Are There Really Any "Good" Elders/Ministers in the Church of God?

In the thread under Herbert Armstrong's disdain for regular members, there have been a lot of interesting comments.  Three of which I post below.  The first two takes exception that there are NO good elders in the Church of God who have risen above the corruption and abuse.  The second claims there are NO "good" elders/ministers in the church because they do nothing to stop the abuse they see happen around them.

"The headline here is wrong. i would agree with it in part only....as usual many are being tarred with the same brush, when in reality its just ''big names'' ruining it for the rest of the Shepherds who try to do a humble work." 3:00

"If you can listen to HWA's Friday night Bible Studies to the brethren, he is so gentle, and would warn us of ministers (even in the WCG) that were wolves in sheep's clothing. This did happen as many of these ministers and their followers turned aside from the Bible truth, causing the great split of 3/4 of the church. Yes, HWA tried to warn us, may be got a bit emotional at times. I have noticed a big difference when I was a member of WCG during HWA's time and now being currently in one of the COC's, that many of the ministers now are very selfish and only there for the money, and treat brethren badly, who do not suck up to them." 8:42

One response says those that sat by and did nothing when they saw abuse are actually culpable to the spiritual/physical tragedies Flurry, Pack, Meredith, and others have caused.

I can't deny that there were "good" elders and ministers in the COG. However, because they sit by and don't speak up when they see abuse and mistreatment of members they are just as culpable as the perpetrators. They know better.

The so called "good" elders and ministers of PCG, LCG, UCG, COGWA and RCG  are guilty of the the suicides, broken marriages, destroyed families and lives because they are helping perpetuate a system of gross abuse that has been going on for close to eight decades. When will they grow some balls and forgo the paycheck and speak out and truly be servants of the members? Then we will truly know who the "good" ones are.

Which side is right?   Is Cal Culppepper good?  Richard Ames, Victor Kubik?  Joel Meeker? Gerald Flurry?  Dave Pack?  Bob Thiel? Jim Franks? James Malm?  Are some better than others or are they all equally wrong?

The COG Cry For The Kingdom To Come So The Wicked Can Be Punished

double click to enlarge

This seems to be the cry of Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry, Rod Meredith, James Malm and Bob Thiel.  They want that kingdom to come so that the evil people around them can be punished.  Some of them almost take delightful glee in  that anticipation.  They do want to see concentration camps, horrible wars, famines, pestilence and a host of other evils they predict for the world.  If it does not happen then they are proven to be liars and thaw would be a major embarrassment considering they want to be god's so whey can dish out that punishment.

Herbert Armstrong's Disdain for COG Members Carries Over to Pack, Flurry, Meredith, Kubik and the Leadership of Every COG to this Very Day.

There was an interesting comment on Gavin Rumney's OTAGOSH blog the other day in response to his posting on PCG's new local radio station.

The comment is about the disdain that HWA had towards the lowly church member.  It is the very same attitude that is still used by Pack, Flurry, Meredith, Kubik and others.

2 June 2015 at 02:53

Picking up on a theme that runs through the last few posts, I believe that this all has to do with control, whether it is Germano, humorless ministers or PCG events. And I believe that it starts with HWA. HWA had a disdain for the average member of the WCG. This is not something that I am asserting as a matter of opinion. This can be established by going back and reviewing what he said and what he wrote. In fact, most lay members in the WCG heard this viewpoint repeatedly.

1. HWA regarded lay members as just a resource for his use. They were called to help him "do the work" which involved large amounts of money and some questionable activities that to this day seemed to have produced nothing. Their salvation was of no importance. If lay members were not ready to impoverish themselves for the work, then God could raise up stones to do the job. (Nobody ever called him on this point.) He was not trying to make the point that the funding of lay members was not needed - he was making the point that they were essentially worthless in his sight and in God's sight. They could easily be replaced by stones. Explicit in this view is that God had no personal attachment to lay members or their salvation. (All this form the guy who touted the wonderful human potential as an advertising ploy.)

2. HWA in a tape played across the country, found the budget to be short and angrily blamed this on self-indulgent lay members. In this context, he stated that he did not expect lay members to receive salvation. He only expected the leaders and ministers of the WCG to receive salvation.

