United Church of God has an article in their Compass Check, geared towards youth and UCG members, telling people to not worry about the end of the world. That is pretty ironic coming from a church that has made its financial living off of endtime malarky.
UCG writes:
Literature throughout the ages explores what the end of the world might be like. Blockbuster movies paint pictures of destruction from earthquakes, alien invasions, nuclear warfare and asteroid collisions. While there might be much to say about it, the end of the world is an unknown quantity to many people.
In God’s Church, we are blessed with significant and uncommon understanding of what “the end of the world” will actually be like. The Bible even comments on the end of the age within its opening pages, a passage we will turn to shortly.
Biblical prophecies about the end times do speak of dire and horrifying events in the future. In Leviticus 26:16, God vows He will bring “sudden terror, wasting diseases and fever” to the nation which does not obey Him (New International Version). As another example, God discusses a soon-coming beast power in Revelation 13. It will have vast control over the world’s economies and brutally murder those who oppose or refuse to worship it, especially the Church of God (verses 15-18).
These and other end-time events are disturbing and troubling to many. What can you do to grow in courage and not be so afraid? How can you stop worrying about the end of the world?So what is the first things UCG members need to do?
If UCG and other COG's actually believed that, then why do the warble on incessantly about prophecy? Let God take care of it when he is good and ready. There is no need for endless theories and speculations about what "might" happen. Not one single UCG minister or any other COG member actually knows what might or will happen. Not a single one.Perhaps the most important thing to remember regarding the end times and prophecy in general is that God is sovereign and in control of all things. God inspired the words of the Bible, and prophecies are only going to be fulfilled as part of His schedule and His plan.
On the Bible’s opening pages, God says this about Satan and foretells an end to his worldwide deception: “I will put enmity between you [speaking to Satan] and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel” (Genesis 3:15).
That “Seed” is Jesus Christ. He is returning to stamp out Satan’s evil from the earth and establish truth and justice. The Messiah will put an end to the violence, destruction and suffering of the end times and usher in an age of joy and peace. “Then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: ‘Death is swallowed up in victory’” (1 Corinthians 15:54). This present, evil age will be replaced by the glorious Kingdom of God (Galatians 1:3-5). We can be absolutely sure that this will happen because this is God’s plan, and He is in control.Do they even believe this? They cant discuss too much about the guy during the week, but they believe he is coming to kick some ass and bring in world peace. This is the same guy the crucify every year in some high school gym or Masonic Lodge, but don't discuss much of the rest of the time.
You and I also have a role to play in this. God expects us to persevere in His truth to the end, no matter what. Note what God says about those who do so in Revelation 3:10: “I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world.” God, who is in control of everything, is certainly able to protect His Church in a time of crisis. He extends an offer of end-time protection to those who faithfully and wholeheartedly follow Him (Zephaniah 2:3).UCG expects it youth and members to do two things:
Pray to develop a trusting relationship with God (1 Thessalonians 5:17). Prayer is one way that you can get to know God and more deeply understand His Will for your life. Navigating life’s ups and downs can be difficult. Turn to Him on both the good days and the bad, talking to Him both when it’s easy and when it’s hard.As much as UCG claims to not want its members to worry too much, they turn right around and tell them to always be aware of prophecies and to look to them in comfort.
“Do not despise prophecies” (1 Thessalonians 5:20). Another important action we can take is to not neglect but instead become familiar with the prophetic insight God provides. Prophecies of historical events demonstrate God’s control and influence over human affairs, which can really help build our faith. Likewise, we can look to the Bible’s end-time prophecies with comfort and confidence that they will proceed just as God has planned because He is in control. Furnishing a good understanding of prophecies about “the end of the world” can help stop you from worrying or being afraid of it. If you aren’t sure where to begin or what to look for, the United Church of God has many different resources to help guide your studies. God wants us to live by His every word, and prophecy is no exception (Matthew 4:4).UCG members, as well as COG members, are sick of the endless speculating and moronic utterances by various self-appointed Church of God false prophets. How many lies do these men need to speak before everyone abandons them? Is it really about prophecy or a means to manipulate member to keep them under control?
For some reason all of the self-appointed prophecy gurus in the Church of God conveniently ignore this verse:The end of this age is coming; the Bible leaves no doubt about that. But God does not want us to worry about this treacherous time. He wants us to remember that in the good times and the bad, He is still in control. God is willing to protect and comfort His people, even in the despair of the end times. We must draw near to Him in spite of these trying circumstances, with prayer and with confidence in His Word, looking forward to the time when God will establish a new age of goodness, peace and joy on earth. In that day, the entire world will recognize God’s sovereignty and take comfort in the fact that He is in control.
