Clyde Kilough has a new name. He can now be called "Iron Man".
The modern day Pharisees at The Shining Light Blog are indignant that Clyde went out and bought a shirt and ironed it on the sabbath! Oh the humanity! The abomination of desolation has occurred! Ironing shirts on the sabbath has destroyed the UCG.
When comments like this are uttered by the ultra conservatives it just shows how theologically bankrupt and graceless Armstrongism really is. This is a prime example on why Armstrongism is splintering into 700+ personality cults that have no relevance to humanity. You never hear these legalistic fools talk about Jesus, grace, love or serving mankind. Instead it just one humongous list of hundred's of old covenant "do not's" that they love to spit out in their hypocritical Pharisaical glory..
Yesterday Clyde Kilough had no qualms about announcing that he had purchased a shirt and ironed it on Saturday. He made no attempt to say that he did so after sun set or any such thing. He therefore left the clear impression that such Sabbath shopping was acceptable. He was surely setting an example of righteousness for the flock: wasn’t he? Would Elijah have set such a terrible example, or would he have made the record absolutely clear by simply adding the words; after sun set?
Poor Clyde, he just can't seem to do anything right any more! :-)
Mark 2:
ReplyDelete2 3: One Sabbath Clyde was going through the Mall, and as his disciples walked along, they began to get a few good deals on shirts at the Gap.
24 The Conservatives said to him, “Look, why are they doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath?”
25He answered, “Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were naked and in need of shirts?
26In the days of Abiathar the high priest, he entered the Mall and bought the consecrated shirts, which is lawful only for Pagans to buy on the Sabbath. And he also gave some to his companions.”
27Then he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
Being interpreted: Man is more important than the Sabbath
28:So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.”
Being interpreted: Human beings take priority over the Sabbath.
(Son of Man=Humans not some special kind of Jesus)
Now we have to assume he needed a shirt FOR Sabbath activities for some reason and it was wrinkled. If he just bought a shirt for no good reason or emergency...well...all bets are off. Then let him be stoned.
:)
PS Those who made this an issue are just full of shirt :)
ReplyDelete"Would Elijah have set such a terrible example, or would he have made the record absolutely clear by simply adding the words; after sun set?"
ReplyDeleteLet's see about this Elijah.
"You are--you and your father. You are disobeying the LORD's commands and worshiping the idols of Baal. Now order all the people of Israel to meet me at Mount Carmel. Bring along the 450 prophets of Baal and the 400 prophets of the goddess Asherah who are supported by Queen Jezebel." I Kings 18
Little did we notice in WCG there were ALSO 400 prophets of the Goddess Asherah. That's 850 humans for Baal
" Elijah ordered, "Seize the prophets of Baal; don't let any of them get away!" The people seized them all, and Elijah led them down to Kishon Brook and killed them."
So we see Elijah hacked the 400 male prophets of Baal to death..nice guy. BUT NOT THE 450 Prophets of the Goddess Asherah..or were they FEMALE?
Here we have the classic Male clash over the feminine. Elijah wanted the female prophets of Asherah for himself while Baal wanted them for himself. They duked it out over the Goddess and Elijah won...Unfortunately we don't know what he did with the prophetesses of Asherah, but he did not kill them.
Perhaps they were war booty and he knew he could take them home for play? Killing all but the women was an Israelite thing. Taking them for their own pleasure was also a Israelite thing.
But I'm pretty sure Elijah never would buy a shirt and iron it on the Sabbath :)
In Old Testament Survey Class NO ONE mentioned the 450 Females prophets alos present or what happened to them.
sorry for the blather..snowed in here
Actually, there is great truth in Dennis's first reply. The disciples were reprimanded by the Pharisees for picking corn, and this was not just a violation of the Pharisaic dos and don'ts! God had commanded the Israelites not to leave their houses to pick up manna during the sabbath in the Old Testament, and there is no difference between the amount of work required to pick manna, or the amount of work to pick corn. So, they were actually breaking Old Covenant law!
ReplyDeleteAlso, Jesus did not deny the fact that His disciples had broken the sabbath. He cited an example of David and his men breaking another iron clad law, and being held guiltless presumably because they had fulfilled the moral intent of the law, or the higher principle behind it. This law behind the law is referred to as the Royal Law of Love by some theologians.
I do not know Clyde Kilough, although I believe that for the most part his beliefs or understandings are different from mine. However, on this one point, I believe that the ironing of his shirt on the Old Covenant sabbath is completely consistent with the teachings of Jesus Christ. Conservatives judging him for this, or criticizing this, their brother, would unfortunately not be.
BB
Jesus would not have used the David/Shewbread analogy if it did not fit his circumstances too. David was on the run and starving. I suspect that Jesus (of the story) was also on the run and starving. This was not just a go over and pick some of the guys corn from the edge of the field. If that ever was the intention of the law, no farmer would be safe from marauders stocking up on freebies.
ReplyDeleteJesus was saying dire circumstances that humans get into come over Sabbath keeping or rules. Again, his "Son of Man" comment is NOT referring to himself in some messianic way. It just means "humans" and in this context, humans in need take precidence over the Sabbath regimine.
The Gospels go out of their way to make it seem as if the occupying Roman army in Jerusalem did not exist. They play bit parts and only when ultimately favorable to the Church or the Jesus story.
ReplyDeleteI suspect this incident reflects Jesus being in danger as a political threat to Rome. Thus the hungry on the run story of picking corn to survive. David was not guiltless due to fulfillling the intent of anything. He was on the run as was Jesus. Jesus and the disciples , for some reason, were on the run and starving.
Only in this contex of the similar circumstances would Jesus teaching hold any water at all.
We were taught that "Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath," somehow means Jesus can make up the rules since he is the originator of the Sabbath (historically the Sabbath is a cleaned up Sumarian Myth with a Hebrew twist), but that is not the point of this.
I think you are right as well in seeing that the Pharisees were not as portrayed in the rather scued Gospels. Pharisees were not the self righteous dolts that Christians make them out to be. I think in some cases, Sadducee has been overlaid by Pharisee.
Reading Josephus was a very revealing project for me. Flavius Josephus had quite a bit of respect for Roman civilization, justice, and the Roman army. He also had a very humane, and well-developed system of ethics, and led an exemplary life of service as a public official, if his autobiographical writings are an accurate reflection.
ReplyDeleteThe translator of the particular version of Josephus which I read expressed that in some cases Josephus's paraphrase of the Old Testament might actually be more accurate than our Bibles of today. He speculated that Josephus had Nehemiah's Bible from the temple archives on which to base his history of the Jewish peoples.
That the OT was revised several times is not even questionable. One of these revisions probably took place during the Babylonian exile, or the post-exilic period. Most of us have seen the editorial comments which are indicators of this as we've read certain passages which describe some landmark, followed by an editorial remark to the effect that, "and it is still standing to this day."
The more we all learn, the more it becomes obvious that one cannot be an obsessive-compulsive legalist accurately. The foundation for absolute legalism is quite lacking!That's probably an additional part of the reason we have grace!
BB