tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post6976421404823344980..comments2024-03-28T01:47:50.775-07:00Comments on Banned by HWA! News and Observations About Armstrongism and the Church of God Movement: Proclamations from Religious Authority Do Not Change the FactsNO2HWAhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02018654662518613623noreply@blogger.comBlogger48125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-16942082079648627402017-06-14T02:14:08.109-07:002017-06-14T02:14:08.109-07:00Hahah,
The word hair is mentioned 22 times on thi...Hahah,<br /><br />The word hair is mentioned 22 times on this thread.<br /><br /><br />"I do not reject the speaker's message because of his hair. I just choose to not listen to him because of his hair. If someone with the same message comes along who is more presentable, I might listen, if I have nothing better to do at that moment."<br /><br /><br />And off you are, sailing to Australia in chains, for contempt of court and the British Judge.<br /><br />ncknckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-41694699599344080062017-06-13T19:36:38.717-07:002017-06-13T19:36:38.717-07:00I do not reject the speaker's message because ...I do not reject the speaker's message because of his hair. I just choose to not listen to him because of his hair. If someone with the same message comes along who is more presentable, I might listen, if I have nothing better to do at that moment. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-9271548544770688422017-06-12T00:20:27.308-07:002017-06-12T00:20:27.308-07:00I hope my lengthy explanation got through.
This b...I hope my lengthy explanation got through.<br /><br />This better explains how it works and why it was so important for HWA to have his lineage traced back to David.<br /><br />It is the medieval way of claiming legitimacy to kingship.<br />Kinda like how millions were spent to search for JFK's son in the ocean. We tend to value mythical connections to mythical leaders. It's in our DNA.<br /><br /><br />http://www.habsburger.net/en/chapter/quest-blue-blood-habsburgs-fictitious-ancestors<br /><br />ncknckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-4440492683854763772017-06-11T23:52:05.652-07:002017-06-11T23:52:05.652-07:00Hi BB,
No. What is typical is that I havel always ...Hi BB,<br />No. What is typical is that I havel always provided sources when kindly asked. <br />The reason I hesitate is because some might use them as a validation for Armstrongist theories.<br /><br />1st. Terminology. I agree that names of the regions have changed due to politics. I mean the Turkish people moved into present day Turkey in only the 15th century from the plains of Central Asia. I wouldn’t mind if they left that area to the Greek and Romans again. Non of the black population in South Africa lived in that area prior to 1650 AD. Except for the Koikoi (bushmen) and one other tribe of cow herders. So their claim to territory is as good as the White population at this point. The Arab in North Africa and current Israel and Syria moved in from the 8th century onward. And no the pharaos of Egypt were NOT black. (although there might have been one or two in a row of hundreds)<br /><br />So what does current DNA traces prove? That migratory persons like Dennis and others descended from other migratory peoples. Whenever DNA is matched with ANCIENT BONES and not with current peoples in a certain region living there currently one gets an interesting picture indeed. <br /><br />I am referring to the ancient bones match.<br /><br />To keep it simple I will quote easily readable sources. <br /><br />Irish – Middle Eastern connections<br />https://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/dec/28/origins-of-the-irish-down-to-mass-migration-ancient-dna-confirms<br /><br />Western Asia – Danube connections.<br />http://www.itechpost.com/articles/5340/20130211/prehistoric-middle-east-migrants-brought-farming-europe.htm<br /><br />Medieval sources for german assyrianism.<br /><br />The Gesta Treverorum (archbishops of trier anouncement)<br /><br />The Austrian Chronicle of 95 seigneurs. Talking about assyrian princesses intermarrying the Austrian nobles.<br /><br />Gottfried Hagens Reimchronik<br /><br />Bayerische Chronik, the official history of Bavaria written by Johannes Turmair of Abensberg in the 1500s<br /><br />And I could go on and on. All fascinating reading for alternative historians.<br />However. I do not for one moment believe these primary sources validate german assyrianism as perpetuated in armstrongism. <br /><br />The only point that I was making was that these ideas did not originate with HWA. But did originate in writing in the middle ages.<br /><br /><br />What I do believe is that these histories echo the contemporary political situation when they were written. Provided the rulers of the day with “ancient genealogies” and therefore “legitimacy” to rule. And moreover the original ORAL history might just echoe the true “original” location of said peoples. (like the black sea region”) Although the scientific time frame of the migration patterns in no way fits the Armstrongist time frame.<br /><br />That’s all.<br /><br />nck<br />nckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-66281427437802984712017-06-11T17:17:04.193-07:002017-06-11T17:17:04.193-07:00If you want to talk science, nck, it's the dna...If you want to talk science, nck, it's the dna that provides the markers that tell us specifically who crossed what seas and migrated up or down what rivers to settle whatever areas. Theories about tribes or sifting for purity are no longer relevant because today we can analyze dna and know precisely the degree of purity, or mixture each person is. Or, not, if people choose to shut out the latest and best available information.<br /><br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-35924761975508070252017-06-11T15:54:18.950-07:002017-06-11T15:54:18.950-07:00See also "Mitochondrial Eve".
