Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web of Corrupt Leaders

Sunday, February 19, 2012

Prophet Thiel Is Not Happy With Us


Prophet Thiel included the above picture on his news story as PROOF that Guttenberg is a military man 
who will come to overthrow the United States.  
Perhaps what the Prophet has failed to see here is that maybe he was doing a dry run 
on the Charlotte offices?  See the bombs ready!



All of the blogs that have been picking on Prophet Bob's uber-fascination with Karl Guttenberg has finally gotten under his skin.  He writes today:

Yet, certain anti-Church of God critics seem to be besides themselves in their often inane criticism of my coverage of his possible end time role.  There were a few comments from critics that I ran across yesterday, and instead of dealing with much of the nonsense, I thought that perhaps I would quote most of one of the comments that was posted about me in response to an article someone posted partially titled The Prophet Thiel and Beast Guttenberg… at the “Banned by HWA” site:
I guess Bob just didn’t notice that Herr Guttenberg plagiarized…his doctoral thesis, it was an enormous scandal, his degree was revoked, and he resigned from the government in shame and fled the country?
Why wouldn’t one think that his political career is over?

Ya know Bob, if you would stop writing inane speculation on your blog we would not be making fun of you.  Alas, you and many other Armstrongites cannot seem to control yourselves and write all kinds of silliness.

He continues:

Part of the problem with many of my scoffing critics is that they either do not know certain scripture or do not accept the writings of the Bible as inspired.  Since I do accept scripture, this might be a good time to quote a scripture (with three different translations) that some of my critics seem to have overlooked related to the final King of the North:
21 His place will be taken by a reject, a man spurned and passed over for advancement. He’ll surprise everyone, seemingly coming out of nowhere, and will seize the kingdom. (Daniel 11:21, THE MESSAGE)
21 And in his place shall arise a vile person, to whom they will not give the honor of royalty; but he shall come in peaceably, and seize the kingdom by intrigue. (Daniel 11:21, New King James Version)
21 ‘In his place will rise a wretch: royal honours will not be given to him, but rather he will insinuate himself into them at his pleasure and will gain possession of the kingdom by intrigue. (Daniel 11:21, New Jerusalem Bible)
 Prophet Bob needs to understand that there are many readers of this blog (over 650 hits a day now) do consider the Bible to be inspired but who cannot and will not interpret it through the lenses of Armstrongism.  Yes, others no longer hold it to be inspired or infallible, but that is not the point.  The point that all the blogs are bringing out is how you interpret what is written in the Bible to make it fit your narrow view of the world.  You can take the Bible and any other great book and relate it to the world around you, yet it doesn't make it true.

Taking events that happened thousands of years ago and labeling them enforce today shows how little biblical understanding Prophet Bob has today.

The Prophet continues with this speculative, unsubstantiated comment:
Since his resignation in early 2011, former German Defense Minister Baron Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg keeps making political and military contacts in the USA and elsewhere that he may be able to use later.  His plan appearance later this week in Georgia (see Karl Guttenberg to Speak in Georgia) is further proof of that.

Prophet Bob yet again claims Guttenberg is here doing reconnaissance as he makes military contacts for the invasion of the Untied States by Germany.  Just because he is speaking in Georgia does not make him a potential world invader or the Beast.  How stupid can some people get?

It looks like I got further under his skin by calling him a "prophet".  He makes this comment in relation to an earlier posting that I did where I listed all of the prophecies about Guttenberg that Thiel claims to have come to pass:

Thus far, several of my speculative predictions about Baron Guttenberg have come to pass (details of several of them are in the article COGwriter Speculations on Karl zu Guttenberg Shown Correct).  Interestingly, the anti-COGwriter critics and scoffers pretty much overlook the accuracy of my speculations (although some do sarcastically refer to me as “Prophet Thiel”).

For those of you that missed Prophet Thiel's amazing list of predictions that have come true, here it is again:

Here are summaries of 23 things from the Bible that Thiel says describes Guttenberg:

