Garner Ted Armstrong, James Malm, Bob Thiel, Gerald Weston
Gerald Flurry, Herbert Armstrong, Ron Weinland, Dave Pack
Garner Ted Armstrong, James Malm, Bob Thiel, Gerald Weston
Gerald Flurry, Herbert Armstrong, Ron Weinland, Dave Pack
Shocking scenes from Wadsworth's Giant Eagle as its citizens prepare for the imminent return of Dave Pack's creature he calls "christ." Of course, the first thing flying off the shelves is the booze! This is confirmation that Dave is telling the truth that his god is looking to see who gets drunk tonight.
Because that this store is named "Giant Eagle" and is next to the holy campus of Dave (in distance), this is further confirmation that he and his boys will be transported on Eagles Wings to the Place of Safety! Nothing is by chance in Dave's World!
Dave's boys from Wadsworth send out a weekly "Prophetic Update" to the declining membership of the Restored Church of God. This week is a doozy and willed with outright lies. these guys need to get off their knees in front of Dave and walk out the door as soon as they can!
Today/tonight/ (December 31, 2020) and early hours of January 1, is the time Dave's creature he calls "christ" is supposed to be returning.
The Church is on fire after hearing the final parts of the series delivered Sabbath! Some quick additional details are helpful as the day we are waiting for approaches:
The first thing to expect is a blast announcing the Kingdom. The evidence still seems to be (6 verses) that this will happen around dawn, though we cannot know the precise hour. Depending on where brethren are in the world, some will be asleep and some awake. Of course, there is no need to stay up.
Seriously??????? WTF! If I was a loyal devotee of the Packster and truly believed the crap he is saying, that Jesus was returning at some point tonight or at dawn, I sure as hell would NOT go to bed! But, reality should tell every RCG member that they should go to bed and get a restful night's sleep because absolutely NOTHING will happen as Dave says.
Another reason not to stay up is that Christ does not come to everyone out of the gate. In the end, shortly thereafter, at least eight verses indicate that everyone receives their reward and work at the Great Supper.
Ah, there you go, boys and girls, some of you will not be taken at the arrival of Dave's creature. Only the most super loyal will get their reward first, which is sure to include the guys in Wadsworth who spend their time on their knees in front of Dave. Men first, and if there is any space left some of you women.
Finally, recall the noumenia (New Year’s) is a “shadow” (Col. 2:16-17). Events would therefore logically unfold after revellings of the previous evening (“shadow”) have ended and the world has crossed into 2021. God may want to see who got drunk the night before. (It is noteworthy that we have heard great numbers in the splinters are planning to gather on New Year’s Eve.) Remember, we must be the people who avoid even the appearance of evil!
This is an outright lie and these guys know this. As if a "great number" of COG members across COGland believe Dave's crap and will be gathering together to welcome in Dave's creature "christ." this truly is one of the stupidest things I have heard (today). Other than the more liberal members in UCG and a few LCG members, all the other splinter groups consider New Year's another pagan day and won't be gathering anywhere together.
May God speed the arrival of His Son and Kingdom!
May God speed the removal of Dave Pack from his self-appointed position!
P.S. When the Kingdom comes, the period before it describes an Israel whose “hands are full of blood” and describes Jerusalem as a city of “murderers.” A report today said that 2020 recorded the worst annual increase in murders in American history. The increase through September is listed as 36.7% over 2019—with the worst part of the year through December not yet included. This most awful statistic finds its place on the list of reasons that we have the year correct!
From a Restored Church of God source:
Excerpts from, sermon 276:
Excerpt from 57 minutes:
Okay. Let's talk. As I've often said, I didn't really know what I was saying. We won't get out of this year. Now, what I meant was we're not going another year, but it's interesting. My words are almost prophetic. Maybe literally were, was I saying something? Uh, I didn't realize I was saying, that's kind of a question everywhere. You turn, people are overwhelmed with COVID and destitution and storms, and they're all saying maybe 2021, just an interesting little side point, flicking it out there. It will be better. One commentator and news comment. After another horror, weary and beaten down and suicides have never been like they are now depression, alcoholism, drugs, domestic abuse, 110,000 restaurants gone, never to return.
Now I want to turn over to acts one and verse seven, and let's revisit in an extraordinary way. The disciples asking Christ, right? As he's about to ascend and I'll show you, you read things over and over until it's time to get to the end. You just don't know. So here we go. They'd been talking about the kingdom of God, the end of verse three. And here's what they asked. Excuse me. When they four were come together, they asked him saying, Lord, will you at this, this space of time restore again, the kingdom, Israel, just right out of the gate, nothing more. Bad's going to happen, brethren. We're not going to see any bad people till bitter. It's just bang. You're going to bring the kingdom down here.
Excerpt from 1:05:
And I'm going to just shock you with some stuff we're going to look at here. What are the odds that we would have the same Sabbath layout in 2021 that would occur in that occurred in 27 when Christ began his ministry late in the year? What are the odds of that? You have to just think about it. I guess you could say six to one on that, but it's lined up to where the series is over and there's a final message. You start getting into some astronomical math, and haven't even given you the most powerful evidence yet.
So I began to, I'd go into Mr. Schleifer's office before I knew any of what I'm about to tell you. And I would say, Brad, you know, this, this looks like new year's night. Would Christ come on new year's night? I mean, would he? And we we go over the evidence, not, not the strongest of which I was suspicious of it before I even examined Luke. But timing itself, I said, this is the final message. You go a few days. And then there's a Maha that, that doesn't even get you out of the week. We're trapped and we'd sit there and we'd go puzzle over it. And Mr. Mr. Habboush and Holcomb we'd do the same. There's no evidence that you wait another second. There's a Sabbath in due season where he gives a final message and then he's waiting and watching that looks like you get to another Sabbath.
