Thursday, January 21, 2016

More Books by COG Members (updated)



What does a hot young ad agent do when he loses everything in the 1929 Stock Market Crash? He heads for California and starts a money-machine religious cult, leaving a trail of dead bodies and ruined lives in his wake.

His tragic fall in the late '80s marked the end of a kind of cult experience America rarely sees - or does it? Kids, read and heed before you're tempted to leave home, drink Kool-Aid, die in a hail of bullets, or give up your college money to a conservative, unaccredited institution....

Jumping Off Bridges by Carole Ritter




The Firescalds Road to the Sky will take you on a journey with a family. You will live with them on an old farm in the high mountains of the Appalachians. You will relocate with them to the flatlands of the eastern shores. You will see good times and bad revealed through the eyes of a growing youngster. Life experiences steadily send his thinking back to the Firescalds and all he learned there. They are there like a road map, helping him to turn away from the wrong choices, which become available.

The Firescalds Road to the Sky by Cleveland Jones



This triune aspect of salvationrescue, roots, and conscious co-creationis foundational to wholeness, building a satisfying life and to feeling like were doing what we were born to do.




One of the author's greatest revelations of God's grace came from accepting and experiencing God s love and goodwill in a tangible way. This led to her making a decision 25 years ago to practice spiritual love. For those who have despaired and wondered if they would ever see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living as did the Psalmist of the Old Testament, "Taste the Grace" is for them. Those who have been tutored to accept the negative aspects of life, have little faith in goodness and love as it pertains to them, and have been groomed to expect more suffering can resist or sabotage heaven when it shows up for them. This book shows how anyone can taste and see that the Lord is good, as promised in the Scripture, and that the good life is there for the taking and the sharing. It is the understanding of God's grace that empowers us to experience more of the goodness of life that includes love, healing, abundance and fulfillment of purpose while on earth. To "Taste the Grace" is to take it in as nourishment. It feeds us spiritually, increases our faith and helps us rearrange and update our belief systems to make room for the good we seek. It brings heaven to earth, and God s love into our lives. This experience enriches us on every level and gives us the confidence to reach for our dreams. Grounded in this grace, we are sourced by lasting and unconditional love. Living from grace is living in love and this is what empowers us to feel good, do good and make good.

by Barbara Patton Unger




In Gems of a Lifetime, Barbara Patton Unger shares 'gems' of light that she has mined in her life. Her metaphor of Gemstones for these illuminations points to a glorious and loving God.She focuses on the precious jewels of light discovered from growing up in her hometown of Joplin, Missouri and gives voice to Oracles of Wisdom gained through, and sometimes in spite of, religious affiliation. She then honors the greatest light of all - the essence of the divine within us. She shows God's goodness IS 'OUR' glory; and these "gemstones" point us to our own days of Heaven on Earth. Awakened to the truth of our "spiritual DNA," she presents her treasures to help others recognize how, even in the midst of sorrows, God can enrich their lives if they look for, value and mine their own sparkling gems.

Gems of a Lifetime by Barbara Patton Unger



The 1993 government assault on the Branch Davidian compound near Waco, Texas, resulted in the deaths of four federal agents and eighty Branch Davidians, including seventeen children. Whether these tragic deaths could have been avoided is still debatable, but what seems clear is that the events in Texas have broad implications for religious freedom in America.

James Tabor and Eugene Gallagher's bold examination of the Waco story offers the first balanced account of the siege. They try to understand what really happened in Waco: What brought the Branch Davidians to Mount Carmel? Why did the government attack? How did the media affect events? The authors address the accusations of illegal weapons possession, strange sexual practices, and child abuse that were made against David Koresh and his followers. Without attempting to excuse such actions, they point out that the public has not heard the complete story and that many media reports were distorted.

The authors have carefully studied the Davidian movement, analyzing the theology and biblical interpretation that were so central to the group's functioning. They also consider how two decades of intense activity against so-called cults have influenced public perceptions of unorthodox religions.

In exploring our fear of unconventional religious groups and how such fear curtails our ability to tolerate religious differences, Why Waco? is an unsettling wake-up call. Using the events at Mount Carmel as a cautionary tale, the authors challenge all Americans, including government officials and media representatives, to closely examine our national commitment to religious freedom.

Why Waco? by James Tabor and Eugene Gallagher



This fascinating examination of the earliest years of Christianity reveals how the man we call St. Paul shaped Christianity as we know it today. 

Historians know almost nothing about the two decades following the crucifixion of Jesus, when his followers regrouped and began to spread his message. During this time Paul joined the movement and began to preach to the gentiles. Using the oldest Christian documents that we have—the letters of Paul—as well as other early Chris­tian sources, historian and scholar James Tabor reconstructs the origins of Christianity. Tabor shows how Paul separated himself from Peter and James to introduce his own version of Christianity, which would continue to develop independently of the message that Jesus, James, and Peter preached. 

