Saturday, May 27, 2023

Dave Pack: The Trial and Error Church of Another god


Trial and Error


To further advance his growing Empire of Speculation, David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God introduced a solid-gold Accountability Shield to further protect him from all biblical responsibilities. Bible prophecy is a process of trial and error, folks. The Pastor General’s desperation knows no bounds.


“The Greatest Unending Story! (Part 444)” on May 20, 2023, was followed by Part 445 on May 24. Part 444 reset the table, but Part 445 tossed a bunch of 444 into the trash to reset the table again. Though, for real, this one last time.


Per Part 444 on May 20:


•  The Kingdom Is Not Coming on May 21.

•  "If Correct," The Kingdom Comes on May 23 But Must be Before May 25.

•  1-1-7-1K Kingdom Structure Iddn’t Gonna Change.

•  Sabbath and Pentecost Constitute “God’s Weekend.”

•  Simpler One Month Kingdom: 18-2-10-3.5


Per Part 445 on May 24:


•  No Kingdom on May 23 or 25.

•  1-1-7-1K Kingdom Structure Changes to 1-7-1K.

•  No One Month Kingdom, But Is Part of The First.

•  The Kingdom To Israel Is Inside The Kingdom of God.

•  The One Year First Kingdom of God Is 390 Days.

•  “God’s Weekend” Never Mind.

•  The Kingdom of God Arrives on Pentecost at Sunrise in Jerusalem



Tired of being quoted verses about false prophets and false teachers, David C. Pack found a verse he could mangle just enough to give him cover for seven-and-a-half years of Prophetic Groundhog Days.

Part 444 – May 20, 2023

@ 00:14 Thought I would explain something to you that might be very interesting and helpful… Prophecy (a third of the Bible) is different than (and really contrasted to) all other doctrines. It’s almost not a doctrine. It’s doctrine. It’s many, many doctrines in one. But, when you study prophecy, you study knowing in part, and it requires a certain trial and error because the amount of it is just so vast. There’s trial and error. You see a scenario. You play it out. It looks good. It has some strengths. Then, eventually, things don't work, and you break it down, and you start again. It's trial and error. You know in part and if God’s guiding, you know a little more and a little more.


He compares prophecy to doctrines like tithing, the Sabbath, and Holy Days. But prophecy is different. He perverts the meaning of 1 Corinthians 13:9, “For we know in part, and we prophesy in part,” and finds another Get Out Of Jail Free Card to play.


During Part 373, David C. Pack explained, “I’m telling, not foretelling.”


During Part 425, he redefined “inspired preaching” to mean “teaching what the Bible says.”


Now, during Part 444, teaching Bible prophecy “requires a certain trial and error.”


Each step defuses the discernment that he is a false prophet and a false teacher. Excuse piled upon excuse piled upon excuse. David C. Pack found another way to “explain away” his persistent failures while also absolving himself of all responsibility for those failures.


He is just a victim of the process, brethren, and not a perpetrator of biblical fraud handling the word of God deceitfully. So, it is okay to continue to pay him to set dates because, by design, one-third of the Bible was always meant to be approached this way.


Part 444 – May 20, 2023

@ 03:10 But prophecy is different. God nowhere says you know about the Sabbath in part. Or tithing in part. Or the Holy Days on unclean meat. There's no other place in the Bible regarding any other subject, any other doctrine where you know in part.



David C. Pack admits that Bible prophecy is basically a guessing game. Except, he seemed torn as to what prophecy is. “It’s almost not a doctrine. It’s doctrine. It’s many, many doctrines in one.”


It's not. It is. It's many. That is another sign of the divided house between his ears.



a belief or set of beliefs held and taught by a Church, political party, or other group


Bible prophecy is a doctrine, despite how Dave wants to frame it. Setting a date for the return of Jesus Christ and having it fail still constitutes being a false prophet, despite how Dave wants to frame it.


The revelation that understanding Bible prophecy requires trial and error was such a huge relief for Dave he expanded on it four days later.