Here are 23 biblical-related items to consider:
  1. Baron Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg is a leader from middle Europe.  His blood line crosses into various countries in Europe (at least Germany, France, Austria, Liechtenstein, and Croatia). So did the Roman empire. (cf. Daniel 7:24; 9:26-27; Isaiah 10:5-11).
  2. He has a military background as he was “Minister of Defence” for Germany..  The Beast of Revelation 13:1-4 is shown to be a military political leader.
  3. He is considered to have some economic expertise. (cf. Daniel 8:25; 11:24; Revelation 13:16-17; 18:3)
  4. He is an extremely popular politician (he was the most popular in Germany in early and late 2010). (Revelation 13:4,8)
  5. He is considered an expert on foreign policy. (cf. Daniel 11:27)
  6. He is some type of Catholic. (cf. Revelation 17:7-11)
  7. Because he is married to a Lutheran (and she apparently did not convert prior to marriage), he apparently is not super strict about being Catholic (some other news reports I have seen also seem to confirm this in other ways as well). (cf. Revelation 13:4,8; Daniel 11:36-38)
  8. His wife also has political connections, and both of them have made various public  “morality statements.”  Hence suggesting that the Guttenbergs represent the moral high ground in Germany. (cf. Revelation 13:4,8)
  9. He seems to have ecumenical tendencies, and that is what the “Great Monarch” of Catholic prophecies and the final Beast of Revelation would likely have. (cf. Revelation 13:4,8; Daniel 11:36-38)
  10. He may be considered to be entitled to use the “King of Jerusalem” title that Otto von Habsburg held. (cf. Daniel 11:31)
  11. Charlemagne was a Frank-German leader and “Holy Roman Emperor.”  The Baron is a descendant of the Habsburg line of rulers (the Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire were from the Habsburg line; cf. Revelation 17:9-11). Certain Catholic prophecies indicate that the “Great Monarch” will be a descendant of Charlemagne. Bible prophecies seem to point to the resurrection of an empire that has revived in the past (Revelation 13:1-3; 17:9-11)
  12. He has the right to select the priest for his parish.  Hence, the idea that political leaders should be involved with religion is something he was raised up believing. A leader combining church and state is prophesied in Daniel 11:37-38 and Revelation 13.
  13. The understanding that his title means “Baron of the Holy Roman Empire” is interesting as the Book of Revelation describes a power that would resemble a re-emergence of “the Holy Roman Empire” and Catholic prophecy specifically tells of a time when “The Great King will be crowned Holy Roman Emperor by the reigning Pope” (Birch DA. Trial, Tribulation & Triumph: Before During and After Antichrist. Queenship Publishing Company, Goleta (CA), 1996,, p. 555). Baron is a title of nobility, but not one of royalty. (Daniel 11:21)
  14. The fact that he has been the most popular political leader in Germany suggests that he has a certain charisma that would be consistent with that which is expected for the final Beast leader (cf. Daniel 7:20,11:21-24,31; Revelation 13:3-5).
  15. He is believed to carefully cultivate his public image, which seems consistent with the cunning (Daniel 8:25) and other practices of the final Beast leader (Daniel 11:36-38).
  16. Because a Catholic monarchist relative (Karl Ludwig Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg) of his was involved in a plot against Hitler in 1944 (and killed for it in April 1945), he may be perceived as less of a threat than others with a German background. (cf. Daniel 8:23-25; 11:24)
  17. He is considered to be a smooth talking attractive leader. (cf. Daniel 8:25; 11:21)
  18. Some of his entertainment actions suggest that beneath his exterior he may have certain “vile” tendencies (cf. Daniel 11:21). His plagiarism scandal seems consistent with this as well.
  19. He has a problem with arrogance and vanity (Daniel 11:36-37).
  20. He is in a type of self-imposed exile and it is possible that the King of the North is supposed to have a period of exile. (cf. Daniel 8:23-25; 11:21-23)
  21. He has risen to powerful positions quite quickly.  And may do that again. (Daniel 8:23-24)
  22. He has been ridiculed and rejected by many. (Daniel 11:21)
  23. He has a certain expertise when it comes to computers and surveillance. (cf. Revelation 13:15-18).

 Prophet Bob close with this final proof for the reason he is infatuated with Baron Guttenberg.  We are in the end times and are commanded to "watch."  Armstrongism has been at the end times for well over 70 years now.  Every single speculation, prediction and utterances has been an abysmal failure.  You would think Prophet Bob would have learned to keep his mouth shut by now.  Especially since Rod Meredith has countless failed prophecies as his legacy.













19 comments:

  1. Here is my prediction.

    I predict that the mentioned political entity, Karl Guttenberg, will continue his career, retire, and live a perfectly "normal" political life.

    I also predict that the mentioned political entiry, Karl Guttenberg, will prove himself as having absolutely NOTHING to do with the "Beast" of Revelation, absolutely NOTHING to do with anything alluded to about ANYTHING Biblical whatsoever.

    In truth, the "proofs" he offersthat make Guttenberg "biblically special" are nothing at all new under the sun - for politics.

    Many political leaders have military backgrounds. All are smooth talkers. I would HOPE political leaders would have some economic expertise, it's scary to assume this qualification is "biblically special". I would hope ANY person in his position would be an expert in foreign policy. The Catholic comparison is, in my opinion, idiotic. And many of the other "predictions that came to pass" are hardly indicative of a biblical personality, but wholly indicative of what is expected of a political leader - of any country.