Paul and Jesus illuminates the fascinating period of history when Christianity was born out of Judaism.

Paul and Jesus by James Tabor



iSly is not just a compelling science fiction story; it wrestles with major issues of human survival. A resurgent Joseph Dane is on the case, with Bluegrass, his colorful sidekick, and TatarKhan, Hypernet Master. They must find the obscure origins of an epic, android shift, before disaster ensues. An android demographic has been built into society, giving humanity a desperately needed survival path: eSly androids working to save humans from the gridlock of financial meltdown, and huge enviro-disasters. But now it's all gone wrong—iSly, a superior line of androids, shifts out from eSly, starts to self-replicate, and plies a new, sinister path. The iSly 'droids start taking over. World leaders are horrified.  
Stanley Gerson is out of the starting blocks with iSly, a story set in the urban, grandeur, risen from a new, techtonic geography in Coos Bay, Oregon. 

iSly by Stanley Gerson




A perplexing aspect of early Christianity is the rapid and widespread abandonment of the practice of rest on the seventh day Sabbath, as practiced in the Jewish matrix of the Christian movement, even though the seven-day week was retained for time-keeping purposes. It is beyond dispute that this occurred, but there is no unanimity on the question of how and why. There is no passage in the sources to which we can turn to find an explicit answer to the question. This book proposes to explore the reasons for this radical shift in the worship practice of early Christians.

   The author uses the classic tools of the historical-critical method, supplemented by newer approaches such as narratology, for a thorough exegetical examination of the relevant passages, not only in the New Testament, but also from other Christian writings of the time (Barnabas, Thomas). The investigation demonstrates that previous models to explain the rapid disappearance of the Sabbath as a Christian worship practice have been inadequate. In their place, a more nuanced, polycausal model is proposed. This sheds light on the question of unity and diversity in the early Christian movement as it began its development from a sect within second temple Judaism to a faith community with its own identity.

Encountering the Rest From God: How Jesus Came to Personify the Sabbath
by Henry Sturcke



Designed to provide readers with a framework for exploring financial markets, this book describes the basic rules of the game in three of the major international financial markets - foreign exchange, Eurocurrencies and international bonds - and aims to convey an intuitive feel for market dynamics. The book blends theory and institutional accounts, considers the interbank market in foreign exchange and explains how to hedge with FX forwards, futures, and options. A new chapter explores aspects of the European Monetary System in two separate discussions: historical background and general features; and the technical details of the Exchange Rate Mechanism.




Songs and Stories Together connects songs to stories and classical music through activities especially crafted for children ages 3--6. This book will delight and charm your students with engaging music and art activities that build skills through singing, moving, listening, and playing classroom instruments. With reproducible pages included, the lessons are designed for all levels of teaching experience. Teachers who have a modest music background can easily teach most of the activities, and each lesson features an ensemble or extended activity meant to be taught by experienced music teachers. Songs and Stories Together is a winning combination!

Songs and Stories Together by Sally Guerrero



FOR THE FIRST TIME IN PUBLISHING HISTORY... Reversing 160 years of falsehood - sharing the true spirit of quantum science from Albert Einstein and Max Planck both, this book goes where no one has gone before, - showing not everyone even agreed with Darwin - especially not the most revered and famous science minds of our time... Event Horizon Publishing llc offers you a surprise here in Darwin’s evolutionary theory, that few realize. Did you know there are two sides on Darwin, even in the scientific world? The most famous and admired scientists over a century have criticized the theory in its non-scientific assertions. They share not from emotion or metaphysics but in science as it should be. Darwin’s Natural Selection idea is very poor. It’s factually porous. With the scientific analysis of the 21st century we see it’s based in mere assumptions. Then we realize it was contrived 100 years before DNA was discovered. DNA changed everything. Anymore, it’s not just the differences in atheist or deist views on evolution, it’s the world of science itself. It’s most recent facts take it apart brick by brick. Darwin’s idea has collapsed - not to stand again. It’s now irrefutable from Darwin’s own Fatal Admission, in his own words we will see it. Read now from Event Horizon Publishing what schools do not want you to read. Those professors in evolution class won’t be able to answer the questions and challenges from the students because they’re coming from science-awareness not mere agendas. Many in science gave immense consideration to analyzing Darwin’s ill-fated postulate. Reading this book we now understand not only the true logic of science’s reasoning in dissolving his theory, but we see an underlying agenda that Darwin had in imagining it. Darwin’s atheism is well known prior to his theory’s arrival; so to have a person with atheistic agendas creating a contrived scenario of Something coming from Nothing is not only self-serving of his views, but means he attempted to make science fit his belief-system. The scientific panorama here is eloquently shared in true simplicity. Based in Reason, in meaningful truth-seeking, it uplifts human feelings toward the exquisite. Elevating realities in Einstein’s quantum- world of light reveal our true-ground of being, liberating us from Darwin’s emptiness. Ask your self who would you believe, Darwin or Einstein? The new physics of life in cosmic consciousness herein, even warms our heart in daily living. Absorbing the meta-Physics of true knowing, shining here right now, we Smile in knowing, science and meta-Physics are not mutually exclusive of the other. Now you can enjoy that longed-for completion, in personal spaces of serene esteem... in this wondrous living universe that we all call home - one that truly inspires us into Awe, if we allow it.


