Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!
With all the new crazy self-appointed Chief Overseers, Apostles, Prophets, Pharisees, legalists, and outright liars leading various Churches of God today, it is important to hold these agents of deception accountable.
Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web of Corrupt Leaders
That pesky ol'Satan is a busy guy lately as he is specifically targeting those whom the UCG believes they have 'converted' over to their way of life. Are new 'converts" to UCGism leaving the church soon afterward? Why is Satan always blamed for ineffectual UCG speakers/ministers who are so bland and boring that they can't retain new members? People thought they were joining a church geared toward Jesus when they joined UCG and later realized the guy is rarely talked about.
In addition, we would like to ask if you would add another vital component to your prayers. Please pray especially for the many people God is calling that they will be unhindered in learning and implementing the marvelous truths of the Bible (Matthew 22:14). In Jesus’ parable of the sower and the seed He said, “The sower sows the word. And these are the ones by the wayside where the word is sown. When they hear, Satan comes immediately and takes away the word that was sown in their hearts” (Mark 4:14-15). Brethren, we can all pray that God will help people resist the devil’s unseen aggression so that the seed of the gospel will put down roots in their lives so as to begin producing godly fruit (Matthew 13:23).
In His model prayer Jesus said, “And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one” (Matthew 6:13). As we pray this way for ourselves, we can also pray for these new, vulnerable “little ones” whom God is calling (Matthew 10:42). This is so they can not only withstand Satan’s toxic influence, but deal effectively with life’s troubles and distractions while growing in and applying spiritual knowledge and understanding (Mark 9:41-42; John 17:15).
Our favorite self-appointed prophet will spend countless hours a week talking jibberish about topics that have absolutely nothing to do with Jesus Christ. Bwana Bob's topics do not even concern his African followers, who could care less about these things. When you face a day to day struggles with keeping food on your table, shelter over your head, and maintaining personal safety, these nonsense topics by their leader do not impress them. Rarely do they ever hear about Jesus Christ, the one they actually take delight in following. Why COG leaders are embarrassed about talking about Jesus has always fascinated me.
Does Jesus even care about those topics, including the Bible? The answer to that is, of course not!
These are some of the unimportant things the Great Bwana thinks is important to know for salvation:
The LCG source submitted this along with the quote below:
And Douglas Winnail tries to sound spiritual by using the word "Transcendental" then proceeds to brow beat. Notice he didn't fully quote Mark 16:15, he quoted "Go into all the world and preach the gospel." Why truncate "...to every creature?"
A Transcendental Purpose: God revealed a vital truth to the Apostle Paul when he wrote, “in the last days... men will be lovers of themselves... lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God” (2 Timothy 3:1–5). Today, people have full schedules and empty lives. When we focus on ourselves—my life, my job, my feelings, and my problems—this is a one-way ticket to frustration. However, some have learned that the key to a meaningful life is to focus on a goal that is bigger than ourselves. Jesus taught that we should “seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you” (Matthew 6:33). Jesus told His disciples to “go into all the world and preach the gospel” (Mark 16:15) and that “It is more blessed to give than to receive” (Acts 20:35). To fulfill our calling as Christians and to have a really meaningful life, we need to get our focus off of ourselves and think about how we can serve others (Matthew 20:25–28). What adjustments can you make in your life to focus more on this transcendental purpose? Have a profitable Sabbath, Douglas S. Winnail
I first became aware of Bob Thiel through an old friend of mine who had taken umbrage with something he had written on Cogwriter, and was exchanging email with him. Oh, I remember what it was. Dr. Ernest Martin had just passed away, and Beto had very ungratiously trashed him. Of course, I became involved in the discussion. Thiel replied that his chief interest was in keeping the Philadelphia era of the church together, and that if my goal was not similar, he had no interest in discussing anything further with me. Typical. I had seen that dismissive attitude before. In reading some of the materials on Cogwriter, I realized that basically it was a brown nose site dedicated to the support of Rod Meredith. Two things occurred to me. 1) Such a site or publications would NEVER have been permitted by HWA during the WCG classic era. HWA wanted the exclusive, and would have been enraged if he suddenly had an echo. 2) LCG members would most likely resent Thiel, because it would be like having an extra parent that