People In Restored Church of God Need To Hear From Us Former Members

From a comment in a previous post:

Sure wasn't any of that when I was giving on a monthly basis:

- First Tithe
- Tithe of Tithe
- Leftover Second Tithe
- Third Tithe
- Offerings
- Volunteering on the campus on Sunday landscaping
- Working Mon-Fri doing everything on top of my actual job
- Setting up and breaking down the halls multiple times on Saturday, opening doors   for people who never could say hi, bringing in food, vacuuming, etc.
- Fundraising Money
- I was paying on top of everything to attend Ambassador Center
- I dressed the part
- Never stepped out of line
- Said yes
- Shoveled for others and never had time to shovel for myself
- It goes on and on

But as soon as I cut RCG off and stop being a cash cow for them and free labor in many cases, I became all these things. 

I sacrificed a lot, gave up my own path for a cause I believed in, and quietly like many others who needed something to look too, I gave RCG the best of me in all areas, and yet that was simply not worthy. 

People who are in the RCG need to hear us, former members, when we say: "Why are you being faithful to a place and person who won't be faithful to you once you are no longer giving them $$$$$$$$$$$$ and free labor"?

I have sat at HQ before Dave Pack and heard him in real-time completely assassinate the character of HQ ministers/employees who would leave. A lot of these never made it onto the tapes/cd or online files because they were cut. 

But I truly sat there as Pack would spit and rage over ministers and employees who would leave and hear him divulge details of their sins. He would never directly say but infer and when David Pack infers you can most certainly use enough common sense to know who and what he is talking about. 

Over time I felt two things: 1. I cannot safely counsel with HQ ministers and 2. Something had to be wrong if every time a minister or employee left, Pack thought it necessary to go to great lengths to assassinate their character. Something didn't sit right with me about that and I just wanted to hear the other side.

It's not surprising when you hear it. You sort of expected it. It certainly is disappointed. Because you feel like you wasted time.

RCG members are conditioned to believe that any kind of questioning internally or externally = loss of salvation.

This is clearly evidenced in his recent sermon where he states that those who believe they have made it to 1335 are locked in, and settled. 

David Pack has proven himself to be a false prophet and not one minister has enough balls to stand up at the pulpit and give a refresher on what a false prophet looks like. 

You shall know them by their fruits is in the context of false prophets, remember that! Matthew 7:15–18

Testing the spirits is in the context of false prophets. 1 John 4:1

David's prophecy is from his own will, and he has a need to be right, to prove himself. 2 Peter 1:20–21

“I did not send David Pack, yet he ran; I did not speak to him, yet he prophesied".

Jeremiah 14:14
Zechariah 10:2
Jeremiah 23:16
Jeremiah 23:21
Micah 3:11
2 Peter 2:1–3
Matthew 7:15–18

The NT has a lot to say about false teachings and false prophets and yet there is no actual prophet in the new testament, that office isn't seen until two witnesses come later on. But why is that? 

Dave Pack: There has never been a COG that has had more vile, rebellious, heretical, criminal, and opportunistic people in its midst than this !

 

Remember, this is a Church of God where the leader is never at fault. 

It is always those ungrateful sods that are employees and members.

Even though I will begrudgingly take your money, you are still nothing more than walking pieces of Laodicean garbage, unfit to be in my presence.

Dave Pack: I know the EXACT day God the Father returns

 

Dave Pack: The entire fate of mankind hangs in the balance if Israelite families aren’t fixed [by RCG members and ministers].

Yes, JC, it is true. 

I am the ROD of Isaiah 11:1 

and you are just the branch.

 

From an RCG source. Comments on Dave's sermon 286. 

There is so much to comment on here, but I will let the message stand by itself.

So after a roughly 19-day hiatus, Dave has had time to rethink and retool his prophecy series since Christ failed to show up at the last predicted date. Unfortunately, there isn’t a lot of new material in Part 286, as these “newly revealed truths” were largely already taught in 2018 and 2019. He is back to foretelling a physical Kingdom, led by himself and RCG members that will rule the world prior to the return of Christ and the Father, which then kicks off another 2 kingdoms down the road.

Since the picture is changing radically from a few weeks ago, he decided to start giving short messages every day for the next week to update the church on his new prophetic speculations. Dave has largely given up on providing reasons for why he gets his predictions wrong, (even though they are coming from God) and chooses to rely on the old trustworthy, “God needed to show us more.” However, in a move reminiscent of Ron Weinland, he declared that RCG members made it to the 1,335 and they are now counting down to additional end times events.

From Wikipedia:

In 2008, Weinland wrote that "the final countdown has begun, as the 1,335 days before the actual day Jesus Christ returns began on Tuesday, September 30, 2008."

Perhaps the most striking revelation from Part 286, is that in order to be “locked in,” one must believe, accept and embrace his latest teaching on the 1,335. Forget historic Christianity’s founding principle that one must believe in Christ to be saved, it would be better to just trust Dave’s newest revelation. So much for Acts 16:31!

A few highlights (usually a paraphrase, except for where quotes are used)

0:40 - “Those who waited to the Sabbath of 2 weeks ago, reached the 1,335 and that math for many reasons cannot be undone. Now just think of us as at “1,321.” In my excitement and exuberance, I didn’t see that it just said, “blessed is he that waits and comes to this date.” It didn’t mention the Kingdom of God, Christ, or God, or Salvation, but the assumption was [to be clear this was Dave’s assumption] that that’s what it was, since we were “waiting.” But the reality was there was more to learn and no one saw that. The “bucks stops here,” I didn’t see it, but now we understand it. So we are done waiting for the 1,335, we are at the 1321. April 3, the Last Day of Unleavened Bread isn’t gonna change it's not gonna move. So the question is how much longer do we wait [until the first kingdom starts].”