Part 445 – May 24, 2023

@ 00:29 …regarding prophecy, we know in part. Requiring trial and error. To some degree, you could say, "hit and miss." We have to piecemeal our way to develop the picture. And I contrasted this approach to other doctrines. I think I cited seven.


@ 01:00 Many found I heard this from many, actually, quite a few. I think, including ministers. Members and ministers. Many found this very helpful.


The people at Headquarters who found this new unbiblical concept helpful are the most pitiful in The Restored Church of God. Perhaps they got the same sense of relief Dave did because it gives a plausible excuse for why he cannot get anything right. It removes accountability for teaching fraud but also eliminates the responsibility of the members to obey the Bible and hold their human idol accountable.


The brethren are not being defrauded. They are enduring. That must have soothed the consciences of many still holding on despite knowing they continue to tithe to The Restored Church of Another god.


It is like when a cheating husband gains relief from guilt because he discovers that his wife has also been cheating. Something uncomfortable suddenly becomes a win/win situation.



After listing all the correct doctrines RCG still holds on to, including the truth about hair pieces and tattoos, Dave finds another way to transfer the blame onto others. It is always the fault of those who leave and never about what and how he taught.

Part 445 – May 24, 2023

@ 03:20 We have, we teach, and we know the Truth. All of it. I might ask, Why ever leave over prophetic trial and error when we’ve learned so much more than others who know so little?… Because it involved piecemeal, some hit-and-miss, and trial and error.


You can now add piecemeal to the process. The Bible must be filled with the concept of hit-and-miss. If you can find those verses, please email My version of e-Sword seems to be lacking them.


@ 03:56 All those other doctrines are clear. They’re taught in a very clean and clear way… But not when you're talking about one-third of the Bible. So, as I’ve said all through the Series, people who wanna leave because we can’t get the third right when we’re moving way beyond everybody else on that and already have the rest of the truth, they just don’t wanna obey God. They just don’t wanna obey God.


The Restored Church of God

Two Out Of Three Ain’t Bad™


The idea that one-third of the Bible was not taught in a clean, clear way so that God’s people could discern a false teacher from a true one never enters the discussion.


May God have mercy on David Crowl Pack.


His blindness continually denies any and all responsibility for causing the little ones to stumble. He is NEVER the cause.


If that one sheep wandered off from the flock—good riddance. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. No millstones are engraved with Dave’s name because those who left RCG “just don’t wanna obey God.” Easy-peasy.



Now that "trial and error" has become an official doctrine of The Restored Church of God, the brethren can look forward to an unapologetic continuation of the Series after Pentecost fails to produce anything beyond stuffed green envelopes.

Part 445 – May 24, 2023

@ 45:10 Dawn in Jerusalem is the only time when the entire world dawn in Jerusalem when the entire world is inside Pentecost. Either just crept into it or just about to pass out. It’s “fully come” to the whole planet worldwide.


@ 47:28 So, what the disciples were asking is exactly what we’re asking. Only finally, trial and error, piecemeal, you know, here a little, there a little, hit and miss. We have pinned down, or we're pinning down when I'm done, I'm gonna give you about forty-eight things; we'll have given you that many that point to Pentecost that appear to make it impossible to move away from.


Pentecost—May 28, 2023

Sunrise in Jerusalem: 5:35 AM (May 27 at 10:35 PM ET)

Sunrise in Wadsworth: 5:59 AM ET


@ 1:15:21 What other day would you pick? I mean, if it’s not Pentecost, it’s gonna take a better person than I to ever be able to explain it. It’s just above my pay grade.


Better Future Dave has already phoned ahead to accept the challenge. Do not be surprised when more “clarifying” comes out of Headquarters this weekend.


@ 1:21:58 But, if it’s not Pentecost, then I don’t know what it is.


By the time I sip my morning coffee tomorrow, David C. Pack will have erred again before the entire church. Those who choose to put their green envelopes in the basket are willing to accept they now attend The Trial and Error Church of Another god.


You get what you pay for. Prepare to keep getting more of it.



A famous quote by W.C. Field applies to Parts 444 and 445.


“If at first don’t succeed, try, try again…”


It is the lesser-known second-half that perfectly applies to David C. Pack.


