Bob Thiel, of the improperly named Continuing Church of God, declared today that Gerald Flurry exaggerates (i.e. lies).
Flurry has an article up about the "times of the gentiles." As usually, Bob Thiel knows more about the bible than Flurry does.
Flurry writes:
One biblical prophecy explains the alarming rise of aggressive world powers today. “And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled” (Luke 21:20-24).We are living in the times of the Gentiles. Our free book The United States and Britain in Prophecy explains who the Gentiles are: any nations not descended from the 12 tribes of ancient Israel. In prophecy, God focuses primarily on two birthright nations (America and Britain) and one scepter nation (the Jewish nation in the Middle East). He uses Gentile powers to punish His chosen people because of their many sins.
Thiel responds:
It is, in my view, truly an exaggerated stretch for Gerald Flurry to claim that Luke 21:20-24 explains our world.
This is rich coming from a man who has exaggerated immensily about his "ordination" process. Gaylyn Bonjour had no intention of doubly blessing Thiel so that he could start a new splinter group. Not once did he, Rod Meredith, or anyone else ordain Thiel to be a minister, prophet or apostle. Thiel has exaggerated the entire process.
The so-called double blessed leader of the improperly named Continuing Church of God is just as deceitful and manipulative as Gerald Flurry is when it come to biblical knowledge and control.
31 comments:
When a movement is started by a minister who came from the world of advertising, one can expect all manner of advertising tricks to be used. Those who have spent years within Armstrongism probably aren't even conscious of all the hyperbole and superlatives. At this point in time, that just passes for normal communication. It is yet another Armstrong shibboleth.
BB
I wonder if any of these guys, in moments of reflection, ever wonder if they aren't just full of shit.
I have to genuinely commend you people that daily expose yourselves to this abhorrent sub-culture of warped "Christianity".
Honesty and most certainly integrity are absent from the ministry and laity alike.
It's sad to see the brutality of those whose only purpose is to "be saved", all the while they miss the point completely.
While the effort is valiant, I fear it's to late and falls on deaf ears as most certainly don't "have eyes to see" nor "ears to hear".
Keep up the good work and hopefully it will yield good results.
With Americas diminishing military power, the world is entering the times of the gentiles. It's not full blown yet, but technically Flurry is right. The trumpet site is the only splinter publication that's motivational. The others, motivation wise, are dead as a dodo.
It may have been an accident, but it happened, a rare double-anointing, making him possibly one of the world's top five holy men, giving him incredible insight into News Events & Trends as they relate to the Book of Revelation. Not even Ellen G White had as much prophetic insight - and she explained the true meaning of 1844!
Comment was made saying: "...The so-called double blessed leader of the improperly named Continuing Church of God is just as deceitful and manipulative as Gerald Flurry is when it come to biblical knowledge and control..."
Is Bob Thiel's treatment of his brother's "exaggeration" any surprise to any of us? No, after all, they both share the same father:
"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." John 8:44
Only thing is that both men are blind to the cause of their own lying words. Both men would rather expose themselves, or others, rather than to expose their father.
When will these men, and the other leaders (e.g. Kubik, Webber, Meredith, Winnail, Franks, Coulter, etc.) of the xcogs, wake up, read, and act like they believe the following words?
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood..." Ephesians 6:12
These once upon a time little helpers of HWA within the former WCG wrestled a lot of flesh and blood, but they didn't seem to understand the real enemy they should have been fighting, if they really want to fight:
"...against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." Eph 6:12
Well, didn't they try to tell us those were our enemies? Or, did they just point the forefinger and ignore the remaining fingers on each of their hands?
And they all sinned......and continue to sin, don't they? Some day, and it may just be a great last day, they will become of the following verse when they think about their own personal sins, rather than the sins and exaggerations of others:
"He that committeth sin is of the devil..." I John 3:8
Fortunately, or unfortunately, HWA, nor the little helpers, not even ourselves have ever been freed from sin for very long.
Even James Malm in one of his latest posts on "The Tree of Life" turned a blind eye to those words of I John 3:8 after he asked this question: "What is this sin that brings death?"
