Wednesday, June 18, 2025

Crybaby Milquetoast Prophet Still Mad A Year Later For Being Called Out As A False Prophet


I just can't win! The sun is shining brightly here in California, and I've gone and caused our crybaby prophet to pitch another hissy fit over a post from a year ago or more. Never has the church had a more delicate and easily offended self-appointed prophet than we have in the Great Bwana Bob Thiel! Sheesh! Grow a pair!

The Delicate Milquetoast writes:

Last year, I saw the following headline from Gary Leonard at the anti-Church of God, Banned by HWA website:

Our milquetoast prophet deceitfully fails to go on and add why he was really upset. There was a video by a pro-HWA group that debunked Bob Thiel claim that he is a prophet when HWA blatantly says there are NO prophets in the church today, but there are a LOT of false prophets!

Holy milquetoast prophet, Batman! Banned has done it again! That Gary is such a BAD person! Stop picking on Bob, you agent of Satan! 
 
Apparently, God's greatest gift to the Church of God popped his self-righteous cork big time over the video produced by a pro-Herbert Armstrong site that took the Great Bwana Bob and other self-appointed COG prophets to the woodshed and gave them all a royal Philadelphian spanking.


This video completely humiliates Bob's claims and correctly points out that since the Bible is complete, there is no need for prophets. The Great Milquetoast Self-Appointed Prophet goes on to sanctimoniously to state this:

Of course, the criteria for a prophet comes from the word of God, the Bible, and not statements from the late Pastor General of the old Radio/Worldwide Church of God, Herbert W. Armstrong.

You can see exactly why no Church of God ever chose to ordain the rebellious anti-government Bob Thiel! Herbert would have kicked Bob's sanctimonious little ass to the curb so fast his big fat Bible would not have had time to hit the ground as he flew through the air.

The Great Milquetoast Bwana then says this while calling out Herbert as being wrong, again. Bob does this in order to stop up his illegitimate self-appointment as a church leader and a prophet.

Now, yes, Herbert W. Armstrong at least once declared that there were no prophets in WCG and no doctrinal need for them. Furthermore, here is what he said in a Bible Study on 1 Corinthians on July 18, 1980:

THE CHURCH IS FOUNDED ON THE APOSTLES AND THE PROPHETS
Paul is speaking to the Church. Now the Church of God was raised up primarily for two purposes: that God could call to lead the Church, apostles, the Church is founded on the foundation of the apostles and the prophets, the prophets of the Old Testament; because no prophet in the New Testament has anything to do with infusing doctrine into the Church or with an administrative position in the Work of the Church. No prophet had anything to do with any of that; so, the prophets mean, the prophets of the Old Testament. They did not preach to Israel. Israel rejected their writings, ancient Israel. The writings of the prophets, beginning with Isaiah and even other prophets – no you could say with Moses for that matter, and with David in the Psalms. All were for the New Testament Church, believe it or not, and yet today they want to say that we are a New Testament Church; and we don’t want anything to do with that Old Testament. 
 
Let me tell you this is the book of God. Now the Old Testament Church couldn’t proclaim the gospel. The Old Testament Church did not have the Holy Spirit, that’s true; but the prophets did and they were writing for the doctrines of the Church and much of Church doctrine comes from the writings of the prophets; Christ being the chief cornerstone and the Head of the Church. Now just keep that in the background as we begin to read what Paul is writing to one of the Churches. 
 
The bolded portion above is not biblically correct. The Apostle Paul was a prophet and so seemingly was the evangelist Timothy. So those prophets did have administrative as well as doctrinal responsibilities.

Because the milquetoast prophet self-appointed himself as a church leader, he therefore has administrative and doctrinal responsibilities which PROVES he is a true prophet. Once a liar, always a liar.

Milquetoast Bob then runs to Aaron Dean to find legitimacy.

Furthermore, I did discuss Herbert W. Armstrong’s “no prophet” position with his long time aide, Aaron Dean (who HWA also ordained). Aaron Dean basically told me that Herbert W. Armstrong was annoyed by various ones who contacted him claiming to be a prophet and he wanted people to stop doing that. However, Aaron Dean also said that Herbert W. Armstrong was not intending to teach that there would be no more prophets or that they would not have a role in the church as we got closer to the end.

Milquetoast Bob goes on to thump his puny little chest:

I have never been a false prophet and urge all to check out what I have taught with the Bible. 
 
Because I am an imperfect human being and one may not agree with all of my views does NOT make me a false prophet.

The Great Bwana is like all of the other milquetoast false prophets in the church today. As long as they couch statements with "could be, may be, might be, possibly be's" then their puny little asses are off the hook. They aren't! Every single self-appointed Church of God prophet has been and currently are liars! That is a simple fact that CANNOT be refuted! 

A true prophet would not need to be from a major theological institution, have the most magnanimous personality, or have a large or impressive Church, but would be the type willing to meet in members’ homes. He also does not have to have had a ministerial background. Or does the prophet even, like apparently the Apostle Paul per 2 Corinthians 10:10 and 11:6 or Moses per Exodus 4:10 or Jeremiah per Jeremiah 1:6, need to be a great speaker. God chooses who His prophets are.

God certainly chooses who his prophets are, but you are NOT one. That is a fact and one more thing that CANNOT be refuted! 

Milquetoast Bob then continues to dig the hole deeper with his asinine reasoning:

A true prophet is under God’s authority. A true New Testament prophet has had hands laid upon him/her and received special anointing under God’s inspiration. You can not anoint yourself nor come up with doctrine that contradicts the Bible (cf. Revelation 22:18-19) like at least three self-declared, supposed, COG “prophets” (Gerald Flurry, William Dankenbring, and Ronald Weinland) and false predictors (like Harold Camping) have falsely done. God’s prophets are true to the Bible–“Scripture cannot be broken” (John 10:35). 
 
It should be understood that although some of the prophets in the Hebrew scriptures did miracles, and some of the apostles in the Greek scriptures were also prophets, not all ever did (e.g. John 10:41). 
 