“Then quit. No use being a damn fool about it.”


David C. Pack is a damn fool too arrogant to know when to quit. The brethren of The Trial and Error Church of Another god are proving they agree with a damn fool and want to keep supporting one. Shame upon both your houses.


To cling to a "trial and error" philosophy is to accept perpetual defeat into the vanishing point. It also proves that ERROR is half of the equation. Which Spirit guides that thinking, the Spirit of Truth or the Spirit of Error?


You also cannot have “hit-and-miss” with David C. Pack because he is ALL miss and NEVER hit. Pentecost tomorrow will only be the most recent example.


Even the Prophets of Baal knew when to give up and let Elijah call upon God. They were instantly proven false when the fire burned the water along with the sacrifice. The brook Kishon drank much blood that day.


It took self-aggrandizing prophecy expert David Crowl Pack the vast experience of fifty years to reach his ultimate conclusion of the matter: Bible prophecy requires trial and error.


Moses, Gad, Nathan, Ahijah, Samuel, Elijah, Elisha, Shemaiah, Iddo, Oded, Huldah, Hosea, Habakkuk, Zechariah, Ezekiel, Jeremiah, Daniel, Nahum, Amos, Isaiah, Joel, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Zephaniah, Malachi, and Agabus would all disagree.


Talk about a great cloud of witnesses that David C. Pack is a biblical fraud, a false apostle, and a false prophet. Also, being a blaspheming liar and hypocrite does help his case for legitimacy.


Abraham understood that even with God, there comes a point where there are not enough righteous left in Sodom to keep it from burning.


How many righteous remain in The Restored Church of God?


Do not stick around to find out. Get out while you still can.



For those who have not yet done so, please read Jessica Brown’s Plea to the Parents of RCG and Adelle Ambrose’s Plea to the Young People of RCG.

Marc Cebrian

See: Trial and Error

The Diminishment of the Holy Spirit: Arianism, Rupertism, and Finally Armstrongism


Theology and Experimenting with Photons


The Diminishment of the Holy Spirit

Arianism, Rupertism, and Finally Armstrongism

By Scriptor

“Rupert's theories were later influential on Herbert W. Armstrong, who adopted many of his ideas about church eras and Jewish holy day observance, along with his British Israelist genealogies of western peoples.[2][3] Clarence Orvil Dodd introduced Armstrong to Rupert's ideas.” (Wikipedia, Article on G. G. Rupert)

A Brief History of the Arianist View of the Holy Spirit

The idea of the Holy spirit really bothers some people. Sometimes I think it is because he is sometimes referred to as the Holy Ghost. And the idea of a ghost, a dead person walking around, makes some people cringe. I doubt that this is what influenced the thinking of Arius, an ascetic, North African clergyman, back in about 300 A.D. Who knows why he thought what he did, really. He was a handsome guy that women found charming and he had novel ideas about God. You know the type. Arius conjectured that God was not a Trinity. He seemed to be all right with the Father, but Jesus and the Holy Spirit must have bothered him. He asserted that Jesus was actually a created being and was subordinate to God even though Jesus created all things. Jesus, after all, was begotten. Arius seems to have cast the scriptural ideas of Incarnation and Kenosis aside. This reduced Jesus to a role similar to that of a Demiurge in Gnostic belief. And the Holy Spirit was not a Person but the illuminating and sanctifying power of God. These views developed into the one-off theology of Arianism. Though Arianism was condemned as a heresy beginning about 325 A.D., some people have clung to it down through the centuries. 

So, fast forward to the Nineteenth Century and an apocalyptic movement called Millerism. Professor Woodrow Whidden describes the 19th Century Adventist Movement as having “a rather pervasive, Arian, Semi-Arian and legalistic mindset.” Out of this seething cauldron of apocalypticism and dashed expectations came the ideas that influenced G.G. Rupert. Rupert, a man with a long scraggly beard, had some ill-defined relationship with the Church of God Seventh Day and started his own organization called The Remnant of Israel with its own publication and based near Oklahoma City (we might say the WCG “in embryo”). And then later we find Herbert W. Armstrong (HWA), influenced by the theology of the Church of God Seventh Day and Rupertism, holding a belief in a Semi-Arian doctrine of God.