3. HWA repeatedly chided lay members by stating that they just wanted to "get" salvation. He converted what Christians would regard as the hope and glory of salvation, highly to be desired, evinced by God himself, into something shameful, evil and wicked all in the interests of squeezing more blood out of the turnip.

Oddly, lay members read and listened to this for years yet fanatically remained loyal to HWA and seemed to believe that he had their interests at heart when he proclaimed over and over again that he did not and was utterly hostile toward them for not coughing up enough money. You can't say the guy wasn't honest, at least about this. It was Joe Tkach, Sr. that actively elevated the salvation of the average lay member to something important. This particular change was revolutionary - a complete sea change in the WCG. This was an abandonment of HWA's view of derision and an alignment with Christianity. This new view was presented in an editorial in the Worldwide News written by TKach Sr. and people in the WCG were so brain-washed that nobody I know even noticed. I would bet that most even today do not know this happened.

-- Neo

Ron Weinland Has Massive Heart Attack While In Prison

Mike is reporting on Don't Drink the Flavor Aid Served By False Prophets  that imprisoned felon Ron Weinland had a massive heart attack on May 28.  This will soon be surely spun into some prophetic sign from Weinlands's god.

According to sources including a comment left on the blog, False Prophet Ronald Weinland suffered a heart attack last Thursday, May 28.  This was not his first heart attack, as he had one on or about August 4, 2005 and was out of commission for 5 weeks recovering from triple bypass heart surgery.  Word is that he returned to prison yesterday and is to have stents put in after he gets stronger.  Some skepticism on that from some quarters.  Perhaps he had urgently needed angioplasty in one area of the heart and they see some other areas that are marginal but not urgent.

JD left a comment:
People are upset in pkg.  Ron had a massive heart attack last Thursday and people are just finding out and are upset because it has been keep under wraps.  maybe the big wigs think people will start running for the doors if their mighty leader has fallen yet again.    Hmmmmmm maybe Ron is one of the ones who is scheduled to die for not repenting.  Has to start somewhere.

Reading the additional comments show that the PKG deliberately kept this from its members.  Others are questioning whey he was released till he gets better and then come back in for heart stents. There apparently is far more to the story than PKG is relaeasing.

Marion McNair: Armstrongism: Religion or Rip-Off?

This three-part volume is a thoroughly documented expose of the modus operandi of the Armstrong religion. The author, Marion J. McNair, is eminently qualified for the task of analyzing this sect as he has been associated with the Armstrong organization for over thirty years. Mr. McNair first attended Ambassador College as one of its pioneer students in 1948 and was eventually ordained to the rank of Evangelist. During the last seventeen years he has been a part of the administrative ranks of the organization at its headquarters in Pasadena.

In Part I, Mr. McNair analyzes the subtle psychological approach used to entice unsuspecting individuals into "the Work." He discusses the "Armstrong commission" and how exorbitant expenditures are rationalized and justified with minimal accountability to contributors. Complete profiles are given of Garner Ted and Herbert Armstrong along with all the top men who helped build the Armstrong empire. For this and other parts of the volume, the author collaborated with a professional psychologist who provides considerable insight into the soul of the Armstrong philosophy and approach.

Part II analyzes the early beginnings of the organization showing the real conflict in Herbert Armstrong's relationship with the Oregon Church of God. You will find that they pleaded with him to study in open discussions his "heresies" in the areas of British-Israelism, prophecy, and holy days, but that he continually refused such overtures. You will be astounded to discover that Armstrong was finally fired from the ministry because of his mishandling of finances and his total disregard for church authority. His move to California was forced upon him by his continual prophesy failures and the desertion of most of his church. He thus achieved a new base of operations, one unfamiliar with his massive prophecy debacles. It was this new base which became Ambassador College and the Worldwide Church of God.

Part III reveals the details of the 1973-74 organizational split, a split which is still continuing. You will see the entire episode from behind the scenes, showing the true concerns of the Armstrongs during the crisis.