you didn't want emerging from your peers, inserting himself and asserting himself into your life. I was also cognizant of the fact that back in 1975, during the church troubles and the first round of splinters, there was no shortage of petulant little ones who had always felt that they had certain truths to which the church would not listen, and who suddenly arose to have their day in the sun. Members were shocked when these somehow got hold of mailing lists of members and began sending their materials around. It was pathetic, and they soon disappeared, having just wasted and exhausted their resources. Nobody wanted these little off-beat nobodies in their lives. People looking for change were more inclined to just leave Armstrongism, or to follow charismatic regional leaders who left, such as Ken Westby in the East, or Al Carozzo in California. Even those "big guys" melted away with time, and nobody even remembers them or their groups today. And, of course, this general trend repeated itself in the '90s, although the attempted correction or reformation of the main body is an added wrinkle, But none of the little guys from the splintering of the '90s have morphed into big guys. The better known ones who were already the leaders on the mother ship got the big pieces of the pie, and have watched them shrink. Bob Thiel has wasted his life. He will never become one of the big guys because real leaders know how to find and strengthen a common chord with a broad cross section of an audience. They know how to relate, and to exchange energy with that audience in symbiosis with the members. Not having that gift, or the polish which accompanies it, is the reason why so many aspiring leaders fail in building any sort of large scale following. Over time, such a leader's rough edges must become rounded, so that they lose personal tics such as flailing hands. They become more focussed rather than jumping around amongst 20 different topics in their public speaking endeavors. They grow in their effectiveness, usually on a short enough time scale so that they reach their peak in time to spend most of their productive years nourishing what they have built. And here we are. There has been no rounding of the rough edges for Bob over the past twenty years, no massive accumulation of followers, and he's running out of time. The only thing he has going for him is that he hasn't quit his day job. His sleight of hand with African believers whose loyalties float amongst various Miller-based teachers is an illusion, and everybody except himself knows this.
Over 10 years ago the most important man in the history of the Church of God movement had a major meltdown because Living Church of God leadership rejected his admonishment and refused to change teachings because this important man said to. He was widely mocked in the LCG at this time and eventually was publicly vilified by Rod Meredith from the pulpit and got kicked to the curb.
Seriously brethren, how could the greatest man in the history of the COG movement ever be treated in such a way! It was shocking, so much so that this self-proclaimed prophet self-appointed himself as leader of the improperly named "continuing" Church of "god".
Unable to garner any COG members from any of the splinter groups, the Great prophet set his eyes on Africa where he was assured a small following. Soon, a few hundred church-hopping Sabbatarians in Africa became "official" members of the Church of the Great Bwana.
It did not take long before the Great Bwana started taking on all kinds of "biblical" titles he claimed he represented. Not content being the world's foremost historian on the Mayans, church history, Mary and Satan's Chair, the Great Bwana set himself up as Elisha, Elijah, Johsua, and other biblical characters which he deems to best fit his self-described characteristics. Never has the Church of God had a greater man leading it than we have in Bob Thiel.
Yet, in spite of all these most superfantabulous characteristics, the Great Bwana had this article up today:
Thiel has published the most beautiful self-own ever!
Researchers have concluded that there are costs associated with self-deception:
The invisible downside of cheating in life
People who take shortcuts can trick themselves into believing they are smarter than they are, says Tom Stafford, and it comes back to bite them. …
Thiel has never had a formal degree in theology (except for his diploma mill Ph.D. out of India). All he is able to say is that he has taken classes at various places. Thiel's theology "education" comes from eh words of Herbert Armstrong and Rod Meredith. These guys have educated Thiel so much so that Thiel considers himself the most educated theologian in the church today. ...trick themselves into believing they are smarter than they are,
The researchers ran another experiment to check that the effect was really due to the cheaters’ inflated belief in their own abilities. In this experiment, students were offered a cash reward for accurately predicting their scores on the second test. Sure enough, those who had been given the opportunity to cheat overestimated their ability and lost out – earning 20% less than the other students.
