Who will God accept? The judgmental Armstrongite or the Protestant?

Who will God accept? The judgmental Armstrongite or the Protestant?

In corner number one, we have a staunch believer in the doctrines of Herbert Armstrong. In this man's life, he has attended Sabbath Services every day in his life nearly without fail. He has kept the Feast in the past 70 years in the Dells, the Poconos, Pensacola, Vail, even Pasadena. He knows every Dwight hymn by heart. He attends every Night to be remembered with the rest of the pillars of the Congregation. He takes notes of every Sabbath Service. He has read the Bible from front to back, which is marginalized with every color highlighter and marginal note you can imagine. He arrives at Church early, and is the last to leave. He is charismatic. But. His home-life is a different story. He is a bully. Argumentative. He thinks of his wife and daughters as his personal property to do with as he pleases. He will not be talked down to. He is the absolute ruler in his home, and is totally devoid of emotion. He mocks and sneers at anyone who does not worship as he does. He condemns anyone who is in "the world" as lost and of Satan. He can't stand any mention of love, or of Jesus -calling such things emotional love-love mamby-pansy religion. He believes women are to remain silent, seen, but not heard. He has a violent temper, and a mind of rage. He believes that the rule of Law is paramount in everything. He shows little mercy, and has a black-and-white mentality. He believes that the mentally ill are cursed, and avoids doctors because they are evil in his mind. He is crotchety, but assured that upon his death, he will sleep and wake as one of the very few righteous enough to be in the Holy First Resurrection. 

In corner number two, we have a typical American Protestant. She does not have much, but she starts every day with prayer and hymns, but she does love a good rock and roll song. She gets the kids off to school - and has an argument with her husband. Her mouth is not always perfect. She can drop an F-bomb at a stubbed toe like nothing flat. But under her breath, she apologizes to Jesus and says she will try to do better with great remorse. She goes to work, talks about sports or the latest TV show. Some of her jokes are coarse and dirty. But in her mind, she remembers that she is to keep her mind clean and on things that are pure and peaceable. She stops, and goes back to her cubicle. She doesn't go to church every day, but when she does she thanks God for his amazing grace and for giving his life in thanksgiving, grateful to be able to learn, grow, and try. She goes to Church on a Sunday morning - she had a bad morning, got into another fight with her husband, lost it with her arguing young children, and almost  stayed home because she was in such a bad mood. But she remembered how God moved in miraculous ways to bring her out of the crisis of her life into the shadow under His wings, and decided to go this time - but she knows she is not judged or lost her salvation if she does not go to Church (which happens alot with the pressures of parenting and in not the best marriage). When Easter comes, she thanks God for Jesus who, around that time of year, died and is risen and lives in those who believe. When Christmas comes, her mind is always on the eating and the gifts and yes, some commercialism - but she always stops to thank God for the fact he was born that she, like Him - may live. It's not a perfect life, but it's a life made perfect only through Christ who lives in her, and she never loses sight of that fact regardless of how the pious and holier-than-thous view her. She rests in the Lord, without worry of losing her salvation. 

Which one of these extreme examples do you think finds favor in God? Supporting arguments? Counterpoints?

"If YOU were sent by God to determine who shall enter HIS Kingdom - which one of these two would you trust to rule and reign with Christ and exemplify His Kingdom?"

Discuss.


submitted by SHT

Dave Pack the Home-breaker: You Will Have to Lose Your Wife or Husband in the Restored Church of God

Adult Sabbath School: From Pastor to Bastard-A Personal Journey and Why It Seems to Annoy the Faithful

It has been a interesting journey personally from the Universe/Dinosaur/Geology loving naïve 14 year old gobbling up Plain Truth to a personal view that if you can't really show it then you can't really know it. Over time I have come to believe that my former perspectives were simply pious convictions based on marginal information. In hindsight I repressed my natural curiosities about the world and origins of everything from where did humans really come from to where did the Universe itself come from or more accurately how did it come about, for my own restrictive religious faith beliefs.  

