Ever since this blog started I have had various COG members in various groups as readers. As time goes by, more and more share information about the abusive ministers and leaders of their churches.
The Internet has been a major thorn in the side of many COG groups. No longer can they sweep under the rug the abusive things they do and say. People talk, people leak information. From the Ambassador Report, the Good News Grapevine, the Painful Truth, Ambassador Watch, Silenced, and many other sites, the Church of God has had to continually do damage control. Members no longer trust their leaders to tell the truth or to do what is right. When abuses happen, people quickly spill the beans. This infuriates ministers so much that they stand in front of their congregation and tell members to NOT read things on the internet. The moment they do that, their members start reading blogs and websites with a fervor. This what happened when Rod Meredith stood in front of his congregation and told them to not read this blog. Within hours the readership here increased dramatically and has remained so ever since.
People share things because they are disgusted by what is happening. They share things because they care about their church and want things to change. They share things about the abusive ministers of other groups because they see how their family members and friends lives are being ripped apart. They share things when they see self-appointed pissants proclaiming themselves as God ordained leaders when they know for a fact that these men are outright liars and don't have a godly bone in their bodies.
LCG members and members of other groups share here because they have a platform that allows them to comment. All of the deluded COG leaders out there do not allow members to question or criticize things on their web sites or blogs. If these men were really preaching the truth, then they would be secure in what they teach, but none of them are. They cannot handle anyone questioning them. They all seem to think they are immune to criticism because they are "God's" ministers.
Many in the Living Church of God know lots of things about self-appointed Bob Thiel and what a hypocrite he is and they feel free to comment. This has not made the doubly-blessed prophet and future second witless witness happy.
The world renown Mayan and Fatima authority has this to say about LCG members who read and comment here, particularly against those that mock him. Elijah Thiel cannot wrap his head around the fact that LCG members do not like him and have no problem stating so here.
P.S. In my 06/29/17 a.m. post on this page, I accidentally omitted that according to the Banned by HWA site, the first three sets of comments I reported about from that site were supposedly "From an LCG source." In other words, an unnamed coward who claims to be a Church of God Christian. That person should consider the following:
16 "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. (Exodus 20:16)
18 Whoever hides hatred has lying lips, And whoever spreads slander is a fool. (Proverbs 10:18)
8 ... all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death. (Revelation 21:8)This is not the first time someone who claims to have been in the Living Church of God has sent the Banned by HWA site false information about me (see the 6/15/17 a.m. post on this page). Anyway, presuming it was someone in LCG, it is distressing that any who claim to be a Church of God Christian would make up such falsehoods. Such a person needs repentance.
Furthermore, why would anyone in LCG actually want to help the Banned by HWA site?
The site is not only anti-COG, it seems to relish being anti-CCOG and anti-LCG. Although I do not know LCG's top evangelist, Gerald Weston, well, it is not likely that he would want his members to encourage the Banned by HWA site at all, let alone want his members to post falsehoods.
But it is distressing when any who claim to be in the COG spreads falsehoods to get the way of truth blasphemed (2 Peter 2:2). But in this age we keep seeing it. Many do not have the proper love of the truth.PS Brother Bob
I am NOT anti-COG. What I am against is abusive liars and self-appointed false prophets who preach abusive bullshit and wreck people's lives, like you are doing. If a COG member is grounded in their faith and have a relationship with Christ, then there is not one single thing I can say here that will cause them harm. It is abusers of the brethren like you, Flurry, Pack, Weston, Kubik, and others that are the issue. I am an issue because deep down you know you are a fraud and cannot handle the criticism.
You know, there are people who dismiss the churches that GTA started because "they're the people who rebelled against Mr. Herbert Armstrong". But I have to say that I thought that the most enlightened outlook presented by anyone within any of the Armstrong-related churches came from Mr. Ian Boyne of one of the GTA churches when he commented (I paraphrase) that his purpose in reading the dissident sites was to understand what the churches have done wrong, and to learn how to avoid making the same mistakes in the future, how to do things better. The man has got a conscience! He is treating what we say here as major corporations treat exit interviews. Corporate professionals know that when people speak freely, and under no threat of penalty, many truths come to surface.
ReplyDeleteBob Thiel has that same opportunity to learn. Unfortunately, he postures as the quintessential gold standard, someone who already knows it all. That which caused his severance from LCG has become exaggerated, and without further checks and balances, will lead to his downfall. In that sense, he serves as a microcosm for what is wrong in the vast majority of the ACOG one man shows, all of which are on a downward spiral.
