Listening to fraudulent self-appointed Church of God leaders whine and moan about problems they see in the world around them is meaningless and useless when they can't get off their privileged, self-important, doubly anointed coddled asses, and make their voice heard by voting.
These babbling fools should be ignored.
This is my first year voting!
ReplyDeleteI was still in a COG back in 2016 and missed the opportunity.
Paying and praying is not the same as doing. The COG’s are not doing anything. They are zombie corpses of a failed movement. They are white washed sepulchers full of rot and decay.
Life is outside of that rented hall.
Go find it.
Do better and be better by loving your neighbor and doing good in your community. Choose the candidate who best represents the ideals of a good responsible person.
Don’t surrender to fear, lies, darkness, greed, and narcissism with sitting ministers or sitting presidents.
We can do better and we can live better!
This post reflects a Christian perspective on political involvement for American Christians. It is as natural as water for a Christian to approach voting as a citizen of a democratic republic from the perspective of their faith. A problem arises only when a political agenda is preached (or a particular candidate is endorsed) from the pulpit, and the alternative is labeled as not Christian or Satanic. As with things spiritual, the guiding principle should be "let every person be fully persuaded in his/her own mind."
ReplyDeleteLonnie
Miller Jones: “A problem arises only when a political agenda is preached (or a particular candidate is endorsed) from the pulpit, and the alternative is labeled as not Christian or Satanic.”
DeleteAnd that is exactly what the COG’s do. RCG members for instance are told to promote Trump in any way they can, because Biden is ‘Satanic and pushing Satan’s agenda.’ But at the same time they’re NOT allowed to vote themselves.
Which only promotes one agenda: that of the RCG ministry.
1. There are no Christian parties to vote for.
ReplyDelete2. Christians are not Christians anymore.
Lonnie, you are clueless. There are NO democracies in the world today. They are all fake. A democracy is ruled by the people. Fake democracies are ruled by special interest groups, political parties, the news media, big money, fake science and secret societies. Most people are TOTAL IDIOTS who can't get these obvious facts into their bigoted brainwashed heads. And so all these countries are headed for SLAVERY and are probably past the tipping point.
ReplyDeleteI once saw a video of Obama giving Americans the finger. This occurred while he was president. Of course, the media covered it up for him. What kind of democracy is that? Wake up zombies.
ReplyDeleteI remember them doing the same for Bush.
DeleteVoted for the first time too.
ReplyDeleteExercised my right as a USA citizen.
Today's world is very different to Mark Twains generation. In his day, America was basically a constitutional republic with voters choosing which group would implement the constitution. Today, America by contrast is a democracy, ie, unlimited majority rule, might is right. America's founders looked at history and feared a democracy.
ReplyDeleteA Christian should think hard about participating in such a unjust system.
"...it would bring about a moral revolution..."
ReplyDeletesome would call that "creating utopia", or, more to the point, man doing it his way....which is what got us into trouble to start with.
It seems pretty obvious, if you want to reduce abortion, vote for that.
ReplyDeleteIf you want to maintain your right to free speech inside your church, vote for that.
If you want to maintain your right to bear arms, vote for that.
If you want less taxes, vote for that.
If you want to have a society that does not encourage rioting and pillaging and destroying, Vote for that.
If you want to work your business within your conscience, Vote for that.
If you want to have a balance between the environment and the necessity for oil, Vote for that.
I did. And thankfully did so throughout my time in the Cogs.
This was my second year of voting after leaving the Living Church of God. These men will no longer have any influence on my life with their immoral demands and teachings. It feels great to be able to do my duty as a citizen. When I see Weston, Thiel, and other COG ministers telling us to no vote you can be guaranteed I will be there to do it now.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 11/3 @ 12:20,
ReplyDeleteYour statement that "There are NO democracies in the world today" is extreme, and I'm not sure that there are many folks who would agree with it. You are correct to point out that a true democracy is governed by the people, but it is also true that this is usually accomplished through elected representatives. Moreover, those people almost always organize themselves into parties and special interest groups for the purpose of pursuing shared goals/agendas (there is nothing inherently anti-democratic about this phenomenon). Likewise, people are also likely to employ whatever wealth and resources they possess to bring about the result they desire. Finally, a free press, science and education are essential components of having an informed electorate (again, there is nothing inherently anti-democratic about these features). And, while I will not dispute that their are always some idiots and bigots in every crowd, I'm hoping that you're wrong that this characterizes the majority of folks.