It's also been an informative and interesting experience writing on Banned over the years now finding a few friends but mostly learning that I have no right to quote the Bible because I question it  and that I'd think differently when thrown into the Lake of Fire. I guess I'll wait and see. 

As a WCG Pastor getting shuffled around over 28 years to 14 different congregations in 5 states and programming myself and family for difficulties down the road and going through the near daily stress of WCG drama and trauma, it's no wonder I am still here. 

While it is of no value to anyone else, I have come to recognize that in personality and perspectives I have most of the characteristics of an Empath and a HSP or Highly Sensitive Person. It's probably the traits that drew me to ministry in the first place and while one did not go to Ambassador to "become a minister,"  I did or I would not have gone. I chose Ambassador over Robert's Wesleyan College in NY, which was a Methodist Seminary. Naïve to think that Ambassador was a seminary but the college prospectus I read never having no real background in WCG seemed legit and normal for a seminary, I thought. (It was not true however)

I pastored between 1972 and 1998  and those years were nothing but one WCG conflict and disaster after the next. Not exactly what I signed up for.  It was made up of:

Sent to Minneapolis under Keith Thomas. I was told it was the premier assignment for me being top of my class etc and "Dennis for you, the sky is the limit" which struck me as an odd thing to say because I had read "he that is 'greatest' among you, let him be your servant" even when a Presbyterian kid. 

Garner Ted booted by HWA from the Church 1972

GTA returning in 1972 '73

"East Coast Rebellion" 1974  I was in the thick of it working for the Regional Director in Chicago

Fired by association

Rehired by request

(Blew my chance to move on when still young)

Move to Findlay Ohio, (Replaced by Ron Weinland)  Kentucky, New York, South Carolina (Followed Gerald Weston) 

1979 Church Goes into Receivership

Bunch of Church Bullshit

HWA Dies and the Tkach years begin

Bunch of Bullshit

Depression and Anxiety increase,

Greenville SC as last Church I pastored proved to be the most divisive group I ever got stuck with. I replaced Gerald Weston. I think when I refused to go to what I considered the Happy Slappy Promise Keepers Million Man Cult Expo and all the elders did as per Tkach suggestions , that was the beginning of the back stabbing, and experience I was not used to. I also let most of the people Gerald Weston bounced out of WCG because they wanted to come back and that went over like a lead balloon with his loyalists who were in touch with him constantly. 

Depression and Anxiety increase and I spent a week in a Charter Hospital getting my head together. In hindsight I was depressed as function of repressed anger that I felt was either something I had no right to express or the price for doing so would be too high at the time.  Told by Victor Kubik when he got in to see me and not on my list to see me, "We think you are just hiding here."

Borderline and somewhat accidental DUI and spent night in a SC jail which scared the Hell into me being an HSP etc. A depression and anxiety thing no doubt. 

(Whew...felt good to get that one out there! Never told Church Administration. lol)

Terminated because my church had been reduced by the Tkach's adventure in wheel reinvention from 450 to 95 and then shortly after, 16.  Every congregation I ever built in sincerity no longer exists now of course.

Found a kindred spirit to share my thoughts, beliefs and fears with

Bunch of stuff and divorce

(My fault not hers)

Therapeutic Massage School which was one of the best decisions I had made in the previous 28 years. 

Bunch of relationship stuff

Moved to Oregon hating South Carolina for a few dozen reasons 

Entering year 70 content to just be myself , enjoy my successful practice in the Willamette Valley  not missing the irony of that.

And an atheist....

"As an atheist, I am angry that we live in a society in which the plain truth cannot be spoken without offending 90% of the population."

 Sam Harris

Secularphobia-Why Americans Hate Atheists

Last week, the Pew Research Center released the results of a new survey concerning who Americans would want – or rather, wouldn’t want – for an in-law. While about 10 percent of Americans said they’d be unhappy if a family member married someone of a different political persuasion, and about 30 percent of Americans said they’d be unhappy if a family member married a gun owner, nearly 50 percent of Americans said that they’d be unhappy if a family member married an atheist.