BB
The Force senses major butt-hurt in Arroyo Grande tonight.
ReplyDeleteSee, the thing is, people sense in about ten seconds who has a humble servant's attitude, and who has an "I am the big kahuna" attitude. When you start by insisting you are a prophet, it's going to be an uphill battle finding people to voluntarily buy into your schtick, and to follow. You might attract a couple of masochists, but you seriously marginalize yourself from the broad cross section of humanity.
ReplyDeleteSensible people do not listen to Bathhouse Bob.
ReplyDeleteBanned is open to Bob’s response. He can’t use the “should we answer our accusers” line, because he does answer, but on his closed website of solitude.
ReplyDeleteBut to be fair to Bob, he was in one instance more hospitable to a correction than was Exit & Support. Bob wrote an article pushing water uphill to defend his position, and, while I mentioned that to him, it was not the issue. My actual correction had to do with his misunderstanding of Torah Law and mitzvot. His response was a neutral, “I’ll look into it”, and he corrected his factual mistakes – easily done on a web page, compared to a hard copy.
About the same time, an article on Exit & Support made similar mistakes, and when I sent them a correction, their reply was anything but polite. But, they did correct their mistakes.
And while it may have been coincidence, after I submitted an article regarding Acts 15 to Painful Truth, Bob did appear to make an alteration to his view on the Jerusalem Conference. Well, not a total correction, but a partial one.
Aaaand there he goes threatening any LCG members who might dare to speak against him, or at least comment on his obnoxious behavior while in LCG. Cowards and the lake of fire, no less.
ReplyDeleteMan up, Bob!
Tired Bob has no reason to complain. He gets paid for his mistakes.
ReplyDeleteBob and most COG ministers are occasionally open to factual changes in their presentations. They are not open to conceptional changes however. These would include such topics as:
ReplyDeleteThe New Testament is a fading out of the Jewish Christian Church and the sanctioning of the Pauline, Gentile church which has won the day
The Book of Revelation is not to be read or understood like a News Website or Newspaper.
New Covenant Christianity is not prophecy based
Truth does not flow from the top down only. Sometimes it bubbles up from the ocean floor or cracks in the foundation.
Jesus is not coming in your lifetime so what should your message be?
New angles and twists to the story of the Bible are not marketing tools.
"Never Before Understood" is a bit of an exaggeration
The chance your one true leader is correct in all he claims is very small
The Bible is not best understood "here a little, there a little. Line upon line, precept upon precept." That is a parody of God mocking drunken priests babbling nonsense according to the context and God will give them "nonsense" if that's what they want. (Bob Thiel keeps repeating this oft misquoted concept to teach how to study the Bible)
No God needs money. Just admit you do.
All the COG leaders are going to die just like everyone else and unless you hurry, the vast majority of what you have inflicted in sermons on the faithful will prove inaccurate and completely wrong.
No human being knows the future and prophets,Apostles and Next Leading Evangelists, and some few others, are kidding themselves if they believe they do or may need medications and not congregations.
Actually the list of conceptual misconceptions is endless in the COGs
...and too, sadly and of course...
ReplyDeleteRevelation Jesus was himself mistaken about soon and coming quickly which is probably why the "knowing" power was given back to the Father only as an apologetic for mistaken notions about the end of the age.
Well..actually it was the end of the Age of Aries, the Lamb (of God) and that Jesus was with them until the end of that 2100 BCE to 30ish BCE and the beginning of the Age of Pices , 30ish to 2100ish AD, the Two Fish(ers of men) started the church age, but we best not go there at this time.
:)
30ish AD I meant. Off to work...
ReplyDeleteEvery time Thiel runs off at the mouth like this he comes off looking like a complete fool.
ReplyDeleteDennis getting closer.
ReplyDeleteI like BB's descriptions of the dawn of aquarius. Although he may not have perceived it this way.
nck
In an era of "YELP REVIEWS" and "GOOGLE STAR RATINGS" for everything, leaders in the COG need to realize that they are going to have to dialog and be accountable.
ReplyDeleteThere is actually a website called "HOT or NOT" , where people post their own selfie pictures to the public for ratings! LOL!
So either get used to marketplace feedback or die out. In the end, corporate churches are a marketing commodity. They are subject to the same market forces as everything else. True Christianity, ultimately, is a very private and personal relationship between the believer and Jesus Christ. Church is simply an "add on" to facilitate the process, sort of like protein bars or juice smoothies are to someone who works out.
