Musing on Vegetables...

Apostle Pack Renames RCG the C'n S Church of God

(Carrot and Stick Church of God)

 

 

 

 

"If you begin with the fifth announcement, then read those before and after it. They are all important. An enormous and detailed prophecy is now being carried out by God. He is preparing events to soon bring His people back together—all of them."

 

 

"If you read last week’s announcement you know we hold no doubt that God’s prophecy in Haggai and Zechariah is still very much “on.” This announcement explains additional expansive elements of the Haggai/Zechariah prophecy that none of us had yet understood. In fact, what you will read this week and next time may help you understand why more time was needed for us to prepare for God’s fulfillment of the prophecy. This included understanding more of what was going to happen. As mentioned in previous announcements, this one will open your eyes to things God has long intended to do with His end-time Church and Work."

 

"Ponder these things. Consider reading the entire book of Exodus for many other details. These will open your eyes to what God plans. I have picked the barest high points in the 40 chapters of Exodus to try to open your thinking to what God is promising His returning remnant in Haggai 2:5—what He is promising those who obey His literal VOICE of instruction and return to His Church to do His Work. Consider also reading the books of Numbers and Deuteronomy.
Do not miss what I now anticipate will be my final announcement! It explains four final elements of the prophecy that have become more clear, including hints that God left about why His plan to fulfill it was not connected to the fall Feast season."

 



 

 "They will open your eyes to things God has long intended to do with His end-time Church and Work that no one ever understood before, and you will see that His Word is PLAIN! These announcements will bring clarity to questions about “dates,” and how brethren should now view the “when” of the Haggai/Zechariah prophecy’s fulfillment."

 

 

"Before covering vital points and scriptures that all should now keep in mind, it is of course obvious there was an error in the prophecy’s timing. There may be other details that are wrong. I always knew this and said it to the Church more than once. In fact, we are still learning additional elements of it. Mr. Armstrong puzzled and puzzled and puzzled over certain much less complicated prophecies. He often said that things he learned came over time—not all right away, or even close in some cases. There are points we learned “late” in what is an enormously complex prophecy. We knew from early on in our pursuit of the truth that this prophecy did not carry with it the kind of time that Mr. Armstrong always had to properly sort through prophecies—ones that, however great in magnitude as we know some are, were simpler to understand. "

 

 

 

"I will explain a week after the Feast EXACTLY what was misunderstood about the prophecy’s timing. It appears we will not be waiting a long time—not another year—for its fulfillment. (Earlier announcements have been corrected.) Next Friday, I will post another one detailing three crucial elements that were previously unexplained, with three more to be explained after the Feast."

 

 

"Make no mistake. THE PROPHECY STANDS. Because it was never my prophecy, but rather God’s, it WILL come to pass. The whether and what of the prophecy have not changed, only the WHEN. "

 

 

 

"Think of the original apostles. They watched and waited year after year after year for Christ’s Return, absolutely believing this would happen in their lifetimes (I Cor. 15:51; I Thes. 4:15). Yet they were off by almost 2,000 years—a full THIRD of the entire length of God’s Plan! However rare, some few may think about this. Here’s what virtually no one reflects on. There was much more that they were waiting on and believed they would live to see—all of the OTHER events preceding Christ’s Return: the falling away, the Four Horsemen of Revelation, the arrival of the Beast, the False Prophet, the abomination of desolation, Jerusalem surrounded by armies, being taken to safety, as well as the Tribulation, Heavenly Signs and Day of the Lord. For decades, the apostles’ senses told them that all of these things lay just over the horizon—that they would live to see ALL of them fulfilled. Think. ALL of the apostles—every one of them!—got ALL MATTERS wrong in regard to timing—EVERYTHING!—and for almost an entire LIFETIME—again, including being off by 2,000 YEARS. Two were Christ’s own brothers, James and Jude. Two more, Peter and Paul, were leading apostles. It is no wonder that Mr. Armstrong himself was wrong for a time regarding Christ’s Return—and thus also was necessarily incorrect about the timing of everything prophetic that preceded it. But only his enemies crucified him. Mr. Armstrong lived to see virtually none—NONE!—of the things that he expected to see. I wonder how many brethren—first century or twentieth century—gave up on big prophecies because the apostles—first century or twentieth century—had their timing wrong. These men did not have the prophecies themselves wrong, but merely only the TIMING. Get the difference. ""

 

 

"I join the apostles who misunderstood certain prophetic time lines. (But so have all of you old-timers in the Church done the same.)"

