from anon...
Bob Thiel continues his journey through La La Land with his mentally disturbed mind now saying he is Elijah and is one of the two witless witnesses. We knew it would only be a matter of time till his mind cracked and he declared himself a witless witness. He was already so far down the rabbit hole that there is nothing left for him to be.
Never has the Church of God seen a more successful and amazing church in its entire history. More importantly, never has there been a Church of God leader as magnificent and awesome as Bob Thiel. Even with all the boasting from Dave Pack, there is none like Bob Thiel.
Although people like the discredited Ron Weinland and David Pack have claimed to be ‘Elijah,’ neither of them are.
But, guess who is that Elijah...Come on, make a guess...
Yet, the Bible does show that there will be an ‘Elijah’ who is alive before Jesus returns and that it is likely that he will be one of the two witnesses. And as Jesus is likely to return within the next couple of decades, it is reasonable to consider that he must be alive today.
Bob Thiel has been on a one-man war in declaring himself as the only COG leader who has restored church history, doctrine, and the message of the kingdom of God. And, he is the ONLY COG leader who has publications in 100 different languages. But then, as usual, Thiel throws in his wimpy capitulation that he MIGHT not be that man.
Could he be one who has restored information on church history, doctrine, prophecy, and the reason that God created anything? Could he be one reaching people around the world with the Gospel of the Kingdom of God in nearly 100 different languages? Or has God not chosen to have him do much at this stage?
Of course, he has to throw Herbert Armstrong into the mix using him as a tool to claim Herbert was speaking about The Bob to come.
Those with a WCG background might find the following quote from Herbert W. Armstrong of some assistance here as he wrote:
Those called into the Church were called not merely for salvation and eternal life, but to learn the way of God’s government and develop the divine character during this mortal life in the Church age …Also Malachi 4:5-6 pictures the Elijah to come at the very end of the Church age (Mystery of the Ages. 1985, pp. 201, 349).And when was the “Church age” supposed to end according to Herbert Armstrong’s old church? Notice:
God has set before us an open door and no MAN can shut it. God can shut it, and He will when the work is finished and the Philadelphia Church goes to a place of safety. …The Laodicean Church is not going to be worthy to escape to a place of safety. When it is too late, they will find that the Church of Philadelphia has gone to safety (What Is the “LAODICEAN CHURCH”? Good News August 1959 Vol. VIII, Number 8).
Now since the Church age has not ended, and the Day of the Lord has not yet come, then it follows that Elijah was to come on the scene publicly after this was written. His restoring of “all things” means that he is to be restoring information that the true Church of God once understood, but later must have lost or misunderstood
Again, Thiel claims he is the only one restoring all things to the church.
The problem is that just as many would not hear Elijah’s or John the Baptist’s messages, relatively few will pay much attention to the end time Elijah as well.
Thiel has been having fits over the last few years that 99% of the COG movement ignores him and his message. No one cares about what he preaches, particularly Living Church of God members. They know him for the liar he is. Rod Meredith, Dibar Apartian, Herbert Armstrong would all have a fit to see Thiel making such absurd claims.
I can state for a fact that Bob Theil is NOT Elijah. He is NOT one of the two witless witnesses. He is NOT a minister of God and is NOT a legitimate leader of a Church of God.
Herbert was speaking about the Bob to come.
ReplyDeleteMan, that's gotta be in the top ten.
Nck
The end-time Elijah will have the power to call fire down from heaven.
ReplyDeleteBob didn't even predict California's wildfires until after they began. He can barely call fire down from his fireplace.
This is disturbing.
ReplyDeleteElijah gets noticed by the world well enough that they kill him.
Has Bob now boarded the train to a Jonestown demise for his cult?
Several serious psychological disorders cause their victims to need constant (and increasing) stimulation and attention as they desperately try to entrap others in their private crazy-world.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that the more Bob feels he is ignored, the more he gets agitated, and along with the agitation his personal boasting becomes more outlandish. He may be on his way to involuntary commitment in a psych ward.
I thought Dave Pack was Elijah. Or is he Moses. No wait HWA was Moses or errr ?? But now Bob is Elijah so many be Dave is Moses. So who’s on first?
ReplyDeleteSince Bob received his double dose, does that make him both witnesses?
