Saturday, July 15, 2023

Dave Pack Ends Sermon Series - Kingdom Begins In Three Days


The David C. Pack Experience


The long, arduous journey has come to an end. During “The Greatest Untold Story! (Part 458)” on July 8, 2023, Pastor General David C. Pack of The Restored Church of God officially ended the Series by declaring the Kingdom of God had to begin before Av 1. Av 1 starts at sunset on July 18, 2023.


The countdown timer has been running confidently on the landing page all week. You have about three days to get your house in order before the universe cracks open and David C. Pack is proven right. Finally. That is a day to be dreaded by all thoughtful, sane individuals on our little blue dot.



Since The Restored Church of God no longer edits David C. Pack’s messages, they let goofy things slip out the door. In their blind foolishness to “rush out” “important” messages to the members, they forgo the professionalism and polish that used to be a staple years ago.


This small but significant moment gives outsiders a taste of “The David C. Pack Experience.” This reveals to members across the globe what it is like to be at Headquarters in Wadsworth with an unedited Pastor General. The emperor behind the curtain is entirely naked.

Part 458 – July 8, 2023

@ 02:55 We got a problem back here. So, just a minute. Let me see. What’s wrong? Is everything okay? Okay. Maybe sit down there.


Dave was so distracted by "a problem" in the room he had to stop the message and address it in front of everyone. Notice how he came to the rescue by giving critical input to end the crisis.


He made a mountain out of a molehill, as he is oft to do. A problem in the Main Hall could be as severe as one minister kneeling at the seat of another, whispering to him, or handing him a note.


David C. Pack is incapable of minding his own business. Someone quietly standing at the back of the room could bring everything in The Restored Church of God to a screeching halt.


Brethren at the Feast of Tabernacles learn this the hard way. During Dave’s bloviating, some people with back problems need to stand for a minute. DO NOT DO THAT if Dave is at the lectern. The sight of a minister bolting from his chair to "handle" the catastrophe in the making would be humorous if it was not so bizarre.


When I moved to Headquarters, we had Sabbath Services at One Park Centre. During a David C. Pack sermon, a woman sitting in front of me began coughing. Surely, much like the sneezers among the brethren, she had complete control and was intentionally drawing attention away from Dave and onto herself. As she exited her chair to excuse herself, Dave stopped his sermon to comment, “Yeah, you should leave.” She looked at me and whispered, “That’s what I was trying to do.”


A member being disruptive while Dave speaks irks him to the nth degree. Dave could not let such an unforgivable offense go unremarked. It was a brief moment I will never forget. It speaks to what kind of man David C. Pack is.


The modern-day unseen, unheard “problem” in the Main Hall brought back memories. This has happened dozens of times. In years past, it would have been removed from the recording, and only the Headquarters congregation would be aware it ever happened.


But now you know, too. If history is our guide, someone got spanked over this.



Another “David C. Pack Experience” occurred a few minutes later as he asked for audience participation to try to guess his latest discovery.


His strange fidgeting and annoying mannerisms must be seen to be fully appreciated. Turn off the volume if you must, but at least watch him and endure his needlessly long pauses.

@ 12:16 The math didn’t work. What are we missing? Read it and see if you can figure out what we’re missing. It’s right there.


Some in the audience were not bothering to follow along. Dave did not like that.


@ 12:47 Don’t stare at me. Look at your Bible. We have people staring at me like they think I’m joking.


The chair-slouchers are so numb to the sound of his voice that they probably did not notice he was giving them real-time homework. That really does happen.


The people were staring at him because they were not engaged. They had no interest in reading their Bible and putting any mental effort into his pointless exercise. The staring people did not care what Dave was trying to sell. Those could be the same people who follow the website.


Headquarters members are not afforded the same luxury as the brethren in the field. They cannot skip Dave's messages but are forced to sit quietly and witness his nonsense in person. Nobody there wants to hear about a Bible Study after the meal blowing up another Saturday night’s plans.


The brethren at Headquarters have to sit upright. They have to occasionally make eye contact. They have to be mindful of the look on their faces. They have to pretend to take notes. “The David C. Pack Experience” is not all fun and games. The novelty of listening to Elijah That Prophet endlessly muse aloud, wears off quickly. Everyone in that room must be praying the Series really is over.


@ 13:01 I wanted to show you sometimes how the Bible can just be screaming at you, and you can't see it.Not one minister saw this. Not one member ever wrote in and said this.


David C. Pack and The Restored Church of Another god hirelings ignore what the Bible says. The enablers turn a blind eye to what they witness. Members writing to tell Headquarters what they see are often met with, “You think you know better than the apostle?” attitude and a stern talking-to by their local sheriff. After I was corrected by Brad Schleifer and Jeff Ambrose on the Third Floor, I stopped sending my questions to Church Administration.


If Dave likes a write-in, he might read it with a positive spin. But, the wrong write-in could become “a teaching moment” for the entire church. It is safer to keep your mouth shut, folks.



The slow decay of what The Restored Church of God used to be continues.


The sermon audio has distortion artifacts in the higher frequencies. The video is out of sync. The wide shot camera in the back is tilted, off-center, and soft-focused. The primary cameras are also blurry. The people who run the technical duties at Headquarters either lack the care or the experience to fix obvious, simple problems.


You could see this as further evidence of God removing His blessings from that corrupted organization. Once they ejected the True God and the True Jesus Christ to become The Restored Church of Another god, the downhill slide manifests in various ways.


Financial struggles and declining attendance has been matched by local disinterest. The RCG Open House had a whopping 90 people attend. The event was more beneficial for internal damage control to pacify brethren rather than effective public outreach. “See, brethren! We ARE working with the public.”


The RCG woes continue to mount as they receive more bitter resistance on social media.


Faux Evangelist Bradford G. Schleifer announced in the Wadsworth Neighbors #2 No Rules private Facebook group that he had been banned from the primary Facebook group. That means the RCG mouthpiece has been cut off from a local audience of 19,600 members.


God has a sense of humor and is a fan of irony. Brad received the very same unfair treatment he and RCG mete out to former members.


Brad’s cry of lament fell on harsh ears in the smaller, 2,900-member group. The word “cult” appears multiple times in the comments.


For the record, I do not agree with the decision of the moderators of the Wadsworth Neighbors group. I am all for free speech. In fact, the more RCG tries to engage the public, the tougher the pushback gets. So, let them use all the tools in their box to “finally” engage the resident of Wadsworth after sitting comfortably on the Campus for ten years. The more Brad talks, the deeper he buries himself.


We moved into the Hall of Administration across from Giant Eagle in May 2013. Only after Dawn Blue of How It’s Done TV on WCTV and I began shining a light on The Restored Church of God did RCG have a twinkle in their eye to engage the local residents.


If this was Dave, he would ask, “Do you think that is just a coincidence, brethren?”



There is no more time left. The very best information was saved for the very end. And if any of this is wrong, just point your fingers straight up. But do not take my word for it.