This important book succeeds in exposing the totalitarianism of the Armstrong regime. It reaches beyond the facade and reveals what the Armstrong "Rip-off" is and how it works. Painful Truth

Read the entire book online here.

Childhood Lost: Memories of a Childhood in The Worldwide Church of God (Armstrongism)

By early summer, my brothers and I had been rather forcibly introduced to Armstrong's god and he was a demanding piece of work. All unnecessary social contacts with the heathen world, such as playing baseball at school or hide and seek with the neighbor children were terminated. God's people, including their offspring, were commanded by God (through Herbert) to "Come out from among them and be not partakers of their sins!"


The sect's marching orders were simple and succinct coming nearly straight as they did from the Lord via Armstrong. "Fear and Tremble," to question Herbert, his hand picked ministry, or their god. While the enduring task of the laity, on the other hand, was to listen and obey. All else emanated from the evil one.


This new deity didn't mess around. He was extremely touchy. One never knew what might set him off. But there was nothing prejudiced about the way he evidenced, in general, an unbiased and unmitigated disgust for all his children. He was an equal opportunity destroyer.


Besides wreaking vengeful havoc upon rebellious teenagers, lipsticked females, and skeptical males, he was a killer of disobedient children. He waited his chance, bided his time and kept the most meticulous records imaginable of every six year old's felonious crimes and gross misdemeanors. For soon enough they would all add up into a veritable mountain of blasphemy, and carnal depravity which no amount of forgiveness could ever expunge, and they would dwell in the lake of fire forever, amen.

-------------

Sooner or later (sooner knowing me) I'd spit on the sidewalk, say "Ah, shit," or be thumbing happily through the pages of the National Geographic to gaze in wonder at the dark naked ladies and remember: HE was watching, listening, taking it all down, and I would be toast.


I discussed this (and other) theologically weighty problems with school yard buddies to get their slant on the matter, but they were all of different faiths and persuasions (if one could believe first graders had faiths and persuasions) and what I learned was shocking. None of them knew the truth, at least the truth as I'd heard it. Furthermore, they'd never even heard of the fundamentalist church I was forced to attend, the Armstrong congregation of the called and the chosen.


That being the case, they could lie, steal, and fornicate to their hearts' content...and still have hope in salvation! That really sucked, and for the first (but not the last) time in my life I looked heavenward and mentally asked, "Why me?" What offense could I possibly have committed to be unfortunate enough to have parents who'd stumbled across "The Way" and worse yet dragged me along with them? For I knew the truth, but instead of setting me free it seemed determined to slit my throat.


I knew the year of my execution as well. Herbert had written a book on the subject entitled 1975 In Prophecy. 1975, he publicly proclaimed, was the year a merciful God had lovingly chosen to show humanity the error of its ways. Privately, however, church members were instructed to be prepared for their Lord's return by 1965. As religious tracts go, 1975 In Prophecy was crude, even for its time, full as it was, of prophetic invective and coarsely drawn pictures.


For all of that, it was still a nightmare booklet designed to strike terror into the hearts of all who read it by purporting to show the ghastly end of a corrupt and decadent world, a world which had stubbornly refused to heed the dire warnings of God's last true prophet, Herbert W.

--------

On top of all that, the church's idea of a properly kept Sabbath bordered, if not wholeheartedly tromped, on the constitutional prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment. Sabbath, in their estimation, began some hours before, at sunset the previous day to be exact. From then on, no form of activity outside of reading Herbert W's private interpretation of the Bible was permitted. On the big day itself, the called and chosen bestirred themselves from their mild mannered walks of life, donned such formal attire as they were capable of affording after numerous tithes and offerings and, strode forth to become the future masters of the universe.


A rented grange hall was the arena for this weekly metamorphosis in my neighborhood. A hollow shell of a place with windows too high to look out of and filled with the most uncomfortable fold out steel chairs humans have yet devised. Here the merry throng gathered for at least five hours every Sabbath and the exhausting ritual of rest and relaxation began.