Darwin's Fatal Admission by Lachlen Paul French




Event Horizon Publishing llc, brings you a discovery that occurred in 1945 at the end of World War II, of which most of us have never heard. Imagine our belief-system being turned upside down. Many believe we’ve been told a true version of history the last 2000 years. Have we really? The Gospel According to Thomas (also known as the Thomas Gospel and the Gospel of Thomas), the first new biblical book in 20 centuries, was found in desert sand, in 1945. It was so shocking and amazing Hollywood made several films based on it. Yet 95% of us still do not know of it. The Gospel According to Thomas, from Christ’s brother, was found in the desert in the proverbial Earthenware Jar - and it revealed 46 Christian scrolls from 2000 years earlier, that the Roman editors left out of their version of the Bible, 400 years later, in 381 AD. This brought up scandalous questions of political intrigue. Aspersions were cast upon this scroll almost instantly by church officials, even before studying it (not very scholarly). When first reading this gospel from Christ’s brother, Thomas (in carbon-dated scrolls like the earliest New Testament), it’s amazing how similar the quotes are to Christ’s quotes in the Bible, in subtle mysterious beautiful ways. Many quotes are essentially identical; and some exquisitely, slightly different, bring new meaning – all are fascinating. They’re so similar to scripture, some experts say Thomas may be the long lost “Q” or the Source document from which Matthew, Mark and Luke arose. It’s believed the scroll was much larger back then. (The Bedouin who found it said several scrolls were burned for kindling.) It is even said Jesus may have helped create it. In reading it, it sounds like what Christ might teach around a campfire. There’s a brevity to its 114 verses. With great care and love, it comes out to you now. Its translation took nine years to complete. It truly engages our modern hearts. This gospel now enjoys current clarity for us, and spiritual continuity for our world. Its message is relevant to people of our day with our frame of reference. Enjoy its present-moment Form, its spiritual Context, along with its beautifully mystical Contents. You can read the original form of Thomas’ Scroll right here as well. Enjoy now Christ’s deepest and his most private teaching to his disciples. Prepare to be astounded.

The Gospel of Thomas: Christ's Recorded Sayings of Mastery

33 comments:

Anonymous said...

I would never read a book like Paul and Jesus by James Tabor. I have Gods inspired word the bible, and my own eyes and mind to evaluate the world. I do not need a seeing eye dog telling me how to view the world, especially a Protestant (or similar) with their Kenneth Copeland mush.

Anonymous said...

Are for real????? The entire point of theology is exploring and examining the Bible and traditions. Thats the entire point of books. They are designed to expand your thinking and broaden your world. You don't have to agree with everything, but at least use your brain instead of relying on theological idiots like Meredith, Pack, Flurry and Armstrong telling you what you MUST believe. The great thing about Judaism is that it encourages debate and discussion on everything relating to God and belief. How else is a person to grow in knowledge? You surely will NOT get it from COG booklets written by theological morons.

Tabor is as far from Ken Copland "mush" that you can get. What an ignorant statement!

Connie Schmidt said...

I think the book "The Missing Dimension In Sex" should be made into a movie.

Byker Bob said...

4:20, are you from WCG and/or the splinters? If so, you arrived at your Bible view and world view through a seeing eye dog named Armstrong, who read interpretive books like "The Two Babylons", "Judah's Sceptre and Joseph's Birthright", "Ages in Chaos", and the publications of G G Rupert, and concocted his own mush which you were compelled to accept because he convinced you that only someone who taught the sabbath, holy days, clean meats, tithing, BI, the end times, and called themselves the Church of God could be relied upon as being used of God in your spiritual guidance.

All of which was fine, until 1975 made a liar of him, 1995 when his empire was seemingly spewed from the mouth of God, and the early 2,000s when the human genome was mapped and British Israelism was proven to be false. The things which we once thought we knew then were found to be in need of a rethink. Perhaps you are a tad late in getting the news?

