Dennis on Weinland: "Oh Ye Of Little Faith?"

Oh Ye Of Little Faith?

Last weekend I had the rare Saturday afternoon off from the spa where I work in therapeutic massage.  Januaries are like that.  So I tuned into Ron Weinland's sermon to hear what Witness One had to say.  Ron , as we know, is one of the very true Two Witnesses of Revelation 11 and Pastor Only of the Preparing for the Kingdom of God Church of God. 

I'm am writing this to those of you from Ron's congregation or who follow him as if he really was who he thinks he is....but is not.  

I would have hoped that most would have learned by now to question their minister when he claims to see himself written of and spoken of in the pages of the Bible.  I mean really, what's the chance?  I suppose believing such things goes back to when we got "Waterhoused" over who and what everyone from HWA to GTA to Joseph Tkach were in the pages of the Bible and the mind of God, but look back and see how well that went.  

If HWA brought the hearts of the father's to the children and the children to the father's," etc, I guess I don't see it.  If Joseph Tkach was a "Weaver" then all i got from that is that he used lousy material, mixed his fabrics and it all fell apart as a very inferior garment.  What i mean is that if you look at what was supposed to be what, it was not and still isn't.'  Personally, if I have to be under a Ron Weinland, Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry type in the Kingdom...well,  can I just have a log home in the mountains and be left alone?

Ron thinks that holding back your money over the next few months, "just in case," is a total lack of faith.  Those of you who do this, congratulations, it is a total exercise in common sense and proper care of yourself and your family.  Don't quit your day job as they say.  

Somehow, Ron had found out that some of his very own congregation were holding back on their offerings and funds that he would really like to get his hands on "just in case Jesus doesn't return " in May of this year. (2012)  I expect that a year or so from now, this article will seem prophetic, but I spare you.  Don't confuse prophecy for Common Sense.

He chided you for your lack of faith.  I think he must of said, "incredible" in there somewhere because that is what Ron always says when he simply can't understand why others do or don't do what he does or doesn't do.  

But we have to talk...

Please don't put all your hopes, dreams , faith and resources into Ron's opinion, and it is just an opinion, of what the immediate future holds for you. No God is going to chide you for your caution.  "Prove all things.." remember?

 I listened to Ron totally misuse the original context and meaning of the Book of Daniel to motivate you to see the error of your ways on this putting all your eggs into one basket thing.  Ron does not really know the historical context , setting of or even the actual time and peoples to whom the Book of Daniel was written, so of course he can't get it right to begin with.  But please, please, do your own homework and draw your own conclusions.  

Anyone can be a Bible reader.  When you read the Bible like a newspaper, which you should not do, you can come up with all sorts of hope that "time is short," "the day is far spent," or it is time to reveal things "which must shortly come to pass."  Ron never notices that ALL those verses were addressed to people 2000 years ago who just knew the end of the age was upon them and Jesus would soon return.   From our perspective, we now know that they were wrong.  How badly it hurt them, their families and resources we don't know.  The Bible never really tells us the rest of those kinds of stories.  I always wish Paul had not just told us what a loser he was ("The things that I should not do I do and the things I should do I don't," but what exactly he did or did not do that made him such.  But alas, I know the trick.  I'm a bad person, I do bad things but don't ask for specifics.  We'd probably all feel better if Paul had told us specifically how he was just like us.

 Ron, like most, read the New Testament as if it was written yesterday to all of you today, but that would be wrong wouldn't it?  Ministers get around that by fooling you about the idea of "types."  Remember when Ron was wrong about a date or event awhile back that you all had been earnestly looking for and when he had to finally speak up about his failure, HE BLAMED YOU!   I remember him saying something to the effect that "You people took it all wrong.  I didn't mean it was physical, I meant it was spiiiiiiritual.....incredible."   Evidently most of you bought it as you are still there waiting for the next shoe to drop. 

I prophecy ahead of time you will hear, "God is giving us more time," or "Who knew God had even MORE to reveal to me!   I never know until we get to that time where God talks to me and tells me more!!!"   Of course, Ron is full of bullshit on this, but it's a great technique and keeps you in your seats doesn't it...

I don't question (maybe one should) Ron's sincerity, perspectives, motives or way he filters his world both Biblical and currently, but I do question his common sense and wisdom.  Do you?  You do realize that every prediction about the imminent return of Jesus, every date set, every expectation expressed, sermon given, shortly, soon and almost ever expressed on this topic over the past 2000 years has been 100% wrong 100% of the time don't you?  What's the chance a real Deity is talking to Ron and will get it right this time.

I will spare you from the entire argument that Jesus is not coming back at all and all of the Bible including the New Testament is past history but that is terribly hard for us all, me included to accept.  Even in the New Testament after the Apostle Paul had told the married to be as they weren't and those that were not married to forget about dating and marriage at that point, (hmmm, sounds familiar?), we find Paul was dead wrong. 


