Will the Members of the Restored Church of God Hold David C Pack Accountable For His Lie?

It is now after 6:00 p.m. Wadsworth time.  All Restored Church of God services are over, even here on the West Coast.  No splinter group ministers died today.  Tens of thousands of COG members did not jump ship to join up with Dave.  Not a thing happened.

David C Pack is now ready to go down in Church of God history as a certified liar and false prophet in the vein of William Miller, Herbert Armstrong, Gerald Flurry and Ron Weinland.  1844, 1845, 1971, 1975, 2008, 2012, and 2013, all dates to live in COG infamy for lies uttered by theological depraved idiots.

The sad part is that Dave's cult members will stick by his side when he comes up with a new excuse.  They did that for William Miller, so much so that his followers became even more fervent in their end time prophecies.  They did it to Herbert Armstrong when he lied in 1971 and 1975.  They stood by Ron Weinland when his prophecies failed and they stood by Gerald Flurry when he lied about Petra two years ago. It only took a prison sentence for Ron to start losing members and ministers, while members have stuck by the side of the other leaders.

What will Dave Pack's members do?  Will any of them have the wherewithal to leave his cult now?  They know for a fact he lied to them.  He has stolen their money to build monuments to himself.  Will Dale Schurter grow a pair of balls and take personal responsibility and walk away publicly holding Dave accountable for his lie?

On Sunday morning, September 1, Dave is going to go about his business as if nothing happened.  He will of course have had his god talking to him over the last day or so telling him to not to respond to his critics.  His god will remind him that the average COG member is a sucker and will soon forget Dave ever uttered his false predictions.  People will quickly forget and send in more money when Dave asks.  They do this because in the back of their mind  Armstrongism has installed a tape that runs 24/7/365.  That tape says, "But, what IF he was right, but the timing is off.  I am under the government of God and must remain loyal or I will lose my salvation." 

That "what IF" is a big deal breaker for many.  They will see it as a test to see if they are loyal to the government of God.  Dave, ever the manipulator that he is, will take full advantage of that thinking.  With threats of being disloyal to the "government of God," to disloyalty to Dave himself, is the yoke that he will hang over his members.

Disloyalty is a heavy burden in Armstrongism.  The problem is, 9 times out of 10 it is disloyalty on the part of the ministers, evangelists, prophets, and leaders that is the issue.  Their disloyalty to the membership is appalling.  They use and abuse the members while never taking responsibility for anything.  Heck, when you have leaders like Dave Pack and Rod Meredith who claim that they have never committed a major sin, what is a bottom feeding member supposed to do? How do you question that...

Dennis Muses: In a multitude of actual counsel there could have been safety.....

2013 Making It Mean What It Never Meant Award

Awarded for the Most Ridiculous Theological Misreading and Misuse of Scripture for 2013



Presented to David C Pack of the Restored Church of God for successfully making the obscure Minor Prophet Haggai mean what it never meant, could mean or ever will mean.

 This evening marks the official end of these ridiculous speculations and analogies gone crazy and the dawn of a new day in the history of the Churches of God.  Truly, truly Sabbath, August 31, 2013 was-is-will be  a Sabbath like no other. 

It was on this day enlightenment came to a few more "I'm stuck in this seat and can't get up," brethren giving what they have not got in exchange for a  church that returns precious little to them but embarrassment, humiliation, fairy tales disguised as sermons, theological nonsense and large bills yet another small fundamentalist religious school and fabulous "Headquarters." 

I am pleased to present this award on behalf of thousands who have watched this theo-drama unfold over the past few months and hung in there to see it through.

Let those with ears to hear and eyes to see just go ahead and use them at this time to free themselves once and for all from the religion pretending to be spirituality and human imagination and reasonings masking as Biblical insights and truth.

We wish Deacon David C Pack  no ill will but that he would repent and fill in his 35 question Ex-Apostle Rehire Forms as soon as possible.  It may take a few seconds to get an answer, so please be patient.

Lessons of the Year


Proverbs 11:14

Where there is no guidance, a people falls, but in an abundance of (Genuine) counselors there is safety.

1 Corinthians 13

New International Version (NIV)

13 If I speak in the tongues^[a] of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. ² If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, (which Restored Church did not have, could not fathom and moveth not) but do not have love, I am nothing. ³ If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast,^[b] but do not have love, I gain nothing.

