From an LCG source:
LCG wants our excess second tithes, but do they deserve it? Do any of the COG's really deserve it? It is not a command or even expectation under the New Covenant. This year treat your family or yourself to something special and let the elite from HQ make better decisions about what type of facilities they rent or use. Let those elite HQ representatives that get free housing and big bonuses for use at the Feast donate that money. Let's have the elite leadership set the example, for once.
Excess Second TitheSome have thought that excess second tithe is no longer set aside for a specific purpose and may be used back home. That is not the case. To do so is to profane what God has set aside as holy!
The Church has traditionally said that a portion of one’s excess second tithe may be used to supplement—not replace—one’s Last Great Day offering. However, one should take care to cover expenses regarding the trip home, some of which can be unexpected, such as a flat tire. After returning home, excess second tithe should then be sent in as a “Festival Tithe Donation” so that it will be put in a fund to help take care of next year’s Festival expenses. It should be noted that the Church rarely, if ever, receives enough Festival Tithe donations to cover all Feast-related costs.
Generally, excess second tithe should not be saved for the following Feast. However, there may be exceptions to this. When someone is going to retire and does not expect to have sufficient funds for the next year, saving some excess second tithe is permissible. Close family members separated by great distances are permitted to occasionally save for the following Feast so they can be with family when that would otherwise be impossible. In situations where income is erratic, it may be best to spread out a bountiful year’s second tithe over several years. But none of this should be our usual practice—we are to save up from year to year (Deuteronomy 14:22).
While it might seem selfless to minimize second tithe expenses during the Feast in order to send more to the Church at the end of it, doing so can frustrate the very purpose of second tithe! Seek to satisfy that purpose during the Feast, seeing to it that you and your family rejoice abundantly and enjoy picturing what God’s Feast represents—thereby learning to fear the Eternal, who gives such gifts to those who love Him. This purpose should be satisfied first—then any additional contribution in your final offering will truly be “excess.” How do I use my second tithe?
All of these disputations about "excess" second tithe are really at heart a kind of "Pharisee practice."
ReplyDeleteInstead, how about trusting Spirit-led Christians to make the best personal decisions about how they should emulate Christ in their own particular situations?
It is not a command or even expectation under the New Covenant
ReplyDeleteIf you can show me where the terms, commands and "expectations" of the "New" Covenant appear in Scripture, I'll believe you!
The agreeing parties, terms, commands and so on of the "Old" Covenant are quite explicit about tithing, and the "Church" is not a part of them! There was no transfer of the Priesthood from the Sons of Aaron to the "ministers" through Melchizedek, and no change on who tithes on what to whom!
The misunderstanding, or deliberate misinterpretation of the book of Hebrews was HWA's source for the tithing doctrine. The churches of the world got it through a mandate of the Roman Catholics. The point in Hebrews is that on Earth, it is the Priesthood of Aaron; in Heaven, it is the Priesthood of Melchizedek, and on Earth, Jesus would not be a Priest!
So offerings are freewill, and while the "church" has no authority to mandate "Biblical tithing" the "Lord loves a cheerful giver"!
1st, 2nd or 3rd tithes are NOT a doctrine of Christianity. The artwork accompanying the article IS correct. The Jews were to tithe on livestock or crops, not money.
ReplyDeleteSo, this feast, give Dave or Gerald a goat, not a check! And none of them even deserve that!
"The Jews were to tithe on livestock or crops, not money."
DeleteWhat scripture is this from?
I guess Wally should know about living in excess.
ReplyDeleteWhen these leaders become just so autocratic, I'd mess with them a little, just to show them who's really boss. LCG makes a federal over your excess second tithe? Send it to the COGAWA! Dave Pack demands your "common"? Give it to UCG. I mean, they all hold to the same doctrines anyway, and claim to be God's Church and God's ministers, so, what's the diff? Better yet, buy your kids some new X-Box games.
ReplyDelete.....made of necessity a REMOVAL even of the law - Hebrews 7:12. This translation will never be accepted by the COgs. How do I know the word removal, from Strong's 3331 metathesis, is correct? From Hebrews 12:27 where in the KJV the word "removing" is from 3331 and there is no doubt from the context of that verse that removing is meant, not transfer. Strong's 3346 is "transfer".
ReplyDeleteThe COgs think "transfer" To what? There is no written LAW of tithing before Moses and before the Levitical priesthood.
"If our children see the Feast as a “Church-approved Christmas” when they are showered with toys, they—and we—are missing the point."
ReplyDeleteEven Wally's comment about "Church- approved" misunderstands who the church is, and what it should be doing.
Deuteronomy 14:22 “You shall tithe all the yield of your seed that comes from the field year by year.
ReplyDeleteLeviticus 27:30 “Every tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the trees, is the LORD's; it is holy to the LORD.
Deuteronomy 12:17 You may not eat within your towns the tithe of your grain or of your wine or of your oil, or the firstborn of your herd or of your flock, or any of your vow offerings that you vow, or your freewill offerings or the contribution that you present,
Arguement: they were an agrarian society and therefore didn't use money.