The term “Armstrongism” is a misnomer although its colloquial use is likely to continue. Armstrongism is really a form of Rupertism and HWA was really a disciple of G. G. Rupert. If God withheld the truth for eighteen and a half centuries and then revealed it, he revealed it to Rupert and not HWA. HWA only added some syncretistic touches to this essential body of Rupertist “truth”.

The Personhood of the Holy Spirit

The Holy Spirit is a Person even though he is referred to in scripture with literary metaphors. God is referred to as a Rock in the OT, for instance, but that is not an ontological statement, just a metaphor. The Bible is replete with allegory, replete with metaphor. It is the bane of Biblical literalists who find themselves having to continually make decisions about what is literal and what is figurative, if anything. Wisdom is personified in Proverbs, for instance. Could then the Holy Spirit, described as a sentient being in the New Testament, just be a personification? The answer of course is "No." Here are a couple of reasons why:

1. God is absolute. He spoke the heavens and the earth into existence. He does not need a divine “tractor beam” (q.v., Star Trek) to accomplish things like an artisan reliant on a tool. If he wants the motion of the sun to stop, it will stop. He can make the sun exist or not exist as it pleases him. He does not need to dispatch an energy to a remote location and expend unimaginable numbers of ergs to halt the motion of the sun. He does not need to control reality with the aid of a force; he creates reality. It exists because he exists. This means that all the language in scripture that uses terms from the physical universe (“pour out”, etc.) to speak about the Spirit is allegorical.

2. Another compelling argument supporting the Holy Spirit as a Person is a simple one. There is what are called Triadic Formulae in the New Testament. Matthew 28:18 is an explicit example. The verse mentions Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Why would the NT authors list the Holy Spirit as syntactically equal with the Father and the Son if the Holy Spirit were not a sentient being? From context, the Triads are clearly non-metaphorical. Their description of God is literal and not lyrical – ontological and not liturgical metaphor. While the language used in scripture that portrays the Spirit using physical processes (“poured out”) seems appropriate to the context, the Triadic context is not suited to metaphor. God would not inspire a Triad using Father, Son and Holy Spirit at syntactical and existential parity that consists of two literal Persons plus a mere metaphor. While metaphor is used liberally in scripture, it is intended to illustrate and not confuse.

Some argue against the Personhood of the Holy Spirit by observing that he is not included in passages where he might be expected. Citing scriptures that seem like they should include the Holy Spirit but they do not is an apophatic argument. It is like the glib argument of atheists when they state “I looked for God in the sky and did not see him so he doesn’t exist.” Maybe their Looking Methodology is flawed or presumptive. Moreover, the apophatic arguments do not have the weight of cataphatic arguments. The existence of Triadic Formulae is cataphatic. They are declarative statements of a relationship between three subjects who are syntactically equal because the three subjects are ontologically equal. While the apophatic argument may or may not have cogency (the data is non-determinative), the cataphatic statements most certainly do. Any renunciation of the Personhood of the Holy Spirit must rationally dissolve these cataphatic Triads.

Drawing on Quantum Mechanics

I am not invoking quantum mechanics here to seem impressive. Paul does say there is a role for Natural Theology in this statement: “Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So, they have no excuse for not knowing God.” Some will use this statement to assert that God has a body like a natural man based on a literal interpretation of some OT language. But let us go deeper with Paul’s idea. If God has a body, then he has locality. If he has locality, say at point A in spacetime, then he is not at point B. He must somehow travel the distance between point A and B to arrive at point B. And when he is at point B, he is not at point A. This means that God is bound by distance. It even makes sense that he must ride a cherubim to get from place to place. And the idea that he must use a power or energy or force (aka Holy Spirit of Arius) to remotely manipulate the properties of the distant Cosmos is then plausible.