2 Peter 2:1-3The Message (MSG)Lying Religious Leaders2 1-2 But there were also lying prophets among the people then, just as there will be lying religious teachers among you. They’ll smuggle in destructive divisions, pitting you against each other—biting the hand of the One who gave them a chance to have their lives back! They’ve put themselves on a fast downhill slide to destruction, but not before they recruit a crowd of mixed-up followers who can’t tell right from wrong.
2-3 They give the way of truth a bad name. They’re only out for themselves. They’ll say anything, anything, that sounds good to exploit you. They won’t, of course, get by with it. They’ll come to a bad end, for God has never just stood by and let that kind of thing go on.
When my parents read us 1975 in Prophecy, as I heard about the US being attacked and defeated, I commented that I would take my wagon and collect newspapers and things to sell and contribute to the war effort. My dad told me that it wouldn't do any good in this coming war because it was all coming from God, and that we were some of the few who were being given advance knowledge of what was going to happen, and the way out of it.
ReplyDeleteI lived in fear of it all, because they always harped on the idea that what if you somehow aren't counted worthy to escape? What if you allow yourself to become Laodicean?
Honestly, what stopped all of the fear in me was the realization in 1975 that so far as prophecy was concerned, HWA and his lackeys didn't know their butts from a hole in the ground. I knew then that if they had been God's Church as they claimed, He would not have allowed them to be wrong about such a major, major thing. It boggles my mind that even a church group that so many within the movement believe defines Laodiceanism would have to be confronting fear of an interpretation of prophecy that failed over forty years ago. And, if you include Armstrongism's antecedents, pretty much the same interpretation has been failing since 1844!
When these forums and blogs began, much of my experience with the mothership was relevant, because at that time, splinter groups were a relatively new phenomenon. Now, we're at the point where many people have already spent more time in their splinter groups than I ever spent in WCG. Many things have changed, but many are the same. I believe it is still good advice that if you find yourself in one of these churches, do not allow prophecy to drive your life, education, finances, or other important life choices. Concentrate on goodness, and good values, but realize that the prophecy aspect of your church has proven to be very shakey, and don't take it seriously. Don't allow yourself to be leveraged by something that is most likely not going to happen in your lifetime. You should be feeling much the same as many of us originals began feeling in 1972, 1973, 1974, and 1975, when we looked around us and realized that it just wasn't happening at all.
BB
UCG says:
ReplyDelete"In God’s Church, we are blessed with significant and uncommon understanding of what “the end of the world” will actually be like."
This is their fundamentally flawed perspective. It is a delusional and mistaken notion. All other errors made by the Churches of God flow from this untruth. Their gross unacceptance of the fact that the scriptures speak of a time back then which was short and a time back then when the night was far spent was and is not talking to them. The many references by Gospel Jesus to "when YOU see...then know..." was about them 2000 years ago. When Paul spoke of "then we who are alive and remain..." he meant HIM and he was also mistaken.
It is not that "behold I come quickly" is just around the corner. It is historically about a time in history, back then, that was rife with religious ferver and Roman conquest of ideas that interfered with their own agenda in which the Bible was written. It is inappropriate to simply blow off historical realities with "Well...they thought it was about them but it is really about us today." That is dishonest to the scriptures and a denial that all the "soon" "shortly" and "time is short" spoken by Paul and many others back then was wrong.
It is just as wrong today to teach children and adults that their lives are not to be lived in the actual present time they have on the planet but in some quasi "just around the corner" and "it won't be long now" mode which is life sucking and education thwarting.
I would encourage any lurking COG youth here to remind their pastor that Gospel Jesus also mentioned that he had come to give life life and that more abundantly. While I'm not really sure what that would have meant in context anymore, it is not a statement of life killing fear and delusional beliefs that in a pinch, "a thousand shall fall at they right hand and then thousand at they left, but it shall not come nigh unto you." Life does what it does and is meant to be lived NOW and not dictated by those who think they know the future and don't.
If Paul proved to be wrong and didn't really know then don't think your Pastor or church does either.
Unfulfilled prophecy or not, I don't feel super secure in todays world.