What would, what would be too long? And then I wonder, wait a minute. He hits a certain point and he can't Terry won't, he can't, he's stuck. It's like, as he stuck with the new year, what is this? That's the way it was, it was questions. What is this? I knew there were no more messages because when the messenger delivers the message, he knows that he did. And I knew this was the last message. And every day, this week, I worked all day, every day and deep into the night. Uh, every day it got clearer and clearer and clearer. I saw all these things. So then you go on over to Galatians chapter four, and we find an interesting clue. We know that God has some year in mind that matters.
Excerpt from 1:35
That comprise the sacred month. What new moons is he talking about? Turnover there at Isaiah one? Let's just read it. He actually says it twice. Just here. You're talking to the rulers of Sodom and Gomorrah sound like our nation today, frankly, the old world in a way to what purpose is a multitude of your sacrifices, the new year's and ancient Israel. And for thousands of years, people give each other gifts. It could be booze, it could be chocolate, it could be food and stuff, and they would lay garlands on the altar to the gods. And God says, I hate that. I don't want you serving other gods. So if you were going to come and set up the kingdom of God, what day might you come? And just smash it right in the middle while the whole world's drunk. Okay.
Excerpts from 1:49 to end
Institutions are something under a year, seven years and a thousand years. If I could have known that I could have sorted this out and a dozen to 15 hours, and then I would have been done about five years too early, or God would have waited later. So why did he, why do you think it went so long? Why did God want it to go long? Well, number one, I'll just say perhaps to humble me. Because of the great honor of getting to teach this and maybe because of what is going to come to me, it now you think of humble. I'm going to use a bunch of words. I'm going to use the word humble, uh, human humiliate and humus. So they all come from the earth here, humans and stuff that lays on the ground. At times it was humanly humiliating to say I was wrong and to stand up and have to explain it again. But I was on a course. I wasn't going to see things and you ought to at least sit here and wonder how in the world Mr. Pack, did you put all this together in a week? I heard what you said last week, and that was helpful. And I hope you think that bang at the end of over five years, is this all the answers? I didn't put it together and put anything together. I was on a train. I wasn't a conductor. I was in the second car. And at times I felt like I was in the caboose. And, but I wasn't a brakeman either. I couldn't slow it down. So I would see more things.
It, we would learn. God will learn who would keep the word of his patients waiting and watching all the way till he arrived, because they saw that big 27 and they understood it. My job was to tell you what God says, not to make a pronouncement. So tell you what God says. I've shown you from the Bible. The best I could believe me. This series is more over than it could ever be. You saw tonight and have heard for over five years and you know, 500. And I don't know, way up there, way over 560, 70, 80 hours, because we cut so much out in the early, early years. They were long, but you've heard it and you've seen it. And it looks like we might have about five days, but I can't tell you exactly in there, but I can see newminea and I can see all the warnings about drunkenness. I can see Peter talking about it. Paul talking about it in Christ three times. And something's going on on that night, which is unusual and is a threat to people because of alcohol and other things that are related. So we might close the series saying, come Lord Jesus. God speed this day and good night.
"Are some of God’s people actually going to flee right before the tribulation?
According to Jesus, the answer is yes.
20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no nor ever shall be” (Matthew 24:20-21, NKJV throughout, unless otherwise indicated).
Let this be perfectly clear, there are two groups of God’s people mentioned in Revelation 12–one which goes to a place of safety and one which does not. It states:
14 But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. 15 So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. 16 But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. 17 And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. (Revelation 12:14-17).
The above shows that the church (symbolized by a woman) will “fly into the wilderness to her place.” Being in heaven with Jesus is not the same as being in any wilderness–hence this is not some type of “rapture” as many Protestants believe in. Also notice that the church “is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.” Hence, this is how Jesus is intending to keep His Philadelphia Christians “from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world” (Revelation 3:10). This “hour of trial,” this “time and times and half a time” includes the period of the Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord.
Notice also that since a flood of water is used to try to destroy the church, but is helped by the earth, that the church is NOT in heaven,..."
I only bring this up again as Bobus is bringing the topic of "Fleeing" up again. Like Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry and himself, the topic of "Fleeing" is probably one the most dangerous romps around the scriptures, taking them out of time and context and cobbling them into a teaching that will have dire consequences for anyone so inclined.
I'll briefly and again show you where the author of Revelation got his tall tale about what he "saw" in vision. He saw the night sky from which many tales in the Bible are put together. Night Flix we might say.I would add Revelation 12
The Woman and the Dragon12 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head. 2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. 3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads. 4 Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, so that it might devour her child the moment he was born. 5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.”[a] And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne. 6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.
Davey Pack, the most superfantabulous COG leader (after Bobiniah Thiel, of course) has delivered a stern warning to all Church of God members who are not heeding his call. Everyone should be prepared to die on December 31 just before midnight.
If I were a betting person, I would bet my entire savings that his creature he calls "christ" will NOT return on New Year's Eve. It will not return the day after or next month or next year at this same time. Davey is a liar and a fraud.
How many times does he need to say this crap before his members and the lap-poodle ministers that stand in awe of him wake up and admit he is a liar? Can these men truly be this naive? Even their other idol, Herbert Armstrong, would slap them across the face for being so incredibly stupid.