But God sometimes does things more quietly.
For example, although Elijah was looking for some dramatic sign (1 Kings 19:11-13), instead God used ”a still small voice” (1 Kings 19:12). Although Elijah accepted that God worked that way (1 Kings 19:13-18), most of the Laodiceans do not. Dreams would be consistent with a “still small voice.”

Dreams after a bad night of sushi is not god inspired. 

Milquetoast Bob's anger is not only directed towards little ol'me, he still has a HUGE burr up his butt with Rod Meredith.

Unlike Herbert W. Armstrong who restored truths to the Philadelphia era, and Bob Thiel who added more details to those truths, etc. Dr. Meredith did not do that. Nor did he fulfill the prophetic office. Nor has anyone currently in LCG done so. Yet, Dr. Meredith wrote that someone had to.On October 3, 2008, Dr. Meredith (then Presiding Evangelist of the Living Church of God) called me and said to me, “God may consider you to be a prophet.” It was Dr. Meredith who first brought up the topic about Bob Thiel being a prophet. 
 
Dr. Meredith must have brought it up again as an email I sent him on November 16, 2008 stated, “Now, you have mentioned to me a couple of times that God may regard me as a prophet. And, of course, it was you and not I that first brought that subject up.” 
 
In late January/early February 2009, Dr. Meredith told me over the telephone that if he (Dr. Meredith) raised his title to the office of apostle, he was considering ordaining me (Bob Thiel) as a prophet. He apparently was unwilling to do the ordination without him being above me. But, of course, his position should not have been relevant–but it was to him. 
 
On February 4, 2009, Dr. Meredith told me over the telephone, “You have an in-depth understanding of prophecy and details of church history. You could be a prophet–that may be what God will have you do.” He also asked me to pray then that he would live another 7-15 years then–I prayed and he did (he died on May 18, 2017–just a little over 8 years later). 
 
In the Summer of 2009, Dibar Apartian told me that Dr. Meredith had been stating in top level meetings that Bob Thiel may be a prophet. Around this time, I had a prophetic dream related to Dr. Meredith.

Top people in the Living Church of God have said that Rod Meredith NEVER said Bob was a prophet! Rod Meredith rebuked Bob many times over.

Anyway, no, HWA’s word do not make mincemeat of my prophetic role. Herbert W. Armstrong believed that there would be future prophets, Aaron Dean confirmed that, Roderick C. Meredith said that God may consider me to be one, and that had the concurrence of Richard Ames (who HWA ordained) and Dr. Douglas Winnail (who had some type of ordination when HWA was alive). 
 
Despite improper accusations from various ones on the internet that I am some type of a false prophet, to the best of my knowledge I have never once posted a false prediction (and I do try to indicate when something is speculation), nor do those critics actually post any “false” predictions that I supposedly made and provide proof that even one was false. Thus, those who love the truth will not listen to their false dismissals.

Note that Bob is still lying when he tries to claim Gaylyn Bonjour's blessing set him apart to start a new church, be a priest, etc, things with Bonjour had NO intention of happening. 

This is also consistent with the following from the Apostle Paul:

14 Do not neglect the gift that is in you, which was given to you by prophecy with the laying on of the hands of the eldership. (1 Timothy 4:14, NKJV)
14 Do not be careless about the gifts with which you are endowed, which were conferred on you through a divine revelation when the hands of the elders were placed upon you. (1 Timothy 4:14, Weymouth)
14 Make use of that grace in you, which was given to you by the word of the prophets, when the rulers of the church put their hands on you. (1 Timothy 4:14, BBE)
6 Therefore I remind you to stir up the gift of God which is in you through the laying on of my hands. (2 Timothy 1:6, NKJV) 
 
The Radio Church of God reported:

God gives special gifts — special powers of His Spirit — to those who are set apart by the laying on of hands. Remember that it was by the laying on of hands that Timothy received the added ability, called “prophecy” by the King James translators. (Ellis WH. Why We Have the Laying on of Hands Ceremony. Good News Magazine April-May 1965) 
 
Furthermore, I did not anoint myself– LCG minister Gaylyn Bonjour anointed me of December 15, 2011 with oil and prayed I would receive a double-portion of God’s Spirit (which he said was reminiscent of the passing of the mantle)–hence I am not self-ordained, but am God-ordained.

There you have it! Bow down at the feet of the Doubly Blessed, Self-Appointed, Illegitimately Ordained Holy Milquetoast Bob. He be da man! 





Tuesday, June 17, 2025

Should you divest yourself of all financial assets and give everything to the Church?



All Things in Common?


If you are a true Christian, should you divest yourself of all financial assets and give everything to the Church? When you die, should you leave all (or the majority) of your estate to the Church? Does God need your financial resources to do His work? More importantly, does God expect you to give your money to the Church, some individual, or a particular organization? Were early Christians practical communists? What does Scripture reveal about the financial practices of the early Church - First Century Christianity?

Unfortunately, too many folks in leadership positions within the Christian Community have staked claim to a substantial part of their followers' income. It is, of course, obviously in their self-interest to make sure that their ministry has a reliable and substantial income available to finance their ministries. In this way, many of these ministries have accumulated great wealth and have used those resources for whatever they deem as appropriate/needful.

Even more alarming, many of the groups which are supported by small flocks of people have resorted to some of the most draconian requirements for their membership to remain in good standing with leadership (smaller groups need a bigger chunk of each individual member's pie). Moreover, all fundraising and donations are usually portrayed as obligatory and/or being devoted to God (the human leader or group is rarely even mentioned (If he/she is mentioned, it's usually in their role as "God's servant" or "God's representative" on earth)!

In this connection, it is essential that we understand the tithing system which was used by the ancient Israelite as outlined in Torah, and that we examine the New Testament Scriptures which relate to the finances of the ekklesia of the First Century. Indeed, without this foundation, it would be impossible to formulate any kind of financial system and legitimately attribute it to Almighty God! Remember too, that ANY interpretations of the passages of Scripture offered by many of these ministries we've been discussing were/are motivated by a desire to maximize their income!

