Saturday, November 28, 2020

LCG marches ahead with its Superspreader annual Christmas weekend celebrations in Kansas City and Charlotte


Kansas City Family Weekend—December 25 to 27

The Kansas City Family Weekend is back! We are offering an extended weekend of fellowship, fun, and food—spiritual and physical—to our regional brethren and any beyond who would like to come. In cooperation with Headquarters, we will share the same dates as the Charlotte Family Weekend: Friday, December 25 through Sunday, December 27. So pick one and come spend time with brethren!

We can’t hide it: it’s mostly cold in December in Missouri. But we’re embracing the cold and are excited to offer a new activity this year: snow-tubing at the nearby Snow Creek Ski Area (just northwest of Kansas City). Snow Creek offers skiing and snowboarding options as well. Other activities will be held near the KCI Airport, including Sabbath services, seminar, Bible study, Bible trivia mystery game, two catered dinners, and our unique brand of evening entertainment.

Housing details are available at our website,, with two hotel options: the Embassy Suites near KCI starting at $109 +tax per night, and the Holiday Inn near KCI starting at $69–$79 +tax per night.

So pack your winter layers—your face is already covered anyway—and head to Kansas City for a warm family welcome at the 2020 Kansas City Family Weekend.

(sign in info deleted) 

Schedule of Activities

Friday, December 25, 2020:

1:00 p.m. – Seminar

November 25, 2020 2

    3:00 p.m. – Bible trivia mystery game

4:00 p.m. – Hotel check-in

5:30 p.m. – Catered pasta dinner

7:00 p.m. – Bible Study

Sabbath, December 26:

Breakfast on your own

2:00 p.m. – Services (replaying earlier HQ livestream)

6:00 p.m. – Catered brisket dinner

7:00 p.m. – Entertainment

8:00 p.m. – Fellowship

Sunday, December 27:

10 a.m. or 12 p.m. – Snow Creek tubing —Michael Keesee

Reminder: Charlotte Family Weekend 2020—Additional Information

Hello, Brethren,

The Charlotte, North Carolina, congregation will again be hosting its annual Charlotte Family Weekend this year! The dates for the event will be arrival on Thursday evening, December 24, with departure on Sunday morning, December 27. See the tentative schedule below. Because of state regulations, this year will present a unique version of the weekend that we believe you will still thoroughly enjoy. Unfortunately, due to governmental coronavirus regulations, please note that we will only be able to accommodate an attendance of up to 400 brethren. We are still awaiting the completion of the contract for the event, and we expect to have a firm registration form available next week for those who can commit to attending the Family Weekend.Anyone considering attending the Family Weekend should review their local/county/statewide ordinances concerning quarantine when traveling out of state and/or traveling to North Carolina.

Rooms at the Embassy Suites Concord will cost $109 (plus tax) per night, and that includes two plated breakfasts. Additional details will be provided with the firm registration form.

We hope to see you here in about four weeks at the Charlotte Family Weekend 2020!

Thursday evening, December 24 – Arrival

Friday, December 25 – Morning seminars / Afternoon activities / Friday night Bible Study

Saturday, December 26 – Afternoon Sabbath Services / Evening plated dinner ($25 or

$30/adult depending on the meal selection), child’s dinner for $16 / Saturday night

Talent Show

Sunday Morning, December 27 – Departure

UPDATED: LCG: Claims again that they have the "sure word of prophecy" They are able to understand world events, unlike other COG's.


The world is still spiraling out of control for those boys in Charlotte, as it has been for many of them for the last 6 -7 decades. Everywhere around them, there is moral decay.  But not in their church. Trump is out, sex, COVID reigns, sex, women rule over nations, sex, there are constant threats of war, sex, famine, sex, disease, sex, pestilence, sex, pot smokers in Colorado and Oregon, sex, and of course there are those necessary but pesky gays (which if they weren't around we would have nothing to talk about).

Oh, and Bobus Thiel would disagree with Winnail's claim that LCG has the "sure word of prophecy". There is no other man on earth that has the "sure word" than Bobus himself. Bobus claims that NONE of the COG's will know when it is time to flee as they have their prophecy predictions all wrong. 

Only the Great One, he who is named Bobus, knows the "sure word".

Watch World News! 