    I also predict my prediction in this is right and I predict Bob - among others - will be PROVEN to be completely and totally wrong. I also predict when proven wrong, there will be no apology - as the eyes will focus on another leader, with the carrot-on-a-stick hope that this one might be the guy to bring all prophecy into crystal clear focus. And just as what happened with Armstrong, Heoh, McNair, Meredith, and every other COG leader-who-has-NEVER-learned their lessons - their combined prophetic watchings, ramblings, and incredulously ludicrous statements will just add more to the pile of stench that is known as Armstrongism - the one doctrine that has a proven HISTORY of absolute failure - because it is based on a "genetically refuted theory of British Israelism" - and refuted just as strongly by failed prophecy BASED of BI.

    Who's predictions will be correct? I'm betting on mine. And when that happens, I bet I, and others who refute these errored ramblings - will never get so much as the beginnings of an apology. Those who are in Armstrongism are too blinded to even begin that they could be a part of what I believe is the most serious religious and doctrinal error imaginable.

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  2. Wow, the power of the internet at work! Bob noticed my post about Karl Guttenberg's disgrace, and actually answered my question!

    And the answer is, the reason why he thinks that Karl Guttenberg's political career is not over is because he's pinning all his hopes on a speculative interpretation of a single verse.

    Next question. Bob, what makes you think that out of billions of people over a span of thousands of years, Karl Guttenberg is THE one that Daniel 11:21 is talking about?

    We're in the gunlap now, Bob. It's been a 2,000 year long gunlap so far, but the time is nearer now than when we first believed. Which means there couldn't be more than about a thousand years left to go. Hold on folks, we're in for wild ride!

    Keep reading your bible like a newspaper, Bob. Statistically speaking, I'm sure your speculations will eventually hit pay dirt. Well, that's it for now. I'm off to play the lottery. Wish me luck.

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  3. Dr. Bob just never fails to entertain, does he? Once again proof that they just eat up everything we're saying! This site practically pays for itself simply in terms of time spent here by various COG leaders and talking heads. Time that otherwise could have been spent furthering their absurd beliefs.

    Score one for the good guys!

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  4. I think the only thing we have going for us is that the Beast of Revelation was Vespasian and the Book of Revelation does not matter much past 70 AD. It was not written in the 90's.

    Revelation reflects very little if any knowledge of the Gospel Jesus. Revelation is not much of a "suffer the little children to come unto me," kinda book and Gentiles don't have much of a chance in its pages. The Great Multitude are secondary Jews scattered in all nations, (Rev 5: 7-10) not gentile, in the diaspora. The Book is Jewish, by Jews, for Jews.

    To the Jewish Christian Church, which is who the book of Revelation was meant to encourage as Rome is taken down by the Messiah, the Apostle Paul would have been the false prophet who said he was a Jew and Apostle and was not, and was found wanting to be rejected by the Ephesian Church. For this, Revelation Jesus congratulated the Ephesian Church.

    Of course, Rome won and the "prophecy" fell way short.

    Humans do not prophecy about things thousands of years in the future. They prophecy about things which must shortly come to pass, but in this case, did not. If you can't get "shortly" right, what's the chance of "longly"?

    I'd not worry about "God's Gift Son of Good Mountain" (Theodore von Guten Berg)

    COGs and most prophesy haunted fundamentalist Christians are still trying to figure out who will win the ball game (Revelation) and that game ended 1918 years ago.

    IMHO of course, along with that of many better trained and informed theologians and historians than most Bible readers avail themselves of.

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  5. You know who suffers by prophet Thiels theological rants don't you?

    Not only the dumb sheep of his fold, but Guttenberg and his family.

    Then there is Thiels kid. Oh what a twisted view this boy will have when he becomes an adult. What potential will he sacrifice if he decides to devote his life to keep Herbert Armstrong's false prophecies alive?

    It seems the prophet is indeed upset. Could it be he is experiencing a "ManPower" moment?

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  6. It is beyond belief that Booby Thiel can be unhappy, since we have collectively proved that British Israelism is absolutely false and that all Armstrongist predictions based on it are wrong.

    The United States and British Commonwealth are not lost tribes of Israel.

    How can Booby even begin to miss the fact that his ideas are utterly stupid in every way. The Bible does not support his offal in any way.

    He is spouting insane delusion on a daily basis.

    I just don't buy it.

    He's lying. He is a liar. He knows he is a liar.

    Roderick Meredith is a liar. Roderick Mededith is a false prophet. The Living Church of God is totally wrong and it certainly is neither living nor of God.