 

So there....

 

 

 

"The only real alternative you have is to follow Christ’s Spirit back to His Church.

Think hard about what you will do...

Do not stake your salvation on the timing of the Haggai/Zechariah prophecy. I repeat a final time. The prophecy is TRUE. Just next week’s announcement will inspire you beyond belief—it is way beyond what you could imagine! Don’t miss it! "

 

"None of this new understanding speaks to when the prophecy will be fulfilled. I will certainly never repeat such a mistake. Those who believe the prophecy and are waiting on God will understand how important these elements are once it is fulfilled. Remember, you can wait in God’s Church for this fulfillment—or outside. It has been inspiring to see how many have come with us beginning in the summer and continuing to present. They know the prophecy is correct and the other two prophecies that quickly FOLLOW are drawing closer daily."

 

The expiration dates for Dave Pack and his Restored Church of God is coming due.  The false concept of "soon", "shortly", "It's the timing stupid.", "I am not mistaken about anything.", and "You can wait for me to be correct in the true church or out in the devil's playground," is wearing thin. 

 

In the New Testament, when it was OBVIOUS that all the soon and shortly of the Jesus return for the first century church was not going to happen, someone, not the original Peter, forged an excuse in 2  Peter chiding the people for not knowing that time is different with God.  It's ALWAYS the TIMING.  (If you don't think there are reasons to doubt the authorship of some NT books or that books credited to the Apostles were not actually written by the Apostles, I suggest a slow read of Bart Ehrman's Forged-Writing in the Name of God-Why the Bible's Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are.  ) A day is a thousand years and a thousand years as a day.  The anonymous author of 2 Peter had to keep the church going and shift the emphasis from everything happening as promised by Paul to a longer view.  Church members were dying and questions came up about just when this great "we shall be changed" was going to happen, IF it was going to happen.   If the focus could not be shifted yet again to the future but in different ways, the church was toast. 

 

Basing a church on the fulfillment of imminent prophetic events, NONE of which were ever meant for us toay or had us in mind 2000 years later  culled from observing the times one personally finds themselves living in is a HUGE mistake.  That is one of the big lessons of the New Testament and why the vast majority of Churches do not go there and emphasise the positive "sort of people we should be" as portrayed in the Gospels and by the Gospel Jesus instead.  It's why they emphasize Jesus and not CHRIST THE SOON COMING MESSIAH.   Most established churches have learned that Revelation Jesus is risky business.  The Seventh Day Adventists however still use this prophetic shtick as the main draw.  Dave Pack uses it as well as his main draw.  It will bite him in the ass as time goes on.  Horrific things may very well be in store for us all with the possible collapse of the dollar, total meltdown at Fukishima or who know what else, but it does not mean any rescue from heaven MUST take place for ME/US/THEM.  It is just life.

 

 

Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry and Ron Weinland will all go the same way as their hero, Herbert W. Armstrong.  They have and are repeating the same mistakes.  They have and are making the same excuses and motivating the faithful to live their lives by reading the news as if it were the Bible.  Bob Thiel scans the Internet for God's prophetic truths coming alive.  So far, at least for now, he is not waiting as Dave Pack is for the literal voice of God in his head to show up.

 

 

"Just around the corner" is a life denying lie and denies the present which will become the past and in the future will make many wish they had never heard of David C Pack or those who spoke as if they really knew...