To say that one cannot have opinion of smoothies or protein bars would be considered ludicrous. The COGs should not be above critical review, and like it or not it is here to stay. Thus, COGs, improve your product and listen to your customers that you are supposedly "serving"! Hats of to Ian Boyne for at least understanding that this is how the world works.
Enlightened businesses engage negative PR and respond to it, and attempt to correct or remedy. The worse thing in public relations is to either deny, or "coverup".
I would love to see an anonymous COG minister evaluation page with star ratings and individual reviews!
I am an LCG member that regularly reads this blog and occasionally comment. This is the only place we can express our frustration of the things he we see wrong in the church. Too many of the men in charge are power hungry and whom could care less about how they ultimately treat us. Too many are arrogant and condescending towards us and make it obvious they don't have time for us. They don't visit us when we are sick, in the hospital or struggling with job loss. Some don't even have time to anoint the sick or even buy a stamp and mail one to us. We are constantly berated by these men week after week because we are never good enough to do right.
ReplyDeleteI am also one who has had many conversations with Bob Thiel over the years. His arrogance and knowitall attitude was tiresome and actually boring. He is just as arrogant and boring in real life as you all experience him on his blogs and in his videos.
Dr. Meredith was right in kicking him to the curb. He should have done it sooner.
Yes Connie,
ReplyDeleteUniversities have websites where professors are rated.
Since you mention it.
I think from a professional viewpoint, if HWA were alive and "banned" or "ambassador report" would have made such website with all 700 ministers listed and people/members/former members started rating them on such website, I firmly believe that I can make a case that HWA would have acted upon the data provided. Actually, I am fairly confident he would have paid for that data.
He was very clear about ministers ability to attract. (as shown in the meredith letter)
nck
Sorry nick. Herbie would have had the Rade shut it down. Members weren't to evaluate ministers. Herbie preferred his own internal ratting system over any sort of open rating system. Odd that one little T would make such a difference, by it does.
DeleteI would love to see an anonymous COG minister evaluation page with star ratings and individual reviews!
ReplyDeleteWell, at least Living University is on RateMyProfessors.com , though it seems that only one professor is rated. I haven't found Flurry's college there at all!
Living University professor ratings
The real story here is not the abuse, but the very bad leakers who need to repent! The "leaks" coming out of LCG are FAKE NEWS. Very possible these supposed LCG sources don't even exist but just fabricated lies made up by bloggers. Failing Banned blog works hard at disparaging & demeaning my tremendous work because they don't want the world to hear the real gospel. It's the single biggest witch hunt in 2000 years of church history! SAD!
ReplyDelete/sarc
I am a p.o.s. and I walk all over members of the church that I don't like and if anybody pisses me off I will disfellowship them!
ReplyDeleteAnd you will not baptize anyone who doesn't have money! Afterall, in the ACOG it's all about the almighty dollar!
DeleteIf the leaders of Cogs like lcg were open and honest with their members, blogs like this would prove to be irrelevant as there won't be much shock to the information provided by sites like this. Do you know how stupid and ignorant it makes you look when you hear that your church has a lawsuit going on or a split is in the works you go down defending God's church and then you realise the critic's were right all along and you were blinded by your sincere religious devotion. I was telling a longtime member of Lcg about the 1975 blunder by the worldwide and he was shocked when he found out from someone more senior than him that it was true, I found that out from the Internet, the guy was almost paralysed by what he found out since he was just making a strong case for the greatness of His church. It felt like I had accidentally kick him in the balls. The man literally went silent and was full of shock. I felt sorry for the guy.
ReplyDeleteLCG does have a review or two on glassdoor.com as an employer, but thats not as interesting.
ReplyDeleteHelen Wheels name one story on banned about LCG that isn't true. If you will note, many of them come with supporting documentation.
ReplyDeleteCurious what you're calling fake news.
Thx. Cheers
Note the "/sarc" at the end of Helen's post. As in "end of sarcasm", or "sarcasm off".
DeleteFactual errors and Catholic or Mayan prophecies aside, I think we agree that for being the head of the only mythical true church that faithfully carries the ‘Philadelphia Standard’, Bob makes a lot of basic Biblical blunders. And for having only a round robin ordination, he takes on the task of being the final authority on doctrine.
ReplyDeleteThe NT does not state the ‘terms’ of the New Covenant, so Bob set himself as the one to 'set the guidelines’. This doesn’t sit well in a COG that claims to keep ‘all God’s laws’ and quotes Matthew 5:17-20.
