Bad Religion In The Churches of God

Our illustrious mountain man and true prophet, revelator and God's most might witness, E. W. King, talks today about "Bad Religion" using a letter by Herbert W Armstrong.

King seems to feel that by using this letter that he is exposing the world of non-COG Christianity, something he and Bob Thiel love to mock.

He quotes this letter by HWA:

What Has Religion Contributed?

Well, surely we should expect to find, at long last, in religion the knowledge of life's purpose, the true values, and the right ways that should make this world a better world — a happy world — a peaceful world.
  
Here, at last, we must surely find a stabilizing and uplifting influence for society.

Yet, shocking though it be — incredible though it is — if we put the searchlight on the facts, and view them realistically with an open mind, we find here the most sickening disillusionment of all. 

Yes, that sounds exactly like the current state of affairs in the Church of God.  Disillusionment reigns supreme.  Closed mindedness has stifled the growth of the splinter groups, and there is no longer a search for facts.  If it did not happen prior to 1986 it is not worth listening to, reading about or preaching about.

Reluctant though we are to recognize it, we find the established religious organizations which profess the name of Jesus Christ teaching the diametric opposite of His teachings —  condemning the customs He practiced — following, instead, the pagan customs He condemned! 

The churches of the Western world are divided and in confusion. They have not converted, saved, and reformed the whole world as they profess to have been commissioned to do. If that be their mission, they have failed miserably. 

The Churches of God are divided and in confusion.  There is absolutely ZERO unity between any of the groups.  Even exchanging preachers during this past Feast of Tabernacles has produced no unification.

Methodist Bishop Hazen G. Werner once said: "We have been dried out by the hot winds of secularism. We who are to overcome the world have been overcome by the world." 

Armstrongism has been overcome by greed and avarice.  Greedy little men have set themselves up as Popes of their little empires where they deliberately destroy lives to further their goals.  The power and greed of the world has overtaken 

"The Church," said Harvard Divinity School's Dean Miller, "simply does not have a cutting edge [it has thrown away the 'two- edged sword' — the Bible]. It has taken the culture of our time and absorbed it." 

To this, Yale's Chaplain Coffin agrees, "We church men are gifted at changing wine into water — watering down religion." 

This world's so-called Christianity has taken the name of Christ — has proclaimed to the world that Jesus of Nazareth was the Christ — has preached the name of Christ with a Message about His Person — but they have rejected His Gospel — the Gospel God sent for all mankind by Him — the Gospel He taught. 

Armstrongism can't even advance to the point of using the name of Jesus Christ.  If it is about the law or some Old Testament patriarch or leader, then they know everything, but Jesus - not so much.  they cannot even talk about what Jesus did or accomplished.  They claim they are the only ones to talk about the "kingdom", but most every church I know talks about the kingdom an dhow to make it tangible for the downtrodden today.   The Kingdom of Armstrongism is about ruling with "iron rod's", wielding "swords" of power, and whipping people into submission.  Who wants any of that?

Look at the other religions of the world — Buddhism, Shintoism, Taoism, Confucianism, Moslemism, Hinduism, and the others. In most countries where these religions are embraced, we find illiteracy, poverty, degeneration, misery, suffering, despair — general unhappiness. None of them has produced a happy world. They have spawned communal wars, hatreds, and violence.

By Mr. H.W.Armstrong

In the countries and cities where Armstrongism is embraced, we find illiteracy, degeneration, misery, suffering, despair and general unhappiness.  What has the Church of God done to help alleviate that?  NOTHING!  Not one damn thing!

Geoff Neilson: HWA and GTA To Be Reanimated Back To "Life" In January 2014

The other day the news story was all about the bones of St. Peter. 

Peter is now passe. 

Now it is the reanimation of the bones of HWA and GTA 

who will be returning as zombies 

in January 2014 to finish the mighty work.

Geoff Neilson, that wild and crazy guy from South Africa, who credits one year's worth of Ambassador College "education" as his standard of excellence, writes:

Who is The 7th Messenger 

God sends to His Church?

God said He'd 7 Messengers send 

To the 7 Churches before they end 

We know the 6th Apostle came and went 

But who's the 7th of these special men? 

Sent by Heaven they're all Apostles 

So is the last Elijah by definition 

His work God regards so colossal 

It saves Earth from utter destruction 

Jesus said Elijah would restore all things 

Meaning the first to last crucial doctrine 

So that prophet's time had to begin 

With the first endtime Philadelphian 

Asked if he was Elijah the 6th said “No” 

Meaning not the first one, as meant John 

Who was also quite dead when Christ foretold 

Of final Elijah's future Restoration 

For him or Two Witnesses to first come 

In the Beast's Terrible Tribulation 

Is too late to warn Israel's wayward sons  

To escape the penalty of their sin 

Do you remember HWA foresaw? 