@ 26:37 Now, for what I believe is the greatest single discovery I've made in the almost eight years of this Series. At least per timing. I wanna tell you some things that are very, very powerful.


Derp. Not very powerful, after all. Tammuz 24 (July 12 at sunset) already came and went to blow up Dave’s new “God counts a year as 360 days despite what the calendar says.” Sorry, I forgot to mention: SPOILERS.


@ 26:50 I know there are some among us who probably don’t believe the Kingdom is near. They just don’t. And that’s just where they are. And, they’re not gonna be ready. But there are most of us, I think, will be.


Another color of the Brainwashing Rainbow is the “Us v. Them” approach. There are “some” among the brethren who disbelieve Dave, but “you” are not like them, brethren.


@ 27:02 So, those of us who are eager to see God intervene and eager for eternal life in the Kingdom, I think I can tell you the most extraordinary discovery I’ve made in the almost eight years of the Series.


Dave equates people who do not buy his malarkey to people who are not eager for God to bring eternal life. This is similar to the lie that people quit RCG because “This is taking too long.” This is David C. Pack’s reality presumption squeezed through the mold of narcissistic denial.



@ 31:01 Now, what follows that I’m gonna explain to you, you just couldn’t make up. Nor could I have ever seen it without God revealing it at the very end.


@ 31:25 That oughta have everybody fairly intrigued. There is a last message in the Series sometime. So, we got about three and three-quarter days if God wants to go 360 days. We don’t have long. We don’t have long.


The date Dave was referring to was Tammuz 24, which began at sunset on July 12. Even though he focused on the significance of this date, he gave himself generous portions of wiggle room by stretching the possible arrival of Jesus Christ to before Av 1 on July 19.


@ 36:32 …and we would not think that six days to go in some month would start the Kingdom until we eventually came to a year. And what do you know? There are 354 days, and Mr. Pack finally realized (God just put it in my mind), “Oh, 354 plus 6.” You’re still in the midst of the years. Still in the midst of the years. You’re in Tammuz, but you get exactly 360.


Three times, Dave credits God with the information he teaches. Information that proves to be more false as each day closes in on July 19. At first, he shows the significance of Tammuz 24 but then stretches the window further.


@ 40:07 I want you to turn over to perhaps one of the most stunning things, a very recent discovery. Turn over to Zechariah 7, and let's just read something. And this confused me a little bit but no more. So, let’s I wanna give you what I think is an absolute gold standard that the Kingdom has to come in the next nine-and-a-half days. And it can’t come next year…


David C. Pack is a prophetic weatherman. He tells you his opinions of current conditions and extrapolates what he thinks will happen in the coming days based on his private interpretation of the Bible. If a weatherman is wrong, you shrug and say, “Of course, he was wrong. He is just a weatherman.”


When a prophet speaks, claiming God's authority and he is wrong, he is to be disregarded.



Dave expects the best but prepares for the worst.


@ 1:08:55 I would tell you (I wouldn’t be able to explain this), but I would tell you, If this month comes and goes, don’t ask me if it’s gonna happen in Av…we’re gonna wait a year. I'll easily see us going to the end of the month, and God has one day.


Boy, oh, boy. If only there was more time. The things Dave would do.

@ 1:11:20 If we had a long wait and somehow God’s gonna do this differently… I have a robust plan. Since my job’s over. I’m gonna get back to what I did when I was 66 years old. Now, I’m pushing 75. I'm gonna get back, and I’ve got a robust plan to advance the work. Just buckle up. But you don't want that. You wanna see the Kingdom advance.


After Tammuz 24 passed, this is EXACTLY how I envision David C. Pack spending his days:


@ 1:11:49 But, I’m not gonna sit around crying in a fetal position in the corner, bawling and shaking because “It didn’t come.” That’s not the way I’m cut. Nor you. We’re the people of God. We endure.


He infers that some of the brethren react the way he was exaggerating. People leaving because another date failed is their way of bawling and shaking. Maybe they are tired of enduring his lies and biblical fraud. That reality does not enter his mind.


@ 1:12:39 Now, lemme just say again, My work in the Series is over. Like John the Baptist…this is the way I live my life ever since I saw the office God gave me. It was always “to prepare a people for the Lord.” Not to warn this world about what’s gonna happen in another announcement year. [chuckles]


Dave likes comparing himself to John the Baptist occasionally. John did not experience the most-ideal retirement package of his day.


@ 1:13:22 But, my job, like John the Baptist, you did no miracles. Who went about a year…


"The Greatest Untold Story!" alone has lasted for over seven years. The Elul 24 teaching began in 2012. What "about a year" he refers to will have to remain a mystery.


@ 1:13:44 And I’m not doing miracles, so John seemed to be, you know, an Elijah. And I’m just telling you, my his job was to prepare a people for the Lord…So, that is over.


God spoke directly to John the Baptist. John saw the Holy Spirit descend upon Jesus Christ as he baptized Him. What John said came to pass. David C. Pack is NOTHING like John the Baptist.



Rest assured, "The Greatest Untold Story!" is now over because David C. Pack said it. And that man is no liar. Ahem.


@ 1:14:13 My job is done.


@ 1:14:30 I can’t come back with 359 [459], and I'm telling you, I won't. There’re no other Kingdom, there’s no little, you know, some little Thimble Kingdom or something that we built in here…it’s just silly. It’s not there.


The Some Little Thimble Kingdom that used to be there is now silly. Some of us realized it was silly before Dave did. He has a funny way of legitimizing his skeptics.


Then, a glimmer of light through the darkness.


@ 1:19:11 We’ve had people quit.

@ 1:28:18 We had a guy leave us the other day and went back to the Millennium. When you do that…He just stood up, blew a trumpet, and said, "I wanna get everybody's attention. We serve a lying, murderous god who's gonna slaughter billions before the Millennium." 'Cause he knows better. So, I know that there are people who will cling to this [1000]. This [1-7-1000] is right. But, I wanna just say if this exact timing is somehow wrong, I simply can’t tell you more. I can’t.


That description of what the man said and did is NOT literal. Dave is waxing poetic by creating a word picture to warn potential defectors. He reminds brethren that he might speak about THEM in the same way if they choose to flee when nothing happens by Thursday morning.


@ 1:30:32 So, Godspeed either Christ coming or a last-minute message to Laodicea that they have to decide before He does. This Series is over. That duddn’t mean I wouldn’t send a quick email about something if there were something helpful that arose. Godspeed either one that the Bible describes. Good night.



The Series is over. The greatest discovery yet. New dates for the return of Jesus Christ are presented with asterisks. Publically addressing a problem when there is none. Putting the congregation on the spot. If only he had more time. His past teaching is now silly. He is like John the Baptist. Exaggerating a member’s departure. He has nothing more he could possibly say. RCG will have to wait another year.


Part 458 was a well-rounded “David C. Pack Experience.”