ReplyDeleteOther speculation is that the two witnesses will be Moses and Elijah, as witnessed in the transfiguration.
David Pack and Bob Thiel are called out as the Two Witless ones. Bullshit shall spring from their mouths and cover their followers. They will tell you how large their PACKages of righteousness are but will be cut short like the husband of Lorena BOBbit. Itty bitty shriveled old men.
ReplyDeleteI've had dealings in the past, two decades ago, with butthurt Bob as the self-appointed COGwriter. He immediately blocked me after a few rounds of questions. I even emailed with the LCG over the authority Bob expressed in his non-sensical COGWriter posts concerning the LCG. He's a nutter....any human who states publicly that they are a "prophet" most certainly isn't one. And I was reminded about one of my favorite movies by "The Bob" comment: "What About Bob?"
ReplyDeletewell, what about it butthurt Bob?
anon111
"Yet, the Bible does show that there will be an ‘Elijah’ who is alive before Jesus returns and that it is likely that he will be one of the two witnesses."
ReplyDeleteThe Bible shows no such thing. Malachi said Elijah would come. Christ said it was John the Baptist:
"For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John, and if you are willing to accept it, he is Elijah who is to come." (Christ's words. Matt 11:14)
Apparently, Apocalyptic Millerites are not willing to accept what Jesus said. Here are some questions about this:
1. The Bible does not say that Elijah is going to return multiple times. How could anyone after John the Baptist, then, claim to be Elijah?
2. What does Elijah have to do with the Two Witnesses? There is nothing in scripture about this.
3. Why would God choose a Gentile, like the various claimants to the office of prophet among Apocalyptic Millerites, to be Elijah?
4. Malachi states Elijah's mission - something having to do with inter-generational reconciliation. How does that include running a small Apocalyptic Millerite organization in the Twenty First century?
5. The parallel between Elijah having "three campuses" and HWA having "three campuses" died a long time ago. But if this was a "credential" for HWA as Elijah why is it not a credential for all the additional Elijahs?
6. Lastly, why are people who are able to make sane decisions in other dimensions of life unable to make a sane decision regarding this malarkey?
ReplyDeleteThe ELIJAH and The LIARS
[WCG] Herbert W. Armstrong was considered by the time he died on January 16, 1986 to be the one who was prophesied to come in the power and spirit of Elijah to “restore all things” because every doctrine, belief, and teaching in the Worldwide Church of God had come through Christ's chosen apostle Herbert W. Armstrong. In fact, if HWA had not taught them about it, it is likely that nobody in the WCG would have known anything about an Elijah to come, much less about any of the things that he had taught them.
[PCG] Gerald R. Flurry made a big show and fuss of saying that HWA was the Elijah, but insisted that everyone must ALSO believe that GRF, rather than Jesus, is what GRF calls “That Prophet” of Deuteronomy 18:18-19. The belief that HWA was the Elijah did not stop GRF from changing anything and everything that he wanted to (including the church's entire commission, HWA's writings such as his last book called Mystery of the Ages, and which is the church's favorite pet rock), and all the while claiming that he has not changed anything. Gerald Flurry is an extreme example of what Satan can do through his false prophets.
[CCG] Some people might be tempted to think that Robert J. Thiel “means well,” and might be tempted to feel sorry for a mentally challenged guy like that. However, it is very important to remember that Bob Thiel is a false prophet and to beware of him. There is no telling in advance how much harm he can do. When Bob Thiel ignored HWA's role as the Elijah in the WCG and began to speculate about who the Elijah to come might be, it was a big warning sign.
[GCG/LCG] David Pack used to complain that Roderick C. Meredith did not believe that HWA was the Elijah, and accused RCM of secretly desiring to be the Elijah, even though RCM just used the title of Presiding Evangelist. RCM always seemed to have a problem with acknowledging HWA's role and wanted to put his own doctrinal stamp on his own splinter groups, even to the point of coming up with a two-fold gospel message, and saying that the “falling away” is in the world rather than in the WCG in 1995 when the apostate Tkaches threw out virtually everything that HWA had taught.
Continued below...
ReplyDelete...continued from above.