'The Temple in 2 Thess 2 is spiritual'  

Then a Man of Sin defiled its ritual 

Thought himself God by 'changing' His Law 

But prophecy is dual it's now clear 

Since the False Prophet must still appear 

And show the world--not himself--untruths 

Camouflaged by 'miracles' the Devil brews 

Did HWA forget the day

--In 1974, that May-- 

When he passed his mantle to GTA? 

Was that the real passing of the baton? 

Christ separating Sixth from Seven?

Ted garnered more Members before his sin

Other than those his father deleavened

After disfellowshipped in 1978

They never spoke or met again 

“To restore all things” means from first to last.

Elijah decides what's to be “held fast” 

That's not the 7th's legal domain 

Ruling out any imposter's false claim 

“The hands of [the endtime] Zerubbabel

have laid the foundation of God's Temple. 

His hands shall also finish it.  Then you, 

will know the LORD sent him too” 

Bible arithmetic doubt overturns 

One man can be the 6th Apostle,  

The First Witness, and Elijah returned 

With God all things are possible 

“Rise from your earthly grave and measure 

the condition of God's Spiritual Temple: 

and the Ministers and Members who worship there” 

Seems to be the Revelation from John's quill 

Something similar happened once before 

After Christ was resurrected from the dead 

Many rose from their graves who kept God's Law 

Then witnessed in Jerusalem, Matthew said 

The Two Witnesses represent 

The last two eras--Christ clearly disclosed 

So who's the 7th Messenger then? 

Surely the Joshua needing clean clothes 

God said He would send only 7. 

6 Messengers + 2 Witnesses = 8. 

So at least one must return hints Heaven 

More likely it's both Armstrong's future fate 

GTA couldn't speak 'til he was three 

His father anointed him and God healed 

His speech was a miracle heard by us all 

The gifts of God are without recall.

If God forgave the sins of this 'Joshua' 

That great act of mercy would signal to all 

No matter how poor or posh they are 

Laodiceans can rise from their fall 

The Two Witnesses 1260-day ministry 

Will be miraculous from start to end 

Rising from the dead would show you and me 

They are both prophets--if again sent 

Sealing their place in Church of God history 

Herbert Armstrong prophesied far more 

Than all the Bible prophets combined 

Of God's World To Come and of things before 

So how could he not be one of their kind? 

As the men Jesus trained were His disciples 

As the prophet's books are God's not their's 

So the Work of Elijah's disciples 

Is first accrued to his account not their's. 

He's the Philadelphia Apostle 

The final Elijah, the start-to-finish- 

Temple-building Zerubbabel 

The Voice Crying in the Wilderness: 

“Prepare the way of the Eternal” 

Who else in the Church is so well known 

By top people in Jerusalem? 

What other ministers Royal Lineage own? 

Which from esteemed King David stems 

Is that why it says: “When this comes to pass, 

You'll know a prophet has been among you”? 

Meaning you knew him sometime in the past 

When he made plain and restored God's Truth 

No-one since has kept the Church united 

Though some claim to be Heaven's sole earthly voice 

Are they failing the test in Scripture cited? 

Echoing the Fallen Angel's wrong choice 

As the Joseph Tribes increasingly fall 

As Assyria spreads her eagle wings.

Remember when and how you were called 

And who first prophesied all these things 

Jan 2014 may the answer provide 

One Sun Cycle after HWA died 

Will he return with his son at his side? 

Turn the hearts of many a Jew and Gentile 

Lead the way to the Christ they denied 

What if this is the final test of your heart and mine? 

Would we follow Elijah-who's-come a second time? 

Would our new loyalties seem more sublime? 

Or would we be Philadelphians? 

Measured by Zerubbabel's plumbline 

The first and last words are the LORD's: 

“He that receives a prophet 

in the name of a prophet, 

shall receive a prophet’s reward” 

“He that receives whomsoever I send 

receives me; 

and he that receives me

receives Him that sent me”

 Geoffrey R. Neilson 

geoffneilson@gmail.com 

Cape Town 20 November 2013

Back In Print: The Edges of Seventh-day Adventism Separatist Groups

For those interested:

The Edges of Seventh-Day Adventism: A Study of Separatist Groups Emerging from the Seventh-Day Adventist Church (1844-1980) Including the Worldwide Church of God, the Ford and Brinsmead Controversies, as Well as the Massacre of David Koresh & His Follower

Amazon has this to say:

