Some Final Thoughts on August 2013 From a Restored State of Mind
I would like to take a moment to refine David C. Pack's view on "Why would God command the rebuilding of the House (i.e. The Temple of the 500's BCE) and not mean NOW?" which to him means during the month of August 2013 and culminating the last Sabbath of that month.
I think we can see that in the course of his meanderings over his role in religion and the role of the Restored Church of God in Ecclesiastical History, Dave has had to make the leap from the ACTUAL meaning of Haggai and the ACTUAL people it was written to THEN, to making it mean what it did not mean THEN to what it must mean NOW. Review his Screeds 1-25 if you wish to see how this miracle occurred.
Matthew never read Luke's story and Luke never read Matthew's. They cannot be the same story. "Matthew" is the master of this in his birth story where he quotes and OT passage as proof of his NT story when in fact he used the OT passage to write the NT in the first place.. Not only that but he misquotes and misinterprets (by our standards) the OT to tell that story. In short, like Dave, "Matthew" (the names were added to anonymous Gospels a hundred years later) makes scripture mean what it never meant. That may be acceptable to some, but it is not to myself and today we would call it fudging the facts and making up tales. Dave is fudging the facts big time and making up tales. While Matthew did it, he knew he was doing it. Dave is not in the "I know it is just an analogy and a form of Midrashic writing." I am sure he does not know what Midrashic Writing is.
2) Directly related, why (or how) would God command the remnant to “Go…build the House!” (Hag. 1:8)—but not mean NOW? How could He mean some undetermined future year? Why would God tell them (twice) to “consider their ways”—but not mean that they should do this now? Try to imagine God saying, “Consider your ways, but take your time. There’s no hurry. In fact, take years to think it over—even though you have been out of My Church for 20 years! You don’t have to DO anything now.”
3) Also related, if God waited 2,500 years to reveal the prophecy’s meaning (3,000 years when various related much older Psalms are considered), is not His waiting done? Does His revealing it not signal that He has reached the time to fulfill it rather than having reached a point one, two or three years out?
17) Recall Haggai 1:13: “Then spoke Haggai the Lord’s messenger in the Lord’s message unto the people…” Haggai is the messenger to God’s people, with what is an all-important message from God. Would not God make clear in such a unique message He describes as “the Lord’s message unto His people” the correct date for action? What kind of message would it be if people did not know WHEN TO CARRY IT OUT?"
This is what the Lord Almighty says: “These people say, ‘The time has not yet come to rebuild the Lord’s house.’”
3 Then the word of the Lord came through the prophet Haggai: 4 “Is it a time for you yourselves to be living in your paneled houses, while this house remains a ruin?”
5 Now this is what the Lord Almighty says: “Give careful thought to your ways...
12... Then Zerubbabel son of Shealtiel, Joshua son of Jozadak, the high priest, and the whole remnant of the people obeyed the voice of the Lord their God and the message of the prophet Haggai, because the Lord their God had sent him. And the people feared the Lord.
13 Then Haggai, the Lord’s messenger, gave this message of the Lord to the people: “I am with you,” declares the Lord. 14 So the Lord stirred up the spirit of Zerubbabel son of Shealtiel, governor of Judah, and the spirit of Joshua son of Jozadak, the high priest, and the spirit of the whole remnant of the people. They came and began to work on the house of the Lord Almighty, their God, 15 on the twenty-fourth day of the sixth month.Haggai 2:
6 “This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘In a little while I will once more shake the heavens and the earth, the sea and the dry land. 7 I will shake all nations, and what is desired by all nations will come, and I will fill this house with glory,’ says the Lord Almighty. 8 ‘The silver is mine and the gold is mine,’ declares the Lord Almighty. 9 ‘The glory of this present house will be greater than the glory of the former house,’ says the Lord Almighty. ‘And in this place I will grant peace,’ declares the Lord Almighty.”
One final example. When the Book of Revelation says, "To show unto his servants what must soon take place," and "behold I come quickly," those were the intent of the author for those folk then under that which they were going through then. We read those words today as if they were written three days ago instead of to others two thousand years ago for reasons and in circumstances that are not ours today. It is very easy to read the NT that way and we do it all the time. It may be a mistake and the reason others have had to add concepts to the scripture and reexplain what "soon" and "shortly" must mean for us today. The apologetic was "for a day with the lord is as a thousand years and a thousand years as a day." People way back in the day were noticing (not scoffing..that's the authors definition) that things are not working out as advertised. The author of II Peter accused them of accusing God of slackness concerning promises. The answer was typical of nice hopes gone south for the time being. "God does not see as you see." "There is a way that seems right unto a man but the way thereof ends in death." "The wisdom of man is foolishness with God." and "My ways are not your ways saith the Eternal." It's a very common and oft used way of saying "oops, seems not to be unfolding as we had taught."
**Please understand I realize fully that this view of scripture is my own based on my own years of study and considerations of past views. It is not my intent to offend or confuse anyone on this topic.
Contact Dennis at DennisCDiehl@aol.com