 

 “Muddy water is best cleared by leaving it alone.”
― Alan Wilson Watts

 

In other words, a person who is fanatic in matters of religion, and clings to certain ideas about the nature of God and the universe, becomes a person who has no faith at all.
Alan Watts

 

 "You take your classified telephone directory, and open up "Churches", and have a ruler in your hand. And you will find that the longest space is occupied by authoritarian, Bible-banging churches. And these people are barbarians, who take the written word of the Bible literally. Because they need terribly, they have a personal need, for something to depend on."
Alan Watts

...seems true.

 

 

 

 

 

 



 

Apostle James Malm: Tribulation Could Start after Feast of 2014

The silliness continues:

I hide nothing from you; this work is to prepare the bride for a separation of the pillars from the lukewarm, in anticipation of the imminent onset of the tribulation of correction for the lukewarm.

Thousands are hearing these warnings and many will respond as various things are fulfilled and the fruits of these groups are revealed.  This is still a work in progress; it is when the abomination is set up doing miracles and the tribulation is within 75 days of starting, that  this work will begin to climax.

This work is preparing the brethren for the advent of God’s two prophets, so that the brethren will already have had a solid warning, and the words of these two will not be a shocking surprise.  

Without setting any date sure; this is highly likely to come shortly after the 2014 Feast of Tabernacles.

Of course there is an ulterior motive to his madness....money.  Since he is not doing any honest work, he has to survive on the funds of his acolytes to keep him in his apartment.

Spend this next year in a concentrated intense diligent effort to prove all things and hold fast that which is good by the word of God; to establish a deep personal relationship with God above relationships with all others.

As you prepare yourselves, please also consider supporting this work of preparing the bride for the imminent trial coming upon us.  While this work is reaching nearly all of the church of God brethren, it is not supported by many and is continually operating at a financial loss.

When he is proven to be a liar yet again, what will be his excuse?  That his members were not ready?  That God is giving him one more chance to warn the brethren in the various COG's to wake up?  Its the same old story we have heard for decades in the church.

Bob Thiel Believes His Little Cult Will Produce the Two Witnesses Right Before the Media and the Catholic Church Attacks His Group Causing the Famine of the Word

Bob Thiel continues his downward spiral into the madness of religiosity.  The end time message is all about him and his little personality cult and how they and they alone will be warning the world about the false prophet to come.  Thiel feels his message is so huge that that it will trigger massive news media coverage that will lead to his group alone being ridiculed.

Then to twist that media coverage even further, Thiel claims that he and his personality cult will be able to use that coverage to their advantage.  They will then be able to get their message out to the world.  Billions around the globe will be listening to Bob Thiel present his message in front of his crooked bookcases. These billions of humanity then will be held accountable for rejecting the message of Bob as 2/3 of them are destroyed.

Isn't amazing the things a self-appointed prophet can come up with, especially when it is an Armstrongite prophet!

Partially because the message of the people of the holy covenant, will enrage the upcoming prince/king of the North (Daniel 11:28-30). One or more associated with the Continuing Church of God will be identifying that the European “prince” (Daniel 9:26-27) who is rising up to become a king, will not be able to truly bring peace, but instead about bring war and will be in league with the final Antichrist. This will likely trigger major media coverage. Scrutiny of real, as well as claimed, COG literature will likely happen and various aspects of real and incorrect COG doctrines will likely be ridiculed.

Media coverage would then be expected to cover more the gospel message and this may be associated with the “short work” of Romans 9:28. Since the true COG is so small, it is highly likely that it getting significant media coverage will help fulfill Matthew 24:14. Some of the Philadelphia remnant will be explaining that it is Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God and not the rise of a militaristic leader that the world needs. According to Daniel 11:32 it is “the people who know their God [that] shall be strong, and carry out great exploits.” Hundreds of millions, if not billions, will receive at least a partial witness.

Bob feels that the Catholic Church will be so incensed by his message and his books that they will bring intense persecution on his personality cult.