⁴ Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. ⁵ It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. ⁶ Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. ⁷ It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

(One might substitute "ministry" for the world "love" in the above)

⁸ Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. ⁹ For we know in part and we prophesy in part, ¹⁰ but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ¹¹ When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. ¹² For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
¹³ And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

 While disturbing at times, it's been an enjoyable adventure in seeing just how far aberrant theology can go. 

USELESS COMMENTS ON CURRENT EVENTS, COG STYLE

USELESS COMMENTS ON CURRENT EVENTS, COG STYLE

For those with a WCG background or now in COG splinters, it's very familiar.

Commenting on current events and how it supposedly ties in with biblical prophecy.

HWA invented his own style, and men like Herman Hoeh and Gene Hogberg perfected it.  Somehow the WCG biblical prophecy experts had insight into any news item at any time.

Falling of the Berlin wall, what does it mean, in biblical terms?

Iraq?  Iran?  Egypt?  There's a biblical app for that.

But look back on any such commentary and it's very clear how pointless such commentary always is.  Can anyone point to any "biblical" commentary on world events that has ever proved to be useful in any way?  At the time it is delivered in such a manner that it must be the most important thing you could ever read or hear.  In reality, of course, it is so much light and sound with nothing behind the screen.

The style is this.  You start with supposedly piercing questions.  "What does [xxx] mean in terms of the prophecies for this region?"  "How will this turn out?".  In other words, you lure the reader into thinking you've actually got answers to such questions.

In reality, of course, the article or sermon is not going to lead anywhere of any utility to you or anyone else.  It doesn't say anything you don't already know if you've even casually read a newspaper or blog, doesn't provide any useful information, or god forbid, actually commit to any view that this current event has anything to do with a 2500 year old prophecy, but it *appears* to create such an aura so that you almost feel that that's what the commentary has done.

What a load of crap!  But it does seem to work for a lot of people...

Let's look at a recent example, from the UCG site, a "Beyond Today daily" short presentation entitled "Attack on Syria?"

Now, anyone who remotely follows news events is aware that Syria is currently an extremely troubled country and that the US is poised to embark on some sort of military action.  But the UCG must have some unique, thought-provoking, biblical perspective on it all, right?

Presenter Darris McNeely has a voice full of gravitas, and begins thusly:

[Darris McNeely] Other news today that probably, or more current is taking place in Syria in the Middle East as drumbeats begin to heighten and increase. Will the United States take some type of military action along with other nations? What will be the impact of that, especially in the aftermath of revelations that the Syrian President Bashar al-Assad has used chemical weapons against his own people? Graphic scenes and pictures have come out about that in recent days, and it has created quite an uproar, and it's an awful atrocity that has taken place. And now seems to be pushing American and other western involvement into this. And what does that mean? What will happen?

You see what he's done?  There's nothing new, just questions that everybody who cares would have.  But delivered properly, it sounds as if his perspective is unique and monumental.  Sure, what does it all mean and what will happen?  Wow, I'm about to receive some important insight into all of this!  I'd better listen to this guy.

But you're being conned.  You're not going to get any insight at all.  In fact, you're not even going to get any strong opinions one way or the other.  But you're going to *feel* as if you did, if you allow the gravitas to work its magic on you.

Copresenter Steve Myers brings in the Old Testament, because there's nothing like the mystique of an ancient text to create the right atmosphere.  But of course he won't say the scripture is necessarily relevant in any way, but let's let him qualify that himself:

"Well, those weapons of mass destruction have gotten the world's attention, and the Bible does focus on Syria in prophecy. And I can't help but think of some of those prophecies about Damascus, about Syria. There's one in Isaiah chapter 17 that talks about the burden against Damascus. And it talks about the fact in verse 1 of chapter 17. "Behold Damascus will cease from being a city, and it will be a ruinous heap" (Isaiah 17:1). Now I'm not saying that that's what's going to happen right at this very instance, but I hope that you'll notice what's going on in the Mid-East more than just saying, "My gas prices have gone up." Because so much is going on. And could it be that we're heading in that direction where end-time Bible prophecy is going to be fulfilled? It will happen. Where exactly are we?"

The great thing about Middle Eastern current events is that most of the regions and cities there have existed for thousands of years and were also around at the time scribes wrote the books of the Bible.  So you can find a verse that mentions a modern-day city, and it sounds awesome!