Let me ruin this Arian view by pointing out that there is something in quantum mechanics called quantum entanglement. Theology must be informed by science. In brief, if two photons (a quantum or particle of light) are entangled, they both react to external forces in a perfectly correlated way without regard to distance. The last four words of that sentence are critical to this understanding. “Without regard to distance.” If a photon is made to react, its entangled photon twin will also react with no delay in time and no matter how distant it is away. So, at some level in reality, the concept of distance does not even exist. Why then would God, who created and now sustains reality, be bound by the concept of distance implicit in a bodily existence – a concept of distance that does not even exist at every level of the Cosmos he has created. So, the idea of God operating the universe at distance through a force or energy called the Holy Spirit fails. God is absolute. He created spacetime and is not bound by it. In his realm, there is no time and there is no space. The model which has God using an energy to control the Cosmos remotely is a peculiar literal interpretation of archaic Hebraisms that are intended for literary purposes.


The Holy Spirit is a Person. Arius, long ago rejected by the church, was wrong and G.G. Rupert and other Millerites should not have paid any attention to him. The syntax of the Triads seals the Holy Spirit into the God class as a sentient Person. God is not going to be restricted by distance when the photons he created are not. I believe it is time for all Arians and Semi-Arians to reconsider their theology.

The god's of Gerald Flurry

As Gerald Flurry recovers from one health issue after another his writing abilities have quickly diminished. The Philadelphia Church of God now pulls old articles he has written.

In yesterdays mailing to thier email list they had an article up that Flurry wrote in 2014 on what they claim is the "True Gospel".

At the very beginning of the article the train wrecks and never recovers. Flurry scornfully mocks Christian belief that's sustained Christians for centuries until Armstrongism came along and dumped those beliefs in the trash can and created a "new" gospel.

Flurry mocks all the things that tick off the legalists in the Church of God movement - Jesus, salvation, grace, the social gospel, and more.

Even within Christianity, there are a variety of different gospels: the gospel about Jesus Christ, the gospel of salvation, the gospel of grace, the gospel of the Kingdom, the social gospel, the Israel message—and many more. Confusion.

What is the true gospel? Even practicing Christians have lost it! And the gospel is everything! That’s what the entire message of the Bible is about!

Flurry then lobs another dinger that he believes invalidates all other Christians except himself, though what he did was invalidate himself but is too blind ot see it. 

The Apostle Paul knew the true gospel and preached it. And notice what he wrote to the people of God in Galatia: “But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:8-9). Paul pronounced a double curse on himself or any man, or even an angel, who preached any other gospel.

We have to know what the true gospel is. We do not want to follow the gospel of men whom God has double-cursed! It is extremely important to get this right! This subject affects our eternal lives. 

Flurry and his mini-me son Lil'Stevie a red the ones accused. They preach anything they can to get out of preaching about Jesus, grace, justification, sanctification, and a myriad of other topics related to Jesus' salvational work. They lead their followers to follow the "gospel of men who are doubly cursed". 

Even more silliness permeates the article:

Read those words one more time: “The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.” Why does Mark mention the Son of God with the gospel? Isn’t “Jesus Christ” enough? No, it isn’t. You need “Jesus Christ, the Son of God.” That is not an embellishment—it is a critical understanding. We have to understand what this gospel is all about, and the Son of God is a truly important part of it!

If there is a Son of God, there must also be a Father.

To understand this truth, look at the Gospel of John. He begins by describing a time when only God and the Word existed. “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God” (John 1:1). Notice, this verse mentions God and the Word, but it does not talk about Father and Son. If you put this together with other scriptures, you see that God became the Father, and the Word became the Son. Why? Because of a great master plan that God has, not only for His Son but also for all the billions of people who have ever lived—even those who, to this point, have never heard the name of Christ!

There was a point in history when the Word gave up His divinity and became a tiny cell, and God begat Him in Mary’s womb (John 1:14). At that point, the Word became the Son of the Father. There was Father and Son—there was family.

Why? What is that all about? It’s about you! It’s a plan for you and for me and for all mankind! “The gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God,” is about the God Family.

The original apostles are rolling in the graves now when they realize what they taught has been perverted to this kind of nuttiness centuries later.

Flurry then resorts to the tired and worn-out mantra of Armstrongism:

Here is where people make many mistakes. “And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many” (Matthew 24:4-5). He wasn’t warning about many people claiming to beChrist. He was prophesying that many people would be talking about Christ! They say Jesus is the Christ—they preach a gospel about the person of Christ. But they ignore the good news that Christ brought! The true gospel, the real good news of Jesus Christ, is not about the person of Christ—yet that is exactly where Christianity goes off track. “Manyshall come in my name,” Christ warned. Many have come with a message about Christ, and they have deceived many. This has happened, and it continues to happen.

Logic continues its downhill slide with Herbert's nonsense:

Herbert W. Armstrong knew the Bible like few men on Earth ever have. Five months before he died, in the August 1985 edition of the Good News magazine, he addressed this very subject of the gospel of the Kingdom of God. “And what was that gospel message?” he wrote. “It was the news of the coming Kingdom of God. And what is the Kingdom of God? It is the divine Family of God, ruling all Earth’s nations with the government of God” (emphasis mine throughout).  

At some point, when the world is filled with so many gods and goddesses, who is there left to rule over? What's the point of all this silliness? After their so-called millennium is over and everyone is now a god or goddess, what is there left to rule over? Is it to be given a planet filled with other gods and goddesses where you will be in charge? Why would you need to be in charge of other gods? Are they less than those trained in Armstrongism? If you are equal to Jesus in god stature, why does he need to be second in command over the other gods and goddesses? After all, it has been ingrained in Armstrongite followers' heads that they will be gods ruling over others. Armstrongites never think things totally through.

Friday, May 26, 2023

Crackpot Prophet On Becoming God Just Like Jesus


Crackpot Bwana Bob must have been smoking some of his herbs peddles in the back stockroom of his profoundly superfantabulous world headquarters in Central CA yesterday. In his weekly letter to his small flock of faithful who might actually care what he writes, he said this:

Now Jesus was not only the first of the firstfruits, He was also the firstborn among many brethren:

29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren (Romans 8:29).
5 Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead (Revelation 1:5). 
Since Jesus is the firstborn, this certainly implies that there will become others who are to be like Him. Thus, becoming like Jesus Christ is also part of the message of Pentecost. Of course the idea of becoming like Christ is taught throughout the Bible and is not limited to Pentecost. Notice what John wrote:

2 …we shall be like Him (1 John 3:2).

This is one of the many lies of Armstrongism and dates back to the time the church sees sin entering the world when the serpent enticed Adam and Eve to eat of the fruit.

The false promise that man can become God goes as far back as the first man, Adam. When Adam and Eve were in the Garden of Eden the only negative commandment God gave them was not to eat of fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The serpent appeared to them and disputed God:

For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil (Genesis 3:5).

When they ate of the fruit they did not become as God as the serpent promised. Rather they brought sin into the world and were banished from God's presence. Satan, however, has been telling people that lie ever since. And, unfortunately, people still believe it.  This Is A False Promise

The Nature Of God Prohibits It

The reason humankind cannot become God is because of the nature of God. God did not become God at some certain point. He has been, is, and always will be God. He is the eternal infinite God. There is nothing lacking in His character and He needs nothing to exist. He is adequate in and by Himself.

Moreover He is the only God who now exists or ever will exist:

Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel, and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts; I am the First and I am the Last; besides me there is no God (Isaiah 44:6).

Isaiah also wrote.

You are my witnesses, says the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me, and understand that I am he. Before me there was no God formed, nor shall there be after me (Isaiah 43:10). 


But to believe that we shall “become God” contradicts the Bible’s teaching about the nature of God. God is one being, not many separate beings. God is eternal and uncreated. But we do not have a past eternity, and we were created by God. Therefore, we are less than God, and can never be all that God is, and we can never be God, for that word implies being eternal, being uncreated, and being all-powerful. We do not have life within ourselves, as does God. We must be given life by God. He will give us eternal life, but that life is not inherent in us, and we cannot give it to others, as God can.