James did his usual thing: cite the law, cite the 10 Commandments and then blame and judge the rest of us because you and I lack ZEAL to keep God's LAW. Again, James gives Satan, also his father(?), a "free pass" by going on to do what? Wrestle flesh and blood!
Is there anything new under the sun? James proves to be not all that different from Thiel and Flurry. They all love to wrestle, and not a single one of them perfectly with zeal keeps God's law (Romans 7:17, 20-21; Galatians 5:17, Jer 17:9, etc.).......including another of the "greatest:" James Malm.
Does James think that trying and striving cuts it with his "god?"
Yes, all of these guys strive to do the best they can with what they have, but is any of them really pleasing God? Really? And I look into the mirror and guess what? Same thing!
And life goes on...
John
"It's not full blown yet, but technically Flurry is right. The trumpet site is the only splinter publication that's motivational."
Whaaaaat? The only things it motivates healthy people to do is cry, laugh, barf or eyeroll. Maybe you'd like to roll the dice again to see if you'll be lucky enough to advance to "barf" or "eyeroll" in the game of Herbopoly. (It's much better then, if you land on Armstrong Avenue: You won't have to pay tithes or "Go to the Lake of Fire without passing Go Figure It Out!)
James endlessly talks about keeping Gods law, but never magnifies the ten commandments. Psalms many times mentions acquiring wisdom and understanding, which he completely ignores. He snears at self help books that magnify Gods laws, as 'psychology today.' If a person loves Gods law, that person would also love to know it's detailed application.
Lol, Booby only WISHES he were as successful an exaggerator as Gerald Flurry has proven himself to be!
There's good reason why 'salesman' is the most hated profession, and even better reasons why religious salesmen are the worst of the worst.
Reflection? I wouldn't expect too much from those two!
DennisCDiehl said...
"I wonder if any of these guys, in moments of reflection, ever wonder if they aren't just full of shit."
They would have to pull their head out of their ass first.
Ummm... didn't that passage in Luke actually happen in 70 A.D.?
Just thought I'd ask....
7:26 AM If someone is detailing the economic and military decline of America, which history shows can have very ugly consequences, something is wrong with you. I can think of many conservative secular sites that are giving a similar warning. The body of evidence is there.
I think the bible authors/editors/redactors/re-editors/re-redactors etc were compulsive over-exaggerators.
so simply exaggeration is ok, we just shouldn't "overdo it"?
In PCG's history of the world Romans created the Sahara Desert.
"Carthage allowed Rome to rise in power and did not react with force against its sudden challenges. A series of violent wars broke out, but it was too little too late. Rome conquered Carthage: It cut down the vast forests of North Africa, creating the Sahara desert; it burned the capital city to the ground, leaving it in ashes; and it salted the once fertile plains, rendering them useless. Rome left Carthage in utter desolation. That is the consequence of inaction." (Abraham Blondeau, Just What Is the Obama Doctrine?, March 22, 2016.)
Pretty sure it didn't happen that way.
Anon1:34AM wrote: "...Americas diminishing military power..."
America's military power is not diminishing.
I suppose you think that our military spending isn't enough.
"The U.S. outpaces all other nations in military expenditures. World military spending totaled more than $1.7 trillion in 2013. The U.S. accounted for 37 percent of the total. U.S. military expenditures are roughly the size of the next nine largest military budgets around the world, combined." — NationalPriorities.org
...and that's not counting the black budget...
But this isn't how countries like the US cease to be military superpowers anyway, if that's what you're getting at. Their military spending doesn't diminish slowly over time because they weren't nationalistic enough, not jingoistic enough, and they didn't make their military spending a high enough priority, and didn't budget enough. Nope.
Their military power doesn't diminish, it simply collapses. Look at the collapse of the Soviet Union. It doesn't matter how much you budget toward your military, when you can no longer afford to field a military anymore, everything just starts to rust. You project military power, and then one day, you suddenly can't afford to project it anymore.
This happens due to diminishing economic power. Maybe that's what you meant?