The inflated sensibilities of Bob Thiel are legendary. Never ordained nor set apart by God to start a new church, his inflated ego led him to do so, believing god was on his side.
The implication is that people in Chance’s experiment – people very much like you and me – had tricked themselves into believing they were smarter than they were. There may be benefits from doing this – confidence, satisfaction, or more easily gaining the trust of others – but there are also certainly disadvantages. Whenever circumstances change and you need to accurately predict how well you’ll do, it can cost to believe you’re better than you are.
That self-deception has its costs has some interesting implications. Morally, most of us would say that self-deception is wrong. But aside from whether self-deception is undesirable, we should expect it to be present in all of us to some degree (because of the benefits), but to be limited as well (because of the costs).
Self-deception isn’t something that is always better in larger doses – there must be an amount of it for which the benefits outweigh the costs, most of the time. We’re probably all self-deceiving to some degree. The irony being, because it is self-deception, we can’t know how often. The invisible downside of cheating in life
The Great Bwana of Africa goes on to make even more damaging self-own's:
Jesus taught that Satan was a liar and the father of lies:
44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it (John 8:44)
Of course, Satan takes advantage of deception and encourages humans to deceive themselves. Recall what happened to Eve:
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression. (1 Timothy 2:14)
6 So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree desirable to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate. (Genesis 3:6-7)
Satan was involved, but the woman allowed herself to be deceived. This type of deception happens every day.
But what about Christians? Can Christians fall victim to self-deception?
Jesus warned that most Christians in the end times would be deceived:
14 “And to the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write,
‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: 15 “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. 16 So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. 17 Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’ — and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked — 18 I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. (Revelation 3:14-19)
Although most Laodiceans do not believe that they are deceiving themselves, Jesus said that they are. Jesus said that Laodicean Christians need to repent–they need to change. They should not let pride get in their way.
Has the Church of God ever had a more prideful man in charge of a splinter group than what we see today in Bwana Bob? No one is more educated than him. No one knows more truth than he does. No one has a church doing more things than his. No one has the fasted growing COG in history (which it is not).
The Great Bwana's pride is so enormous that he even put out a sermon on the topic warning OTHERS to not be prideful...which he is ok with it.
‘The Atlantic’ ran an article titled “Quit Lying to Yourself.’ It explained that this was not good and does not lead to happiness. The BBC ran an article about dangers of self-deception. The Bible warns about lies, self-deception, and pride. Does the New Testament warn that Christians can be deceived? What did Jesus say was the truth? What did Jesus tell end-time Laodicean Christians to do? Dr. Thiel addresses these issues and more in this video.
The prophet then goes on to claim that prophetic deception can lead people astray. Hello!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Other than Dave Pack, does the COG have a bigger liar in their midst than Bob?
Self-deception is common. Try not to fall for it. The word of God is truth (John 17:17), hopefully you will believe it enough so that you will resist Satanically-encouraged self-deception (cf. James 4:7).
Sadly, the COG has been infected with this disease from almost day one. Each successive year has brought out bigger and bigger liars. Self-deception in the COG is a plague!
Continuing to dive into the posthumously gifted 16 hours of conversations that William H. Behrer, III, recorded of David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God has been a unique challenge. Due to the length and number of files, I opted to address the low-hanging fruit first by starting with the shortest ones.
There are already four recordings not worth reporting on. My goal is to only present the most noteworthy for the public interest. These recordings are educational by further piecing together the mosaic of who David C. Pack really is when the doors are closed. The unfiltered conversations provide a growing character study of a man who claims he is God’s Apostle and Elijah.
This may be a disappointment for some, but there is nothing illegal yet discovered or any “super wowzers” that would tantalize the casual non-COG reader. If anything illegal is revealed, the local authorities will be notified. If Mr. Behrer did not do that already, I doubt I would be able to, either.
But, for those who were in RCG and have dealt with David C. Pack, this will give you PTSD flashbacks. I have heard from multiple former ministers that this was how the man still operates privately, which these recordings will provide you with a taste of.