First, in terms of God's covenant with the Israelites, we must remember that this particular iteration of God's Law (Torah) was designed for a primitive, agrarian culture surrounded by a bunch of decentralized, polytheistic, and pagan societies. As part of the religious system, which was formulated for them, a tithe or "tenth" of their crops and livestock were to be devoted to sustaining the priestly class and the central sanctuary (Tabernacle at first and Temple at Jerusalem later) outlined in Torah. We should also note that this system was premised on the pre-existing ownership of land, livestock, and seed. Moreover, it was based on whatever INCREASE the farmer experienced over the course of a year. In other words, a large portion of their wealth was excluded from the formula.

Even so, we must also remember that Gentiles had no such tradition to draw upon and were never required to tithe on their income and send the proceeds to the central sanctuary in Jerusalem. Moreover, under the terms of the New Covenant, both Jewish and Gentile Christians were NEVER made subject to the Levitical Priesthood of the Old Covenant. Hence, the notion that the tithing system designed for that priesthood and Temple's support was ever transferred to ANY Christian ministry is purely speculative and NOT supported by Scripture.

Now, we come at last to the Church described in the New Testament. In the book of Acts, after Peter's Pentecost Sermon and the large influx of Jewish converts into the Church, we read: And they devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. And awe came upon every soul, and many wonders and signs were being done through the apostles. And all who believed were together and had all things in common. And they were selling their possessions and belongings and distributing the proceeds to all, as any had need. And day by day, attending the temple together and breaking bread in their homes, they received their food with glad and generous hearts, praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved.(Acts 2:42-47, ESV) Notice, that the decision to have all things in common and sell possessions was a collective one. It wasn't imposed on the membership by the Apostles, and it was distributed according to need within the membership of the Church. In other words, this practice was a spontaneous reaction of the people to the needs of some of the less fortunate among them.

Indeed, the impression that this feeling was general and spontaneous among the earliest Christians is reinforced by what we find in the fourth chapter of the same book. We read there: Now the full number of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one said that any of the things that belonged to him was his own, but they had everything in common. And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all. There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold and laid it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need. Thus Joseph, who was also called by the apostles Barnabas (which means son of encouragement), a Levite, a native of Cyprus, sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet. (Acts 4:32-37, ESV) Once again, we see that this was a collective decision of the extant membership, and that the proceeds went to address the needs of the less fortunate among them. Moreover, we are told that a disciple named Barnabas sold some land and brought the entire proceeds of that sale "and laid it at the apostles' feet."

Then, in the very next chapter, we read the story of another transaction by a married couple named Ananias and Sapphira (Acts 5:1-11). As we read over this story, it is implied that the couple colluded to withhold part of the proceeds of their sale of land for themselves and make it appear that they had made the same kind of offering that Barnabas had made. Nevertheless, according to the account, Peter confronted them about their deception and told them that they hadn't lied to him - that they had lied to the Holy Spirit! In the account, husband and wife both drop dead on the spot as an example of Divine punishment for their prevarication! Even so, notice that it is NOT suggested anywhere in this account that such offerings were a requirement imposed upon the membership by Peter or the other apostles. And, finally, we should note that there was a widespread (and mistaken) impression among the apostles and early disciples that Christ would return in their lifetime. Hence, their willingness to part with worldly wealth was understandable.

Did Jesus Christ have anything to say on the question of Christian giving? He certainly did. He said that Christian giving should be motivated by a desire to please God and help others, and NOT to receive notoriety, gratitude, or accolades from others (Matthew 6:1-4). Christ also taught his disciples that a small amount from someone with limited resources was worth more in God's eyes than a large contribution from someone who was wealthy (Luke 21:1-4).

"Wait, didn't Jesus endorse tithing for New Covenant Christians in the Gospel of Matthew?" our legalistic friends will demand. The answer is an emphatic "NO!" The passage to which they are referring is found in the twenty-third chapter of that book. We read there: Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cumin and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. You blind guides, straining out a gnat and swallowing a camel! (Matthew 23:23-24, ESV) First point, who is Christ addressing here? Jewish scribes and Pharisees - folks who are supposed to be operating under the terms of the Old Covenant (Torah)!!! Christ is clearly portrayed here as criticizing the behavior and hypocrisy of Jewish religious leaders. In fact, his remarks were intended to be illustrative of behaviors and attitudes which his disciples should NOT imitate! In other words, the scribes and Pharisees should have been doing those things (including tithing).

Likewise, Christ's apostles taught that Christian giving should be focused on helping others in need and should be done willingly and with joy - NOT out of a sense of obligation, or to fulfill the requirements of some commandment, or in anticipation of some future reward for doing so (II Corinthians 9:7, James 1:27, I John 3:17). Paul's letters to the Christians of Corinth demonstrate that he regularly took up offerings to help Christians in need (I Corinthians 16:1-2, II Corinthians 8:1-14, 9:1-14). Now, Paul was certainly entitled to personal support for his ministry as an apostle of Jesus Christ. Nevertheless, we find him on a number of occasions working to support himself - so that he wouldn't be a financial burden to the brethren of the Church (Acts 18:1-4, I Thessalonians 2:9, I Timothy 5:17-18). And, like Christ, Paul also felt that giving to the Church should NOT infringe on a person's ability to take care of his/her own family (Mark 7:9-13, I Timothy 5:8)!

Thus, we have seen that Christian giving was intended by Christ and his apostles to be a voluntary contribution to help others in need, and to supply the physical needs of the ministry (food, clothing, shelter). Christ and his apostles NEVER commanded their followers to tithe and/or send their money to headquarters. We've also seen that the Scriptural principles behind these freewill offerings precludes using them to support an opulent lifestyle for ministers (like mansions, crystal chandeliers, designer clothing, expensive cars, air-conditioned dog houses), support an organizational bureaucracy, pay for a leader's pet projects, a fancy television studio, a private jet, etc., etc. We have seen that neither Christ nor his apostles endorsed a kind of communist program for the ekklesia or required that believers contribute a certain percentage of their income to support the Church. What should we all have in common? Love for each other and compassion for those in need!

by Miller Jones/Lonnie C Hendrix 

Sunday, June 15, 2025

PCG Cult Places Their Celtic Dance Troupe In Danger By Sending Them On Propaganda Tour To Israel

 


The Philadelphia Church of God has been pretending that Celtic Dance is going to convert hordes of new members and that it is a unique way of presenting the gospel message to the world.

