CGI: Covid-19 Ain’t That Bad!
The Church of God International’s follow-up to Pastor Bill Watson’s Coronavirus Report is out. The International News (Summer 2020 edition) features an article on its front page by Mike James entitled “No Need to Panic Over This Pandemic.” In fairness to Mr. James, this offering is better sourced and more thoughtful than his colleague’s presentation on the subject. Unfortunately, his attempt to provide some historical perspective on humankind’s experiences with pandemics ends up trying to minimize the seriousness of our current predicament.
In the article, Mr. James provides a brief summary of several historical pandemics and provides estimates of the mortality rates associated with them. However, the information he presents about them seems to contradict his own conclusion that “this present virus is not as significant” as the events he references in the piece.
James begins with the Peloponnesian War and estimates that between 75-100,000 Athenians lost their lives in that pandemic. He tells us that approximately five million souls perished during the 115-year period of the Antonine Plague. James also references the horrific death tolls experienced during successive episodes of bubonic plague, possibly numbering 100-200 million people. He also references the number of Native American deaths attributed to smallpox and measles over the five-hundred-year history of European settlement in the Americas. James informs us that one or two million souls perished over one-hundred years of successive cholera pandemics. He talks about as many as 150,000 folks dying as a consequence of yellow fever in the waning years of the 19th Century. After referencing another 15 million deaths due to bubonic plague in the 19th and 20th Centuries, he proceeds to discuss several flu pandemics. Mr. James informs us that about 360,000 died because of the Russian flu, 50-100 million because of the Spanish flu, one million attributed to Asian flu and 200,000 worldwide deaths because of swine flu. Finally, Mr. James reminds us that as many as 35 million souls have perished over the last fifty years because of AIDS.
Historical perspective is good. We must not ever forget what a horrible toll these diseases have exacted upon humanity in times past. Looking back reminds us of the terrible cost of these pandemics and the fact that we must be ever vigilant about the threats which they pose to our existence as a species. These past sorrows, however, should NEVER be used to minimize the threat that we are facing in the present.
Over the last seven months, we have lost over 330,000 souls to this pandemic worldwide (as of 5/22/2020) and over 95,000 in the United States. How do those numbers compare with the statistics that Mr. James cites in his article? The facts speak for themselves and do not require any further commentary from me (or anyone else).
Miller Jones
CGI's fearless leader, the Great Orange One (Donald Trump), announced today that churches are
ReplyDelete"essential places that provide essential services." "Now, who in their right mind could disagree with that?" his supporters will ask. "Those demonic Democratic governors who are suppressing our freedoms need to be stopped!" they will shout. I wonder how many lives will be sacrificed on the altar of Trump? In yet another cynical ploy to appeal to that narrow slice of Americana known as his base, the Great Pretender has sought to divide and conquer yet again. I hope and pray that God will frustrate the efforts of him and his supporters in this regard!
I would wager that the per capita rate of ACOG ministers qualifying for the Lake of Fire is far higher than the per capita rate of fatal COVID-19 infections.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDelete“Church of God International: Covid-19 Ain't That Bad!”
Maybe not, but the Church of God International is bad. It was started by Garner Ted Armstrong and others who rebelled against Herbert W. Armstrong and the Worldwide Church of God. COGI members were already really sick long ago.
I wanted to share this comment that I received regarding the above post:
ReplyDeleteChild mortality has been high through much of history. Even 100 years ago most families could expect half their children to die before reaching adulthood (hence the need for large families, to ensure some would survive). Should we therefore say to people who've recently lost a child, "Put it in perspective, people 100 years ago lost lots of children. Get over it"?
@ 2:05 pm
ReplyDeleteNot all CGI members are "already really sick" as you falsely claim as many of us had no affiliation with the worldwide church. Many including myself came into the CGI without really know who they were. Many of us came in when there was no internet or when the internet was new and there was not a lot of information about them out there.
Like many new off the street members I thought they were just an ordinary sabbath keeping church like the Seventh Day Adventists or Seventh Day Baptists. I knew virtually nothing about them. I began seeing some signs and began hearing things about GTA and the Worldwide Church. I came in after GTA was fired and knew nothing about him. Around the time I joined about a half of dozen other newbies came in around the same time and they knew nothing about the CGI's past as well.
I began seeing and hearing things in the CGI that seemed odd and not really biblical. As the internet grew and more information became available I began researching the CGI and the Worldwide church, and what I found completely turned me off this organization. The funny thing is that those other half dozen Church of God newbies who came in around the same time as me left around the same time as well. I guess they also saw through the Armstrong organization. Too bad the Church of God lifers didn't see what us newbies saw and left as well. Instead they are just bouncing around from one church to another.