Real people listened to Paul, adjusted their lives accordingly and ended up with nothing to show for it but less funds and broken relationships.  Of course, Paul never said, "I apologize,"  "I meant well,"  "I thought that voice in my head and light in my eyes that spoke to me was real but I guess not,'" or anything like that.  He turned on the church and accused them of being "scoffers who asked where was this coming of Jesus we keep hearing about."  Please stop and realize that to Paul these people of common sense were scoffers, but in fact, they were right.  Time was not proving to be short nor was the day shown to be far spent.  Life went on, Paul said basically, "oh well, I fought a great fight. It was fun while it lasted.  I kept the faith.  I came up with and I know there is laid up for ME a crown of righteous which I guess you get too maybe someday...gotta go."

I know you will have a hard time with this, but from all we can see and read in the New Testament,  the Apostle Paul, Peter, James, John, all the Elders, all the opening prayer givers, all the closing prayer givers, Deacons , Deaconesses, False prophets and false apostles and yes....even Jesus as presented to us in the Gospels was wrong about the arrival of that Kingdom and just how soon it would be upon them.  "We shall not all sleep but we shall be changed, " for them and every prophecy haunted minister and church since has turned into "We shall all sleep...deal with it."

I am speaking to you with a sincere heart.  I suppose in some way, I am ministering to you in a really weird way from what you have always thought of what ministers do.  Actually I am no longer a minister but go with me on this concept.  :)  

PLEASE DO NOT LET RON WEINLAND CHIDE YOU FOR YOUR LACK OF FAITH IN HIS OPINIONS

PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THE WAY HE SEES AND FILTERS THE BIBLE THROUGH HIS BRAIN IS HIS OPINION

PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT IF YOU ARE TO 'PROVE ALL THINGS' THEN YOU HAVE NO PROOF THAT RON IS IN TOUCH WITH GOD NOR GOD WITH HIM IN ANY REAL WAY THAT CAN BE PROVEN

PLEASE REALIZE THAT ANY REAL GOD IS NOT OUT TO TRICK OR DECEIVE YOU AND THAT THESE THEOLOGICAL DISASTERS IN THE MAKING IS MERELY DUE TO THE LACK OF WISDOM AND COMMON SENSE OF YOUR PASTOR

PLEASE GIVE IF YOU MUST.  IF THAT IS WHERE YOUR TREASURE IS THEN LET YOUR HEART FOLLOW, BUT PLEASE USE YOUR OWN COMMON SENSE AND PROVIDE FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR OWN "JUST IN CASE."  JUST IN CASE IS NOT A SIN.  IT IS BEING RESPONSIBLE.  YOU KNOW...'IF A MAN PROVIDES NOT FOR HIS OWN HOUSEHOLD HE IS LESS THAN AN INFIDEL.." OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

LEARN TO SAY DIRECTLY TO MR. WEINLAND, SHOULD THE NEED ARISE, "PLEASE MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS ON HOW I PERCEIVE MY FAMILY RESPONSIBILITIES SHOULD THIS REALLY BE THE END OF THE AGE OR REALLY NOT."

PLEASE FIND A WAY TO DISCONNECT THE RING IN YOUR NOSE THAT RON HAS THE LEAD FIRMLY ATTACHED TO.  FOLLOW IF YOU MUST BUT FOLLOW ON YOUR OWN TERMS.  RON CAN NEVER PROVE TO YOU THAT HIS WAYS ALONE ARE GOD'S WAYS OR THAT YOUR CAUTION IS UNBIBLICAL OR A TOTAL LACK OF FAITH.  REMEMBER, RON IS ACTUALLY ASKING YOU TO HAVE FAITH IN HIM WHILE HE MAKES IT SOUND LIKE YOU ARE DENYING YOUR FAITH IN GOD.  APPLES AND ORANGES...

Well, I think you get the point.  I promise that if the real Jesus really really returns on Pentecost of this year and you really really are the only true church and Ron was truly truly God's faithful witness of two, I will write a humble letter off apology and recognition of this as being so.  I'll renounce my own insights over the years and sit quietly in church and never never want to be a deacon, elder or minister ever I promise.  I'll just give what I have not got, or should not give and call it even.

Well, I guess this is the Forrest Gump moment.   And that's all I want to say about that.....

 
Dennis C. Diehl
DenniscDiehl@aol.com

The Church of God Wikipedia Propaganda Machine

Silenced has a call to action in regards to the mountains of erroneous material that fills up many Wikipedia entries that pertain to the hundreds of Churches of God and Armstrongism.  Many have fairly accurate information in them, while others look like they have been written by the PR officers of the various splinter cults.  The biggest offenders are (which should not be a huge shock):

Radio Church of God/Worldwide Church of God


United Church of God




Philadelphia Church of God


Living Church of God


Terry Ratzmann


Roderick C. Meredith
Silenced writes:: Wow. Just…wow. Did he write this himself?