BB

Anonymous said...

6:05 PM A person cannot grow in knowledge by listening to people cut from the same cloth. You end up deceived. Protestant books (I have read by the late Robert Schuller) as well as "COG booklets written by theological morons," all sing the same song. They all give a edited Pharisaic world view. The effect is of imprisoning peoples minds. Someone recently here condemned "selfish ambition." No one challenged this ridiculous accusation. Ambition is good. 'Selfishness' in the sense of self interest is good. It is demanded by the parable of the talents. It is the core of life itself . Yet near everyone here is deceived, agreeing with the altruistic, sacrificial claptrap. People such as David Pack ruthlessly exploits this. King David asks God for ruin upon his enemies. When do the Protestants teach this? Do you know that it is a sin not to hate, when warranted? The emperor in Star Wars was correct when he stated "hatred makes you strong.' No protestant or similar will tell you that. If you want to expand your mind, try reading 'Honoring the self' by Nathaniel Branden for instance. Self love is a taboo topic by all your religious friends. When it comes to religion, all these books essentially lie by leaving out information, and by over emphasis. Reading the bible, without distraction by others point of view, is the wisest policy.

Anonymous said...

Christ praised the person who had the greatest selfish ambition, and turned his one talent into ten. Society would stagnate if people did not want more, lots, lots more. People who complain about selfish ambition should be tared and feathered and run out of town. And that's after being flogged first. Oh yes, only the big people in the churches are entitled (secretly) to ambition.

Anonymous said...

When people are young, everyone is forced into the situation of seeing the world through others eyes, be it the parents, society, or Armstrong etc. This is unavoidable, since 'proving all things' is a lifelong process, and in the meanwhile, people need a map of reality to live by. I am no fan of Armstrong. His 1975 prediction caused enormous damage to many church members lives. Some people told me that they lost the will to live around those years. The reason for the 1975 prediction was to try to manipulate/coerce God into bringing down the curtain on human history at that time. The reason he did this was to try to cover up the fact that communism was failing. Armstrong morally was a communist, eg his "give way" and the 'Mao Zedong' dark blue suits that all men were required to wear around this time. Plus hiding trade as well. He was a closet communist. He officially condemned communism, but that was condemning a certain ruling communist gang, rather than the ideology. What Armstrong tried to do is reprehensible, in trying to use God as a tool to destroy billions for the sake of protecting the commie false God. No doubt, people will ask how I know this? Simple, God confirmed my suspicions and prayer requests on this issue, by putting thoughts into my mind. This is something I experienced thousands of times since getting baptized. A Christian is one who follows Christ, not a man or physical church. The holy Spirit has also confirmed the truth about the coming tribulation as well. Sorry, it's going to happen. If a person lives by the ten commandments, tries to grow as a person, and grows by supporting the work, God will answer that persons prayers. This is where the atheists intellectualizing falls down.

Byker Bob said...

8:53, you may want to read the Wikipedia article on dating creation, paying particular attention to the section pertinent to the Jewish school of thought. There have been so many theories on this over the millennia, that you would nearly have to pick one, making your best, most educated guess. Some people have had firm dates in mind, but these are based not on factual information, but on people trusting that the one determing their favorite date is or was a prophet or apostle. As an example, back in the '60s, we used "Mr. Armstrong says...." as being irrefutable proof. You see where I am going with this? Come 1972, no trib. Come 1975, Jesus didn't keep the personal appearance tour that HWA had booked for him. He was a no show.

Also, although there is definitely a 6-1 rhythm pattern throughout the Torah, if this were also God's plan for man's dominion and the birth of a Godly millennium, most certainly Jesus would have known not only the correct date for creation, but also the date of His own return. Yet, scripture records Him as clearly stating not only that He did not know this, but also that no man could know it. So, the time of the end, marked by tribulation cannot possibly be based on mathematic formulae.

Last, but not least, the date of creation used by Rabbi Hillel II, father of the Hebrew fixed calendar, would seem to indicate that we have about 225 years to go until absolute year 6,000. By that time, even if British Israelism had been true, there probably aren't going to be a heck of a lot of pure Anglo Saxons left around. Based on current dating and marriage trends, we know that the old taboos against interracial marriage have almost completely fallen. Everybody is going to be in everybody else's wood pile by that point in time. Heck, they pretty much are right now.

That's got to be pretty frustrating if you hold old school Armstrongist points of view, isn't it? Yet, those things constitute the bullwhip by which your "servant leaders" attempt to continue to abuse and control you.

BB

Anonymous said...

I read one of James Tabor's books before I knew he had anything to do with WCG. He definitely has departed from those old beliefs. Somewhere in the book I noticed a few tip offs which reminded me of WCG, but more in flavor than doctrine. Now I remember it was The Jesus Dynasty. I am an agnostic, and I found it very interesting. Generally I avoid religious books.
It was an historical account and he presented several scenarios, it wasn't like he said what the truth was. I got the impression he was closer to Judaism than what we call Christianity. He was actually a professor of theology at the University of Northern Carolina I believe. So it was a good read....intend to try another of his books.

Anonymous said...

hey anonymous 8:53, HWA was not a communist, he was more of a fascist if anything. Obviously you didn't know him, I don't think anyone who was close to him thought he had communist leanings. If anything the whole church was right wing in their political views........... If they had voted it would have been republican.

Anonymous said...

11.37. Armstrong 'give way' is primarily referring to goods and services, hence left wing. The tyrannical ministers makes the church right wing. So the church was both left and right wing. Keep in mind that left-right wing follows the body mind dichotomy, a false dichotomy at that. He didn't have commie leanings? Ask people what the church was like in the 1960s. Ambassador college was run like a prison. The church members did all activities together. The men had neo military haircuts and personality less clothes, no individuality allowed. Informally, the ministers had the right to lord it over church members faith and life. This is collectivism, through and through. Again I remind you that he rejected trade. He betrayed his training in capitalist advertising and embarrassed collectivism. His fruits prove this. Since these attitudes are similar to working class traits, many church members don't notice, or they privately agree, His give way is passing the physical goods around, the 'outgoing concern,' which is earned in the real world, is passing around emotional wealth. Collectivism, collectivism, collectivism.

Anonymous said...

11.37. Armstrong stated that 'governments is everything.' He said this over and over. Judging him by his fruits, this meant tyranny . David Pack in one of his booklets (probably removed by now) reprinted a ministerial letter from Armstrong telling ministers that they can be 'kings on thrones' here and now. I clearly remember the 'kings on thrones' statement. I probably have it on one of my old drives. He was instructing ministers to treat members lives as their own. This is beyond communism which was a economic social system. He embraced any and all tyrannical systems. This is cold blooded murder. All his other sins are petty compared to this. Many church members to this day, do not comprehend freedom and self responsibility. All they know is idiot-4child' living.

Anonymous said...

BB. You are assuming a precise 6000 years to the day or hour plan. I don't see this in the bible, or see the need for this. Why should God deny Himself any flexibility in his master plan. There are many books on timing on the market. They point out that there is not one, but a multitude of mathematical patterns that events can conform to. Some being more probable than others. Or expressing the same thing slightly differently, societies develop in waves, and these waving are mathematically related, hence timing. But, but, these waves can be extended, or truncated, resulting in a change in the mathematical outcome and hence timing. Timing influences human behaviour, but ultimately, people are free moral agents, making their own choices. Hence their are a multitude of timing possibilities rather than the 'correct' one.

Connie Schmidt said...

In trying to put an economic term on the WCG and other one man dominated splinters, likely NAZI fills the bill. There is centralized economic control of the organization (like Communism) , but also a militaristic expanisionistic streak as well. The Nazis had their own dress codes, idealized body types, hair and eye colors etc. Nazism is a form of state socialism.

Nazism and Communism fixate on hierarchies. The racial superiority of the Aryan race is central to Nazism. Built on a foundation of pseudo-science and biological determinism that places Jews, blacks, and other minorities in very low regard, Nazism divides human society along strict religious, ethnic, and racial lines. Communism focuses on economic hierarchy – more specifically the stratification of classes. There are the “haves” and “have-nots,” and Communism seeks to empower the latter to revolt against the former. Each belief system enforces a regimented set of rules for “acceptable” political behavior – painting a very bleak “black-and-white” world with very little wiggle room for divergent political thought.

http://www.differencebetween.net/miscellaneous/difference-between-communism-and-nazism/#ixzz3xzp0XDD0

Anonymous said...

"I would never read a book like Paul and Jesus by James Tabor...I do not need a seeing eye dog telling me how to view the world, especially a Protestant (or similar) with their Kenneth Copeland mush."

TRANSLATION: I prefer ignorance and stagnation. The impoverished set of thoughts, ideas, and points of view I already have are good enough for my narrow little mind.

"I have Gods inspired word the bible, and my own eyes and mind to evaluate the world."

TRANSLATION: I am a good mind reader. I can even read the minds of incorporeal, transdimensional beings that no one can even prove exists. Because I'm such a good mindreader, whenever I read a book, I always know exactly what the author was trying to communicate, even if that author is a god. I may not be omniscient, but I'm the next best thing. You can kneel before me now and kiss my feet. I know you want to.

Byker Bob said...

I'm not assuming anything. In fact, because the timekeepers in the creation narrative don't appear until later in the creation, I believe that relativity dictates that we aren't even talking about literal 24 hour days there.

However, since the poster I responded to seems to be programmed in the Armstrong mode, I addressed the falacies inherent in attempting to mathematically compute the so-called 6,000 years for man. It can't be
done, unless you think that an angry old man flapping his hog jowls and calling himself an apostle constitutes "proof".

BB

Anonymous said...

9.53 AM. You come up with 'translations,' yet claim that I am the mind reader. Really?

Anonymous said...

BB. I made no reference to a 'old man flapping his hog jowls.' Please, no straw man arguments. My post explains why no one can pick dates with certainty, nothing more. I gave the scientific explanation for this, which you ignored. So, everyone who disagrees with you is 'programmed in the Armstrong mode.' Hmmm.

Anonymous said...

Connie, Russian communism differed from Nazi socialism because Russia was economically self sufficient, but Germany was not. Germany had to import raw materials and food. In exchange, it exported manufactured goods. Hence Germany had to tolerate 'capitalism' in its import/export sector. Or more precisely, fascism, with the government lording it over these 'capitalists.' But both Russia and Germany were collectivists with the differences in personality that you mentioned.

Retired Prof said...

Anonymous January 21, 2016 at 7:59 PM said, "Reading the bible, without distraction by others point of view, is the wisest policy."

Absolutely right. Such a reader comes to a satisfying conclusion, automatically. It may take a while, and the conclusion might not satisfy anyone else, but then there is no reason it should. The pride of accomplishment in constructing one's personal knowledge structure is deeply gratifying. I am here to attest that finally reaching my own conclusions about the Bible smoothed out the inner turmoil that stemmed from trying to come to terms with what somebody else told me I ought to think and do.

And the best part is that, since I am acting as my own minister, I pay tithes to myself. Every month I (the congregation) deposit 10 percent of my income into my (the minister's) hunting and fishing account. Neither the congregation nor the minister has ever complained about this redistribution of wealth, because the minister's lessons are so closely attuned to the congregation's needs that they are well worth the cost.

Anonymous said...

"9.53 AM. You come up with 'translations,' yet claim that I am the mind reader. Really?"

Are you, or are you not claiming that when you read your bible, you are doing no less that reading the very mind of god? It seems you completely overlook the fact that there are over 42,000 different christian sects that cannot agree on how to interpret the bible. Yet you claim that when you read it, you're the one who knows what god meant? If that's not one step below omniscience, then I don't know what is.

On the other hand, it's nice to see you're honest enough not to fight the charge that you prefer ignorance and stagnation.

Anonymous said...

Dear Conny,
I like most of your comments but you are extremely wrong on the Nazi wcg comparison.
Part of wcg heritage is armstrongs quakerism. Distinctly anti militaristic.

Indeed when you would blow the dust of "The wonderful world tomorrow, what it will be like."
You will instantly recognize the Communist model. Including the relocation of all the tribes.

Let allone hwa communist involvement in the and the books that were printed in his uncles printfactory around 1917 that influenced him.

You should really re listen the speeches of Stanley Rader and HWA adressed to China's communist leaders in 1978 full of praise in their attempts to govern a billion people.

I am not saying hwa was a communist. I only say he was heavily influenced by it and later became a weaver in the global web that today is called globalism. I am not going into that but I say an increasing gap in haves and have nots which is exactly according to Karl Marx's economic predictions for captitalisms path. This is not conspiracy. Just google Karl Marx and das Kapital, Re read The wonderful world tomorrow, and compare that blueprint with Stalins blueprint for a communist society.

nck

Byker Bob said...

Communism is non-militaristic? HWA a globalist? (uh, hello! Remember "the beast"?)

HWA was a plagiarist, and borrower, who created a strange and unorthodox amalgam. It is well known that he had a copy of Mein Kampf in his personal library. He spoke admiringly of Hitler's rage. There were also sermons about the evils of both fascism, and communism, although HWA's personal style was one of totalitarianism. Apparently, in the context of theocracy, totalitarianism became the ideal form of government.

Above all things, HWA was into power, his own power. He borrowed heavily from a variety of resources to build and support it. He even invoked God in promoting his own power, and for a while, many of us bought into it.

BB

Anonymous said...

Well, bb I understand what you are saying. And it is quite a difficult topic in our tweet like exchange.