Marc Cebrian

See: The David C. Pack Experience

The Waldenses and the Church of God Myths Associated With Them


A time honored classic:



By Jared L. Olar

As someone who was born and raised in the Seventh-Day Sabbatarian Worldwide Church of God (WCG), I was taught that Christians who worshipped Jesus on the first day of the week were violating God's commandments. I believed that the majority of Christians were nothing less than apostate-for true Christians, I was told, should follow the example of Jesus and the original Christians by resting on the Sabbath day and observing the seven annual festivals described in Leviticus 23. 

The WCG used to teach that this terrible apostasy began to take shape in the first century A.D., even during the lifetime of the original apostles. In this interpretation of early Church history, though most Christians went astray, God preserved a faithful remnant of Sabbath-keeping Christians who endured persecution at the hands of ``the False Church.'' Through the centuries, the faithful remnant were known by various exotic names, such as Nazarenes, Ebionites, Quartodecimans, Paulicians, Petrobrusians, Passigenes, Lollards, or Sabbatarians. We claimed that in the High Middle Ages and the late medieval era, most true Christians were called Waldenses. 1

However, as an ardent student of history, my studies eventually revealed that the version of Church history I'd learned in the WCG was gravely flawed in many different ways. As this article will show, history fails to substantiate the belief that the Waldenses (or even some of the Waldenses) were Seventh-Day Sabbatarians. Neither can history support the belief that the Waldenses were ancestral to English and American Seventh-Day Sabbatarians in the 1600s. 

The Waldenses of Sabbatarian Legend:

In the mid-1800s, Ellen G. White, one of the founders of the Seventh-Day Adventist Church, wrote a chapter about the Waldenses in her book The Great Controversy, where she said: 

``In lands beyond the jurisdiction of Rome there existed for many centuries bodies of Christians who remained almost wholly free from papal corruption. They were surrounded by heathenism and in the lapse of ages were affected by its errors; but they continued to regard the Bible as the only rule of faith and adhered to many of its truths. These Christians believed in the perpetuity of the law of God and observed the sabbath of the fourth commandment . . . But of those who resisted the encroachments of the papal power, the Waldenses stood foremost . . . The faith which for centuries was held and taught by the Waldensian Christians was in marked contrast to the false doctrines put forth from Rome . . . Through ages of darkness and apostasy there were Waldenses who denied the supremacy of Rome, who rejected image worship as idolatry, and who kept the true Sabbath. Under the fiercest tempests of oppositions they maintained their faith.'' 

But the Seventh-Day Adventists were not alone in claiming the Waldenses as spiritual and historical antecedents. That same view of the Waldenses is widespread in the publications of the Sabbatarian movement. Here is the way the WCG characterised the Waldenses in their Ambassador College Bible Correspondence Course, Lesson 51, published in 1968: 

``The Waldenses recognized that they were the true successors of the apostolic church. They kept the Sabbath, also the yearly Passover. And each September or October (in God's seventh month-see Lev. 23), they held at the headquarters church a great `conference.' As many as 700 persons attended from afar. New students were chosen, ministerial assignments were made, and crowds gathered daily to listen to sermons. What could this gathering have been but the Feast of Tabernacles! . . . But in 1194, Alphonse, king of Aragon, Barcelona and Provence decreed these `WaldensesZapatati or Inzabbati [keepers of God's Sabbath] who otherwise are called the Poor Men of Lyons' worthy of any punishment short of death or mutilation.'' (ACBCC p.11) 

In this account, the Waldenses were presented not only as Seventh-Day Sabbatarians, but as observers of the seven annual holy days of the Hebrew calendar-not coincidentally, just like the pre-1995 WCG. It is also probably not a coincidence that this account describes the life and activities of Peter Waldo, founder of the Waldenses, in terms remarkably similar to the way the WCG was formerly wont to describe itself and its founder, former businessman Herbert W. Armstrong: 

``Then Christ acted. The man He chose to become His apostle was a wealthy merchant in Lyons, . . . Christ saw by his actions that Waldo was in earnest. His mind began to be opened to the truth that had formerly meant nothing to him . . . Waldo brought the same practical common sense that had made him successful as a businessman to the organization and Work of the Church. He had the education and experience which so few in God's Church had (I Cor. 1:26). Jesus Christ probably guided that experience, unknown to Waldo, long before his conversion. As he preached, others united themselves and their efforts to his. They became, as it is said, `as many co-workers for him.' They dedicated their lives and their property to the spread of Christ's gospel. This little group became known as the `Poor Men of Lyons.' But that was not the name of the Church. They called themselves the Church of God, or simply Christians.'' (ACBCC p.6) 

Further on we will see just how far off the mark this depiction of Peter Waldo was In fact, Waldo and Armstrong had little in common. 

The Waldenses of Protestant Legend:

Seventh-Day Sabbatarians are not alone in claiming the Waldenses as spiritual and historical ancestors. Historically speaking, the Seventh-Day Sabbatarian movement evolved from the wider Baptist and Puritan movements. Like their spiritual cousins the Sabbatarians, Baptists have often insisted that their churches trace back to the Apostles through a succession of non-Catholic sects such as the Montanists, Donatists, Paulicians, Albigensians, and Waldenses. This is essentially the same point of view that informs such publications as Herman L. Hoeh's old booklet A True History of the True Church (1959) and Ivor C. Fletcher's aptly-named Incredible History of God's True Church (1984), both of which were written by followers of WCG founder Herbert W. Armstrong. 

This interpretation of Church history is known as Baptist Successionism, or ``Landmarkism''-from the principle that a Baptist could recognise historical ancestors of the Baptist churches by looking for sects that had certain doctrinal traits and practices, called ``landmarks.'' Baptists looked for baptistic traits, while Seventh-Day Sabbatarians have sought Sabbatarian traits. The classic presentation of Landmarkism was the old Baptist work The Trail of Blood, but it has appeared as recently as 1994, in Dave Hunt's A Woman Rides the Beast

``The truth is that Roman Catholicism did not represent Christ and was not His Church. For at least a thousand years before the Reformation the true church was composed of multitudes of simple Christians who were not part of the Roman system. That such believers existed, refused to be called `Catholics,' and worshipped independently of the Roman hierarchy is history. It is a fact that they were pursued to imprisonment and death since at least the end of the fourth century.''

Now, as a matter of fact, beginning as early as the 1500s, it has been common for Protestants to see the Waldenses and other non-Catholic groups of the Middle Ages (like the Albigenses, Lollards, or Hussites) as proto-Protestants or evangelicals, forerunners of the Protestant Reformation. Of course, the Waldenses did choose to ally themselves with the Protestant Reformers, and the Waldenses today are doctrinally and theologically similar to the Methodists. The Italian Waldenses of modern times are even formally affiliated with the Italian Methodists in a federation. Thus, it should be no surprise that even Waldensian historian Giorgio Tourn's 1989 book You Are My Witnesses-The Waldensians Across 800 Years would describe the early Waldenses as: 

``a slender band of twelfth century evangelicals, harassed and excommunicated by the Church . . . engaged in rediscovering the Bible and circulating it in their native tongue, in preaching and making common cause with the poor . . .'' (Tourn p.11) 

Nevertheless, the absorption of the Waldenses into the Protestant movement was a later development. As we shall see, the early Waldenses were neither evangelicals nor Sabbatarians, nor is it possible to trace a lineage from the Waldenses to later non-Catholic groups that arose after the Protestant Reformation. 

