Wednesday, August 21, 2013

Dennis Muses: Something Moot This Way Comes...In Ten Days

24 Unreasonable Reasonings
As we enter the last week of August, where Dave Pack has proved beyond all doubt  the amazing Church of God events and reunification that will occur as spoken of by the Minor Prophet Haggai about Dave Pack himself, let's take one final look at the "proof" for all of  this.  Shortly, it will matter not one bit and some will have some 'splanin to do.


Dave writes:
The Time Is NOW!
"Now comes a series of reasons Haggai’s prophecy will be fulfilled this year. They are summarized, with only a very little detail added. More could be said of each, but the descriptions given will suffice to those willing to think just a little about them. Realize there are over 30 more reasons—many of them very powerful—that I have left off the list because some will be covered later or because they would only be recognized as proofs by our Headquarters ministry (involving various miracles, some big). Readers would be largely unable to appreciate them as proofs:"


Dave loves numbered reasons for everything.  30 Proofs of This and 90 Proofs of That are a common approach in his sermons.  Let's take a look.


1) Understanding the meaning of the prophecy, starting with Haggai 1:2, automatically carries the requirement of taking a position on it. This cannot be avoided after one learns it. Think about this....


This assumes there is "understanding" or the understanding is correct to begin with. Dave's view of himself in Haggai as "Joshua" is not correct.  I guarantee you it is not correct.  A genuine understanding of the content and intent of the Book of Haggai guarantees you that Dave has gotten off to a very bad start in all this. I can take this position and be correct where Dave says if you don't agree, you are on the outside of his truth.


2) Directly related, why (or how) would God command the remnant to “Go…build the House!” (Hag. 1:8)—but not mean NOW? How could He mean some undetermined future year? Why would God tell them (twice) to “consider their ways”—but not mean that they should do this now? Try to imagine God saying, “Consider your ways, but take your time. There’s no hurry. In fact, take years to think it over—even though you have been out of My Church for 20 years! You don’t have to DO anything now.”


Well...the entire New Testament is filled with our infamous "time is short," "the hour now is," " of things which must shortly come to pass," and "the day is far spent" comments about just how soon Jesus is coming. Of course that has been 2000 now years so I'd not get to excited about if God would inspire comments or scripture and not meant "Now."   Try to imagine God saying the above statements and saying "Behold I come quickly but  I'm taking my time. I am in no hurry."  Well actually I can imagine that.

3) Also related, if God waited 2,500 years to reveal the prophecy’s meaning (3,000 years when various related much older Psalms are considered), is not His waiting done? Does His revealing it not signal that He has reached the time to fulfill it rather than having reached a point one, two or three years out?


See answer 2


4) Next, why would God wait longer? What would He wait for? The remnant is absolutely ripe for deliverance.


Why not. See answer 2.  There is plenty of proof that God says soon and means later. People are always ripe.

5) Internally, and this is no small thing, God’s Church is truly ready to expand the Work in a BIG WAY. The prophecy features this as the MAIN PURPOSE of the remnant returning! Without the prophecy’s fulfillment, this expansion would be delayed one year—or more! Why would God notify His Church of the prophecy’s existence at the very same time our staff is ready, our websites are ready, our literature is ready and even God’s college is ready for more students if the prophecy were not imminent? Why would God notify His Church if HE were not ready?


There is NO connection between any organization "being ready" and being the organization that is the correct one to be ready.  The Catholic Church has awesome resources and is a bit more "ready" than Dave to do great things which does not prove any Deity is obligated to use them.  Dave is assuming these things mean the Deity IS notifying Dave when it seems Dave is actually notifying the Deity.


Circular Reasoning…… | Wildomar Magazine

6) Related to this, the buildings on our campus can very soon handle significantly more staff than we have now. This is already true without the other two buildings scheduled for completion in the late fall. However, this extra size works perfectly if the prophecy occurs this year.


The Mega-Church down the road from Dave Pack and The Restored Church of God could hold all his buildings within itself.  I had dinner at Christ Church Episcopal Church, Elementary, Middle and High School this week and the Restored Church is nothing. Size matters...