3:30 - “The 1,335 calculated for us the year of creation, it’s an amazing story. I can now tell you what no one else knows, I know the year of creation and the ministers know it and they are affirmed to secrecy.” [then jokes about stoning the ministers in the snow if they tell anyone].

9:00 - I want everyone to be absolutely clear. I am going to take various component parts, that are very different from what we learned before and bring them together...It’s been about 19 days since I spoke, I thought the kingdom would come 5 days after that, and well here we are 2 weeks after that, and we are nowhere close to learning what will happen next… We need to drive home “bite-sized” pieces that I will give you over the next few days. We will only go 90 minutes and I will stop mid-sentence if I need to and we will pick up tomorrow. [Dave went 106 minutes, in Part 286)

10:00 - There is no way the Kingdom is coming before Monday! But the ministers, if they all stood up and I asked them to a man, “Is the Bible clear which day the Kingdom of God is coming?,” they would all tell you, yes they know. That's “candy,” that’s “the desert,” at the end of these messages.

21:57 - Behold I will send you Elijah the Prophet, that’s the “Messenger” before the coming of the dreadful “Day of the Lord,” we know that’s the Last Day of Unleavened Bread, thats April 3rd, lets say it very plainly, the Father is coming on the “Day of the Lord,” so is Christ, They are both coming after the 7th head. All Israel is back before the Father and Christ.

24:00 - There is a kingdom of some reach and power, when 4 billion Israelites are resurrected and live on Earth. We will need to fix Israelite families! The entire fate of mankind hangs in the balance if Israelite families aren’t fixed [by RCG members and ministers].

27:30 - I am certain of these things now, I am going to speak every day for an hour to an hour and a half, except Sunday) so you can have a clear picture of things that are so similar, but so different.

37:40 - The “master of the house” is the Father, not Christ! This is irrefutable, there is not one soul outside this room who knows or thinks the master of the house is the Father!

1:03:00 - RCG now teaches you need to accept Dave’s teachings on the 1,335 to be “locked/saved.”

“If you embraced, and accepted, and you believe the 1335, you understand it, then you were "locked" [saved] two weeks ago. You may see some people leave, very few as, as you've heard in the sermons and all the messages. We're growing, I think faster than we have in about a decade and in every conceivable statistic we're doing wonderfully well, but you'll see it, an occasional foolish person will drop out. Pray for them, cause they're coming to a VERY BIG RODEO and everybody's going to get included. You'll see how this all develops. Those people obviously didn't believe the 1335. You couldn't have believed it and believe it. It was basic math, and with some science and understanding of the calendar, it's fairly basic. If they believed it, they're settled. If you see people leave, they're being ejected because whoever's here "last" is going "first." If people leave, they're being expelled by God, there could be more, they're going to be expelled because they're not going to go first if they didn't believe it. Now, I just thought I'd clarify that.

1:10:20 - An attack is leveled at everyone who has ever been at RCG and left. One could ask, if over 140 people were employed at HQ and left, are they the problem, or is RCG?

“And there was one era of God's church [Restored over the last 22 years] that had to work in this murderous, wicked environment. Where people among us would attack us, lie to us, lie about us, steal from us. We've had criminals, heretics, every vile person, every kind of ax grinder, heretic, opportunist, rebel you could ever imagine has been in this work over the last 22 years. Mr. Armstrong saw as many and worse, but it was a longer period of time, in a smaller church. We had to do the work in the Laodicean age. And we had to build this campus, with very few of us pulling really hard, selling all that we had. And God says, you honor those people because they lived in the rotten generation. The one I'm going to punish in the Day of the Lord, you put them at the head of the line. They're different.

 They came through almost their own fire before the fire. They're going first. That's the only way you can understand it. Since we're all going to receive the Kingdom at the same time, there's no other way to understand it. And having been in the ministry, for I'm going on almost 51 years now, I've watched the world change and I've watched God's people change. We're not doing the work in the age of brotherly love and the Philadelphian era. Again, people come lie to us, lie about us, sow division, come looking for jobs. God will sort it all out. "I wish them all well." (publically Dave will say this in sermons but privately, in conversations, to the ministry, etc… he viciously attacks these people.) Let them go. If they're still there and invited, they're not going first, but don't rule them out. Judge nothing before the Lord comes, I Corinthians 4:5. So I wanted you to understand once and for all, why we go first.”

1:39:57 - Dave claims he is the “Rod” of Isaiah 11:1 and that Christ is the “Branch.” Virtually every Bible commentary (Christian and Jewish) understands this to be Jesus Christ or the Messiah. However, Dave claims that verses 1-10 actually apply to him personally when the “first Kingdom” starts in the next few days/weeks.

It is quite obvious from any translation that Isaiah 11:1 refers to the same personage, not two different ones. As near as I can tell, if you claim to be a Christian, then taking one of Jesus Christ’s roles is blasphemy and something of a position one wouldn’t want to be in.

• NASB - Then a shoot will spring from the stem of Jesse, And a branch from his roots will bear fruit.

• NLT - Out of the stump of David’s family will grow a shoot—yes, a new Branch bearing fruit from the old root.

We could ask, when this year comes and goes with no return of Christ and no fulfillment of these days as predicted, will Christians who claim they follow the Bible do the right thing and leave the work of a false prophet?

Zerubbabel The Only True COG Prophet Continues to Humiliate Bob Thiel

Zerubbabel Elohiym

Repairing the Breach

Facebook

 

Where would the Church of God be without some crazy prophet in its midst? We have had a lot come and go over the last 80 some with all of them being proven liars. That has not stopped our current crew of self-appointed prophets though.