This finding comes as no surprise. Social science has long revealed high rates of secularphobia – the irrational dislike, distrust, fear, or hatred of nonreligious people – within American society. For example, a study by Penny Edgell of the University of Minnesota, from back in 2006, found that atheists come in last place when Americans are asked to rank members of certain racial, ethnic, or religious groups as potential spouses for their kids. And a Gallup poll from 2012 found that 43 pecent of Americans said that they would not vote for an atheist for president, putting atheists in last/worst place, behind Muslims (40 percent of Americans said they wouldn’t vote for a Muslim for president), homosexuals (30 percent wouldn’t), Mormons (18 percent wouldn’t), Latinos (7 percent wouldn’t), Jews (6 percent wouldn’t), Catholics (5 percent wouldn’t), women (5 percent wouldn’t) and African Americans (4 percent wouldn’t).

Additionally, psychology professor Adrian Furnham found that people give lower priority to patients with atheist or agnostic views than to Christian patients when asked to rank them on a waiting list to receive a kidney, and legal scholar Eugene Volokh has documented the degree to which atheist parents have been denied custody rights in the wake of a divorce.

Consider further evidence of secularphobia in America: It is illegal for an atheist to hold public office in seven states; atheists aren’t allowed in the Boy Scouts, the American Legion, or the Veterans of Foreign Wars; Humanist chaplains are barred from serving in our nation’s military; charities regularly reject donations that are offered by secularist organizations. And while secular Americans have never faced the kind of prejudice, hostility, and violence experienced by Native Americans, African Americans, Latino/a Americans, Asian Americans, Jews, Catholics, Mormons, Muslims, or homosexuals, there is still no question that atheists, agnostics, secularists, and others who eschew religion are widely disliked.

 What gives?

There is no single, universal cause of secularphobia, and the dislike of non-religious people has varying sources in different societies and at different times in history; what caused people to hate the secular in Jerusalem in 300 B.C.E. or in Tegucigalpa in 1799 is certainly different from what causes people to dislike the secular in Rhode Island today.

That said, we can account for the current level of secularphobia in the US by considering these four factors:

1. Americans equate a lack of religiosity in general – or atheism specifically – with immorality.

2. Americans equate a lack of religiosity in general – or atheism specifically – with being un-American and/or unpatriotic.

3. There is no stigma concerning the expressed dislike of the non-religious. While there is a stigma (to varying degrees, depending on one’s social milieu) attached to being racist, or anti-Semitic, or Islamophobic, or homophobic – there has never existed a social or cultural backlash against people who openly express disdain for secular folks. So people simply feel much more comfortable expressing their dislike for atheists than, say, Latinas/os or women.

4. Insecurity on the part of the religious. Faith – believing claims without sufficient evidence, or claiming to know things that you don’t or can’t know – is an increasingly shaky endeavor. And in order for religious faith to survive, it requires a lot of social support: the more people who share it, the easier it is to maintain and reproduce. Thus, anyone who rejects the tenets of your faith, or calls them in to question, is a threat. Atheists lack a faith in God, and thus theists are particularly threatened by the growing presence of such humans, as they call into question the very thing that is ever so shaky to begin with: religious faith.

United Church of God Elder Stephen Allwine: “For reasons that are too personal and would give away my identity, I need this bitch dead.”

 has a new article up about Stephen Allwine's despicable behind the scenes maneuvers to hire hit men to kill his wife.  It details Allwine's time at Ambassador, meeting Amy, becoming a United Church of God Elder.  It is probably one of the better researched articles to be published on the murder ofAmy Allwine.

‘IF YOU WANT TO KILL SOMEONE, 

WE ARE THE RIGHT GUYS’

MARA HVISTENDAHL SECURITY 04.25.19

ON A BRISK day in March 2016, Stephen Allwine walked into a Wendy's in Minneapolis. The smell of old fryer grease hung in the air as he searched for a man wearing dark jeans and a blue jacket. Allwine, who worked as an IT support technician, was lean and nerdy, with wire-rim glasses. He was carrying $6,000 in cash, money he'd collected by pawning silver bars and coins to avoid suspicious deductions from his bank account. He found the man he was looking for sitting in a booth.