7) Also related, but separate, our infrastructure is ready to receive and serve a much larger flock this fall! This includes field ministry being ready, but also other things.


So what...see #6


8) Maturing interest from many in the world due to one year of explosive television expansion requires many more laborers in the ministry by this autumn.


Let's see the numbers.  How many maturing interests?  How many members make up Restored Church as of today?  How many visit requests?  How many ministers do you have and what are their names?  Where are your current churches?  How much did RCG take in last year?  Co Worker types?   We need to have you be about the numbers on this one.  What does "explosive" mean?


9) The Restored Church of God is experiencing an AWESOME period of growth and development at this time—in the runup period just prior to the prophecy’s fulfillment. This is putting it mildly! To us, this is powerful indication that we are on the right track for this year—that God is not only pleased with His Church, but that He is helping it get ready.


"To us..." is very telling.  That is not the same as "God is..."  By these standards, God is pleased with many churches.  God is well pleased with Joel Olsteen and Benny Hinn.


10) If the prophecy did not happen this year, the remnant would remain another year (or more) undergoing ever worsening false ways. Worse off, they would have a commensurate shorter time to spiritually recover before the Tribulation. Think worse condition, less time to recover.


Any you know this?  Soaking in "false ways" is what humans do for thousands of years on end. One more won't hurt.  I'm suspecting Dave might be concerned about one year with him having less access to their money. Could be just me.

Before You Accuse Someone of Circular Reasoning, Make Sure You Are


11) If reunification occurred next year (or any year after), those with God’s Spirit would have one more year cut off from God’s Church. This carries the potential for more to quench the Holy Spirit (I Thes. 5:19) and lose salvation.


So what Dave?  That is not your responsibility.  You sound as if only you have the power to bring them in now so such things don't occur.  If any Deity wanted them to not suffer another year's loss, he/she knows how to finish the good work done in them I'm pretty sure, if I recall scripture correctly.  You're not the mother.


12) The readers of the Haggai prophecy announcements (this is #21) who believed them would be the most disillusioned and the biggest candidates to QUIT everything if God did not return His people to one House this year! This would work directly against what God is doing—directly opposite His overall purpose.


Now you have hit the nail on the head.  And they will be the most disillusioned.  But who wants illusions anyway so it's a good thing.  Dave is  skating on thin ice this reason.  This may be the only real prophecy he makes that actually comes true.


13) Further desolation (Hag. 1:11; 2:16-17) from God of the splinter “houses” would practically wipe out the few remaining senior leaders in them. This includes pastors and elders, all of whom are NEEDED TO CARRY OUT THE BIG WORK!


So what.  "God is able of these stone to raise up..."  I think Dave wants the instant version of things and few organizations , if any, materialize instantly manned and ready to go.  Setting dates, times and seasons where something "must" happen is going to prove a dangerous game and huge mistake.  It's called a Weinlander in COG code.


14) The onset of all future years would never come with clarity—with any certainty! Would God leave thousands who are now aware of this prophecy in such a condition? Hardly.


Like it has to date?  This is a ridiculous reasoning.  In the New Testament all the Apostles and zealous unnamed deacons, elders, and members were dead wrong about the times they lived in.  Paul was totally wrong about Jesus return and had to eat crow at the end of his life claiming "there is laid up for me....." before he died. That original debacle has indeed made all future years unclear which is why thousands of humans have predicted the end that never comes over the past 2000 of them. It's reasonable to see the rise of "scoffers."  They really are just noticing reality.


15) Next, for those who will see the value of how to pursue spiritual matters, there is this: After fervently seeking God about it, not one reason the prophecy is off this year ever emerged in the minds of even one of our 16 Headquarters ministers! I (we) have NEVER prayed about, studied over, meditated on, fasted about and counseled with other ministers regarding a subject more than this one—in fact no other subject is even close!