Somethings happens in Damascus, and so Steve says "I can't help but think of some of those prophecies about Damascus".  And when something happens in Athens I can't help but think of Herodotus writing about how king Xerxes burnt it to the ground.

But what does that have to do with any insight into this current event?  Answer: nothing, and in fact Steve clearly realizes this, because after going out of his way to quote a scripture as if it has some crucial connection, he quickly adds: " Now I'm not saying that that's what's going to happen right at this very instance...", so I guess the only point was to create a wow factor that "I can quote a biblical verse that refers to the ancient city that was still called Damascus, just like this one!"  And let us again state the obvious: "Because so much is going on."  OMG, talk about ROTFLMAO! 

Once you know the method and style, you could write commentary like this with your eyes closed.

Steve continues, "Could it be we're heading in that direction?"  Now, naturally he doesn't have the foggiest clue, but he's just asking, and it sounds so awesome to ask such a profound question.  Give it a try, you can do it too!  (It must be spoken with gravitas of course, this is important).

"Is the Australian economy on the eve of collapsing?"

"Are the prophecies of Egypt as the king of the south referring to the Muslim Brotherhood?"

"Could it be that Miley Cyrus' career is over?"

Dunno, maybe so, maybe not, but let's pretend I have special vision on it, and after all let's just see what happens! 

Indeed, it's usually best to just see what happens.  Amazingly, you can do this by reading the news every day.

Darris McNeely actually endorses this line of action:

"And will it happen? We'll have to wait and see. It likely, something is going to take place. What will be the impact of that? We don't know. Everyone is waiting right now to see exactly what will take place."

The above quote was not edited, that's what he really said! :-)

So, in summary, it seems that it would have saved a lot of time and space and trouble, to reduce the "commentary" to it's essential element, which is this: 

"A lot of things are happening in the news these days. Let's keep reading the news to see how they all turn out!"

But that's what everyone does anyway, so exactly what did service did this commentary provide? 

It's amazing that anyone, in or out of UCG, or any COG, would watch or read such a commentary with the hope of gaining any insight or useful information of any kind.

And not to pick on UCG, it's just not all that different from any other COG discussion of "world news and its connection to prophecy", past, present or future.

Such a waste of words, setting the reader up with obvious questions, and leaving them hanging with no answers of course, because there are none at this time.

Now, there are some things the presenters could have actually said that might have been useful, but that would not have supported the atmosphere they wanted to create, which is that by reading ancient texts with a COG interpretation you somehow get some special insight into what's going on in the current human drama.

To do this, it's necessary to always speak generalities, as McNeely does at the end of the presentation which leaves you with this unbelievably priceless statement:

"It's an important area to watch, an important event and twist that is taking place even as we speak and take note of this at this time."

I can't imagine listening to this presentation and not being left with the gnawing feeling: "Ok, something's happening somewhere as usual, but what exactly was your point, anyway?"

Of course, these commentaries always have to speak in generalities, because there is no choice.  Scribes living in the bronze age never dreamed of what the world would be like in 2013, and couldn't have cared less anyway.  They had their own issues to deal with.  Trying to comment on current events "in the light of biblical prophecy" is such an empty, useless exercise, and provides the modern individual no helpful service whatsoever in trying to understand or even know what's currently going on in the world.

No matter how much serious gravitas you put on it.

Michael

Dennis can't help it and muses one more time before September

 

Official Restored Church of God

Apostolic Reinstatement/Rehire Form



 

 

The following Church form is to be filled out by any Apostle of the Restored Church of God who is seeking reinstatement and rehire into the ministry of the Restored Church of God. 

 

(Any similarity to any previous rehire forms is merely coincidental)

 

  Important Questionnaire

 

(By David C Pack-Apostle formerly known as Joshua High Priest)

 

A crucial series of questions present themselves before every shepherd of any rank. As you read, think hard—very, very hard!—about your original calling to serve in one or more offices under the sure guidance and direction of Christ as Head of His Church. Ask yourself each difficult question today’s circumstances require you to answer. Do not permit yourself to look away from hard realities now confronting all of God’s ­people.