All of that will likely trigger the King of the North to take actions that lead to the end–this includes the persecutions, pre- (Daniel 7:25a, 11:29-36) and post-tribulation (Daniel 7:25b).
Since “Catholic” leaders have renounced the millennial portion of the gospel message, some of them will not want it to be broadcast into all the world in the 21st century (for some details, please see Did The Early Church Teach Millenarianism?). They will support the King of the North’s efforts to stifle the message, probably in the name of “tolerance” and/or calling parts of the message “hate speech.” A famine of the word is coming (Amos 8:11-12; cf. Romans 10:14-15).

And in the end these rising leaders (likely some ‘new’ type of top leader of Europe along with some type of pontiff) will not like that–they will not want the world to learn what they will really do (and may not even believe it themselves at first, cf. Isaiah 10:5-7). They and/or their supporters will also likely falsely teach that the faithful Philadelphians will be espousing a doctrine (millenarianism) of a coming antichrist. Whatever condemnations that they and/or their followers make towards the Philadelphian faithful and the Continuing Church of God will trigger persecution (Daniel 11:29-35, Revelation 12:13-15; see also Persecutions by Church and State). This will also lead to the end–the start of the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:21; Daniel 11:39; cf. Matthew 24:15; Daniel 11:31) as well as a time of protection for the faithful Philadelphia Christians (Revelation 3:10;12:14-16; 

It continues to be fascinating watching the mental melt down of Thiel as his delusions grow stronger every day.  The recent article by Dennis is talking about this every thing we see happening with Bob.

More Vile Family Destroying Filth From the Morally Degenerate Philadelphia Church of God

In November of 2010 there was a letter sent to The Painful Truth web site about a Philadelphia Church of God family that threw their daughter out on the street and refused to care for her:

"For some time, my niece has been disillusioned by the Philadelphia Church of God. Her first awakening occurred when she asked her parents if she could stay with a non-cult member relative who lives on the East Coast, (that would be my wife and me), for two weeks, as part of her summer vacation. A boy her age, (a non cult member), who was enrolled in an accelerated program at school studying to become a doctor, was staying with us."

"When my niece continued to press her parents to be released from the abuse of the Philadelphia Church of God, her mother said she was “dead to her,” and turned her photo face down on her bureau top. Her parents told her to leave the house, as they wanted to concentrate their love and affection on their other daughters, who wanted to remain in the cult. My niece said her parents told her she was infecting the household with her “evil.” While kicking her out of the house, they refused to drive her anywhere, and threatened anyone who helped her with legal action for harboring a minor. My niece was forced to walk a busy highway for over an hour alone, until a classmate saw her and gave her a ride."

"Some days later, when my niece called her parents after she was out on the streets for a few days desperate to return home, her parents refused to answer her calls, or return her voice messages. When they saw her in public, they turned their backs on her and walked the other way. At one point, her parents let her return for a few days while they made sure they wouldn’t get in any legal trouble by abandoning their minor-aged daughter to the streets. During these three days, my niece says she had to sleep on the floor, as her parents had turned her bedroom into a weight lifting room and removed her bed, giving it to the family dog. She was told to leave the house after the third day, apparently after the parent’s consultation with their “lawyer,” who must have told them they wouldn’t get into too much legal trouble. If their lawyer is the one I know of, this individual is a cult member, who the Bar Associated suspended at one point for practicing law in their state without a license"

The Painful Truth now as a letter from the father of the non-PCG boy mentioned above.  What he tells is a sickening story of the filth that Gerald Flurry and the Philadelphia Church of God have brainwashed its members into believing.