Unlike ICG, PCG and others, Bob is not in the anthropogenic climate change denial, but reserves the right to pronounce which natural disasters resulted from climate change and which were God’s punishment. Now this is my own understanding of prophets and prophecy, but I would think Bob should have said, ‘If California legalizes same-sex marriage, there will be a severe drought!’ But that pronouncement was instead made in hindsight.
"Do you know how stupid and ignorant it makes you look when you hear that your church has a lawsuit going on or a split is in the works you go down defending God's church and then you realise the critic's were right all along and you were blinded by your sincere religious devotion."
ReplyDeleteBack in '92 and '93, I was telling people that the Tkaches were lying and that they were just trying to figure out how to change the doctrines so as to lose as few people as possible. I wasn't speculating because I had inside sources and knew for a fact the content of conversations Joe Jr., Feazell, Joe Sr., Schnippert, Dr. Stav, and others were having in the Hall of Ad and the Office Facilities Building. Nobody wanted to believe me. There was just no way they were going to take my word over the word of their pastor, the Worldwide News, etc. I got criticized. But I thought people should hear the truth, even if they weren't prepared to accept it at the time. They were all blindsided when Joe Sr. came clean.
It's really tragic that ministers have an atrocious track record of lying in their official capacity, and yet, every time they do, members accept what they say as though there's no way would ever lie to them, as though they had never lied to them before, when in fact, they've done it so many times already it's hard to keep count!
The COGs should not be above critical review, and like it or not it is here to stay.
ReplyDeleteThat review system already exists in your Bible. It's John 10:27.
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me
If your ACOG minister berates you, listen closely. Do you hear the voice of Jesus Christ? If you do, God is correcting you for your own good, and you need to be humble and obey your Shepherd. If you are hearing the voice of Jesus Christ through your minister, you will be happy to be humble and obey, because you will have seen how this has worked out well in the lives of other members of your group.
However, if all you hear is a petty human dictator trying to feed his ego by making you feel small and under his control, and if you have seen people ruined for following that dictators' guidance, you are disobeying Christ if you obey such an un-Christlike human leader.
How can you be sure you have found the true Shepherd guarding His flock? Look for a pasture filled with contented sheep who are flourishing under the Shepherd's care. If the sheep are fearful, or are biting each other, or are being sold for mutton, that flock does not have Jesus Christ as its Shepherd. Go elsewhere.
Personally, I have yet to see any ACOG group that resembles a flock of contented sheep flourishing under the care of their Shepherd and His human assistants. If you have found such a group, I consider you lucky and I wish you well.
Anonymous July 2, 2017 9:30 AM said: "...I am also one who has had many conversations with Bob Thiel over the years. His arrogance and knowitall attitude was tiresome and actually boring. He is just as arrogant and boring in real life as you all experience him on his blogs and in his videos. Dr. Meredith was right in kicking him to the curb. He should have done it sooner."
ReplyDeleteTbh I regularly read Thiel's spiel and have done so for several years now. I enjoy his analysis on national and international news from a Christian eschatological perspective.
Having said that I admit I am finding his repetition frustrating and tiresome of late. Rarely does a post go by that Thiel hasn't made reference to Daniel 11:39 or his view that America is the "strongholds" mentioned therein or refers to Revelation 17:12-13 or his view that the EU will reorganize with 10 leaders as fulfillment of that passage or that Habakkuk 2 is a prophecy about America's skyrocketing debt and its economic collapse or most especially refers to a previous post (or publications of his) wherein he "predicted" such and such and it's just happened or is in the process of happening so he blows his own trumpet that such supposedly proves his "prophetic" gifts. And I've kind of noted a pattern that if you look at any particular week or month of the year he seems to rehash the same topics he did at the same time last year and the year before that.
So although I don't discount his views re Daniel 11, Habakkuk 2 and the US or Revelation 13, 17 and the EU I'm feeling like in recent months I've learned enough having eaten the meat and spat out any bones that I can start to move on. I feel like I'd be hindering my spiritual growth otherwise. And there's far more to learn than what Thiel in his limited capacity offers his readership.
Anon3:53 PM-
ReplyDeleteYeah, I put the sarcasm off tag in there just for people like you who wouldn't get that I was comparing the sort of rhetoric that Thiel is using here with the sort of rhetoric Drumpf uses, by rephrasing Thiel's talking points in language copied and pasted from Drumpf's many silly tweets.
12:13
ReplyDeleteYou are right about the preference.
I was talking about the ability to flexibily accept the irreversible. (i.e. The internet and its specifics)
Nck
Let Bob consider this scripture: "You shall not make merchandise out of the brethren"
ReplyDelete