This is going to be a bitter pill for Bob Elijah Elisha Amos Thiel to swallow. The comes from a Church of God member who freely admits there is idolatry in the Church of God. Even worse this comes fro the guy who is exposing Bob Elijah Elisha Amos Thiel as a false prophet and accuser of the brethren.
John D, on the Church of God Perspective writes:
Do people in the Church covet? Yes. Do people in the Church shade the truth? Yes. Do people in the Church steal? You know that some do, even if it is only small amounts. Judas, who was in the presence of Jesus Christ, still stole. So, it should not be surprising that people can call themselves Christian and still be involved in idolatry.
Having said that, obviously the warnings are there and there so often not only because idolatry is possible but probable. Look around, and some blatantly worship a dead man. Some worship their organization or perhaps the man running it (often by introducing the idolatry as a flagrant elevation of the dead man and then shifting to themselves). Some people have fallen in love with their own pet doctrine and left the Church because their pet doctrine was more important than keeping the commandment to assemble together. Some have made an idol out of government. Some border on worshiping the host of heaven with their fanatical and distorted view of the calendar. Idolatry in the Church of God is not only possible, but it is!
How true are his words! This is been going on for generations. Just look at the various Church of God leaders we have today. Idolatry regions supreme. Worship of HWA and of themselves. Worship of doctrines and law instead of grace and
Still think idolatry cannot exist in the Church? Christ Himself said it would be there at various times down through the ages. Remember that He admonishes each and every one of the Seven Churches of Revelation to listen to what He says to the “churches“, plural. The messages were targeted to each and yet meant for all.What message does Bob Elijah Elisha Amos Thiel preach that emulates
Instead, most treat the messages as a way of picking out the one we like the best, applying it to ourselves and then hit everyone else over the head with the others. It is so backwards that it is a doctrine of Satan. Ironically, it in itself is a form of idolatry in the Church of God, taking notions like “us vs them”, “Laodicean vs Philadelphian”, church “eras” and such way out of proportion and making them more important that the actual messages Christ was delivering to all the churches down through all of time up until His return.
17 comments:
Good examples of idolatry within the ACOG culture, but the biggest idol of all was not mentioned: The Bible. A collection of writings about God and "His" expectations is revered more than the Creator. God is replaced as the perfect and infallible One. Instead of acknowledging God as THE final authority on religious matters, they openly give that designation to a book (they're not alone in this - a large part of Christianity is guilty of the same sin). I've said it before: Sola Scriptura is idolatry! Glory to God ALONE!
From my time in living, I found it rampant. From the little round icon that has to be on the podium, it has to be hanging at every assembly. To Meredith referring to hwa every 5 minutes it seems. To the members worshipping Meredith and not Jesus.
IF the members had their eyes open they would see it.
There was a PANTHEON of worshiped beings in Pasadena.
There was the man MOST to be revered (you know, the one who raped his daughter over and over). And there was this handful of men around him, who had been with the main one for a long time, or who had some sort of "important" position, who reflected the glow. Mere members sought to reflect this glow by boasting, "I got to hear Mr. ----- at my Feast site!" Any excuse will do for a feeling of being better than those around you.
And ever meet someone who WORKED FOR the church, there in Pasadena? The condescending attitude of those people was something to witness. If they came home to visit family, people would point them out to you, awed by their having a position that meant they'd be on the earlier flights to Petra. The PRIDE they oozed when they talked to you -- if they bothered -- was off-putting beyond belief.
Men were idolized, the organization was idolized, and people tried to grasp some of that idolatry for themselves by association. Failing that, you might hear someone boast about how much time they spend praying and studying; the conversation, at first, might have had nothing to do with that, but they turned it that way so that some small part of the people worship might be theirs, too.
This reminds me of a Herbie inner circle minister (now deceased) who visited our church in the 1980s. I have never experienced a person who radiated such a strong 'I am so very important' aura. I read that he was discovered in bed with another ministers wife. The elder who complained to HQ, was humiliated by being forced to be baptised again. Like in all dictatorships, criticising the government is the greatest crime. This is great soup opera material.