10-21-2013
I am the father of the non-cult  (b)oyfriend (now her husband) in the letter. (Editor: next letter down) Everything you say is true, but what you didn’t know, couldn’t know, is the devastation that she has brought on my family. I paid for their entire wedding, their rings, their honeymoon, an entire new wardrobe for her, and within months of their marriage, she had reconciled with  family, and is dragging my son into the clutches of this cult. When her parents turned her out on the street at age 17, they threatened me with legal prosecution if I gave her aid in any way. I told them that i simply could not turn my back on someone so helpless, and so obviously in need. Now that she has secured my son and reconciled with her family, she disapproves of my life as a doctor (a dentist), as well as my girlfriend’s life as a cosmetologist. My relationship with my oldest son Spencer has been all but destroyed by the demands and brainwashing that her family and her church have taught her to do. None of her family came to the wedding. It was my honor to serve as my sons best man at his wedding as well as walking the bride down the aisle to give her away to my son. She currently is constantly undermining my ability to raise my remaining three children. Whenever they go over to Spencer and Jessie’s house, she “borrows” their phone and erases my girlfriends number, blocks her from their Facebook pages, and generally undermines any attempts at my son and my reconciliation. My son obviously tries to maintain contact with me, but even though we only live a few blocks apart, he can’t come over here without immediately being scolded and compelled to come “home” to her. It’s ironic that they claim to be Jewish and yet they wanted me to throw their daughter out into the street when she was looking for shelter. Have they forgotten the Holocaust? Fortunately not all Europeans shared this belief in WWII. She was literally living in my daughter’s closet for some time because she didn’t want me, or my then wife, to get into any trouble. I literally was hiding away a Jewish girl in my closet for months while her parents played them role of the Nazis and the SS. It was crazy! Now my son can barely have any relationship with me because she disapproves of our lifestyle! My son now works at the opportunity center in Redmond OR as a tutor to the disabled adults that live there. Oddly enough, Jesse’s (the niece) mother is my son’s supervisor! It goes deeper, much deeper than I could possibly convey in this letter. it would be a book. Thank you for sharing her story. It was a tragedy to my family and destroyed my second marriage, and greatly strains my current relationship. Feel free to write back or call me anytime should you have any questions or need additional information. Thank you for publishing this story, I hope it can save another family from going through what my family is currently going through.

The entire email exchange is here.

Dennis Muses on the loss of common sense

The Titleists

You can't be a Church of God leader, at least among the more ego centric ones, without a title.  It has to be a grand title.  The New Testament is populated with Apostles and Evangelists but we generally have to guess at just who were those below the title of Apostle .  Some were made this and some were made that , but Apostle is the one you wanted .  The Apostle Paul wanted it so badly, he made himself one and aside from "Luke" calling him one twice, Paul calls himself an Apostle the other 22 times in the New Testament he is called on.  Since he "conferred with no man," about everything that's evidently the only way he was ever going to be called an Apostle.
 

But the Church of God Gurus take it all up a notch or two.  Mr. Joshua C. Pack started out, if my memory is not failing, as "The Watcher."  He quickly graduated to Apostle out of fear of what to do should an Evangelist come into his sliver and outrank him as a mere Pastor.  From there it all started to go south with "And yes brethren, I am Joshua the High Priest as spoken of by the Prophet Haggai."  Ridiculous stuff of course, but entertaining and will provide Mr Pack with years of crow to dine on no matter what he thinks is merely off in "the timing."
 

Gerald Flurry is not just a prophet, he is "that Prophet," which of course he isn't.  Ron Weinland and Laura are both of the Two Witnesses of Revelation.  I suppose we're still waiting on someone to announce, "And yes brethren, I am Christ," but we'll have to see.  Title taking is probably one of the more childish and ridiculous traits of these one man shows in religion for which Christianity is taking such a beating over.  In this area where I live, SC, it seems that the more ignorant one is as a preacher who preaches because "I stopped drankin" the greater the title.  Most stop at Evangelist and have yet to meet an Apostle here in Greenville.  I know they are out there.  Only in the Wildworld of God have I ever met prophets, priests, Joshuas, Watchers, Witnesses numbering two and Apostles.  In my Presbyterian background, "Mr." or "George" did just fine.
 