We have Gerald Flurry the final prophet of Edmond Oklahoma and now the official King of the Church of God. Gerald has been so blessed by God that he now possesses the true coronation stone that his creature christ will come back to sit upon as he is crowned the second King of all the earth. Plus, we must be eternally grateful for the restoration of the true dance of God to this end-time church! How could we ever have gotten along without this new truth?

There is also Dave Pack, the self-appointed apostle/prophet and best bud of JC who has been preparing his Wadsworth campus for JC to return to. Davey is eagerly looking forward to walking the hallowed grounds of the Wadsworth campus with JC by his side. Dave has bought a house and has it ready for him on Akron Road and also set up a charge account at the Giant Eagle for him. JC then can use Dave's broadcast studios to send out the final witness to the world, for the third time.

We also have Ron Weinland who preaches from his basement to the world. After being mocked in San Francisco after his speech at IdeaCity, he went on to become the first official felon to lead a Church of God in the end-time age. After a heart attack and suffering hallucinations from COVID-19, Ron's witness is quickly fading into the background as gibberish is about all he can preach any more. As he and his dingy wife travel to visit his micro churches, she has her fingers covered in diamond rings so they can use the proceeds from their sale if they need money to get to Jerusalem when it's time to be the two witless witnesses.

Speaking of gibberish, this leaves us with TWO final witless witnesses and self-appointed end-time prophets of the church. Both peddle in the craziest gibberish imaginable. There is Bob Thiel, the self-appointed messiah and Grand Bwana to Africa, the appointed Elisha, Elijah, Amos, Joshua, and the most double blessed man on earth today. His mind wanderings are getting so bizarre that he has become a comedy routine for the church to mock.

Then there is Zerubbabel. The true prophet to the Churches of God! All of our other guys are just agents of Satan as they preach their heretical lies, but God in his mercy has sent Zerub as a witness to us!  Plus, Zerbubbael has made fools of them as none of them know how to dress like a real prophet! Zerub does!

You can listen to this amazing man here as he discusses giants who roamed the earth along with giraffes. Note that Zerub says the giants were all destroyed in the flood but flourish in the world today. Such mind-boggling new information! Thiel has been seen whimpering in the front window of his world headquarters over this, and the fact that Zerub is on Twitter and he is not. Poor Bob, always the bridesmaid and never the bride!

PCG Wayne Turgeon: You don't know who you are messing with if you mess with PCG

 

When I came to Pasadena in the mid-1970's it was still the era ministers were saying a lot of weird stuff (not that has ever stopped since then). 1975 in prophecy was sitting on their doorstep and nothing was happening. The church was still reeling from major defections of ministers when Walter Sharp left and new splinter groups were starting. Then the receivership hit and the craziness amplified. One of the things I heard over and over was that the State of California, the Governor and the Attorney Geranl had better be really careful because the Almighty God was standing behind the "work" and terrible things would soon be happening to those who persecuted the church.

That mythology still exists in the extreme COG splinter cults like the Philadelphia Church of God and that brings us to our buddy Wayne Turgeon. If there has ever been a better example of a self-righteous jackass in the church, it is Wayne. From his days as a puffed-up student and Auditorium usher to his marrying into the Flurry clan, Wayne is a walking textbook case latest DSM-5.

Before Turgeon was sent to PCG's Edstone, England cult college campus he left he made these comments:

PCG Members Told to Take a Stand and Die If Necessary:
February 19, 2021 

 

Before Wayne Turgeon moved to Edstone, England, he gave a Bible study where he kept quoting HWA and told how HWA in a 1984 sermon said (and I quote): “We are becoming God teachers.” 

 

He cited Romans 8:31 and then said, “How dare anyone come against a true Christian? They don’t know what they’re dealing with and what they’re messing with.” He went on to say, “But do we always realize who’s behind us, and who’s backing us when the times get tough? Or are we going to run like the flip-flopping politicians? Or are we willing to take a stand and die if necessary?” He added, “If we are loyal to God (translation: loyal to PCG govt.), He always watches over us.” 

 

He also said, “We pray we will all be together soon in that place of safety wherever that might be. Things are going to get worse before they get better.” –PCG source Exit &Support Network

Dave Pack: I know when God arrives, Now I just have to figure out when Christ arrives...

 

We never know today what will come out of Dave's mouth due to the absolute craziness over the last few years. He does not disappoint today.

Brief Note From Mr. Pack 

 

Greetings brethren! 

 

The Church is on fire with what we have learned—and particularly the 1,335 understanding! Everything is on track! 

 

Be assured, the overall prophetic “superstructure” remains intact. In fact more has been learned that strengthens the picture. 

 

I will give a short Bible Study to be posted tomorrow night. In the meantime, here is something to “puzzle” over… 

 

Read Ezekiel 21:24-26. Now an enigma. Verse 27 adds, “and it [the crown] shall be no more, until He [Christ] come whose right it is; and I [God] will give it him.” 

 

Think! There is a gap between the events of verses 24-26 and Christ’s coming to David’s throne to wear the crown. How could this be? 

 

The answer is shocking! We know when God arrives. The question becomes: 

 

When does Christ? Enjoy trying to figure out Ezekiel 21. Wait until you hear all that it opens up! 

 

David C. Pack 

 

P.S. A member/co-worker letter will finally arrive next week. You will learn why the delay.

 

Gerald Flurry: "...Satan has already been cast down to earth–but members have 'angelic protection.'"

Exit and Support Network had this up about Gerald Flurry's latest sermon.

February 17, 2021 

 

After the new U. S. president was sworn in GF gave another of his sermons with lunatic ideas and erroneous theology. Here are just a few: 

 

He believes Satan has already been cast down to earth–but members have “angelic protection.” However, Laodiceans (since they didn’t go with GF) are not so fortunate and Satan is “stamping all over them.” 

