Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!
With all the new crazy self-appointed Chief Overseers, Apostles, Prophets, Pharisees, legalists, and outright liars leading various Churches of God today, it is important to hold these agents of deception accountable.
Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web of Corrupt Leaders
We've pumped greenhouse gases into the atmosphere and built houses in ecosystems which are prone to fire, strong winds, and erosion; and then have the audacity to expect God's intervention?
First, let me say that I do not have a theodicy that I think is a consistent explanation of what I see go on in the world. Neither have I read a theodicy written by someone else that fulfills that purpose. I can just offer fragmented viewpoint. Since I have thought about issues of theodicy all my life with no resolution, I expect to go to my grave with no theodicy that is more than theory. That is my apologia.
God is mysterious. I cannot tell you why we live in an era of what theologians call “already but not yet.” Christ waged a great war against Throne, Principalities and Powers and overthrew them. Paul seems to see this to be a major, reality-altering revolution brought about by Jesus, something at the core of his coming to this earth. But Thrones, Principalities and Powers are still in operation. But like everything in operation in the Cosmos, it is under license granted by God who rules over all. Hence, evil happens in the world and there is no evidence that God has anything to do with any of by direct agency. “May your Kingdom come and may your will be done” informs us that God’s will is not being done on earth at this time if “kingdom” in this passage refers to Christ’s return to overthrow the kingdoms of this world.
God is not pre-emptive. Jesus is going to return at the beginning of the Millennium but geopolitics is not going to suddenly, precipitately change. If you check the Book of Revelation there will continue to be hard times during the Millennium. It is not going to be the Wonderful World Tomorrow from day one. There will be process and segue. There will be a gradual phasing in of the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. The same is true of this era of already-but-not-yet. Gradualism appears to suit the purpose of God. I can conjecture but I cannot confidently tell you why.
We are then left with condition, circumstance and trust. The conditions and circumstances of Southern California – the Santa Ana Winds, the accidental flame, the combustible flora – and other conditions like Miller points out. And trusting in God is where we must find ourselves. I think we will spend most of our lives waiting for the Red Sea to part – and betimes it will.
Scout @ 2:47:24 PM PST I agree with your observation here. It is not going to be a Wonderful World Tomorrow from day one. Scriptures are clear on that point. The sad tragedy of the LA fires is simply a reflection on the state of this present time and the conditions were just right, awaiting for that spark. We read time and chance happen. To one and all. God sends rain on both the just and unjust. In the meanwhile we wait, and in faith. May it be strengthened.
The point is that we have all had to process some form of this question. And not very successfully in most cases. Many theologians would class the LA fires as a natural evil rather than a moral evil. But trying to figure out what is going on is not, otherrwise, easy. Atheists like Dennis just chalk such events up to ordinary factors. Christians must deal with the fact that there is also a supernatural realm. God may punish. Or thrones, principalities and powers may be intervene. Is anything really "time and chance?"
I believe this is the most difficult part of Christian doctrine. All answers seem inadequate when there is tragedy. I don't have any answers that I am confident in.
I believe that our attention will soon be deflected to the massive effects of all of the presidential executive actions. They just have not hit yet! Reality is that life as we knew it for the past 75 years is being revolutionized. The curtailing or withholding of federal funds will drastically affect the rebuilding efforts following these fires, and other disasters, regardless as to how we view them from a theological point of view.
What I find ironic is that the withholding of federal funds actually defunds the police!
Yes, Miller. Humans as a species are totally capable of assessing odds and probablility, and yet most consistently play against the odds. However, in the field of investments, another law comes into play, and that is that high risk potentially provides higher yield. The fires give us an interesting study. The elevated risks for a cush life in the Pacific Palisades or Malibu were high, but to many, the lifestyle in such an exclusive community minimized the risks, and made the risks worth taking.
I doubt that most of the folks in Altadena anticipated any such risks. While history does contain instances of fire and destruction in the semi-rural coastal areas, there was no such history to warn the folks in Altadena.
I see a parallel to Armstrongism here. It was an excessively high sacrifice religious philosophy. HWA lured his followers into it by the promise of a higher reward, one that in the minds of some made the risks and sacrifices appear worthwhile. But alas, Moses supposes amiss!