Some deacon or elder would hop up on stage, bid the congregation be seated and, once it was, to rise. The first of four hymns was then thoroughly butchered...and they were no ordinary hymns either. Herbert W. had a brother who fancied himself a song writer and musician. He'd taken many of the more bloodthirsty of the Psalms and added what he thought were appropriate melodies, most of which sounded like lugubrious variations of the funeral dirge played backwards. Once the joyful noise had been replaced by blessed silence, the called and chosen were told again to sit, and they did. For the next four hours.


The ministry of the church labored mightily under the illusion that they were experts in every field of human endeavor. Their training and education did little to relieve them of this happy burden. They were, to a man, all educated at Ambassador College in Pasadena, California. This college had been invented by the big man himself to teach young minds his version of God, the universe, and the hereafter. Among other things, the curriculum fostered a humble attitude of self importance, spiritual arrogance and personal conceit. They were, they were told, the most called of the called and chosen.


The rest of the curriculum at A.C. was decidedly simple. The entire universe was six thousand years old, modern science was all wrong, contemporary educational institutions were tools of the devil, as were medical doctors, dentists, and especially psychiatrists. If you had the faith (and were as nearly perfect as they were), God would cause all you did to prosper. If you had the faith, he would protect you from all manner of evil and heal you of all maladies...except mental illnesses (these were, and remain to this day, in private church theology at any rate, products of either self deception or demon possession).

----------

The order of worship in a standard disfellowshipping, which is to say that of a lay member, was precise and prescribed. It entailed verbally flaying the flesh off the unrepentant, vocally roasting their heretical remains over brightly burning cauldrons of collective self-righteousness, then figuratively holding the still smoldering carcass up before the entire congregation for spiritual edification and formal disfellowshipping.


When a member was disfellowshipped, all regular sermons were temporarily preempted to deal with the juicy allegations. Questioning the authority of the ministry, divorce and remarriage, use of tobacco products and poor attendance were all capital offenses, spiritually. Once a member was amputated from the body they were regarded as dead, spiritually now (unless they humbly and abjectly sought the pardon of the ministry) and literally later when God returned.


On the great day of a disfellowshipping, the pastor would mount the podium with that dejected air of reluctant regret which only the hopelessly self-righteousness can muster, the consummate spiritual executioner too weary to wield his axe.


He would then stare out over the sea of gathered faithful and begin. But he wouldn't just solemnly announce the distressing news and get things over with. No, he would begin softly, sadly, blending shadow with shade, color with hue, till, in the middle of his discourse, the lurid portrait of a vile sinner would slowly begin to emerge and take horrifying shape. Toward the end of the sermon this despicable creature, once known as a Christian, was conclusively identified and their craven deeds of rebellion and intransigence fully and finally described in a crescendo of sound and fury from the pulpit that would have had even Satan quaking in his boots. And members would park pitiful expressions of dismay and shocked disbelief on their incredulous faces and ask each other, "How could this be? How could Brother or Sister... have fallen from grace so horribly?"


But in reality none of them were surprised in the slightest. Everyone had been discussing the situation for weeks as befits concerned responsible Christians and, as a rule, had socially ostracized the poor bastard many Sabbaths previous. The obligatory casting out was a mere formality. Except when it involved, as it sometimes did, the ministry. In those cases, the hell fire and brimstone was kept to a minimum with little or no information on dastardly deeds forth coming; other than "by the way," asides to the flock to pray for an endangered brother who was fighting a deadly one man battle in hand to hand combat with Satan himself.


The sense of relief at any sermon's end was palpable. More than a few of the called and chosen would quietly (but wholeheartedly) whisper "Thank God!" as the minister wrapped things up, and not for the spiritual sustenance they'd nearly gagged on either. But even this wasn't the end. Two more uplifting hymns were essential, plus a closing prayer.

Read the entire book check it out here:
In pdf form
Online book form

More Fun Comments From Living Church of God's Michael Germano

An LCG member sent me the following screenshots of comments Michael Germano has made over time. What a lovely attitude for a man who is trying to impress the worldly men and women who might be accrediting Living Church of God's so called  "university."  Germano is obviously no fan of the Gentile occupying the White House, which is typical of most of the splinter groups.  It really galls them that an African American is ruling over them.  If a woman happens to be elected in 2016 you might as well expect the Germans to start setting up concentration camps in the U.S.