Lonnie
Anonymous 11/3 @ 12:42,
ReplyDeleteMany of America's most recent experiences tend to refute your contention that we are subject to "unlimited majority rule." After all, Al Gore received a half million more votes in 2000 than George W, and Clinton received 2.9 million more votes than Trump in 2016! - So much for "unlimited majority rule."
bob thiel for sheriff!
ReplyDeletejim:
ReplyDeleteYou left off the big one:
If you want a moral president that respects the constitution, vote for that.
Whatever you do... Vote YES on NO!
ReplyDeleteVoting may not be a sin. The typical thoughts and attitudes, as well as the actions that we often take against our fellow citizens usually are.
ReplyDeleteThere actually IS a "Christian Party" - or at least there was four years ago. Their website shows no sign of fielding a Presidential candidate this year.
ReplyDeletePlenty of UCG members have voted in big elections in recent years. And they've commented about this week's vote a good bit on social media.
That makes COGWA look odd for not even talking about political issues and candidates over the last few weeks. One pastor said that even talking about politics is non-Biblical "vain jangling" (quoting KJV).
Miller Jones
ReplyDeleteYou are doing a straw man argument regarding unlimited majority rule by indirectly bringing up the electoral college. My point is that the elected governments in a democracy can strip away the rights of minorities. In a constitutional republic this is not possible since the government is bound by a document such as the constitution to protect everyone's rights. Which is why in America for example, 70% of the federal budget goes to wealth redistribution. According to bible morality, wealth belongs to it's producer ('a workman is worthy of his wages'). Wealth redistribution is biblical theft, though regarded as moral by most voters.
Rights in a democracy (as in the ACOGs) are de facto, or if one scratches the surface, are permissions from the government rather than being inherent by virtue of being made in God's image.
I did vote, despite what my minister and Mr Pack were telling us.
ReplyDeleteI’m curious.. Where in the scriptures does it say that I (as an RCG member) can’t vote? David Pack even wrote a booklet about it, but it is still not clear to me.
A discussion on Watergate came up in a Spokesmans Club meeting, and I said I voted for Nixon - I felt inspired to do so from something GTA said. Since then, it's been "none of the above", and still is - so I did my civic duty, to a point. But I will vote on any local policies, such as alcohol licensing, transport levy, etc.
ReplyDeleteFor countries where voting is mandatory, Bob Thiel said that if the fine (for not voting) was too high, then vote "randomly". Why not just submit a blank ballot?
NEO,
ReplyDeleteGenerally like your comments, though you are off with this last one. I won't claim great morality for Trump, but if we look at Biden there is no claim for morality there either, I say less, but I won't belabor the point. I truly hope you recognize that.
Trump is far more consistent with the Constitution than Biden has been and Biden has verbally stated multiple areas in his platform against the Constitution.
Where in the scriptures does it say that I (as an RCG member) can’t vote?
ReplyDeleteInteresting that Orthodox Jews vote - apparently they can't derive any rule from scripture either.
There was a PT article about the Israeli election in 1977 of Menachem Begin. According to the story some people felt compelled to vote for him for no conscious reason - the same being said now about some Orthodox voting for Trump.
My decision to submit a blank ballot (just for the "I Voted" sticker) was based on "put no trust in man". Some Pastors will tell you "God knows who will win", "God chooses who will win", "God uses whoever wins", etc. Those choices involve (to varying degrees) free will and free determination.
The concept of not voting comes from the verses that God puts people in positions of authority, and God removes them (Daniel 2:21; Romans 13:1). He doesn't need anyone's help to do it.
ReplyDeleteIt also stems from Christians being "ambassadors for Christ" (2 Corinthians 5:20) with a "citizenship in heaven" (Philippians 3:20) - not in this world (2 Timothy 2:4).
9:02
ReplyDeleteFor countries where voting is mandatory, Bob Thiel said that if the fine (for not voting) was too high, then vote "randomly". Why not just submit a blank ballot?