THEY HAD CONNECTED on LocalBitcoins, a sort of Craigslist for people who want to buy cryptocurrency near where they live. Allwine opened the app Bitcoin Wallet on his phone and handed over the cash, and the man scanned a QR code displayed on the phone to transfer the bitcoin. The transaction went seamlessly. Then Allwine returned to his car to discover that he had locked his keys inside.

It was his birthday. He was 43. And he was supposed to join a woman named Michelle Woodard for lunch.

Allwine had met Woodard online a few months earlier. The relationship had progressed quickly, and for a while they exchanged dozens of messages a day. Their passion had since faded, but they still slept together from time to time. While he waited for the locksmith to arrive, he texted her that he'd stopped to buy bitcoin and was running late. Once the door was jimmied open, he met up with Woodard at a burger joint called the Blue Door Pub, determined to enjoy the rest of the afternoon.

---------

Yura promised that customers' money was held by an escrow service and paid out only after a job was completed. But Allwine worried that when he deposited money it would simply end up in someone's bitcoin wallet. He wanted Yura's claims to be true, though, so against his better instincts he transferred the bitcoin. “They say that Besa means trust, so please do not break that,” he wrote Yura. “For reasons that are too personal and would give away my identity, I need this bitch dead.”

“This bitch” was Amy Allwine, his wife.

--------------

The day after Stephen bought the bitcoin, he uploaded a photo of Amy to Allwine.net. The picture had been taken on a family vacation to Hawaii, and it showed Amy wearing a teal shirt, with a broad smile on her tan and freckled face. About 25 minutes after he posted the image, Stephen logged in to his dogdaygod email account and sent Yura the link. “She is about 5'6", she looks about 200lbs,” he wrote. The best time to kill her, he continued, would be on an upcoming trip to Moline, Illinois. If the hit man could make her death look like an accident—by, say, ramming her Toyota Sienna minivan on the driver's side—he would throw in a few more bitcoin. 

Click on the link in the title of the article above to read the rest of this chilling story!

The Medicine Man vs COG Leaders and Self-appointed Church Prophets

Can you imagine a Church of God leader ever being this humble?  

Have you ever seen a COG leader among his people, working and getting his hands dirty?

Have you ever seen a COG leader live a "low key" life?

Have you ever seen a COG leader ever be quiet instead of trumpeting their own horn trying to PROVE they are legitimate?

PCG: Where is the True Church Today?

For decades now we have seen hundreds and hundreds of articles, sermons and telecasts on the so-called "true church."  It is now 2019 and the various Armstrong Churches of God are STILL trying to prove they are the only true ones. We've seen the self-appointed liars like Thiel, Malm, Pack, Wienland and others claim they were God's most highly favored sons and the rightful teachers of the "word".

The Philadelphia Church of God, in its attempt to retain members, is trying to get its members to fall for the deception that Gerald Flurry's church is the "one and only".

Wik Heerama of the PCG has an article up on their website titled, "Where Is God’s True Church Today?"  In it he says this:

“Throughout the Church’s history, though many fell away, Christ always led the faithful few. … There has never been a time that God’s Church did not exist after Christ built it. Its work may have been hidden, slowed down or nearly stopped. But the true Church always survived and revived!” (Philadelphia Trumpet, November 1996).

Not only did Christ found the Church, the Bible also reveals that He is its living Head(Colossians 1:18; Ephesians 5:23). That means He actively guides it.

Does it make sense that the Church Christ founded would be divided into many different sects and denominations? That Christ would be Head of many different organizations, each teaching different doctrines? God is not the author of confusion; He does things “decently and in order” (1 Corinthians 14:33, 40; the word “churches” in verse 33 merely refers to various congregations of the one true Church, as we shall see later). Teachings that contradict one another cannot all be true, and could not be inspired by Christ!

Does it make any sense that the Armstrong Churches of God, which claims to be founded by Christ, are currently split into hundreds and hundreds of silly little groups?  Hardly a year goes by anymore without some self-appointed turd claiming he is the new heir apparent.  Do these idiots truly believe their "christ" is impressed by all of the divisions and organizations out there? Is that "christ" impressed by the blithering idiots that self-appoint themselves as Chief Overseer's or official Zealots?Is that "christ" impressed by the outright lies of Ron Weinland, Dave Pack and Gerald Flurry?