In every age of His Church, Christ’s sheep have needed shepherds. Those with special leadership training and experience from the past will be held accountable in a greater way than all others (Jms. 3:1-2). Dereliction of duty by those “to whom much was given” will mean that “much will be required” of them some day (Luke 12:48). Take a deep breath and think of yourself standing before the “judgment seat” of Christ (II Cor. 5:10). You will be forced to give answers to HIM then if you are unwilling to demand them of YOURSELF ­now.

The millions constituting the physical remnant of modern Israel returning from captivity are foretold to come “weeping and loathing themselves” for having rejected God’s Way (Jer. 50:4-5; Ezek. 6:8-9). What about the spiritual remnant, who once knew that Way, but largely left it? Will/does this describe you? Read the above verses, and then read the following questions slowly, carefully and prayerfully. They are the biggest way that the ministry should “consider their ways.” Consider writing out the answers:

          (1) Retirement—Mr. Armstrong taught that retirement is not an option for a true minister.

• Did you retire? If so, when, and why did you think yourself an exception
• (Did you think you were someone spoken of in the Bible anywhere and if so why?)

 

(2) Non-Career—Mr. Armstrong taught that “going non-career” is not an option for a true minister.

• Did you do this? If so, why did you think yourself an exception?
• (Did you go non-coherent at any time during your ministry?  If so why do you think that occurred?)
  

(3) Established Doctrine and Tradition

• In what doctrines or traditions do you believe Mr. Armstrong “got it wrong”? (Include all areas—be specific.)
• (In what doctrines, traditions or scriptures do you think you "got it wrong"? Include all areas--be specific)

 (4) Did you actively resist false doctrine in your ministry?—or give safe sermons where you disagreed? (Be specific.)

• During the liberal years of the 1970s?
• In the WCG in the late 1980s and early 90s?
• In your splinter or splinters?
• (Did you give dangerous sermons at any time that could be construed as unbalanced or a sign of mental illness?)

(5) On each doctrine where you came to agree with God’s enemies—either Joe Tkach, those who assisted his destruction or your splinter leader, such as David C Pack—why did you agree?

 

 

(6) Why should you still be considered for the ministry in God’s Church?

.Why should God’s flock ever again be entrusted to your care?

• Are you prepared to re-win brethren’s trust, including brethren now here whom you will likely also pastor? What about re-winning the trust of Headquarters?

7.  Did you actively pursue where God’s Truth, Church, Work, College and Government were found?

 

 
• If not, why not? Be specific.
• If so, how hard? Be specific.

          ( 8) Have you read or viewed any of our Splinter Explanation Packet material?  (Have you read Psalm 51 and 30 other scriptures on unsound teaching and beliefs?)

• What items?  Did you at any time hear my “30 Reasons” sermons of 1993 and 1994? (Parts 1, 2 or 3?)

 (9) Do you now believe again that Christ works solely through one unified organization?

(10) In light of government(s) you followed, how do you see God’s government today?  (Are you willing to submit to it no matter who you think you are or were?)

(11) Have you returned to believing that Mr. Armstrong was the final “Elijah”?—and Zerubbabel?  (Have you gotten over believing you were the Joshua of Haggai?)

(12) Have you returned to believing that truth only enters the Church through apostles as Mr. Armstrong said so often?  (And have you come to see that self ordinations are dicey and slippery concepts in religion?)

(13) Do you believe I Corinthians 12:18 applies to you with no qualifications added?

(14) Do you believe there can be exceptions to I Corinthians 1:10 and 13—regarding members or ministers in the Church?

(15) Are you willing to temporarily or permanently become an associate pastor?

(16) Are you willing to be excluded from the ministry until you requalify?

(17) Are you familiar with the new teachings that God has added to His Church on top of what Mr. Armstrong taught?

• Which ones?—and do you agree?

         (18) If your ordination(s) is(are) invalid, are you interested in being re-trained for Christ’s true ministry?

          (19) Do you believe ministers should be able to voice opinions to others about:

• Where Headquarters is “wrong”?
• What Mr. Armstrong taught/said/did “wrong”?
• What Mr. Pack (Or any current Apostle should Mr. Pack be found wanting)teaches/says/does “wrong”?
• Where your boss is “wrong” or harsh, etc.?
• Where you disagree doctrinally?

          (20) Do you consider yourself as having been (rate yourself from 5 being best to 0 being worst):

• Weak
• Cowardly
• Slothful
• Covetous
• Confused
• Compromising
• Foolish
• Political (And did you ever “run for office” in a splinter?)
• Heretical
• Deceitful
• Easily deceived
• Betrayed your calling
  

(21) Why did you lose the ability to “discern good from evil” (Heb. 5:13-14)?—and for so long?