The Waldenses of History:

The very same year that Dave Hunt asserted his successionist model of Church history, Baptist historian James Edward McGoldrick published a definitive debunking of successionism entitled Baptist Successionism: A Crucial Question in Baptist History. In the preface, McGoldrick writes: 

``Although no reputable Church historians have ever affirmed the belief that Baptists can trace their lineage through medieval and ancient sects ultimately to the New Testament, that point of view enjoys a large following nevertheless. It appears that scholars aware of this claim have deemed it unworthy of their attention, which may account for the persistence and popularity of Baptist successionism as a doctrine as well as an interpretation of church history. Aside from occasional articles and booklets that reject this teaching, no one has published a refutation in a systematic, documented format.'' (McGoldrick p. iv) 

McGoldrick's book includes a chapter in which he considers whether the Waldenses could be considered spiritual and historical ancestors of the Baptists. Coupled with the information in Giorgio Tourn's You Are My Witnesses, McGoldrick's book presents a picture of the early Waldenses that bears little if any resemblance to the picture presented in Seventh-Day Sabbatarian literature. 

Here is McGoldrick's account of how Peter Waldo (Old French ``Valdes,'' Latin ``Valdesius'') made the radical changes in his life that led to the founding of the Waldensian movement: 

``Little is known about Waldo's life, but it is clear that he was a prosperous merchant in Lyons who suddenly divested himself of his wealth in order to pursue a life of `evangelical perfection,' which, to medieval Catholics, meant following the example of Christ, including the Savior's poverty. Waldo's decision to alter his life so radically came about 1176, soon after he had witnessed the sudden death of a prominent citizen of Lyons. The sources indicate that Waldo became impressed with his need to follow Christ when he heard a minstrel relate the legend of St. Alexis, who had renounced riches and separated from his wife to undertake a pilgrimage to the Holy Land. Waldo also accepted counsel from a priest who told him of Christ's command to a rich inquirer who had come to him seeking the way to eternal life. Jesus said: `If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.' (Matthew 19:21)'' (McGoldrick p.70) 

This is the way Giorgio Tourn's You Are My Witnesses narrates the same events: 

``Valdesius, it was said, after Mass on a certain day came upon a minstrel who was singing the story of St. Alexis, the rich and spoiled member of a noble family who all of a sudden, on his wedding night, left his bride and family to undertake a pilgrimage to the Holy Land. There, as a result of his saintly life and sufferings, he became so disfigured that, upon his return to his old city, no one recognized him. Ignored and left to die under an old staircase, he was identified only after his death . . . Valdesius, so the story goes, was deeply touched and invited the minstrel to his home to play the song again. As he listened, Valdesius began to believe that he should follow Alexis' example and renounce completely his previous life. 

``Another account has it that as a rich merchant in the midst of poverty he was troubled in conscience and sought counsel at the cathedral from a priest. The two were said to have engaged in such prolonged and earnest conversation that at last the priest read to Valdesius the passage from Matthew 19, in which Jesus tells the rich young man to sell all his goods, give the proceeds to the poor, and follow him. 

``There is yet another version. Valdesius was said to have been extremely upset over the sudden death of a friend who was taken in a seizure in the course of a banquet. He is supposed to have asked himself, `If death should overtake me, would my soul be ready for the journey?' After weeks of uncertainty, this tale goes, he decided to give up his former way of life and begin anew.'' (Tourn p.13) 

In light of what McGoldrick and Tourn have said, the flaws and inaccuracies of the WCG's version of events are obvious. Compare their accounts to that of the Ambassador College Bible Correspondence Course, Lesson 51: 

``As always it began again in the very smallest way. The world scarcely noticed. Waldo began to preach in 1161. Yet the three Catholic writers who attempt to explain the origin of his work know nothing of the first 12 to 15 years. By that time a notable work was being done. They do relate that a friend's sudden death at Waldo's side shocked him into serious consideration of the meaning of life. 

``Note here a contrast. Martin Luther, when a friend at his side was similarly struck by lightning, fled in terror of God to the life of a monk. He endured physical and mental agony, until, years later, he worked out his 'faith alone' theology to escape the harsh God he assumed the Bible taught. Waldo, on the other hand, knew of God as a God of love. Obviously, he had not been reared as a Catholic . . . . In the district of Walden, his family must have known of God's Church. 

``Seeking completely to follow Christ, Waldo began to give away the bulk of his money. It was his enemy, he said, which had kept him from God . . . .'' (ACBCC p.6) 

The Early Waldenses and Catholicism:

The WCG's version of events gives little or no hint of what the medieval sources recorded about Peter Waldo's Catholic beliefs, habits, and attitudes. Far from it being ``obvious'' that ``he had not been reared as a Catholic,'' in fact Waldo went to Mass, sought the advice of priests, and sought to follow the ascetical example of St. Alexis. Needless to say, such things would have been unthinkable to a disciple of Herbert Armstrong. 

According to McGoldrick, after Waldo underwent his conversion experience, ``Waldo developed a sense of urgency to become learned in the scriptures, and to that end he paid two scholars to translate the Gospels and other portions of the Bible into his vernacular tongue.'' (McGoldrick p.71) That is the kind of impulse that evangelicals or Seventh-Day Sabbatarians can truly appreciate. However, medieval sources clarify that this translation came about when he asked some Catholic priests to translate the four Gospels, some books of the Bible, and some of the writings of St. Augustine of Hippo, St. Jerome, St. Ambrose of Milan, and Pope St. Gregory I. 

Not surprisingly, the WCG never mentioned that the Waldensian vernacular Bible translation was the work of Catholic priests, that it was not a translation of the entire Bible, and that Waldo was apparently just as devoted to the study of the writings of significant Church Fathers as he was to the study of Holy Scripture. Also, Waldo's commissioning of a vernacular translation of parts of the Bible is just one of many historical examples that undermine the widespread myth that the medieval Catholic Church refused to allow the common people to read the Bible in their own language, or that the Bible was deliberately locked up in a language only a few priests and bishops could read. History provides numerous examples of medieval Catholics from all over Europe preparing vernacular translations of the Bible in whole or in part, and doing so with approval of the Church authorities. Waldo's behavior was unexceptional in that regard. 