In fact, God inspired the Apostle Paul to write, “Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment” (1 Corinthians 1:10). That is a deep level of unity! And we should expect to see that unity within the Christ-led Body of believers. There must be no division in what is believed, taught or preached (Ephesians 4:13).

With over 400 some Armstrong Churches of God today, we have 400 some different interpretations of "truth". None of them speak the "same thing." They cannot agree on doctrine, prophecy, or even being followers of the "jesus" they claim to follow.  They most certainly are NOT joined together in same mind and in same judgment!

Do the many differing and opposing churches of Orthodoxy, Catholicism and Protestantism “all speak the same thing”? Why is Christianity divided into many different churches, denominations and sects? Why do these different Christian groups believe such vastly different doctrines?

The Philadelphia Church of God and the Armstrong Churches of God are in no position to criticize the various Christian denominations of Christianity.  The questions Wik should have asked is:

Why is the Church of God divided into so many different splinter groups?

Why do these Churches of God believe such vastly different things?

Its Time For COG Members To Part Company With The Liars And False Prophets Running The Churches

If every minister, member, or speaker who dares to utter a prophecy could understand the impact of a false prophecy on the lives of a fellow member - perhaps, it would cause one to stop with their careless and thoughtless babbles. 

When a person speaks a prophecy, and that prophecy turns out to be wrong, it causes discouragement, sadness, disappointment, despair, even depression - all the way to personal doubt about the authenticity of Jesus Christ Himself. When a person speaks a false prophecy, it causes a desensitization and an expectation of failure. When a person speaks a false prophecy, it does more to tear a person away from God then it does to build someone up in God. It is so counterproductive to the Christian life that only when one realizes the impact that careless prophecy does to a person that one understands a little bit why in the Old Testament false prophets were dealt with so harshly and severely. 

The Church of God is littered with thoughtless idiots - and I do mean idiots - who, in an abundance of zeal but a lack of a sound mind - have taken a tool of prophecy and have used that tool to defecate all over the Bible, and vomit all over the word of God. Every time a minister opens his mouth, and utters nothing but contemptible lies, it shames Jesus Christ and it hurts His people. It is just as bad as picking up a knife and stabbing a person in the heart, because what comes out of their mouths are sharp, vicious lies that only cause despair in agony. 

Yet they continue to spew lies from the mind of the heart of the father of lies - the devil. Why do they do this? What is it that causes them to continue in lies, even after they're proven wrong? 

I've spoken before about the issue of pride within the Churches of God - and it's no different with false prophets. Admitting to being a false prophet is admitting to a liar. Admitting to be a liar causes people to lose trust in the pastor. And when you lose trust in a pastor, you leave the Church. If you leave the Church, you cut off the pastor from a certain amount of money. Do you see where I am going here? 

Prophecies in the Churches of God have always had an impact on "The Bottom Line". Prophecies were used by Armstrong to increase funds during his large scale building projects, which allowed the completion of the Auditorium. The prophecies - which turned out false - already accomplished their purpose - to fund the building project. Prophecies have always had the goal to increase income, and whether or not the prophecies were correct or not did not sway the prophet. Once the prophecy is issued, and the timeframe is gone, and the money has come - the purpose has been accomplished. There's no refunds - just an "apology" and a kick down the timeline for the prophecy - maybe next time. 

Seriously, there is not a "next time".

The effect of a false prophecy is anti-everything the Holy Spirit's fruits are. Does a false prophecy by a false prophet bring joy? No, only incredulous doubt. Does a false prophecy by a false prophet bring peace? No. It only proves the prophet has not been spoken to by God whatsoever. Does a false prophecy bring truth? Absolutely not. A false prophecy is just that. It's a lie by a liar who is, almost always, at least in the Churches of God, unrepentant, unapologetic, unwilling to admit, and scared to death that any admittance will impact his financial intake. This is why they don't renounce. This is why they don't admit. Because it's all about the MONEY, and admitting one is a false prophet will take away the MONEY. Kicking down the line keeps the MONEY flowing in. This is truth. This is what it has always been about. 