Genesis 13:2 Now Abram was very rich in livestock, in silver, and in gold
That argument is incorrect, even hundreds of years prior to the law money (silver and gold) was used. Therefore, did God just forget to include everything in the law, or has HWA broadened the interpretation of the law to recieve more money? God even made a provision which included money in regards to tithing,
Deuteronomy 14:25 then you shall turn it into money and bind up the money in your hand and go to the place that the LORD your God chooses
So if God wanted Israelites to tithe on money, they would have known exactly what it was and how it applied. The Israelites understood tithing in a literal (produce) way,
2 Chronicles 31:5 As soon as the command was spread abroad, the people of Israel gave in abundance the firstfruits of grain, wine, oil, honey, and of all the produce of the field. And they brought in abundantly the tithe of everything.
Nehemiah 10:37 and to bring the first of our dough, and our contributions, the fruit of every tree, the wine and the oil, to the priests, to the chambers of the house of our God; and to bring to the Levites the tithes from our ground, for it is the Levites who collect the tithes in all our towns where we labor.
In summary, while they were more of an agrarian society than us today, many people still lived in cities and towns. There were potters, traders, fisherman, carpenters, weavers, tailors, etc etc, all of which would not have tithed according to the law. The law was specifically tied to increase in produce in the holy land (the old covenant was tied to the land). The people had money, used it, and knew what it was for.
These “ministers” are worse than the IRS
ReplyDeleteIn regards to the FOT--Deuteronomy 14:26 Use the silver to buy whatever you like: cattle, sheep, wine or other fermented drink, or ANYTHING YOU WISH
ReplyDeleteNo restrictions about buying stuff, great gifts or clothes , or jewelry or ANYTHING! Having mercy on the poor is up to the leading of the Holy Spirit upon the individual, and is not regulated by any kind of religious government.
Also very much missing in scripture the TITHE OF THE 2ND TITHE idea.
The COGs have a long history of treating people like infants. Im surprised they dont use safety pins holding envelopes attached to their shirts for lunch money, like kindergardeners at the FOT.
I would not begrudge the elite HQ representatives getting financial bonuses or being highly honoured IF they fed their members spiritual meat. Instead they constantly feed their members spiritual milk. I recall members complaining to me in the 1980s that they were forced to spent too much time reading non church books in order to educate themselves about how the world really works. Especially after giving truck loads of money to the church.
ReplyDeleteAnd the members are expected to fake reality and pretend that the spiritual milk is spiritual meat.
"... IF they fed their members spiritual meat. Instead they constantly feed their members spiritual milk."
ReplyDeleteThe only thing ministers in the church do is feed us curdled buttermilk.
Phrases "1st T (tithe)", "2nd T", "3rd T", are not in scripture. The "third year" IS NOT the 3rd tithe year. Tithe in the 3rd year was 10% to 3.3% of the population: Levites 2% - Num 31:30, and estimated 1.3% for stranger, etc. No tithes were paid every year to others but 10% was kept by the populace for the feasts every year except the 7th. You could pay, in the 3rd year, in money but it has to be 12% of the value of the real thing like grain, etc - Lev 27:31. Firstfruits are not tithes. All this is based on the Levitical priesthood, now removed.
ReplyDeleteThe Herbertized COgs say: HUH??
And you shall spend that money for whatever your heart desires: for oxen or sheep, for wine or similar drink, for whatever your heart desires; you shall eat there before the Lord your God, and you shall rrejoice, you and your household.
ReplyDeleteMy heart desires to put it into the bank savings account. So that what I'm doing with excess.
Money is man's creation. (Mind you nowadays it's increasingly digits on a computer and nothing tangible at all!)
ReplyDeleteAnimals and plants are God's creation.
God demanded a tithe from His creation ie animals and plants.
To give God man's creation ie money as God's tithe would be a kind of pollution or defilement imo.
Note the lessons from the coin in the fish's mouth and Christ's "Render unto Caeser" declaration.
I never subscribed to the church's tithing teachings because in the church we are equals, differing only in function, not status. So why should one church member be tithing to another church member? Hence the NT teaches freewill offerings! One thing that use to gall me though. The call and pressure to turn in the excess second tithe usually came at the BEGINNING of the feast!! How stupid is that?
ReplyDeleteThe interesting thing is, money alone does not ensure the successful preaching of the Gospel. Look at Dave Pack. All that common. Builds himself a TV studio. Gets on all manner of stations. What good did it do? It's shut down.
ReplyDeleteGerald Flurry. His campus, his archaeological digs, and cultural foundation. The jet. Eddington. None of this has taken him anywhere. He's got the HWA trappings, but not the success the old man enjoyed until it collapsed and disintegrated.
You'd almost believe that these men had somehow brought a curse on their ministries despite all the money they take in, because the churches they lead are stagnant. Sunday-keeping Christians are vastly more successful in getting the gospel out, and in achieving church growth. Taking their cities for Jesus Christ. Considering all of the splinter groups, there aren't even enough Armstrongites to match just one of the mega-churches in a typical American city.
2:42:00 PM
ReplyDeleteWhat is your issue with DW's statement? Who he stated was to tithe or what he stated was to be tithed?