And, it has taken them this long to realize this?
Members of the Living Church of God Council of Elders met for three days of meetings this week. Many topics were covered, but there was much discussion on how we can reach a broader audience. We are probably reaching more people than is evident from those who respond by requesting literature, but we recognize that we are only reaching very small segments of the populations in the countries where we have a presence—and that there are more than 8 billion people on earth today. Please beseech God to open doors for us to reach a far greater audience than we currently are reaching.
42 comments:
At least they acknowledge that it is GOD who opens the doors. If that isn't happening, maybe we should be asking why?
Dear LCG,
Please remember that whichever group is the most effective Church of God group in the Laodicean Age, THEY (does this mean YOU?) are the Laodiceans! I'm looking at you, too, Bwana Bob!
The Christians that God responds to are often the ones who are persecuted and shunned within these groups.
Maybe this will make them all realize the church was never going to be hidden. The light of the world has never been so dim that no one knows about it unless they receive a magazine or a free booklet.
‘only reaching very small segments’ is a huge understatement.
Their audience is so small it is almost invisible.
None of the cogs are
All I know is when Paul preached in Acts, the whole city came to hear him.
Maybe their heart means well, I don't know, but the men of God who preached and did have the Holy Spirit that came with the gifts of the spirit. They also had the fruits.
One of the best comments on this site ever!
Leaders of some mainstream church groups face a similar dilemma.
I heard one leader say on U.S. Election Night that the church's influence "is waning" and badly in need of revival - even with Mr. Trump winning.
Or wakeup very early in the morning on the weekend to watch a TW program for 30 min. It's an old and outdated model. Perhaps they should have kept their college and first estate not splintering into so many groups.
The one thing I will agree with about RCM, when he regularly would state: "At the time of the end, there will be a work of God. And that work of God will be so powerful that it will be hated. You have to be known in order to be hated."
Many people thought Ames, Meredith, Ogwyn were going to be the ones to bring ... But there's going to be a new crop (if it's the very time of the end). But you have to be a special crop that has everything correct, with the proper attitude.
1036
For the LCG, small is good. I'm sure they consider themselves to be the "little" flock mentioned in Scripture, lol.
This is just plain silly! God does not call people into Armstrongism. He does allow people to fall prey to it, though, to permit them to learn lessons!
All the Church is to do is preach the gospel. God determines how many, and who, will respond. It is not the Church's job to fill the pews. God reserves that to Himself.
They say that regularly for pity and donations. Then you actually go to their meetings and theyre screaming about how dominant they are and what a majority they are. Its very dissonant, like FoxNews whining about "the mainstream media" but also claiming to be the most watched network.
Why should God "open doors" when the message is .....every man purpose to give the required 10% - cf 2Cor 9:7?
Yep, that's it. Many are called, few are chosen.
I believe the why, is in the how. They, we for the most part, are not following the instructions Christ gave correctly.
If the church is feeding its members spiritual milk rather than spiritual meat, don't you think that would effect how many and who God calls?
Maybe if all the COG's got together, although that is highly unlikely, they could all do a more effective "work". Don't they all realise that a house divided against itself cannot stand?
The COGs simply don't recognize the Door. Jn. 10
Burt
Theyre not interested in "filling the pews" for spiritual/moral concerns, theyre interested because they want more funds.
Let's face it, the cogs were created through division. That is how Armstrong got his following. If the mainstream Christians believed one thing, Herbert decided to teach something counter to it. He divided families and friends.
The COGs know division and separation. It is unity and working together with any that hold even the slightest difference in or application of belief that they are ignorant of.
These are different times, and people are either more educated and sophisticated, or they have the resources to check out those who proselytize. If you watch any old mainstream TV shows from the 1950s and even '60s (except perhaps Star Trek) you will realize why Armstrongism does not attract the huge numbers of people that it was perfectly capable of back during that era. This is why we say it was time and date-stamped, as opposed for having eternal appeal. I seriously doubt that any of their Einsteins could even repackage or reimagine it in such a way that would match the efforts of1920s advertising exec HWA. I'll give him this, he certainly was able to take an intellectual property which cost him nothing, and to parley it into a fantastic wealth-builder!
The bible does not instruct splinters to "get together." Rather it teachers the opposite. 2 Corinthians 6:14: "Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?" Herb railed against his splinters, pointing out that they didn't have a "work." He ignored that the main purpose of church attendance is to help its members become Christ like. Asking them to attend congregations where some were constantly being abused by minister-protected church crazies was immoral. Besides, there's nothing stopping members in every splinter from supporting a work through their prayer life.