It's been a fascinating watching Dr. Bob Thiel come on the scene in his own mind.  He claims to be a prophet.  While I see him as struggling as a teacher, much less prophet, he is awesome in his own mind, even though he isn't. 
 

In an interview with my friend and editor of The Journal, Dixon Cartwright, the leadership of the Living Church of God, from which Bob bolted noted the following when Bob endeavored to explain some things to them on his authority.
 

"In his recent letter to Dr. Thiel, Dr. Meredith said he can't remember saying anything like that, and, besides, October 2008 was only a month after he, Dr. Meredith, had suffered a stroke.


"That you would take anything that I said in that time period and try to use it is not right," Dr. Meredith wrote. "I do not ever remember saying anything like that, and I can assure you that I have never thought you might be a prophet!"


Dr. Thiel said an E-mail he received from Dr. Winnail dated Jan. 7, 2013, prominently mentioned "prophet," as follows:


"When we made comments to you that 'you may be a prophet' (and that could include some point in the future) that was to be kind to you."
 

Dr. Thiel said the LCG leaders' denials of their speculation that he might be a prophet are inappropriate.


"Their improper denials should be shown to be that as opposed to giving the impression that I dreamed things up."
 

Aside from own view that Bob has dreamed and does dream things up, as do Flurry, Pack, Weinland and others, I fully understand Dr. Winnail's comment of "being kind"  to Dr. Thiel.  I have had to do that myself in the past when , as a pastor, I sat in the living room when others wanted to reveal "one more thing me" about them.  One fellow got up and went to the closet and brought out his hooded robe with references to Revelation sewed all over it.  He also was a prophet and wanted me to know it.  I was not comfortable of course with his attending services but was "kind" to him.  I guess I wasn't kind enough because as I tried to leave he blocked the door and raised his fists at me.  I guess he was not pleased even with my being kind.  He said,  "I know karate!"   Huh?  Fortunately I had just come before visiting him from my brown belt karate class and it might be nice if I could just pass and go down the stairs on my own power.  We just starred at each other for that long moment and he let me pass.  When I got to the bottom of the stairs, he went bonkers and I left the building.  It was the only chance in life I ever had to kick the ass of a Prophet.  Being "kind" to some members along the way was a skill with the only other choice being confrontation and division.  I was told we must stand when taking passover as the Israelites did.  I was told I must use the Spotlight (Illuminati) expose' stuff for sermons.  I was told lots of things I MUST teach the church in my tenure as pastor.  Trying to be kind, balanced and preserve the fake unity of the church was not easy. 


I always chuckled within when the Church sang...'We are not divided. All on body we.  One in hope and doctrine. One in charity..."  Uh huh.   No church can sing that with a straight face.

 

At any rate, most of us are familiar with Bob becoming a Prophet in his own mind after being given "a double portion" of God's Spirit when asking for a mere anointing for a minor health issue in Charlotte.  Of course, when one is looking for proof of God's divine favor , it is always readily available.  I knew a massage therapist once who solved all of lives questions by saying, "If I see three yellow trucks on the way to work, I will know the universe is telling me that ____________ is what I should do, where I should go or what I should say or be."  Of course, there were always just 3 yellow trucks on the way to work .  Trucks 4-12 were filtered out of the equation.

 

Bob Thiel is no prophet and if he thinks he is one, no one will listen to anything he speculates on.  It is all speculation after all.  COG ministers are speculators and when you throw in a little Gospel, Revelation and Dr. Good, you can title yourself up and receive tithes evidently.
 

Bob Thiel is NO Prophet.  Let me illustrate.

Isaiah 1

New International Version (NIV)

1 The vision concerning Judah and Jerusalem that Isaiah son of Amoz saw during the reigns of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz and Hezekiah, kings of Judah.

Isaiah 6

New International Version (NIV)

Isaiah’s Commission

6 In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord, high and exalted, seated on a throne; and the train of his robe filled the temple. ² Above him were seraphim, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying. ³ And they were calling to one another:

“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty;
    the whole earth is full of his glory.”