Jesus told His disciples to watch for the fulfillment of Bible prophecies indicating that the end of the age and His second coming are near (Matthew 24:42–44; 25:13). However, these same prophecies reveal that many will be surprised by dramatic events that erupt to mark the arrival of the last days, because most people do not understand the prophetic significance of world events that are making news today. This is why God has given His Church a “more sure word of prophecy” so it can function as a watchman to proclaim the real significance of events we see in the news today (2 Peter 1:19–20, KJV). The moral decay and declining influence of the Israelite nations (Leviticus 26:14–19; Deuteronomy 32:29), the growing fears of war, and the eruption of pandemics and the spread of natural disasters (Matthew 24:1–8), an alliance of nations in the Middle East and North Africa (Daniel 11:40), and the emergence of a military power in Europe with links to the Roman Empire promoted by an ecumenical-minded papacy (Revelation 17:1–5, 12–13; Isaiah 47:8)—all point to end-time events outlined in Bible prophecies. As we see these prophecies coming alive today, we need to draw closer to God and continue to watch world events so we are not caught by surprise when Jesus Christ returns to this earth (1 Thessalonians 5:1–6).

Have a profitable Sabbath, 

Douglas S. Winnail

Bobus Thiel still is totally ticked off that the Living Church of God (i.e. Rod Meredith) refused to listen to his demands that they change their beliefs to suit his deluded thinking. How dare they ignore God's doubly blessed and self-annointed How dare they!

On the blog Bobus runs he has this comment about the Living Church of God and its refusal to follow his demands.

LCG continues to cling to a position its top evangelist told me was wrong--and that has to do with the European Beast power who rises up and destroys the USA in Daniel 11:39. Instead, the above, consistent with LCG's flawed official statement of beliefs which Dr. Meredith promised me with Richard Ames and Douglas Winnail as witnesses, in December 2011 would be corrected by the end of January 2012, still has the start of the Beast-led war and the Great Tribulation with Daniel 11:40. Unless LCG changes, it will not know when the Great Tribulation will begin until it is too late.

Considering every single COG leader out there has failed in their prophetic utterances, why should we believe another self-appointed false prophet? 


Friday, November 27, 2020

UCG tells a whopper of a tale on why their ministers are guardians of the "truth"


Various Churches of God regularly have members who question the "authority" of some of their leaders and ministers take upon themselves. These churches continually lash out at those people. How DARE they QUESTION God's anointed!

The United Church of God, who claims to be a better, more sanitized version of Armstorngims, still seeks to control members in every manner possible. They are not COGlite any more.

Here is part of a letter sent to UCG members in Australia a few months ago: 

Those ordained to preach the gospel are ‘sent’ – therefore, those who ‘send’ these ‘teachers’ must have ‘authority’ to do so. Where does that authority originate? From the Head of the Church, Jesus Christ, as He has appointed these ecclesiastical roles and responsibilities within the Body of the Church, (I Cor. 12:27-28; Eph. 4:8, 11) so that the Body would be edified by the “truth” being preached “in love” (Eph. 4:12-16). Within this environment the members of the Body ‘learn Christ’ (V20), in a structured way, that is they learn how to think and live like Jesus Christ, as they are ‘taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus’ (V21). The truth is ‘in’ the Body which Jesus Christ leads and directs (Col 1:18). Paul’s SPS statement in I Timothy 3:15 captures one of the great purposes of the Church of God: “…I write so that you may know how to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.”

COG leaders and ministers are guardians of the truth, allegedly. Given the diverse track record of beliefs that the various COG's teach, none of them are unified in any core doctrines and teachings. It's every leader for himself. They also assume that since they are COG ministers they have a divine right to a special truth that the rest of Christianity is apparently too stupid to understand. Given the lies we have seen out of Thiel, Pack, Flurry, Weinland, and others and the complete mishmash of idiocy they promote, how can anyone believe they preach the truth? None of them are certainly guardians of truth or even of 1st century Christianity.

The boast that UCG makes in that the church has a "special" exegesis demonstrates the arrogance and bullying nature of the leadership.  Go against them in any way and you are insulting Jesus Christ! they are all special and called out! Never forget that!

Consider our connection with ‘the Truth’ this age. Where did you and I learn the truth - about God, about God’s plan of salvation? We learned it from the Church. No other church denomination – nor indeed any other belief system in the world – other than the Church of God - understands, upholds, and preaches the truth of God, as it is revealed in, by, and through, Jesus Christ! Outside of the ‘Church of God’, no other church denomination preaches with clear Biblical exegesis, that the Holy Days and Festivals of God reveal precious hope-giving insights into the Plan of God! We all found out about that hope right here – in the Church of God. 