A person who is the embodiment of what and who God is will embody the fruits of Who God is and What He stands for. There will not be a rush to prophecy, but a desire to serve. There will not be a rush to pretend to be a know-it-all, but a mind of compassion and understanding to help each person individually. There will not be a constant conveyor belt of speculations, maybe's, if's, and's, or but's, or of orders, commands, and legalistic bullcrap which only serves and fuels ones ego of importance - but a true heart of compassion, love, joy, and service in the love of Christ. The desire of a true minister of God will not be to hold all the cards in regards to prophecy - but to strengthen and build up the Church in Jesus Christ in love and in service. 

The negative impact of false prophets cannot be understated. False prophecies are absolutely devestating to the well being of good-hearted, God-minded Christians - but they've been happening for thousands of years by those who think they speak for God but only crush the souls of their followers, leading many away from God to a life of godlessness. God is not found in the pastors, the ministers, or the churches and the theologies of false prophets, but in the still, quiet, flowing river of simple love, grace, mercy, truth, goodness, and compassion. Those who blast lies like a lion love to deafen the quiet whisper of holiness. The only way to truly listen to whispers is to embrace the Whisperer. It is time to stop feeding the false prophets and enabling their evils. It is time to embrace the Whisperer. It is time to put the false prophets out of work. It is time to stop giving money to evil wicked ones. It is time for Church of God Christians to repent from enabling wickedness - and turn to God - and part company with liars and false prophets.

submitted by SHT

What Every COG Minister Should Wake Up To And Read Every Morning

• Every life in my congregation is precious and dear to God.
• Every counsel that I give can impact a life permanently. 
• My advice can alter the course of history for the life of the member and the lives of generations to come. 
• I take personal responsibility for every word that I say in God's name. 
• I have a responsibility to exhort, encourage, and uplift my congregation. 
• I have the responsibility to take every interaction in equal importance, big or small. 
• I must do nothing that negatively impacts a Believer's relationship with God, their family, and the Church. 
• I must respect a Believer's personal relationship between them and God
• I am not an overlord. I am a servant, a helper, a mentor, and a friend. 
• I am a guardian. I must protect the Church and it's members from abuse and harm, inside and out of the Church. 
• I must avoid greed and the love of money in all its forms as a minister of Jesus Christ. 
• I must flee from immorality and live a life dedicated to helping and serving the Church without distraction. 
• I must preach on things that will make an impact and help the specific needs of my Congregation. 
• I must center and focus on Jesus Christ in every interaction and in every message of my Pastorate. 
• In every interaction I must act in love towards all I serve. 
• If I must correct and counsel, I will do so in Godly love, kindness, and most of all, in prayer and respect. 
• I will respect a member's personal life in regards to family, job, talents, and personal life in the Lord. 
• I will resign from the ministry if my personal life impacts the health and spiritual welfare of the Church. 
• I will counsel with the Church's leadership and devout members of the Church always and in prayer. 
• I recognize I am a servant, not an overlord. I am a helper, not a commander. I am a guide, not a sheriff. 
• I will keep my sermons on point, on message, and completed in a reasonable time. 
• I will take seriously the impact I have on every life at every time in the position of service that I am in. 
• I will never use the funds of the Church for self-centered, greed-oriented, personally-benefiting reasons. 
• I will never ask for, demand, guilt, or coerce members for funds or for money in God's name or otherwise, especially Low Income members who would be harmed financially and spiritually. 

submitted by SHT

The Problem With Failed Prophecies In The Armstrong Churches of God

It is unbelievable that the United Church of God would say that they have a more "sure" word of prophecy than any other Church of God group. 

For over 70 years, in the zealous mindset of the Churches of God, when it comes to prophecy, they have been trying to fit their predictions into reality like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. They have never even come close to even beginning to have a handle on any kind of accurate prophecy in any of their major predictive theories. Not even once. 