Two patterns have “more clarity” based on the seven files I have reviewed. These patterns were visible to the men at Headquarters but are now immortalized "on tape" for those who never met him so they can experience them for themselves.
1) Dave does not let people finish their thoughts because his words are more important.
He verbally steps over people so that they do not get to finish what they are saying. Dave had heard enough, and now, back to what was really important: What he had to say. Keep this in mind when you listen to all the recordings, and you will not be able to "un-hear" it.
2) Dave tells the men exactly what they should say or write because he knows how others will think and react in return. He has entire exchanges figured out before they happen.
Jim Habboush is not the only Meat Puppet at Headquarters. Throughout the years, all the ministers in The Restored Church of God have been spoon-fed words and given responses to responses because "all-knowing" Dave is a master at dissecting human thought in advance.
David C. Pack WANTED these conversations recorded so there would be a precise execution of his will. One man told me a story about how he got “a talking to” because he did NOT record a conversation and did not use the perfect words Dave had graciously provided.
The goal was met, but Dave was still unhappy that his exact words were not cloned. Why?
If a man is successful at a task and parrots Dave’s words, Dave could claim another victory due to his direct involvement. However, if that man had made his own choices and used his own approach, Dave could not place his flag on that hill. Every success at RCG must fly under Dave's banner to be valid.
Every "win" at Headquarters needs to originate with Dave’s superior counsel and not because of the skills and discernment of the men under him.
The men will get full credit for a task only when that task fails or is a disappointment. If something went wrong, it was the man’s fault for not following Dave’s instructions effectively. Or he is just incompetent. (Ministerial incompetence will be covered in Tape #34 next time.)
Tape #30 is a seven-minute discussion of how David C. Pack wants William H. Behrer, III, to respond to the request by Mr. Zwick at The History Channel for Dave’s involvement in “The Nostradamus Effect” program. They want to include him as one in an ensemble of interviews.
#30 – History Channel Meeting with DCP & WHB
This transcript has been cleaned up to make it more intelligible. The stammering half-thoughts and repeated words would drive you nuts if you had to read them.
[Start]
DCP: Quickly. Bill's gonna respond to Zwick. History Channel. [Unknown] It's outta the question. You literally powerfully validate the crap they're gonna alright?
WHB: Right. Exactly.
DCP: If you use me as a set-up and you reduce me to that crap.
WHB: Yes.
DCP: So. Now here's the point. You gotta say that in the letter, and it's not really somewhere you have to be crude, but being very diplomatic, iddn't gonna get it done. This is not a time for extra diplomacy, Bill. It's a time for "just the facts, ma'am," Joe Friday.
You gotta tell him who I am and what I do. And just say, "Mr. Pack can't possibly lend his name to the kind of junk that others will utter on these subjects.Nobody understands the scope of what's coming. If you wanna understand the full scope, listen to his entire series or read his book, and you'll realize his voice is worth ten times all of them put together. Now, that's an arrogant statement. The problem is, it's true." And he'll either bite or he won't. If we don't say it and we just bow out, we don't want to be in. You gotta tell him why.
WHB: Yes.
DCP:And if he feels indicted, get over it. “Well, go ahead without us.” But there's an avenue. Let's see if we can keep this door open and make it a barn door. Not a side door. And if he says, "Okay, here we are." It's gotta be an interview. You could actually tell him, "If you wanna quote large portions of Mr. Pack, large portions, not even interview him, that's fine. But you've gotta let him be a big part of the answer. If you wanna let other people utter junk, Mr. Pack is happy to set up himself as the Anchor Response.
Do you understand? Or you can interview him. Or, if you want to, you can play most all of his broadcasts. He will actually give you permission to do that." It depends on which one they want to do. I read through all of them. The introductions to all twelve [Revelation – The World to Come]. I can see why he wants them. And they'd be wonderful. But they set up the truth, not falsehoods.
WHB: Right.