They recently shipped off the entire troupe to Israel to put on performances there to open the eyes of the Jewish nation to the holy dance of David and how their heritage is buried in a Hill Tara, in Ireland, where Jeremiah supposedly took the Ark of the Covenant and buried it.

Little did PCG know that almost as soon as they arrived on Haifa that Israel was going to bomb the everliving daylight out of the Islamic filth in Iran that has been threatening the world and holding the Persian people captive. But, the show MUST go on! God will protect them as a witness to the church and the world!

Currently the PCG is having its Irish dance production in Israel. They have two shows remaining, “Be’er Sheva” on the 16th and “Jerusalem” on the 17th. The dance crew consists predominately of minor children who are forced by their parents and church leadership to preform. The Flurrys have discovered a new way to create revenue utilizing child labor! Any reasonable, responsible, loving “leader” would have immediately recalled all plans pertaining to Israel when the President of the United States ordered the relocation of all personnel in the Middle East. But not Gerald Flurry, or Stephen and Amy, or Brad Macdonald. No! The show must go on!

On X, in response to being called out for their careless, greedy actions, the Celtic Throne account posted a picture of them performing the day prior in Haifa, claiming the “Celtic Throne Family were all happy, healthy and safe!” This, only hours ahead of Iran’s retaliations. This is a fantastic example of how they attempt to control the narrative and gaslight its members (who by the way are not permitted to have Smartphones and are encouraged to make the Trumpet.com and other PCG resources their primary news source). 
 
I’m sure in the end they, along with the majority of Israelis and visitors, will most likely be safe; however, it will not be because God protected them because they are a “special and called out people” as they will claim, but because Israel has an incredibly advanced military and intelligence team! Thanks to the IDF, Mossad and the US and UK, the Celtic throne children will probably be fine, but just watch to see PCG spin the entire dastardly situation into a faith building MIRACLE! –T. C.

The PCG boasted how well received the program was in Haifa, Israel, all with a standing ovation. 

The Philadelphia Church of God Parody Account on X, noted that the PCG had to cancel its last two shows in Israel because of the threats from Iran.

They also had this:

 

This was PCG gloating about the show in Tel Aviv. All of the Israelis in attendance immediately converted to the PCG and are now sending tithes to Gerald Flurry so he can dig up patriarch Jeremiah's ark buried in Ireland! Amazing!

One person on Facebook who knows some of the male dancers said that "this is a closeted gay boy's dream to be part of this production. A lot of pumping iron with the bros at the gym in order to look good on stage and revel in the adulation."


There is no doubt that these young men and women, as well as the smaller kids, are talented, but this is NOT preaching any gospel message to anyone. This is the PCG gaslighting their members into thinking this is gospel preaching so that they will continue to send in money to fund the elite children of the church as props for a failing cult of Armstrongism.

While the audience will stand, clap, and cheer on these kids, no one in attendance will join PCG. It never happened in the Worldwide Church of God when it dumped tens of millions of dollars in tithe money that was spent on lavish stage shows and to bring in musical artists from around the world to perform on the stage of the Ambassador Auditorium. No mass conversions happened. We did piss of the Jewish community as they thought we were out to covert them to the church. No gospel message ever reached them, or anyone else, for that matter.

One thing the Church of God has been good at over the decades is wasting tithe money. Just more proof of how debased Armstrongism really is.

Saturday, June 14, 2025

Dave Pack: Never Again Until Next Time

 


Never Again Until Next Time

During “The Greatest Untold Story! (Part 579)” on June 7, 2025, David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God taught that the Kingdom of God would arrive on the June 20 Summer Solstice. He repeated that he would never be able to teach another date because the biblical facts he discovered were so overwhelming


Part 579 – June 7, 2025
@ 30:57 …at the summer solstice [chuckles], it can't and it and it’s a Sabbath. I just keep going over this. You know, cannot tarry. I mean, just think of all the moments we’ve looked for in this regard. This would answer every question. It would it would be it you’d be at the point where I could never offer you any other date after looking at this, and we got a lot more to cover. Could never offer you another date.

Proof that David C. Pack does not listen to his own sermons, nor does he remember anything he said since 2013 in 3…2…1…

@ 50:33 Can you imagine me coming in two or three weeks and telling you some other date? It’s outta the question.

Brethren in The Restored Church of God do not need to imagine. They have already lived that, and the dissolution of the prophetic Summer Solstice is a mathematical certainty because Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God will not arrive on June 20, 2025, and because God’s Holy Spirit does not inspire David C. Pack to teach what he does.

Dave would do well adopting the personal philosophy of George Costanza by doing the opposite of everything he thinks because a new date is so inevitable that not even Bradford Schleifer, Carl Houk, or that coward Ryan Denee would deny it. Living from prophetic date to prophetic date IS life inside The Restored Church of God.

Seasoned RCG members learned long ago that they can never believe the words of their Pastor General. Consider whether that is a baseless accusation or a proven fact of history.

Flashback Part 172 – April 27, 2019
@ 1:03:45 I wish I had understood that. Now I do. I’ll never ever, ever again say the day.

Flashback Part 460 – July 22, 2023
@ 1:26:07 Now, it took a long time to learn a plain date where I could never come to another one. I could never come to another one. You could never. There's no way.

Flashback Part 440 – May 3, 2023
@ 38:53 I’m not setting dates anymore. I’m just not doing it.

Flashback Part 471 – September 30, 2023
@ 1:43:43 And I’m not here to tell you the day. I’ll never do it again. I’ll never do it again.

Dave desperately wants to be absolute in his confident declarations, but because his mind knows what he truly is, his assertions waver with decaying certitude. Carefully observe as his strength bleeds away, lacking the boldness of his first utterance.

Part 579 – June 7, 2025
@ 1:36:01 And the first one is a seventh day, weekly Sabbath at the moment summer begins. The perfect time for a for God to start the Kingdom. If this is wrong, brethren, there there’s no path I see to a different date than June 20th. Or 21st in Jerusalem. Other possibilities? I don’t know. Maybe. Maybe. Ya just sit here. I know the Kingdom’s gonna be here. If it went beyond it.