Lowell Tarling wrote ‘Edges’ for that most wonderful of all author incentives – insatiable curiosity. Combined with a quest for enlightenment, he undertook a subject few would have chosen—the history of those people and groups that separated from the Seventh-day Adventist church. Of necessity, this also includes touching on the history of the mainstream Seventh-day Adventist church. Lowell’s education and early adult experiences were deeply entwined with the Seventh-day Adventist church. However, it would be a mistake to assume that his writing on the subject suffers from any degree of bias. There is a sense that he took on the role of bystander, and this essentially gave him a valuable degree of separation and objectivity. Methodical in his approach and relentless with regard to research, Lowell delivers a surprising, connective, inside view of a divisive period in the growth and emergence of the separatist groups that were spawned within the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Sparing nothing, he pares back the layers of doctrine, dogma and the heated nature of the schisms in the church. He deftly reveals the angst, divergence and egotism; but also humanity, desire for truth and humility. For all of these were present in the interchanges that shaped not only those movements that separated, but also the Seventh-day Adventist church. The first edition of ‘Edges’ was published in 1981. Reprinted now to a generation who did not share the past struggles is indeed worthwhile. It is because of the conflict and debate of those times that they now sit in the pews of churches of their choice, where ‘saved by grace alone’ is integral and unchallenged. Essentially, emergence from dissension is a human experience. It occurs with every doctrine, creed or organisation. There is a wider view - this is not only the history and narrative of one church’s crises. It touches wherever we are in life. Ultimately, it is impossible to ignore the authenticity of Lowell’s search. We sense that it means more than a disengaged treatise on a topic of interest. In the end it matters less whether he found viable answers to a religious dilemma. It is significant that he had the courage to ask questions. Above all, it is notable that at the close of the book he chose the words spoken by Christ, ‘Whosoever will, may come’.

Buy it here:  The Edges of Seventh-day Adventism Separatist Groups

Crazy Church of God Beliefs: Peter Buried on Bricket Wood Campus?

Every once in a while a new story will pop up that tells of another Church of God legend that is completely bonkers in reality.

The other day this was sent to me:

Many years ago there was an article in the PT or possibly the Good News that stated that the Vatican way way back  sent what they said were the remains of Peter to England. The article claimed that they were buried on what became the AC campus at Bricket Wood. Does anyone else remember this?  This was a long time ago so I don't remember the details of how this took place.

I have never heard this and I have to say this is the stupidest thing I have heard in ages.  They lengths people go to to try and legitimize the beliefs of Armstrongism is amazing.  I guess this was to further solidify the British Israelism malarkey that the church used to believe.

Its no wonder people fall for the lies of David C. Pack, Gerald Flurry and others. If they believe these kind of stupid stories they will believe anything these fraudulent "ministers" tell them.

Will Gerald Six-Pack Flurry now uses this to try and buy the Bricket Wood campus?  So far he has failed to buy anything. Will he now lie to his members and tell them that he is seeking to preserve the burial place of Peter?

Dennis muses...

“Sit down before fact as a little child, be prepared to give up every preconceived notion, follow humbly wherever and to whatever abysses nature leads, or you shall learn nothing”

Thomas Huxley

Remember when you "came into the truth"?   I certainly recall as a teen being asked "just how did you come to the truth?"   Decades later, of course, I came to realize it wasn't THE Truth at all.  It was A BELIEF for the time and it certainly was a then "Present Truth", but it was not the truth. It was what I thought was true, but it did not hold up to the facts as time and my own desire to know more played out.   There were many many more facts to sit down before yet to come to challenge my preconceived notions of that truth.  It did lead to an abyss.  I learned a lot.  Faith is what one has, it seems, before the facts sweep it away.  Faith is what one has in the world of mostly untestable religious beliefs and views.  If you could actually test it, it would not be faith.  

We are all familiar with the way one "proves" one's faith.  You give tithes and offerings and the scripture promises that this will be the proof of God's reality.  Just see how the windows of heaven open up for you.  Another way was to call for the elders of the Church when you were afraid you were going to die of some malady.  "And the prayer of faith will save the sick and the sick shall be made well."  There, that does it.  Of course that opened the door for endless and ridiculous views on the roll of doctors and medicine but I spare you. I can only speak for me, but I saw NOT ONE miraculous and obvious healing of a major illness that did not simply play itself out either to getting better or death.  I know..."Well duh, YOU weren't...."  We usually are left with getting the Deity off the hook for having not proved anything in this way by saying such things as one did not have the proper faith, we have to ask according to His will and it wasn't or you can't just give to get.   No matter, the Deity always comes off smelling like a rose no matter what and the poor human who was asked to prove something by doing something is still found defective in their faith or asking or dead..but thanks for playing. 