I think we can all see the day when America can no longer afford to field the sort of military we have now, we take our place alongside Russia and the UK, and cede superpower dominance to China. But it won't be because our "military power" diminished, but because our economic power did, forcing our current military power to simply collapse. More or less overnight.
If America wants to stay a superpower, the government should probably spend less on the military, and spend more on education and economic infrastructure instead. Because if you're not an economic superpower, then you can't afford to be a military superpower. No matter how nationalistic and jingoistic you might be...
People in Armstrongism have a history of not just exaggerating, but of going off balance in many areas, and ways. The other night I was watching a movie that had a character named "Sabitha". I said to myself, "Geez, I wonder how this one got past young parents in the WCG. You'd have thought a lot of them would be naming their daughters after the sabbath!"
Come to think of it, WCG kids could probably have been named a bunch of things that were highly regarded by members, or pertained to the teachings of HWA. Prophecy. Leviticus. Assyria. Herbert. Loma. Sinai. Petra. Tithe. Millennium. Philadelphia. Judge. There are probably dozens of names that all the poor, abused kids in the church could have been proudly named back in the day! Imagine! "Leviticus, did you memorize your Bible verses today?" or, "Assyria, when you say 'Yes, Ma'am!', I want to see a smile on your face, not a sour look that tells me you have a bad attitude!"
BB
BB,
My children would agree.
Especially my son Petra Philadellennium Tithe III, and my daughters British Israel Barbara and Cleanfoods Candice.
Regards,
King James Approximately
Back in Arkansas, a new preacher moved in to pastor the little church at Clantonville, and he made it a point to visit everyone around there and invite them to come hear him preach so he could persuade them to get saved and join the church. He visited one family way up Leatherwood Holler who had a whole yardful of little bare-assed kids. He talked to the mama because the daddy was out doing odd jobs: carrying hundred-pound sacks of sugar through the woods. Now you gotta realize they're all dumb in Leatherwood Holler, and the futher up the holler you go, the dumber they get. This woman lived in the house way up at the head of it, in the back bedroom, upstairs.
Anyway, preacher asked her if she regularly read the bible, and she said she sure did. In fact, she said her and her husband named all their children with names right out of the Bible. Esther, Nehemiah, Adam, Ruth, Ephraim, Delilah, Samson, Eve, and she called off a bunch of other names too. She said "By the time we had this one"--she indicated the baby she was nursing--"The names had just about run out. But I finally found one."
Preacher said, "Oh, what name did you pick?"
She said something that sounded like "Pizlum Sieve."
"I've read the Bible through several times, and I don't recall that name at all. Are you sure you got that from the Bible?"
"Oh, yes. It's right here." She picked up her dog-eared Bible that had chapter numbers written in Roman numerals. She opened it up and pointed to Psalm CIV.
(By the way, that's the kind of story I got chewed out once by Carl McNair for telling at Ambassador College. He said Californians already thought we Arkansawyers [only he pronounced it "Arkansans"] were nothing but ignorant hillbillies, and there was no use making the situation worse.)
Especially my son Petra Philadellennium Tithe III, and my daughters British Israel Barbara and Cleanfoods Candice.
My kids, Pabst Auditorium Egret and Crudcream Superdeaconess Humblesuperior, say hello!
THE FALSE PROPHETS
Here is a quick overview of some of the false prophets and their impostor cults that Satan sent to plague the COG scene with error, confusion, instability, and fear while wasting people's time, energy and money.
Philadelphia Church of Fraud (PCG) -- Gerald R. Flurry
The nature of the beast: Gerald the (short) runt of the psychopaths tried to compensate for his short stature by making up numerous grandiose titles for people to use in worshipping him, and by teaching his runt-worshippers to be really mean and nasty to everyone else, including any of their own family members who were not as crazy as themselves. Intoxicated by his own self-love, and by too much beer, he got into alcoholism, plagiarism of Malachi's Mess., flooding the PCG with new revelations that he made up, editing and changing HWA's writings, the identity theft of claiming to be That Prophet, stealing people's tithes and offerings for his PCG impostor cult, promoting sexual immorality among the PCG members, and now, since he never repented of any of those abominations, Irish dance.