 

Only PCG can see the “vision” and “can prove it” since, as GF says, “We are a special people before God.” The world “has to listen to this one last message” from GF. You hear this in all his sermons. Everything is always one last–“one last chance,” “one last warning,” etc. How many one lasts are there? 

 

I had to shake my head when he said, “If you remain loyal to God, you are never going to be spiritually alone.” He won’t come out and say that what he really means is: “If you remain loyal to PCG government.” But even so, what does that have to do with being “spiritually alone”? Perhaps it means “alone” when you are thrown out of PCG. 

 

The word “loyal” isn’t even in the KJV which is what GF uses (except when he twists words from some other version such as the Moffat). What escapes GF is that loyal is primarily what God is to us. We are told in the Word of God that even if we are faithless, He remains faithful. (See II Timothy 2:13 NKJV:” If we are faithless, He remains faithful; He cannot deny Himself.”) Why is that not understood by those in PCG? 

 

I would say it is because members are not being taught that if they belong to Christ, nothing can take away their salvation. [Note: See Q&A: Can We Ever Lose Our Salvation?] The Word of God continually says God will never leave us or forsake us and that He continues to work in us until the end of our life. (See Philippians 1:26 KJV: “Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:” and Hebrews 13:5 KJV: “…he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.” 

 

GF said to “study the new Trumpet magazine…especially the feature articles as they are truly outstanding.” Folks, how about studying the book of Colossians without PCG literature and find the treasures in Christ? (Colossians 2:3 KJV: “In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.”) We have everything we need in Christ. But that isn’t enough for GF.

He quoted from HWA so many times that I lost track of which were HWA’s words and which were GF’s, He said we are “going to rule the Universe” and “restore the Universe” (this doctrine comes from the Mormons) and we need to “get our minds on the New Jerusalem.” How about saying “get our minds on Christ” who is our only hope. (See Colossians 1:27: “Christ in you, the hope of glory:“) 

 

Towards the end of his sermon he said, “This is our future”and talked about the “power” we are going to be given. It’s all about power with GF. –PCG source

In the Church of God Semanitics Is Everything

Herbert W Armstrong: Semanitics Is Everything

 

If we Google the term semantics, we learn that this word conveys “the meaning of a word, phrase, sentence, or text.” And, while we all recognize the importance of being clear about the meaning and scope of what is being communicated, most of us have also experienced those obnoxious individuals who love to split hairs so that they can be right (and, more importantly, everyone else can be shown to be wrong). Unfortunately, in the religious realm, Herbert W Armstrong was one of those individuals who obsessed over semantics.

For Armstrong, most of Christianity had completely missed the proper meaning of what constituted the “gospel” or good news message which Christ taught to his disciples. Armstrong believed that the Christ-centric message of Traditional Christianity completely ignored or suppressed the message about a future and literal world government headed by Christ. And, as has been pointed out in this forum and other places, Armstrong both ignored the Great Commission of Matthew 28 and the clear indications in Paul’s epistles that his message was focused on Jesus Christ and his salvific work. It is unfortunate that Mr. Armstrong seemed incapable of allowing that a message about Christ could accommodate a message about his kingdom. For Armstrong, it was an either/or proposition – clarity demanded one explanation or the other (making one wrong and the other right).

It seemed to be incomprehensible to Mr. Armstrong that words can have multiple meanings. Indeed, his writings suggest that he rejected the notion that words, phrases, sentences or texts might be subject to different interpretations. Armstrong had discovered “THE TRUTH.” If there were other possible meanings/interpretations, they must be disregarded because God or the Holy Spirit had revealed to him the “TRUE” meaning/interpretation.

Armstrong believed that the fact that his organization incorporated the terminology “Church of God” as part of its name was a hallmark that his group was the “TRUE” Church which Jesus Christ had founded on that day of Pentecost so long ago. Never mind that the Greek word “ekklesia” suggests an assembly of people called together for the purpose of worship. Never mind that Scripture also attaches the term to Christ, the First Born and various places. Why not the “Assembly of God”? Why not the “Assembly of the First Born”? And, if the “ekklesia” was composed of everyone who had God’s Holy Spirit, would it really be accurate to suggest that any one human organization claiming to be the “Church of God” fully encompassed what that term really means?

For Herbert Armstrong, traditional understandings of terms like religion, Christian, paganism, grace and truth were said to be wrong. Indeed, in almost any area of Christian doctrine/dogma which we could name, Armstrong claimed that the traditional understanding was the diametric opposite of the truth.

However, Armstrong’s preoccupation with semantics was probably no where more apparent than in the realm of prophecy. It was how Armstrong defined terms like Israel, Babylon, Assyria, Zerubbabel, one crying out in the wilderness, place of safety and Great Whore which colored his unique interpretations of Biblical prophecy. For Herbert Armstrong, it wasn’t just the meaning of these terms either – it was the timing and chronology which he insisted were implied by those understandings. In short, Armstrong’s semantics demanded that the “end times” were upon us and insisted that his followers even more fully embrace his understandings of Biblical semantics.

There are a few scriptures that come to mind when dealing with the power of words, and how they can positively or negatively impact us. Here are a few of them: “Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat its fruits” (Proverbs 18:21), “There is one whose rash words are like sword thrusts, but the tongue of the wise brings healing” (Proverbs 12:18), “Whoever keeps his mouth and his tongue keeps himself out of trouble “ (Proverbs 21:23), “Whoever guards his mouth preserves his life; he who opens wide his lips comes to ruin” (Proverbs 13:3), “I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak” (Matthew 12:36), “For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart” (Hebrews 4:12) and “If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person's religion is worthless.” (James 1:26) One has to wonder what Mr. Armstrong thought these verses meant.