Although I was only with the church for about two or three years I find it odd that I'm here on Banned reading about and commenting on the churches of God. I accidentally stumbled across this site a couple of years ago. I guess there is some kind of bizarre fascination with this strange religion of Armstrongism although my only experience was with the CGI.
So I have to say to Anon 2:05 pm, it's really unfair for you to accuse many current and former CGI members such as I and others who came in off of the street as newbies as being "rebellious" and "already sick". Totally unfair as we had no Worldwide Church past.
If we rebelled against anyone it was Jesus; and against the real mainstream cross wearing, Jesus and Holy Spirit believing Christian churches that we were members of to join up with this church of God insanity. Thank God many of us left the church of God mess and returned to serving the real Jesus. And yes I do like wearing my cross necklace and being led by the Holy Spirit and praising Jesus. So Anon 2:05 pm, you can keep your Church of God insanity and I'll walk with Jesus and allow myself to be lead by the Holy Spirit that your churches of God deny and are embarrassed about and keep my God given sanity.
Craig
Craig,
ReplyDeleteAmen, well said, and may God bless you on your journey!
God Can't be Contained!,...Karen!
ReplyDeletePandemics of 1918 death toll is estimated to have been anywhere from 17 million to 50 million, and possibly as high as 100 million worldwide, making it one of the deadliest pandemics in human history.
ReplyDeleteCorona, not so much.
Miller Jones writes> The facts speak for themselves and do not require any further commentary from me (or anyone else).
ReplyDeleteOtherwise the science is settled in your mind. That is not science.
As with climate change, true science is never settled. It is on going and constantly challenged. Speaking as a authority figure requires you to give your credentials as to the authority you claim. If this is the standard for Bob Thiel it is the standard for Miller Jones.
The numbers are exaggerated. Hospitals get money for marking a death as covid instead of some other cause.
ReplyDeleteJobs are essential. Power drunk politicians are not. COGs are not.
ReplyDeleteI think all the splinter groups should cancel sermonettes and sermons tomorrow and instead listen to Kate Tempest's poem titled "People's Faces." Maybe this will help them to get a grip.
ReplyDeleteThere is no virus, it’s all a lie.
ReplyDeleteHey anonymous at 2:05. You are ignorant & do not know what you are talking about. Nobody rebelled against HWA he threw Ted out because Ted confronted him about his incest with his daughter
ReplyDeleteYou can believe HWA's apologist lies if you want but maybe you need to wake up & read Jack Kessler's letter to Stan Rader back in the early 1980's
I guess HWA modeled his purges like those of Stalin & Hitler. HWA was also jealous that GTA had better responses on his telecasts & appearances that Herbert did.
Why is CGI suddenly the target ? CGI now is a shadow of what it once was for various reasons.
ReplyDeleteWhy are people fuelling the focus on CGI? I thought Victor Kubic had preached as a friend in their congregations ? Do you not approve ? Has it all turned sour so now the focus ? We can all single out this sermon or that and demolish it.
How are people telling the truth treated in your neck of the woods ? Baited and hated perhaps.
ReplyDeletePower hungry politicians are using the virus as an excuse to shred the constitutions bill of rights. That is, physical Israel is following spiritual Israel in being ruled over by tyrants. The ACOGs conveniently ignore this even though they have mentioned the principle many times.
It's kinda funny watching these church leaders bellyaching about the government treating them as children, even though they treat their members the same way.
I very much doubt 'Craig' has ever stepped foot in a CGI church. Or even he exists.
ReplyDeletewell Mike is right, it's not that bad...the seasonal flu is much deadlier, but no one wants to talk about that.
ReplyDeletelast thing I read said that about half of those with covid-19 have no symptoms...doesn't get much milder than that.
even the CDC is backing off it's earlier claims and now saying that it takes prolonged exposure to someone with the virus in order to catch it.....the earlier idea that contaminated surfaces were dangerous is now being dismissed.
it will turn out to be one big hoax....make people afraid and you can convince them of anything. (something you accuse WCG of...and there was a grain of truth to that)
My one word response to this crisis...
ReplyDeleteSWEDEN
"During this difficult time there is a very important question we all need to be asking ourselves, and I haven’t heard anyone ask it yet: What would Jesus have us do?
ReplyDeleteIt’s a game-changer: 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment, and the second is like it, Love your neighbor as yourself' (Matthew 22:37-39).
Ultimately, this issue shouldn’t be about anyone’s “freedoms,” but about caring for and helping each other. That’s what Americans do, or used to.
To mask or not to mask — that is the question. But it shouldn’t be.
'Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.'
— Philippians 2:4"
--Dorothy Horne for the Longview News-Journal
After watching my wife battle COVID19, both in treating others who contracted it and when she contracted it herself, you'll pardon me for not buying you guys' little theories. I may be glad in general that its not as transmissible as originally thought, but when I hear this kind of stupidity from people who haven't experienced it, I don't have a problem wishing it on your dumb asses.