Ironically in Australia a supposedly “democratic” country, unlike the US and UK and a host of other countries, voting is compulsory and if you don’t you’re fined. So for a lot of years now I’ve done a donkey vote even scribbling my protest on the ballot that voting shouldn’t be compulsory and it’s totally undemocratic. Hopefully one day Australia will grow up like other nations of the world and abolish compulsory voting.
I started voting the moment I realized and understood that God is more powerfull than I am anyway.
ReplyDeleteI believe HWA abolished voting as a) a symbol that "christians are in but not of this world as part of a new society" and b) to prevent bickering and be of one accord in the church.
HOWEVER, when I look at the QUAKER stance just before the Declaration of Independence, it appears they were staunchly "British", remained passive in voting for independence, (since it would mean war) and King George was "all the man", according to John Adams,thus supporting "the Status Quo.
I wonder how much of a Quaker influence his family had wielded. After all, HWA's fear of "Germans" also reflected the fear of the German mercenary troops hired by the British to crush the revolutionaries.
HWA's entire life work railed against "revoltionary commies." He even had Jesus given a Roman haircut with short hair, definitely not revolutionary maccabee haircut or che guevarra.
Fair and square undemocratic empire builder..
Nck
If you voted you are either fine lying to yourself or to others. There was no one worth voting for with a clean conscience.
ReplyDeleteTrump is an honest man.
ReplyDeleteHe declared victory based on a map colored with all States in Red.
Not a single person had pointed out to him that this was the Covid infection map.
Nck
6.52 PM
ReplyDeleteIf you don't vote in Australia, they send you a letter which includes a fine and an application for an exemption. Not voting for religious reason is always accepted, with the fine wavered.
Personally, I feel that voting is the responsibility of all adult members of that country, so making it compulsory seems reasonable.
IIRC, it was John Adams that opposed letting the common man vote because he felt they didn't understand the issues well enough to make intelligent decisions....
ReplyDeletehe probably had a point....American elections are mostly beauty contests...ask the average voter why he/she made their choice and you'll get a vague answer such as "so and so is for the working man".....the majority simply don't understand what's a stake.
the fact that Biden got so many votes should tell us that...and suddenly finding thousands of ballots, 100% for Biden, in Michigan (I think), reveals that the idea that the people's votes count is a farce.
anyway....God chooses the leaders.....maybe He intervenes directly at times, and at other times He sits back and lets man do it to himself...
America is/was a great experiment...to show man that he cannot govern himself...he is corrupt, and anything he attempts will be corrupted.
Anon 652
ReplyDeleteAustralia is interesting. From my visits there, I felt if voting wasn't compulsory only the die-hard party supporters would bother. And I remember elections were usually on Saturday.
Someone who was really against "the system" deliberately didn't vote. He told me he was fined $25, and his appeal would be "he had a cold". I told him tell the truth, you're a rebel! Then, okay, if you're going to lie, tell them it's on religious grounds. No, he stuck to his story, and I don't know if he had to pay...
"America is/was a great experiment...to show man that he cannot govern himself...he is corrupt, and anything he attempts will be corrupted.
ReplyDeleteNovember 5, 2020 at 5:13 AM"
You also said:
"anyway....God chooses the leaders....."
Your comment is completely ignorant. If "God chooses the leaders" then how the hell does that prove that man can't govern himself? That's the dumbest thing that the WCG taught, well one of the dumbest.
Maybe we could govern ourselves if God left us the hell alone and let us choose our leaders. <<<----<<<Sarcasm just in case you don't recognize it.