According to David C. Pack we are all going to be found unawares on the night of Dec 31/2020 eating and drinking with the drunken, not watching for our Lord. He will supposedly come that night and destroy us for not accepting the manifestly glorious servant who was sent before Him to prepare the way. Part 276 was his "final part" once again...
Just how many FINAL sermons does this fool need to preach? How many FINAL sermons do Restored Church of God members have to sit through before they wake up?
Dave's lap poodles in Wadsworth are struggling to find out who keeps leaking Dave's crackpot sermons to the unclean masses of COGland. While the above memo from Wadsworth looks benign, it is not.
As Dave sinks further and further into madness, they struggle to keep things looking awesome in Wadsworth, even though some of his right-hand men know deep in their hearts that Dave is batshit crazy, they still feel a need to defend him.
They are not willing to put their faith in the God that they supposedly follow and step away from Dave's madness. They have been part of the system that has instilled in members' heads that to do so is an immediate loss of salvation and that erroneous belief is ingrained in them.
This is sure to tick off sanctimonious Bwana Bob Thiel, the great savior of Africa, and to 299 caucasian members. New Years Day is the day he hates the most as it is a double whammy for him. Pagan New Years Day and football.
Davey Pack the most superfantasmic prophet to ever exist in the Church of God has revealed that his creature "christ" is returning on New Year's Eve! This is another insult to the delicate man-boy Thiel because he failed to see this in his dreams.
What a kick-ass New Year's Eve this will be! Wadsworth must be so excited!
Now, here's another point. We have kept the word of Christ’s patience a long time. We might ask, how much longer would God expect, generally speaking? It's easy to be patient for the last, you know, one or three or five days, whatever it is, um, If this is the last message. that part's easy, the hard parts behind us.
Now, I could take a long time to explain this, but I came to understand something about the month of Kislev - this Kislev. The foundation of the ancient Zerubbabel Temple was laid on Kislev 24, this is Kislev 26. And there were 14 different places in Haggai and Zechariah that stress the importance of that day. I wondered could it actually be that day, which was Thursday two days ago, right before Hanukkah started Thursday. Could actually be that day? Well, no, then we’d know the day and Christ would have known it for thousands of years. Can't be.
So, it's got to be, is it close to that day? You go read it because here's what God says in Haggai [2:18-19], “Now on this day. This day, when the foundation of the Lord's House was laid…” And I looked, and I thought, OK, you have the ancient Zerubbabel, then you have this crisis Zerubbabel with seven eyes – it means out of Babylon. Then he laid he laid the physical foundation stone in a temple back, you know, 2,500 years ago Christ is the foundation stone; he laid the foundation stone of a spiritual temple. Would he pick the same day? Call it “foundation.” That was a physical stone; we're all spiritual stones and don't you lay any stones on that stone back there 2,500 years ago until you make note of this day, “I'm going to bless you on this day.” Well, it wasn't 924.
So, I began to realize I'm going to have to give another message. I've learned too much. God's people do not know what is about to happen. They don't know! They have some ideas; they don't know they're going to meet the Father right away. They don't know the great supper and the wedding supper are the same thing. They don't know the fire’s one day. They don't understand exactly these things about how Elijah comes first, and he's the twig, and once you see that twig it's a lock. It's a lock. The question would be we're trying to figure out talking about whether or not, uh, uh, it's around the end of Kislev.
Couple other interesting things. You, you weigh them, give them whatever, whatever value you give them. Because most of most of the Book of Zachariah was written in Kislev. The whole back of Haggai stresses the importance of Kislev. And I began to [think] - it never crossed my mind – I really, “Oh, I was born in Kislev. Would that be a, would that signify (just a question) with that signify…” I mean, the odds are you know eleven to one against that. I was born in Kislev, would that be the signal to me that maybe the twig, and that's why we're very close?
And Mr. Schliefer, my right-hand man, was also born in Kislev two days before I was, a few years later, alright? And um, so I just noted that – “mmm, I don't know.” But here we are, there's three days left in Kislev, is, is there some indicator that it's around 924? Well it’s not 'cause we've already started the beginning of 927 and not everybody's even heard this. Could it go on into Tevet? Would it be the first day of Tevet? I don't know because then you have exactly, uh, umm 9 months until, you know, the devour month. Would God want to do it that way? I don't know. I am not saying he would, or he wouldn't. It can't be both.
An interesting thing, this is important: in John 10 – now, we're entering the third night of Hanukkah, I want to just throw that out there – when Christ introduced this monster wolf in John 10, the Antichrist, who is the man of sin, who's the thief, the murderous thieving destroyer, And there are thieves, and robbers, and strangers who see this wolf, and they run off; their hirelings are run off, he's the evil shepherd, and he's warning all about this and telling the whole story about how this porter goes and works with him, the only other place where it says he commanded the porter to watch. And then the porter watches, and then there's this monster coming. I will tell you, Christ taught that in John 10 and brought to light the man of sin, he was speaking during Hanukkah. So now is he telling us this is going to go down in Hanukkah? Well, there's a little under 6 days to go in Hanukkah, because Hanukkah starts in in, in um Kislev and ends in Tevet.
