Dedicated to David C. Pack, Gerald R. Flurry, Dr Robert Thiel, Mr. Gerald Weston and All the Lesser Sliverados
A Skill Never Learned
(I should add a previous article on The Church Member Bill of Rights as it is a specific list of topics in the mind your own business category up with which you should not put.
https://hwarmstrong.com/blog/2018/05/12/the-church-members-bill-of-rights-basic-rights-any-member-of-a-church-should-expect-to-enjoy/comment-page-1/)
(I should add a previous article on The Church Member Bill of Rights as it is a specific list of topics in the mind your own business category up with which you should not put.
https://hwarmstrong.com/blog/2018/05/12/the-church-members-bill-of-rights-basic-rights-any-member-of-a-church-should-expect-to-enjoy/comment-page-1/)
Dr Thiel, his yearly Christmas is Pagan orgasm having now run its course, has launched, as expected, into the New Year's is Pagan and we should not do it stage of the year. He's delighted that a non-Christian in Turkey has agreed with him that New Years is very bad and it should not be done. There is the generic drunken orgy descriptions, but I suspect he's never actually been around most people who actually note the passing of the year.
Personally, I can't stay up that long for no good reason and simply revert to sundown being good enough a time to start January 1st. I have never been much of a party person to begin with and always take and park my car strategically whenever so I can leave when I want and I do. Borderline introvert I suppose.
We all know quite well that past and present both minister for sure and member too often have never mastered the fine art of minding one's own business.
Can you imagine someone telling Dave Pack, after a sermon on how they should give their money to him and often to simply "mind your own business"? LOL! Excellent!
Ditto for Bob Thiel who compulsively feels the need to set everyone straight on just about every topic he can think of that he himself believes he needs to adhere to personally. Much of it lies in the category of "mind your own business" even when he hunts and pecks around the Bible for God's authentication and validation on the topic. And of course, you find it.
My dad had a now son adopted way of telling others, including his doctor (dad passed away at 98) and ministry (he was an elder in WCG) that anything they told him to do or how to think would be "taken under advisement." In his world, that usually was the polite way to say "No, and please mind your own business." The Doc told Dad of his concern because at 95 Dad had "an extra heartbeat" that concerned the Doctor. Whatever the remedy was supposed to be, Dad told him that at his age one never knew when they'd need an extra one and not to worry about it but he'd take the advice or even the should or must under advisement. Works for me.
I'm at the stage in belief or lack of it where I have no idea if there is a real God telling others what to tell us as to how to think and be, or just a bunch of Priests and Scribes making stuff up in the name of their cultic deity for power and control. I'm more a fan of show up and cut out all the crazy middlemen if all this is so vitally important and my eternal future depends on getting all this exactly right or else. I tend to opt for the latter but that's my perspective and issue based on my own experience and understanding.
"Thus saith the Lord and now say I unto you" just doesn't inspire confidence in me after all the drama and trauma of the WCG and frankly growing up Church experiences.
But my wish for these men in particular is to better practice the fine art of minding their own business and the wisdom to know when, which of course they won't. Bob Thiel's recent rant on New Years, as expected, made me respond mentally almost immediately with "Bob, you need to mind your own business. I'll discuss it with God myself if and when the opportunity arises"
“There are only three kinds of business in the universe: mine, yours, and God’s.” ~ Byron Katie
Do you think you’re responsible for the universe? Or do you stick to your own business?
Where do you draw the line between your business and other people’s business?
If we suffer, it’s usually because we’re in somebody else’s business, not minding our own life and choices.
We try to give advice, dictate how things should (or shouldn’t) be, and complain when things don’t work out.
We feel anxious, stressed, disappointed, and discouraged.
Other people can do the same thing to you, sticking their nose in your business. How does that make you feel?
When you walk around with the weight of the world on your shoulders, you won’t be able to focus on yourself. Instead you’re focused outwardly, looking for ways to fix the planet.
The world can include your spouse/partner, kids, coworkers, neighbors, your countrymen, politics, the environment, and an endless barrage of causes for concern.
The thing is: when we are not focused internally, minding our own business, making sure that we’re following our own advice and living our lives truthfully, we won’t be able to help others. We’re doing the world and ourselves a disservice.
If you want to end your suffering of wanting to change things outside of your control, look within to see why you do it in the first place.
Why do we get into other people’s business?
Interfering in other people’s business can be so ingrained that we do it subconsciously most of the times. If it’s not an action, it’s with words or thoughts. We can’t wait for the person to finish so we can jump in with our advice.
