Dennis On: Dave C Pack's "Clarion Call" and "Time Is Short Brethren - Jesus Is Coming Soon!"

(sorta)

“However, though we do not, even now, know the day or the hour, we do know, from God’s prophecies, that it is today very near! Notice this, in Luke 21:25-32: He had been foretelling the world events, right now beginning, leading to ‘distress of nations’ in world troubles and world wars, ‘with perplexity…men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things that are coming on the earth’—world troubles such as never before experienced. ‘When ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand. Verily I say unto you, this generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.’

“So all signs show we are in the very last generation of

this present evil world."

Let's not be too coy here.  All the current Churches of God and most Fundamentalist Christians believe that all the references in the New Testament by Jesus , Paul, John or whoever wrote the pseudopigrapha books in the names of these men, believe that "soon", "Time is short", "Of things which must shortly come to pass", "The night is far spent", "The hour now is", "WE shall be changed", "We who are alive", and so on, refers to this day in which WE live. From the first century AD and through out ever century of the church since, this has been so.  It also has been 100% wrong 100% of the time to date and yet lives were lived, plans put on hold, monies given and fear cultivated to keep the machine of the established churches well oiled .  Perfect love casts out fear, which is the opposite of love.  Hate is merely the bi product of fear, but love is not on the table here when it comes to motivating people to "send it in", "pull big triggers" or my all time favorite sermon and quote of the Apostle Joshua C Pack, and I include it here in full because it so unbelievably arrogant it has to be read in whole to get the sense of just how short time must feel to the Apostle.

"If you hold those riches, I'm telling you, you trust in them"

"Go get a big chunk out of your home. And put your money where your mouth is and send it here. And I'm not talking about one, two, three thousand either. How about ten, twenty, thirty, fifty, or one hundred thousand dollars? Go do it."

"Wives, you can be independent in this. You have 1/2 the worth of whatever you have in your house.

I'm officially telling you this...Wives, legally you have the 1/2 the funds. What are you going to do about it?...Husbands...'well, my wife is not in the church'...tell her...'you don't have a voice woman' "

"Go get those assets and get them here"

"Don't sit on vast resources that we can use now"

"We are not a splinter"

"I do not covet your silver or gold...the gold and silver is God's and He will get it someway"

"We do not have the funds...plans...bookstores...We need to redesign our web site...We need many hundreds of thousands of dollars to arrive at God's headquarters soon...the timing is now"

"This is different...ask Him for the faith to liquidate certain assets and give it to the work"

"I'll say it again, we are talking about liquidating existing assets...it all belongs to God and the brethren"

"We have a lot of plans so big going on in this office it would cause just this room to to rock and gyrate if you knew what was going on. We just need a lot of money and we need it post haste...I would give more if I had it"

"Herbert Armstrong wrote an article...'Prepare to greatly reduce your standard of living'...What he wrote by far, is more for us now than it was then... its all going to be taken away from us anyway brethren"

"There will be follow-up sermons. Time to bring in related points"

"Let us know how much you plan to send and when you plan to send it...You must be willing to communicate... If you do need to counsel, please do that...If you are not ready to distribute what you have...you don't believe the flow of prophecy"

"This is announcing the last blast, the clarion call as it were, to finish the work...Whether it is 4,5,7, 9 years to go, God knows...This is liquidating assets...I have the authority to tell you to do it... I have the moral and spiritual, and ecclesiastical authority to tell you to do what I have also done"

"Get it now when it requires faith... when you are dead you don't need it... if you named us in your wills, it can take us months or years to get it"

"The wives in the faith will say give everything you can...We don't have the luxury of waiting years...today, leaving everything in your will simply doesn't work"

"Now you just have a second mortgage... and frankly we flee before most of it ever becomes due"

"...some may think that they want to tap their 401k--maybe you want to let us know that... why would you want to tell us? We are starting to prepare a budget now, the needs are now...it would be nice to know now"

"Think big...Pull big triggers"