Some people use John 10:34— “you are gods”—in support of the idea that we shall become God. But Jesus was not commenting on the question of what we will be in the resurrection. In this passage, Jesus is quoting from Psalm 82:6, in which the Hebrew word translated “gods” is elohim. In context, it refers to unjust human judges (Psalm 82:1-27). Jesus says the following in John 10:34-36:

Is it not written in your Law, “I have said you are gods.” If he called them “gods” to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken—what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, “I am God’s Son”?

In John 10, the Jewish leaders were accusing Jesus of blasphemy because he had claimed “to be God” (verse 33). Jesus was saying, in effect, the following: “If Scripture can call unjust human judges “gods,” how much more can the name ‘Son of God’ refer to me?” Jesus was not telling the Jews that these unjust judges were Gods. As the psalm says, they were mortal. Rather, Jesus was cautioning his hearers about their own unjust condemnation of his use of the term “Son of God.” Both the psalm and Jesus were talking about mortal human beings. The question of what we will be like after the resurrection has nothing to do with John 10:34.

In the resurrection, we will be like Jesus Christ, and that will be wonderful. We will be God’s children forever, living in perfect joy and happiness, and we thank God that we can become his children even in this life, through faith in Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. BIBLE PROPHECY: WILL HUMANS BECOME GODS?


Thursday, May 25, 2023

Rod Meredith on Bob Thiel


A comment recently about Bob Thiel:

DW. What are you doing Bob? Do your 100 members know about Rod Meredith stating, in no uncertain terms, that NOBODY in the church thought you were a prophet? Do they know about the letter he sent you, basically calling you an arrogant, know it all that had as best, bugged everybody in the church, or at worst, seriously offended them? Do they know he told you you were full of pride and for your own good, needed to either cut it out or be disfellowshipped? Are they aware of any of these facts? Shame on you, Bob. You are a deceitful worker, doing whatever you want to make yourself a "big man" in the work. You couldn't play nicely with the other kids, so set off to anoint yourself a prophet and lead people to their eternal damnation. How about just learning what Christianity is and becoming a follower of Jesus? It is more than enough for all of us, because it is NOT ABOUT US!! It is about Him and what He did for all who believe. You disgrace His Holy Name every time you open your mouth.

Wednesday, May 24, 2023

A Plea To RCG Young People by Adelle Ambrose

A Plea To RCG Young People

by Adelle Ambrose


Dear Young People of RCG, 


In all honesty, I don't even know where to begin. Having been out of The Restored Church of God for almost five years and listening to "The Greatest Untold Story! (Part 443)" just inspired me to write again. I have so many thoughts and emotions about what is happening inside that high-demand religion that I spent my formative years believing in wholeheartedly.


Firstly, I want to empathize with you all who are still trapped in that toxic environment ruled by Dave Pack. Those of you who may see the many flaws can see past the plastic show of charisma and charm that your leader puts on in front of the whole church. I feel for those of you who are still living under your parent’s roofs, too young to venture off on your own and flee from RCG.


I know many of you. You all are smart, capable individuals. However, how you sit in that room as DCP berates your own generation and, frankly, shouts at you about how the younger you are, “the more rotten you are inside." I would not tolerate it, and the fact you do makes me so sad.


All of the young people sitting in that cold room deserve so much better. Not just from the ministry (if I can even call them that anymore) but especially from your own parents, assuming that is how you came to be in RCG.


This is clearly fear and manipulation tactics. Take it from someone who suffered fifteen years of Dave Pack pounding on the lectern, perpetually raising his voice. I don't miss being startled so much as an eight-year-old that I would literally jump in my seat.


Since I left, nothing in RCG has changed, except for Dave Pack getting worse.



Dave Pack’s rant about Taylor Swift was so laughable.


“She’s this filthy, lewd entertainer who travels the world with barely anything on.”


The fact he cares enough to bash a hugely famous, hugely wealthy singer and songwriter is hilarious. What I took away most from his ridiculousness was that his putting her down (as he has with many others in the past) showed me what an insecure person he is. To me, that's all it is. He's showing off his insecurities for the whole church to see. It doesn't look very good for him, I might add. It was kind of like a little child having a hissy fit. But I did get a good chuckle out of it.