⁴ At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook and the temple was filled with smoke.

⁵ “Woe to me!” I cried. “I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King, the Lord Almighty.”
⁶ Then one of the seraphim flew to me with a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with tongs from the altar. ⁷ With it he touched my mouth and said, “See, this has touched your lips; your guilt is taken away and your sin atoned for.”
⁸ Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?”
And I said, “Here am I. Send me!”

Jeremiah 1

New International Version (NIV)

1 The words of Jeremiah son of Hilkiah, one of the priests at Anathoth in the territory of Benjamin. ² The word of the Lord came to him in the thirteenth year of the reign of Josiah son of Amon king of Judah, ³ and through the reign of Jehoiakim son of Josiah king of Judah, down to the fifth month of the eleventh year of Zedekiah son of Josiah king of Judah, when the people of Jerusalem went into exile.

The Call of Jeremiah

⁴ The word of the Lord came to me, saying,

⁵ “Before I formed you in the womb I knew^[a] you,
    before you were born I set you apart;
    I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

⁶ “Alas, Sovereign Lord,” I said, “I do not know how to speak; I am too young.”

⁷ But the Lord said to me, “Do not say, ‘I am too young.’ You must go to everyone I send you to and say whatever I command you. ⁸ Do not be afraid of them, for I am with you and will rescue you,” declares the Lord.
⁹ Then the Lord reached out his hand and touched my mouth and said to me, “I have put my words in your mouth. ¹⁰ See, today I appoint you over nations and kingdoms to uproot and tear down, to destroy and overthrow, to build and to plant.”

Ezekiel 1

New International Version (NIV)

Ezekiel’s Inaugural Vision

1 In my thirtieth year, in the fourth month on the fifth day, while I was among the exiles by the Kebar River, the heavens were opened and I saw visions of God.

Micah 1

New International Version (NIV)

1 The word of the Lord that came to Micah of Moresheth during the reigns of Jotham, Ahaz and Hezekiah, kings of Judah—the vision he saw concerning Samaria and Jerusalem

Nahum 1:1

New International Version (NIV)

1 A prophecy concerning Nineveh. The book of the vision of Nahum the Elkoshite.

Habakkuk 1:1

New International Version (NIV)

1 The prophecy that Habakkuk the prophet received.

I believe we get the point.  On the other hand, Dr. Bob  gets info from the Internet like any of the rest of us can do.  He doesn't really hear the voice of God or would ever dare to say "God told me to tell you...."  He sees no visions and if he did he should know better than to tell everyone about them because what little credibility he has would go down the tubes.  Visions and voices are not well received in the 21st Century.  Not that Dr. Bob does not have dreams.  He does, and he does take them as God like in origin at times but only gets bits and pieces of truth.

"I did have one dream several years ago that seemed to be from God," he said, "and events subsequent to it have confirmed at least parts of its validity."
Bob Thiel to Dixon Cartwright

Dreams that "seem" to be from God are dangerous.  I'd prefer a God that woke me up and said, "Ok, look at me and go get ten witnesses from Channel 4 and a camcorder."  Bob is being silly which is not a good trait for a grown man who wants to be taken seriously. Bob said he "prayed about" getting a sign and he prayed about being a prophet.  Dave Pack was so impressed with how hard they all all prayed at HQ about last summer being The Great Unification on August 31st, it could not be wrong.  We know how that worked out for Dave.

Hey!  I can't find Pizza Hut...Call the Europeans"

 

 

When asked about specific prophecies he had made which may have come true, Bob notes...

"Two come to immediate mind that possibly push the envelope a little bit," he said. "One, I wrote in my 2012 book that it appeared that the United States was having problems with its GPS [Global Positioning System] system and that it was possible that it may decide it would need to rely at least partially on Europe's Galileo system."


When Dr. Thiel wrote that, the U.S. Air Force was denying it would ever rely on the European system, he said. Yet it was soon reported in the news media that America would make use of Galileo.