"There is only two positions you can take regarding all that I have mentioned, only two, there is no middle ground. You're either going to yield, to submit and to follow, the clarion call that the time is now or you're not. And postponing a decision is deciding not to do it...It's saying I'm going to wait until it gets closer because it is not there yet...Don't say that I'm going to wait until it gets closer, when I can see...The decision is that my treasure stays on earth or I goes to heaven. Period. I will not lay up for times to come or I will. And this is the real test of Laodicea... either hold on to your assets... or give it... God is in this decision, no question. Testing the church's faith"

"We live in the most materialistic age in the history of the world. People trust in physical things. They trust in bank accounts...If you have excess and don't need it, those verses mean you...That's the Laodicean attitude...Put your money where your mouth is...Empty your assets"

"There is only one place He works...Where the...work is...that's where God is working...one elder commented here at headquarters, if people can't be motivated by a clarion call to finish the work such as this, why will those same people somehow believe the internal signal given to the church of the 1335? Why would they believe it?"

"This is the Laodicean age...Be careful that you don't tell us how to spend your assets... It belongs to God.. You don't tell God or His servants how to spend it"

"Your faith is being tested. Think about that"

"We will all fast on November 17th...I have to...ask you for a very special financial sacrifice for God's work"

"The purposes of the fast...(a). To fast for God's intervention...(b).Fast for personal faith and courage to follow what I am asking you to do...(c). Fast for personal strength...(d)...Fast for faith and courage in others with more than you to give...Go get a big chunk out of your house...their assets, IRAs, and pension funds...(e). Ask God to move specific properties...that they have told us they want to sell. Pray that these properties move...that is part of what this fast is about"

David C Pack-The Clarion Call-November 3, 2007

Whew...let me catch my breath....ok....   It must have been an effective sermon and I am sure honest and sincere folk gave until it hurt because after all, "time is short and we have Christ's work to do,"  That was 6 years ago.  I suspect most can only do this dramatic time is short giving once in their whole lifetime and they you are tapped out.  You also now are so invested you have to stick it out to see what happened i would suspect.  

An inside source assures me that some in high places that the Apostle Pack, at one time, did resist the idea of building a campus and all that goes with it ala HWA format and types. Kinda like those Bible Theme Parks maybe but duplicating the "template" as it is called, of HWA and his vision of empire and work.  The feeling was that if monies were spent on such physical and permanent facilities it could be misconstrued as 'My Lord delays his coming."

Well..those days are obviously over.  Decisions have been made about just how short time is after all and there are buildings to be built and HWA templates to be replicated.  (I assume there will be some templates yet to be replicated that will not be all that pleasant, but I spare you.).  How easily COG empire builders slip form "My Lord delays his coming " to "Blessed is he who is found so doing."

Now slap me if I am wrong but...

Matthew 24:

43 rBut know this, that if the master of the house had known in what part of the night sthe thief was coming, he would have stayed awake and would not have let his house be broken into. 44 Therefore you also must be tready, for uthe Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.

45 “Who then is vthe faithful and wwise servant,3 whom his master has set over his household, to give them their food at the proper time? 46 xBlessed is that servant whom his master will find so doing when he comes.

...has much more to do with not letting a thief break into your home and being ready for the return of the Son of Man than building dining halls, auditoriums, houses and campuses for God and getting hold of a $25,000 Steuben knick knack for your office.  Maybe it is just me.  I can tell you that Christ University was not the next thing on this "time is short" group of folk 2000 years ago. 

On the other hand, rumor is that the Apostle Joshua Pack believes his own work will be short.  Three to six, five to nine, and this was a few years ago, years at most.  Some say he thinks 2016ish.  I have my doubts.

Looks to me like "time is short" really does mean "No problem, my Lord delays His coming and it is ok!"

"Brethren...God does not see as a man sees.  One day with God is as a thousand years silly.  His ways aren't YOUR ways.  In fact, there is a way that SEEEEEMs right to YOU...but it is going to kill  you if I don't predict your death first.  Besides, I saw Field of Dreams and if you build it, Haggai said they would come."