@ 1:39:33 But, theoretically, I’m tryin’ to give you a theory of. Th–then I would I would truly say, if it is not [taps table] ten [13] days away, we do not know the day and the hourand we’ve gotta wait upwards of six months, but it might only be two more days or one week or something.

What? So much for the Summer Solstice on June 20 being the end of the road. Dave left the door open to teach something else six months away rather than admitting no man knows the day and the hour. For Dave, “taking His words at face value” is optional.

Dave seized the opportunity to defuse the false prophet critics. Present company included.

@ 1:41:16 So, you have the proof. I am not foretelling in some way where I got the word from God’s mouth,but if you asked me, did do I believe all of what I read the three times Christ said the Kingdom of God comes in summer and it’s tied to trees, oak trees. Do I believe that we have about a a about a little less than 13 days? Yes, I do. I think that’s what it is. If that’s not it, you will not hear me come back. I mean, I'll if we were here, I’d throw out possibility. “Here’s one that’s little bigger in the Scriptures. Watch this one.”

Dave's conviction continued to weaken. Already gone were the days of “I could never offer you any other date.” Oh, the good ole days of 70 minutes ago.

@ 1:43:29 So, I I I think we all understand. You have the facts. I absolutely hold to this date and will offer no other going forward other than possibilities should we have to, and I think that is not a possibility.

Possibilities are the bane of self-assigned, uninspired leaders. Since David C. Pack is not a true apostle or a true prophet, possibilities will forever be cactus needles thwarting his pain-free path to the Kingdom of God. He rubs thorns into his own eyes.

One small detail that could be interpreted as progress for Dave is that he avoided leveling implied promises by holding up his own life as collateral.

Flashback Part 426 – March 4, 2023
@ 42:23 I know that the way has been prepared, and we all understand, and if we had to wait ten years, or until I died, no one will ever tell me we don’t have this exactly right.

Flashback Part 447 – June 6, 2023
@ 1:56:16 10-1-7-1000 is immutable. I will die on that hill. That’s the hill I die on. There's no way the Scriptures change, or the Sabbath can change.

Pastor General David C. Pack is as trustworthy as a drug addict, promising he will never use again. You take a grave risk believing him, but do not be surprised when you get home to find your television and laptop missing. 

“The Greatest Untold Story!” is what happens when a self-appointed end-time servant of God tries to make his yes mean more than yes. Setting dates for the return of Jesus Christ will continue because David C. Pack is cursed to do it never again until next time.



Marc Cebrian

Dave Pack is Summer Lovin’



Summer Lovin’

If a member of The Restored Church of God disagrees with what David C. Pack teaches, all they need to do is wait one week because the Pastor General will eventually agree to disagree alongside them.

For yet a little while, Pentecost was the big deal RCG brethren had been waiting for. Until a week passed, and Dave revealed that Sivan 15 on June 11 was the real big deal.


During “The Greatest Untold Story! (Part 578)” on June 1, 2025, David C. Pack waved the flag of victory.


Part 578 – June 1, 2025 [Pentecost]
@ 02:39 This is now Pentecost. In fact, Pentecost is over in Jerusalem. I knew it. I knew it wasn’t going to be Pentecost, so we’re right on track.

The same man who taught that he was moved by God’s Spirit to teach that the Kingdom of God would arrive on Pentecost spoke on Pentecost in God’s name to say he knew it was not going to be Pentecost, which proves he was right about it not being on Pentecost.

The brethren in The Restored Church of God pay this guy to say these things to them.

When Dave has a brain-baby about some random element in the Bible, he blows it up to be the most mind-blowing secret to be revealed in 3,500 years. By combining a Tuesday and a full moon on the 15th of a Hebrew month, discovering this amazing fact just before it happens must mean that time is short.

@ 39:33 And is it just a coincidence that the 15th of Sivan, the full moon of Sivan, comes of the fourth day of the week this year? If that duddn’t give ya goosebumps, then you needed more coffee at lunch [chuckles]. Think it through.

The brethren staying in The Restored Church of God are not thinking it through. The remaining members must avoid reading their Bibles until they are forced to open them each Sabbath while pretending to take notes. David C. Pack has taught a date for the return of Jesus Christ and failed 129 times.

That is not a path inching toward success.

During a six-minute rant of theological lunacy stuffed with bizarre logic and goofy ideas, David C. Pack confidently explained why the end of the long journey to the Kingdom of God was upon them. The video clip is just a slice of the silliness of how Dave’s broken brain functions.


@ 42:44 You know, there’s a point where simplicity would appear. Simplicity in Christ. In peace.

The peace did not last because Dave self-neutered everything he said the following week. Everything he said was wiped from existence in less than seven days.

@ 42:55 Think again for the moment of 2520 days begin in the year 2025.

@ 43:47 Now, here’s an extraordinary thing I it just hit me like a bombshell this morning.

Dave is dazzled by his personal revelations because there must be a biblical purpose for what enters his head.

@ 44:03 This Series began on a full moon. Exactly a full moon. It will end on exactly a full moon. I don’t know why I never thought of that… Now, that was extraordinary enough to me. I thought, “Wow, wow, wow, wow. That’s amazing.” But it gets more amazing.

What is amazing to him includes the stone-cold math of ten times twelve, intercalary months, and lunar months being 29.53 days. For real. Watch the clip.

@ 46:36 If this is next Tuesday in the middle of the day, then we were we we the Series went ten years, God’s time, ten kingdom years on the dime before seven years before a thousand more. Think about it. Is that now is that an accident? I didn’t figure it out until my next-to-last message in the Series.

Every message is the next-to-last message in the Series because David C. Pack will never finish. Nothing he preaches will manifest, and his only choice is to remain a slave of his own ego. The Greatest Untold Story! Series will be completed when Dave retires into the grave. Then, watch the roaches scatter.

The hirelings at Headquarters care not for the sheep. Neither do they care for their false human idol. His mental deterioration progresses, and not even Edward “the walking void of critical thinking” Winkfield wants to do a wellness check in the Third Floor Executive Imaginarium.