This one apparently is a direct slam against his former employers, the Worldwide Church of God.

Is James Malm's Mixture of "Deadly Error" to be Trusted?

A reader here asks:

I was wondering about James Malm and if he is someone we should be following. He seems to have a lot going on as far as teaching about God. Now he is writing booklets and trying to explain about everything from prophesy to Passover. If you have seen his many blogs you will know what I mean. The only thing that bothers me it seems like the bible if true is the only book needed, not someone trying to explain what God has already explained, which means adding to the word of God, I want Gods take on what he says not James Malms. I am split as to what to do because in one sense he seems to know so much and in another sense there is just something I can't point out but worry about if I believe him. He may have a lot of truth but I worry about if there is any error, and truth and error mixed is a deadly combination. Thanks very much for all your work in showing error of others, I have learned a lot and thankfully haven't gotten sucked in to listening to others because of them being exposed. I will continue to follow your site and hopefully one day you will get a chance to let us know either way about Mr.Malm. Thank you.

So the question is, Is James Malm to be trusted?

UCG Mark Mickelson/Don Ward Claim Vic Kubik And Others Bypassed Council In Order To Hire New Pastor Trainee's

Trust us and blindly follow...

I received the following information regarding a recent UCG Council meeting.

It seems that Vic Kubik, along with two others, unilaterally decided that UCG was hiring three new men to be trained as pastor's and one trainee to receive a stipend, without getting the entire Council's approval.  They apparently bypassed the Council of Elders in this decision without consulting them for any input and to where the money was coming from to pay them.

Excerpts from Council letter:

Wednesday, May 20, 2015

Chairman Robin Webber called the meeting to order at 4:08 p.m. Eastern, and the meeting was opened with prayer. All 12 Council of Elders (Council) members were present....


New Hired Ministerial Trainees—Robin Webber 

Mr. Webber mentioned a Council member had brought forward a concern regarding the hiring process. He asked the Council’s permission to place it on today’s agenda. The topic would be hiring of trainees mentioned in Mr. Kubik’s member letter sent out this week. The question was raised about what part the Council has in helping with these decisions. Also the budget called for four new hires. Where will the money come for the fifth hire?

The discussion surrounding the interpretation of 8.7.2 (1) that deals with a stated Council responsibility of “to approve the selection of all officers, agents and employees; also to remove, if necessary, any officer, agent or employee; to prescribe duties for them; to approve their compensation; and to require from them their faithful services.”

The Council is within its bounds to interpret the bylaws on its own, and this bylaw has been subject to various interpretations over the years.

The chairman reminded the Council that the administration had brought their plans forward twice regarding the ministerial training program via a videoconference meeting before the General Conference of Elders (GCE) conference and the recent May meetings that followed.

Additionally, legal counsel Larry Darden mentioned current human resources (HR) policy for hiring states the Council can delegate to the president. For new positions the president is to get approval.

Chris Rowland mentioned that this isn’t a new position.

Mr. Webber said that the administration has put the names forward and feels there is a sense of urgency to train these individuals at this time. Three of those six trainees will be moved to train under another pastor. Those names can’t be currently shared at this time due to processes of notification and notifying current employers.

Don Ward asked how these men were selected from all the names put forward by pastors. And who decides where they will be moved to?

Roy Holladay explained that these individuals had their names put forward and were highly recommended by church pastors. Others in the current listing will be looked at for the future.

Dr. Ward reiterated his question about who decided on these six.

Roy Holladay said they are available and qualified. There will be four to five recommended each year from pastoral input. It was then clarified that there were three who made the ultimate selection of these six trainees with input from their pastors: Victor Kubik, Roy Holladay and Chris Rowland.

Mr. Holladay, answering the second question, said that these new trainees will be placed with men who have specific mentoring skills. In the ministry different individuals have varying skills, and it’s a unique skill to be able to mentor others towards this calling.

Mr. Rowland, in further clarifying the first question, said that the selection was made from pastoral input. A letter was sent to all those individuals who were recommended to get further details on those men.

