What If...?
What if it was ok if all the members or
ministers in any COG didn't all speak the same thing?
What if gentleness, goodness, meekness,
kindness and longsuffering was taught and displayed more than the unknowable
meanderings of prophecy?
What if the minister had a servant personality instead of a Plantation Owner mentality?
What if "give as you are able," was all one ever heard from the Pastor or the Church Organization?
What if the lowest priority of a Church was a building program?
What if you could look your Pastor in the eye and tell him "that was the most far fetched view of scripture I have ever heard?"
What if the Pastor laughed at himself when he gave such sermons and was called out on it?
What if some of the membership really had a more balanced view of scripture than the minister?
What if it was not permitted for the Pastor to use the words "soon," "in our lifetime," "gun lap," or "soon coming...." in any sermon?
What if a member could tell the Pastor he'd take his advice under advisement ?
What if you were able to make your own decisions about living your life even though the Pastor felt the decisions he makes in his life are more correct?
What if you messed up and had a Pastor who could freely admit "I messed up too," and had a good laugh together?
What if members gave up on the idea of becoming "perfect or mature as God is perfect," and just did the best they could under the circumstances?
What if it was ok to get to church or the Festivals as best you could without fear of being a slackard?
What if it didn't matter what Adam, Abraham, David, Solomon, the Prophets, or any real or imagined character in the Old Testament did or didn't do thousands of years ago?
What if a COG Organization did not have to spend so much energy and time trying to convince others they were the one true Church?
What if numbers and statistics didn't matter and were proof of nothing?
What if the leadership of Grace Community International apologized for reckless theological games and realized the damage and doubt brought to the minds of tens of thousands was more than the sweetness brought to the hundreds left over.
What if "I am sincerely sorry for the pain caused," and "I was wrong," were ok concepts for the minister to utter from time to time.
What if advertisers of religious perspectives did not have to scream in red print at you from the pages of the Journal?
What if any minister who declared himself a Prophet, Apostle, Watcher or Witness , out of the blue and without due process and proof was bounced out on his ass or asked to get some counseling?
What if a member could freely sit through a sermon and be ok with telling themselves this particular sermon is boring, crazy, weird or egocentric and probably not true as presented.
What if a member could utter the words, "Please don't tell me, us, my family, my wife, my kids what to do or how to be."
What if you had a minister that said, "I have come to see that things are not exactly as I always thought them to be..."
What if you had a minister who understood the background, context, origins, intent and story behind the scriptures?
What if science was not "falsely so called."
What if all the COGs could say, "Let's face it, we have allowed some pretty weird personalities to tell us what to do and how to be and perhaps have not understood the Bible as it was intended to be understood."
What if everyone understood the Bible is not inerrant or perfect and you really can't be 100% God and 100% Man in any way anyone can imagine.
What if we all laughed at those who sound and act like they understand the above concept evolved over hundreds of years to plug the holes in other questions raised over time.
What if the COGs understood the concept you can never make a scripture mean what it never meant.
What if pious conviction with marginal information was not how a COG wanted to present it's views?
What if you didn't "send it in," or wouldn't "send it in" until or unless you were confident it would not be misused, wasted or stashed away by the Pastor?
What if everyone roared with laughter when the Pastor wanted to build another college or House for God knowing how big the Universe is?
What if the words, "I was wrong," "I didn't know," "I have no background in that," "I see the problem," "I know I tend to be...", "I have made (and list them) mistakes in my life," "I am sorry...", "I apologize", "What do you think we should do..?", "I don't know the answer to that..."
What if perfect love actually cast out fear and like Rodney King, we could all wonder why we can't get along?
What if all the COGs never again allowed ONE Minister, Pastor or Self Appointed human being to tell them how it all is as if they really knew?
What if...
1 Corinthians 13
1 If I speak in the tongues[a] of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast,[b] but do not have love, I gain nothing.
4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
...was really true in the COGs or on the planet?
Whew......now that's back on
track!
Amen.....
Dennis C
DenniscDiehl@aol.com
DenniscDiehl@aol.com
10 comments:
You left out one critical one:
What if the church admitted that they took our money under false pretenses, squandered it on luxuries and excess, and announced that they were returning some of our money to us.
No matter how much money a church amasses, they never have enough.
Love it, love it, LOVE IT !
Too bad you are asking the COG's to be normal like the rest of us.
I don't know how they can labor under the delusion that they can treat others like garbage, and consider themselves holier than thou.