Others in Lyons were attracted to Waldo's notable piety and devotion, and before long a movement of lay Catholics had taken shape, calling itself ``the Poor'' and looking to Waldo as unofficial leader. But this was not a separate, free-standing church with non-Catholic teachings. ```The movement did not seek to alter Catholic dogma and was not intended to be a separatist church . . . . Waldo hoped to gain papal approval for his movement.'' (McGoldrick pp.71, 76) 

Obviously, this is not a historical continuation or outgrowth of some earlier non-Catholic church or sect such as the Paulicians, Petrobrusians, or Henricians. Rather, this is the genesis of a movement within the Catholic Church, a movement to encourage pious asceticism, spiritual renewal, and concern for the poor. In fact, the early Waldenses bore a far closer resemblance to the Franciscan Order than to any Protestant church, let alone any Seventh-Day Sabbatarian church. Indeed, the Waldenses and Franciscans both arose in part as a reaction against the lives of luxury of far too many Catholic prelates of that era. Also, just as St. Francis of Assisi and his followers encountered trouble and opposition from Catholic authorities, so too did Waldo and the Poor of Lyons. But where the Franciscans succeeded in winning the approval and support of the Catholic Church, the Waldenses eventually became a separatist or schismatic group who viewed themselves as the only genuine Christians on earth. 

Conflict with the Catholic Church:

We have already begun to see that the WCG's picture of the Waldenses was gravely flawed and erroneous. Note now their description of the way the Waldenses came into conflict with the Catholic Church: 

``Persecution was also raised by the archbishop at Lyons. About 1176, he forbade the `Poor Men' to preach. `We must obey God rather than men,' they replied (see Acts 4:18-19; 5:28-29). 

``When they persisted, they were cited to appear before Pope Alexander III. Now it was no longer just a question of preaching at Lyons. The issue at stake was whether God's Work anywhere could continue. For archbishops and popes exercised civil power in that age. 

``Striving to be wise as serpents yet harmless as doves, Waldo himself went boldly to Rome in late 1178. He put forward the Bible translation into Provencal-which could be understood all over southern France and adjoining parts of Italy and Spain-and urged the common people's need for it. Doctrine was kept in the background. 

``The pope appeared willing at first to accede to Waldo's demands, but left the decision to the Lateran Council of 1179. Two of Waldo's associates appeared before the council. They were virtually condemned. `You can preach,' they were told, `but only if the local priest asks you to!' The reason given? `The Roman Church cannot endure your preaching!''' (ACBCC p.7) 

Compare that account to the way McGoldrick relates the reasons Waldo and his movement fell afoul of the Catholic Church: 

``The bishops at first would have found nothing about which to object had not the Waldenses assumed the right to preach. It was unauthorized preaching in public places that aroused suspicion and led the Archbishop of Lyons to attempt to stop them. 

``In 1179 a small delegation of Waldenses appeared at Rome during the Third Lateran Council and asked Pope Alexander III (1159-81) for his approval of the Waldenses' ministry. At that time the Waldenses gave the pope a copy of their Bible translation. The pope and council recognized the Waldenses' right to practice evangelical perfection but denied them the right to preach.'' (McGoldrick pp.71-72) 

In the WCG's version, Waldo and the Poor Men of Lyons were non-Catholics who wanted the Catholic Church not to interfere in their ministry, so they acted in a duplicitous, dishonest manner to downplay doctrinal differences. However, McGoldrick's account presents the Waldenses as Catholics who began to preach without first obtaining permission from their priests and bishop. Told to stop preaching by their bishop, they appealed their case to the pope to obtain official sanction for their movement. Far from making ``demands,'' the Waldenses had actually petitioned or requested relief. This is hardly the behavior of non-Catholics who do not recognise papal authority. 

But why did the Catholic Church refuse to grant the Poor Men of Lyons permission to preach? In the WCG's version, the only ``reason'' given was that ``the Roman Church cannot endure your preaching.'' But that is no reason at all. It's merely a confirmation of the original verdict of the Archbishop of Lyons. To explain why they were forbidden to preach, we should examine Walter Map of England's description of his encounter with the Waldenses at the Third Lateran Council: 

``We have seen these Waldensians at the Council called by Pope Alexander III; they are simple and unlearned people who take their name from their leader, Valdes, a citizen of Lyons on the Rhone. They presented the pope with a book written in Gallic, containing texts and commentaries on the Psalms and other books from the scriptures. 

``They insisted that they be granted authorization to preach, judging themselves to be experts, while in fact they were merely conceited, like those birds that are unable to see snares and believe they are free . . . Two of the Waldensian leaders were brought before me. They had come to dispute the faith, not to search for truth in love . . . 

``The presiding prelate ordered me to proceed in my questioning . . . . To begin, I put to them elementary questions . . . 

```Do you believe in God the Father?' They replied, `We do.' 

```And in the Son?' They replied, `We do.' 

`` `And in the Holy Spirit?' They replied, `We do.' 

``Then I added, `And in the Mother of Christ?' And once more they answered, `We do.' 

``At this last response a roar of derision went up and they withdrew, confused, and rightly so, because they had no one to guide them. And yet these same people expect to lead others.'' (Tourn pp.19-20) 

Walter Map's exercise demonstrated that the Waldenses lacked theological schooling. Indeed, many Waldenses were illiterate, and committed whole books of the Bible to memory through oral repetition. The two Waldenses that Map interviewed at the Lateran Council couldn't understand why their affirmation of belief in the Mother of Christ elicited laughter and mockery. Far from being non-Catholics who rejected Catholic doctrine, they saw themselves as good Catholics and had a deep devotion to Jesus' Mother-they readily confessed belief in the Virgin Mary. Indeed, Waldo himself is said to have taken his vow of poverty on August 15, the Feast of the Assumption of Mary. 

Where they went wrong was in unintentionally implying that Mary was the fourth Person of the Godhead. The traditional Creeds only apply the words ``I believe'' to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, never to Mary. Also, in unwittingly approving of a title for Mary-``Mother of Christ''-that was associated with the ancient Nestorian heresy, their words implied a denial that Jesus Christ is simultaneously true God and true Man. Nestorians rejected the title ``Mother of God'' because of their denial of the Incarnation, saying that Mary was only ``Mother of Christ'' and nothing more. The Waldenses certainly didn't mean to espouse Nestorianism-it was an innocent mistake of the unlearned. And that was Map's whole point: the Waldenses should obtain a solid grounding in the teachings of the Catholic Church before asking for permission to preach. 

Recall as well that the Waldenses first got into trouble with the Catholic Church by preaching in public without first asking their bishop for permission. The reason the Catholic Church "could not endure" their preaching was not only that they were uneducated and apt to fall into classic theological traps in their attempts to explain Catholic doctrine, but also that their preaching conflicted with the hierarchical nature of the Catholic Church. As early as 110 A.D., Catholic bishops have claimed primary responsibility for preaching the Gospel, saying that it was committed to the Twelve Apostles and their successors the bishops, who could in turn delegate the duty of preaching to priests and deacons, and even to laymembers from time to time. The conflict first arose when Guichard, Archbishop of Lyons, refused to give Waldo and his followers permission to preach-doctrinal matters were not an issue at this point. 