Oh mercy Lord Jesus.  Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot and Stalin were very confident of their decisions for the very same reasons.  I think we know why.  Praying and studying "fervently" is no proof of being correct.  I had done that for years over many topics all of which fell apart.  "Dear Lord, please bless the work and guide Mr. Armstrong" and "Help me to be the best minister for your people" come to mind.  Time would fail to speak of fervent prayer for children dying who died anyway.  Besides, your 16 headquarters types know not to cross Dave.


16) Similarly, as questions emerged throughout our pursuit of truth with the many details of the prophecy, so many of these details kept coming clear as direct answers to prayer. And these were often immediate.


Edgar  Cayce got details quickly too.  Dirrhea can hit suddenly and immediately but that is not a sign of good digestion.

17) Recall Haggai 1:13: “Then spoke Haggai the Lord’s messenger in the Lord’s message unto the people…” Haggai is the messenger to God’s people, with what is an all-important message from God. Would not God make clear in such a unique message He describes as “the Lord’s message unto His people” the correct date for action? What kind of message would it be if people did not know WHEN TO CARRY IT OUT?


You keep repeating this "would not God ...if it wasn't" thing.  This is not a new reason.  Besides, the "his people" were the Jews of Haggai's time because why would God say that in Haggai to his people if he did not mean his people then?  Why would "his people'" be people 2500 years into the future.  I'm using your own reasoning here Dave.

18) Since the apostasy, God had not wanted the remnant back in His Church, but now He does. He would first reveal the remnant to His leader, then tell him how they would return, and finally that He meant NOW. This was the order in which these things became apparent.


Yikes...and you know this?  So we've gone through all this so you could be God's man when God got around to it and THEN we get some relief?  I think Dave tends to tell the Deity what must be and when and not the other way around.  This "his leader" thing is troubling.  It is one of the few times Dave won't say "me."  Is this wiggle room?




19) Imagine God not revealing the year the remnant is coming—but only the day and month. Vast amounts of time would have been wasted by His leaders studying and preparing for something that was not imminent. Would God put His Church in such a position?


This of course assume God revealed any actual day or month.  Vast amounts of time are being wasted.  God put the early church in just such a position by turning "soon" into "but a day with the Lord is as a thousand years....and a thousand years as a day."  This is called an apologetic.  It was written in II Peter, not by Peter but later by church leader types who to reexplain the first century debacle of "soon" and "time is short."  Not to mention, "of things which must shortly come to pass."


20) Of interest, God revealed to me during ELUL four years ago my role as the modern Joshua.


Gotcha!  If God revealed this to Dave four years ago, would not God have revealed it to the church four years ago? Why would God reveal it if it was not the time to tell everyone?  I'm just using Dave's reasoning on other proofs.  Was it in a vision?  Was it in a dream?   Tell us this reveal story please.  Or did Dave just read the Bible and say, "hey...that's ME!"


21) Also of interest, I and The Restored Church of God learned about the New Testament remnant last ELUL (August). Let’s ask: Would timing of when we were shown the prophecy not be tied to its unique timing of fulfillment during the very next available ELUL?


This is not interesting at all.   I'm wondering of some lackey and kiss up told Dave that he was Joshua and that was the starting point.  HWA never thought of being a Apostle until someone told him he was one.  It was all downhill from there. See # 19 and # 20


22) We might ask: does the DEVIL know the prophecy is on? For those who understand how the devil works—that he counterfeits EVERYTHING God does—a variety of counterfeit theories have recently appeared about how God is going to reunite His people. Should not the devil be expected to do this at the time it would cause the most confusion? You will soon see that most of these theories are coming from men standing on the wrong side of this prophecy.


Maybe the others have it right and Dave is the Devil's version?  Maybe pots are calling kettles black here?  I think we will soon see that Dave is standing in the muck of prophecy up to his eyeballs. 

23) With God’s people split up, it is now almost impossible to do a powerful Work. (This might be the one area where the splinter leaders would agree.) God’s Church is largely stymied in working with both brethren and the world because of the confusion and deception from top leaders about where God’s Church is, who has the truth, who is carrying on after Mr. Armstrong, who is doing the true Work, etc. (Reread #22.) There is no other way to proceed than for God to remove leaders who have lulled with deceit many thousands who were blind (Rev. 3:17) to begin with.