First you missed out on a period of heavy UN involvement. Good for you. But you simply missed a large part of wcg history. For example Nakasone was meeting hwa very briefly at UNESCO meeting in Paris. hwa was sitting at the main table at UN 40 years celebration. You figure out why. In any case this was before all the hollywood involvement.

hwa mentioned frequently he sat with Henry Ford. Now there you have a capitalist fascist.
In understanding nazism one must understand that is means national SOCIALIST party.
I know "wonderfull world tomorrow" was written after you left. A comparison to the Communist Model is apparent although the agricultural society could be fascist too. One must distinguish however between what communism actually pertains and the ussr system that was being fought during the cold war.

True hwa changed his government style many times in order to maintain control.
Under the influence of Stanley Rader (jews that fled from the pale in early 1900) hundreds of thousands of dollars were poured into institutions that served democracy and especially the rule of law.
-hwa chair of law (ucla or san francisco can;t remember)
-9th circuit court
-LA mediation services (a model copied all over the USA
-world court
-separation of church and state court case

Anonymous said...

The totalitarian model. "A christ type" ruling with a "rod of iron" to move populations over vast streaks of earth, to plough the earth is more akin to chinese, south east asia, ussr type of communism though.
Remember in Pasadena the Plough and plowshare statue (or bush) This was originally a gift from the ussr to the united nations.

In the United Nations building in New York there is a huge painting depicting a world that is being constructed like an Ikea cupboard.

I was just reading an article on a foreign tv producer who was sent to New York in the seventies to just watch television and return with ideas for new television formats.
It is hard to remember that seventies world with scarce and feeble worldwide contacts.
I believe that the many wcg sponsored dinners with many top diplomats present served to improve contacts in a world where everyone involved had personally witnessed the other one as the enemy. How completely different from this time and era where we hail Russian tennis stars because they are gorgeous really.

I know you will say that even if those dinners served the purpose I stated hwa was certainly the oddity present. I know you would.
I am not sure. When you watch all videos with hwa preaching to the elites he is certainly making it very clear (during the heat of the cold war) that the use of American Nuclear weapons was not something unimaginable. This guy in his giii with clear contacts on government level was making it very clear that the use of nuclear weapons was a clear and present and immediate fact. Not some far fetched european wishy washy political idea.

A message the OFFICIAL diplomats could of course NEVER utter towards its allies although being policy. However an unofficial messenger was preaching that in full force to most of the elites. Now that is what you would call a covert operation.

"The forming of the Beast" was official US policy since 1949. (as a force against ussr)
hwa was preaching with full force that the US had to heed this beast from turning against its creator. This is not out of line with official policy.

I was just watching "the boat that rocked movie). Very amusing comedy, to see how those rebels at sea were saturating the euro area with american music and culture. This was not the netflix, download era. This was a time when every Euro nation would have their own currency, music, radio, tv stations, programming to influence the masses.

Many of these "illegal" stations earned 20% of their income by broadcasting the world tomorrow. So yes really played its (small) part toward a world we call global today.

Don't put any effort in trying to convince me that all of this would have happened without wcg. Of course it would. I am just saying wcg played its (small) part in this globalist effort.

nck

Byker Bob said...

Still no footnotes, still no fact check. No way of counter-checking or verifying. You appear to be the only one who "knows" this stuff, nck.

The UN was founded Oct. 24, 1945. The fortieth anniversary would have been Oct. 24, 1985. HWA died approximately three months later on Jan. 16, 1986. We know that he was quite feeble, bed-ridden, heavily medicated, and often incoherent in the months leading up to his death.

You surround these alleged facts with your own shallow, simplistic thoughts and crappy spelling and grammar, over, and over, and over, and seem to expect people to buy into them. Nobody is. Even if what you say were true, who would even care? If HWA had such influence and impact on the world around us, that wasn't wasn't what he used to ruin the lives of his wives, children, and all of us. It is downright stupid to discuss what kind of totalitarian he was, NAZI, Russian model communist, or Chinese model communist. He grabbed and borrowed from everything and everyone to build and support his power over his dumb sheep. Billy Graham had much more influence, and Billy Graham was not an ego-infested flaming asshole.

BB

Anonymous said...

What appalling ignorance this blog (including the arrogant know-it-all) keeps spewing out.

Just one example: the Russians were never communists; it was a system of State Capitalism.

Americans are brain washed regarding the most basic facts about everything. They even think they live in a democratic/republican system when in fact it is a plutocracy / kleptocracy. Even the liar Bernie Sanders will admit that much.

Anonymous said...

HWA had a copy of Hitler's book? So what? It's a global bestseller and is currently flying off the shelves in Turkey and Germany.

By the way, there is a copy of Hitler's book in your local library too. Kill the librarian!!! Kill all information!!!

Byker Bob said...