The underlying reasons behind our behavior are usually one (or a combination) of the following.
Knowing better
We feel qualified to give advice. We know better than the other person. We can guide them in changing their behavior and doing things the way we see fit—for them.
Rigid expectations
We have a view of how things should be and expect everyone to comply with such a view. We feel the need to tell others how to act or what to do in order to comply with “what should be”.
An amplified sense of responsibility
We take it upon ourselves to feel responsible for everybody’s business. We will feel guilty if we don’t get involved. The flip side of this is: we don’t trust that others are capable of taking care of their own business.
Think about the times you got involved and offered unsolicited advice or help. Why did you do it? What can you learn from it?
The art of minding your own business
Knowing when to get involved in other people’s business (or not) is an art.
When it’s a matter of life and death, the action required is pretty clear. For example if someone is drowning, you will either try to save them or you’ll get help. But if someone is talking about a painful breakup or a challenge at work, you don’t necessarily need to butt in.
The art of minding your business involves:
Using your intuition
You focus internally on your own life and your own business. If a friend needs a compassionate ear, you listen intently, without showering her with advice.
Most of the time it will be about you offering sympathy, compassion and understanding rather than judgment, advice and opinions.
Neutralizing thoughts and actions
To know the parameters of your own business and to stick to them is an art. It takes practice to master the skill. It’s not easy to not offer advice or act on behalf of others.
It’s even harder to quiet the mind in a way that you stop thinking interfering or judgmental thoughts. You stay in a neural state.
Letting others be
As you learn to be in your own business, you let others be in theirs. You trust that they’ll do what needs to be done in a way that serves them best. You feel responsible only for yourself and your actions without fear or guilt.
Within the art of being in your own business, there are a few straightforward guidelines to help you in interacting with others and your environment.
The science of minding your own business
The following guidelines can be applied in most situations.
Don’t offer advice unless you’re specifically asked for it. You’re not obligated, nor expected to chime in.
Offer your help or advice with no strings attached. If you have expectations, take a step back and try to neutralize your thoughts about the situation. Help only from a place of love and compassion, not guilt or expectation.
Remove yourself from situations where you need to take sides and the situation doesn’t involve you, or could potentially damage a relationship. You won’t do others a favor by getting in their business. Let them sort it out and if they need your help, trust that they’ll ask for it.
When you mind your business you will feel lighter; you’re not in charge of the universe. You’re more at peace. You are responsible for your life and free from expectations and disappointments.
Start today by focusing on your own needs and business. Trust that others and the universe will take care of their business. The more you trust and focus inwardly, the more things start falling into place, the way they’re meant to be.
Thiel is an idiot, no doubts about that!
ReplyDeleteHOWEVER-- isn't our interest then in Thiel also a matter of US "not minding our own business"??
Gamaliel"s advice in the Bible has a wisdom to it...
“In the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail."
And there is really no need to worry, as guys like Pack, Flurry, Malm, Thiel, Weinland ad nauseam, for they will surely fail, die and be forgotten and (at best) be a footnote in some cult reference book somewhere.
I confess that my interest in "all things WCG universe" is nothing more than a sick obsession, similar to when one gets "jilted" by a longtime lover , and you wonder on what they are doing/ dating/ living at etc.
I really do need to "get a life", and "get over it". Watching the COG continuing train wreck is sort of like watching and getting wrapped up in the drama of pro wrestling, or a serial TV series like "Mad Men" or "Lost". The reality of all the drama is really not relevant to my life, but a strange virtual fascination.
I think I need to join a hiking club, or knitting group!
Me too Tonto! lol!
DeleteWho are you kidding Tonto. You have an agenda you will never leave nor the likes of Anon 8:13.
DeleteIn all my years I am yet to encounter church members who don't mind their own business.
ReplyDeleteI know right, Tonto. I think Banned serves more of a watcher of the watchers kind of site for the benefit of those who might not get the big picture of what being involved getting involved with them. I have my moments as well where it is just let it all go and let the buyer beware on their own. In reality, I don't find many convinced either by the views of others on whether they should get involved with a Dave Pack or Gerald Flurry. It seems a function of knock yourself out but don't say you weren't warned etc. And too, why bother to warn. No one warned me! lol. Live and burn!
ReplyDeleteSometimes I read Cogwriter or at least the topic and see Bob being hardly prophet like with simply asking questions he is dying to answer and then his answers get me going! lol
I plan to sit alone in the yard this evening with my telescope instead of knitting. I did my biking for the day.