"The structure represents an achievement in design, construction and technology, and is unique in the region. Its four levels contain a mix of elegance, modernity and technological innovation. Four beautiful chandeliers hang in the building’s signature north and south towers on the second and third floors. Throughout the structure, 605 very long window panes allow natural light to brighten interior offices and meeting spaces. Natural light spectrum fluorescent fixtures provide a vibrant work environment for the interior offices as well. Befitting the quality of the God we serve, the nearly 300,000 square feet of wall space is lined with over four miles of cherry and oak wood trim. To allow for maximum connectivity within and between multiple departments, 10 miles of Category 6 data cable and three miles of fiber optic cable were also laid throughout the building. Our meeting hall has been finished, with new chandeliers installed last night.

Many elements of the campus are now coming together, with more trees, gardens, and sod being installed each week. Exterior work outside the Hall of Administration on the eastern side is also taking shape. The developing landscape has approximately 4.5 miles of pipeline buried beneath the surface to irrigate the rolling grounds. God has blessed us with water from our own spring that will enable us to maintain the green turf and sustain many towering trees, lush plants and flowers through the hot summer months without the enormous cost of water this many acres and plants would require. This has turned into a tremendous blessing considering the possible water restrictions that may be imposed in the future. We have developed a saying that, “The Garden of Eden is open for business again.” We are pleased to announce that there will be a public area where city residents may enjoy spectacular flower gardens and specially decorated grounds." God's Work Advances Again

And of course, this is just the beginning of the end time permanent and incredibly expensive template for the time is short  and the hour now is Restored Church of God.  It certainly is a twist on being found so doing.  Jesus did know he meant miles of cherry wood and excellent trees planted to grow for decades and awestruck the brethren, who of course, are paying somehow for all of this.  Maybe it's done with equity loans?

Don't forget....

"This is announcing the last blast, the clarion call as it were, to finish the work...Whether it is 4,5,7, 9 years to go, God knows...This is liquidating assets...I have the authority to tell you to do it... I have the moral and spiritual, and ecclesiastical authority to tell you to do what I have also done"

"Get it now when it requires faith... when you are dead you don't need it... if you named us in your wills, it can take us months or years to get it"

"The wives in the faith will say give everything you can...We don't have the luxury of waiting years...today, leaving everything in your will simply doesn't work"

One of my favorites... 

"Now you just have a second mortgage... and frankly we flee before most of it ever becomes due"

"...some may think that they want to tap their 401k--maybe you want to let us know that... why would you want to tell us? We are starting to prepare a budget now, the needs are now...it would be nice to know now"

Sigh...Now personally, I don't care what Dave Pack does, thinks, believes about himself or his place in the Universe, but I do care about double talk in religion.  In Apostle Joshua's right hand we have "time is short" and "and frankly WE flee before most of it ever comes due, which sounds illegal to me, but what do I know and in his left hand we have, well yet a third Ambassador Campus with all the trimmings under the guise of being found "so doing."

I guess RCG members must be totally brain dead by now.  Let's take a look at the "My Lord delays his coming" concept with my own meager contribution to reality included.