[RCG] David C. Pack wrote a booklet proving that HWA was the Elijah. Surprisingly, David Pack later posthumously promoted HWA out of the way to the “office of Moses,” and came up with “130 proofs” that he himself was the Elijah. One of David Pack's “proofs” was that he had already “restored” his “common” doctrine that everyone had to send him virtually everything they had -- “or no salvation if you don't.” David Pack's booklet proving that HWA was the Elijah then disappeared from his so-called Restored Church's website. David Pack had originally taught that the understanding that HWA was the Elijah who had already “restored all things” was a great wall of defence against doctrinal heresy. Ever since personally breaking through that great wall of defence against doctrinal heresy, David Pack has been vomiting out heresy uncontrollably.
[COTEG and COGaCF] Norbert Link and seven members on his Editorial Review Team wrote in a booklet about Human Suffering that, “The 'Elijah,' spoken of in those passages [Malachi 4:5-6], is a reference to the Church of God – not just one particular individual! Christ gave to His Church – His spiritual body – the commission to RESTORE all things.” By “His Church” they probably mean the leadership (that is, themselves) and not every little member. You have to watch what lawyers slip into their writings.
[COGWA] Even Ralph Levy from COGWA in a sermon seemed to think that the church was Elijah.
[WCG] This is all very interesting considering that the original Elijah was a person, and John the Baptist was a person, and Herbert W. Armstrong was a person. By the end of HWA's life, and even shortly after, everyone in the Worldwide Church of God seemed to know that HWA was the Elijah. In fact, on May 3, 1982, the Advisory Council of Elders in the WCG had given HWA an $11,500.00 Steuben crystal gift entitled “The Cup of Elijah the Prophet.”
ReplyDeleteBob Thiel:" I am Bob Thiel."
World:" Bob who?"
Double Dose Thiel, makes me want to have a Double Dose of Whiskey!
ReplyDeleteExperience shows that anyone claiming to be the end-time Elijah is much more likely to be an end-time DIotrephes.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteIt's sure a good thing that we have NEO here to straighten us out.
Now tell me who's going to straighten NEO out, since "Millerite organizations" aren't the only ones who teach this.
https://calvinzelie.blogspot.com/2008/11/elijah-and-new-testament.html
Hey, The False Prophet (or 2nd Beast) calls down fire from heaven too.
ReplyDeleteRev 13:13
"And the second beast performed great signs to cause even fire from heaven to come down to earth in the presence of the people".
Maybe, this is Bob!
wow....!!!!
ReplyDeleteButt-hurt Bobbie missed his chance to prophecy an extremely important event...the death of RBG, which will pave the way for the re-election of the King of the North Donald Trump. Trump is the leader of the fourth reich, and will lead the military forces of the USA/NATO/Zionists directly to Armageddon. You can watch it on the news.
anon111
Thiel: "The problem is that just as many would not hear Elijah’s or John the Baptist’s messages, relatively few will pay much attention to the end time Elijah as well."
ReplyDeleteNow THAT's Bob's first real bonified and to be proven true prophecy!
Thiel: "The problem is that just as many would not hear Elijah’s or John the Baptist’s messages, relatively few will pay much attention to the end time Elijah as well."
ReplyDeleteNow THAT's Bob's first real bonified and to be proven true prophecy!
Maybe it's Thiel's, but it contradicts what HWA taught and what his interpretation of Revelation seems to support. People will pay enough attention to the end-time Elijah that they will KILL him because his message upsets them. In fact, the lack of attention paid to Bob is one more proof that he is NOT the end-time Elijah or one of the Two Witnesses.
Anonymous (3:22) "Now tell me who's going to straighten NEO out, since "Millerite organizations" aren't the only ones who teach this."
ReplyDeleteWhat is your point? How does that "straighten Neo out?" I looked at the article. My guess is that a Calvinist Presbyterian got contaminated with some Apocalyptic Millerite literature. He cites the unfounded idea that one of the two witnesses would be Elijah. That is virtually an Apocalyptic Millerite one-off. The blog host writes "When some Christians look ahead to the future return of Elijah . . . ". He does say where he got this material.
Rather than find someone else who has made the same mistake as the Apocalyptic Millerites which demonstrates nothing, it would be to the point if you responded to the six points I listed.
Now you can see why Mr. Meredith kicked Bob out of LCG. His arrogance and egotistical attitude was offending almost everyone in the church. A lot of people found him to be offensive and outright disgusting.