Here's another interesting point. There is a fast that begin, that, that, that occurs in this First Kingdom, and that fast is on Tevet 10. There's another one in the fourth month; 10th month, 4th month, 5th month. In the 7th month they're supposed to fast right after Trumpets. God said I'm not going to hear you. But there's a fast on Tevet 10. Tevet 10 it just so happens is Christmas. If Israel is supposed to fast by Tevet 10, then Christ has to come before Christmas, which might be the man of sin, who is a Pope coming “in his season,” the Christmas season. The Catholics make Christmas the biggest of all. They’re the most Pagan, the most heathen group, big as they are, and it's their season. Is that… I'm just throwing out all these things. One thing, time is running out. It's been a long time. We have to be getting close.
Daniel was unsealed. I finally understood every element of Daniel this week. It all came together – and twice God says, “When that book is unsealed at the… now the end.” It's go time. So why did I finally understand Daniel – Daniel 12:4 and 9 talks about this period – why’d I understand that right, right now? I had to explain it. I never understood Daniel 7 correctly. Or some things in some other verses. I used to think the man of sin was that guy in Daniel 11 'cause they looked alike. Well, because they're both popes and he had to separate them. One was the season, one was the year; year later. So that's important. Then of course is the basic question, why would I learn it all now? Well, it's obvious, so we can wait another year. Trying to be facetious.
Then, of course, there's the fact that the last message everything turns on what was its content. It was designed by God to prepare the way for the Father. You didn't even know, and I wasn't, I wasn't, I didn't believe he was coming – maybe his spirit would stand here, whatever. I had that wrong. Well, until the brethren had been prepared for the Father and all the things – that's what it said, “The things that are going to shortly come to pass…” a fire for one day, the man of sin has proof moved in. Until we understood all of that – had the day of Christ in the right place, and it wasn't the day of the Lord, they’re 10 months apart – we weren't ready to go.
So, content is critical. The content of this message is not explaining “be sure we got all Revelation right,” it's laying out the whole plan of God from Aardvark to zebra. You know, A-Z as we say. The whole thing, the whole bible on, the whole book. So, content would suggest this is the last message. I've asked, “What would I say next week?” The only thing I could do is drill deeper.
Now, I'm not saying it's as certain as one to a quadrillion to the 4th power. I'm not, I'm not doing that, but I'm telling you there's an awful lot of things that line up. Just an awful lot of things. Both – it's funny: uh, I'm called the fig tree, you know, both of my servants, my, my assistants rather, Mr. Habboush and Holcombe were born in the month of Shevat, which is the month of Figs, which is kind of an interesting thing. I don't make a big deal of that stuff, I don't, but it is kind of interesting. Mr. Schleifer born in Kislev, would that be because, because I'm raised in Kislev and then Christ comes in Tevet? Or would it be both of them happen in Kislev? They're just things that I would, I would leave you with.
So. If you're not on fire - and I would, I would, I would adjure you, brethren – watch. Everything suggests now, but I can't give you the day in the hour. I don't even know how long it will take for everybody to hear it. I don't know how you can show the servants and they don't all hear it. But if you're not on fire about this, you're asleep. There are some among us who will be asleep. We got some smug people among us, you'd be surprised. I don't go around telling people, ‘You're smug and you're not,” but I mean, I can look out in an audience and see somebody who's smug. You know, we gotta face like a wooden Indian, I mean, I can tell. I mean, I can tell who's onboard and who's not. Now, let me go further. If you now leave this church for even a splinter, you are almost suicidal without knowing it. I don't even know if you could hear all of this and get included if you blew it off and went to a splinter. Maybe you could, maybe God would be merciful. You heard five years or most of it and then left. You know, “Where is the parousia? My Lord delays his coming, I'm outta here, I'm gonna go get drunk.” Like those, you know, different warnings.
And finally, if you go to the world – you go back and you give up everything – you have a death wish. You were a sow or a dog who has returned to the mire. I'm just warning you. I'm warning you. To the, to, to, to the mire or the vomit.
It would seem to me. It would seem to me. That this message – could we say so very obviously? – appears to have prepared the way before God.
Let's watch. <end>
Transcript 02:48:51-03:05:43 Sermon 273
[Ezekiel 3:16] “And it came to pass (verse 16) at the end of (a week) seven days that the word of the LORD came to me, saying (again, So here we go), son, a man, I have made you a watchman to the house of Israel...” I'm just telling you again, I know we've gone over all this, God says, but in effect, I'm telling you again. “Therefore, hear the words in my mouth and give them warning from me.”
Then it says, “When I say to the wicked...” And then it talks about what he's supposed to say, that they're going to die, and so for, you tell 'em. Speed-read it, brethren, go on down. The wicked man may die in his iniquity, but you better tell him. “But his blood will I require it your hand.”
You could say in a way I'm telling all of God's people, with or without ears to hear, I'm telling all of God's people do not go into this fire and do not leave this church. If you leave this church, you just wrapped your hands around a death star. Don't do it, it's a suicide. It's a. It's a suicide wish – a death wish. Don't do it.
But I'm just putting my own twist on this for the moment.
Verse 19, “If you warn him and he turn not, then he'll die, but you've delivered your soul. Again, When a righteous man does turn from his righteousness, commit iniquity, (and so forth”), and then you warn him, and he can do the right thing at the wrong thing, 20 and 21. “And the hand of the LORD was there upon me; and he said...” Now, look, here's what God told him, and I never understood this. Where does it, how does it fit. “Arise, go to the plain, and I will there talk with you.” So he spoke with him again! “...the river Chebar: and I fell on my face.” Verse 24, “then the Spirit entered, made and he stood me up. And here's what he said in verse 25 – I wonder what, you know, I’d read this since I was a kid in college – “But you, O son of man, behold, they'll put….” I'm sorry, verse 24, “Then the spirit entered me, and set me on my feet, and spoke to me, and he said unto me, go shut yourself within your house. (I want you to go isolate yourself). But you O son of man, behold, they'll put bands on you, and shall bind you with them, and you shall not go out among them.” It's almost like we're going to lock you down. You're not going anywhere.
And I did I had COVID. It wasn't pleasant. My wife got it and I was stuck for a few weeks. Then I wanted to be careful, and by then I saw this, but I wasn't sure exactly how to apply it.
“… and you’ll not go out among them. And I'll make your tongue cleave to the roof of your mouth, that you shall be dumb, and shall not be to them a reprover: for they are a rebellious house. But when I speak with you (how? Moving by the Holy Spirit), I'll open your mouth and you'll say to them, thus says the Lord God, (and so forth).” And then the application is explained there.
Now it's not exactly the same today. But I just found it interesting: I went longer than I had after speaking for nine straight years, or five straight years. I went nine weeks and didn't speak, and I've never done either, and I will never do either one again. But it's just interesting that circumstances threw me away from the pulpit and it was because I was supposed to really think a lot about this. I'm even on a campus, by the way, where I didn't go off the campus. I don't know if I've been off, maybe, I don't even know if I've been off the campus in nine, in nine weeks. I'm not sure if I have. We live in paradise, why would, why would you? I, maybe I did, but I can't remember.
Now we could ask why would God clear up all of this? Let's do some summarizing. Why would God clear all of this up after so long unless less he is ready to send Christ now? The picture is clear - I guess if Christ doesn't come then maybe next week I'd be back and we drill deeper on things that we went through about like bullets come out of a machine gun. I know that and I apologize, but it's gone a while so I want to be done.
There is a final ration. If there was something else to be said, what would it be? It has to be a final message. We've seen all the verses. How might we know this is the last message? There's a few additional things that I find interesting, I'm gonna lay them out, that create a powerful narrative. Or we'll say, call it, call it a supposition. First of all the big 25 had been here for a long time. We could just start by saying the twig is due – just start there.
I was shut up in my house for 9 weeks. You give that whatever value you want to give it. Never happened before. And it was beyond my control until about the 5th week or so. And then I realized I was learning some things, and I waited, and I wasn't sure I was supposed to speak again. I wasn't sure, and I thought, well, maybe the wait could go on. I talked to several men. And, um, so, uh, that was that.
If you now leave this church for even a splinter, you are almost suicidal without knowing it.
I don't even know if you can hear all of this and get included if you blew it off and went to a splinter.
Maybe you could.
Maybe God would be merciful.
You hear 5 years or most of it and then left.
And finally, if you go to the world, you go back and give up everything, you have a death wish.
You are a sow or a dog who has returned to the mire.
I am just warning you.
I'm warning you...to more, to vomit.
It's that time of year and Christmas trees are everywhere and Church of God leaders are popping their corks on how evil Christmas is compared to the fraudulent "holy days" that they have appropriated and changed to fit their needs.
One of the biggest myths in the Church of God about Christmas is the Jeremiah 10 malarkey that so many of them trot out this time of year. All of them are just passing on information that they were fed at the feet of theologically bankrupt men from Pasadena.
Bobiniah Thiel is one of the most whiney guys about this that the church has ever seen. He has produced a long list of things that wank him off about Christmas and Jeremiah 10 is in that list.
In Jeremiah 10, God says not to follow pagan practices, such as using a decorated tree, in the worship of Him.
Here it is, 2021 and real theologians have understood this verse for hundreds and hundreds of years and yet The Great Bwana to Africa actually believes this verse is about decorating Christmas trees. I guess that is what we should expect since he has no formal theological education about the Bible from REAL professors. He has to rely upon COG booklets and crackpot teachings of Rod Meredith and others. Plus, it is always important to remember that COG ministers and leaders are experts at "proof-texting." Picking, choosing, and isolating one or two scriptures while ignoring the previous verses and those that follow; is how these guys operate.
Ralph Woodrow was, unfortunately, one of those that contributed to the fallacies taught by the Worldwide Church of God through his book, Babylon Mystery Religion much of it based upon the errors put forth in Hislop's, Two Babylons. WCG ministers embraced this book with gleeful spitefulness. It was their proof to denigrate Christians around them. To Woodrow's credit, he later repudiated his erroneous book and its teachings with another book, The Babylon Connection?.
Woodrow later wrote a book in 1994 called, Christmas, Reconsidered.
He has this to say about Jeremiah 10. You will also notice veiled references to Amstrongite mythology.
Did Jeremiah in the tenth chapter of the book that bears his name, forbid the use of Christmas trees?
A number of years ago, I received a phone call from two men. Both help positions in an organization which has distributed multiple thousands of booklets that claim Jeremiah condemned the Christmas tree. But contrary to this booklet, written by their founder, they pointed out to me that the Jeremiah text, when taken in context, simply will not allow this meaning. Though not wanting to be disloyal, they could not in good conscience continue to hold a view that was contrary to what the text actually said.
For any who will study it out, the Jeremiah text clearly condemns idol worship. The subject is not the Christmas tree as we know it today. Here is the text - Jeremiah 10:3-14:
Learn not the way of the heathen...the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree ou of the forest, the word of the hands of the workman, with the ax. THey deck it with silver and gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it might not move. They are upright as the alm tree, but speak not: they must needs be bourne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of then; for they cannot do evil, neither also si it inthem to do good...the stock is a doctrineof vanities. SIlver spread into plates is brought from Tarshish, and gold from Uphaz, the wor of the workman, and of the hands of the founder...Every founder is confounded by the graven image: for his molten images a falsehood, and there e is no breath in them.