Disobedient, not Heretical:

Waldo and his movement were very disappointed that they would not be officially sanctioned by the Catholic Church, so they made a fateful decision. McGoldrick describes their reaction in this way: 

``Waldo and his disciples were ordered to submit to the bishops. To render unqualified submission would, however, have meant the end of their preaching, so the Waldenses disobeyed and brought upon themselves a barrage of clerical criticism. As of yet the Waldenses had issued no pronouncements which could have been rightly construed as heresy, and in 1180 Waldo signed a statement of faith dictated by a papal legate in which the popular exponent of apostolic living subscribed to all of the major tenets of traditional Catholicism.''(McGoldrick p.72) 

Take special note of the fact that at this early stage, the disagreements were not doctrinal, but rather had to do with obedience to Church authorities and the license to preach. To show just how fundamentally Catholic the beliefs of Peter Waldo and his original followers were, here are lengthy excepts from the statement of faith that Waldo gave when he met with the papal legate Henri de Marci in the Languedoc in 1180: 

``In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and of the Blessed and Ever-Virgin Mary: Be it noted by all the faithful that I, Valdesius, and all my brethren, standing before the Holy Gospels, do declare that we believe with all our hearts, having been grasped by faith, that we profess openly that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three Persons, one God, and that the divine Trinity in full is one essence and substance, eternal and omnipotent, and that the single Persons of the Trinity are fully . . . one God as affirmed in the Creed . . . . 

``We firmly believe and explicitly declare that the incarnation of the Divinity did not take place in the Father and the Holy Spirit, but in the Son alone, so that he who was the divine Son of God the Father was also true man from his Mother . . . In Him co-existed two natures, God and Man in one person, . . . and He ate, drank, grew weary, and rested after His journeys . . . 

``We believe in our hearts and confess with our lips one Church, Catholic, Holy, Apostolic and Immaculate, apart from which no one can be saved. 

``We accept the sacraments celebrated in the Church through the invisible and incomprehensible power of the Holy Spirit, even though administered by priests who sin . . . 

``We firmly believe and affirm that the sacrifice, that is, the bread and wine, after its consecration, is the body and blood of Christ; in this sacrifice the good priest adds nothing more and the wicked priest in no way diminishes the sacrifice. 

``We believe that those sinners who repent in their hearts, confess with their lips and give satisfaction with their works, according to the scriptures, can receive God's forgiveness . . . 

``We firmly believe in the judgment to come, and in the fact that each man will receive reward or punishment according to what he has done in this flesh. We do not doubt the fact that alms, sacrifice, and other good works benefit the dead. 

``And since, according to the Apostle James, faith without works is dead, we have renounced this world and have distributed to the poor all that we possess, according to the will of God, and we have decided that we ourselves should be poor in such a way as not to be anxious for the morrow, and to accept from no one gold, silver, or anything else, with the exception of raiment and daily food. We have set before ourselves the objective of fulfilling the Gospel counsels as precepts. 

``We believe that anyone in this age who keeps to a proper life, giving alms and doing other good works from his own possessions and observing the Lord's commandments, can be saved. Brothers, we make this declaration in order that if anyone should come to you affirming that he is one of us, you may know for certain that he is not one of us if he does not profess this same faith.'' (Compiled from Tourn pp.20-21 and McGoldrick pp.76-77) 

Such a strongly Catholic statement of faith would never have come from the lips of Herbert W. Armstrong, who rejected the Trinity as a satanic, pagan teaching, and denounced the Catholic Church as ``the False Church,'' ``Babylon the Great,'' and ``the Great Whore.'' Also, as we saw earlier, Giorgio Tourn presented the early Waldenses as ``twelfth century evangelicals.'' Thus, it is understandable that at one point Tourn seems to try to explain (if not downplay) Peter Waldo's belief in those teachings of the Catholic Church with which evangelicals disagree. Tourn wrote: 

``The pope's representative proceeded to interrogate Valdesius so as to check his orthodoxy, and then required him to sign a formal declaration of adherence to the Catholic faith. Valdesius' stand was so `Catholic' that he did not hesitate to affix his signature. It is worth noting that Valdesius inserted in the text a significant expression of his own. For him and his companions, the call to a life of poverty was in consequence of obedience to the command of God . . . .'' (Tourn p. 18) 

This resembles McGoldrick's words quoted above, ``Waldo signed a statement of faith dictated by a papal legate.'' But there is no good reason to believe his statement of faith had been dictated by Henri de Marci, with only an addendum on Christian poverty being of Waldo's own authorship. From beginning to end, the statement of faith reads as though it were the expression of Waldo's own faith-an attempt to make clear to the Catholic Church what he and his movement stood for. Waldo probably did more than affix a signature to a statement that had been dictated for him. If anything, Waldo may have dictated the statement to Henri de Marci. And this was not the only time that Waldo affirmed his adherence to Catholic teaching: 

``In a statement of faith submitted to the bishop of Albano, Peter Waldo affirmed his belief in transubstantiation, prayers for the dead, and infant baptism.'' (McGoldrick p.77)

From Disobedience to Heresy:

Though Waldo and his movement did not start out with the intention to separate from the Catholic Church and to renounce many Catholic doctrines, that is nevertheless what eventually came to pass. 

``While Waldo and his followers had no doctrinal quarrel with Rome, their defiance of episcopal prohibitions against preaching led in 1184 to their condemnation by a synod of bishops meeting in Verona. Much to their dismay, the Waldenses were excluded from the Church and declared to be heretics. 

``In 1207 Durand of Huesca abandoned the Waldenses and returned to the Catholic Church. He asked Pope Innocent III to authorize an order of `Catholic Poor,' a move that would be completely submissive to the hierarchy. St. Dominic Guzman had assisted Durand in recruiting small bands of Waldenses who agreed to return to Rome. Later, clerical opposition to the Catholic Poor hindered their work badly, and in 1254 Pope Innocent IV directed the Poor Catholics to merge with the Augustinian Hermits. 

``Exclusion from the Church caused the Waldenses to re-examine dogma. . . The drift away from Catholic dogmas was relatively slow and uneven, and some segments of the sect became more radical than others.''(McGoldrick pp.72-73) 

Waldo does not seem to have approved of everything his followers were beginning to do. In any event, due to pressure and persecution from ecclesiastical and civil authorities, the Waldenses adopted a strategy of outwardly behaving as orthodox Catholics while secretly spreading their views. As an underground sect, they gathered for worship with a version of the Lord's Supper that was modeled on Christ's miraculous feeding of the five thousand. Consequently, the underground Waldensian Eucharist included bread, wine, and fish. While regularly going to Mass in order to avoid detection, they would however only confess their sins to their own elders rather than to a Catholic priest. 