ReplyDeleteThe new picture almost has me convinced! lol Now if Thiel would actually start wearing a camel hair coat, go live in the wilderness, and eat locusts and honey he might be a little more authentic. How can you be a voice crying out in the wilderness, if you don't actually live in the wilderness after all?
ReplyDeleteAll kidding aside, this guy seems to become more self delusional by the day. And again I say the tragedy of it all is that uninformed people in Africa have fallen for his lies.
Concerned Sister
How dare he do this!!!Doesn't he know the ONLY true witness today is"THAT PROPHET" who resides in Edmund Oklahoma! He has Herbert's drinking I mean prayer rock. It really blows one's mind the grandiose claims & titles these guys bestow upon themselves but looking back Herbert blew his own horn all the time also. I know there will be some posters say this isn't true but I grew up in Worldwide and unfortunately it is true.
ReplyDeleteYou guys have got it ALL wrong.. There's only ONE Elijah, that Prophet, Moses: God's handpicked #1, the one and only true witness. The man that says he's is God's personal messenger and Christ's replacement here on earth: David C. Pack.
ReplyDeleteHow dare you guys dispute him!
NEO I have no desire to comment on your baseless/worthless points. If you can't see the obvious point in my post that's your problem not mine.
ReplyDeleteTo spell it out, It's not only Millerite organizations, which you freely joined 60 years ago, that teach this and to claim that that Presbyterian Calvinist learned it from a Millerite is just "hilarious"!
Maybe the Millerites learned it from Presbyterian Calvinists.
Your hatred of everything Armstrong is glaring! Armstrong, whom you willingly followed for some twenty odd years. Hilarious!!!
I recall when weinland told a audience made up of the general public, that he was a prophet among them. You could look at their faces when they realized they were listening to a delusional bullshitter. They were embarrassed for him.
ReplyDeleteWhat weinland got was ridicule, and rightfully so.
When these acog clowns start this shit that they are some bible character, know that the end is just starting. Not for the world, but for their little shit shows masquerading as a righteous religion. Its not a real religion, it is just a carnival of horrors.
Anonymous (5:15)
ReplyDeleteOh, Mr. Hilarious again. Thanks for identifying yourself. I still don't know what your point is and it is obvious that you don't either.
Please include the word "hilarious" in the body of your future comments about my posts so I can ignore them. Thanks.
Come on Booby, why dont you lead by example?
ReplyDeleteStart wearing camel hair coats and eating grasshoppers for starters!
Ok.
ReplyDeleteWe have an earthquake in Pasadena at the start of Trumpets.
None of the "prophets" saw that coming.
Peurhaps they leave this stuff to the minor prophets, such as.......scientists.
Nck
That's the greatest picture in the history of Banned
ReplyDeleteNEO, you know the point. It's obvious. You just can't see how pathetic it is for anyone who has been in the WCG since the 60's to still be in GCI. Hilarious!
ReplyDeleteSigned Mr. Hilarious
Is. Dr. Thiel throwing Gerald Waterhouse under the proverbial bus?
ReplyDeleteYou know - the man who declared HWA, "The Modern-Day Moses! The Modern-Day Elijah!! The Modern-Day Zerubbabel!!!" ?
NEO quoted and noted:
ReplyDelete"Yet, the Bible does show that there will be an ‘Elijah' who is alive before Jesus returns and that it is likely that he will be one of the two witnesses."
The Bible shows no such thing. Malachi said Elijah would come. Christ said it was John the Baptist:
"For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John, and if you are willing to accept it, he is Elijah who is to come." (Christ's words. Matt 11:14)
Apparently, Apocalyptic Millerites are not willing to accept what Jesus said. Here are some questions about this:
1. The Bible does not say that Elijah is going to return multiple times. How could anyone after John the Baptist, then, claim to be Elijah?
In this case I agree with Bob's statement and disagree with NEO's argument.
It is suggested that when reading the NT it is essential to have some appreciation for what may be termed "Second Temple Exegesis in the First Century". Richard Nelson's observation about the book of Hebrews maybe applied to all of the NT:
"The logic of the book is based on ancient rhetorical patterns and pre-modern exegetical principles that makes the reader's task exceptionally difficult" (Richard Nelson, Raising Up a Faithful Priest - Community and Priesthood in Biblical Theology, p.141).