ReplyDeleteGiven the history of man, it seems that it would take a miracle, or a bizarre degree of luck for there not to be some kind of nuclear, biological or other insidious type of war within the next 100 years.
There was once a discussion of existential threats years ago on an ACOG related forum, Connie. The takeaway was that up until the present, all of the existential threats have been of a nature where scientists had a broad enough time frame to conduct research, perform experiments, and diffuse the threat before it could result in some sort of terminal event. The existential threat that scientists fear is the one that comes on so suddenly, does not allow time for analysis and experimentation, the wrong choice is made, and the resulting devastation wipes out enough people, infrastructure, and accumulated knowledge to take us as a species back into something very much like the stone age.
DeleteIt is indeed conceivable that some disasterous event could strike mankind. We read every day about more evidence of global climate change, or drug-resistant gonorrhea, and no amount of effort has reigned in or taken out the mad man in North Korea. Most commonly discussed events are all far too large in scope for individuals to prepare for in advance, to mount a defense. We know from personal experience that quality of life goes way down when one listens to and joins some sort of collective for protection, because that group then co-opts one's life for decades over something that has proven over time to be very unlikely. There will always be those who seek to exploit and to profiteer.
Best to just live one's life in the best and most positive way possible, and not secede from the general population.
BB
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteYes, nck, it was a bit different in my neighborhood. While everyone else was scared of the Russians and having air raid drills that would be useless in thermonuclear war, the church was telling us we needn't worry about the Russian or Cuban missiles, because it was Assyria-Germany that was going to be used to punish America for forgetting their national identity (Israelites) and culture (sabbath and holy days). Imagine, holocaust-Germany punishing people for failing to embrace Jewish culture! A then predominantly Protestant nation forcing people to become Catholic! But, such was the HWA logic as applied to Revelation's apocalypse, his artificially created hook to go against conventional logic of the cold war and to become entrapped in his cult.
DeleteI can also tell you that as the rest of the world was filled with joy, the dismantling of the Berlin wall was seen in Armstrongite circles as proof-positive that the end was imminent!
BB
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteConnie, in the long run humans will probably go the way of outsmartimg ourselves and extinction.
ReplyDeleteProphecy has been misunderstood and hijacked by Herbs church to get away with exploiting and abusing its members, big time. But that doesn't invalidate prophesy. It's there in the bible. The baby shouldn't be thrown out with the bath water.
ReplyDeleteTo me, the narrow gate is having a healthy respect for prophesy.
Good comment, BB. Especially the part about not allowing prophecy to 'drive one's life, education or finances'. "There has never been a need as great as now, and we must warn our peoples'!! In the 60's as a teenager I once dreamed that I had gone out to our mailbox .... we lived about a tenth of a mile off the highway on a gravel road, and had no telephone. In my dream I found a letter from the church informing us it was time to flee and gather wherever, BUT the date had already passed and we were not notified in time since we had no phone and the mail was so slow. When reading the letter, I resigned myself to the knowledge that our family was going to have to endure the horrors of the great tribulation as we held onto the truth. Sure was great to wake up!! ;-)
ReplyDeleteAnd, what happened in your nightmare, 10:39, was the way we were taught. God would not speak directly to the members even in dire matters. Any possible warning had to come through and from the gatekeepers, the HWA church. Reality is that God is not limited to telephone, mail, or any other form of human technology used by a corporate church. But, that didn't keep self-justifying authority figures from attempting to convince us otherwise. It was all part of the "hook".
DeleteBB
Anon 10:39 am, I too was a teen in the 60's and cut a LOT of school in NYC, a LOT. When my mother finally caught on, she used the threat that I would be on the dock in NY harbor, just having missed the boat, if I was not in school where she could get me. She told me to then stay in Manhattan where the bombs would surely fall and kill us all instantly. Nice, eh? My mom. I still have holocaust dreams at least once a year. Can you imagine? Almost 50 years later.
ReplyDeleteMy holocaust, demon, and child abuse nightmares went away probably twenty years ago. They were persistant symptoms of PTSD, and were horrifying. Other accompanying symptoms can be depression, paranoia, explosive anger, and lack of empathy for others. It took lots of work, but those symptoms are largely gone as well.
DeleteI never ditched entire days at school. I did steal a pad of hall passes, learned to forge my teachers, signatures, and used them to hang out in the library reading Hot Rod and Car Craft Magazines. As for ditching a whole day, I was too afraid of a 3 day suspension and the last thing I wanted was three whole days under house arrest with one of the parental units. When I smoked in the lav and drank in the parking lot, I was just real careful.