Then UCG does what all other COG's do in order to discourage members from studying on their own. God reveals nothing to an individual but does so only through the church. Bollocks!

It is also important to remember ’how’ God revealed that truth to us - God did not reveal it to all of us ‘individually’, and then we somehow ‘found’ each other. No! We learned it from the Church – when God opened our minds to understand the truths taught by the Church and drew us into that structured Body.

In order to control members and not let them think on their own, the church has always produced hundreds of books, booklets, and reprint articles that cover every imaginable topic a person wants to know. God forbid if you happen to study something and reach another conclusion, which most of the time will be right! 

Over many years, information on various Biblical topics was presented in ‘Booklets’. It is quite interesting then that this same information is now called a ‘Study Aid’ or a ‘Study Guide’. This extensive range of material is intended to be an aid and a guide to our study of the Bible – to give us guidance and insights into understanding the truths of the Bible for that is one of the great purposes of the Church. In the spirit of Paul’s instruction in Romans 10:14 (quoted above), this ‘preaching’ is ‘sent’ in the form of ‘Study Aids’ and ‘Study Guides’ – and various other mediums including sermons and bible studies from the ministry of the Church. All of this comes from and through the Church of God.

The COG has always had its own special versions of "exegesis" that it uses to claim doctrinal truth. All of that stems directly back to a man who had no theological training other than reading some books in a public library for 6 months while not taking care of his family by working.

It is also worth noting that the Church promotes – and itself practices – certain rules of exegesis – rules by which to study God’s word faithfully – to ensure we all “rightly divide the Word of truth”.

Following these rules – and recognising the central role the Holy Spirit plays in revealing truth (John 14:17, 26) – the Church of God has produced clear and sound “Study Aids” for more than 80 years on a range of Biblical doctrines that only the Church of God understands and has consistently taught in the modern era.

It is our way or the highway. Truth only resides with us. Do no even presume to understand things on your own, through diligent Bible study and a good examination of scriotures.  Only WE the church can tell you what to believe and how to believe it.

Did you or I come to this depth and breadth of Biblical truth and understanding apart from the Church? No – and we didn’t, because that is not how God works. These ‘study guides’ enhance and provide direction for our study of God’s inspired Word – helping to bring us to completion – helpful to understanding salvation through Christ (II Tim. 3:14-17). They are not ‘God’s Word’ – but they are important in helping us understand God’s Word more fully. 


Thursday, November 26, 2020

On a Lighter Note: Fleeing to My Place of Final Training and Safety


The first hint of Earthaven comes at the 1:20 Mark

I was personally never a fan of the Church's or at least some in the Church's view of a "Place of Safety and Final Training"  I never gave a sermon on it and was quite prepared not to tell anyone that it was time to flee.  The whole concept is a cobbled together scriptural hike through the OT and Revelation making things mean what they never meant. Jonestown was the icing on the cake. As most of you know, Gerald Waterhouse's visits were not high on my list of events and eventually I told him so. 

But, now, and at this stage of my life personally, I have been given an opportunity to live off grid for the most part and settle in for , hopefully, a last life adventure before a gabillion years of non-awareness.  I had in my will that I would be cremated, but evidently I shall more likely now be composted. :)

Will stay in touch as much as practical and give the occasional non-Church of God progress with "Living Intentionally" with a minimal twist. 

PS  Had a very nice, 45 minute interview with Forbes Magazine  London Editor about my personal experiences and impression at AC and in the ministry. The Place of Safety etc, was just a small part of the discussion.  There is a podcast and the Editor said that Forbes is branching out into entertainment issues.  I told him WCG was very entertaining but more prone to mucking up your life eventually. 


Earthhaven Mission Statement

Learning sustainable culture

Community Description

 Earthaven is an aspiring ecovillage founded in 1994 on 329 acres in the mountain forests of western North Carolina, about 50 minutes from Asheville. We are spiritually diverse, and value sustainable ecological systems, permaculture design, elegant simplicity, right livelihood, and healthy social relations. We have both vegetarians and omnivores, and some of us raise livestock for food. We hope to become empowered, responsible, ecologically literate citizens who model bioregionally appropriate culture for our time and place. We intend to become a village of at least 150. 