Apparently people use religion as a drug to make them feel good, by putting others down. I'm guilty of doing this too in the past when I was on my COG high. Now I realize the best high you can get is just being yourself, loving your friends and family, and treating people kindly (no matter how dopey they are).
I think John Lennon must of wrote the song "Imagine" after he met a COGer.
What if there were no titles, offices, or positions in a "church"? I remember Jenkins had a mass "ordination" of "deacons" in the West Houston church(over twenty at one time I believe). The split came a few years later. The new WCG combined churches with the East and the South churches. Now they had around thirty "deacons". All of them were fighting over being the most "important". The new "pastor" was pulling his hair out with all the jockeying, so decided to de-deaconize everyone in a sermon. Guess what? They ALL left! So, I guess if all your "what ifs" were fulfilled, there would be no "churches".
The COG Splinter mental practice and habit of endeavoring to determine who is more true than who is a sad comentary on whole meaning of spirituality. The COGs are religious practices, not spiritual ones.
Those like Dr. Thiel struggle to determine who the true people and beliefs are and of course, it is the one he choses. He makes great hay out of how LCG and UCG won't unite until UCG adjusts their beliefs to LCG's. Pathetic and sad in the bigger scheme of things.
The other problem would be that the actual leadership could not and would not yield to the other. It's why one would have sacrifice their soul to a Dave Pack in order to get paid by Dave Pack. Dave Pack always wins and you....just don't.
What if the members of the various COGs under the thumb of the one man simply informed him that there would be no more funding, tithe or contributions until he got off his high horse and acted abit more average and understanding. People can force this if only they would. The problem is that the mental habit is be "in the spirit of rebellion to authority" and that always stops such message sending in its tracks.
No Presbyterian, well educated Pastor would ever think of thinking or behaving like COG one man show types. They would know better through a genuine education in the how and why of ministry.
They'd also know you can't read the Bible like a newspaper. Something the COG ministry and gurus have yet to fathom.
Dennis writes,
"What if...[these things were]...really true in the COGs or on the planet?
Whew......now that's back on track!"
To use a train/track anology, I guess HWA's church could be considered to be Herbie in a loco-motive(with attached passenger cars) travelling around a roundabout.
Then, inspired by HWA, lots of wannabee cult leaders got their own loco-motives going, heading off in different directions from the roundabout, each huffing and puffing while their wistles blew, "CHOO-CHOO-CHOOSE ME! I'm the TRUTHIEST!", while picking up all the passengers they could/can.
Problem is, they're all headed from No-wheres-ville, to No-wheres-ville, while grasping their tickets firmly in hand and hopefully thinking they're on the right track.
It should be a Twilight Zone episode, LOL!
Norm
Dennis, if all of those "what if" statements were reality, well then we might just see some other changes as follows:
Individual ministers out in the field would not be using people as much as they have done to cut their lawns, babysit their kids, clean/paint their homes, etc.
They just might do some of those things for themselves...perhaps even make some time to help brethren with babysitting their kids, but cut their own lawns and clean their own homes...etc.
I say "some," because they all didn't do those sort of things, but some did take advantage of the brethren when they could have done things themselves or paid others to help them out. The brethren have families too...
John
Spot on.
"Individual ministers out in the field would not be using people as much as they have done to cut their lawns, babysit their kids, clean/paint their homes, etc."
I spent year two of my career babysitting, lawn mowing, YMCA going, sitting at coffee listening, not going thru doors before the boss, getting corrected for doing that. Losing the "how long can you take sauna heat contests" and everything but visiting, helping, encouraging and teaching. I thought that kind of thing was only folk lore until I had to do it all.
I know of one ministerial assistant who was required by his minister boss to open all doors for the boss so that if there were any infectious germs on the door the ministerial assistant would get sick instead of the minister.
I would not have lasted 3 months as an assistant or junior minister.
Mish-mash wrote: "I don't know how they can labor under the delusion that they can treat others like garbage, and consider themselves holier than thou."
There is a meaning to treating other people like garbage--it is an expression of dominance. When they dish it out and you are willing to take it, this is not in any way at odds with their "holier than thou" posturing. Instead, it is the signature on the bottom line of the social contract. It is the very proof that you are in full agreement that they really are better, more worthy, and more holy than you are.
Dennis wrote: "No Presbyterian, well educated Pastor would ever think of thinking or behaving like COG one man show types. They would know better through a genuine education in the how and why of ministry."
They may call themselves "ministers" but ironically, ministering is probably the one thing that "COG one man show types" have never actually done.
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