The Day of the Lord   2 Peter 3:1-17 1Dear friends, this is now my second letter to you. I have written both of them as reminders to stimulate you to wholesome thinking. 2I want you to recall the words spoken in the past by the holy prophets and the command given by our Lord and Savior through your apostles.                                                 3Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come,(In reality, scoffers are simply people both 2000 years ago and now who notice that the words "short" and "now is" did and do not actually mean the same thing to them as they meant to those who proclaimed it. It is a different kind of short and soon.  scoffing and following their own evil desires.(Of course, their motive, as mine, is pure evil. It is not a sincere noticing of double talk or the mixing of short and long term ideas. It is just them and me being evil.  4They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.”  5But they deliberately (See...once again, the noticing and saying is not sincere.  It is deliberate scoffing and rebellion and the forgetting is deliberate.) forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.  6By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed.  7By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.(Ok, that's fine, but you're off topic.  We're talking about you saying the scoffing is because many notice that your soon and shortly don't mean the same thing evidently as mine or theirs. )  8But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.(Ohhhhh that's it!  See I was right. Days and years are different now. Why did you not mention this when you first said "soon" and "shortly" years ago?  I think you just made this up to explain the scoffers observations but maybe I am wrong.    9The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance. (Gotcha...I don't understand delay, slow or where and when is this going happen? stuff.  So while it appears slow and delayed. It is not because the problem is in their, my, our understanding.  This is where  you get bombed with "my ways aren't your ways", "the wisdom of man is foolishness with God" and "there is a way that seems right...but...).  10But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. (Now you didn't tell me this a few years ago.  The coming was going to be obvious with trumpets and in the clouds and now it is a thief in the night and unexpected.  You keep changing the rules on me and you wonder why they, we, I  notice it.  The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.a  11Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives  12as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming.b That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat.  13But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.  14So then, dear friends, since you ( Oh whew...you still mean us 2000 years ago...Great!)  are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him.  15Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.  16He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. (Oh..so now Paul is a bit to blame too for being hard to understand.  First time you mentioned this to us.  What your saying is that Paul tends to exaggerate and he does this in all his letters?  Why didn't you tell us that. We took him at face value.)  17Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position.  18But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen. (  Ok, will do.  But honestly, can I be honest here or are you going to call me a scoffer again who just likes to be evil?  My Lord still delayed his coming in human terms and those are the only terms humans understand.  It is like being accused of using "human reasoning" and then asking the accuser what kind of reasoning does he use?  Human reasoning is all we have unless one claims special powers and contact with the gods.  Oh ...they do..I forgot.  Personally I don't find many growing in grace in the world of the Apostle Joshua C Pack.  I certainly don't find them growing in knowledge.  That would involve study papers, input, reading and thinking outside the booklet box and we know that is not permitted and never will be.  So growing in knowledge is OUT!  I believe I have made my point at least.  I can see pouring resources into booklets and radio if one has a message, real or imagined.  Especially if time is short and love compels one to reach as many as possible and as quickly as possible before it is too late and the night is far spent.  But I don't believe for a minute the Apostle Joshua C Pack believes time is all that short or you'd not be seeing this foolishness of recreating yet a third time the Ambassador College Campus.  According to the current behind the scenes , go find those sermon tapes and get them back, schedule, 2016 ish is not all that far away.  Two sides of one mouth comes to mind here.  Carrot and stick also comes to mind along with just around the corner, just out of sight and just over the next hill.                                                         The scoffers in the times of the early church 2000 years ago were correct in noticing that, after all Paul and John had said, how they said it and the clear implication that they meant it meant their time, those people and that work of God, were wrong.  Paul even left the scene rather cynically saying that "oh well, I fought a good faith, I kept the faith..therefore there is laid up for ME, (which is typical Paul), a crown of righteousness...oh ok...and not just me but you too...gotta go."  Ruined relationships, lost resources on which to actually live, lost properties, angry children at parents who gave it all away and sent too much in too often leaves it's scars.  Recall Paul told people not to marry and to that it was much better to stay single as he was.  Of course he never heard any Jesus taught the opposite even thinking time was short for humanity too.  The Apostle Joshua C Pack is indeed recreating the HWA Ambassador College and Campus Template.  May I remind you the original is being torn down even as I write.  The Second Campus in Edmond is falling on hard times and the third is rising on the backs of the zealots who will probably repeat yet a third time the history of "My Lord Delays his coming."    The Apostle Joshua's work is calculated to last as long as he does.  It will be a comfy life but full of more drama to come. I think the Apostle thrives on drama as long as you spell his name correctly.  And then it end in the back of a debris truck or taken over by a business or a church that believes the exact opposite of it all.  There will be nothing new under this sun. And brethren, speaking of things that must shortly come to pass, are soon to come and sending in all one has because we need "big triggers pulled" and not to worry, "we flee before it ever comes due," is double speak.    It is a subconscious belief that my lord does delay his coming and tricksters  have buildings to build and an empire to establish.  It is a theological disconnect and those seeking security and safety have for the past 2000 years gotten burned but good putting up with it.  Amen and Aaaaaaamen as they say around here.

contact Dennis at: denniscdiehl@AOL.com