DCP: And you've gotta Bill, you gotta use words like, "You're gonna hear fiction from the mouths of people who are ignorant of what they're talking about."Here's what you do. You gotta impress him with our knowledge. They don't understand what happens when, as well as where and to whom. They can't understand the speed, sequence, and seriousness of prophecies because they don't understand the Bible interprets itself. That if a prophecy includes a symbol, Revelation is filled with them. Then God has to interpret the symbol. They just interpret it themself.
So, you know, at the end of the day, you've gotta write a pretty slam-bang deal here. Or they just have to go on without us. And I will never let myself be part of, you know…If they want me in, I'm in. And I wanna know how much they're going to use or they can't use me. But you've gotta act like we got something they want. "Mr. Pack's the foremost authority on prophecy in the world. He's read in every nation and territory of the world. Uncounted millions and millions of his books are out there. He's in demand. He's very selective." Say it. I mean—boom.
We know who prophecy says I am. We know who God says I am. The things I'm gonna have to do before it's over, I better be the top expert. Maybe that's ever lived. I believe. Can I just tell ya? There're are probably three things I do well in life. One is analyze. Two is swim. And the third one's, "I know prophecy." And I know that I know prophecy better than any man who has ever drawn breath on planet earth. I don't count Christbecause He's--
WHB: No, I understand.
DCP:I know more than John or any of the prophets because Daniel, he didn't even understand his own book.
WHB: He thinks you're right.
DCP: And then, so, who would be in the running? Herbert Armstrong? Think what I've learned that he didn't know.So, you know what, Bill? Let's act like it. If people reject it, that's their problem.
WHB: Right. Absolutely.
DCP: They won't reject it for long. And soon enough, there'll be a profile. They'll realize, "I could have had that guy,"and then they'll come, and we'll absolutely own any…You know, Joel Osteen's going on Fox News Sunday with his wife. They want, you know, all those Jimmy Carter teeth, Mr. Ed, you know.
And at the end of the day, that's where they're gonna come here. If it's not now, that's okay. It's gonna come on our terms.But let's find out if anybody. Listen. You. "If Mr. Pack speaks with authority for a reason, he is an authority, and he knows he's an authority. It doesn't mean he's arrogant, but he's not gonna lend himself, please understand Mr. Zwick, he's not gonna lend himself to guys who are, frankly, gonna embarrass themselvesbut realize there's nobody at the History Channel who will know that they did." That's the kind of stuff you gotta utter. This is a longer letter.
WHB: Yes, sir. No, absolutely.
DCP: "So, Mr. Pack is available if you want him to be if you want him to anchor the thing."
WHB: Okay.
DCP:"He'll give you the highest ratings you've ever thought about. He'll scare your audience. But what's coming's gonna scare your audience. And if you're interested in truly educating your audience, which will give you high ratings, everybody'd be talking about it.
WHB: Right. And he was very quick to admit when he looked at the material that this was why he's in contact with you. Because it gripped--
DCP: At the beginning?
WHB: He's watched through four of them.
DCP: Four of them?
WHB: He watched through...four of them. Each of the YouTube clips on each of the Horsemen. That--
DCP: Part one?
WHB: Part one, yes.
DCP: All the part ones.
WHB: So, he said--
DCP: A lot of part ones were the set-up, even for part two and three. But the introduction set up each of the parts.
WHB: So he's aware of what you've said and everything.
DCP: Well, then, I don't know the guy, and he still wants to listen to--
WHB: Oh, no, we're gonna still say it, though. I think we need to be on record. I need to be. You're not saying this, anyway.
DCP: Yeah.
WHB:I'm saying it.
DCP: Yeah.
WHB: We need to be on record. You know, "I've spoken to Mr. Pack, and I was able to sit down with me today, and we finally been able to get together since I've been back and went over what you propose and [coughing], and I'll show that.” Yeah, absolutely.
[Unknown]
[End]
Dave appeared in Episode 9, “Satan’s Army,” which aired on November 10, 2009. None of his demands were met, but the bait was too tempting to pass up. All his tough talk with Mr. Behrer must not have penetrated beyond the walls. Though, if half these ideas made it to Mr. Zwick’s inbox, it gave him the best chuckle of the day.