ReplyDeleteRSK
ReplyDeleteThe death rate of COVID19 per 100,000 is lower than previous flues in the last few decades. Basing policy based on your wife is hardly scientific. I remind you that the lockdown is a type of living death, but it's unsurprising the old people who have lived their lives, aren't bothered by this. And what about the young people? What about their hopes and dreams? Are they supposed to eat cake?
"Ultimately, this issue shouldn’t be about anyone’s “freedoms,” but about caring for and helping each other. That’s what Americans do, or used to."
ReplyDeleteThis is precisely what America did for several weeks with shelter-in-place orders that had taken place nationwide. Mitigation was designed to minimize the asymptomatic spread of covid19 and soften the load on the healthcare industry, ICUs, ventilators, etc.
"Quarantine is when you restrict movement of sick people. Tyranny is when you restrict the movement of healthy people."
DBP
Anonymous 5/23 @ 9:48 PM,
ReplyDeleteWe've lost more folks to Covid-19 in less than four months than we lost in nine years to war in Vietnam! As for the death rate per 100,000, we don't have that figure nailed down yet (Due to a dearth of testing, we still don't know for sure how many people even have the disease - which obviously makes uncertain the number of deaths which should be attributed to it). And your answer is old folks are selfish? Do you think old folks enjoy being cut off from the people that they have loved and cared for their entire lives? You sound like an advocate for social Darwinism - Let's get rid of the old and weak so that the young and strong can fulfill their hopes and dreams! Who's being selfish?
RSK May 23, 2020 at 4:30 PM
ReplyDeleteAnd when people begin to kill themselves because they are ruined financially, do we say the lock down was worth it? When the mortgage cannot be satisfied, will the people say the lock down was worth it even when they lose their housing? No.
5:49
ReplyDeleteI'm rather sympathetic toward Opinionateds arguments. I have however noticed on other blogs that he clings to dangerous theorizing to bend reality in adressing genuine concerns. For instance "hope" invested in hydro/malaria medicine as a preventive measure.
I hear his concerns and I am pretty sure this young brave childless single Egyptian would never have let the Israelites go with Moses for so petty a reason of firstborns dying.
Egypt would be strong and prosperous. Lets conquer the Nubians and have us some extra replacement kids.
Nck
nck is misleading. Look at the comments here> http://livingarmstrongism.blogspot.com/2020/05/hydroxychloroquine-is-no-good-against.html#comment-form
ReplyDeleteMiller and nck give misleading statement. Every-man should decide logic on their own level. I am a collector of information. I have nothing to sell but the ideology of self determination.
Look at the comments here and expand your horizons> http://livingarmstrongism.blogspot.com/2020/05/pcg-insists-coronavirus-death-toll-is.html
Oh yeah.
ReplyDeleteI forgot. Opunionated does not recognize the gathered statistics regarding the first borns that died. As I said..... Make Egypt Great Again.
Just poking fun Opinionated.
I am sympathetic toward your opinion regarding economy and most non medical arguments. Its a tough job leading a nation. Not many people truly know the difficulties of being a pharaoh and tough choices facing a pharaoh.
Perhaps the local governors of Luxor, Asuan, Nubia, Heliopolis should decide the issue of the Israelites. Those statistics on frogs, hail, children must be rigged.
BTW. The temple at Karnak will be opened to the mourning crowds. They are essential service. Those rumors about 140 temple infections in assyria this week are lies designed by the papyri industry to frighten us all and kill egyptian magical thinking mystery religion.
Nck
Hahah.
ReplyDeleteI like my new self appointed role as advocate for the "dull administrators" of the Egyptian and Assyrian empires, worrying about the costs of all those "costly wars". Calculating on those papyri and stone tablets, the dull realities costs and operational demands, of "making a name unto oneself that would resound through history."
And now the papyri fear press demands the release of the "Hebrews", oh man.........whose gonna compensate for that..........?
What........a siege of a distant hill fort, of some obscure tribe................this is gonna cost us big time..............? (Stone tablet Ashur XII found in Nineveh library)
nck
CGI IS correct! This virus is really no different than the annual flu! Wake up people!
ReplyDelete* So far, influenza and pneumonia in the U.S. for this 2019-2020 season has affected about 36-51 million people with approximately 83,780 deaths so far.
* Annual worldwide flu cases average about 800,000,000 (that's 800 million) with up to 500,000 deaths.
This worldwide hysteria is NOT a crisis; FAR from it. Here are some “real” pandemics from past history:
* The Black Death of 1331-1353 - Killed up to 200 million / Up to 60% of Europe
* The Spanish Flu of 1918-1920 – Up to 100 million people died worldwide