Mark Mickelson mentioned that he believes the Council and administration are operating outside of our bylaws. There are issues in terms of doctrine, issues in terms of employment and issues in terms of media that should receive Council approval that are not receiving Council approval at this time. And those are all separate discussions that he would give more detail on if wanted. What is being discussed now brings up the point that the Council does have responsibility for new hires and not just new positions. We need to either change our bylaws or change the way we operate. He doesn’t think this is the way we agreed to operate. He also asked for the Council to consider face-to-face meetings in August to address these things.

Robin Webber is then "surprised" that anyone dared to question what had happened.

Mr. Webber inserted a measure of surprise and desired explanation of Mr. Mickelson’s stated position that this might impact doctrine.

Bill Bradford said that with the new trainee hires there was no approval by the Council. He reiterated the inquiries already raised about the hiring process and making sure the new trainees are doctrinally sound. He also asked Mr. Rowland where the money is coming from when this many new trainees were not in the budget.

Mr. Rowland replied that this was discussed with treasurer Rick Shabi. Ministerial and Member Services (MMS) feels that with the environment in the Church right now we have to be able to act quickly at times. He then mentioned that the extra funds came from what is in the bank already.

In reference to Mr. Mickelson’s previous statement, Mr. Webber asked the administration to share an overview of their selection process in regards to qualifications and doctrinal soundness.

Mr. Holladay said that locally he talked to Steve Myers about them. There are always unknown quantities with all of us that we deal with. MMS is very comfortable with all of the selected individuals.

Mr. Bradford asked if the others who had their names put forward by pastors were interviewed as well. Mr. Holladay replied that they were not. Mr. Bradford asked why not.

Mr. Holladay replied that letters were sent out to get their input. Several wrote back that they would like to serve, but for various reasons could not do so at this time. They weren’t interviewed, but there was communication with them. The Council has the authority to review all hires but has not always exercised that authority.

Mr. Rowland commented that Roc Corbett specifically brought this bylaw to the Council’s attention on his behalf during the recent review of the bylaws, to ask for direction on the handling of new hires. The Council said nothing about doing anything differently.

Mr. Webber went back to the fundamental issue: that the Council reviews the credentials of the president and operation managers. All elections and selections have consequences regarding our choices. Once made, we place confidence in such individuals while maintaining oversight. The Council strives to offer the administration as much leeway as possible. It’s a process that we work through.

John Elliott mentioned bylaw 8.7.2 and that it appears to need further clarification. Mr. Webber asked what kind of clarification it needs. Mr. Elliott said it needs clarification in regards to hiring, as was stated by MMS. He suggested that this topic be brought up for a future meeting.

Mr. Webber agreed. He had talked with secretary Gerald Seelig that morning about this topic and asked for his input.

Mr. Seelig said that since 1997 this has been an issue with questions that arise and can be contentious at times.

Mr. Webber restated that the Council should always have oversight, but should not micromanage.

Peter Eddington mentioned that at the home office the precedent has been that the Council has delegated it to the president. This is what is being followed. If there is a need to change that precedent then it needs to be made clear.

Scott Ashley said that four years ago we went through a time when 15 to 20 new hires had to be done, and they weren’t brought before the Council. He doesn’t see any breaking with precedent, but that also doesn’t mean the Council can’t address it again.

Mr. Kubik stated that what we have been doing with the hiring of the six new trainees is still a very new thing. Mr. Kubik reminded the Council that at the home office they meet regularly and prayerfully. They are careful to not mention names too quickly, and they are learning from what they have done. They appreciate the input from the pastors at the regional conferences.

Mr. Webber mentioned this is not an end, both in the ministerial training selection process and in the lives of those not currently selected. He mentioned his own experience at Ambassador College of not being immediately selected to “go out” after graduation and the course it took. Much is yet to occur in the lives of all these individuals.

Mr. Webber asked the Council about their desire to take a straw poll to get the feeling of the Council in this matter.

Don Ward feels that certain UCG leaders are bypassing the Council in several actions.  One was the epic failure of UCG's new web site that shoved official church teaching to the secondary pages on the web site instead of boldly proclaiming their doctrines and intent on its main page.  After being widely mocked by countless web sites and its own members, the Council is trying to bandage that "ouchie" up.