Some of us work in small, onsite businesses or nonprofits owned or run by members, including Useful Plants Nursery; Culture's Edge, an educational nonprofit; the School of Integrated Living (SOIL), an educational nonprofit); or by offering services such as tours, campground lodging, carpentry and home construction, home care, child care, and healing arts. 

As a learning community dedicated to sharing our resources with the public, we offer workshops in Permaculture design, natural building, consensus decision-making, Sociocracy, creating new ecovillages, herbal medicine, health and healing, and women’s mysteries. 

We also host large events such as the Continental Bioregional Congress , the annual Southeast Regional Permaculture Gathering , and a Village Harvest Festival  We welcome students and other learning groups, and support homeschool parents of children at Earthaven and nearby. We are seeking hardworking, entrepreneurial people, including but not limited to organic growers and farmers; people with solar system, electrical, plumbing, and mechanical skills; healers, artists, and families with children.

Packing my 2009 Toyota Yaris with ALL my earthly goods.  Minimalism has always played a part in my thinking through the years.  They all fit nicely and leaving in a couple of days from Portland.  If I didn't have astronomy stuff,  meteorites, fossils and artifacts, I'd have extra space!  :)

Will be living just off Another Way

Excellent Stargazing away from the city lights

Home is the second and third floors to the left. The view is that of gardens, pasture  and farm creatures. The place is one of a number of Earthhaven neighborhoods on the 325 acres it encoumpasses. There are about 100 adult members and 25 or so children. 

 Earthaven in the NC Mountains near Black Mountain

Will be able to have the Best Feasts Ever...

And, of course, occasional "Final Training" or more likely "on going."

The power is solar and stream powered generator for battery storage. Wood for heat. 

There will be Internet (Phew) but cell phones may take a bit of a short drive to pick up on. 

I would regret turning down the opportunity..

Discerning right from wrong when listening to your minister

Ever since Herbert Armstrong hit the scene and in the subsequent years after his death, the Church of God has been filled with men who claim to have direct access to God, that their words and writings are God-inspired, and that we as members are to heed every word that comes from them as the "truth." The problem lies when men like Pack, Flurry, Thiel, Weinland, and others say things, they expect us to take it all as being true when the vast majority of us know they are liars and blasphemers.

In the churches of God, we have heard over and over that God ordained the ministry and, therefore, they are the only ones who have the ability to interpret scripture. Bible studies held without a minister present are frowned upon, if not outright forbidden. 
But what does scripture say? 
Scripture says when we’re baptized, all of us whom God has called and chosen have the same two things: God’s spirit and God’s word.

Nothing irritates many of today's COG leaders than the laity sitting around and discussing scriptures. How dare they! They have not been educated at God's College, whatever and wherever that may be, so how can they know the proper meaning of scripture!

One of the amazing things about Judaism is that many of them regularly sit around and discuss and argue scripture. So many in the COG think it is blasphemy to argue over scripture, but if you look at the different COG leaders today, they all do that in their own unique way. The main way is when they each declare that God has delivered to them the CORRECT version of how things should be. That immediately negates every other COG leader out there. Then those offended COG leaders ramp up the discourse and clam revelations and dreams sent by their god to them. It is all one huge mess.

Jesus Christ, in Matthew 11, invites us to learn from Him. Luke tells us that the Bereans poured over the scriptures to compare what they were hearing preached with the word of God to see if the preaching matched what God says. 
Paul repeatedly admonishes us to study to show ourselves approved by rightly dividing the word of truth and to prove all things and to work out our salvation (this indicates an intimate relationship with God and Jesus Christ, which is impossible without being in the word of God).

Many COG members, regardless of the group they are in or not in, know far more about scriptures than most of the COG leaders today. There are women in the COG who can up to shame most of the present-day COG leaders, which I think is hilarious! 

The diaspora (this was all the Hebrew Christians, not just some) is admonished in the book of Hebrews that they should be spiritually mature enough to be teachers, but that they are not because they haven’t learned how to discern between right (God’s word) and wrong (everything else) and good (godliness) and evil (worldliness). 
Scripture does not say what we often hear in the churches of God. However, this belief among the church of God ministers is (although most of them probably don’t realize it) designed to make the non-ministers dependent on them for everything. 
But we are supposed to be dependent on God and Jesus Christ for everything, not another human being just like ourselves. 
Although this may be unconscious, it is a perversion of the word of God.