Sending in marines


"Another was when Julia Gillard was elected prime minister of Australia," Dr. Thiel continued.
 


"The day she was elected I posted at cogwriter.com that I felt (I feel that's whimpy prophecy) that she may do something to cause China to take a closer look at Australia for the possibility at some point in time, perhaps taking it over militarily or somehow being part of the removal of the government in Australia.
 


"And then that happened when President Obama and Prime Minister Gillard made an agreement to put troops in Darwin, Australia. They put marines there."

Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, thanks for playing.  In my world, that is Internet reading and speculation just as millions of other Internet readers can do.  No visions. No Oracles. No Word of the Lord.  Just Internet reading and speculation.  More silly stuff.  We all here on Banned predicted Dave Pack would not unify the Church last summer.  I guess we are prophets too.  We predicted Ron Weinland was not only not one of the Two Witnesses but would probably go to prison for a time.  We predicted Dave would never apologize to his church for speculating and putting them at great risk of ridicule.  It's all about the same.  I predict economic chaos in the first half of 2014.  I predict the dumping of the dollar by China and Europe.  I predict a cold winter in SC but then again so did the Farmer's Almanac.
 

Dr. Theil would never dare to say that what informs him is God himself through voices and revelations, oracles and visions.   That would be the end of his meager work right there.  Dave Pack on the other hand is anticipating the Voice of God speaking to him and his members directly in the near future.  Group schizophrenia is not a good thing and never ends well.  It's not "Good News."
 

Dixon went on to ask Dr. Bob...
 

The Journal wondered how Dr. Thiel receives his prophecies. Does he hear things? Do thoughts pop into his head? Does he have visions? Does he do automatic writing? What is his prediction-receiving system?


"Just prayer and study," he said. "I do not claim that I've heard voices, if that's what you're asking."
 

"I would say that I pray daily, and one of the things I pray would be related to Proverbs 3 verses 5 and 6, to trust the Lord with all your heart and not lean on your own understanding and in all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your paths.


"So I pray about what I'm going to write about, and then I write."
 

I write without praying first.

 

Sincere prayer and study  does not qualify one as a prophet if there is such a thing in reality to begin with.  I prayed my heart out in times past to "be used in the Work,"  "be a good pastor to folk.  I prayed as a teen for God to please show me the true church and to please accept me to Ambassador College.  All those prayers were answered to my harm.  My experience is that one finds the answer on has preselected by hunting and pecking one's way through the Bible for assurance one is on the right track.  Wrong train.  The Old Testament prophets failed big time in their prophecies as did the Apostle Paul and others in the New Testament with their views of how short time was for them.  I'm sure they prayed about it and studied "the scriptures" for their views. Nothing new under the sun for the past 3000 years in prophetic meanderings.  It's what humans do to encourage themselves about what's going to happen in the unknowable future.  It also mucks up the present.
 

The Journal asked Dr. Thiel for any predictions he'd like to mention for 2013.

"Well," he said, "other than the Great Tribulation cannot happen [in 2013] and despite the fact that one Church of God-related blogger thinks it might, that would be one off the top of my head."

 

Bzzzzzzzzzz...thanks again but prophecy is not telling us what cannot happen.  You have to tell us what WILL happen.  That off the top of your head?  Can't you do any better than that?  "Off the top of my head, saith Isaiah,  Assyria is going to kick our ass if we don't repent."?
 

To conclude.  Bob Thiel is not really any kind of Biblical prophet.  Dave Pack is not really an Apostle nor for sure is he Joshua of Haggai.  Ron Weinland and Laura are not really the Two Witnesses nor is Gerald Flurry "that Prophet" of Malachi. 

 

 

Someone needs to take their Bibles away from them for one year and not pray about anything anymore so hard that they finally see what they want to see and get to be what they want to be.  It is good entertainment but it can prove devestating to the lives of sincere folk who get snookered by the God hauntedness of it all.