    What does it take for Thiel to finally get it?

    When will Thiel repent and accept the truth?

    And when will he finally shut up in embarassment and slink away.

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  7. On the one hand, I can understand becoming defensive when ideas that you have formulated come under scrutiny. However, I have found that most well balanced individuals will eventually come to moderate them based on constructive criticism.

    Unfortunately this seems never seems to be the case with Robert Thiel. The more criticism he receives on a given subject just seems to cause him to dig in deeper. Apparently he has never considered that he may be wrong. It is too bad that a writer who considers himself the ultimate news source for all COG issues is so biased and inflexible. Then again, perhaps that is oddly appropriate for a disciple of Meredith and Armstrong.

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  8. Here's a challenge: Let Thiel open his blog for comments.

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  9. The fact that he is even over here reading this blog makes me laugh. Aren't these guys not supposed to be reading anything that is not be their apostle, prophet or guru? He is breaking their direct command on this. Shame, shame not reading church authorized writing ! You are not following the government you reprobate.

    I agree, let him open up his blog for comments, which he would never do. Then he'll have to spend too much time answering his critics and less time looking up the Baron's activities.

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  10. Maybe Karl Guttenberg will have an airport named after him like Franz Josef Strauss, whom Meredith and HWA also claimed as the head of the coming beast power.

    Munich Airport is named after Strauss, who played a prominent controversial role in politics of the Federal Republic of Germany from the 1950s until his death in 1988

    Strauss was the author of a book called "The Grand Design" in which he gave his views of the way in which the future unification of Europe should be decided.

    He was committed to the creation of a United States of Europe.

    Hence all the speculation of his roll in prophecy....Theil is just another speculator....as they all are.

    anna

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  11. Thiel is just rehashing declarations made when my family was in the church in the 50s...and the 60s...and the 70s, even after we all took flight to Petra, remember that?...and the 80s, even after HWA died, remember that?...and the 90s, even after JWT died, remember that?...and the 00s, even after GTA died, remember that?...and...

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  12. And maybe Guttenberg is really a spy working for the German BND or a double agent for the CIA or perhaps a terrorist for Al Qaeda?! Seriously?!?!

    Maybe Bob's avid imagination would be better served if he went into fiction and wrote a thriller novel or produced a Hollywood script. Something like "The Da Vinci Code 2" or "The Omen 6" perhaps?

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  13. "Hence all the speculation of his roll in prophecy....Theil is just another speculator....as they all are."

    One mans speculator is another mans false prophet. I can't remember how many times I've heard "Speculation!" as an excuse to ignore Matthew 7:15

    I'm looking at you, dad!

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  14. That Guttenberg fellow has a long name!

    It's Karl Theodor Maria Nikolaus Johann Jacob Philipp Franz Joseph Sylvester Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg.

    I think that in anticipation of Karl having sex with Booby Thiel, Booby needs to practice squealing, "OH, KARL THEODOR MARIA NIKOLAUS JOHANN JACOB PHILIPP FRANZ JOSEPH SYLVESTER FREIHERR VON UND ZU GUTTENBERG, IT FEELS SO GOOOD WHEN YOU PUT YOUR MEAT-HOOKS IN MY THIEL-BOOBIES!"

    Norm

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  15. A long time ago, in MAD Magazine, there was a parody on conspiracy and paranoia. I recall two frames from that. They depicted a Martian, with one of those Weinerdude beanie-coptor hats, and the caption was, "Next time you see some weirdo, and he claims to be a Martian, be careful what you say to him!" Next frame shows us that the fun-poker has been incinerated, and the Martian looks jubilant. The caption reads: "Because, he may actually be a Martian!"

    Could this apply to Bobby Thiel and his ersatz "beast" Guttenberg?

    Nah!

    BB

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  16. Ya know Bob, if you would stop writing inane speculation on your blog we would not be making fun of you.

    Yeah, right.

    C'mon - you'd still find other things. Like you did with James Malm's views on how to keep the Feast.

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  17. You are right Anon. The trouble still remains, if these nutjobs in Armstrongism would keep their mouths shut there would be no need to report on them. But, as I have said before, they cannot stop making STUPID comments. As long as they continue to make asses of themselves, I will continue to report it, using their OWN words.

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  18. Something tells me that Robert Thiel will be frequenting Karl's store (The Handsome Baron's Meat-Hook Emporium), to try to catch a glimpse of that handsome rascal, and maybe even chat him up.
    (Of course, only when the Baron isn't battling Snoopy in the friendly skies above.)

    Good grief!

    Norm

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  19. Snoopy? Isn't she that hot little chick on Jersey Shore?

    BB

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