Unless of course none of you matter to any Deity and you are on the wrong tracks theologically to begin with. 

24) World conditions cry out for a big Work NOW!!!—not one or more years from now.


World conditons have always cried out "NOW"     "How long oh Lord wilt thou not avenge...." comes to mind.  That was 2000 years ago as well.  Actually world conditions cry out for "way back then."

So there you have it.  Dave calls these reasonings "powerful."  I don't.  When the premise is wrong everything that follows is as well.  This is a great example of this. Why bring this up now again?  Because in a mere 10 days none of this will matter.  Life will go on.  The world will have it's problems.  The economy will get closer to tanking and more people will get tazed for talking back to cops.  But the road to Wadsworth will be crowded on Saturday with folk going to Walmart, not church. 

  Contact Dennis at DennisCDiehl@aol.com

Monday, August 19, 2013

This is a musing...

"Where in the World are The Splinters?"
 
"In six short weeks, the “Church of God landscape” will forever change. Saturday, August 31 will be a Sabbath unlike any other in history. It will be the first time in decades that all of God’s people around the world will be meeting together in the same locations for services. Words cannot describe the excitement and happiness that will be everywhere soon after this reunification. In many areas, much of or possibly even entire congregations might “roll over” into The Restored Church of God. Brethren will have had weeks to prepare for this and to “consider their ways” before God. Those who come will have been led to return to the Body of Christ the day before this Sabbath. Reread this last sentence."
Screed #23

 

DANGER: Golf's Ticking Time Bomb  

" I tell you...they are coming.  They are....  You people just don't have faith!  God would not have revealed the real meaning of Haggai in a year different from the year it was going to happen.  Think!  Consider!  Ask why you don't get it. How many proofs do I have to give!"
(I made this one up...for now)
 
 
Well, here we are.  Getting into the last week of August and still nothing much on the horizon as far as Exodus 2013 is concerned.  At least nothing visible on my end.  I can't imagine if there had not been some major defections especially by men of renoun, Dave would not have spoken up to at least use it for advertising and propaganda.  I could be wrong.  Maybe there are lines of ministers right now being processed and tested , hidden away in sound proof booths with their cell phones confiscated.
 
 

Stalag IV-B/Z, WWII POW Camp

Reporting For Ministry Mr. Pack...Sir!


I imagine there are look outs posted all around the grounds for signs of unusual traffic and movement into Wadsworth and towards God's Headquarters.


Photo Gallery -

"No Sir..we're looking.  We don't see anything yet."

 

Changes: a new brand is being born

"Yes Sir...of course we're looking out the entrance towards Giant Eagle.
 
 

Hotelblues.com » Gallery » Screen Shots » Bad Hotel » Hotel Watch

"No Sir...I'm sorry.  The parking lots aren't filled up yet.  We have a few spaces left"
 
 

Walgreens

"Sir!  I think I see a group from United coming onto the property!"
 
 
Become a Zombie for The Walking Dead | The Walking Dead Podcast

"Oh sorry Sir...my bad.  It's the group who want their retirements and 401k's back from last week."

 

Banned by HWA! Books, News and Observations About Armstrongism and

"Yes Sir, that's exactly where we referred them."

 

GRANT HATFIELD: April 2010

                                                   

" Yes Sir...we'll look again.  Where are you looking Sir?  Oh wait!   Yes we see that too..."
 
 

FRAME BY FRAME: PROTEST

"No sorry Sir...that's just those former employee kids again...Yes sir, the ones you called demon possessed in church for not sitting still while you spoke."

 

Cloud Corridor - WWII Airmen in Captivity

"Yes Sir, we see them too.  Those are the staff you just let go and took their fleet cars."

 

Toronto Real Estate and Neighbourhoods Blog | Move Smartly: Ed's

"We do have a second minister here wanting an audience.  He doesn't want to say which splinter he is from until he knows he passes the test."

 

Gordon Campbell » Blog Archive » WTF: Beating up on Goff

"Oh sorry Sir...we thought you said 'fork him.  Our bad."