The belief that COG ministers and leaders are the direct conduit from God in all matters, both spiritual and physical is not only a perversion of the Word of God but utter blasphemy. Look at the perverted things they say and how members suffer under their leadership.

I wonder how many COG members out there actually study the Bible WITHOUT any HWA booklets or writings of any other COG leader? There are Christians in the "world" who are far better versed in the meaning of Scripture than many COG members because they are willing to look at many sources. Sadly though, far too many sit there month after month, year after year waiting for their minister or leader to tell them how things should be.

We, as followers of Jesus Christ, bear responsibility as well. Many of us aren’t abiding in the Vine continually by digging into the word of God and reading it (the words on the page, not the words we think are on the page), thinking about it (as the source against which we compare the words we have heard, not the other way around), learning it, and applying it. 
Instead, many of us look to human words (in writing, in sermons, etc.) for knowledge, instead of to God’s words. We are not guiltless in the perversion of the word of God either.

You can read the entire article here which includes two examples of subtle deceptions of a couple of current COG ministers.

Concretized Christianity: “Huh?!?” Things We Hear…


Wednesday, November 25, 2020

Bob Thiel: No Christian Needs To Celebrate National Holidays (Thanksgiving) Nor Should They Watch Vile Filthy Satanic Football On That Day!

It is that time of year as people in the United States celebrate Thanksgiving, though this year will particularly unique due to the COVID restrictions. It is also time to remember the silliness that comes forth out of the resident fools leading various Churches of God, particularly in the improperly named "continuing" Church of God. 

Sadly, we miss James Malm's yearly rant on pagan Thanksgiving, but Bobus Thiel makes up for that loss.


Almost Arrested Elisha Elijah Amos Joshua Doubly Cursed Bob Thiel is back again his yearly meltdown.  Americans are celebrating Thanksgiving and watching evil Satanic  American Football.   Oh, the horrors!

This time around the self-appointed false prophet is also taking a swipe at Thanksgiving.  Real Christians do NOT celebrate national holidays.  Of course, his 1,997 members on the dole in Africa don't celebrate it anyway, so I don't know what his beef is...other than he has to complain about something every day of his miserable negative life.  Has the church ever produced a man who is filled with such negativity?  Does anything please this delusional false prophet?

The Doubly Delusional false prophet starts out by smearing Thanksgiving:

Today is national holiday in the USA called Thanksgiving. And despite certain claims, its specific origins are not pagan. But, of course, no Christian needs to celebrate national holidays like it. And the Bible does condemn gluttony. 

I have never seen anyone sit down and make gluttons of themselves on Thanksgiving, and even if they did it is NOT a sin for that meal.  Gluttony is a life long process of greed, not a single meal.  If that were the case that almost every single minister that has ever eaten in a Feast of Tabernacles Ministerial Hospitality room is a glutton.  Having worked in several of these exclusive areas I have witnessed first hand the over-indulgence of the ministry in food and alcohol.  They deserve the best! It is owed them!

Then the Doubly Cursed delusional false prophet gets to the gist of his entire Debbie-Downer's prime tool in turning the masses away from the "truth once delivered."

One thing that I have noticed on the day called Thanksgiving by those in the USA, is when I have been at many other places than the home I lived in, American football has been playing on television.
For many, other than food and family, football is a major focus of the Thanksgiving holiday.

Oh, the horrors!  God come quickly and save humanity!!!!!!!!!

The Doubly Cursed false prophet is doubly incensed at what Youtube did with his video "sermon" on their channel:

When I was posting a video on YouTube several weeks ago on giving thanks (watch Ingratitude and Giving Thanks), apparently because it mentioned ‘giving thanks, YouTube suggested that a ‘key word’ for the video should be ‘American football’ (which was not in the description).

Then Rod Meredith's wayward "son" trots out his "jesus" as proof his stance on football is correct:

While I have even heard some people thank God for football, it is not a sport that I believe that the God of love would condone.
The person that Jesus stated was greater than all others born of women (Matthew 11:11), John the Baptist taught:

14 Do violence to no man (Luke 3:14, KJV)

What do sports like American football and boxing do? They harm people. Even if played according to all of its rules, American tackle football is evil because it actually physically harms many its participants...
The truth about the harm the sport causes is something that professing Christians, and others, who think that they should watch American football should think about. 