BBSee also "Mitochondrial Eve".<br /><br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-66653027394357366972017-06-11T15:49:09.260-07:002017-06-11T15:49:09.260-07:00So, still no footnotes, references, or corroborati...So, still no footnotes, references, or corroborating source materials? Kind of typical!<br /><br />Also, (and I quote Wikipedia here), "Due to the geographic ambiguity and Eurocentric nature of the term "Middle East", some people prefer use of the terms Arab World, WANA (West Asia and North Africa), or the less common NAWA (North Africa-West Asia). Both the Arab World and MENA (Middle East, North Africa) region remain the most common terms and are used by most organizations, academia, and political entities flexibly, including those in the region itself."<br /><br />Why the quote? Dennis and others here have had their genealogies traced more specifically back to Africa. If, by your term "Middle East", you actually mean MENA, NAWA, or WANA, there is still an opportunity for your unsourced assertion to be partially correct. Africa is called "Mother Africa" for some very good reasons.<br /><br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-41874963844096861592017-06-11T13:51:19.656-07:002017-06-11T13:51:19.656-07:00Oh I just saw your question about the linguistic c...Oh I just saw your question about the linguistic connections.<br /><br />There are many connections between the saxon language and the ancient Sanskrit from the Hindy Vedas but again we will meet on the square that this does not in any way validate the theory of Israeli migration into Europe.<br /><br />Nordic types descending from olive skinned, dark haired brown eyed people???????????????????<br />Oh man. WE ALL DO, even the red head neanderthal aussie girls with scottish names. I thought you were versed in darwinism and the rules for selection?? I know you are.<br /><br />Of course as I said and I repeat. Non of the science validates the supposed 600 bc tribal migration. I am talking real science only, always.<br /><br />nck nckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-52189699962220515622017-06-11T13:44:48.937-07:002017-06-11T13:44:48.937-07:00BB
I said that the junk science originated with t...BB<br /><br />I said that the junk science originated with the medieaval monks, both the myths about the Tuathe de Danaan and the Assyrian connection. It did not originate with HWA. So I believe you call it "a straw man" when you ask me for proof about the connection. I said the monks perpetuated junk science and local myths in order to establish "blood ties" for the local nobility and thus legitimize their claim to power.<br /><br /><br />By the way ALL people descend from the middle east and recent finds connect ancient Irish and peoples from the Danube to the Middle East. That is pure unadultareded science.<br /><br />HOWEVER we will meet on the square that non of the science meets the "armstrongite time frame criteria" but I would wish everyone to stop denying that peoples from the middle east moved along the Danube into Europe.<br /><br />nck<br /><br />nckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-86714348909270854802017-06-11T13:00:42.942-07:002017-06-11T13:00:42.942-07:00Do you have any medieval or primary sources provin...Do you have any medieval or primary sources proving that the Germans, Deutche, or Allemandes are descended from the Assyrians (a completely different race)??? How do Nordic types descend from olive skinned, dark haired, brown eyed people? Where are the linguistic and cultural connections?<br /><br />Some of our readers here probably consider the Bible to be the ultimate primary resource without realizing or acknowledging that it is not the Bible so much, it is rather Herbert W. Armstrong's interpretaions and modifications that are their primary sources. That is fatally flawed thinking!<br /><br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-31792419703790909262017-06-11T08:50:53.384-07:002017-06-11T08:50:53.384-07:00What's your preference in violence, Anonymous ...What's your preference in violence, Anonymous 4:04? Knives? Guns? MMA?<br /><br />LOL!<br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-85408129110142644432017-06-10T10:55:17.940-07:002017-06-10T10:55:17.940-07:00[You cannot discover anything "ancient" ...