Miller Jones/Lonnie Hendrix

Bob Thiel: Does he know more than Dr. Fauci and did he discover a cure for AIDS?

 

The other day. the official Church of God Wonder Boy and God's ONLY double blessed self-appointed prophet came out with a bunch of zingers that show just how deceitfully crafty he is in his claims.

Now before going further, let me state that 1) I have been trained in virology 2) the National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Disease twice concluded that my work with herbal, glandular, and vitamin therapy had ‘significant scientific merit’ against the HIV coronavirus in the 1990s, 3) I do have a Ph.D. in a biological field, and 4) I have successfully treated people with a variety of viruses with natural interventions for about thirty years (this is not something that people like Dr. Fauci, who the AP has repeatedly promoted as an expert has done).

A retired Public Health Educator from Indiana sent me this today: 

I am addressing this as a Retired Health Educator who for years had to evaluate material to make judgments on the reliability of information before using it to teach others. I am making no judgments on the science here, just the way the information is presented that sends up warning signals. 

 

But first: Is our good Dr. Bob telling us that HIV is a coronavirus? Or does the Doctor/Prophet make a typo?

Secondly: 

 

1) “I have been trained in virology” is not the sort of statement a virologist would make. “I have been trained (or studied, etc) at NAME OF INSTITUTION or “with NAME of SCIENTIST is more likely. 

 

2) A trained virologist would not make a statement that NIAID had “twice concluded” anything without giving us a reference citation to where those conclusions appeared. 

 

3) “I do have a PhD in a biological field” are red flag, weasel words. What “biological field? Again, someone with a valid PhD who is writing about viruses would specify the field. 

 

4) “I have successfully treated...for about thirty years” — where are his citations to any of this from established medical journals, conference proceedings, ANYTHING peer-reviewed? The failure to provide any peer-reviewed information is disquieting.

This is the same kind of deceitful nonsense that Gavin Rumney called Bob out on years ago when Bob claimed to have a theology Ph.D. from a real university, which ended up being a diploma mill out of India. Thiel also claims that he went to Fuller seminary as proof of his super fantastical theological understanding. One class in one semester does not make one a theologian AND he has no degree from Fuller or even Ambassador College, which, most assuredly does not make him a genuine theologian. His so-called education in theology comes from the junk theology of Herbert Armstrong and Rod Meredith which consists of booklets and sermons that proof-text scripture to fit the desired topic being spoken of. 

Is there anything truthful about Bob?

 

Gerald Flurry Still Promoting His Failed Prophecy

Above is the screenshot of Gerald Flurry's January 1 prediction that Donald Trump would be reelected and that God was going to perform a miracle. It is now February 15 and the article is still up, apparently because Gerald did NOT make a false prophecy. His god is all-powerful and will still make this happen.

In his article he states:

The God of the Bible is absolutely trustworthy. When He makes a promise, He keeps it. When He issues a prophecy, you can stake your life on it coming to pass! 

 

I have lived my life by this truth for over four decades. And I have seen God deliver miracle after miracle. Never has God failed to do what He said He will. 

 

Back in November, I wrote an article titled “Why Donald Trump Will Remain America’s President.” This article is based on some prophecies in the Bible, and to this day I remain convicted that it is 100 percent reliable. All the evidence may look contrary, but that doesn’t shake my conviction. God will ultimately stop Joe Biden from being America’s next president. Read that article to see what God prophesied. Those prophecies are sure. Keep your eyes on events, and watch what God does!

All of the evidence has proven it to the contrary and yet Flurry is still convicted his words were and still are 100% reliable. Flurry is starting to sound as crazy as Bob Thiel! False prophets in the COG have a fertile ground to plant their batshit imaginations into. There is always some gullible fool that will believe them, though those numbers are rapidly diminishing as every day that passes their lies become more exposed.

Flurry continues:

In Amos 2:11-12, God condemns those who have a “prophesy not” spirit. Then in Amos 3:7-8 we read, “Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. The lion hath roared, who will not fear? the Lord God hath spoken, who can but prophesy?” (Amos 3:7-8).

There are two opposing spirits here! One says “prophesy not.” The other says, “Who can but prophesy?” The Lion of the tribe of Judah—Jesus Christ—has roared! If you don’t fear God, then you will probably say, “Don’t prophesy.” But if you know God, and you listen to what He says, then you have an entirely different view. Who can but prophesy?

In the Bible prophets were usually men gifted by God to deliver a revelation to the church, but that ability to be a prophet carried tremendous responsibility: 

Deut. 13:1 “If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 

 

Deut. 13:2 and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, ‘ Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,’ 

 

Deut. 13:3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the LORD your God is testing you to find out if you love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 

 

Deut. 13:4 “You shall follow the LORD your God and fear Him; and you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling to Him. 

 

Deut. 13:5 “But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has counseled rebellion against the LORD your God who brought you from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, to seduce you from the way in which the LORD your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from among you.

The Bible says that true prophets of God have to be 100% correct in ALL their prophecies. Notice above that even if they are wrong just ONE time, they are to be put to death! that's a pretty heavy burden to carry for self-appointed COG prophets. They don't care however, their narcissism and mental imbalances cause them to believe they are set apart for an end-time witness. the sad track record of COG prophets is every time they are wrong, their god resorts to sending them a new revelation or understanding that they had been blind to before. That new revelation just keeps getting more outlandish by the day.

COG members have been conditioned over the decades to believe anything that COG leaders say, all because of the erroneous and absurd doctrine of church government. Look at all the times we were told that if a minister speaks it is as if God himself spoke it. To even dare question a minister was a sure ticket to the lake of fire. Because of that members failed to heed the very standards the scriptures told them about prophets it was easy for the current crop of buffoons to step forward and make their claims.

Plus, the biblical office of a prophet no longer exists anyway in the church since the canon of scripture has been completed. That reality is a common understanding in Christianity, particularly since Christ came and sealed the deal. the church does not need fools like Flurry, Pack, Thiel, Wieland, or any of the others if they are followers of Christ, as they claim.

Since COG leaders cannot look to anything Christ said and have to look backwards all the time, let's not forget what Jeremiah had to say about prophets. We quickly can see what frauds we have in the church today. 

Jer. 14:13 But, “Ah, Lord GOD!” I said, “Look, the prophets are telling them, ‘You will not see the sword nor will you have famine, but I will give you lasting peace in this place.’”

Jer. 14:14 Then the LORD said to me, “The prophets are prophesying falsehood in My name. I have neither sent them nor commanded them nor spoken to them; they are prophesying to you a false vision, divination, futility and the deception of their own minds.

Jer. 14:15 “Therefore thus says the LORD concerning the prophets who are prophesying in My name, although it was not I who sent them — yet they keep saying, ‘There will be no sword or famine in this land’ — by sword and famine those prophets shall meet their end!

Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith 

by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, 

through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared...

1 Timothy 4:1-2

 

Why do crackpot COG prophets expect us to believe their every word?

The last few weeks have not been good for self-appointed COG prophets. One failure after another has smacked them across their smug faces. Never has the face of prophethood in the Church of God been such a horrible mess. From Jesus standing up Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry's reinstallation of Donald Trump to the US presidency, to Alton Billingsley who prophesied that Hillary Clinton would defeat Trump and be set up as the first woman to rule over the United States right before the Holy Roman Empire destroyed the nation and took people into slavery.

Despite all these failures, these stinking piles of steaming bullshit continue on and get even more fervent in their predictions. Unless of course, you are Bob Thiel and your prophetic radar is broken making you are the king of the could-be's and may-be's. They all demand that we respect their prophecies and not mock them. 

Gerald Flurry is particularly perturbed right now that people are not heeding him and his prophecies. In his latest Trumpet rag he has this up: Do You Believe All That the Prophets Have Spoken?.

What is a true Christian? One who follows Jesus Christ—as well as His true apostles, prophets and other leaders. 

What utter bullshit! A Christian is a follower of Christ and of no man. Self-appointed apostles, prophets, and COG leaders come and go and leave trails of destruction in their wake. When has the COG had a true prophet in its midst over the last many years? COG leaders always have to have Christ plus something added.

After Christ was crucified and resurrected, He walked among a group of Jews without being recognized. They talked about how Christ was a mighty prophet in word and deed. They searched His tomb but found it empty. This disappointed them because they had hoped Christ would redeem and save Israel at that time. They didn’t understand the timing of God’s plan—that they had only witnessed Christ’s firstcoming, not His Second Coming. 

 

Then Christ had something very important to tell them: “Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken” (Luke 24:25). Do you believe all that the prophets have spoken? All of it? To follow Christ, we must do this. He doesn’t want followers who relegate prophecy to mere history or who disregard the Old Testament. Christ rebuked these Jews severely!

I can state for a fact to follow Christ one does NOT have to believe any COG prophet or anything they speak. It is not a requirement for salvation. 

As Flurry continues on the bullshit gets deeper and deeper:

God wants to lead us. Magnificent glory is available to us—if we’re willing to do what the prophets say. Heed the prophets, because God sent them to teach us what we need to know to enter His Kingdom, which is also His Family. 

God has NOT sent Bob Thiel, Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry, Alton Billingsley, or Ron Weinland to us. They have absolutely NOTHING to teach us that is worthwhile or necessary for salvation and entrance into some phantasmagoric hell hole of a kingdom these guys want to set up according to their wishes.

“And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself” (verse 27). These Jews didn’t know the Bible passages about Christ’s first coming. Christ was telling them they had been lazy in their Bible study! 

COG members are lazy in their Bible Study of they actually believe these professional bullshitters.  No one in their right mind who has even a superficial understanding of the bible would EVER join up with these guys. 

Flurry goes on to speculate that Jesus always looked back at the prophets of the Old Testament because the New Testament did not exist yet. And we should do so today. We need to do that because today 90% of all prophecy is being fulfilled and we need to follow today's prophets.

“And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you that which shall befall you in the last days” (Genesis 49:1). In the last days! Ninety percent of all Bible prophecy is being fulfilled in this end time. “… At the end it shall speak …” (Habakkuk 2:3). Sometimes, prophecy is dual, meaning Bible history will repeat itself. We need to know prophecy!

Flurry believes that he and his church and his prophethood are prophecies in the Bible for the end times. Rising out of the ruins of the mother church and into the mess he has created.

God the Father is perfect. Jesus Christ is perfect. The Bible is Jesus Christ in print. Remember this when you study the Bible. Imperfect translators made some mistakes, but this doesn’t nullify the messages of any of the biblical books. 

 

“And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me: Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up” (Acts 15:13-16). This is another example of the New Testament quoting the Old Testament. Here, Amos 9:11 is referenced. 

 

“In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old” (Amos 9:11). God’s Church fell several decades ago. Someone had to raise it back up before Christ’s return. This is all about the throne of David. Where is that throne today? Christ will sit on it when He returns, so it has to be somewhere on Earth already! Study my free book The New Throne of David to learn more.

Imagine a god being so impotent and weak that it was unable to keep a church alive for its people and needed Flurry to come along and restore it. How pathetic is that god? And, what kind of a god needs a special rock to come back and sit upon when it supposedly is already King of all that is? It certainly does not need a rock in Edmond Oklahoma to come back to or a sad storefront in Grover Beach, CA, or a campus in Wadsworth, Ohio.