WCG Beaverton/Portland between 1974 and 1985


I have a contact looking for information from anyone why may have attended the Beaverton/Portland Oregon, Worldwide Church of God churches between 1974 - 1985. We are still looking for anyone who may know Steven Lynn Ross who wrote a lengthy article on Petra.  Email me at no2hwa@ (without the space). 

Restored Church of God: Remember as you fundraise for the church that the more zealous you are demostrates to God how much he can use us in His kingdom

Why is it that so many of the "larger" splinter cults in the Church of God are so consumed with money? Their god has to be the most impotent thing humans have ever created. It apparently cannot do anything to save people unless money is flowing into these COG leader's tax havens that they call "churches."

Restored Church of God, under the most superfantabulous Dave Pack, is the one group who's god is consumed with building up its monetary stockpile. The more money you give the more Dave's impotent god inflates.

RCG's Kenneth Orel writes:

Through hard work and vision, God’s people have raised over 2.5 million dollars over four years. This has made possible monumental advancements in the Work—much more than you may realize.

If you have participated in fundraising over the past four years, you have been directly involved in preaching the good news of the soon-coming kingdom of God to a world filled with misery and hopelessness. You have been directly responsible for helping warn the physical nations of Israel of the coming Tribulation and warning spiritual Israel—those with the Holy Spirit—of possible eternal death if they do not “anoint their eyes.” Collectively, we have supported God’s 21st century servant by providing and generating the funds necessary for him to speak to the world. Did you realize fundraising supported such a massive purpose?

How has the "world" ever benefited from any of Dave's miraculous works? Unless one looks at his superfantabulous web site, which incidentally is the greatest thing humans have ever created, one would not have any idea who Dave Pack is and what the Restored Chruch of God is. He has had zero impact on the world. No world leaders have ever met the reclusive Dave. His magazine is a piss poor imitation of the old Plain Truth magazine that went out to over 8 million subscribers. Dave is lucky if he can get his own members to read his Real Truth.

Orel goes on to make this appalling statement:

Those of us who are zealous and participate in fundraising demonstrate to God how much He can use us in His kingdom. For years, we have been taught that we are in training. Training implies we are getting ready to be used when the time comes. That time is quickly coming upon us.

Given how sick the leadership is in various Church of God groups and the abuse they dish out, the question that needs to be asked is WHY would ANYONE ever want to be a part of those "special kingdoms" they have created in their own minds. It is not a kingdom God has ever planned. These fake kingdoms are only figments of COG leaders warped and deluded minds.

Did you know that the more money you give the better the chance that people who the god of Dave has "called" will now have a chance to join the one true church?

If you do not fully understand this aspect of “doing the Work,” here is more clarification: Participation in God’s Work involves the support of spreading the message of the good news of God’s kingdom by television, radio, print and the Internet—all tools that are available to us right now. From here on out, every penny brought in by fundraising will be used to reach individual human beings who are being called out of Satan’s kingdom and into God’s kingdom—to join in the work of spreading that good news to all nations. 


Remember, those people being called, like yourself, have been specifically chosen by God to be the firstfruits of His master plan of salvation. Is fundraising becoming more important in your eyes?

And the COG has the nerve to mock Catholics and indulgences! Hypocrites!

As usual in the Church of God movement, members are always found to be lazy and disinterested in the lofty goals of their leaders. The world is STILL in a screwed up mess because of you lazy members!

Over the years, there have been many in the Church who have done much and have gotten involved, yet sadly, there have been those who have done little or nothing. The difference between these two types of people is vision. To those who are involved, the kingdom and their part in it is real. They see the destruction Satan has wreaked on an unsuspecting world, and have determined in their mind that they want to be used by God to clean up the mess.

Those of you who do not fundraise are allowing Satan access to your mind. That crafty devil is looking for ways to he can use you thwart the master plan of the creature Dave calls god.

Do you realize God is watching us every moment to determine who will assist Christ in cleaning up Satan’s mess? “And that You should visit him [man] every morning, and try [test, investigate, examine, prove] him every moment?” (Job 7:18). He is evaluating how He can use us to transform people’s lives later by how much we do now. 

Fundraising is the reason the "work" exists, because the impotent god of Dave cannot bring to fruition its pathetic kingdom without some money in the coffers.  And, the more money you raise and give to this great work of Dave and his impotent god, the better the chance that god will have a special role for you in its sad little kingdom. The more you give the better looking that crown is going to be!