All the same, their views were still closer to Catholicism than to Protestantism. The chief differences between Catholic and Waldensian teaching were an insistence on a strictly literal interpretation of Christ's teachings regarding riches, oaths, vows, and the taking of human life (the Waldenses became pacifists, and rejected the use of the death penalty). As mentioned before, only after the Protestant Reformation did the Waldenses become evangelical Protestants. However, well before the 1500's, the Waldenses did come to identify themselves as the only true Christians, believing that the Pope was antichrist and that the Catholic Church had departed from the true faith in the time of Pope St. Sylvester I and Emperor Constantine. In that way they certainly resembled many Protestants, especially Seventh-Day Sabbatarians.

Never Sabbatarians:

Just as the early Waldenses were not evangelicals, so too they had little, if anything, in common with Seventh-Day Sabbatarians. Though Sabbatarians have frequently believed the Waldenses included Christians who observed the seventh-day Sabbath, there is simply no historical evidence for that belief. 

We saw above that the Waldenses were sometimes called Zapatati or Inzabbati, names which the WCG formerly interpreted as ``keepers of God's Sabbath.'' In fact, those names had nothing to do with any sort of Sabbatarian belief. Rather, they referred to the Waldenses' preferred footwear. In a 2002 newsletter, Seventh-Day Adventist historian Dr. Samuele Bacchiochi pointed out certain errors in the writings of Ellen G. White. In his newsletter Bacchiochi wrote: 

``What [Adventist scholars] have found in some documents are references to the insabbati, a common nickname for the Waldenses. In the past some uninformed readers have taken this term to mean that the Waldenses were Sabbath-keepers. . . Unfortunately the term insabbati has no connection to Sabbath-keeping. As Adventist Church Historian Daniel Augsburger explains in the symposium The Sabbath in Scripture and History, the Waldenses were often called insabbati, not because they kept the Sabbath, but because they wore sandals. `The Latin word for sandals is sabbatum, the root of the Spanish zapato and the French sabot. The sandals were an outward sign of their being imitators of the apostles in living the vita apostolica and the justification of their preaching the gospel.' In other words, the Waldenses were often called insabbati- sandal-wearers-because many of them wore sandals cut away at the top in their itinerant ministry of preaching the Gospel.'' 

Furthermore, although the WCG once tried to identify the Waldenses as observers of the annual holy days of Leviticus 23, there is even less reason to link them to such customs than there is to link them to Seventh-Day Sabbatarianism. True to their Catholic origins, the Waldenses celebrated Easter or Pascha-``Passover''-but they were not in any way Quartodecimans. Their Paschal festival was not timed to start on the 14th day of the first month of the Hebrew sacred calendar, but instead simply followed the Catholic Church's calculation. As for the annual Waldensian conference in September and October, far from an attempt to celebrate the autumnal Feast of Tabernacles, its timing resulted from the fact that certain Catholic feasts and saints' days especially loved by the Waldenses happened to fall in the autumn. 

It is clear, then, that the medieval Waldenses could not in any way be either spiritual or historical ancestors of Seventh-Day Sabbatarianism. The conclusion of McGoldrick's chapter on the Waldenses applies not only to Baptists, but also to Sabbatarians, and indeed to most of Protestantism: 

``At no time in their history were the Waldenses Baptists, despite some beliefs, such as the concept of a free church, which the two groups have held in common. Neither Waldo nor his early disciples could have subscribed to any historic Baptist confession of faith, and those doctrines that are peculiarly baptistic would have been unacceptable to Waldenses in any period of their history. Although successionists have hailed them as Baptists, medieval Waldenses were quite similar to the Catholic Franciscans, those of the Reformation were akin to Presbyterians, and those of today have become Methodists.'' (McGoldrick p.83) 


1The Worldwide Church of God no longer holds these erroneous views. A chart detailing WCG's actual historical roots in the Puritan and Millerite movements can be found at the end of the book Transformed by Truth by Joseph W. Tkach, Jr. (Multnomah Books, Sisters, Oregon, 1997). 

Issue 14


File translated from TEX by TTH, version 3.01.On 9 Feb 2003, 16:48.

Friday, July 14, 2023

Spiritual hosts of wickedness and rulers of the darkness now attacking God's greatest prophet!


Satan is angry and boy is he pissed! He cannot stand the thought of the Great Bwana to Africa and 100 Caucasian getting more attention than he deserves. Satan and his crafty web masters have created some coding that redirects people away from the Great Bwana Mzungu's articles and booklets. Oh, the humanity! How will the world ever recover?????

Greetings from the Five Cities region of California. 
We have had some reports of problems people have had when at the website. 
Essentially, false re-directs come up with various searches and some links. We are working on this and would appreciate your prayers. 
The Apostle Paul warned:

12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. (Ephesians 6:12) 
And we certainly seem to be seeing this with the interference we have run into. Paul further wrote:

13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. (Ephesians 6:13) 
So, again your prayers would be appreciated as we try to work through this.



Thursday, July 13, 2023

Prophet Joel Is Back And He Is Getting Angry That Everyone Ignores Him

Herbert Armstrong never imagined that he would dream up a church with more Old Testament prophets returning to join it in the last 30 years than has happened to the entire history of the Church of God movement. We have had Moses, Elisha, Elijah, Melchizedek, Malachi, Micah, Habakkuk, Jeremiah, Zechariah, Zephaniah, Amos, and many more. 

Interestingly enough,  NO ONE has EVER claimed to be a follower of Christ that is named in the New Testament. No Matthew, Mark, Luke, Peter, Paul, John, James, Agabus, Silas, Manahen, Philip, Barnabas, or Thomas has ever decided to return to give a powerful message to the church. The problem there is that if they did then they would have to talk about the New Covenant and Jesus and that is anathema to most COG self-appointed prophets and church leaders.

Today we have the distinct privilege of having Joel in our midst. Don't get too overly excited though, Joel is actually the Great Bwana to Africa and 100 Caucasians - the most important Church of God leader since the dawn of creation! As the foundations of the world were being laid out and even before the plans for Jesus being incarnate on the earth and dying on the cross, the Great Bwana Mzungu was already being planned to return in the perilous end times and live in Arroyo Grande and have the most astounding Church of God headquarters since the Temple was built in Jerusalem! Such an amazing dude!

As usual, though, the Great Bwana Mzungu Joel is NOT happy that Church of God members ignore him and the amazing things he has to say. Just like in days of old, modern-day Laodiceans look at Bob Joel and just laugh.

The Great Bwana Mzungu Joel goes on to quote Herbert Armstrong ( as if anything he has ever said is now sacred scripture) and then goes on to say this:

The Great Bwana Mzungu Joel is really ticked off at the Laodicean COG members who should be joining up with his group in these perilous end times as a show of unity. All COG groups should immediately dump their leaders and join up with the Great Bwana Mzungu Joel along with their checkbooks.