At any given moment in time, everyone is content with their present truth, or they would move on.  Churches are filled with good folk who totally accept what they hear every week no matter how untestable or untenable the story is. The members of Apostle Dave Pack's RCG are extreme examples of just how silly this reality can get.  Some feel that stirring of discontent and quietly reserve their judgment as they search out the matter as that is their nature to do so.  Most don't have that nature.  Like Dave Pack, who surrounds himself with "agreers", most Churches are filled with "accepters."   There is no curiosity that there may be more to the story or that the old old story may really be out of date for what we can know know.  What holds most in place with old old stories is the fear of being wrong or having to reconstruct a belief system that  eases the fear, quilt, shame and anxiety we thought we had gotten under control with the last belief system.  People get angry and very defensive when new facts challenge old beliefs.  They can easily dismiss the "facts"  as they would see them and cling more tightly to "the truth."  It's how we think and what we do when facts make us insecure or even angry.  One can know they are not dealing with the facts when all they can come up with is sarcasm, anger and accusations when starring into the abyss.  In my experience in the difference between religion and good research in a matter is that when good research is not as good as it should be, what was learned is added to the fund of knowing but then one keeps looking.  That's called progress.  When the research or understanding of the who, what, where, when, why and how of the Bible is brought into question, you deny the problem and kill the messenger. It is why religion is a stuck thing and the same, yesterday, today and forever. 

“It is not that I'm so smart. But I stay with the questions much longer.” 
― Albert Einstein

I can't help but wonder what is going through the mind of a Dave Pack after his most recent theological blundering about him being the real Joshua the High Priest of Haggai and the one true church that will be the magnet that retrieves all the poor disillusioned and lost COG splinter types.   While Mr. Pack may be able to buy a little time by reworking his puzzle or digging deeper into the code, he was very badly mistaken and deluded and simply is not the kind  of personality that can admit that.  He was correct, as he thinks, about the prophecy and the prophecy is still "on", but he was wrong in the TIMING.  It's always the timing isn't it...

Dave's God tricked him, or at least left him out of the loop on a few matters of importance in this whole matter.  I love the phrase he uses, "additional expansive elements."  There are always those aren't there when a man makes a fool out of himself and can't find an easy way out by simply saying, "I was mistaken."  Adding an "I apologize" would be unthinkable because that would indicate the mere humanness of the man and we can't have that.  We're talking Apostle and Joshua a High Priest as spoken of by Haggai the Prophet here! After all, if one is wrong about something as overarching and awesome as this, what else might they be wrong about?

The human ego bound up in religion and even more so in the kind of ministry run by a Dave Pack simply can not allow itself to be wrong.  Apostle Pack can no sooner be wrong than he can lose. Herbert Armstrong never could either.  He got out of accepting the fact he was wrong by insisting that "God has revealed new truth."  "New Truth" is what you come up with in religion to excuse the mistaken notions of the old error.  When a man speaks the words "New Truth" in religion, it just means he is making adjustments so he won't lose too many folk and income over his mistaken notions of himself or what he thinks he sees in scripture about himself or his calling.  For a man in this day and age to see himself spoken of in the Bible is insanity.  It never ends well.

In the Bible one is challenged by ...

I Kings 18:21

New International Version

Elijah went before the people and said, "How long will you waver between two opinions? If the LORD is God, follow him; but if Baal is God, follow him." 

...but there are many more than just two opinions in this world.  Either/or is not the path to truth either.  In the text it says "but the people said nothing."  Good on them!  Perhaps they were unsure of the outcome and were holding off a bit..  Perhaps some liked Baal and the Priests .  One never hears about  the Priestesses in the tale who were not killed and probably were the prize for the winning god.  This tale may have been a pissing contest between two gods who wanted to date the same girl.   But the idea here that there are just two choices , one of which is "the truth" is simply not how life works.  Besides, the God of Elijah who did such things and demanded much from the people has given way to new concepts of God and new truths about the evolution of that god in our world today.  If Jesus was the "God of the Old Testament,"  ( *He was not nor ever claimed to be) he since had discovered much new truth about himself and changed His and perspectives big time. 