For those who desire to take this seriously and therefore are qualifying now for positions of great service in the government of God, Christ asks a compelling question: “What more can you do?” (Matt. 5:47). The context of that question comes when Christ was explaining that the law has been magnified. God’s Way is always about doing more—pushing ourselves for the greater benefit of others. 


For those who have chosen to be in His Kingdom as rulers (and it is a choice), Christ needs to know who is going to go above and beyond what is expected of them. (Read about the unprofitable servant in Luke 17:1-10.) 


Just doing what is expected of us is not enough—not for anyone who desires to wear a crown serving under Jesus Christ in His government. They must do more.

Actually the only thing anyone is going to serve "under" here is King Dave himself. Jesus is no more part of this plan than he is in sending Bob Thiel visionary dreams.

Now, for the grand finale...

The Church is poised to become the biggest thing in religion the world has ever seen. The Greatest Work no longer “lies yet ahead.” The Greatest Work described in Isaiah 29:14 and Habakkuk 1:5 is now



Tuesday, November 24, 2020

Why are so many in the COG happy reading the Bible in isolation than they are in risking themselves and going outside and doing it?


Christianity Without Religion (PTM) has a short article up by Brad Jersak, People of the Book or the Book Above the People?

It includes this comment by Barbara Brown Taylor on the Bible and how people worship the words in ink more than the concept of putting those words into action and doing something about it. This has been the malady of the Church of God for decades. The words in The Book, the inked out words, are far more important than actually doing what it says. The church has always been selective in what it believes and practices when it comes to this. This is part of the reason Pack, Thiel, Weinland, Weston, and Flurry are all about talking and writing so much. They think their spoken words and their writings are far more important than actually being 'followers of the Way' and getting off their privileged asses and putting their so-called faith into action. These fake leaders and far too many other COG leaders think their words are far more important than following Jesus. In the same manner, they have deified the words of the Bible and the book itself as the reality instead of moving past the printed words and into doing some kind of action. This is why so many COG members ignore church leadership any more.

"… I notice [that] whenever people aim to solve their conflicts with one another by turning to the Bible, defending the dried ink marks on the page becomes more vital than defending the neighbor. As a general rule, I would say that human beings never behave more badly toward one another than when they believe they are protecting God. In the words of Arun Gandhi, grandson of Mohandas, “people of the book risk putting the book above people.” "
"I know that the Bible is a special kind of book, but I find it as seductive as any other. If I am not careful, I can begin to mistake the words on the page for the realities they describe. I can begin to love the dried ink marks on the page more than I love the encounters that gave rise to them. If I am not careful, I can decide that I am really much happier reading my Bible than I am entering into what God is doing in my own time and place, since shutting the book to go outside will involve the very great risk of taking part in stories that are still taking shape. Neither I nor anyone else knows how these stories will turn out, since at this point they involve more blood than ink. The whole purpose of the Bible, it seems to me, is to convince people to set the written word down in order to become living words in the world for God’s sake. For me, this willing conversion of ink back to blood is the full substance of faith. 
In practice, this means that my faith is far more relational than doctrinal. Although I am guilty of reading scripture as selectively as anyone, my reading persuades me that God is found in right relationships, not in right ideas and that a great deal of Christian theology began as a stammering response to something that had actually happened in the world."
-Barbara Brown Taylor

Monday, November 23, 2020

London Calling: Upcoming Forbes Interview on WCG's teaching on "The Place of Safety"


I was contacted by an editor at Forbes London who is writing about WCG's teaching on "The Place of Safety" and my personal experiences with the concept as a former Pastor.  Interesting in that Forbes is mainly an economics publication 

(I hated the speculation and never intended to tell anyone to go anywhere taking Gerald Waterhouse's marathon sermons with a grain of salt from my youth. You all recall, I am sure, his response when I asked him what he would do when HWA died. I eventually told him personally how I felt about his visits and that he caused more problems for me than he solved. He just said "Is that right?" and I got kicked under the table). I would have opted for online "final training"  The whole concept was a badly cobbled opinion and teaching taking many unrelated and vague OT and NT scriptures and weaving them into making the texts mean what they never meant nor could mean to this day ).  After the Jonestown debacle, the fear of it all in the minds of many was set.   However, I found that "going along to get along" was more common than speaking up. 