He also invested into young people as he made evangelist out of men in their early twenties, starting a college for young people to attend in a beautiful setting. He was twice their age, and he understood in order to grow an organization/church, you grow it with young people.
Now splinter groups have a major problem, there is no college (2 campuses) like before, young men aren't given positions like that before. It was the 1950's a post war economy that benefited also from the policies of FDR. Things were made in America, and didn't have to worry about many things that we do today.
They should have bought local church buildings, not invested in jets, invested into people more. Created a broadcast network instead of getting onto channels. All this when the money was good, and they had ownership of property. They continue to use the time & date-stamp approach and those are the results.
Quite a few considered that concept. See at least mainstream churchianty televangelist have different churches on television. Say like on TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network), Parsley has his own church, Creflo has his own church, Duplantis has his own church, Hagee has his own church, Copeland and Hinn have their own church groups, BUT they put their differences aside and are all able to be shown on TBN a network. The splinter COGs couldn't even do that and they all came from Armstrong. They wouldn't have to be so careful what to preach on this station or that station. It's embarrassing.
Tank
Too Much Evil
The WCG splinter groups have done enough harm already to former WCG people. They should not be trying to attract, deceive, rob, and harm even more people from the outside world too.
Gerald Flurry's PCG cult and David Pack's RCG cult are so satanic that these two false prophets ought to be ASHAMED of themselves.
Question The Con-Artists
Prospective WCG splinter group members should ask the scammers some questions.
For example:
1. Why are there so many different WCG splinter groups?
2. Why are all the WCG splinter groups so small?
3. Why is every one of the WCG splinter groups currently less than one-tenth of the size of the old WCG at its peak?
4. Why cannot the WCG splinter groups get along with each other?
5. Why do all the WCG splinter groups teach different things than each other?
6. Why do all the WCG splinter groups teach different things than the old WCG used to teach?
7. Why do the WCG splinter groups continue to split and shrink?
8. Why are the WCG splinter groups utterly unable to grow larger the way the old WCG did?
???Herbert W Armstrong shall arise, with a vehement countenance, and give heed to conundrums (third tithe, dual prophecy, 7 feasts, throne transferred, I'm apostle, 3 days/nights 72 hours, first tithe, etc - all false), and his power shall be mighty but not by his own power, and he shall corrupt to an extraordinary degree, and shall prosper, and do his thing, and shall corrupt many saints. And through his cunning also he shall cause deceit to prosper in his hand, and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and during a time of prosperity shall corrupt many............
Before you laugh uncontrollably, check all the possible Hebrew meanings of key words as in a concordance, and consider Prov 30:27 as to the word "king"........ before concluding HWA could not possibly have fulfilled this prophecy?
Tank is right. The splinters could believe 99% alike and would still focus on that 1%. Again, God is not mocked!
I suppose hwa is still just too small even though he had a greater influence than his church size might suggest.
The principle I've heard advanced in the mainstream (on radio and TV) is that a good Christian submits to the authority and teachings of the leader of whichever church he or she is a member. And, they don't think much of DIY "Lone Ranger" Christians, who don't place themselves under church authority. I even heard one pastor say that "if you don't agree with such and such, then perhaps this isn't the correct church for you! You are a Christian and are still saved, but find another church which is compatible with your beliefs that you can support whole heartedly.
They don't state this in the splinters, but I believe that this is a general principle that the splinter surfers follow. Crabby Culpepper get on your nerves? Why not try United?
Anyone who has tried watching LCG videos on YouTube or tried to read their magazine, knows that LCG are rather out of touch with the modern world. Boring presentations and articles will not attract new members. And they are wrong on various points of prophecy. I do not see God working with LCG particularly.
LCG can stand for Laodicean Church of God.
Free Your Mind, Friday, November 22, 2024 at 9:35:43 AM PST, wrote:
"Anyone who has tried watching LCG videos on YouTube or tried to read their magazine, knows that LCG are rather out of touch with the modern world. Boring presentations and articles will not attract new members. And they are wrong on various points of prophecy. I do not see God working with LCG particularly."
******
And that LCG council of elders?
May we also be thankful that God so loved the world that He did not send a LCG council/committee?
Time will tell...
John
Anon, Wednesday, November 20, 2024 at 3:27:58 PM PST, wrote:
"If the church is feeding its members spiritual milk rather than spiritual meat, don't you think that would effect how many and who God calls?"