I have a genuine question. Do any of you actually understand what he is teaching anymore? I know I didn't five years ago, and it hasn't gotten any better. I remember sitting in Sabbath Services, trying to take notes and not being able to because I had no idea what was being taught. DCP has set so many wrong dates for his events to transpire, and none happen. How do you sit through the teachings of a man who has been wrong too many times for me to count and still decide that he is God's apostle? If you all honestly believe God is speaking through him, then that is basically you saying these frequent mistakes belong to God. I seem to recall God doesn't do that.


What broke my heart and infuriated me most, however, was the way in which DCP spoke to all of the young people in his “True Church.”


“So let’s talk about the youth of The Restored Church of God. They will get no slack because they haven’t left. Unless they fear God and start right now. So let’s talk about what God says He has in store for young people today who will be ripped up and eaten alive if they don’t pay attention.”


“And the younger you are in this generation, the likely the more rotten you are inside. Unless you change. There are exceptions, of course.”


I can’t begin to explain to you all how horrified this makes me feel that he would say such awful, traumatizing (yes, these are traumatizing, hateful words) statements to a group of young people, especially the very young ones, the elementary and middle-school aged kids sitting in that room.

Young adults, how are you willing to let a grown adult yell at you about your own generation and how messed up you apparently all are? How are you okay with hearing that you will get "ripped up and eaten alive" if you leave? His language makes me sick to my stomach, even five years removed from his nonsense.


I know how some of you may feel. Yet again, this language is manipulation and a fear tactic. He's admitted to losing young people, as he should be. Who would want to stay in an environment where you are told you are rotten if you don't listen to DCP? That you will die because you don't think DCP is second to God? Some of you practically worship the man at this point. I will admit that when I was a kid, in my head, he was second to God. I was that scared of him, too.


I grew up living in fear for the first fifteen years of my life. I know how much it can negatively affect an individual. I know some of you are going to need a lot of therapy after you decide to escape, which breaks my heart. While I haven't received any yet,  I know I will if I ever decide to have a family of my own. I'm scared of bringing parts of my childhood into my adult life. I want to continue to end some of the family dysfunction that grew into a generational cycle.



Now, I want to directly address the parents of the young folks in RCG.


What hurts me most is the adults I looked up to (especially those who attend RCG's World Headquarters) that are still defending a man who is, in my opinion, both verbally and mentally abusive. You are hurting your children. You are causing them a fear they will have to live with and work through for years. I know I still do.


You are backing up a man who tells parents still attending that if their kids have left, they will die in a gruesome, horrific way very soon. Worse, even if young people still attend, they could also be "torn apart" anyway. They don't sit in their chairs the right way. They don't have the right look on their face.


How can you sit and listen to that? How can you just sit in your chair and not do something about this? As a parent, how is your conscience okay with that?


I trusted and looked up to so many of you as a kid, seeing some of you as practically second parents. How is all of this okay with you, Mr. Winkfield? Why do you allow stuff like this to continue, Mr. Schleifer? How can a parent choose to keep their kids in such an emotionally and mentally unsafe environment?


All of this truly breaks my heart.



Young people of The Restored Church of God, I implore you to escape so that you can live a healthier life away from a controlling, narcissistic leader. The god that Dave Pack preaches is not the God of the Bible. God does not lie and trick His servants into lying.


If you can, escape so that you can build healthier relationships and families. If you can’t, at least tell your parents how you feel. Let them know what you think about DCP’s words. They may have no clue it even bothers you.


 Some of you may be able to help your parents to escape. Escape so that you can break dysfunctional generational cycles. Escape so that you find freedom. Escape so that you can discover all the possibilities that lie outside a high-pressure, toxic religion. Escape so you make your own decisions about people, religion, and the world as a whole. Escape to find peace. Escape to find your true self.


Spreading your wings will be terrifying at first. Still, I can promise you what's waiting for you on the outside is infinitely better than being trapped within.



You can read Adelle Ambrose’s Exit Story here.

Marc Cebrian

See: A Plea To RCG Young People