There are five points about this passage that should be carefully noticed:
First, consider the workman: "...one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman." A surface reading has caused some to supposed this workman to be a lumberjack, going into the forest to cut down a Christmas tree. But this is not the intended meaning. A "workman" was one who took material - in this case, the wood from the tree - and formed it into an IDOL. Later in this passage, the "workman" is portrayed as plating an idol with silver and gold - clearly not a lumberjack!
The same word appears in a parallel passage about making an idol from a tree: "He that is so impoverished that he had no oblation chooseth a tree that will not rot; he seeketh unto him a cunning workman to prepare a graven image" (Isaiah 40:19, 20; see also Hosea 8:4-6) Idols were commonly made out of tree stock (Jer 3:9)
Second, notice that the tool the workman uses is called an "ax." Though the word as (or axes) appears 18 times in the Bible (KJV), the word here translated "ax" is a different word! It is not the ax that a lumberjack would use to cut down a tree, but is, more specifically, a carving tool. The workman would use this tool to form an idol from the tree already cut down. Some translations use the word chisel; "For the customs of the people are worthless; they cut a tree out of the forest, and a craftsman shapes it with his chisel" (NIV).
Third, the idol described in Jeremiah 10, carved from the "stock" of a tree (margin: "wooden idol"), was "upright as a palm tree (verse 5) - as a person standing. This does not fit today's traditional fir or spruce "Christmas tree" which is not shaped like a palm tree.
Fourth, Jeremiah spoke against worshipping an idol made from a tree, not the tree itself. though the workman could make the idol look like a living, walking, talking being, yet it was lifeless.
The prophets commonly pointed out the absurdity of believing in "idols...the work of men's hands. They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not: they have ears, but they hear not: noses have they, but they smell not: they have hands, but they handle not: feet they have, but they walk not" (Psalm 115:4-7)
So here, the idols Jeremiah described, "speak not" - implying a mouth, not speech. The same point could not be made if Jeremiah was speaking of a Christmas tree - no one expects a Christmas tree to talk! These idols apparently had legs, yet could not walk. They must be carried, "because they can not go" (Jer 10:5). Had Jeremiah been speaking of a Christmas tree, his whole argument would break down; everyone realizes a Christmas tree must be carried - no one supposes a Christmas tree should walk.
Fifth, these idols were dressed in clothing" (Jer 10:9). A Christmas tree may be decorated, but no one puts clothing on a Christmas tree, not blue, purple, or any other color.
Jeremiah comes right out and uses the term "graven [carved] image" (Jer 10:14) - not a Christmas tree - but an idol carved in the likeness of a man. Isaiah described the same thing: "They that make a graven image...the carpenter stretched out his rule...and maketh it after the figure of a man...he heweth him down cedars, and taketh the cypress and the oak...eh maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto" (Isa 44:9-15).
By simply applying sound, recognized, and basic biblical interpretation, it is clear that Jeremiah described idol worship, not tree worship.
But even if Jeremiah's subject had been actual tree worship, what bearing would this have on our subject? At the Christmas season, thousands of people have a Christmas tree, but I am not aware of any of them worshipping it.
I have seen ant-Christmas booklets that argue that people worship the Christmas tree because they bow on their knees to place presents around it! The very weakness of this argument exposes the absurdity.
It could be argued that time and expense are wasted on a Christmas tree. It could be argued that leaving a tree to grow in the forest might serve a better purpose. It could be argued that the lighted tree presents a fire hazard. But to argue that Christians worship Christmas trees - no way! Christians worship Christ, not trees. When the season is over, they get rid of their trees: they burn them up hand them over to the trash collector! - not something people would do with an object of worship.
A Christmas tree is a seasonal decoration. If there is was a danger of Christian people veering off into tree worship, then not only a seasonal tree, but perhaps even trees for landscaping would be condemned. Imagine someone preaching that we should destroy all trees on our property lest we be tempted into tree worship!
The fir tree and pine tree were considered objects of beauty, even for the sanctuary of the Lord (Isa 60:13). Some believe there were avenues of trees leading up to the sanctuary, while others think in terms of wooded slopes around the sanctuary. In either case, an ornamental purpose is implied, not merely lumber from these trees for building purposes.
Inspired prophets often used the tree as a symbol of that which is good. A man who serves the Lord is "like a tree planted by the rivers of water" (Psalms 1"3). The righteous flourish "like the palm tree" and gro "like the cedar in Lebanon" (Psalms 92:12). They are "trees of righteousness" (Isa 61:3). Wisdom is "a tree of life" (Pro 3:18). The blessing of long life is likened to a tree (Isa 65:22). Those who overcome wat of "the tree of life" (rev 2:7). god's people are symbolized as an olive (from 11:17). These and many more references show how trees can symbolize good things.
The Christmas tree, as we know it, only dates back a few centuries. In those earlier times, trees were decorated with fruit, which some considered symbolic of the tree of life 9rev 22:2). Today's round Christmas tree balls are simply stylized fruit (unless you are a COG member and think they are Nimrod's testicles).
For some, anything round is a pagan symbol. But who made the fruit round, who made manna round, who made the moon round, who made the sun round, who made the earth round" Roudnis not wrong.
Ideas about paganism can be carried to a fruitless extreme - even innocent things become suspect. If someone sought to condemn flowers - a young man bringing flowers to his girlfriend, or placement of flowers on a grave - probably some pagan origin could be claimed even for this!
Some object to the star decoration that is commonplace at the top of a Christmas tree, pointing out that the star was the symbol of the ancient pagan god (Amos 5:26). But a much more feasible explanation for the star would be that found within the Christmas story: the star that led the wise men to Bethlehem.
A person who places a star on a Christmas tree is not worshipping a demonic god, knowingly or otherwise. It is only a decoration. those who are quick to brand anything linked to stars or the sun with some occult origin, need to remember that even Jesus is called a "Star: and the "Sun of righteousness" (Num 24:17; Rev. 22:16; Mal 4:2). Let's not accuse biblical writers like Moses, Malachai, and John of promoting paganism!
It is quite inconsistent to build a belief on some minor similarity, while ignoring vast differences. Consider the following examples: alcoholism is bad, so one should not use shaving lotion - it has alcohol in it. Smoking cigarettes is bad, so one should not eat smoked meat. It is bad for people to chew tobacco, so one should not chew gum. Jeremiah condemned idols made from trees, so people who decorate with a Christmas tree commit idolatry!
We have given reasons why we believe Jeremiah spoke against an idol made from a tree, and not the tree itself. Still, if a brother in Christ feels he shouldn't have a Christmas tree, let him follow his conscience. If another chooses to decorate his home with a Christmas tree, he should not be condmcned for this. The greater harm would be to allow a nonessential point to cause needless confusion and division among the people of God. Christmas, Reconsidered
If Church of God leaders will lie about this simple little verse, how can you trust them to interpret other scriptures?
One thing we can say about Bobiniah Thiel is that he is consistent. Consistently glorifying himself every time he waves his hands or thrusts his big Bible in the air as if it gives him some kind of authority. It is always about himself and the things he does. Jesus is hardly ever spoken of and when he's it is as if he's an embarrassment.
Bobiniah is telling his 299 caucasian members today that he is still being persecuted. Eight years of intense persecution and yet here he still is, whining like a little petulant spoiled brat.
CCOG 2020 Hindsight: 8 Years of Philadelphian Restoration (you can watch his patheticly boring sermon here)
Has there been 8 years of Philadelphian restoration in the Continuing Church of God?What has happened over the past 8 years.What happened in 2020?Was there any interference from censorship by Vimeo or YouTube?What are the plans for the future?Has God poured out His Spirit in the last days consistent with the Apostle Peter’s sermon in Acts 2:17-18?Has the CCOG taken more seriously performing the teachings of Deuteronomy 31:10-12 and Matthew 28:19-20 than any other COG that Dr. Thiel had been affiliated with?Is CCOG going through open doors?What about Africa?Does the CCOG now have Spanish language videos?How large in the CCOG?Is the CCOG the fastest growing xWCG organization in the 21st century?What has been going on with websites, videos, personal visits, literature, and youth programs?What about false statements from anti-COG types?Has CCOG been restoring more knowledge of God’s plan (cf. Matthew 17:11)?What about preparing for the short work (Romans 9:28), the full number of Gentiles (Romans 11:25), and leading the final phase of the work?Do Laodiceans seem to have a race problem?Are there any future plans for radio?How many languages are available at the CCOG.org website?Why did CCOG acquire CG7.org?Why has CCOG put together a lengthy apostolic succession list?Does the CCOG expect that some of it members will ‘instruct many’?Should Philadelphians support CCOG?
From an LCG source:
What to Remember: As the world celebrates the December holidays—that find their roots in the ancient Roman Saturnalia with its feasting, drinking, gift-giving, and partying that culminate on the winter solstice to commemorate the rebirth of the sun around December 25—it is good to remember that Jesus Christ was not born on that day, but probably in the fall of the year 4BC around the time of the Feast of Trumpets. Jesus’ message did not focus on Himself or His birth but on the coming Kingdom of God (Mark 1:14–15; Matthew 6:33) and a way of life based on His laws (John 14:15). It will be His government that will bring peace and justice to this troubled world (Isaiah 9:6–7) as He rules from Jerusalem with His saints (Revelation 5:10; 11:15–18; Isaiah 2:2– 4). The biblical Holy Days are designed to keep us mindful of God’s Great Plan of Salvation for all mankind (Leviticus 23). The mission of God’s Church is to proclaim the knowledge of that plan to all the world before He returns (Matthew 24:14). The time is coming when the pagan-based revelries of December will give way to the true Holy Days of God and what they picture for all mankind and for all time.
Have a profitable Sabbath,
Douglas S. Winnail
Did anyone ever tell us that Dave has mental health issues?
Dave Pack said the following in his recent sermon (from an anonymous source):
(Context: HWA's vision was getting so bad that he couldn't see his Bible during sermons, so just used what was in his head. DCP states that people aren't accustomed to that.)
"Because we're not going to pull out our Bibles much today, I'm going to…. We will later in the sermon, but not right away. But brethren listened in services in the synagogues when Paul would go. They didn't have a Bible they could take with them for centuries upon centuries and more after that. They sat there, and they listened. And they learned, as the word was preached to them.