The show is currently listed with a more woke-friendly title, “Nostradamus Effect: Cataclysmic End of Human History," on YouTube.
For being the “anchor” of the program, it was an odd editing choice to make the audience wait for 16-minutes before the younger, non-Elijahn Dave blessed them with his apostolic wisdom.
For the morbidly curious, this YouTube link will send you to his first appearance: https://youtu.be/0VQ2kuJPFNQ?t=968
If you dare watch the broadcast, do not blink or get up to fetch another beer because you could miss all his shining moments.
16:20 to 16:32 – 12 seconds
20:43 to 20:54 – 11 seconds
25:40 to 25:49 – 09 seconds
29:44 to 29:58 – 14 seconds
34:54 to 35:11 – 17 seconds
36:56 to 37:04 – 08 seconds
41:08 to 41:12 – 04 seconds
41:25 to 41:33 – 08 seconds
43:01 to 43:12 – 11 seconds
That is a grand total of 94 seconds. One minute and thirty-four seconds of Anchor Response Dave in a 45-minute program. How could they have done it without his vital input?
Mr. Zwick must have understood that Dave was best taken in tiny doses. Otherwise, if you give him the floor, he will presume your ears off for two and half hours.
Despite how they used him on the show, RCG felt proud enough to issue a Press Release that is still on the RCG website.
After listening to the meeting and watching the show, what was presented in that release written by Mr. Behrer is pretty laughable.
My favorite line is:
Commenting on his interview, Mr. Pack stated, “I bring a clear and different viewpoint to the program, and as a result my comments stand apart from the other voices presented.”
“…because I doodie in the toilet, not in my pants.” Okay, I added that last bit, but the point remains valid.
The press release quote is not an accurate representation of physical reality. His comments were used as a biblical book report. He provided the Cliff’s Notes for the Book of Revelation. His apostolic authority and keen insight were reduced to "This happens, and this happens, and this happens."
He may have been "clear," but his "different viewpoint" did not "stand apart” from the cacophony of other voices. And there is a legitimate reason for that.
David C. Pack did not understand the nature of the show, or he would have known the whole series did not focus on the opinions of a single person. The producers shotgunned ten different sources in each episode to present a broader narrative.
Coming from a 30-year production background, I could have warned Dave that nobody on earth can promise how much of an interview they will be able to use in the final product. You do not know what the interviewee will say. You do not know what other “experts” will say. There is a balance of who said what best and measuring it against their screen time.
If he wanted to be on more, he should have offered to grow his hair long and get lip and eyebrow piercings. But sadly, the role of Satan was already filled. However little he appeared in the show, his Participation Award is still pinned on the fridge at Headquarters.
In an ironic twist, had Dave been able to bless The History Channel with his “unique insight” in Episode 9, it would be a source of embarrassment today. Everything he used to teach about the Book of Revelation has been thrown out since.
This includes RCG literature and The World to Come programs that Dave wanted Mr. Zwick to watch. These have been scrubbed from all RCG platforms. This should scream to everyone that a David C. Pack teaching does not age well.
The Nostradamus Effect was written vaguely so they could be creative with the material without having to cite exact sources. Another ironic twist is that since that program aired, Dave has adopted the same language for when he preaches now. “The religious texts suggest…” “Some believe…” “…maybe…”
That kind of phrasing is known as a “proof” in RCG today.
While the entire seven minutes is a character study, a few quotes are worth repeating. Keep in mind that none of Dave’s preconditions were met. NONE.
“You gotta tell him who I am…‘Mr. Pack can't possibly lend his name
to the kind of junk that others will utter on these subjects.’”
“…you've gotta write a pretty slam-bang deal here.
Or they just have to go on without us.
And I will never let myself be part of…”
The History Channel featured a verified false prophet, false apostle, and biblical fraud on their program about what the devil will do in the Last Days. Mr. Behrer really did tell them who he was.