@ 47:28 It’s interesting. We did the math. Lunar months are 29.53-plus .53 plus days on average. The Series was 2,000 was 3,544 days. We divided that by a 120 20, and the average and the average month in there was 29.53-plus days. [tongue click] To the thousandth.

@ 48:09 But I thought you’d find that interesting. Add those things to the list of reasons I gave you last week as to why, and there are some others, as to why I think we’re right on. Third week in a row.

It was not an interesting six minutes. It was lunacy presented as “simplicity in Christ and peace.”

@ 48:34 I hope that has you excited as you walk out of here. The last six years, we thought it was Pentecost. We finally realized, no. Pentecost is in the shadow of the day we are waiting for.

If the All-Believing Zealots walked out of Pentecost services excited, it would prove to be another short-lived dopamine hit because a Tuesday full moon was not true love. It was just prophetic infatuation.

The brethren soon learned that the Summer Solstice was the real, real big deal.



During “The Greatest Untold Story! (Part 579)” on June 7, 2025, David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God revealed that the hidden key that unlocked the prophecy door to the Kingdom of God was the Summer Solstice on June 20, 2025.

This nullified everything Dave taught during Part 578, proving his six minutes of gibberish was upgraded from perplexing to disturbing. Everything he thought was significant and inspired by God was actually a misinterpreted brain fart. Just like the entire Series.

Jesus Christ Returns June 20, 2025
on the Summer Solstice


Part 579 – June 7, 2025
@ 00:21 For a while, I thought the 5th, Pentecost, was the date we were looking for, actually, for years. Until I became a little over a week ago sitting with the fellas and very, very uncomfortable. …the Comforter in you will not leave you if you are one of God’s ministers and, never mind, a the leading minister uncomfortable. You will not be uncomfortable, never mind extremely so if if it is if you’re your date is correct.

When the Pastor General of a multi-million dollar 501(c)(3) non-profit religious organization is more uncomfortable than anyone else in the entire church, that should raise a red flag for everyone attending.

@ 01:07 Now we’re waiting for the 15th [Sivan]. So we ten days to full moon. Is this correct? Again, I became uncomfortable about a Tuesday.

@ 08:43 If summer equals it or He, and He, Christ, equals the Kingdom of God, then summer equals the Kingdom of God. Now, June 20th is the first day of summer here. In Jerusalem it’s it’s the 21st. But that’s the first day of summer.

@ 44:50 I was terribly uncomfortable with the 5th [Sivan 5 Pentecost]. Much more the 15th [Sivan]. But it looked like it had to be 2520 days in the in the year 2025, you know. 120 months of preaching. But it looks like we got another ten days. Ten once and ten twice. It’s what it looks like.

The six minutes of lunacy was officially dissolved. That should give brethren an uncomfortable pause before believing anything else spewing from Dave's mouth. He also explained what something else “looked like” that was proven false, but this time, “it looks like” the Summer Solstice. #reliable

David C. Pack tells people everything they need to hear to determine whether he speaks the truth or not.

@ 45:21 Why? Well, because you’re gonna be raised on a Tuesday. Or a Thursday. Or a Sunday night or something. It never made sense. But I, you know, [mumbles].

“But I, you know, taught it anyway,” Dave should have said.

David C. Pack just told on himself. He admitted the pivotal Tuesday point that supported Sivan 15 never made sense. But that did not stop him from preaching it, claiming to speak in God's name and under His direction and authority.

@ 50:41 All the discomfort is gone. I don’t wanna wait another 13 days. …But that’s not what God wanted.Hafta get the Series done.

All the discomfort will return with a vengeance as the Summer Solstice approaches, but David C. Pack will not be uncomfortable laying credit for his teachings at God's feet. No, over that, he will sleep like a baby.

Until further discomfort is announced, all eyes are on the June 20 Summer Solstice.

 


Just like he did with Pentecost and Sivan 15, Dave piles up a big stack of goofy junk and sells it as meaningful evidence for the Kingdom of God arriving on the June 20 Summer Solstice Sabbath.

@ 16:36 I’d like to just tell you that the summer solstice on the Sabbath when it hits Jerusalem is almost exactly dawn. It’s seven minutes off of dawn. …We’re waiting for the dawn that is the summer solstice. The dawn of a Sabbath. …it might be 500 years before that would happen again. Or is that a coincidence? Dawn in Jerusalem is 5:34[AM] when the summer solstice hits seven minutes later, at 5:41[AM]. Here it would be June 20th. There, it would be June 21stThat’s astonishing.

@ 30:09 It cannot. I mean, it just it's it's it it it’s locked. The summer solstice on June 20th, so obviously, if this is what God is talking about, could never, ever, ever tarry. It can't delay.

Add this to the bottom of the pile of dates that cannot tarry according to Dave: Passover, Pentecost, the Feast of Trumpets, the Feast of Tabernacles, Tevet 10, Iyar 1, Shevat 1, and Abib. And now, the Summer Solstice.

Listening to Dave tell on himself for over two minutes has valuable insight for those paying attention. The best way to dissolve the legitimacy of David C. Pack is to listen carefully to David C. Pack.


@ 55:16 Now, you're me, and you're trying to figure all this out, and you know that nobody else ever has. … but I'm gonna figure it out. It has to be God just would show me.

@ 55:47 I can't bother to study with a Bible. It's way too slow.

A member should tell that to a Headquarters hireling and then anticipate a warm reception. Maybe if David C. Pack actually studied the Bible he proclaims to understand, he would not be wrong about the return of Jesus Christ 129 times since 2013. Or he might even learn it is not his job to figure that out.

@ 56:18 But now it's just God keeps them in my my head and I and I I can just roar through them. Almost explode through them 'cause there's a hundred boxes to check. But finding the date that this was gonna be was like threading a whole series of needles. And after you think you've got it done, and it's maybe Pentecost, you come to, “Oh, here's a haystack. By the way, there's one more needle in this haystack.”

Does God intentionally guide His chosen servant to explain the Mystery of God to His flock inaccurately, or is David C. Pack presumptuously trying to figure things out by sorting biblical needles in the prophetic haystack?

@ 55:50 So, I know God helps me.