I would recommend the book "Three Views on the New Testament Use of Old Testament". The three contributor's are Walter C. Kaiser Jr., Darrel L. Bock and Peter Enns; the last of whom NEO is familiar with.
The Introduction by Jonathan Lunde, one of the editors of the Book, is especially informative.
Of the three views Peter Enns is the most preferred.
Walter C. Kaiser, Jr. disagrees with NEO's conclusion in "Have you seen the power of God lately," see below.
Walter C. Kaiser Jr. (PhD, Brandeis University) is distinguished professor emeritus of Old Testament and president emeritus of Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary in South Hamilton, Massachusetts. Dr. Kaiser has written over 40 books, including Toward an Exegetical Theology: Biblical Exegesis for Preaching and Teaching; The Messiah in the Old Testament; and The Promise-Plan of God; and coauthored An Introduction to Biblical Hermeneutics: The Search for Meaning; etc.
I suggest that it would be hard to argue that Walter Kaiser Jr. is an "Apocalyptic Millerite".
Ac 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God...
An interpretative key for the NT speakers and writers is that "The Days of Fulfillment Have Come." This makes for some interesting exegesis, which can be misleading if modern Western logic is only applied in reading the Scriptures.
Peter's use of Joel provides an one example to support the argument that Elijah is yet future.
Continued next post.
Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great [gadol] and dreadful [yare'] day of the LORD:
ReplyDeleteJoel 2:31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great [gadol] and the terrible [yare'] day of the LORD come.
Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.
Peter quoted, with some ‘editing', Joel on Pentecost in AD30:
Ac 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
Ac 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
Ac 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
Ac 2:19 And I will show wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
Ac 2:20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
Ac 2:21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
One extreme theory that has been advanced as to the relationship between these passages is that Pentecost was the total fulfilment of Joel's prophecy. This is would be similar to arguing that John the Baptist totally fulfilled Malachi's prophecy.
In regard to the concept of inaugurated/realized eschatology, Richard D. Patterson's uses different terms for describing the concept:
"Joel's prophecy was fulfilled but not consummated. It awaits its ultimate fulfillment but was provisionally applicable to Pentecost and the ages of the Spirit as the initial step in those last days that will culminated in the prophesied miraculous signs heralding the Day of the Lord and the events distinctive to the nation of Israel. (For the concept of "fulfilment without consummation," see R.T. France, Jesus and the Old Testament, [London: Tyndale, 1971], pp.160-62)" (Joel, EBC, Vol.7, p.258).
Mt 17:11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias indeed comes, and will restore all things [future tense].
Mt 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already...
Christ agrees with the Scribes, but.
"It is clear, then, that Jesus regarded John both in the sense of already fulfilling the prediction that Elijah was to come and yet as falling short of the total fulfillment which could only be realized in the future... There would be a coming of Elijah in the future just before the awful judgment of the last days connected with the second advent of Jesus Christ. (The reader who seeks a more technical discussion of this important distinction may read a fuller treatment of this matter in my book, The Uses of the Old Testament in the New, chapter 4, Chicago: Moody Press, 1985, pp.77-78)" (Walter C. Kaiser, Jr., ibid, p.105).
The ‘inaugurated' fulfilment of Joel's prophecy occurred at Pentecost but the ‘realized' fulfilment is yet future. John the Baptist was the "inaugurated" fulfilment of Malachi's prophecy, but the ‘realized' fulfilment is yet future - the already/not yet of inaugurated eschatology. An ‘Elijah' precedes the start of Christ first and second half weeks.
"Thus declaring that "Elijah has come and he is John the Baptist" has the same scandalous quality as declaring "The Messiah has come, and he is Jesus of Nazareth"..." (M. Eugene Boring, Matthew, NIB, Vol. 8, p.365).
Anonymous 8:07 AM said, "That's the greatest picture in the history of Banned"
ReplyDeleteMY COMMENT - The picture of delusional Bobby Thiel appropriately reminds me of something out of Monty Python's Flying Circus. Perhaps cartoon Bob can make a Monty Python animation of himself as one of the two witless witnesses.
What a comedy and clown show. Will Ron Weinland's wife, who is suppose to be the other witness witnessing what witless witness Tax cheat Ron Weinland does, be the other witless witness witnessing what cartoon Bob does?
