Its been a while since we had the Friday Night Smackdown by Doug Winnail for something else that LCG members are failing at. This time he is questioning whether or not LCG members are "team players".
Apparently, Jesus is not part of the agenda for being a "team player".
Are You a Team Player? God has called us to be part of a team. Effective team players have skills and perspectives that can be identified and learned. Christian team players must be focused on the same goal—the Kingdom of God (Matthew 6:33) and work together to preach the Gospel to the world (Mark 16:15). They avoid saying or doing things that offend others (1 Corinthians 10:32; Matthew 18:6–7). They are forgiving and able to overlook slights and insults (Proverbs 10:12; 17:9). Team players don’t criticize or sit in judgment of others; instead, they make sure their own lives are in order (Matthew 7:1–5; James 4:11). Effective team players have learned to be peacemakers (Matthew 5:9), and they treat others gently, respectfully, and are willing to listen (James 1:19). They appreciate that the team is made up of individuals with different talents, and they let other team members know that they are appreciated. In short, good team players have learned to love their neighbors. Let’s all strive to develop these vital qualities.
Have a profitable Sabbath, Douglas S. Winnail
Doug Winnail:
ReplyDeleteWhat he is really saying…….
MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY.
Does he think we are bloody idiots?
"They avoid saying or doing things that offend others."
ReplyDeleteThis is typical ACOG bull. Such statements conveniently avoid mentioning that many members give themselves all manner of perks and are offended when their victims complain. Such perks are:
-Giving themselves the right to flog the conversion rather than it being two way.
-Lording it over members faith.
-Emotionally abuse others.
-Pecking on others by eg, violating their body space.
-Constantly finding fault in others, etc.
These people often rush to their minister complaining of being "offended."
People have rights, and if others are offended by the exercising of these natural rights, they can go eat cake.
Implicit in these types of articles is that the responsible must jump through loops so that the irresponsible can put their feet up and behave like hillbilly rednecks.
Which means that members should NOT "OVERLOOK SLIGHTD AND INSULTS." Everyone one has a right to be free from abuse and be treated with dignity and respect.
Doug's soft on crime approach is why God is not blessing his or any ACOG.
Or does Doug think that God will put new people into his church so that his minister pals and his coddled abusers can treat them like dog crap.
It is written, "You shall know then by their fruits"
ReplyDeleteDoug if the shoe fits.........
When Doug asks us to be team players, he's implying, "I'm the quarterback. You are a linebacker whose job is to protect me."
ReplyDeleteThat is the exact opposite of the shepherding role that Jesus expects of his true ministers. The shepherd isn't a team captain. He is a servant who goes after stray sheep even when they wander away from the herd. When you read Doug's namby-pamby description of how he expects team members to treat each other, it's easy to notice that he doesn't describe God's people as a family. Family members can't be cut or traded to another family. They aren't all equals or peers, yet each has his or her own inviolable place within the loving bonds of the family. Why does Doug invent a false "team" concept of Christian relationships when the Bible doesn't do any such thing? Why doesn't Doug stress the importance of family relationships within God's family, like we find in, you know, the Bible?
There is an odd tension in this seemingly innocuous statement by this Splinterist preacher. It took me a little while to sort it out. Teamwork emphasizes synergizing diverse skills and extending respect to the views of each of the team members (dare I say a democratic approach). Teams are characterized often by a willingness to compromise in accomplishing work. And teams are characterized by the subordination of personal goals for the good of the team as a whole. This theme did not run through the WCG and Ambassador College that I knew. The emphasis there was on personal position, the exercise of power over subordinates and the ambitious climbing of the organizational ladder. Practices typical in a strongly hierarchical organization.
ReplyDeleteBut then again, I have not been an Armstrongist since about 1994. Maybe somewhere along the way, the concept of teaming was introduced in Splinterdom. And this would amount to a renunciation of a principal attribute of the old, now extinct WCG and Ambassador College.
********* Click on my icon for Disclaimer
Most brethren are indeed "team players" , and have been so all along over the decades. They get along fabulously at reunions, weddings, funerals et al.
ReplyDeleteIt is indeed THE COACHES , ie the "ministry" , that have caused ALL of the various splits, controversies and factions. The legacy of AC graduates and ministers has been one of playing "king of the hill", vanity , lust and greed. Doug needs to be writing to his fellow COG ministers , and praise the membership that has endured the shenanigans of the COG system for such a long time.
Doug's done it again, and almost one year to the day. On THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 4, 2021 Banned website posted a thread with the following title:
ReplyDelete******
LCG: If You Are A Proper Team Player You Will "...deal with people gently, respectfully, and patiently, and are willing to listen..." Just Like We, The Leadership, Do With You
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And it is virtually identical to what was posted again, by Doug Winnail.
I was tempted to re-post my 4 Feb 2021 comment to Doug's writing, but I won't, b/c it's "in the can!"
For Doug, it appears nothing is "in the can," b/c he keeps repeating the same basic message, and his latest commentary is only a little over a year later. Is anybody reading it from his organization?
It makes me wonder: Is Doug part of the "living" group or really part of a "dead" group, or one that is lukewarm? Why does Doug so repeat himself so often? Is God not allowing that group to grow in the grace and the knowledge of Jesus Christ? It is evident Doug, apparently driven by another spirit, is into another gospel by another Jesus.
Well, are Doug's readers deaf, dumb, blind...enough so as not to have learned anything from Doug's earlier 4 Feb 2021 virtually identical commentary? I doubt it, but Doug loves to repeat his own words. Why not repeat more of God's words? Jesus' words? Oh, those were of the Father!
Of course, Doug, former WCG hireling, who fled from that organization to become part of another organization of men. Was the grass any greener?
Why does the living group exist? Why are they trying to do what was done under HWA in the former WCG? If God was working with HWA of WCG, and HWA died: what did God do? Move on? To where?
Well, it certainly does not look it was to the living ("dead?") group, among other xcog ("dead") groups. If there was to be a scattering of the former WCG, it must have been very effective, and only a professed evangelist like Doug can do is basically repeat repetition of "milk" and "junk food" and serve it to others who will partake of it.
Where is Doug's Jesus "very soon" to return to reign on earth 1,000 years so Doug can be seen in his leadership position with Him? Yes, that Mickey Mouse Millennium.
And Satan will "very soon" return from the bottomless pit to interrupt Doug's idea of an "everlasting peace of Jesus on earth:" oh, but Satan isn't even in that pit yet.
Okay, Doug burdened all of his team member readers with all of the "do's and don't's," requirements, prerequisites etc. needed so they will become effective team players, and concluded with writing: "...In short, good team players have learned to love their neighbors. Let’s all strive to develop these vital qualities."
Why did Doug conclude with that? It's because it seems not many listened to him last year and made the changes Doug was hoping for. Well, how did Doug write his conclusion last year, 4 Feb 2021?
"...In summary, good team players have learned how to love their neighbors. Let’s all strive to develop these important skills so we can do God’s Work effectively!"
Well, boring though that all may be, who does not believe that "repetition is the best form of emphasis?"
Time will tell...
John
Yep, Tonto. And sadly, to most of our hurt.
ReplyDeleteTonto observed: "It is indeed THE COACHES , ie the "ministry" , that have caused ALL of the various splits, controversies and factions."
ReplyDeleteCorrect. HWA left CG7 to start RCG, Dr Martin and others left HWA (willingly) to form new COGs, and GTA left (unwillingly) to form CGI then (unwillingly) to form ICG, GF and JA left (unwillingly) to form PCG, RCM and others left (willingly) to form COGs, DCP left GCG (unwillingly), Bob Thiel, Sheldon Monson and others left LCG (willingly)...
It is rare when members alone walk out and congeal to form a new COG. Most members leave to change COGs, become mainstream, become independent, or just give up.
Zippo wrote:
ReplyDeleteIt is rare when members alone walk out and congeal to form a new COG. Most members leave to change COGs, become mainstream, become independent, or just give up.
UCG may be the rare exception to this. Ministers saw that most members of their congregations were not taking the "changes" very well. They knew that if Tkach pushed WCG members hard enough, they would flee to PCG, GCG, or CGI, or would simply stay home, leaving less money for WCG ministerial salaries. Some WCG ministers, including Hulme, Webber, and Kubik, had been happy to preach the "new understandings" but were afraid of losing their comfortable lifestyles if members defected en masse.
So, the ministers who formed UCG got out ahead of those members and gave them a place to go, even if it meant that these ministers would have to go back to teaching things they had repudiated under Mr. Tkach.
9.59 AM
ReplyDeleteSpot on. Under Tkach, the church kept shrinking, so they had to had to jump ship before it completely sank.
God's church, Grace Communion, is the "little flock".
Deletethe ministers who formed UCG got out ahead of those members and gave them a place to go
ReplyDeleteWith very few exceptions, when a WCG member left to join PCG or GCG he had to leave his old congregation and go to a new congregation with a new minister. What actually happened in UCG, though, for the most part, is that the same minister at the same meeting hall simply announced to the members that this was now a UCG congregation. The members didn't go to a new place; it was the minister who made all the changes.
12.38 PM
DeleteYour account seems odd. Weren't there some intermediate steps like the Global church. Using your description, it's the minister rather than individual church goers who decided on Tkach or UCG. Which would mean that members saw no difference between the Tkach or UCG teachings. Very odd indeed.
@ 2:45PM
ReplyDeleteFor a while in the early 1990s, lots of WCG members were dissatisfied with the Tkach changes, but had determined that PCG/GCG/CGI were worse than WCG, so they stayed while waiting to figure out what to do. There are many accounts of ministers telling dissatisfied WCG members, "Just wait, don't leave, there'll be an answer." Then, in 1995, ministers who had been planning UCG in secret announced the existence of UCG and told them what to do.
GCG wasn't an intermediate step for many. Rod Meredith expected that when WCG imploded his group would get tens of thousands of members, but most of the ministers who formed UCG had been ministers under Rod in WCG, and there was no way they would go back under his control. Only a few left GCG to join the newly formed UCG, because Rod created in GCG members a sense of their superiority for leaving WCG earlier.
Who would take team-building advice from Doug Winnail?
ReplyDeleteDoug was a third rate WCG minister who rose to the top of the Church of Rod because RCM could not attract bigger names.
Doug has been trying, unsuccessfully, to make something happen in LCG for years - but no leadership and no teamwork has resulted in no results - no nothing.
LCG doesn't even have as many tangible assets as Dave Pack.
LCG doesn't even have as many tangible assets as Dave Pack.
ReplyDeleteRCG truly is rich and increased with goods. If you calculate RCG's tangible assets per member it's a big number that puts the other ACOGs to shame. Unfortunately, SuperDave gained those assets by driving many of his church members into poverty.
I'm just so glad I was "Class of 1975" when I graduated from Armstrongism, and not Class of 1995! Of course, by now, that extra 20 years seems inconsequential, but at the time, friends were telling me they wish they'd seen the light when I did! Still, there is also always someone who feels called upon to defend some abominable crap hole in which he happens to still live.
ReplyDeleteHaha- everyone knows "team player" means "being on my team"...it means everyone needs to be a "team player" except those that make the rules, the ministry.
ReplyDeleteDoes Doug play for the other team?
ReplyDeletePerhaps he plays for more than one team?
TEAM PLAYERS CALL A SPADE A SPADE AND ARE OPEN AND HONEST!! THEY DON’T BEAT AROUND THE BUSH!! DOUGY, YOU MIGHT WANT TO COMPARE YOURSELF AND WHAT YOU ARE DOING TO JESUS CHRIST!! I personally see a STARK CONTRAST!! He was NOT part of a HIERARCHY and TOLD PEOPLE THE TRUTH!! You and your minions just want to keep your worthless positions and do not want anyone rocking your boat!! CONSIDER IT ROCKED!! You SICKEN me with your endless NONSENSE!! Team players to you are SYCOPHANTS who go along with YOUR AGENDA!!
ReplyDeleteAnon, Friday, February 11, 2022 at 3:03:00 PM PST, said:
ReplyDelete"...For a while in the early 1990s, lots of WCG members were dissatisfied with the Tkach changes, but had determined that PCG/GCG/CGI were worse than WCG, so they stayed while waiting to figure out what to do. There are many accounts of ministers telling dissatisfied WCG members, "Just wait, don't leave, there'll be an answer." Then, in 1995, ministers who had been planning UCG in secret announced the existence of UCG and told them what to do."
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Amen to that!
When my wife and I read a copy of the procedure to be used for the 1995 Passover: that the bread, among other things, was to be broken up in advance of the Passover service (another change that was not a change! Duh!) we told our WCG minister we would leave if the procedure would be implemented. He already knew that something was in the works, so we were told, paraphrasing as best as I can recall: "Just wait. Don't leave. Something is in the works, but details not to be available for several more weeks," and he would do the traditional Passover service like we've done in previous years. We stayed, and the Ucgaia was created. Later changed to ucgia. The WCG hireling and those who agreed with leaving WCG to go with United all left to a new location (initially having Sabbath services in a private home).
Anon also said: "...GCG wasn't an intermediate step for many. Rod Meredith expected that when WCG imploded his group would get tens of thousands of members, but most of the ministers who formed UCG had been ministers under Rod in WCG, and there was no way they would go back under his control. Only a few left GCG to join the newly formed UCG, because Rod created in GCG members a sense of their superiority for leaving WCG earlier..."
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I was told by a Global member that he was confident that Jesus left WCG and went to Global, and there was no ifs, ands, or butts about it. And our former WCG hireling, now a United Pastor told us that they never considered joining GCG b/c he had been "under the Rod" at AC and never again would he, and other former WCG hireling who experienced that Rod, ever again come under the Rod.
GCG imploded; Living is virtually "dead," same for United.
How much longer will lcg, united, cogwa, etc. (name a xcog organization/Ass.) will they continue spewing out their Mickey Mouse Millennium (another Jesus to return very soon to reign on earth for 1,000 years), a third resurr, the unpardonable sin, etc...ans still blind, as though living in darkness, to identifying the beast and the man of sin, etc.?
Time will tell...
John