Saturday, November 19, 2016

Dave Pack: Some in UCG, LCG, and PCG condemned to "everlasting shame and contempt"





Salvation is only available in the Resorted Church of God  People tin the various COG's that reject Dave now and will do so again in the future.  They are damned to "everlasting shame and contempt."
But many brethren died in United and Living and PCG—outside the Body of Christoutside God’s government—and they have a chance to come back and help, and some of them are going to succeed and go on to everlasting life, and some are going to fail and go on to everlasting shame and contempt. They, literally, come back—a resurrection of the dead—come back and are given a chance, a second time, to do the right thing and if they do it wrong again, they get everlasting shame and contempt. But, boy, will we need teachers!

16 comments:

Byker Bob said...

Has he adapted the Mormon doctrine on this? The Mormons teach that at the resurrection, people will be given a total explanation of what is real, what is right, and what is wrong. Then, fully informed, they will be offered a choice as to which way they want to go, ie, their first real opportunity to choose life or death. As I've stated elsewhere, I am not LDS, and have no intention of becoming LDS. However, when this doctrine was explained to me, it immediately clicked. With the assault of all of the confusing religions and various claims that are made not only through faith-based organizations, but also through science, and through conspiracy theories, this is the only way in which a loving God would treat or develop His children. It is consistent with the lesson provided to St. Thomas by Jesus.

As per usual, though, here we have an Armstrongite splinter group leader usurping it. He is taking a wonderful and beautiful thing and making it ugly, subverting it to his own foul advantage in such a way as to convince people that they will ultimately be forced to accept the crappy way in which he, Dave Pack, wields authority and for all eternity. As I've said before, Mr. And Mrs. Pack should have named their son "Dick".

If Dave ends up becoming this obstacle as he says he will, a lot of people who would otherwise choose life are going to willingly choose death.

BB

Anonymous said...

No man can speak for God, including me, right here, right now.
Who are you going to listen to?

Anonymous said...

BB, we already know 'what is real, what is right, and what is wrong.' We know this because it is in our bibles. In fact, we are commanded to keep expanding our understanding of what is real, right etc by scriptures such as 'prove all things..' etc. We already know enough to determine 'which way we want to go.' We do not need perfect wisdom and understanding in order to build character.

This is just more gibberish from Dave. Reading his material makes me feel embarrassed for the man. Has he no pride or self respect?

Byker Bob said...

1:04, the Bible is often sparse in its verbiage, leaving big windows open for interpretation. I've found that the more I think I know, the more questions come into play. In many cases, people can be trapped, as we all were in Armstrongism, in a simultaneous condition of both naivety, and arrogance. And the ministers held us in that condition, often grieving the Holy Spirit, by making any differences in understanding a salvation issue.

If you base your understanding of the Bible soley on the teachings of Herbert W. Armstrong, you may want to indulge in a bit more of the independent research that was always forbidden right after baptism. "Prove all things" was only encouraged up until you were baptized. There was no continuous testing of what they said after that.

BB

Anonymous said...

From what I remember of the days of HWA and the original WCG, those that turned their back on the truth and God would experience the second death. Ok this scenario might apply to someone like myself who left the church in 1970's. I would be resurrected after the millenium, the Last Great Day? and thrown into the Lake of Fire. I would be put with the goats and be nashing my teeth (so everyone will have teeth at this event). At the same time I would see the sheep in glowing white robes next to God, awaiting the glories of eternity. I hope I get to see the various leaders of WCG and they are recognizable, then I won't mind so much been cast into the fire. Or is there some chance these characters will not be recognizable in their eternal body? while I will be there in shame nashing my teeth. I suppose with all the billion of humans I might not be noticed......... Now why would God be resurrecting someone just to sentence and kill them forever, why not leave them dead?

Black Ops Mikey said...

The question is, will David Pack continue to succumb to his psychotic delusions which will lead to a Jim Jones / Jonestown conclusion?

Anonymous said...