Which is honestly saying a lot, because their entire theological foundation hinges only on their predictions of prophecy being correct. Their claim to fame is that they, and only they, have the keys to the Kingdom of God, and that through their understanding of their identity as "spiritual Israelites", then suddenly everything was supposed to have fallen into place. This is the very thing that all ex-members, living or dead, of the Church banked their lives on - that the Church had a mystery long solved, evidenced by their correct interpretations of prophetic understanding. 

From their claim that a large part of the Bible is nothing but prophecy, to their literal interpretations of Revelation to the claim of theological duality in prophecy - their claims were the biggest part of their legacy that made the "glory years" what they were. It were these predictions that filled arenas and auditoriums with those who believed what they interpreted prophecy to mean. Who can forget their colorful images of Daniel, of Beasts - of Revelation images with the voice of Art Gilmore over brass instruments echoing their prophetic interpretations? The biggest gamble of any Church of God member's lives was the gamble that the Church knew what they were talking about. The only problem? Enough time has passed that any logically thinking person can know with full certainly that every thing they ever said about prophecy has turned out to be absolutely, categorically, and blatantly false. Their prophetic interpretations cannot be defended, and any belief in their prophetic interpretations today can only be attributed to an acceptance of lies and an inability to renounce what must be renounced, if truth is the yardstick one measures by. 

Chronological timeframes have been wrong. Predictions about people have been wrong. Predictions about world events have been wrong. Predictions about world leaders have been wrong. Every one - but that has not stopped certain zealots who believe they alone have the correct interpretation of prophecy from trying. Whether it's Bob, Dave, Ron, James, Gerald, Gerald, or Tom, Dick and Harry - without fail, their timelines end up being fantasies based on delusions of correctness. Truthfully, a five year old who claims to understand how algebra and calculus works can be trusted more than a Church of God minister who claims to know how prophecy and the Bible works. Plus, a five year old can be trusted more than any Church of God minister can. At least a five year old has the intelligence to be corrected when told he's wrong and listen to people who know more than he does. 

If their entire construct of their entire religion - and we're talking about Armstrongism - is wrong, then how can one put any credit in anything that they talk about? Partly because of one simple comparison that every one of them makes - them vs. what they see "in the world". What the Armstrong Apologist sees in the world of Corporate Christianity to them is far worse then the failures of Armstrongism. They see what they view as idolatrous worship of false images, pagan holidays and symbols, sun worship, belief in lies such as Santa and the Easter Bunny, embracing of Jeremiah-like Christmas trees, and the rejection of Old Testament commandments they feel are in force. This is what they use to justify that they are "more correct" than "the world", even though in reality they are just as wrong, just in a different tangent. What they do not admit they are doing, however, is measuring everything in the mind of physical legalism, not in the mind of spiritual atonement and reconciliation with God in a pure heart in mind - which they think is impossible spiritually as they judge them physically based on what they think is unacceptable in the eyes of God. 

Regardless of your opinion about the physical aspects of more mainstream Christianity, or however disgusted you are with some of the traditions and observances of the same, it does not change the fact that the Churches of God have been sharply condemning of others while dismissive of their own heretical problems. There can be no sugar coating it - lies, deceptions, delusions, and failed prophecies have been as big a problem with the Churches of God as they ever could be. And no amount of shifting blame to the problems of Mainstream Corporate Christianity as they see them will ever make that statement untrue. Untold harm and psychological damage has been the result of the lies and failures of the Churches of God's prediction addiction from people of all ages - from children to senior citizens, and all those who have ever listened to the lies of Herbert Armstrong and every splinter leader, from Dave to Bob to James, who in their self-righteous arrogance dares think they speak for God when the record is clear they only speak from their own minds, without one shred of credibility or reason to believe they could be right. Ronald Weinland himself has cemented the reality of what happens when one banks on Armstrong predictions for the record of Armstrongism for generations to come. 

There is one thing about prophecy that we can know for sure is true in the Churches of God when it comes to the "sure word". That the only sure word of "prophecy" in the Churches of God is "False".

submitted by SHT