Flurry ends with this:

God wants us to live by every word of all these prophets. This will fill our lives with glory, wonder, majesty and royalty! God’s Word is about to flood the Earth (Isaiah 11:9), but we can soak it up right now!This world is suffering for not paying attention to the prophets of God. Soon, God will raise the ruins of the world just like He has in His Church. 

If you ignore the prophets of old you are sure to ignore the prophets of today in the church. Seriously? What crap! Besides, a follower of Jesus does NOT need a physical "church" to cling to for salvation.

We’re right at the edge of Christ’s Second Coming, when all will choose the right tree that Moses prophesied about. Christ will fill the Earth with wonders that will set our imaginations on fire!

No one needs either of the two trees of Moses or Herbert Armstrong's two trees for that matter. Christians know that Jesus made those trees obsolete and unnecessary. COG leaders and false prophets always have us looking backward at something outdated and unnecessary and establish all kinds of obstacles in our paths.

Gerald Flurry, the COG's most accurate prophet?

The Church of God has so many crackpot self-appointed prophets right now that no one knows who to follow.

Dave Pack and Ron Weinland have had one epic failure after another. Bwana Bob Thiel is so wimpy that he will not ever take a stand on anything and throws out so many could-be's and may-be's that he has no credibility.

That brings us to Gerald Flurry. The Phialdpha Church of God, in their latest Trumpet Brief, claims that Flurry is a real prophet.

Dear Subscriber,

If you’ve seen anything from the Trumpet website over the past few months, you’ll know that editor in chief Gerald Flurry has written a lot about prophecies from the book of Amos as pertaining to the presidency of Donald Trump.

For this article, I want to relate some statements Mr. Flurry made about Amos—not three months ago, but from three decades ago. What took place in the lead-up to a certain fateful day in 1994 is vividly applicable to today.

On Dec. 21, 1991, based on certain end-time prophecies in the book of Amos, Mr. Flurry made the following statement to our members (emphasis added throughout):

I wouldn’t even be surprised if within the next two years you … see a massive earthquake in this world, perhaps even in Pasadena, California.

In an October 1993 message, he went further, stating:

Is it possible that God could strike with an earthquake … maybe even on January the 16th, 1994? Is it possible something like that could happen? Well yes, I would say it’s possible, especially in the state of California.

He doubled down on his warning in a December 1993 article for the Trumpet magazine:

God also says He will punish Israel with the earthquake. Will an earthquake be the next California disaster?

A massive earthquake, on or around Jan. 16, 1994, in or around Pasadena, California—warned about up to two years in advance. Ludicrous.

On Jan. 17, 1994, at 4:31 a.m., a massive 6.7-magnitude earthquake rocked Los Angeles County, California—the same county in which Pasadena is located, with the epicenter only 20 miles away. Known as the Northridge earthquake, the event remains, to this day, the costliest earthquake disaster in United States history and the ninth-costliest natural disaster.

So there you have it. Flurry is a better prophet than Bob Thiel or Dave Pack!

Poor Bob Thiel. You know things are bad when Gerald Flurry can show up Bob.  Bob is always the bridesmaid jumping for the bouquet and never the bride. Poor little fella. 

You can read the full article here: Gerald Flurry, Amos and the Earthquake

UCG: Don't Go To The Radicalized News Sources But Come To Us Because We Have The Real Truth. We Have The Logos!

Those fun boys in Cincinnati are back letting us know that they are the best source for unbiased news that there could possibly be! With their claim that 57% of Americans distrust the news, they want you to know that they are the best source of news you could ever possibly need. 

It’s important to note that these numbers represent journalists and media on both ends of the spectrum—liberal and conservative. And government doesn’t fare any better. 

 

What is disturbing about this for us in the Church of God fellowship? Follow-up research conducted a few weeks ago found that a majority (57 percent) of Americans interviewed noted that divisiveness is so extreme that they believe the United States “is in the midst of a cold civil war.”

Then the boys say this:

Consider these parallels: even before he was president, Abraham Lincoln saw similar issues. Back in 1858, he declared: “If we could first know where we are, and whither we are tending, we could then better judge what to do, and how to do it” (Lincoln’s emphasis). When he spoke this, the United States was bitterly divided. He famously then paraphrased the words of Jesus Christ in Matthew 12:25: “a house divided against itself cannot stand.” 

 

Today, this is more important than ever. In this current crisis of mistrust, we need to recognize that people on both sides have become radicalized. 

 

As Lincoln stated, “what to do and how to do it” are critical. In this world where credible, reliable and trustworthy information is all but lost, where can people turn for real truth?

Hmm...let me guess...just where are people to turn to for real truth? Hmmm...I wonder where that could possibly be? 

The biblical answer is found in John 17:17: “your word is truth” (English Standard Version, emphasis added throughout).

Imagine that, the "truth" found in a Church of God, particularly the United Church of God. Who knew! 

Remember, these are the same guys who plotted and schemed, behind the scenes, while still employed as ministers of the Worldwide Church of God. This went on for many months with them meeting in the SOG apartments and off-campus to figure out how they could start a new church, take as many people as possible to fund a new organization that would keep them all employed as ministers. And while they did this they were actively kicking out WCG members left and right who disagreed with the changes. Depending on how well they liked you and if they thought you had a lot of money, they would then pass on to these people to wait and a new church would be formed and they could join it. 

Yes, these are the men now asking you to trust them with the "truth".

Never mind that though, the boys want you to imagine that they answer to a higher power. 

But consider this. There is a certain Greek word that refers to vocabulary. The phrase for vocabulary that is simply translated “word” in English is lexi (from which we get lexicon). 