Anonymous, brown stuff is dripping out of your ears. Next thing we know, you'll be denying the holocaust, too. Crawl back under the rock where you left your crack pipe. It misses you.

BB

NO2HWA said...

BB Sometimes people (4:44) say such stupid things that i let them through just for the fun of it.

Byker Bob said...

Good, Gary! You certainly accomplished your goal! This guy is dumb as a rock, but probably fantasizes that he is equal to Stephen Hawking!

BB

Anonymous said...

BB.

I'll try and work on my spelling.
It is my spelling and nck sign that distinhuishes my posts from others like 4:44 who take some ideas further than I would.

I expect no one to buy into my ideas. From my perspective it is very frustrating that it seems that people discussing hwa or wcg on this board seem to "know nothing" about it (paraphrasing your words that I seem to be the only person knowing about my statements) As I said 80 percent of what I say is taken from official publications like "the worldwide news".

I agree that from a theological viewpoint there is no point in discussing nazi or communist leanings. My post was merely a reply to Connies comparison with Nazism.

Personally to me it is somewhat relevant however.
To most a booklet like "the wonderful world tomorrow what it will be like" will be an artefact of a dying philosophy.

To me it is alive and relevant.
To shed some light on my existence. I am confronted nearly every 30 seconds with decisions to allocate huge funds into programs like (water dams in the mountains of Kenya for electricity, acquiring huge agriculteral stretches in the Ethiopian highlands for large Western or Chinese companies, trying to feed billions. Evaluating the works of Monsanto or Cargill. Now I ask this question for myself. Are they doing "the work of God" is this the (secular) fulfillment of "the wonderfull world tomorrow"? Billions are being fed in comparison to the seventies. Or is it just so that the truth of the matter is that man through its companies is destroying the Rainforest, the Amazon, the Indonesian rainforest in order that you can have your cheap palm oil or genetically manipulated grains in ALL of your foods.

I ask myself what is happening? And yes I relate that to the philosophy that was taught in my youth that it is ok to move populations in order to build that dam in the mountains of Ethiopia for electric power, to remove farmers from the plateau for large scale farming, in order to feed a hundred million Chinese, in order to involve Africa in the world economy and benefit from large scale operations like Monsanto or Cargill.
So there you have it. Am I doing the work of God or am I destroying the world?
Communist? Capitalist? So the moment I try and spell right it becomes an existential question for me instead of a joke making money and solliciting comments from my brothers. (and dare I say that Conny is not my sister for the sake of keeping something to dream for myself)

Ok.
You say I do not provide foot notes or fact check.
Gary informed me that posts with links are likely to not slip through the system.
However I would be happy to provide information if asked.

Anonymous said...

I cannot for lack of time provide fact check for all the hundreds of things I said.
Please re read my last posting and feel free to ask 2 questions.
Of course it will be easier to provide quick reference to facts I posted since the other 20% are personal ideas that I originally intended to be discussed. I assumed the facts were a given.

Another reason I did/do not provide links is that I do not want to be seen as an apologist for the armstrongs since on religion I agree 98 percent with you bb. I just don't like to direct people to armstrong information. If they so please most of what I say can be verified in 5 minutes nowadays. (even the disclosed diplomatic mail to thatcher)

Since you specifically asked about the UN conference.

The UN conference was held in June 1985 in San Francisco.
To be specific hwa attended on the 25th and 26th by special invitation.
At one of the dinners at the 26th in the Fairmont hotel hwa was seated next to the wife of the ambassador of the USSR. The ambassador commented that at least hwa was not so condemning of the ussr as other teleevangelists.
A lot of the diplomats like the French ambassador the UN, the Chinese ambassador to the UN, and presumably Perez de Cuellar commented to hwa that they had seen HWA discuss world events on the world tomorrow program..

Since you mention Billy Graham a lot. Billy Graham when visiting China stated that he was the first christian speaker to the chinese. Most of you here would agree since they do not feel hwa was a christian, so I give you that. Of course wcg was there earlier doing the groundwork, sharing the groundplan of the ambassador auditorium for the trade center in Beijing etc.

Now you commented that hwa was feeble. Yes he was in october 1985. But not so in June 1985.
The UN conference was just a stopover to the 20th anniversary of the Des Moines Church area. HWA was directing Pastor Cloninger through town and the area of his childhood as Mr Cloninger was lost in parts of town. It serves to show how clear hwa was at that time even when Des Moines had obviously changed over the years and he was just months away from his final destination.

By the way in Des Moines he was again presented with a sword and ploughshare statue. (ussr gift to the UN) (but this is just a curious aside.

Now do I feel this is important for the overall evaluation. No. But since you keep admitting that you don't know any of this I keep posting for enlightenment and the above stated personal purposes.

nck