It WAS possible to lend his name because his 94-seconds of junk fit in nicely with the rest of the junk. He got nothing he wanted, but he still did it. Of course, he was going to say “Pretty please” but wanted to play hard-to-get. Getting Dave did not turn out to be that hard.
“‘He's in demand. He's very selective.’”
David C. Pack has never been in demand by anyone. Not then and not now. Not ever. Nor did he prove himself to be “selective.” Especially during this one and only time he was asked to participate in anything outside of RCG. Maybe after having thirteen more years of obscurity under his belt, he would now be available for a Wadsworth Chamber of Commerce ribbon-cutting ceremony downtown.
He would bite on ANYTHING offered to him today. Dr. Timothy D. Ranney is waiting to accept your call at (330) 334-2266. If you accidentally ask to speak with a minister who is not compromised, you will be sent directly to voicemail.
“And I know that I know prophecy better than any man
who has ever drawn breath on planet earth.
I don't count Christ…”
This is before self-becoming Elijah. And That Prophet. And The Greatest Nonsense Ever Told! Series. How could he measure such a claim way back then when all the current-day proofs were not yet available?
Consistently failing for seven years running is a perfect indicator of “I know prophecy better” than a fortune cookie. Wait, I take that back. Fortune cookies laugh at Dave. Even without counting that 2013 indiscretion.
“‘…he is an authority, and he knows he's an authority.
It doesn't mean he's arrogant…’”
There is something uniquely arrogant about a man telling someone else to tell someone else how not-arrogant that arrogant man is. That is some next-level meta-arrogance.
“‘He'll give you the highest ratings you've ever thought about…
everybody'd be talking about it.’”
Granted, Dave did not get used in the way he wanted, and The History Channel wisely did not acknowledge the greatness they were sliding past in the hallway. But, if what Dave said was true, The World to Come program on YouTube and worldtocome.org would have been wildly popular. Some episodes gained significant views for a “tiny little church in Ohio,” but even David C. Pack abandoned that flagship format five years ago.
Just ask: If the content is not of interest to the creator, why should it be of interest to the audience?
Flash forward thirteen years, and Dave is still struggling to gain legitimacy and notoriety. He torpedoed any possibility of biblical legitimacy a long time ago. But, oh boy, is his name getting noticed these days. But not in the way he wants. ;)
Thanks to Mr. Behrer, thirteen years after this conversation was recorded…I’m talking about him. And you are reading about him. Please share with your friends so we can give David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God all the “highest ratings” he can stand.
John Robinson of the Living Church of God finishes a letter to the faithful with this:
Don’t Fall for It All through the ages, Satan has been actively trying to deceive the nations, and one of the deadliest tools in his arsenal is the mixing of satanically inspired ideas with the name of God—in other words, calling the wrong thing by the right name. Despite what Christianity Today claims, Satan does not flee from us when we “have a good time at his expense” with the very practices he has inspired—rather, he flees from us when we resist him (James 4:7).
Let’s remember that God, through His inspired word, makes it very clear that we should never mix other philosophies, holidays, venerations, or rituals with anything that God Himself has ordained. Let’s make sure we do not fall for the traditional formula, and instead heed God’s commands in 2 Corinthians:
Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will dwell in them and walk among them. I will be their God, and they shall be My people.” Therefore “Come out from among them and be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, and I will receive you.” “I will be a Father to you, and you shall be My sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty.” Therefore, having these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God (6:14–7:1). The Traditional Formula
Everything in COGland is a satanic conspiracy. This powerful entity reigns supreme in the COG and in LCG. It is running around deceiving everyone. Jesus always seems to be cowering in the back room somewhere unable to stop satan.
When it comes to deceiving, LCG has been right at the top of the list. From decades of Rod Meredith's end-times scenarios of concentration camps, meat hooks, and parents eating children, to the infamous "within the next 5-10 years" nonsense he was known to spout, Meredith's deception reigned supreme. From abusive leaders/ministers to policies meant to cause division in families and relationships, the LCG, if anything, has been a participant in that so-called satanic deception. When it comes to "filthiness of the flesh" the LCG and the COG as a whole have been right at the top of the list. It's pretty hypocritical to condemn other people of the world when their own houses are just as filthy.