Anonymous 12:48 AM
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 6:49 AM
I've used the religious exemption clause in the Australian Constitution for abstaining from elections over the last few years. IIRC for a couple of elections, like federal and local, the fine was waived and no questions asked. But, in the most recent state election I was informed it wasn't acceptable as a valid reason since state legislation gives no provision. So the fine remained until I protested some more highlighting the inconsistency (eg Federal and Local provide religious exemptions, but State doesn't?!) and how this violates my right to practice my religious beliefs freely, which is guaranteed by a piece of state legislation. This time the female issuing officer, who came across as quite aggressive in tone I found, stated: "...a person whose religious beliefs prevent them from attending a voting centre on election day has the option of becoming a general postal voter. An application form is included with this letter for your use if this option is suited to your circumstances. If it is the act of actually voting that is precluded by your religious beliefs, you would be required to provide evidence of your religious belief and an explanation of why this belief precluded you from voting at an election. This information would need to be provided in relation to each election for which you are entitled to vote and fail to vote. In relation to future State or Council elections or by-elections, if you choose not to vote and do not provide the...Electoral Commission with a valid and sufficient reason in writing in relation to your failure to vote, or do not pay the penalty amount, the matter may subsequently proceed to Court. You may then also be asked by the Court to provide evidence of your beliefs and/or further information to support your claim. I have reviewed this matter further and in this instance the infringement notice has been withdrawn and a decision has been made to issue an Official Warning. However, should you repeat this offense at a future election action may be taken against you..." I thought to myself that’s a fine example of legalese or doublespeak! So, according to her, if my religion prohibits me from voting and I fail to vote then I must give evidence of my religious belief and an explanation. But, if I fail to vote and don’t provide “a valid and sufficient reason” or pay the fine I’ll be hauled off to court! Yet, to her, my religious beliefs aren’t even considered “a valid and sufficient reason” to not vote! So I’m screwed if I use my religious beliefs as a reason to not vote. And this despite the fact that voting is, constitutionally, a right and not an obligation—unlike the political parties would have us believe! Suffice to say I’m now a general postal voter and thus will continue my small protest against compulsory voting for the foreseeable future by post.
It will take a civil war to get our freedoms back. Voting won't do it. Both parties are corrupt and are destroying the country and bankrupting it. Jesus is a false hope. Christians are deluded by the hoaxes of prophecy and salvation. Since they ignore all facts which refute the bible they will be ignorant for life.
ReplyDelete5.13 AM
ReplyDeleteThe 'man can't govern themselves line' is used by all the ACOGs to justify lording it over their members. More accurately, many men can't govern other people. And not forgetting, many people govern themselves just fine.
In the ACOG-land, the 'man can't govern themselves' translates into fools lording it over their betters.
It's all abusive cult gibberish.
The "everything he attempts will be corrupted" was a Gartner Ted favorite, and it's wrong. The person who corrupts everything he touches has a name. He's called a psychopath. It seems GTA was projecting. Psychopaths make up a minority, not the majority of the population. Accusing members of being psychopaths in order to justify lording it over them is common and it's vile.
The purpose of human history is not to purely prove that man cannot govern himself. That is a deliberate narrow interpretation. The purpose of history is to smash false god's, and there are hundreds if not thousands of them, including the many found in the ACOGs. Since you missed it, the ACOGs are collectivistic, a false God. They are also right wing, ie, they lord it over members lives. Tyranny is also a false god. And they reject God's laws, putting their faith in abusive cult "morality" instead. Another false God.
Herbs church did not fall apart for no reason.
Watching the American election and the continuing fallout I have to ask myself honestly are these the best America can really offer up in the choice of President??!! Between demented old Biden and troublemaking old Trump??!! Well whoever wins I know who the loser’ll be—the American Christian!
ReplyDelete" You also said:
ReplyDelete"anyway....God chooses the leaders....."
Your comment is completely ignorant. If "God chooses the leaders" then how the hell does that prove that man can't govern himself? That's the dumbest thing that the WCG taught, well one of the dumbest. "
you would make a good news media reporter ....you present half of the truth to make an invalid point....
you left out:
"...maybe He intervenes directly at times, and at other times He sits back and lets man do it to himself..."
"...maybe He intervenes directly at times, and at other times He sits back and lets man do it to himself..."
ReplyDeleteYou're the one who emphatically said "God chooses the leaders"
If your last sentence was meant to qualify that statement then you should have made it clear that God "allows" certain leaders, and sometimes he "chooses" them. But alas you didn't and now you're trying to justify your double mindedness. Very funny!
either way, He chooses them.
ReplyDeleteit's all to carry out His plan to completion.
Just jumping in with a reminder: now that apparently a dem has won the presidency the COG messaging will change from: God is slowing things down/giving us more time(repub) to God is speeding things up/the end is closer than it ever was(dem) Or some variation of this messaging.
ReplyDelete