          (22) What do you consider to be your ministerial rank?
(Joshua the High Priest of Haggai, Apostle) Evangelist Ÿ Pastor Ÿ Preaching Elder Ÿ Local Elder Ÿ Local Church Elder Ÿ “Elder” Ÿ Ministerial Assistant


          (23) Are you prepared to dedicate the rest of your life to serving God’s flock and fixing completely the horrific mess you helped cause in so many lives?


          (24) In light of how you once saw Mr. Armstrong, do you still recognize the fruits of a true apostle when you see one?

• If you say yes, why did you follow Joe Tkach until he destroyed everything?
• (Why did you follow David C Pack until he destroyed everything?)

          (25) Describe your spiritual condition today. (Also, rate your temperature from 0-10, with 10 the highest.)


          (26) What 5 biggest lessons did you learn from and since the apostasy? (In order of importance.)

Did you fast before you answered all of these vitally  important questions?

 

          (27) How many times did you fast for 24 hours (or more) before answering these questions?

          (28) How many times have you prayed over Psalm 51 on your knees?


          (29) Having now long abandoned many doctrines you said you would never leave, how would you convince Headquarters that this time you “mean it” if you intend to now “hold fast” (Rev. 3:11)?


          (30) What have been your pastoral actions during the troubles of recent weeks and months?


          (31) Are you prepared to spend a full year (or more) catching up with all you must unlearn, relearn, and learn new?

          (32) What personal responsibility do you feel for the deplorable condition into which God’s people have sunk?

          (33) How would you prove that you are still Spirit-led?—or were ever Spirit-led?

 

          (34) What date did you leave the WCG (RCG), and why did you remain beyond May 1995, if this is the case?  If you are the One Apostle, or were, why did you remain beyond September 1, 2013???

(35) What did you do after reading the article “God’s People Back Together—SOON!”?

       (If you threw up, explain why you thought you threw up and did you throw up more than once?)

FINALLY:  You are NOT to discuss this or share it in anyway with ANYONE (expect with us)

Feast Presents Are Cool - So Here Are Cool Toys For The Feast Though Remember Christ Died For Your Sins Which Is The Best Feast Gift Ever....

I am speechless at the thought process behind this.

I never cease to be amazed at the money making schemes of COG members.  It is based in Cincinnati.  Three guesses it is a UCG person.

All that is missing is The Bible Game and the Talent's Game.

Check this out: Toys For The Feast

- See more at: http://www.coolesttoysonearth.com/for-the-feast#.UiAOsBD9nRZ

Huh?! You Know About the Feast?

Now you may be wondering, how does Coolest Toys know so much about the Feast of Tabernacles? It just so happens that one of our employees, Jason who works in marketing, observes the FOT and brought up with Elliot, the owner, that a lot of feast-goers are looking for cool toys for their children and grand-children (and maybe even for themselves). Jason wrote this:

"So I have some reservations about direct marketing to fellow-feast goers, but I kept getting questioned at Sabbath services about gift recommendations for their family since they knew I worked at Coolest Toys on Earth. They said, "Well Jason, we'll be spending our 2nd tithe somewhere, so it might as well be with you." My family of seven had the tradition to get each person a feast-present, but I know that not everyone does it. Talking to some other friends, they were afraid that if I didn't handle this well, it might denegrate the feast by turning it into the Church of God's version of Xmas. I agreed with them: that would be awful, and resolved that I would keep it suggestions only - so high-pressure selling was out of the question. I try really hard not to hard-sell to anyone, anyway. Since I get the questions no matter what I do, I would get the team to just give cool recommendations if families were in the market. So hopefully, we have the right tone that helps families out, but only if interested. And if I suggested the wrong tone or approach, I hope they find the time to email me with suggestions. Afterall, feast presents are cool - but definitely not necessary. Here in America, God has blessed us beyond belief with riches, awesome feast sites, the truth of God's plan played out in His Holy Days, and the fact that Christ died for our sins. That, by far, is the best feast gift ever." -Jason Nitzberg

We at Coolest Toys hope you have a wonderful time, where ever you find yourself this fall. Hopefully our suggestions were helpful and please, make this the best feast ever.