The gene pool at the Philadelphia Church of God compound, through the intermarrying of elite leadership families, exactly like the old Worldwide Church of God elite did, has produced some rather sad cases for ordination. But desperate times in the PCG call for desperate ordinations. The horror stories about this "kid" are all over private Facebook groups, just like the appalling stories of his dad featured on this blog.
Grant Turgeon Ordained Local Elder: October 30, 2022
Grant Turgeon [oldest son of Wayne Turgeon] of the Edmond congregation was ordained a local elder on October 11 by Gerald Flurry and Andrew Locher. He will serve in the Edmond congregation. –[name withheld] Exit and Support Network
In a sermon on the first day of the CGI’s Feast of Tabernacles in Clearwater (CGI was also associated with two other festival sites in Florida), Pastor Bill Watson marveled over the fact that God’s people were still celebrating this festival in 2022. The clear implication being that most of the “old-timers” believed that the Kingdom of God would have been established many years ago by now. This observation was followed by a statement which anyone who is familiar with the history of the Armstrong Church of God culture will find astonishing. Watson declared: “We were falsely accused of actually setting dates, when in fact really we never did, as far as our culture was concerned.”
After that jaw-dropping statement, Watson went on to observe that Christians are currently viewed as an “annoyance” or as “troublemakers.” According to Bill, TRUE Christians don’t go along with the mainstream media. From his perspective, God has revealed HIS TRUTH to the folks in CGI, and they need to tattoo that stuff on their brains! He insists that CGI members can’t allow themselves to swallow the narrative of the world around them. In other words, Christians cannot be woke or politically correct!
What kinds of things did Mr. Watson have in mind? He went on to remind his audience that God created Adam and Eve - NOT Adam and Steve (I know I’ve heard that one somewhere before). Continuing, he went on to make the astute observation that homosexuals “can’t reproduce,” and that it’s consequently an obvious perversion of the biology which God intended. Watson then went on to decry the fact that he can’t say anything about voter fraud, because “we’ll lose our YouTube account.” He then proceeded to make clear that Bill Watson didn’t drink the Kool-Aid on Covid-19. He reiterated his often stated opinion that masks don’t make sense. This, apparently, is what Bill meant when he referred to the fact that Christians like him were now viewed as annoyances and troublemakers; but he also made it very clear that he was not intimidated by these gainsayers. He declared that Christians have got to put “blinders” on so that we don’t get distracted by the noise that these critics generate.
Nevertheless, Pastor Watson did admit that some folks in the Armstrong Church of God movement have been misled by clever individuals. He cited the unnamed leader of the Restored Church of God as an example of just such a deceiver and went on to declare that “any minister…that basically attempts to steer you to follow them - get outta there…because if they are not pointing you to Jesus Christ there’s something very suspicious that’s going on.” You know, despite the awkward wording, I think that Pastor Watson may be on to something with that statement – I kinda liked that one! What do you think?
This post on Twitter indicates that Gerald Flurry's fall out of his bathtub during the Feast is far more serious than they originally let on. Here we are at the end of October and PCG is asking ministry to pray for the despot.
Remember this blast from the past? It was from October 2017. If we think he is crazy now, he was already heading down that road in 2017.
Superfantabulous Dave Pack has announced that if all of the RCG members "stay on fire" by being filled with Dave's messages, they will glow radioactively when his fake "jesus" returns.
Here’s why. If you can stay on fire for the Work before he gets here—avoid getting drunk, or unaware, or sleepy, before he gets here—after he gets here, you’ll glow radioactive, you’ll be so on fire. The test is whether you can stay awake before he gets here; whether you can be accounted worthy during the easy times, like right now. Once they show up, everybody is going to sit bolt upright, come forward on their seat, eyes bugging—all of us. The whole world will, but before he comes, particularly if we are warning about him, it’s going to be tough. The first thing I wanted to say here, is just believe Christ. Apart from Him saying, “Fear not,” believe Him when He says your goal is to be deemed worthy to escape before anything here happens.