Dave Pack, as do others, implies that you are either in his truth, which of course is identical to the true God's truth, or you are not.  His infinitesimal and insignificant Church is the True one.  Everyone else, in all the other true ones aren't true at all. If they don't follow Dave they aren't even sincere and if they are in ministry, they are of the devil.  Personally I have never met anyone in any church who admitted to being in the wrong or false church. It's just not how we think when we join ourselves to something.   What a silly mess these men make of religion.  Humans minds don't get much smaller than this.  Small minded folk fight back with "Some people are so open minded their brains fall out."  That works better for me frankly.  I'd rather have my brain filled up and flowing over than atrophy. As I have noted in the past, men like Dave Pack never liked or read a book they didn't write. Book is being generous.  They are the Booklet Churches of God.  In Dave's case, it is the Plagiarized Booklet Church of God.  Or maybe the Xerox Church of God. 

Sitting down before the facts as we can best and possibly know the facts of anything is not what grown men usually do in a religious context.  The Bible is FULL of warnings and threats to not do that. It's why things are labeled as "a mystery" but it also means stay in your place.  "We see in part," also works to keep one in place because it implies there is no real  reason to "search out a matter" and besides, that's only for Kings and Apostles to do, but it also really just means, stay in your seat.   You haven't lived until you read Dave Pack's article on why truth can only come through Apostles.  Actually he keeps an arms length from saying much about it himself as the whole thing is just HWA quotes on the topic.  Dave has some wiggle room but he won't ever use it unless he gets desperate to seem like he will take the views of others into consideration. After all, this is the man who tells us as if it was a good thing that in his world, there will be no study papers, no committees and no theological discussions that he does not come up with first.   One grows in Dave Pack's kind of grace and knowledge and not your own. 

 Most religious folk don't really grow in knowledge.  Most COG types don't grow much in grace much either.  It's a dirty word.  They certainly don't do it as a little child though they would have you believe they do.  Most people don't give up their current truths because they are , to them, eternal truths and not subject to examination or change.  "I change not" is often taken out of context to justify the stubbornness and arrogance we see in such mindsets.  

Few are willing to stare into the abyss.  Some call it "the dark night of the soul."  Some, "a midlife crisis..."  Either way, not to stare into that occasional abyss is a formula for getting stuck thinking one has all of life and all things God figured out.  Very few realize that just because the Bible says this or that, does not mean that is really the truth of the matter. "God said it, I believe it, that settles it for me," is a slippery slope when one is forced to consider whether a real God or just Priests and Prophets said that for their own reasons or in a delusional state.

Most don't like where starring into the abyss of religion or theology can take them.  They are told the same thing over and over and over and over, week after week after week after week until there is no room to sit before anything and reconsider it.  How many sermons and "Refreshers", which were exhausting, did I sit through where all I could come up with was "Oh God...not this again."

Life in the typical Church of God and most fundamentalist churches is the formula for learning nothing because there is nothing more to learn.  But there always is....

*Footnote:

When Moses, in the story, asked God who it was that he should tell the the people sent him, we have the hugely overblown and theologically analyzed statement of "tell them 'I am that I am' sent you,"  In that culture, when a man could trick the god into giving out his name, the man could have come control over the god.  In effect the God, knowing this, merely said in Hebrew, "it is none of your business who I am..."  It was not meant to be the huge doctrinal statement it evolved into.

A Reader Here is STUNNED That No One Cares About All The Erect Penises In Our Architecture

Anonymous said... 

I am STUNNED at the sheer level of ignoranece being displayed here on this blog! Have you people got nothing better to do than to attack other Christians (in this instance the Living Church of God) who are actually telling you the truth about hidden phallic symbolism within the Christian churches?

This is NOT just the Living Church of Gods interpretation! Read the following quote - (that's if the ignorant 'Christian' rabid rabble on this forum can actually read above that of the level of a 6 year old) -

Hargrave Jennings (1817-1890) a British Freemason, Rosicrucian and author on occultism and esotericism, talks about phallic symbols in his book 'Phallicism, Celestial and Terrestrial, Heathen and Christian:'


"The spires and pinnacles with which our old churches are decorated indeed, all uprights, including all the architectural families, and the varieties of tors, towers, and steeples, the especial mark and glory of Christian building, come from these ancient symbols. They are everywhere indicative of the Phallus, or index-finger denoting the “Fire”, the aspiring fire, against the inclination of gravity, which was the first vitalized idea, or Idol, worshiped magically and philosophically, the enlivening, godlike Power.”

(Hargrave Jennings, Phallicism: Celestial and Terrestrial; Heathen and Christian and its Connection with the Rosicrucian and the Gnostics and its foundation in Buddhism, p. 72, 1884), (Hargrave Jennings, Rosicrucian and Gnostic Meanings Of The Obelisk, Pyramids, And Phallic Monuments, 1884)

http://www.jesusisfreedom.net/secret-worship-to-sun-god-ra-in-churches-and-temples.html

December 4, 2013 at 10:54 AM