This includes one that is missing and SHOULD be written: Ron Weinland

Armstrongism has always done a white wash on its self over the decades.  In its eyes it has done no wrong, committed no evil, and has been the most glorious resurrection of the True Church in 1,900 years. The truth is, in many cases, that the Church of God has blatantly lied about it's history.  It has attempted to cover up murders, suicides, huge legal challenges, rapes, wife swapping, child molestations, stalkings,  embezzlement and more.  If you can name an evil present in the world it most likely can be found existing in Armstrongism.  One person some years ago even accused he Church of genocide with is vile medical prohibitions.  How many thousands have died over the decades because of church leaders deliberately banning medical intervention? 

It's time these liars be held accountable on Wikipedia!

So if any of you want to join the Wiki Truth Squad contact Silenced for more information

Happy 26th!

Dennis On: ""For God So Loved the World...." A very sincere question to consider

"For God So Loved the World...."

A very sincere question to consider

I would like to seriously and sincerely reopen a question I have had for years about the teaching that God gave his only son, Jesus, as a sacrifice for us.  I believe this audience would be able to draw on scores of scriptures to this effect so I will not reproduce them here.  

What I would like to ask, and sincerely so, is "In what way is Jesus death a real death and in what way did God give his son?"

I know our initial reaction is "on the cross" or "he turned his back on Jesus and abandoned him at death," or "Jesus gave his life for us..."  etc.  But in what way? From my perspective, it was not in anyway I can identify with as a human and the "loss" God suffered is not like any loss I have seen in the faces of parents who lost real children in death.

My personal problem with the concept is that from all accounts, well most, Jesus knew he would die but also that he would return better than ever in a mere three days and not in the flesh, but back at the right hand of God.  In what way is that a sacrifice?  Every sacrifice that died in the entire Bible stayed dead.  Jesus merely appears as a sacrifice but in a way that is not really like all the so called '"types."  Jesus death was not like human death.  It was almost like a play that has a really good ending once we get to the end.  It seems more like going through the motions but not really the emotions.

Now granted, it is no fun to die at a young age, but hundreds of thousands and millions have done it before and since Jesus.  But they are all dead and gone.  I can't imagine any grief lasting long if the families and friends of those who have died would have had to wait a mere three days to get them back better than ever. I can't even imagine any of those who died being all that upset if the knew, as Jesus and God evidently did that they would be back shortly better than ever.  That's not dying.  That's stepping out for a bit and coming right back.  That is not what humans call death nor parents who have lost a child, a tragedy that eats their soul up for the rest of their lives. 

God the Father knew, evidently, what his plan was and could bring his "only begotten son that he gave  back quickly.  I can't do that.  No parent of any children I have buried can do that .  How can this be said to be the most amazing parental sacrifice in the history of the world?  I can see if  the figure of Jesus STAYED DEAD and was not himself ever to be part of the coming Kingdom.  Now that would be a sacrifice on the part of both Jesus and God the Father.  But this mere "weekend inconvenience," seems to fall far short of that?  I ask sincerely for an answer.

In what way would God have agonized over Jesus death if it was merely a short weekend event from which God would easily recover the life of his son?

In what way is this the most amazing sacrifice of all time?  (Thousands of humans have been crucified, skinned alive , boiled alive and burned to death which would seem far more hideous than any six hour death on a cross.)  I have my doubts about Jesus being "marred above any other," as well but will leave that for another time. Death on the cross is generally a days long event where no burial is afforded the criminal and the body is left to fall off the cross to be eaten by dogs.  Jesus had the burial of a King with little of the humiliation that would normally accompany such events.  I'm sure many would have said in his day that "Jesus got off easy. He died really quickly."  

I have recalled how this question came to me when a client told me she lost her only child in an accident.  After telling me how little help her church had been trying to encourage her with, "God won't give you more than you can bare," "at least you have other children," (She didn't) or "At least you will see her again in heaven," the Pastor himself made the mistake of his theological career.  He told her that "well, God lost his only child too."  

"Uh oh.." I remember thinking.  He sure stepped into that.  I asked what she said and she assured me that she screamed "NO!" at the minister and then said,  "Jesus seems to have known he would die and come back in three days. God knew He was going to resurrect him in a mere three days better than ever.  My daughter is still dead!  A real sacrifice should stay dead.  Jesus death was merely a weekend inconvenience for both Jesus and His Father."

Ugh....I just listened and thought that she , in her grief and clarity, had hit on something so deeply disturbing to me that I later wrote about it.  I asked what the minister said and she said he just looked at her and said NOTHING.  Probably the best think he could have done under the circumstances.

It is a sincere observation and it has raised a deeply troubling but sincere question in myself since then.  

So in sincerity I ask,  In what way did God so love the world that he gave his only begotten son....?  How was it the most amazing sacrifice of all time?  Should not a real sacrifice stay dead?  And why would Jesus actual death which quickly was remedied by a better than ever resurrection be considered some kind of substitution for ours?

I simply have no answer for this observation and if I were still a minister and this was thrown in my face while someone was grieving the real loss of a child, would have nothing to say but,  "that's a good question.  I don't know."

 
Dennis C. Diehl
DenniscDiehl@aol.com