Here is something from Joel chapter 2:

12 “Now, therefore,” says the Lord, “Turn to Me with all your heart, With fasting, with weeping, and with mourning.” 13 So rend your heart, and not your garments; Return to the Lord your God, For He is gracious and merciful, Slow to anger, and of great kindness; And He relents from doing harm. 14 Who knows if He will turn and relent, And leave a blessing behind Him — A grain offering and a drink offering For the Lord your God? 
15 Blow the trumpet in Zion, Consecrate a fast, Call a sacred assembly; 16 Gather the people, Sanctify the congregation, Assemble the elders, Gather the children and nursing babes; Let the bridegroom go out from his chamber, And the bride from her dressing room. 17 Let the priests, who minister to the Lord, Weep between the porch and the altar; Let them say, “Spare Your people, O Lord, And do not give Your heritage to reproach, That the nations should rule over them. Why should they say among the peoples, ‘Where is their God?'” (Joel 2:12-18) 
Repentance is something that Joel proclaimed was needed and that is still the case today. Notice that he was saying that all, including the religious who felt that they were God’s people, needed to repent and gather together. That gathering together is something that the Philadelphians need to do in this end time–those who do not, risk being protected from the Day of the Lord, etc. (cf. Zephaniah 2:1-3).

You read that right. Unless you join up with the Great Bwana Mzungu Joel you will NOT get into Petra with him! This, may not be a bad thing because can you imagine 3 1/2 years in the desert with Bwana Bob Mzungu as your preacher! What a hot mess that would be!

The Great Bwana Mzungu aka modern Joel then quoted this about dreams.

Here is some more of what Joel wrote in chapter 2:

28 “And it shall come to pass afterward

That I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh;

Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,

Your old men shall dream dreams,

Your young men shall see visions.

29 And also on My menservants and on My maidservants

I will pour out My Spirit in those days.

30 “And I will show wonders in the heavens and in the earth:

Blood and fire and pillars of smoke.

31 The sun shall be turned into darkness,

And the moon into blood,

Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord. (Joel 2:28-31)

According to the Apostle Peter, there was a partial fulfillment of this (Acts 2:16) on the Day of Pentecost c. 31 A.D. (Acts 2:1).

But as verses such as verse 31 will not be fulfilled until after the start of the Great Tribulation, it is logical to conclude that God would still use dreams to sometimes convey parts of His message prior to the start of the Great Tribulation.

The Great Bwana searches high and low throughout the Bible for ANYTHING that he might remotely claim as validation for his apostasy from the Living Church of God and the setting up of his own lacking in a personality cult. The second he saw the words "dreams" his body shook in ecstasy! "That's it, by Jove! Dreams! I'll use dreams as proof of my right to start a new church to restore all the lost truth of the Bible and help usher in the end times, oh, and print hundreds and hundreds of booklets in hundreds of languages that people will only use as bird cage liners. But heck, at least I tried!"

The Great Bwana to Africa and 100 Caucasians then goes on to claim Herbert Armstrong mentioned the idea that The Great Bwana to Africa would arise in the end times. Herbert Armstrong would NEVER, NEVER have had ANYTHING to do with Bwana Bob Mzungu Thiel! No one thing, whatsoever!

The late Pastor General of the old Worldwide Church of God (WCG), Herbert W. Armstrong, basically said so in a 1981 sermon (scripture is from the KJV):

All right, now there’s another prophecy for the people … 
Joel 2:28-29 And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: (29) And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit. 
So there is a time coming when God will start pouring out His spirit on human beings. … Day of Pentecost, 3000 were baptized. Peter preached a sermon. They were pricked in their hearts. God began to draw them. God was now… Remember He said, “I will pour out of my spirit on all flesh.” All right, there’s a duality of that. (Armstrong HW. Building The Temple. Sermon, February 14, 1981) 
Herbert W. Armstrong was correct about the time coming when God would pour out His Spirit as well as the duality (see also Does the CCOG have the confirmed signs of Acts 2:17-18?). There was a duality to what Peter preached in Acts 2–and that duality is for our current time! 
Perhaps it should also be mentioned that the Personal Correspondence Department in the old WCG sent out a letter on dreams and stated the Bible showed that future dreams from God to His people were expected. It then had a date change added to it and here is a quote from that one:

Thank you for your question concerning visions or dreams. The Bible reveals that in times past servants of God were given visions and dreams for specific reasons and/or to convey special messages. …God has used this means of communication in the past and will do so again (Acts 2:17; Joel 2:28) (L052 Worldwide Church of God, 1989) 
As the WCG did not publicly acknowledge any such dreams after that letter was sent, the interpretation must be that God would later use dreams (it should be mentioned that the original date of L052 was prior to 1986–hence it was not a change by the Tkach Administration).

The Great Bwana to Africa and 100 Caucasian uses Herbert Armstrong again as PROOF he had to start a new church.

Consider also something that Herbert W. Armstrong wrote:

This very WORK OF GOD for our day is foretold in the prophecy of Revelation 3:7-13. But there it is revealed that we, today, are a people of but little strength – little power (verse 8)! – within ourselves though we have faithfully KEPT GOD’S WORD! The impact of this WORK OF GOD today is going out only through the power of God! Are you having your part in this very WORK OF GOD? But – let’s face it! – WE DO NOT HAVE WITHIN OURSELVES, AS GOD’S INSTRUMENTS FOR HIS WORK TODAY, ANYWHERE NEAR THE POWER OF GOD THAT ACTIVATED THAT ORIGINAL FIRST-CENTURY CHURCH! For that very reason, the living Christ says (verse 8), He has opened to us the gigantic door of MASS COMMUNICATION! The magnified power of the microphone and the printing press. Yet that is only physical, mechanical power! The REAL POWER that makes God’s Work vital and alive is the Holy Spirit of God! (Armstrong HW. Christians Have Lost Their POWER! Plain Truth, Jun 1958). 

Again, it should be pointed out that Herbert Armstrong would have disfellowshipped and marked Bob Thiel for his gross heresy and grievous sinful rebellion!

The Great Bwana to Africa and 100 Caucasians Joel then ends with this:

As it turns out, dreams had been given to several people who later became part of the Continuing Church of God which were essentially fulfilled. 
Yet, most people (including Christians) discount that, despite God inspiring Joel to write about it and the Apostle Peter to preach about it. 
Laodicean Christians think they are great judges, but sadly do not believe that God has been using dreams in this century. 
They do not seem willing to accept those prophecies God gave to Joel. Most do not know the biblical differences between true and false leaders or the signs that GOD says He uses. 
Parts of Joel’s message have been at least partially fulfilled and the fulfillment of other parts will come to pass.

True Christians have always been wisely taught to use thoughtful discernment when lying self-appointed prophets like Bob Thiel claim to be instruments of GOD. This is EXACTLY the reason that 99.98% of the Church of God movement REFUSED TO join up with Bob Thiel. They know him to be a liar and a deceiver of the brethren. 

Bwana Bob Thiel is NOT Joel or a prototype of Joel or any other prophet from Biblical tradition. That is a fact and cannot be refuted. He is no Elisha or Elijah. He is not even a good minister. Stay away! Far Away!