[You cannot discover anything "ancient" that implies young. IMHO. :) Zircon crystals, discovered as the oldest on earth to date at 4.2 billion don't imply a "very young planet." They imply the 4.2 billion year old + planet, when it was younger than we thought, cooled in a mere 160 million years and had abundant water sooner than expected. That is just better science if proven so. Much upheaval and extinctions were to follow including a couple "Snow Ball Earths"]<br /><br />So now the "scientific" speculation you propose (and it is speculation) makes an already improbable story get even more fantastic. A very hot collection of gasses and solar material form into a planet, cools to a temperature where standing water can rest on the surface and even develops deep oceans and atmosphere - all within a mere 160 million years. <br /><br />That may satisfy you - but no serious scientist would have claimed that previously. In fact, that story is still being told on the nature channel with the earth cooling over many hundreds of millions of years - a billion or so (give or take a few million) - completely ignoring the implications of recently discovered, ancient zircon crystals. <br /><br />Lets cut to the chase. You have an initial bias (which is your prerogative) that insists all that is came from non sentient forces. Yet the universe runs on repeatable, discoverable laws that are ONLY of interest to sentient beings. The universe is infinitely complex, but its not capricious. It's workings are repeatable and discoverable. If it were capricious, nothing could be known for certain and sentient intelligence would be of no use at all. <br /><br />Capriciousness is a qualitative state that implies either the absence of rules enforced by intelligence or a disregard for rules/order. That implication alone should give one pause in thinking that non sentient forces are responsible for all that exists.<br /><br />In any case, I think Aaron's videos may be suitable for refuting simple falsehoods from simplistic religious folk who build museums featuring men riding on the back of dinosaurs. But they don't really rise to an intelligent debate over design versus random chance. His refutations of the biblical flood story can also be challenged since much of it addresses either traditions associated with the story or misconceptions of the biblical account.<br /><br />In any case, everyone must draw their own conclusions on these matters. We are obliged to apply the intelligence we naturally possess but didn't build or create. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-90778287341717535122017-06-10T04:04:38.047-07:002017-06-10T04:04:38.047-07:00"The interesting thing is that if you Google ..."The interesting thing is that if you Google so many of the myths we were taught, you find Armstrong influenced sources as the primaries coming up in your search. "Is Germany Assyria?" yields quotations from "Dr." Hoeh's discredited and self-repudiated "Compendium of World History" as an example. Wikipedia articles on these topics cite Herbert W. Armstrong and the earlier Worldwide Church of God as main proponents. Even blogs not run by former Armstrongites occasionally reference Herbie and Hoeh. And, others come forward in rebuttal citing actual history. If the Armstrongite sources were properly set aside, there would be very little mention of British Israelism, German Assyrianism, Native American Canaanism, and other like topics. Those are all based on junk history and theories that pure examples of peoples who existed in ancient Biblical times must exist somewhere in the world today. In other words, the visible process of assimilation is not taken into account, and this is done purely for the benefit of prophecy."<br /><br /><br />That is because google is a "secondary source" not a primary source.<br /><br />Most of the theories, junk history etc are based on medieval sources being roman catholic monks recording "local traditions and myths". <br /><br />Although Armstrong was the most succesfull disseminator of said flawed histories, he was certainly not the originator of German Assyrianism, British Israelism etc etc. <br /><br />Mostly the medieval sources served to establish, solidify and explain the power of the European nobility and especially the monarchs and the emperors of the roman german empire and of course the later british empire whose ascend to power could only be ascribed to "the power of god and his blessing" never on the sinful nature of the people. Totally missing the point that sin like covetousness and self centeredness and competition is the engine that propelled the anglo saxon world forward.<br /><br />The American empire is the epitomization of all that and HWA and his philosophy was a perfect fit for the times of the ascend of the American worldwide empire now rapidly being replaced by the times of the gentiles. (and their application of technology)<br /><br />nck <br />nckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14580008070423402328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-6658322699845858932017-06-10T04:04:27.381-07:002017-06-10T04:04:27.381-07:00Byker Bob and Allen Dexter do a lot of trash talk,...Byker Bob and Allen Dexter do a lot of trash talk, easy to talk shit about people on the www, but I bet face to face you had better watch what you say. I never back down from a fight. We should meet and see what your words are worth. Get back to me and we will get in touch in person!!!<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-78179555801273010742017-06-09T19:01:25.890-07:002017-06-09T19:01:25.890-07:00So called big bang scientists (actually nothing mo...So called big bang scientists (actually nothing more than textbook readers) keep updating their "science" just like Bible readers Flurry and Pack (formerly Herb and Rod) keep updating their "prophecies". One old "cosmologist" or "prophet" dies and a new one takes his place with a few revisions. This proves the wisdom of Solomon, who said there is no end to books or blogs that don't know what they are talking about. It all proves that he was right: there is nothing new under the sun (except for those damn cell phones). The universe did not start in big bang. The once Al-Mighty Inescapable God-Killing Second Law of Thermodynamics is now on the ropes--it only works for near-equilibrium conditions, which makes it almost laughable for much of the cosmos, which is made of plasma, as I've been telling you people for years now. Sorry about that. The supposed Invincible Greater Than Any God Second Law works well in a test-tube or refrigerator but not out in the universe. Big Bang my Butt. The universe is cyclic. It keeps going and going. God is the ever-ready bunny. All my life is a circle, as one musician put it. <br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-61333669168424631022017-06-09T18:46:30.604-07:002017-06-09T18:46:30.604-07:00... There is no challenge or need for a sentient f...... There is no challenge or need for a sentient force ... <br /><br />Well, the universe itself is a sentient force. So chew on that for a while. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-43107044605057643442017-06-09T18:44:47.985-07:002017-06-09T18:44:47.985-07:00Some who comment on here a LOT are small minded pe...Some who comment on here a LOT are small minded people too. It's bad enough to have to read their ignorance, but it can be amusing. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-9143809409106058632017-06-09T18:35:42.431-07:002017-06-09T18:35:42.431-07:00It may be amusing to BB. It's just plain astou...It may be amusing to BB. It's just plain astounding to me. <br /><br />Allen C. DexterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-29841912765197963792017-06-09T14:25:55.482-07:002017-06-09T14:25:55.482-07:00Armstrongism always had a collection of quirky ins...Armstrongism always had a collection of quirky institutionalized habit patterns generally not found amongst more educated, or deeper thinking individuals. The ministers often set examples of invalidating the people with whom they disagreed by attacking their physical attributes rather than addressing their ideas. They also widely questioned or lampooned their opponents' sincerity. So, of course, the minute you display a picture of a man with long hair, an Armstrongite isn't going to even wait to hear what the unsuspecting guy has written or said. That's already been invalidated by the hair.<br /><br />Oh well. Good to not have such small minded people close to me. It's bad enough to have to read their ignorance, although it is occasionally amusing.<br /><br />BBByker Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15602697337552385535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-33163651366886835002017-06-09T13:50:38.974-07:002017-06-09T13:50:38.974-07:00https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwbK9jkQHJM
What ...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwbK9jkQHJM<br /><br />What zircons can tell usDennisCDiehlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10417850852638492246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-27233621836434908082017-06-09T13:42:24.952-07:002017-06-09T13:42:24.952-07:00" I'm more interested in his facts and ar..." I'm more interested in his facts and arguments - not constantly hearing his opinion on "creationists"."<br /><br />His niche is addressing creationism and the fight to keep it out of public education as an alternative to science. He is running for State Legislature in Texas to continue his work in education.