Before this interview, Wednesday, I would like a bit of fresh input on how you may have felt personally about it when the concept was presented. No rants, just how you really felt.  Fears, expectations, questions, etc.  Back in the day, did you agree?  Did you look forward to it?  

Thanks for your input. 

An aerial view of Petra reveals that while it may have deterred the Romans, it is not exactly safe from above in our day.  

Sunday, November 22, 2020

Why the church needs your tithe money


Steven L Ross - Where is the Place of Safety? Info needed


I received a note today asking for information on the following individual and the article he published. Does anyone have the article and /or know where Steven Ross now is?

The reason I am asking is that a reporter from an internationally known magazine is researching a report/book/podcast on Steven L. Ross in relation to the Petra info spoken about below:

I'm trying to learn more, both about Steven and his split from the church, as well as the church itself. Can you help? Any information is welcome. 

And if anyone who knew Steven can talk to me, I'd love to talk to them. 

Those interested in the Petra doctrine or those who may have relatives or friends hooked on the idea will benefit from an article recently published by the Foundation for Biblical Research. It is titled "Where Is Your Place of Safety?" Written by former WCG member Steven L. Ross, the article is one of the best ever done to disprove the WCG's Petra theory. AR32, June 1985

When you are no longer welcome at your parent’s house because you chose to leave 'the church'


There has been a lot of discussion on this blog over the years about various Churches of God who actively destroy families due to their arcane and divisive doctrinal/church teachings. From Dave Pack's cult breaking up marriages to Gerald Flurry's cult which prohibits members from speaking to children and/or parents who are no longer church members. The list of abuses has been long and at times shocking in how unchristian they all are.

Here is a letter from a person who has dealt with this in his family's life. 

A post recently appeared here about what it means to be persecuted, and one of the comments that it provoked hit particularly close to home. The commentator wrote: "What does it mean to be persecuted? I will tell you what it means .... It means that you are no longer welcome at your parent’s house because you chose to leave ‘the church’. It means that your children never met their grandparents because you are an outcast (because you left ‘the true faith’). It means that you, your husband and your children are told that you are ‘evil’, ‘satanic’ and ‘lost’." Unfortunately, this is not an uncommon experience among those who have left one of the Armstrong Churches of God.

And, like many others, I have personally experienced some of this rejection and isolation described in this person's comments. After leaving the Worldwide Church of God, all of my former friendships and associations within that organization ended abruptly. Even worse, the only way "back" was to conform to the expectations of the corporation/organization. Without my complete submission, it was made clear to me that reconciliation was impossible. All of those relationships were contingent upon my unqualified acceptance of the party line.

Later, when I left the “fill-in-the-blank” Armstrong Church of God, the same thing happened - only it was even worse this time, because family members were also involved. My dad was a minister in that organization, and he was friends with one of the leaders of the group. Even worse, that leader/friend was a hardliner in the tradition of the old Worldwide Church. Also, my brother (along with one of his children's family) joined the church and adopted and fully endorsed that leader's theology and political views.

However, unlike my earlier experience, this time the death of the relationships wasn't immediate and complete. Instead, the relationships deteriorated over time. Eventually, religious and political topics were declared to be off limits in my interactions with family members - they didn't want to hear anything that contradicted their views. Contact and conversations became less frequent and confined to the weather, home repairs and the health status of family members.

In fairness, I don't want to give the impression that this was an entirely one-sided affair. Over time, I began to resent the restrictions on our relationships. I also began to resent my dad's frequent traveling on behalf of the church, and his unwillingness to visit me. And how does one deal with the sincere desire to "fix" things - to make things better? What do you do when the other side regards you as ignorant, deceived, apostate, wicked or some combination of all of the above? Do you surrender your identity and beliefs to rekindle the closeness and affection that you once shared with them?

In thinking about these things (and I've had many years now to think about them), I'm reminded of the principles behind successfully navigating relationship difficulties (marriage counseling, conflict resolution, etc.). Among many, the foundational principles governing such endeavors are that both sides acknowledge that there is a problem and have the desire to "fix" things. And how does that work when one side believes that compromise or accommodation might endanger their prospects for eternal life in God's Kingdom? How does that work when one side believes that the other is intent on destroying the church or the republic they cherish?

I must admit - at times, the situation seems hopeless and beyond repair. But then I'm reminded of something that alcoholics and addicts have known about for a long time: The Serenity Prayer. You know - the one that goes something like this: God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference.