October 1, 2012, is a day I’ll never forget.
I was the main speaker for our morning church service. Our annual convention, the Feast of Tabernacles, was kicking off and it was the first day. For the membership, this event was a high point of our year. People had gathered from surrounding states. The mood was upbeat, and people were overjoyed to have congregated together.
Yet, as I started my sermon, I had a panic attack.
It was one of the scariest moments of my life. I was on stage in front of hundreds of people. And I was suddenly gripped in a series of feelings that I had never felt before.
Admittedly, I had no idea what I was experiencing at the time. There was an occasion or two before where I experienced some of this, but not to this level.
It was 10 years ago, and I remember it as if it was yesterday. I had no idea it was going to happen. I had spoken in front of large audiences many times before. It came on suddenly and out of the blue.
My heart was beating out of my chest. I felt clammy. I began to sweat.
It’s hard to describe but there was a feeling of pressing, impending doom. A suffocating tightness in my chest. It was like my world and the room were closing in.
It literally crossed my mind that I had to walk off the stage. I wanted to run. But I couldn’t. Here I was in front of 200+ people.
Could people tell? I asked myself, as I simultaneously tried to keep delivering my message. Surely, they can tell.
Ninety grueling minutes. The structure of my sermon helped. Knowing that I just had to follow the outline. Get to the next series of scriptures.
Waves would come back throughout the message. But I kept going.
An hour and a half later, I got through it. I was exhausted and defeated. Yet I survived.
As I walked off that stage around 12:30 pm that day, I felt relieved and scared. Relieved I made it through. Scared because I had no idea where this came from or what it was.
It shook my world. I had no idea what to do with it.
It undermined me in many ways. When would this happen again, I thought? It’s like it became some sort of lurking monster in the closet.
I never spoke to anybody about it. Not my closest friends (didn’t have many, to be honest). Not even my wife.
As I look back, a fair question is: Why didn’t I address this, then or later? Why didn’t I walk off the stage and deal with this?
I am sure there are many reasons, but I was in survival mode. I did not want to be humiliated. The concept of walking off the stage in the middle of a sermon would have been catastrophic, or that’s what I believed at the time. It would have been the talk of the Feast site. Frankly, it would have been the talk of the whole church. Since I was a “senior minister,” whatever that meant in hindsight, a PR campaign of some sort would surround my wife and my family.
There was no clean way out of this. So, in the end, I concluded I had to work through it, and by work through it, I knew that meant ignore it, bury it, lock it away. Survival mode.
For years, I didn’t even feel I could speak to my wife about this. Not that she wouldn’t have been supportive. It’s that you didn’t talk about things like this because they didn’t happen to God’s people, spiritual people, normal people…so if it happened to me, then I must not be those things.
To provide some context, from a church culture perspective, talking about anxiety or having a panic attack or even emotional health in general, was not acceptable. It just “wasn’t done.” To be open about one’s mental health, or worse, emotional struggles, would never happen.
See, God’s spirit is one of a “sound mind.” And, if you don’t have a sound mind, well, then you are in trouble. You’re weak. You are not close enough to God.
Then there was the additional level of being in the “ministry.” There was this pressure to be perfect. Granted, we would all admit or say the words that nobody was perfect and that everyone fell short, including ministers. But, when ministers actually did fall short, or need help, it really wasn’t accepted or supported, and it was seen as weakness and shortcoming, plain and simple.
So, what did you do with any weaknesses you had? You covered them. You buried them. As deep as you could.
You didn’t address them. You sent them as far down as possible, and you piled as much stuff on top as you could, hoping they wouldn’t surface too often.
In 2012, I had been absolutely run ragged. A campus (or, more properly, a compound) was being built.
The church had received large sums of money due to new teachings from the leader. In 2008, the infamous “Clarion Call” sermons were produced. This essentially laid out a timeline that led brethren to believe they should give all their money before Jesus returned. (Incidentally, the range of time given at that time explained that it was impossible for Jesus to return after 2021. He would most certainly arrive before 2021. That, evidently, didn’t happen.) But by 2011, the “Common” doctrine was instituted. An even more disgusting and onerous financial doctrine was yoked upon the necks of church membership. It was now doctrine for the Church’s apostle to tell people to sell all and send it to him. And many did, perhaps most did.
By 2011, the Church had bought land. By 2012, construction had begun. It was an incredibly stressful time. My youngest son was born in July of that year, and instead of looking back with joy at that time, I instead don’t remember much of his birth or first few months. It was marred by stress and constant turmoil and worry. Within that same timeframe, I was present during an instance that occurred to my brother, in a roomful of grown men, that I will never forget and for which I wish I had said something. It is and will always be one of my most vivid and awful life memories. (Perhaps that’s content for another time.)
It got even worse in the years ahead, but that, too, is a topic for another chapter.
The simple point? It was an incredibly stressful time.
The Mask
Ironically, I have pictures of this very event when I had this panic attack (included here). It’s fascinating for me now to try to look at them as an outsider and see if anything was going on. I don’t believe you can tell in the photo how close to meltdown I really was.
Like at no other point in my life, I had to keep the mask on. I had to play the part I was required to play.
See, this was all part of something I was thrust into in my 20s. I was told I was going to be a minister really early on. I had to step up. Be mature beyond my years!
I was always pushed to be somebody I wasn’t. I was too young-looking, I had to look older. I had to part and comb my hair a certain way. I had to stop wearing shorts around the lay members (mature men don’t show their legs!). I had to wear fuller dress pants, whatever that meant. I had to remove “youngish” ways of speaking. Etc. Etc.
Put on the mask, Kevin.
I did.And it almost ruined me.
This panic attack was my mind trying to break out of the inauthentic existence it had found itself in. Cognitive dissonance was raging through my mind like an out-of-control wildfire. I just hadn’t learned to identify it yet.
It took me several more years to figure this out, but I did. On some level, as I write about this for the first time, I am still figuring it out now.
I would pay a lot of money to travel back in time to this event. I would talk to myself and explain what was happening. I would give myself permission to accept what was going on and guide myself in making steps to improve my situation. I may have even tried to convince myself to tell the brethren in that moment exactly what was going on. Despite the shock and the gasps, I’d be willing to bet that many in the room could have related. I would tell myself to open up to my wife about it afterward and receive her support, to not go it alone.
When you are in a bad place in life, your body and mind will respond.
The authenticity of you will not remain buried. And although I buried my true self so very, very deep, I am slowly uncovering each layer and getting back to the real me.
Kevin,
ReplyDeleteI am glad that you have allowed yourself to acknowledge your humanity and frailty, and you sound like you are in a much better place now. I hope and pray that you will continue to allow yourself to be open to that and the same thing in others, and that you will continue to explore God and the world around you. I am also encouraged that you are willing to share your journey with others - this indicates that you want to help others and feel at least some responsibility as a former leader within Pack's Church to assist others who find themselves in similar circumstances.
Hopefully, you are also aware that your position of leadership within an organization that exploited its membership will engender feelings of bitterness and resentment among the elements of your audience that suffered as a consequence of that. The Christian thing to do is to own that, assume responsibility for the part you played in that and be ready and willing to apologize to them. By participating in these forums and being willing to listen to and experience the pain of others, you have the potential to be of immense help to both yourself and others in healing the hurts that your former association engendered. May God assist you in the road ahead.
I don't mean to be a nasty, but it seems that he didn't follow Gods' instruction to "obey God rather than man" from the very beginning. He gave credibility to Dave's thieving Common doctrine, so I find it difficult to be sympathetic to this man. In my books, he's no victim.
ReplyDeleteSTRONG DECEPTION by the FALSE PROPHETS
ReplyDeleteThe RCG was the second-worst Bait & Switch scam ever to hit WCG people, next only to the PCG's Bait & Switch scam.
PCG people were promised HWA's old teachings, but then got Gerald Flurry's new whoppers instead. And they really were giant WHOPPERS!
RCG people were promised HWA's old teachings, but then got David Pack's new whoppers instead. And they really were giant WHOPPERS!
All the time, effort, and money of the people in the PCG and the RCG got worse-than-wasted doing the exact diametrical opposite of what they thought they had gone to the PCG and the RCG to do. Instead of being the most informed people around, they became the most messed-up people around.
To put Kevin's (um, Mr. Denee's) post into perspective, remember that even after that panic attack he continued as one of Mr. Pack's minions for nearly 5 more years, during which he hurt a lot of people very badly.
ReplyDeleteHow many of the current splinter tyrants are harboring secret doubts, as Kevin did for several years before giving up his privilege and acting on those doubts? Should we feel empathy, knowing how they feel trapped? Or should we feel disgusted, knowing that they are willfully continuing to benefit from a system they know is based on lies?
"To put Kevin's (um, Mr. Denee's) post into perspective, remember that even after that panic attack he continued as one of Mr. Pack's minions for nearly 5 more years, during which he hurt a lot of people very badly."
ReplyDeleteTo put your bitter comment in perspective, remember that he and his wife, Dave's Daughter, broke all ties with Dave when they made the courageous decision to leave the church. From what I know of them, having been to home, they regret every single day they stayed. Trying to remain loving and loyal to your father and father-in-law while yet knowing how much it was damaging their family was a tough decision to make. Love of family outweighed remaining loyal to the church and Dave's lies.
Both Kevin and his wife are active in thier community giving back as much as they can to those in the world around them, something that I can almost guarantee you are not doing. If you are still a COG member it is guaranteed you are not doing anything for those around you.
He, his wife, and his wonderful children are flourishing now that they are not tied to Armstrongism. Even better is that all of Dave's kids are out of the church and living productive lives.
I applaud all the children of COG leaders who have left the church over the decades. Their stand for integrity and truth far exceeds your stance which was to do nothing.
I applaud Kevin. It is hard to walk away from what you have been taught. First you have realize what you have been taught isn’t right. Then you have to assimilate that knowledge then you have to make a decision. I left WCG 25 years ago, best decision I ever made. Fortunately for me my wife and I were on the same page. I totally support Kevin and wish him well.
ReplyDeleteJim-AZ
We must remember that we are all human and humans make terrible mistakes, and it is through these mistakes that we learn some very hard lessons. Keep your chin up. It took great character to admit now how screwed up you were.
ReplyDeleteThe Apostle Paul captured Christians, men women and children and put them to DEATH! He was out of control until his Macedonian moment.
ReplyDeleteMany a German soldier was put into horrific double bind during WW2, who were actually decent people. The same goes for guys in the bush in Vietnam. A kind of neurosis develops, and a disconnect from reality when put into these kinds of situations. My own father had PTSD from such until his death.
What matters is that Denne has repented. If we have any grace within us at all, we must allow for people to change and to move forward. God does this for all of us!
Being the son in law of Dave Pack and having your world in that organization necessarily makes breaking away very difficult. You know your wife matters, you know your wife's and children's relationships with their father and grandfather matters.
ReplyDeleteIt's a blessing that you are on the same page with your wife. It could very easily have been different which adds perhaps the worst complexity when dealing with these control cult organizations.
Thank you for contributing. I look forward to hearing more. You can help many in this capacity. As I say to all that leave these cults, "Comfortably get to know the hope we have in Jesus, as we really weren't exposed to it in the cult."
Kevin Denne said, "Here I was in front of 200+ people."
ReplyDeleteMY COMMENT - This statement is laughable. In the glory days of the mother Worldwide Church of God, congregations in the smallest of US cities where they existed commonly had weekly attendance of 200+. The Feast of Tabernacles had multiple U.S. Feast sites of 8,000 - 10,000 in attendance.
All the ACOGs are doing a low wattage "make believe work" of no real consequence or reach. If Denne had a panic attack in front of 200 people, I could only imagine the meltdown he might have had speaking at a WCG Feast site before 8,000 - 10,000 brethren (and I am being very kind).
Richard
BTW, Denne conveniently leaves out in "My Panic Attack behind the Pulpit – Reflections and Confessions of an Ex-Evangelist (Part 1)" any statement referring to the subject matter of his sermon. He stated that he had an outline, but completely leaves out what the topic of his sermon was. Could it be that he was required to preach on Dave Pack's "Common" (Communist) Doctrine? Could it be that Denne's sermon mission was to fleece the brethren for his father-in-law? Something doesn't smell right with Denne's essay!
ReplyDeleteDenne said, "The simple point? It was an incredibly stressful time."
MY COMMENT - Oh Boo Hoo Hoo! Grab the tissues.
Let me suggest Denne doesn't know what real stress is. He worked for a fake Church doing a fake work, building a fake institution for a fake false Apostle. Come into the real world working for real organizations producing real products for real customers, answering to real stockholders, real government regulators and real corporate boards. Then Mr. Denne might learn a lesson of what real organizational stress really is.
Conversely, may I suggest that the real stress might have been experienced by the brethren (and not Denne) who were being threatened (no doubt with eternal Lake of Fire damnation) to answer the Clarion Call liquidating everything they owned only to find out Pack is a fraud. Now there is real stress Mr. Denne!
Richard
9.41 AM
ReplyDeleteThe Apostle Paul believed he was doing the right thing in persecuting Christians. German soldiers were shot if they didn't follow orders. I find it hard to believe that Kevin was in either category.
A reminder that being soft on crime means being indifferent to the victims of crime. And another reminder that the prodigal son didn't harm any innocent people.
Everyone is allowed a "road to Damascas" experience. How do we expect the ministers to experience redemption from Armstrongism? Aren't the guys who leave the ministry part of our little club? Some of the good guys? When they see the light, shouldn't we be happy that they are suddenly real human beings who we can actually talk to, without feeling as if we're having a conversation with the Plain Truth or some Armstrong-penned booklet??? Isn't it true that so very few ministers leave and come clean that the ones who do are actually a miracle?
ReplyDeleteAlso, where is it written that every minister was automatically an asshole? Some were pretty cool, really genuine human beings just trying to help the members of their congregations.
And finally, it's a fact that you can provoke a nice guy, and goad him enough that eventually he'll respond in kind! We speak of prophecy around here frequently. Why create self-fulfilling ones.
I applaud Mr. Kevin Denee. He and his wife managed to escape what we have all proclaimed to be a worst nightmare scenario. That says it all, right there! Kicking him in the teeth is just plain stupid!
I guess the pertinent question is: did Kevin seek to save his life only during this time period? That answer is yes. The question now is: is he willing to lose his life to save many from the unfruitful works of darkness? I would hope that the answer to that would be a full yes.
ReplyDeleteThere is pity to be given to Kevin and his like - children born into or starting at a young age in their parent's church, trained in the way that they should go. He was honoring his father who I had heard was a very honorable man and that should be applauded.
I never did get a chance to meet Kevin while I was attending. I did however get a knowing wink from him once as he was coming in late from the airport at the Feast in Florida while I was working security. Even though he never met me, he understood completely what I knew.
There is fright, there is fear, there is uncomfortablness and there is panic in the presence of great evil. Experience is a hard teacher sometimes and this was a hard one for Kevin. I am looking forward to the fruits of that experience and to the continuing of him honoring his father.
I applaud Kevin for his honesty and openness about a very difficult time. For everyone who wants to lambast him that he stayed too long and didn't leave sooner. He was a victim too. I think you're granted some allowance for being brainwashed for so long and coming out of that. May the exodus of the "youth" (in COG terms this is anyone below retirement age) continue.
ReplyDeleteThe COG is a whitewashed sepulcher full of old mens bones and ideas. Let the dead bury their own dead.
But how many former ministers genuinely repented of being a HWA minion? How many "repented" because their thirty pieces of silver were taken away by losing their comfortable jobs or being increasing abused by their higher ups?
ReplyDeleteIt's like Will Smith "apologizing" for slapping Chris Rock only after realizing the publish backlash and injury to his career.
The WHOLE POINT of Christ's sacrifice is that it allows forgiveness of ALL our sins. Even if there is no way we could humanly atone for all the damage we've done as sinners.
ReplyDeleteMr. Denee must know that his preaching ruined many people's lives, sending them into a poverty from which they can never recover, while he was one of the few elites who live comfortably because of the hideous "Common" doctrine he enforced.
Mr. Denee must also know that he spent at least a few years living as a hypocrite, knowing he was preaching a lie but not wanting to hurt his wife and children, even though by protecting them he was hurting hundreds of people duped by Pack.
That's a lot of regret to live with. But it's also the whole point of Christianity. Short of committing the unpardonable sin, there is no point at which you are beyond Christ's forgiveness. We will never know whether Mr. Denee would have stayed with Pack for many more years had Pack not abused him. But we can rejoice that he is no longer under Pack's control.
There are ex-members of some fundamentalist Mormon groups who make it their mission to help current members find their way out. There's an "underground railroad" of ex-members who make a guest bedroom or two available to boys who are thrown out to make polygamy feasible for the leading men, and to girls who don't want to be one of 20 wives sealed to an awful abusive husband. Perhaps in his own way Mr. Denee can perform a role like that for ex-RCG members. Whether he literally opens up a guest room so bankrupted givers of "Common" can build up some savings and get re-established, or whether he writes eloquently as an insider willing to show himself as flawed in order to expose Pack's even greater flaws, he has an opportunity now to do a lot of good. He'll never atone for the full extent of the damage he has done, but he can do a great deal, and we shouldn't judge him more harshly than his Savior judges him.
7.46 AM
DeleteChrist forgiving all our sins is not the same as some magic wand wiping away reality. King David murdered Uriah the Hittite, and the resulting stain and diminished respect will stay will him for all of eternity. Sins can have eternal consequences.
ReplyDeleteI still remember Dave Pack's August 31, 2013 prophetic date guess that totally failed in spite of all his given and not given reasons for it.
It was a huge warning sign not to take too seriously anything that Dave says. Those who did not learn from that big blunder got many more big blunders later.
King David murdered Uriah the Hittite, and the resulting stain and diminished respect will stay will him for all of eternity.
ReplyDeleteKing David is honored as a man after God's own heart. Try calling him a despicable murderer in the Kingdom of God, and see how God decides to deal with you!
8.47 AM
DeleteYes David will be honored in the kingdom. But he will have less honor than he would have had because he murdered an innocent man. He cheapened himself for all of eternity. That is the way the world works.
I'm not surprised that this offends Herbs former and present minions.
That says more about your god than it does your David.
DeleteOne thing that WCG taught, that kept some doubt in my mind and intellectual distance between me and their teachings, was Herbert Armstrong's insistence that "...work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" (Phil. 2:12) referred to how well you obeyed and followed headquarters. That is trusting them to work out your salvation FOR you, so their explanation never made sense to me. I praise God that He made it possible for me to not get sucked to more than I did.
ReplyDeleteDavid will be honored in the kingdom. But he will have less honor than he would have had because he murdered an innocent man. He cheapened himself for all of eternity. That is the way the world works.
ReplyDeleteDavid will be over a vast number of people in the Millennium and beyond. The vast majority of those people will never have committed murder. If, as you suggest, eternity consists of considering your superiors to be "damaged goods" then that's a pretty crappy eternity, and sounds a lot more like a ministerial council with the resentments and politics and backbiting, etc.
Or is the truth that because of our sins we have ALL committed murder, and that our murder of Jesus Christ makes us all equal, such that nobody will bother to count which of us murdered "just" Christ, and which of us murdered Christ and a few other people?
Do we know that King David will actually be in the Kingdom? He lived and died before there even was such a thing as salvation. Jesus Christ had not yet lived a perfect life and died for our sins. If David is in the Kingdom, does that mean that Neanderthal, Cro Magnon, Pithecanthropus Erectus and the entire hominid gang will be there, too? I'd simply love to learn from them how to make hunting implements, and how to do cave art!
ReplyDeleteSorry, 11:56, only those with some Neanderthal DNA are eligible to receive the Spirit in Man (well, Spirit in Neanderthal, to be precise) and thus as ensouled beings to have a hope of salvation.
ReplyDeleteModern mutants with no Neanderthal DNA are by definition soulless drones and have no more chance of salvation than a housecat.