<br /><br />Anon said:<br />"The discovery of ancient zircon crystals formed from the earliest history of the earth imply a very young planet that was not hot, had deep water already present and no known conditions that prevented it from being habitable. That's a real challenge to a narrative that assumes only natural, non-sentient forces were responsible. "<br /><br />You cannot discover anything "ancient" that implies young. IMHO. :) Zircon crystals, discovered as the oldest on earth to date at 4.2 billion don't imply a "very young planet." They imply the 4.2 billion year old + planet, when it was younger than we thought, cooled in a mere 160 million years and had abundant water sooner than expected. That is just better science if proven so. Much upheaval and extinctions were to follow including a couple "Snow Ball Earths"<br /><br /> Water is thought to have arrived in the heavy bombardment by comets and meteors and chemically when h and o2 found each other over millions of years. There is no challenge or need for a sentient force to be responsible for all this. And if so, we'd at least have to admit for the vast majority of deep time, 4+ billion years for earth and 13.78.billion for the universe , the Deity was content with no live and then mostly single celled life for a very very long time until about 6000 years ago... when it must have gotten lonely. uh huh, sure, fine :)DennisCDiehlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10417850852638492246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-63499503359101297592017-06-09T13:17:36.211-07:002017-06-09T13:17:36.211-07:00I can't take this guy seriously. Any man with ...I can't take this guy seriously. Any man with long hair looks like a horses ass."<br /><br />Then, I guess you don't take George Washington and the other founding founders seriously, and you probably join Trump in his contempt for the Constitution they bequeathed to us. Styles and grooming change. If you really want to follow that fictitious Jesus, go get yourself a Roman and Middle Eastern wool robe to wear. I clip my hair short because that's the current norm. Besides, I don't like to take a lot of time for grooming. I remember when I was a letter answerer for old Herb how concerned people were about teasing hair, using hair spray, etc. Big hair was once the style for women and they spent hours on it. Now, everybody just lets it hang every which way. That will give way to a new norm one of these days. There are much more important concerns than momentary hair styles.<br /><br />Allen C. DeXterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-63306250638897489202017-06-09T10:53:31.946-07:002017-06-09T10:53:31.946-07:00Whether Ra is a nice guy or not is not something I...Whether Ra is a nice guy or not is not something I know personally. I'm willing to assume he's a great guy. I just wish he'd get to the point a lot quicker in his video content. I'm more interested in his facts and arguments - not constantly hearing his opinion on "creationists".<br /><br />The two issues I raised concerning how much water is available on earth (for a flood covering the mountains) and then how the earth came to have abundant water for life (unique in the solar system), including the problem zircon crystals present to the standard narrative of an earth forming naturally from hot solar material, cooling for a billion years or so, finally achieving a temperature that would permit standing water on the surface .... all that is in question by actual scientists. <br /><br />The discovery of ancient zircon crystals formed from the earliest history of the earth imply a very young planet that was not hot, had deep water already present and no known conditions that prevented it from being habitable. That's a real challenge to a narrative that assumes only natural, non-sentient forces were responsible. <br /><br />I gave links to scientific journals reporting the discovery and implications of the zircon crystals dated at 4.25 - 4.4 billion years old. The earth itself is estimated at 4.5 billion years of age.<br /><br />Even skeptics need a little humility I think.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-72485512996602436972017-06-09T09:18:26.123-07:002017-06-09T09:18:26.123-07:00I can't take this guy seriously. Any man with ...I can't take this guy seriously. Any man with long hair looks like a horses ass.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-226103369043606765.post-68502487663347788932017-06-09T08:53:20.622-07:002017-06-09T08:53:20.622-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.DPR567https://www.blogger.com/profile/16595957211284328166noreply@blogger.com