Dave desperately needs God to be helping him because the sublime horror of realizing he is doing this all on his own selfish, arrogant human steam would be cause for a catastrophic implosion through a psychotic break.

All the “facts” presented in Part 579 will soon prove to be fleeting empty ideas blown away by the winds of theological progress. The betting pool is now open for how long until Dave admits the Kingdom of God arriving on the Summer Solstice “never made sense” and left him feeling “terribly uncomfortable” and “much more” than Sivan 15.



In The Restored Church of God, a parable can be determined to be literal or symbolic based solely on the fickle judgment of David C. Pack. The same parable will be considered literal in one message but illustrative in another based on the present truth of Dave's broken brain.

@ 09:23 But, it’s a parable. Should we believe that the Kingdom of God comes in summer? That’s June 20th. I've had this in the back of my mind for a long time, but not enough knowledge to put it together.

@ 19:55 Now, I I’m I I I don't hear from Gabriel as I like to say periodically. I try to listen for the still, small voice of God’s word. But I understand that if summer equals Christ and Christ equals the Kingdom, then summer equals the Kingdom. Unless it’s a parable.

Some prime motivators keeping people locked in The Restored Church of God are fear and guilt. The fear of “just missing out” on the arrival of the Kingdom of God because they left “God’s One True Church.” The guilt of questioning the Pastor General is akin to questioning God and how He chooses to work with His chosen servants.

Openly questioning a teaching from the chair that a parable is to be taken literally is cause for suspension because that is an attitude of rebellion against God’s Government.

Field mollusks are trained to flip any narrative coming their way and turn it back upon the member, then make their attitude the focus of the discussion. Part of the manipulation and gaslighting strategy comes straight from Headquarters as Dave weaves this in to inoculate against naysayers.

Here is a classic David C. Pack manipulation and gaslighting combo:

@ 11:17 But I'm gonna give you the facts from the Scriptures, and then you’re left with whether or not to believe what Christ said. I’m tryin’ to just take His words at face value. Don’t play with them. And see if there’s if there’s support evidence to summer. To June 20th.

David C. Pack has made a career of making up “facts from the Scriptures” and only takes “His words at face value” when it is convenient for his current theory. Dave “plays with them” all day long.

@ 19:19 Midst of the years? As in dawn in Jerusalem? What would be June 21st there or the night of June 30th here? Did? Christ said summer three times. Did He actually mean summer?

Questioning what Dave teaches is to question Jesus Christ. Reject that at your own risk.

@ 1:41:16 So, you have the proof. I am not foretelling in some way where I got the word from God’s mouth, but if you asked me, did do I believe all of what I read the three times Christ said the Kingdom of God comes in summer and it's tied to trees, oak trees, do I believe that we have about a a about a little less than 13 days? Yes, I do. I think that's what it is. If that’s not it, you will not hear me come back. I mean, I’ll if we were here, I’d throw out possibility. “Here’s one that’s little bigger in the Scriptures. Watch this one.”

Dave will not come back unless he needs to, which means he absolutely will.

With psychological manipulation entirely in place, members of the Restored Church of God may now anticipate the arrival of Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God on June 20, 2025.

@ 1:38:01 I absolutely am committed to ten [13] days away. I would recommend you commit to it as well.But above that, commit to the Kingdom of God.

Above that, dear brethren of The Restored Church of God, commit to the human idol you choose to worship by sitting in agreement and paying his salary.

@ 1:43:29 So, I I I think we all understand. You have the facts. I absolutely hold to this date and will offer no other going forward other than possibilities should we have to, and I think that is not a possibility.

He will hold to the Summer Solstice until he does no longer. He will offer no other date going forward until he has to. Classic Dave.

David C. Pack studied the Bible without his Bible to determine the Kingdom of God would arrive on the Summer Solstice. Despite all his verbal summer lovin’, nobody in The Restored Church of God should relax on a lounge chair sipping a Mai Tai until June 20. Be prepared for the Pastor General to turn cold on the Summer Solstice.


Marc Cebrain

See: Summer Lovin’

Friday, June 13, 2025

ep17:HERBERT W ARMSTRONG & THE WORLDWIDE CHURCH OF GOD - CHURCHES OF GOD: Investigating and Reaching Faith Groups and Cults




ep17:HERBERT W ARMSTRONG & THE WORLDWIDE CHURCH OF GOD - CHURCHES OF GOD -  
no trinity, annihilation, SDA, false prophecy Investigating and Reaching Faith Groups and Cults We examine different groups to see what they claim compared to what The Bible states. === Today’s denomination has been around a long time. With a basis in SDA - Seventh Day Adventism and The Law, its founder Herbert W Armstrong was a strong proponent of BI (see #405 The Cults ep16) and amongst many of the teachings of this group are the giving of several 'tithes' and...
  • Abstinence from eating unclean meats listed in the Old Testament, such as pork and shellfish.
  • God's children are not actually "born again" into spirit until after the return of Jesus to the Earth.
  • Soul sleep
  • Annihilationism for unbelievers
  • He prophesied world calamity and the return of Jesus by 1975.

This is another must-watch because these churches are known under several names - and are far away from the Gospel of The Lord Jesus Christ - yet many believers seeking a sound church can be drawn towards them because of their strong stance on certain issues.

Thursday, June 12, 2025

The Day After

 


Can UCG Ever Restore Trust And Accountablity With Its Leaders?

Humble, servant leadership in the Church of God? 
What a novel concept!



When United Church of God split off from the Worldwide Church of God, they had a chance to boldly step out and reform the way the church operated and how it treated its members. Unfortunately, this never happened because the top men who gathered for a year before UCG's formation, planning their exit, were men already corrupted and tainted by the power structure and poor operational principles practiced by the church. Many in Pasadena watched these men and knew how they operated, but they wanted no part of UCG's formation. These men were not servant leaders but men who coveted their positions of power as a minister or as a department head.

Sadly, they took the same operational patterns over to UCG, where servant leadership never came to fruition. Their long-held belief was that members were there to serve them. There was and still is a total lack of transparency in how they operate. WCG ingrained this in them all too well. UCG ministers today feel they are no more accountable to the members than they were while in WCG.