BB
There is no baby in the bathwater. Just old bathwater from the first century
ReplyDeleteThe book of Revelation finishes with a severe threat against anyone who adds or subtracts from that book. The spirit of this would apply to denigrating the book.
ReplyDeleteThe world's a dangerous place. Sometimes it pays to play it safe.
The Catholic canonizers just barely let it into the canon.
DeleteThe Catholic canonizers didn't want the Bible translated into English and put Tydale to death because of his translation. So I wouldn't put much clout on their opinion of the book of Revelation.
DeleteA Lutheran pastor once told me John had good drugs.
DeleteThe Catholic canonizers had been dead for almost a thousand years by Tyndale's time.
DeleteWell, Dennis, there are a handful of writers who suggest that Revelation was born from the writer's use of morning glory seeds (still grows on Patmos) or perhaps hallucinogenic mushrooms from neighboring Kos.
DeleteI dont personally put much credence in it, as the Apocalypse seems awfully lengthy and detailed to be a simple trip story. But who knows. Perhaps John of Patmos found his original trip so interesting that he kept taking them in an attempt to understand and stitched the book together from multiple experiences. It would certainly be funny if so much Christian eschatology was based on the vivid hallucinations of a well-read drug user.
when I was about 6 years old, I remember my mother telling me how she would poison us with soup so the NAZI's wouldn't be able to torture us and make us eat pork...that was about 50 yrs ago and I remember it like it was yesterday.
ReplyDeleteThis is off topic: Are their any people on this blog who were in the Tupelo, Mississippi congregation of WCG or it's spin-off groups? If so, would you kindly let me know.
ReplyDeletePerhaps if you would use your name instead of using "anonymous" someone here from Mississippi might be willing to get in contact with you.
DeleteThere is one poster who apparently attended in Tupelo during an unspecified period, but they also post as Anonymous and I do not know how often they read these threads.
DeleteAnon 12:52, I attended WCG in Tupelo from 1987-1994. I have never attended any of the splinter groups nor do I want too. How exactly does one get in contact with you? What reason are you wanting to get in contact with former members? I don't have email or a Facebook profile and I don't have a phone.
Delete5.21 PM
ReplyDeleteSure, use that Catholic church as your moral compus. The same church that killed 40 million people during the inquisition and protects pedophiles. Great going Einstein.
That doesn't follow. Canonization occurred 500-800 years before the first known Inquisition?
ReplyDeleteThe propaganda about the Catholic church is outrageous. (not Catholic myself)
ReplyDeleteBut let us look at Herbert W. Pervert Armstrong who raped and molested his own daughter for years. The same HWA who had Filipina girls flown in to service his perversions.
Who kept a masturbation log for himself and a Hermes bag for his creepy sex devices.
Then we have others in that miserable cult who wanted concubines!
And the famous, gorgeous Ambassador campus with its row of phallic symbol bushes.
Ambassador which used paddles on kids to break tail bones, bruise butts and titillate their sadistic desires on kids. It's pedophilia friends.
And yes, let's talk about the church pedophiles who are legion.
Pot.. Kettle.. Black.
The church did not wish to include Revelation in the canon because the book was fulfilled in 70 AD and they knew it.
ReplyDeleteI don't know that they "knew it" in general - at least, I cant recall multiple instances of early writers saying so. But its also possible that many of those guys who scrutinized the various gospels and purported lea!tters for continuity of doctrine found Revelation to be something of an anomaly. It must have been an interesting process.
Delete"Dear Diary, I've got eighteen supposed letters from Paul to go thru tomorrow, plus four letters from various Jameses, seven that say they're from Andrew, and a couple signed as "Apollos". Oh, and one supposedly by Judas Iscariot, but I think that one's obviously fake since it mentions Paul before he was named Paul. Meanwhile, somebody just brought me a copy of some book by a guy named John, and its full of stuff about beasts and locusts and falling stars and what not. Its a lot more fun to read than all these dry preachy letters, though, I'll give it that. Good night, diary. Pompey"
Mark
ReplyDeleteSo in 70 AD an army of 200 million swept through Europe, and the sea and rivers turned to blood. Ha ha ha ha. You and Dennis are sooo funny. You should get on stage with Jerry Seinfeld. Ha ha ha.
Does anyone know how to contact the owner of "Ambassdor Reports" at hwarmstrong.com?