Many Christian denominations teach that salvation is only possible if one is a member of their group. It's a lying ploy to chain their members to the group. A Christian is one that follows Christ rather than attends a certain denomination. When believed, it's not uncommon for members to commit suicide when expelled from that group.

Black Ops Mikey said...

While we are concerned about people committing suicide when expelled from a group, with Armstrongism these days, we're starting to be concerned about the whole group committing suicide under the direction of their nutty leaders....

Anonymous said...

ahhh, so Dave is the one appointed Judge of men.....glad you cleared that up for me.

Anonymous said...

"Has he adapted the Mormon doctrine on this? The Mormons teach that at the resurrection, people will be given a total explanation of what is real, what is right, and what is wrong. Then, fully informed, they will be offered a choice as to which way they want to go, ie, their first real opportunity to choose life or death. As I've stated elsewhere, I am not LDS, and have no intention of becoming LDS. However, when this doctrine was explained to me, it immediately clicked"

What do you think the COG view is on this? How does the above differ from the COG view as you understand it?

Byker Bob said...

7:55, you are serious, right?

In the WCG version, HWA explaining his crap to you in this life counted as if God had explained His truth to you. In the Mormon version, there isn't any soul sleep involved. You die. Immediately thereafter, you are presented with the choice, you make it, and are sent to the place appropriate to that choice. In the HWA version, about 99% of all the people who ever lived in the entire history of planet Earth will live for 100 years, "qualifying" for the free gift of salvation by being ruled over with rods of iron by the spiritual dictators previously groomed by Armstrongism. Those who qualify get to live under Armstrongism for all eternity. And somehow, they see this as being a reward rather than being eternal punishment.

BB

nck said...

BB, that explanation is a travesty of the actual teaching.

The "rod of iron" was only about Christs return presenting himself to mankind.

Only wcg members were supposed to have heard "the truth". But it Gods prerogative to judge who of those members was really converted to qualify for leadership positions.

The millenium is only about those people who survived WWIII.

After the millenium there would be the great resurrection where the majority of mankind would get their first chance for salvation.

As I recall.

But there could be more technicalities involved.

nck

Anonymous said...

5.43 PM you ask why would God resurrect people to judge them, even if to eternal death?
The reason God will do that is called civilization. It is a expression of the preciousness of human life. Ministers treat life as cheap, so I understand why many can't comprehended this.

Retired Prof said...

Anonymous Nov. 21, at 8:37 AM, I am not 5:43, but I can't help noting that your words do nothing whatever to answer that person's question, "why not leave them dead?"

You say "The reason. . . is called civilization." But civilizations have laws against torture, which is what you are recommending. Awaking people from unconsciousness so that they can be subjected to humiliation, terror, agony, and death is the very epitome of uncivilized behavior. It does not express the preciousness of human life in any way.

Besides that, it is highly inefficient. If the goal is to get permanently rid of those who fail to qualify for the kingdom, then the least wasteful course is to simply leave them oblivious. Best go ahead and get the saints started learning the jobs they will carry out from then on (whatever those might be), not delay the real work with an elaborate spectacle of superfluous cruelty.

Unless, of course, this spectacle is the first step in their training for the jobs they will carry out from then on in the service of an evil god.

Byker Bob said...

It would also be a lot less painful for beings in the Kingdom to be able to think, "Uh Oh! So and so didn't make it!", rather than having watched them actually burn alive right before their very eyes.

Personally, I wonder if the ancients had any word for "oxydize". It's a longer term process, but basically, the same things happen in oxydation as in burning. Matter is transformed, and energy is spent or released.

BB

Anonymous said...

Retired prof, murderers in todays world get a trial, and a pronouncement from a judge. The same will happen come judgment day. I think it self evident that this use of time is a expression of the fact that life is precious, both of the victims and the criminal. You seem to not comprehend that man is made in Gods image, and hence precious. This is the axiomatic, so I can say no more.
The weeping and gnashing of teeth is a normal reaction to the sentence rather than some external torture. My bible does not say that people will be thrown ALIVE into the lake of fire. It only says that regarding the Beast and false prophet.