The prophecies of the dirty little rat: The PCG was originally going to do a “short work.” This was not only the end times, but the “end of the end times,” and now for many years it has been the “last hour,” and yet the end is no yet. Gerald did not dare to give a sermon on the “last minute” for fear that if he did the end would come right away. More likely, he would have gone on about the last seconds, and then about the last milliseconds of the last second--and for who knows how long! First they had to edit, change, and reprint MOA, then they had to build an auditorium, and now they have to do some Irish song and dance routine to try to bring on the end. This is even worse than getting strung along watching the last minutes of some stupid football game that someone reassuringly tells you is almost over.
Restored Church of Fraud (RCG) -- David C. Pack
The nature of the thief: David the (tall) overgrown psychopath wants it all: Your income, your savings account, your retirement account, your house, your body (to do continual fund raising), your soul (to utterly extinguish), etc. David has a long history of not being able to get along with anyone, anywhere, anytime, because it is so hard to find anyone who can stand him for very long. If only those lucky but ungrateful RCG bums would just quickly believe whatever they are told to believe (whatever the latest version of it is), quickly do whatever they are told to do, quickly hand over everything they have, and smile and pretend that they are doing it all voluntarily and happily, then maybe Dave would not have to lose his temper all the time and yell and spit at them in front of everyone else.
The prophecies of the liar: David pretends to be a typical, logical male who can come up with literally dozens and dozens of reasons and “proofs” for the crazy things he says, and like the Devil he can even misquote the Bible, but nothing he predicts ever happens. Even Dave's glib assurance that his followers will not become destitute after giving him everything they have will probably prove to be wrong. Especially that one!
Continued below...
...continued from above.
Church of Fraud--Preparing for the Kingdom of Fraud (COG-PKG) -- Ronald E. Weinland
The nature of the clown: Ronald the (joking, right???) clownish psychopath just wants to travel and shop and enjoy the over-priced Euro-junk that passes for an automobile across the pond. Since serious writing might require actual work, and Ron was more into clowning around with his rubber chicken and letting his mind drift, he got into writing prophetic fantasy fiction. Since he did not put on his thinking cap, someone else put a propeller cap on him to make it look like he has a sense of humor, but beware of his latent tendency to act like Pennywise the clown (who snuffed out the dear little children).
The prophecies of the joker: Perception is all-important and self-fulfilling when dealing with Ronald McWineland. Those who view Ron as a big joke will have a big laugh. Those who take Ron seriously will have serious problems. Therefore, it is extremely important that you laugh quickly and loudly at all of Ron's jokes: at all his prophetic jokes, at all his request for money jokes, at all his request for submission jokes, etc. Remember: Those who laugh first will also have the last laugh. Those who have no sense of humor, or who cannot tell Ron's jokes from reality, will surely suffer. You can either laugh now or cry later. Therefore, choose laughter, the best medicine, and a great cure for Ronitis.
Continuing Church of Fraud (CCG) -- Robert J. Thiel
The nature of the con: Robert the (inexperienced, newbie) amateur psychopath was hoping to attract some well-off Americans to con, but he was only able to attract some more-experienced, professional psychopaths from Nigeria (home of the Nigerian letter and e-mail scams) in Africa who were intent on conning him. As a false prophet, Bob cannot see anything coming. Doubly cursed, and worldly unwise, it is like he does not even have eyes.
The prophecies of the conned: Bob really admires the demons for their alleged knowledge of the future that they supposedly reveal to pagans. The problem is that the dirty, filthy, lying, unclean spirits won't even tell Bob the truth about what the sneaky pagans in Nigeria are up to right now. They are crookeder than a crooked little bookcase in one of Bob's homemade videos. The cons are conning a fellow con! Giving to Bob's scam is like giving to a Nigerian scam because that is where the money will ultimately end up.
I knew some Petras and Tea-Tephis.
Flurry says: One biblical prophecy (Luke 21:20-24) explains the alarming rise of aggressive world powers today.
That prophecy in no way explains the rise of aggressive world powers but rather the results expected after they have risen.
