From a reader.
The UCG "Council of Elders" , is 100% USA based, with all white ministry. Even the international regional representatives are home-based in the USA.
Nearly half of the UCG membership lives AWAY from the USA, yet has no council representation of someone who lives there!
Thousands of black Africans are in the UCG, yet not one council member who lives and works in Africa.
Baseball desegregated in 1947 with Jackie Robinson, but it was 30 years later before a black manager was seen in baseball (Frank Robinson). UCG, just like baseball, speaks out against racism, but the real proof will be when they allow empowerment in upper management at the Council level of a minority presence and representative to the population numbers that are members of the UCG.
UCG, on the international basis, is still practicing a Colonial European plantation mentality to its own members. TontoThis lack of leadership diversity in the Church of God is not unique to UCG. Living Church of God, COGWA, Philadelphia Church of God, Restored Church of God, and many others are white based in its leadership and almost exclusively American in its international leadership.
Would diversity matter? HWA had his board of trustees. All were dependent on HIM for their jobs, titles, homes on Waverly Drive, etc. I don't think a one of them had any real input on decision making. GROUPTHINK, was everywhere. HWA gave his views, then asked, "What do you think?" The answer, I imagine, was always the same. Probably, the only person who had some input, or could manipulate HWA was Stanley Rader. Few others would jeopardize their positions, titles, offices, etc. by questioning HWA. But, what if the people, the members could choose their representatives to serve on the board and they would as many of them as they are the appointed members? What if the leaders had to sit and answer questions from the membership concerning doctrines and policies? Weren't the student leaders at AC appointed by the leadership of the college? Just pick those who can be manipulated or who already think like the boss. Imagine if RCM chose the leaders? Here's a thought. When RCM was head of Church Admin, if you did a personality profile of those who he appointed to the ministry or promoted in the ministry, if they would be of a certain type, versus those who were appointed by other heads of Church Admin., such as David Antion or C. Wayne Cole (I'm showing my age now)?
ReplyDeleteWhen RCM was head of Church Admin, if you did a personality profile of those who he appointed to the ministry or promoted in the ministry, if they would be of a certain type, versus those who were appointed by other heads of Church Admin
ReplyDeleteVery good insight. In LCG, there are huge personality differences between the typical personality type ordained under LCG's Doug Winnail, the typical personality type ordained under LCG's Carl McNair, the typical personality type ordained in WCG during HWA's lifetime, and the typical personality type ordained in WCG under the Tkaches. The handful of LCG/Bryce ordinations are probably closest to the McNair ordinations. One way to understand the tensions in LCG is to notice the conflict between these different personality types.
What??????
ReplyDeleteSince when did Church become a democracy????
Oh yeah, I forgot about the RCC, they change doctrine to suit the masses.
Why? because of all the UCG splits and splinters thats why.
ReplyDeleteWhat would be the personality type of a doubly blessed annointation by G Bonjour?
ReplyDeleteNck
Outside of the US, members are considered as half-humans.
ReplyDeleteNar, even if they are half-human, there could be a couple at the CoE.
Was Meatloaf singing about Theil?
ReplyDeletehttps://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/meatloaf/paradisebythedashboardlight.html
Tonto likes to play a dangerous game of opposite double life living. Arrogantly biting the hand that feeds.
ReplyDeleteNo-one would ever suspect. I am superior in intellect. My cronies will fight to protect me. I have all options covered....
This will not end well.
Anon at 3:56 ---
ReplyDeleteI have never received a dime from any COG or the UCG, nor has any relative of mine. I am not ordained by the UCG. I am not a ministers wife. So your comment about "biting the hand that feeds" is a weird obsession of yours.
I will gladly call you to confirm this fact. Email me your phone number at tontosixkiller@gmail.com and I will discretely call you in complete confidentiality.
Dennis Diehl knows who I am , as does Gary the administrator here. Both will vouch that your cockamamie imaginations are way off!
Talk is cheap in your other fake life as Connie you claimed Victor Kubic a close friend.
DeleteYou are not as skilled a writer as you think. Biggest mistake was flooding the Anti COG world with your comments upon comments for years and years.
This is funny.
ReplyDeletePlease rise....... and turn to..... Paradise by the dashboard light. (on the tune of Horst Wesel lied... (inside joke))
Announcements:
We have apointed 4 gentile members into the general council, representing 2 entire abd complete votes.
Sermon:
Did the Assyrians introduce Bratwurst at Stonehenge.
End prayer.
Please beware of wolfs like DCP who will make you drive 4 hours to services.
Nck
I can only remember one African American minister in the WCG - Elbert Atlas Where is he now?
ReplyDeleteNck, stop right there, before we go any further, do you.......
ReplyDeleteWe were barely seventeen and we were "doubly blessed"...
How many of the admins and writers from this blog are black?
ReplyDeleteI think its zero. But there are also likely no Asians, Indians or Muslims either. This blog has a severe lack of diversity.
And as we all know diversity = righteousness.
What about all the religions in China? There are no black people there. Or in Indonesia or Japan? They must all be racists!