Nathan Albright had this up on his blog around the time UCG was stabbing their former president in the back and seeking to elect a new leader who conformed to their desires instead of the members.

The recent decision not to confirm our widely respected president for another term, conducted behind closed doors and seemingly at odds with the will of many elders and members, has understandably created confusion and distress. When decisions that affect the entire body are made without transparent processes or clear explanations, trust inevitably suffers. Combined with concerns about financial stewardship, media strategy, and potential conflicts of interest, we find ourselves at a crossroads that demands thoughtful consideration of how we might better align our governance practices with our shared values and mission.

The Current Crisis of Confidence

Understanding the Root Issues

Before prescribing solutions, we must candidly assess the nature of our current difficulties. The non-confirmation of our president despite his popularity points to a disconnect between formal governance structures and the wider community’s perspectives. This disconnect becomes particularly troubling when:

    1. Decision-making processes lack transparency
    2. Resource allocation appears inconsistent with results (expensive rebranding versus cost-effective video production)
    3. Technical expertise gaps exist in critical ministry areas
    4. Informal power centers seem to exert undue influence over formal governance structures
    5. Potential conflicts of interest threaten to compromise objective decision-making

These challenges are not unique to our church. Throughout church history, religious communities have struggled with the tension between institutional authority and communal discernment, between tradition and adaptation, between leadership continuity and renewal. The task before us is to address these tensions in ways that strengthen rather than weaken our community.

The Cost of Inaction

If we fail to address these governance challenges, the consequences could be severe:

    • Erosion of trust between leadership and members
    • Declining engagement and participation
    • Reduced financial support
    • Difficulty attracting and retaining talented leaders
    • Impaired mission effectiveness
    • Potential factional division within the church

Biblical Principles for Church Governance

Transparency and Accountability

Scripture offers clear guidance regarding leadership accountability. The apostle Paul’s instructions to Timothy emphasize that church leaders must be “above reproach” (1 Timothy 3:2), implying that their conduct should withstand scrutiny. Jesus himself taught that “everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed” (John 3:20). These passages suggest that while privacy has its place, secrecy in governance often works against the church’s spiritual health.

The Church of God has never practiced transparency. They got by with it all through the decades until people started having access to email and the internet. At that point, they could no longer hide things. Sure, they would lash out and disfellowship members who dared to question them and would publicly tell members not to read dissident literature or read stuff on the internet, but people ignored them, and they have never been able to stop the flow of information that surrounds the church to this day. They still try and hide stuff from members, but it gets out eventually and when it does the shit hits the fan. Literally! 

Servant Leadership

Jesus established the paradigm for Christian leadership when he washed his disciples’ feet and taught that “whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant” (Mark 10:43). This model stands in stark contrast to worldly power dynamics where authority flows downward through command and control. In Christ’s kingdom, authority flows upward through service and sacrifice.

Servant leadership in Armstrongism is a joke. They love to talk about it all the time, but the broad majority never practice it. I remember to this day three of UCG's top men who, while in Pasadena before the implosion, would hand-pick the men who would wash their feet at Passover. We had to have warm water for them and large fluffy towels ready to dry their immaculate feet. These guys treated members with contempt at times. One who worked in the Church Offices would stand in the hallway after counseling sessions with members and laugh and joke with other ministers about the person they had just met with. Granted, there were a few men who did practice servant leadership, and members respect them to this day, whether in or out of the church. These men tended to be treated like dirt and sent off to the neither lands to run small churches.

Wisdom in Decision-Making

The Book of Proverbs repeatedly emphasizes the value of seeking counsel: “Plans fail for lack of counsel, but with many advisers they succeed” (Proverbs 15:22). The Jerusalem Council described in Acts 15 demonstrates a collaborative decision-making process that involved testimony, scriptural reflection, and consensus-building. These examples suggest that important decisions benefit from diverse perspectives and open deliberation.

Wise decision-making from church leaders and councils? What an oxymoron! 

Unity and Consensus

Paul’s letters frequently emphasize the importance of unity in the church. To the Philippians, he writes, “make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and of one mind” (Philippians 2:2). While unanimity on every decision is unrealistic, governance processes that seek consensus rather than mere majority rule better reflect this biblical value.

Albright ends his article with this vision he sees that the church can actually do. History proves it will not and is incapable of doing, but it's a good dream.

Conclusion: A Call to Faithful Governance

The governance challenges our church faces are significant but not insurmountable. With wisdom, courage, and commitment to biblical principles, we can transform this moment of crisis into an opportunity for renewed faithfulness and effectiveness.

The path forward requires contributions from everyone in our community:

    • From current leadership: Humility to acknowledge legitimate concerns, courage to implement meaningful reforms, and wisdom to balance tradition with needed change.
    • From elders and ministers: Constructive engagement with the reform process, patience during implementation, and commitment to unity amid disagreement on specifics.
    • From members: Grace toward leaders navigating complex challenges, active participation in new feedback channels, and continued financial and volunteer support during the transition.
    • From all: Prayer for divine wisdom, discernment of God’s leading, and recommitment to our shared mission and values.

The ultimate measure of successful governance reform will not be structural changes or process improvements, though these are important. Success will be measured by renewed trust, increased engagement, improved stewardship, and most importantly, enhanced effectiveness in advancing the gospel and making disciples.

Our church stands at a crossroads. One path leads to continued frustration, declining trust, and diminished impact. The other—the path outlined in this essay—leads to renewed vigor, restored confidence, and revitalized ministry. The choice before us is clear, though the journey will require sacrifice and commitment from all.

May we choose wisely, act faithfully, and move forward together in the confidence that God remains at work in and through our community, even amid institutional challenges. The future of our church depends not primarily on governance structures or leadership personalities, but on our collective willingness to pursue faithfulness in all aspects of our common life—including the critical dimension of church governance.

In the spirit of the apostle Paul’s exhortation, let us “make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace” (Ephesians 4:3) as we navigate these waters together. And may our governance reforms, like all our endeavors, ultimately serve to bring glory to God and advance the kingdom of Christ in our world. 


The entire article can be found here:  Restoring Trust and Accountability: A Path Forward for Church Governance