Now, how many scrolls could Paul or Peter or others take to the synagogue or into a Sabbath service? You know, you walk up to a pulpit and I take this, what did they carry with them? They may have carried some things, maybe written out on a parchment, but they probably carried an awful lot in their head. I carry the Bible in my head in many ways that probably, uh, the average person who's newer in the faith and doesn't deal with it as much as I do maybe couldn't understand. Um, but uh, the Bible actually slows me down. I can explode through long strings of scriptures in my mind and put things together without the Bible, so, um, I hope you'll understand that.
And if you're older in the faith, you probably do that to some degree yourself. The two men I work with are the same, um. And, uh, I feel sometimes like a sadist when I'm working with them, 'cause we have to work so fast. And fortunately, God rewarded me with two assistants who are masochists, and, uh, so it works very well, works very well, but it is a quite a dynamic. You know, what's that old joke? What did the, what did the uh, the, the masochist say to the sadist when he met him? The masochist said, “Hit me, hit me!” And the sadist said, “No.” That was a way to be sadistic don't give ‘em what they want. Anyway, I thought that was a good joke when I heard it – I was ten years old and, and I've been telling it ever since. Obviously you can see that.
It's another week in the Living Church of God and its members have screwed up once more. This time they are taking for granted that they have been called to
Greetings from Charlotte,
This week’s telecast is by Mr. Wallace Smith, “Just What Is the Kingdom of God?” It is so easy to take for granted this wonderful truth God has opened our minds to understand, whether we are new in the Body of Christ or whether we have been around for many years. I remember that when I first came to this knowledge, I saw it as simply changing the location of our eventual reward from heaven to earth. But the difference between the concept the world has of going to heaven and the world-ruling Family of God into which we may be born as sons and daughters of God—what we call the Kingdom of God—is as great as east is far from west. However, the longer we are the Church the easier it is for us to take this wonderful truth for granted. It is also easy to take for granted that we have been called now to do a Work, yet it has been exciting to see the progress in the Work over this turbulent year. Even this month, Mr. Cristian Orrego and Mr. Peter Nathan report that new groups are coming with us in Mexico and Africa. Last Sunday we learned that income is up in Jamaica, one more of many of our offices around the world where we see this trend. At the beginning of 2020, a good week saw over 3,000 responses to the telecast. Today, a good week is over 4,500 responses, and some programs have drawn more than 5,000 and one over 6,000. We have much to thank God for and much not to take for granted.—Gerald Weston
Banned by HWA recently posted some commentary on a video produced by Dave Pack which purports to definitively answer the question: Does God Exist? In fact, Mr. Pack's video is only one of many offerings from the ACOG's on this topic - The founder of the movement, Herbert W Armstrong was the first of this tribe to discourse on the subject.
The problem with these offerings is that they almost always rely on false science - bits and pieces of real science which ignore anything that might contradict the point they are trying to make. This is often called confirmation bias in the real world. What is confirmation bias? According to Psychology Today, "Once we have formed a view, we embrace information that confirms that view while ignoring, or rejecting, information that casts doubt on it. Confirmation bias suggests that we don’t perceive circumstances objectively. We pick out those bits of data that make us feel good because they confirm our prejudices. Thus, we may become prisoners of our assumptions."
This phenomenon is closely related to the concept of willful ignorance. In defining the term, Urban Dictionary tells us: "The practice or act of intentional and blatant avoidance, disregard or disagreement with facts, empirical evidence and well-founded arguments because they oppose or contradict your own existing personal beliefs. This practice is most commonly found in the political or religious ideologies of 'conservative' Americans. Many times it is practiced due to laziness--people not wanting to have to do the work to rethink their opinions, the fear of the unknown, the fear of being wrong, or sometimes simply close-mindedness." In this connection, it is interesting to note that the author of the Second Epistle of Peter denigrated those who are "willingly" ignorant (see II Peter 3:5).
However, this kind of ignorance is not the exclusive property of Armstrongites or Christians in general. Unfortunately, it also very often afflicts the atheists and intellectuals who are fond of pointing out the cognitive dissonance and outright hypocrisy of their religious counterparts! Very often, these folks ridicule or dismiss the concept of FAITH (which should be the real basis of the true Christian's belief in things Divine).
And most students of the Bible know that the best definition of faith is found in the eleventh chapter of the Epistle to the Hebrews. As with many things biblical, however, the flowery old King James English sometimes gets in the way of comprehending the real import of what is being said. Please allow me to paraphrase those critical first three verses of the chapter: "Faith demonstrates the reality which underscores our hope - it is our EVIDENCE for the things that we cannot perceive or evaluate by the exercising of our human senses. Our forbearers shined through the expression of their faith (and we should not devalue their contributions to our understanding of these things). Faith is our tool for understanding that God created everything out of things which are also not readily perceived through our five human senses - it allows us to conclude that God is the source of all things without having all of the physical evidence at our disposal to reach that conclusion based entirely on our own observations." (see Hebrews 11:1-3)
It makes me sad when folks attempt to negate or dismiss things which they don't understand (and don't demonstrate any inclination/desire/willingness to understand). Unfortunately, most of us reach conclusions about things based on varying degrees of research and consideration (often little to none), and then we are finished with it. We have proven our belief(s) to our satisfaction, and everyone else be damned! The problem with this should be obvious to everyone. When we are no longer willing to explore and learn, when we close ourselves off to the possibility that others may be right (and we may be wrong), we have taken the path of willful ignorance. Is it really so terrifying to admit that we don't know something? Is God finite or infinite? Is God contained? Is God finished? What is the origin of our ability to learn? Can God learn? Can God grow? Is ignorance bliss? What do you think?
Lonnie Hendrix/Miller Jones