Dear Anon:
ReplyDeleteI am not "Anti COG". I believe in God, and care about the Body of Christ of true believers. I am , without a doubt, anti cult, anti self appointed Biblical characters like Pack/Flurry and many more, and anti centralized collective communistic church business models, where the body of believers have no say, and where leadership has no accountability.
Often in the COG 'servants" are on top of those served. Strange stuff.
Was Jesus anti-Jewish because he pointed out the faults and corruption of the established hijacked Temple staff and priests? Did he come to "tear the veil" in the temple, to liberate all people to have a direct relationship with God, without the interlopers who pretend to be the mediators between man and God??
Nonetheless, I am nothing to the corporate COGs, and although there are those amongst them that are good decent folk, including ministers, I hold no titles or empowerment there. If you wish to slap a label on me, I am a follower of the COG 7th Day Denver. Even in the corrupt Temple of Jesus time, there were some Pharisees that had a soul, and were good people.
I am not a close friend of Victor Kubik. I do have relatives who attend the UCG, however, none of them are close friends of Victor Kubik either, and none of them are ordained or employed by the UCG.
Enough about me, and who cares anyway. You give way too much credence and empowerment to some commenter on website. Your fascination with me is odd, and you need to get a life. Again, "anonymous" take up my challenge and lets chat sometime! Im not afraid to do so, so why are you?
Anon @ 8:24 am wrote: How many of the admins and writers from this blog are black?
ReplyDeleteI think its zero. But there are also likely no Asians, Indians or Muslims either. This blog has a severe lack of diversity."
Thre are two admins here, me, the blog owner, and Dennis a contributor. I approve and/delete comments coming through, not Dennis. Many others have contributed here who are people of color or of some other nationality. I have long supported the opinions of others and have given them room to write articles here. Of particular note being Ian Boyne of Jamacia. The chances of Anon @ 8:24 being a person of color is pretty much nihil considering he is from Armstrongism.
Tonto wrote: "Enough about me, and who cares anyway. You give way too much credence and empowerment to some commenter on website. Your fascination with me is odd, and you need to get a life. Again, "anonymous" take up my challenge and lets chat sometime! Im not afraid to do so, so why are you?"
ReplyDeleteSometimes those comments coming through are so ludicrous that they have more entertainment value than anything else. People usually have a good method of shooting themselves in the foot when they do this.
NO2HWA said,"this lack of leadership diversity in the Church of God is not unique to UCG. Living Church of God, COGWA, Philadelphia Church of God, Restored Church of God, and many others are white based in its leadership and almost exclusively American in its international leadership".
ReplyDeleteMY COMMENT - The WCG and its splinter harlot daughter churches certainly did not learn the lack of diversity from their dead Sardis parent/grandparent church. For example, African American Whaid Rose is a past President over multiple terms of the Church of God, Seventh Day. Small in the USA, the "dead Church" has an international membership of 300,000. It is decentralized, and administered by their diverse International Ministerial Congress with leaders located onsite in international countries and whom are as diverse as its members are diverse.
Nope, today's Armstrong Churches of God didn't learn it from their dead Sardis grand parents!
Richard
Guys don't care all that much about what others think of them, but women do. Which is why I think Tonto is Connie. My suspicion is that Tonto is Connie plus her husband, the dynamic duo.
ReplyDeleteYou are correct Anonymous 2:08. Tonto is Connie.
Delete2:08pm Why do you care so much?
ReplyDelete2.08 PM
ReplyDeleteWhy do you ask?
And 4:18pm is 2:08pm! Who cares if Tonto is Connie?
ReplyDeleteWrong. 4:18 is not 2:08.
DeletePosting to share factual information in regards to international representation on the Council of Elders. Anthony Wasilkoff is Canadian and works in Canada (international representative). Jorge de Campos is originally from Africa and primarily serves the languages that speak Portuguese (international representative). Rainer Salomaa just ended a 3-year term on the COE was born in Finland and migrated to Canada where he serves in Canada (international representative). John Elliott (newly reelected COE member and international representative) primarily serves congregations in Canada. Mario Seiglie was born in Cuba and has served 23 years as a pastor in Latin America. Can more cultural diversity be sought after for an international church? One can hold that opinion. But to minimize the background of those who are serving, or recently served on the COE, is not fair or accurate.
ReplyDelete5:29pm Don't worry, most here aren't happy unless they're bitching about something cog.
ReplyDeleteANON at 5:29--
ReplyDeleteMy original posting on the site claims that NONE of the Council currently LIVE or pastor in their respective international areas. Canada can be "defacto" considered as part of the greater USA/North American empirical self.
Noticeably absent from the council are any currently living and residing Black Africans, or Phillipino individuals, of which both groups "en toto" account for thousands of members.
If I recall correctly, there has NEVER been a Black of any nationality or location or Asian of any nationality or location, including North America ever on the UCG Council going back to 1995.
Isn't that a bit odd, considering that Asians and Blacks represent more than half of humanity, and a large amount of UCG membership when measured on a global basis??
Tonto
ReplyDeleteWould it by a conservative estimate be possible to have female deacons as "representatives" from those nations. I mean if there are men qualified they for certain will have day jobs, and if female are qualified, they are able to multitask anyway?
Nck