Richard
Anonymous (3:28 and 3:29)
ReplyDeleteThank you for the research. I do not have access to some of your primary sources so I cannot mount a seamless rebuttal statement. But I will give my view of the concepts you propose.
First, I do agree with Peter Enns in his viewpoint that the NT writers used material from the OT, particularly prophetic statements, creatively and adaptively. But we cannot induce a general principle from this that applies broadly to all cases of OT citation by NT writers. Some statements in the NT such as the reference to Elijah in Matthew 11:14 or the reference to adultery in Matthew 5:27 are uncomplicated statements of fact. We cannot devise a principle that says if one application is creative, then all applications are creative. This is the construction of a false category.
Second, the fact that Christ or the NT writers were creative in an application of OT language, that does not mean that we can arrogate this same privilege to ourselves. The speculation that there might be many more Elijahs after Christ identified John the Baptist as the fulfillment is an example of this kind of arrogation. The view "Peter's use of Joel provides an one example to support the argument that Elijah is yet future" is also an example of this kind of arrogation.
Another argument put forward by your sources is that because Elijah preceded Christ's first coming, Elijah will also precede his second coming. (This is different from the Apocalyptic Millerite phenomenon that has Elijahs popping up everywhere and every time some Apocalyptic Millerite leader needs a credential or some convenient drama.) This view has no unequivocal scriptural foundation. It may or may not be true and must be categorized as speculative.
I find the following statement ironic: "One extreme theory that has been advanced as to the relationship between these passages is that Pentecost was the total fulfilment of Joel's prophecy." This "extreme" is actually the default condition that should be accepted by everyone. The burden of proof is on those who would speculate that there were future fulfilments of this same prophecy. Richard D. Patterson's "inaugurated/realized eschatology" is a variation on the Millerite type/anti-type model. It is interesting and apparently valid in some cases but does not rise to the level of incontrovertible and universal principle that supports the unbounded proliferation of Elijahs among Apocalyptic Millerite organizations now active.
There is no clear and unassailable statement that declares there will be another appearance of Elijah before Christ's second coming. Malachi spoke of one appearance and Christ identified who that was. Using this principle of a former and latter fulfillment, would it be reasonable to advocate a second rendition for all the other various people and events relevant to Christ at his first coming? I think not.
This could go on. Let me stop here and just say that I find the arguments founded on these sources thoughtful but unconvincing.
Thanks NEO for qualifying your position; but it is something that we will have to agree to disagree on.
ReplyDeleteSome thoughts:
You write:
"Some statements in the NT such as the reference to Elijah in Matthew 11:14 or the reference to adultery in Matthew 5:27 are uncomplicated statements of fact."
Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
While John the Baptist came "in the spirit and power of Elias" (Luke 1:17) I do not see that he fulfilled Malachi 4:5 in its fullest sense as I believe that "the great and dreadful day of the LORD" is yet future.
So while Christ's statement is a fact I do not see it as "uncomplicated" if indeed the Day of the Lord is yet future.
Mt 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
For around thirty years I considered it an uncomplicated fact that Christ was in the heart of the earth for three literal days and nights, or something close to that time.
One year around Passover this comment was made on a forum:
"I do believe there is an issue about how natives of the Roman empire counted and understood days within the passage of time. Look at the following results about what Cornelius said to Peter... It leaves a reader wondering whether it was three or four days ago."
This comment was the trigger to find out for myself why a Friday crucifixion and Sunday resurrection was accepted by mainstream Christianity, which seemed to contradiction Mt 12:40, which as mentioned, I thought was an uncomplicated fact. But there was more to this.
I have read numerous writings on ANE literature, such as "The Lost World of ..." series, whose leading contributor is John Walton. While there is much debate on his observations I keep his statement in his commentary on Genesis in mind when reading the Bible:
"One of the greatest obstacles we face in trying to interpret the Bible is that we are inclined to think in our own cultural and linguistic categories. This is no surprise since our categories are often all that we have, but it is a problem because our own categories often do not suffice and sometimes mislead" (John H. Walton, Genesis, NIVAC, pp.67-68).
I was indeed misled in believing that Christ was literally three days and three nights in the heart of the earth; not realizing it was a Hebrew idiom; just as "on the third day" is a Hebrew idiom for "the day after tomorrow".
So for me, if I am not misled, there is more to Matt 11:14 and 17:10-13.