 

But lexi is not the Greek word that is in the inspired prayer from Jesus to God in John 17:17. This is a critical point: Jesus uses the Greek word logos—the verse actually reads: “your logos [Word] is truth.” 

 

Why is that Greek word logos important? Beginning a few hundred years before the coming of Jesus as the Messiah, many philosophers claimed and used the Greek logos to refer to the ability to think, as a means to persuade, as reasoned discourse, as the difference between humans and beasts. Logos was the center of many teachings.

I guess Logos is as good a word as Jesus, or getter actually. UCG, like most COG's do not mention Jesus that much. Its law, law, law. Or, law, tithe, government, hoy days, and a little Jesus. 

If we now revisit the entire prayer of Jesus in John 17:17, we then see Jesus praying for us today! “Sanctify them [set apart for holy service] in the truth; your word [logos] is truth” (ESV). This Logos—Jesus Christ as the Word—must be living within us (Ephesians 3:17). 

How can Jesus be living in the COG when the church has basically ignored the dude for decades? These are the same men who were embarrassed to even say the name Jesus for many years. Today it is cool for the more liberal COG's to say the name Jesus more as it makes them think they are appealing to real Christians in the world.

Think on this: if we indeed are to fulfill our personal individual mission of being lights to this darkened world (Matthew 5:14), a world darkened by mistrust, we must fully know, understand and be living the precious truths that we hold. We must be anchored in faith and active in trust! People in the world should see that Word of truth openly living in us. 

 

As we approach the Passover and the Days of Unleavened Bread, I call upon each one of us to revisit the spiritual trunk of the tree and hold it fast. A most crucial part of this trunk of the tree is the precious plan of God, highlighted by the knowledge and application of the Holy Days.

Jesus, plus the holy days. That's how it works. In the COG it is always a "+" god that needs to be affirmed. Something always needs to be done to placate the angry god they actually follow.

Do we consider that this Word, this Logos spoken of by John, who is today our Elder Brother who stands ready to help us, is the One who both gave the Holy Days we observe and also lives in their meaning? Does the understanding of these Holy Days live and manifest itself in our daily lives?

It is always important to do something to make the angry god happy. Do a lot of works and God will be pleased and then it may drop a few spoonfuls of grace upon you. The Jewish holiday s were vital to the identity and growth of the Children of Isreal to gain their identity. These laws were to them alone and not for anyone around them. Contrast that with what most Christians understand, that with Jesus, grace overwhelms everyone and everything, not just a certain group of people.

But then again, this is a COG and the law must reign supreme. The Cincinnati boys want their members to pray about their message during the upcoming holiday instead of placing their focus upon that dude that embarrassed them. the dude who can give them rest, comfort, and distress them from the rigamarole of everyday life.

Allow me to address one more issue: as we approach the upcoming Holy Days, I would also ask you to consider and pray about the fact that the message of the Church must endure and prevail in this turbulent environment of mistrust. We don’t speak for the Left or Right—we openly declare the reality of the coming Kingdom of God! We contrast the truth of the Bible with the events of the day, “crying aloud” (Isaiah 58:1) and proclaiming a warning message to repent of national and personal sins. 

One of the COG's biggest fear tacts was to constantly whine about a "famine of the word". For two millennia there have been Christians who have fought and died to preserve the word they claim as too important to keep let die.  These martyrs who died knowing the truth they found never once believed that it was going to disappear at some point in time. Their God was more powerful than that. Not the god of the COG's though. It was so impotent that it let its message disappear for 1,800 years till Herbert Armstrong discovered it in a public library. 

We should solemnly consider that the Bible warns of a coming time of spiritual famine, “of hearing the words of the LORD” (Amos 8:11). That time is not yet, but in a time when research confirms that media and government leaders are “purposely trying to mislead people by saying things they know are false,” we must double down in prayerful vigilance, holding fast to the spiritual trunk of the tree.

For decades the COG has misled people with what they call the "truth". A truth that many of them don't even actually believe because that truth needs to focus upon Jesus and that just pisses them off. The COG in 2021 places more emphasis upon sacred rocks, double blessings, dreams, and visions of apocalypse as the god they look to than it does at any time upon Jesus and what Christianity knows and understands.  Some day the COG might catch up to that understanding.

From Personal from the President Victor Kubik

Restored Church of God Update: We have kept the patience and now are blessed! Everything is now lining up for the Sabbath

 

Prophetic Update

As stated in the announcement posted Saturday night, if time passed, God would reveal more. This was the case—and in the most wonderful way possible! While it may seem impossible on its face, everything still holds!

“Math and science” made clear Sebat 24 was the only date that truly worked to start the 1,335 and integrated with all the other dates in prophecy.

Everything lining up for the Sabbath is in fact even more significant than we understood!

Recall that in Dan 12:12, the 1,335 is explained as something we “wait” and “come to,” at which time brethren are “blessed.” With the date passing, God has revealed that being “blessed” meant something better than any of us could have imagined.

God has made clear that those of us who waited to the 1,335 are now in a “blessed”—settled—condition! Many verses support this. Here are just three:

Rev. 1:3 says we are blessed when the time is still “at hand”—before Christ arrives. How would this be possible without this amplified understanding of the 1,335?

Rev. 22:7 says much the same—that we are blessed before Christ comes “quickly.”

This explains how the little flock in Luke 12:32 are scheduled to receive the Kingdom!

This understanding also makes clear we are right on track regarding timing. The wait to the 1,335 is over. This means we have kept the patience in Heb. 10:36—we have “done the will of God”—and now only have a “mikron” to go (vs. 37). We don’t know exactly how long this is, but it must be short!

As Mr. Pack said in his last message, there is no time or need for another message. Although “blessed,” let us all continue watching together—remaining spiritually strong right up to the very end. Stay alert!