******
What members are fed does not affect how many and who God calls, and that is easily seen by reviewing Revelation 2-3, which tell us how God planned to deal with His Church over an approximate 3,000 year period. The spiritual food varied from era/congregation to era/congregation, and so did the control (not influence) God allowed Satan to exercise with each of them.
It appears God's Church is already fixed/set at 144,000 (Revelation 14:1-5) by God, who knows who/when He chooses (Revelation 1:4 “According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:”) someone into that Church.
Jesus Christ is the Lamb involved with God's Church, whose names it appears already exist within that book, and written from before the foundation of the world:
Re 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Re 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
Re 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb s book of life.
Well, Jesus Christ did say that it was His Father who would draw/drag members to His Son, so the Father controls that "how many and who" and when, and it is God's Will be done. The Father gave all of that information to Jesus Christ (Rev 1:1); none of the information was Jesus' idea(s).
So, God already knows who will be in the first resurrection.
What about the second resurrection? Good news for "the rest" of the world, too!
"Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:" Matthew 25:34
And that is also prepared from "the foundation of the world."
There is no need for a 3rd resurrection; however, at some point after that 2nd Satan and his angels will be taken and destroyed. In the meantime, we all learned to hate evil to one degree or another.
Will those hirelings who fled the former WCG eventually come to preach God's inspired words given to Paul, not only in Eph 1:4, but in 2 Cor 5:19, which in part states: "To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them..."
Time will tell...
John
So true 7.39 am. Today's mainstream churches define "church authority/government as the right to Lord it over members faith. This is condemned in 1 Peter 5:3. and Mathew 20:25. So "prove all things" in Thessalonians 5:21 means that every reader is to be a "Lone Ranger." The churches regard this as impractical. The danger and warning to every Christian is that they can be "robbed" of decades long church friendships by being put out of their church for questioning church teachings. It's wise to limit one's friendships in the church and to also have friends outside of the church.
Well, FYM, anyone who has ever listened to the several versions of "Road Runner" (Greg Kihn Band, or Joan Jett and the Blackhearts) knows that to be in tune with the modern world, at one time, you just had to have your radio on! I mean, come on! Radio Church of God??? Even HWA knew that. Thing is, at this point in time, that is all antiquated.
LCG is still thinking in time and date-stamped modes which have expired. The examples their "Apostle" provided used the mass media of that day. If an HWA type came along to start a church today, he or she would need to be a brash young account executive conversant in today's media, with the capability to do podcasts which went viral. This involves demographic and psychographic studies which would reveal a commonality of hot buttons to which they would appeal in order to market the message. These are not a constant. Some basic ones remain, but others are changing in response to societal changes. Binge watch old 1950s and '60s TV programs to capture the zeitgeist of those times, and to understand why Armstrongism was able to be successful.
The greying of the ACOGs, and virtual idolization of their "Apostle" blinds these people. HWA funded Stanley Rader's education, and he was an invaluable tool to him for life. Somebody needs to do this with one of the young members, only in the field of mass media. Because it damned sure isn't going to suddenly and organically pop up from amongst one of the congregations.
BB
Correct 5:45 the best thing is to limit the friendships. And you are going to need friends and family outside the church in case things happen. As far as a lone ranger goes. Another verse comes to mind, "Work out your own salvation with trembling and fear." Philippians 2:12
Correct BB (as usual),
I'm always reminded of Daniel and his friends all who were young and skillful.
Daniel 1:17 As for these four young men, God gave them knowledge and skill in all literature and wisdom; and Daniel had understanding in all visions and dreams. (Dan. 1:4)
See it's not enough to just know the Bible, you have to know other things. That's why when ACOG dismiss people who are gifted in science and history along with other domains, it becomes problematic. At least Ambassador College allowed for young people to come in and other people to work that could offer another perspective or talent if permitted.
You grow your church with young people, HWA that's why he started those colleges and named those young evangelist. Now the splinters have the older members who have the time date stamped approach hoarding the resources and positions. Christ worked with his disciples who were near his age group.
RSK is correct, more members/attendees = more income for the church and thus a guaranteed salary and retirement for the pastor. The best teachers in a church work for free, voluntarily, with their own earned income outside of the church, just as the Apostle Paul sometimes had to do tent making to make a living.
In response to BykerBob, you are correct. Most church organisations of all denominations are stuck in the past, in "the good old days", so they lose members, are out of touch, and have no idea how to reach people. And using archaic English and the old KJV just puts people off. Teaching via videos, video meetings, and having dialogs rather than boring old long monologs is the way forward.
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