredith paying you?

Anonymous said...

Bob's ordination problem is not a problem. He needs to give a four hour sermon. Wander all over the Bible with stories and prooftexts, throw in some history of WCG and bingo, he can say, "And yes brethren, I am a Prophet."

Worked for Dave Pack. No one on earth thought Dave was an Apostle but in four hours, they learned a bitter lesson in how one gets to be what one wants to be.

Head Usher said...

Apostolic succession is an unprovable and highly unlikely thing. If there is even one break in the chain, then the whole thing is invalid and you're a fake, right? There isn't sufficient documentation to prove an unbroken chain of "ordained" men. But even if there were, why should we assume that a man who has been "ordained" possesses some sort of god-magic that allows him to pass along god-given authority, and, oh yes, god-magic, to whomever he chooses? Ordination. What a silly and meaningless ritual. It's just a way for men to take power, justify their dirty political games, and simultaneously claim that they are your only link to "divinity." Whoever made this shit up was a genius, that is until he ordained his first helper, who probably stabbed him in the back and stole his "mantle."

Douglas Becker said...

Con Church of God following in the footsteps of Polycrap.

Assistant Deacon said...

Ha, DB, I was just about to post the same thing:

PolyCRAP: multiple sources of crap.

Painful Truth said...

The first post up top reads:
"Anonymous said...

You keep calling it a personality cult. That depends on why people join. If they join because they think it is the closest to the truth, it is not a personality cult."
________________________________

In personality cults you follow the leader. Anyone who don't is out.
So yes, it is a personality cult.

Follow the rules Anon:

1: The guru is always right.
2: You are always wrong.
3: No Exit.
4: No Graduates.
5: Cult-speak.
6: Group-think, Suppression of Dissent, and Enforced Conformity in Thinking
7: Irrationality.
8: Suspension of disbelief.
9: Denigration of competing sects, cults, religions...
10: Personal attacks on critics.
___________________________________

Lesson over.

Steve Kisack said...

Polycarp was a Catholic:

"He(Polycarp)spent two hours praying for everyone he had ever known and for the Church, 'remembering all who had at any time come his way -- small folk and great folk, distinguished and undistinguished, and the whole Catholic Church throughout the world'."

He was the BISHOP of Smyrna. This is a Catholic concept which involved one hierarchical leader per city. Titles and offices are not biblical, but had it's origin in the Catholic Church and had been adopted by all of those who frollow Armstrong.

Byker Bob said...

If Bob Thiel simply and humbly advocated personally fulfilling the great commission of Jesus Christ, I don't believe anyone would find anything wrong with that. The problem is with his personal aggrandizement, fantasizing that he is a great prophet, great leader, or part of his imaginary chain of apostles.

You've got a Freudian slip, in the usage of the phrase "apostolic secession", but that slip inadvertently tells the truth of Armstrong origins. Apostolic succession describes the passage of the apostolic torch from generation to generation. The term secession describes the act of seceding as did the Southern States in their quest to retain states' rights. And, yes, Armstrongism did secede from the ranks of the apostles, with its latter day leaders attempting to create a false history for itself. So, using the phrase "Apostolic Secession" to describe Armstrongism is totally accurate!

BTW, HWA called all of the antenicene fathers "Catholic", dismissing them as succeeding heirs to the gospel. Others, up to a certain time and place, called these early leaders "proto" Catholic. Much can be learned from reading their writings, but I know of few past or present ACOG members who have ever taken on such a reading project. A past commenter on some of these sites, Jared Olar, stimulated my interest in these historic figures, and I've read any and all of their writings which I've been able to find ever since.

BB

Anonymous said...

"If Bob Thiel simply and humbly advocated personally fulfilling the great commission of Jesus Christ..."

He is. Jesus died so that humans can be forgiven from breaking the Law. If you try to keep the Law and beg for forgiveness when you break it (which you will), you'll enter into the Kingdom. Romans according to HWA.

Paul Ray

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

"Bob's ordination problem is not a problem. He needs to give a four hour sermon. Wander all over the Bible with stories and prooftexts, throw in some history of WCG and bingo, he can say, 'And yes brethren, I am a Prophet.'"

"Worked for Dave Pack. No one on earth thought Dave was an Apostle but in four hours, they learned a bitter lesson in how one gets to be what one wants to be."



This technique worked for Gerald Flurry too.

One year Gerald Flurry suddenly gave a 5-part sermon series collectively called "That Prophet" in which he claimed to be the prophet mentioned in Deuteronomy 18:18-19. In short order the identity theft was complete and Gerald Flurry--rather than Jesus Christ--became "That Prophet."

It seems like Gerald later had to flip-flop a bit on this and say that Deut. 18:18-19 was referring to Jesus, but Gerald still claimed that some prophet was prophesied to come and kept for himself the title of "That Prophet."

Anonymous said...


"Worked for Dave Pack. No one on earth thought Dave was an Apostle but in four hours, they learned a bitter lesson in how one gets to be what one wants to be."

&

"This technique worked for Gerald Flurry too."


As someone once pointed out, a very serious problem with these self-appointed dictators is that one never knows in advance what all ideas they will come up with. Whatever they do come up with, their followers will be required to go along with it. Either that or else admit that they were duped and stop throwing good time, energy, and money after bad.

Anonymous said...

Polycarp wasn't Roman Catholic anymore than he was Eastern Catholic or Orthodox Steve. Just because these organizations honor him as a saint doesn't mean they can lay claim to him as one of their own. Isn't that just like what Armstrong and his followers have done by claiming likewise eg that Ebionites, Paulicians, Waldensians, etc were the ancestors of the WCG? Plus Polycarp was a quartodeciman for which reason he debated with Anicetus the bishop of Rome at the time who was in favor of observing the Passover on a fixed day of the week (ie Easter Sunday) rather than a fixed day of the year (ie 14 Nisan). I wish there was more records about his and his followers beliefs besides the little fragments of his writings that have survived.

Steve Kisack said...

Anonymous said...
"Polycarp wasn't Roman Catholic anymore than he was Eastern Catholic or Orthodox Steve. Just because these organizations honor him as a saint doesn't mean they can lay claim to him as one of their own."

MY COMMENT: Hmmm. Well, apparently the apostle John didn't lay claim to him. There's not one word about him in John's writings. Why not, if he was such a great and "true" Christian? And, why didn't Polycarp set them straight when they called him a bishop? Did he accept being a bishop? Why? This is totally unbiblical.

"Isn't that just like what Armstrong and his followers have done by claiming likewise eg that Ebionites, Paulicians, Waldensians, etc were the ancestors of the WCG?"

MY COMMENT: Yes, that's erxactly what Polycarp did, claiming that he was a disciple of the apostle John. Again, why didn't ANY of them quote something from the apostle John? What? He didn't say a word about Polycarp? Hmmm!


"Plus Polycarp was a quartodeciman for which reason he debated with Anicetus the bishop of Rome at the time who was in favor of observing the Passover on a fixed day of the week (ie Easter Sunday) rather than a fixed day of the year (ie 14 Nisan)."

MY COMMENT: It really didn't make any difference. The early New Testament Gentile "churches" did NOT keep "holydays". There is no command in the New Testament to keep the sabbath or the "holydays". Those are NOT the signs of a true Christian.

"I wish there was more records about his and his followers beliefs besides the little fragments of his writings that have survived."

MY COMMENT: Even if there was, what difference would it make? Many don't believe what has already been written, which I quoted from above. We all have our minds made up.