ReplyDeleteThere is an article I wrote that is carried on this website. The site owner prepared an intro to the article (animated video) that contains some erroneous information. For instance, it says that 1-Ws were "slave laborers". This is not in my article and was not true.
I would like to contact the owner of the site and ask that the intro be corrected.
Starts out by saying:
ReplyDelete"Literature throughout the ages explores what the end of the world might be like."
Then, ironically, references apocalyptic literature:
"Biblical prophecies about the end times do speak of dire and horrifying events in the future."
Why should I believe one bit of apocalyptic literature more than any other bit? Why should I not assume Robert Kirkman, creator of The Walking Dead, is just as much of a "prophet" as the authors of myriad ancient apocalyptic texts?
...chirp...chirp...chirp...
And what should superstitious people do about the fact this fiction is on a shelf?
"Pray..."
Talk to themselves. Sounds about right.
Christinsanity: delusional, nonexistent problems leading to truly idiotic "solutions."
Helen Wheels, I know some Christians and they most definitely are not apart of the Armstrong cults. They are good people and they go out of their way to help those in need in our local community. You said "Christianity: delusional, nonexistent problems leading to truly idiotic "solutions". " You are the one with problems and your problem is clearly with Christians. I bet you wouldn't lift a finger to help someone in need! The Christians I know go out and donate food & clothing to the less fortunate in our city. What do you do? Sit around on your back side and condemn, ridicule and criticize people who are at least trying to make a good difference in the community. Before you start your ignorant BS with me, I am an atheist. I will defend the rights of others who are doing good no matter what they believe!
DeleteAnon 4:18 AM, you are a rare breed. Most atheists never defend anybody.
DeleteMark
ReplyDeleteThis is a dissident site. We are not fans of HWA or his abusive church. The worst aspect of his church which you failed to mention is that it was run along abusive cult lines. Members were and stilt are robbed of their adulthood, which is life itself.
It's not a question of Catholic versus Herbs church, but rather what's the truth on any matter. But you do seem to be a follower of the Catholic church.
Like many here, I believe that a Christian is one who follows Christ rather than some physical corporate church.
Anonymous the book of revelation is metaphor. It is not literal.
ReplyDeleteIf it were literal Christ would have hooves and horns and wool because he is described as a lamb.
We both know Christ is called a lamb because he paid for everyone's sins. Sacrificing truth for the sake of feeling comfortable is not prudent. Many Jews did that when Hitler was coming to power, and look how that worked out.
ReplyDeleteAnon4:18AM trolls:
ReplyDelete"I bet you wouldn't lift a finger to help someone in need!"
Then, without a hint of irony, says:
"Before you start your ignorant BS with me, I am an atheist."
Need I go on?
Got it. You're an "atheist" who comes on Armstrongist-specific blogs to defend against Armstrongist-specific criticisms, such as mine, and appears to arguably claim that their peddling of apocalyptic, fearmongering, delusional BS, is "trying to make a good difference in the community."
I spent 12 years in UCG, and decades in WCG. I'm not ignorant about that. If the only christians you know are "most definitely are not apart of the Armstrong cults," then where do you get off calling me "ignorant"? Your comment sure makes it sound like you're an interloper, and you're totally ignorant of the cult you're defending here.
I know when and where UCG does "good." Where do you get off claiming that I wouldn't give them credit for that? But I'm also going to ding them for when and where they do the opposite.
Why wouldn't I help someone in need? Just because I'm not a christian? If so, that's a cliched accusation that an atheist worth their salt would never stoop to.
I've been helping a single mom in difficult circumstances in a third world country make ends meet so she can raise her two daughters. How's that for helping those in need? What do you do?
Ignorant indeed. Your comment reveals three of your own fingers pointing right back at ya.
Seriously, the moment someone says "I bet (insert wild accusation here)" on the internet, I usually scroll past. Its a big "tell" indicating the poster isn't going to be good for much.
DeleteYou verbally attack anyone who doesn't share your narrow-minded views! You are the troll.
ReplyDeleteHelen
ReplyDeleteSo you spent decades in WCG, 12 years in UGC, and then you fell away.
You have frightened the crap out of me, so I forced myself to go to the gym tonight and build some character.
My condolences for failing to qualify. I can't say the same for Dennis, cause he's chosen to become a spiritual menace.
Neo: Please contact PT owner here: painfultruth@hushmail.com
ReplyDelete