Dr. Ward didn’t think it was necessary for a straw poll. His understanding was that people proposed would be narrowed down so the Council could then discuss the final hires. He was surprised to hear of the new hires in Mr. Kubik’s letter with no discussion from the Council. He asked, “Regarding the new hires, is the Council to give input, or is the administration just wanting it rubber stamped?” Dr. Ward stated that he understood the desire to put confidence in the administration to perform their roles, but major issues come up at times in which more immediate Council review and oversight is needed. Such an issue was the recent rollout of the new website that needed more initial Council direction and careful review to ensure that the Church’s positions are accurately stated. Here was a case in point of the need for more immediate and necessary Council oversight on a major item, which did occur.

Mr. Holladay commented a number of the new traineees are already in the process of changing careers. It would be difficult for them to wait until there is the Council approval at this point. The issue of them being doctrinally sound is very valid. This is one of the reasons for having them trained under a pastor who is balanced. For the round of hiring we take the Council’s input and improve the process, but at this time we have already committed to hiring these men.

Mr. Mickelson stated that he would prefer not to take a straw poll since the decision has already been made.

Mr. Elliott suggested that the Roles and Rules Committee (RRC) can have the issue of the bylaw remanded to it. Then the RRC can have a proposal for this process for the August meeting.

Mr. Rowland said he would be glad to send out policy 2.1, “Recruitment and Hiring” from the human resources (HR) policy manual to anyone who wants to review it, because it is pretty clear about what the process is. This policy was approved by the Council in 2001. The process needs the approval of the Council and/or the president to hire someone. If something is needed to be updated it would be this HR policy.

Mr. Mickelson asked if the precedent referred to by Mr. Eddington and Mr. Rowland also included spending money outside the approved budget. Any spending that is not within the planned budget needs be addressed by the Council at a later date, which would include salaries and moving expenses.

You would think that close to twenty years after UCG's formation that they would have things all figured out.  Since they were the "new and much improved" Church of God at that time, they set out thinking they would be a  better church and be run more efficiently.  The problem is, and always has been, is that the very foundation of the UCG was envisioned in clandestine backstabbing plan's in Kubik's on-campus apartment on how to take as much money and members as they could while they were all still employees of the Worldwide Church of God. Every single person in power in UCG was a minister in power in WCG where they did what they wanted and spent as they wanted.  That power carried right over into UCG along with the abuse and wastefulness they participated in when in the WCG.  Nothing truly has changed in UCG. Ethics has never been the banner of the UCG since its inception.

Who Kept The Best Pentecost?

On Sunday, May 24 it was the traditional day for the Christian celebration of Pentecost.  The day the Holy Spirit descended and was made available to all believers.  It is a day widely celebrated throughout much of Christendom.  It is even one of the few Christian holy days that the Churches of Armstrong celebrate on the same day.  However, there is one big difference, the Churches of Armstrong all feel that they and they alone are the only ones keeping it correctly.

Like Bob Thiel, most in the Churches of Armstrong look down upon and mock Christians around the world.  Thiel, in all of his self-righteous glory, calls all Christians "so-called"  except for those of his minuscule sect. For the rest of the Churches of Armstrong. there are no Christians on the entire face of the planet who are more enlightened than those of the Church of Armstrong.  They and they alone posses all true spiritual knowledge.  Therefore, the TRUE Pentecost could only have been celebrated in a Church of Armstrong service last Sunday (May 24).

Unless of course, you are of the Church of Malm.

If you are a Church of Malm member or follower you would have celebrated Pentecost TODAY (May 31, 2015).  The Church of Malm believes it and it alone are the only ones on the planet who are in possession of revealed truth through its modern day mouthpiece, James Malm.  He and he alone is the only true reveler of hidden knowledge that even Herbert Armstrong did not know.  He even says that Herbert Armstrong was sorely misguided on many things and his acolytes clap like happy seals.  They are looking down upon all those in the various COG's today as ignorant fools who did not know that TODAY was the real Pentecost.

So who kept the better Pentecost?