 

August | 2011 | troopytracks

"No...just be a bit more patient Sir.  I'm sure they are all getting gas even as we speak."

 

Keep Your Eyes Peeled on Behance

"Yes sir.  As painful as that sounds, we will do that Sir and let you know if we see anything happening."

 

8 Common Small Business Marketing Problems - Results Easy

"Hi Sir..No Sir. Not much going on here.  It could happen Sir."

 

Ticking Clock

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sunday, August 18, 2013

Ron Weinland: Ron Writes About Sex While In Prison



It's a well known fact that many times when people scream and shout about something they hate, they are actually dipping into the pie they claim to despise.  It is also a well know fact that those incarcerated in prison for long periods of time turn their sexual thoughts over to other things.

Weinerdude is back with his latest missal about sex.  Why are all the  Armstrongite ministurds that lead the various splinter groups sooooooooooooooooooo occupied with sex?

Has his time being incarcerated with Big Bubba brought some sexual thoughts into Weinerdudes head?  Does Laura, the 2nd Witness, and devoted spender of tithe money have some competition right now?

Weinerdude, or as he is affectionately known on other boards as Conland Swineland, truly has to be the biggest idiots the Church of God has right now.  He writes some of the most incredibly stupid things possible and the fact that there are a small group of people who believe his stuff show how sick a COG mind can get.
“Therefore God also gave them over to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts (which becomes magnified by hormones) to dishonor their own bodies between themselves. Who changed the truth of God into a lie…” (Rom. 1:24-25).

"The more that people turn to sin (any kind of sin), the more unsound and distorted their thinking, choices, and behavior becomes toward the subject of sex. Sin distorts and perverts all thinking, but it is more manifest in the area of sexual thought, emotion, and conduct. The product of this “wrong thinking” regarding sex then leads to distorted judgment, feelings (emotion), and communications in relationships. Through Paul, God reveals part of this process and correlation in thinking and behavior.

"This process begins by people moving farther away from living in agreement to the awesomely beautiful enhancement to the marriage relationship that God created mankind to be able to experience together as husband and wife. Marriage between a man and a woman was created to be the closest and most important relationship that mankind is able to experience in all human relationships. The sexual part of that relationship is an important part of the overall relationship and reveals much about each individual separately and also the ability of both (as a couple) becoming “one” as family. The sexual relationship between one man and one woman in marriage was created to be natural, healthy, beautiful, endearing, binding, and exciting in producing one of the most giving and receiving experiences that two people can share together in life."
"Finally, however, what has changed over the past century due to a world cursed with greed and misuse of scientific knowledge, the world today is plagued with an over abundance of dangerous chemicals that can and do alter the proper healthy functioning of the human body that God so perfectly created to exist in a physical world. Large quantities of chemicals are added to foods we eat, ingested or injected as medications or used in other medically evasive practices, as well as the excessive use of chemicals in every imaginable area of agriculture. Animals are given medications, steroids (growth hormones), and other growth altering drugs, which then enter the food chain as meat, milk, eggs, etc. The genetics of plants (for produce, grains, etc.) have been altered (unnatural) which humans then consume. Although everyone is assured that these are “safe,” these were not what God created the human body to consume or be exposed to.

"This cycle goes on and on, but it has produced changes in the children being born and changes in children as their bodies are growing and many of these very things actually work to alter the chemical makeup in a person (hormone production as an example, and other chemical regulators of the human body and mind) which can produce a different sex mindset than what one has been born with physically. Such things are also the cause of many diseases and illnesses. Many know as young children that they are different and think differently than much of society around them. Today, we are all the product of a cursed and sick world (physically, mentally, and spiritually), which is the product of 6,000 years of mankind’s rejection of God.

"As the subject of homosexuality has just been addressed, it also needs to be stated that having such feelings, emotions and pulls are not sins, but the practice and lust of it is sin. This is just as true for those who are naturally drawn to those of the opposite sex. Such is not sin, but the practice of sexual relations outside of marriage is sin, as is lust and the fantasizing that is so often associated with it."