8 comments:
I think we could do without the mystery right now.
We've pumped greenhouse gases into the atmosphere and built houses in ecosystems which are prone to fire, strong winds, and erosion; and then have the audacity to expect God's intervention?
First, let me say that I do not have a theodicy that I think is a consistent explanation of what I see go on in the world. Neither have I read a theodicy written by someone else that fulfills that purpose. I can just offer fragmented viewpoint. Since I have thought about issues of theodicy all my life with no resolution, I expect to go to my grave with no theodicy that is more than theory. That is my apologia.
God is mysterious. I cannot tell you why we live in an era of what theologians call “already but not yet.” Christ waged a great war against Throne, Principalities and Powers and overthrew them. Paul seems to see this to be a major, reality-altering revolution brought about by Jesus, something at the core of his coming to this earth. But Thrones, Principalities and Powers are still in operation. But like everything in operation in the Cosmos, it is under license granted by God who rules over all. Hence, evil happens in the world and there is no evidence that God has anything to do with any of by direct agency. “May your Kingdom come and may your will be done” informs us that God’s will is not being done on earth at this time if “kingdom” in this passage refers to Christ’s return to overthrow the kingdoms of this world.
God is not pre-emptive. Jesus is going to return at the beginning of the Millennium but geopolitics is not going to suddenly, precipitately change. If you check the Book of Revelation there will continue to be hard times during the Millennium. It is not going to be the Wonderful World Tomorrow from day one. There will be process and segue. There will be a gradual phasing in of the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ. The same is true of this era of already-but-not-yet. Gradualism appears to suit the purpose of God. I can conjecture but I cannot confidently tell you why.
We are then left with condition, circumstance and trust. The conditions and circumstances of Southern California – the Santa Ana Winds, the accidental flame, the combustible flora – and other conditions like Miller points out. And trusting in God is where we must find ourselves. I think we will spend most of our lives waiting for the Red Sea to part – and betimes it will.
My two cents.
Scout
Scout @ 2:47:24 PM PST
I agree with your observation here. It is not going to be a Wonderful World Tomorrow from day one. Scriptures are clear on that point. The sad tragedy of the LA fires is simply a reflection on the state of this present time and the conditions were just right, awaiting for that spark. We read time and chance happen. To one and all. God sends rain on both the just and unjust. In the meanwhile we wait, and in faith. May it be strengthened.
What is the point of the meme -- that a loving God would not allow bad things to happen?
The COG Catholic 5:25
The point is that we have all had to process some form of this question. And not very successfully in most cases. Many theologians would class the LA fires as a natural evil rather than a moral evil. But trying to figure out what is going on is not, otherrwise, easy. Atheists like Dennis just chalk such events up to ordinary factors. Christians must deal with the fact that there is also a supernatural realm. God may punish. Or thrones, principalities and powers may be intervene. Is anything really "time and chance?"
I believe this is the most difficult part of Christian doctrine. All answers seem inadequate when there is tragedy. I don't have any answers that I am confident in.
Scout
I believe that our attention will soon be deflected to the massive effects of all of the presidential executive actions. They just have not hit yet! Reality is that life as we knew it for the past 75 years is being revolutionized. The curtailing or withholding of federal funds will drastically affect the rebuilding efforts following these fires, and other disasters, regardless as to how we view them from a theological point of view.
What I find ironic is that the withholding of federal funds actually defunds the police!
Yes, Miller. Humans as a species are totally capable of assessing odds and probablility, and yet most consistently play against the odds. However, in the field of investments, another law comes into play, and that is that high risk potentially provides higher yield. The fires give us an interesting study. The elevated risks for a cush life in the Pacific Palisades or Malibu were high, but to many, the lifestyle in such an exclusive community minimized the risks, and made the risks worth taking.
I doubt that most of the folks in Altadena anticipated any such risks. While history does contain instances of fire and destruction in the semi-rural coastal areas, there was no such history to warn the folks in Altadena.
I see a parallel to Armstrongism here. It was an excessively high sacrifice religious philosophy. HWA lured his followers into it by the promise of a higher reward, one that in the minds of some made the risks and sacrifices appear worthwhile. But alas, Moses supposes amiss!
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