Regarding “we are living in the times of the Gentiles” is also completely out of time and focus.
Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Jerusalem trodden down by the gentiles STARTS the “time of the gentiles”. Until then, Jerusalem is controlled by the Jews.
The time the gentiles control Jerusalem is the Great Tribulation, hence, that period, the times of the gentiles, end (are fulfilled) at Christ’s return.
If Flurry wants to scare the laity, he should be using these verses: Rev 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
Verses 1-2 refer to all of them being judged at the time the gentiles take over.
That means they are NOT in their coveted “place of safety”, hence we already know what their judgment is.
They’re spewed out of Christ’s mouth.
And when does that happen to all of those in the splinter groups?
Rev 15:7 And one of the four beasts gave unto the seven angels seven golden vials full of the wrath of God, who liveth for ever and ever.
Note that God’s wrath hadn’t been poured out at that point, which means the Great Tribulation hadn’t yet started.
Rev 15:8 And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the temple, till the seven plagues of the seven angels were fulfilled.
The day of Atonement is the only day when the glory of God fills the temple with smoke and when no man was allowed to enter the temple.
In that scenario, no man can enter until all of the plagues have been poured out and the jobs given to the angels is finished.
Rev 16:17 tells us when that will be.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
So, the temple is closed to all men until the angels finish their tasks, which is bad news for those that might wish to repent.
But again, why would they want to repent, they have need of nothing.
Again, given the above scenario, we can now include the two witnesses.
As evidenced throughout scripture, God uses the physical to get His message across to man since it is only the physical that man can relate to.
What the angels of Revelation carry out are first proclaimed by the two witnesses in revealing God to man.
Since the ministry and laity of the splinter groups have desecrated the covenant they made with Christ at their baptism and keep the old covenant tithing laws, they’re about to be toast.
So much for the sermonette.
These men need to see psychiatrists.
It used to be when you said you thought you were Christ or one of his apostles, etc, that they put you away.
Now it is fashionable to claim to be something .
Not one of these men prophecies or has one characteristic of anything they claim to be but then it takes a person with the mind of a cult member to follow them doesn't it?
Finally, if you are a Christian you would believe prophecy and prophets ended with the advent of the NT, Evangelical and CoG nutcases not withstanding
Finally, Christ is the last and final prophet.
No one can add to his words.
These slivers teach third tithe, but I find no reference to it in the new testament. Aren't people already paying for it in their taxes? These churches are hardly impartial when it involves getting free money.
The point about repenting, is that it is over rated. The purpose of human existence is to build the mind of God, rather than 'repenting.' My point is that it takes a lot of time to grow as a person, so a deathbed 'repentance' or even a 'repentance' in the tribulation, will be too late for many. Too little, too late, as they say. Which is why we are told that 'today' is the day of our salvation. We are to grow now, or some future repentance could prove meaningless.
2.02 AM. If you read up about it, people do not join cults, but groups that turn out to be cults. The deception and mind twisting is so gradual and subtle, that people only recognise it after they leave the group.
How does your world view explain the book of Revelation, if all prophecies ended with the NT?
Ignore the hair splitting clown senior Citizen.
The NT includes Revelation which are the words of Jesus Christ.
Christ was resurrected in the NT.
These hair splitters love to show off and try to catch people with their amazing biblical knowledge.
"how does YOUR world view explain" he demands etc.
What a smarmy smart ass tone.
After all we all know the people in the CoG are smarter than everyone else.
5.20PM. Many of Christs answers to his critics were 'smarmy smart ass,' as well. Yours is the typical anti thinking, anti intellectual attitude that existed, and still exists in the churches. Ministers love your attitude, as do the church bullies. Why do you come here then?
And yes, we are smarter than trailer park drunks.
Did not Garner Ted Armstrong preach the gospel to "Trailer Park Drunks" when he appeared on HEE HAW with Buck Owens, and sang "Put your hand in the hand that stills the water" on the show?
Since the series is available on reruns and on DVD, Trailer Park Drunks have true witness and are fully accountable! :-)
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