After pondering the issue for many years, I came to the conclusion that one cannot worship oneself. One can be proud, have a very inflated opinion of oneself etc, but not worship oneself. The reason is that by definition, worship must be something outside of oneself, since worship sets the direction of ones life.
Shouldn't the ACOG leaders be trashing Prince, and complaining about his popularity and wealth? Maybe the reason they are not, is that he comes from a branch of their same Adventist family. Apparently, Prince was a Jehovah's Witness!
BB
COGs minsters can not give a sermon without talking about "I" "me" frequently. Idolatry in the cogs, especially in the ministry, definitely and plenty.
4.58 Christ used the word "I" frequently vas well. In the NT God refers to Himself umpteen times. People love to talk about themselves. It's only natural.
And there are Jehovah witness dissident sites like this one. With similar complaints as well. Not surprising that the COG splinters don't critics them, since they recognize them as soul brothers. Ain't it interesting the JWs taught that the end would come in 1974 as well. Who copied from whom? Or was there a conspiracy?
In 1969 at the Feast of Tabernacles at beautiful Jekyll Island, Garner Ted Armstrong of all people gave a sermon on Idolatry. I remember it like it was yesterday because it was the morning service next day after the night before when Mr. Armstrong spoke during the hurricane. The night before, light bulbs were popping and he could hardly be heard over the pounding rain as ushers and deacons did everything they could to secure the world’s largest tent with 8,000 people underneath from “Satan’s wrath” as the Church would explain. Think about that – 8,000 people under a tent during a hurricane!
The next morning on Jekyll Island was absolutely a beautiful day and I can remember sitting under the tent hearing the ocean waves off in the not so distant background. Garner Ted Armstrong, the public face of the Worldwide Church of God heard around the world on “The World of Tomorrow” gave a sermon on “Who is your idol?” He quoted scriptures about how God was going to destroy all idols. His final sentence of his sermon which in hindsight is very ironic given Mr. Ted Armstrong’s grave stone contains his engraved signature on it, “If it is true that your idol is YOU, then whom shall God destroy?”
Fast forward to 2016 and the Splintered Worldwide Church of God franchises, to quote Mr. Ted Armstrong in today’s context: “If it is true that your idol is ________ (insert Bob Thiel, Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry, Herbert Armstrong, Rod Meredith, you), then whom shall God destroy?”
Richard
Didn't 1974 fall in the period where "The age of pisces shifts into the age of acquarius" ?
Signalling the end of an "age" as we knew it.
I am not into astrology at all (like every sentence of the book of revelation seems to be), however nowadays it seems the answers to mans problems are being solved in "an exponential" way, leading to "singularity" through modern technology and a change of heart of so many young people all over the world.
nck
"What message does Bob Elijah Elisha Amos Thiel preach that emulates Jesus Christ?"
Well, that's the big question, isn't it?
LOL Byker Bob!
I realize your comment was tongue in cheek about ACOG leaders not trashing Prince since he was a Jehovah's Witness!
I guess it's more because "The Artist Formerly Known as Prince" (or maybe the artist later known as Prince(?)) simply was not on the radar of the ACOG leaders.
Unfortunately, Prince didn't have a song titled, "Tithe and give extra building fund offerings like it's 1975!"
Wrong question.
The question really is:
Is there any end to the idolatry in the church of God?
And by the way, God wants His Name back -- He never gave it to the Armstrongists.
"And by the way, God wants His Name back"
What name?
"Jimmy"?
I think that'd be appropriate because of all the things He's "jimmied"
Anonymous 5:18. I agree about the Jehovah Witnesses. I know some and am quite surprised at the similarity of their religion to WCG. Perhaps they are a bit more oriented to the New Testament, but so much else is the same. Yet WCG used to ridicule them and they were just another false religion. Who is laughing now, the Jehovahs are still strong and have lasted much longer that WCG, and every town it seems has a Kingdom Hall.
I once read an article that many very famous people who I'd never thought, tithed faitfully.
John D. Rockefeller, William Colgate and many others. Not general charity but tithing.
nck
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