1020. I guess as a pastor I did have people running to me to let me know so and so was such and such. Perhaps it was their way of believing it a good in with me or something. I also had the occasional member sneak into a hospital room against all protocols and family wishes to anoint someone or pray for them or both, with one breaking into tongues for the poor patient who didn't know what the hell was going on. That was rare but over the top minding another' business uninvited.
I think the Church Member Bill of Right is a list of what I not the business of the minister or elders on visits etc. Most members , in my experience, had enough going on in their own lives to not mind the business of their friends. I don't believe I minded too much of theirs and they often wanted to mind mine as I recall.
I am not sure why this was posted here unless the problem is meddling in all of the ACOG splinters. That I can agree with. I personally learned early in life to avoid trying to solve other peoples problems. When someone would come to me and say so and so told me about this problem; what can you do about it? My response was; since so and so came to you and not me they must expect your help in solving it.
ReplyDeleteI have question: How could a member sneak in and anoint a person the hospital? Did you give them an anointed cloth" ASB
Tonto, you have made some excellent points here and on the comment thread regarding Dennis' last post. God's plans will succeed irrespective of what we think or do - they don't require our help, and they will not be hindered by our attempts to obstruct them.
ReplyDeleteWe should all respect each other's unique journeys and be willing to acknowledge that different conclusions/destinations are possible. Need proof? Consider the very different conclusions which Dennis and Neo have reached!
Our shared experiences of the WCG and its splinters, should have taught all of us that it is dangerous to suppose that our understanding is the one and only legitimate one. The TRUTH is not a fragile thing. If you can demonstrate today that something is true, you should be able to demonstrate its truth tomorrow or twenty years from tomorrow! And,if we are not willing to explain/modify/adjust/change our current understanding of something based on new information or evidence, we cannot claim to be objective or open-minded. As our past experiences should have taught us, we are NOT infallible (even in matters of faith) - We MUST entertain the possibility that we could be wrong (and that the other guy may be right)!
I have question: How could a member sneak in and anoint a person the hospital? Did you give them an anointed cloth" ASB
ReplyDeleteNo, I had nothing to do with it. The member was dying of cancer and the woman got it in her head to practice faith healing. I think she thought I had not done enough, whatever that might entail. She also had started speaking in tongues so emotionally she was primed for such a thing. It was most unwelcomed by the family and the member died in the next day or so. As her pastor etc I did get the job of cleaning up after with the hospital and family.
Thanks Dennis for that information. I can relate to that. My wife's family is Apostolic Pentecostal and they go through that same procedure when dealing with deathly sickness. They respect me because I have accepted their procedure and have prayed with them. Of course I have never spoken in tongues so I don't have the holy spirit they have, ASB
ReplyDeleteSeems like there's a little yin and yang to this thing. The nose of the minister is in the business of the members. The nose of the members? Well, it wouldn't be polite to repeat the location. But, I can tell you that it is brown and rather smelly! So the relationship of the nose is what preserves the functionality of Armstrongism.
ReplyDeleteBB
Tonto said:
ReplyDelete"Thiel is an idiot, no doubts about that!
HOWEVER-- isn't our interest then in Thiel also a matter of US "not minding our own business"?? "
Calling out the lies of Bob Thiel is not "meddling in his business" if Thiel was doing good for others instead of deliberately lying about his double blessings, dreams, and his self-appointment, then there would be no need to call him out. People's lives are at stake because of his lies. There is nothing godly about the man.
It may not be any of my business, BUT...BUT whatever happened to Cartoon Bob? What made it my business is when "almost arrested for Sabbath keeping doubly blessed Dr. from a degree mill Bob Thiel announced to the world that God kicked open the door of animation to the grossly misnamed Continuing Church of God.
ReplyDeleteIs God "shaking the nations" with cartoon Bob?
Richard
ANON AT 1:56 Who are you kidding Tonto. You have an agenda you will never leave nor the likes of Anon 8:13.
ReplyDeleteMY COMMENT:
Yes, I have an agenda, and I will be open and honest about it. My personal mission is to fulfill the prophecy made by Paul Revere and Raiders, at the end of the song "Cherokee Nation" which quotes this ..."Maybe someday when we've learned , Cherokee Nation will return, will return, will return"...
Listen to quote here:
https://youtu.be/QZ0gobSHgIs?t=141
First the return of the Cherokee Nation, and then the return of Jesus Christ.
Nuff said!
I thought you "retired" and went away to mind your own business (atheism). WTF?
ReplyDelete