Friday, February 27, 2015

Flippant Living Church of God Correspondence Dept. Rude Replies To Questions About Members Being Disfellowshipped Without Recourse

From a reader here:

Some of the victims of the recent LCG purge actually wanted to stay in  LCG

I know someone who met a few of them at the UCG Feast. My friend wrote  LCG to ask how they justify kicking people out without offering counseling or making attempts to "help" these supposed sinners.  He was shocked at the flippant, rude replies given by the LCG Correspondence Department (an LCG minister).


John Doe Question:
Hello. I met exLCG members at the Feast this year (UCG) that said they were disfellowshipped and marked for having a bad attitude. They also claimed that nobody tried to help them or counsel with them. My question is what is your policy on disfellowshipping/marking members? Do you try to help members that go astray? Is a negative attitude enough of an offense or do you have to commit adultery or something like that? Thank you.

LCG Reply:
The Living Church of God does not arbitrarily disfellowship or mark individuals. These things happen because of individuals not obeying God, or causing division or other disruptions in the Church. It has been our experience that talking with disfellowshipped members will always result in them stating they were unfairly and unjustly put out of the Church. We can assure you that this is not the practice of God’s Church.

If you need further information, please let us know.


John Doe Reply:
I can imagine that it is usually true that getting kicked out would result in the person or people feeling upset and negative. These people seemed to be sad more than anything else. My concern was that they seemed to be converted and they seemed like kind people so it lead us to wonder what kind of horrible thing they might have done that would result in an immediate disfellowshipping without a minister trying to counsel or help them in any way. We decided that they would be in jail if it was something that bad and they were at the Feast so they obviously weren't child molesters or killers. That leaves us wondering what kind of offense would result in a converted family getting kicked out?  I'm sure you can’t say. But I still wondered 2 things that your email didn't answer. Does LCG disfellowship/mark members without trying to counsel them first? What type of offense warrants disfellowshipping/ marking church members? It seems like you would try everything possible to help before giving up a member as "Gods Church". Maybe these people are good actors and we were fooled. It has made us and our friends curious and we have thought of them many times since getting home from the feast. If these people want to be with you it seems like they would be helped instead of removed. I would think that Christian love would cause their minister to do everything possible to keep them in the church and to help them, not keep them out when they obviously want back in.

Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions

LCG Reply:
The question we ask is why would you think that the ministry would not do all of those things? That is what ministering means. Yes, we are supposed to be forgiving, but we are still given the task of protecting the flock. How would you personally respond to what God inspired Solomon to write in Proverbs 6:16-19?

Your further statement seems to indicate that these people were not treated fairly, that ministry did not try to help them. Why would you state that, if you were not being influenced by the individual(s) themselves. Isn’t that a fair question for us to ask of you? You “seemed” convinced that they were “converted.” People can be converted and still be in bad attitude and cause division because they feel their position is righteous. Paul’s epistles are full of these types of issues. Would these people admit that they were guilty of causing discord, etc,?

Please don’t be misled, the Church takes itself very seriously in these matters. Jesus warned that to offend one of the little ones, it would be better to tie a millstone around the neck and be cast into the sea.

You are asking us to answer a matter without full knowledge of the circumstances.

John Doe Reply:
I wouldn't "think that ministry would not do all those things". That is precisely why I took the time to write you in the first place. I only had one side of the story and I wanted to know if it was true. I was serious when I said that I have thought about attending with LCG in the past. I have been disappointed with character traits that became apparent after the UCG split. I'm looking for evidence of the fruits of the Spirit and Philadelphian love.

I am not being "influenced" by these people like you say. I can find the facts and make decisions on my own. I also did not see anything in them that indicated that they had a "bad attitude". They didn't say anything bad or negative about anyone in LCG.

The only reason I thought they weren't counseled is because they said they were disfellowshipped and marked without being counseled. Are you saying that they lied about that fact? I didn't include their names in my original email because I assumed that you would not be willing to discuss the details of other people with a stranger. I was only asking in broad generality if LCG would kick people out without first trying to help them and if so, what circumstances would warrant such a severe reaction. I thought that you knew who I was talking about because I would think that there wouldn't be too many people disfellowshipped/marked right before the feast. So I also assumed that you did in fact know the circumstances. Its fine though.

It seems like your answers will be non-direct, evasive and somewhat offensive. It seems accusatory of you to say that I am being "influenced" by them.  I wasn't trying to be argumentative. I was trying to get both sides to make a fair judgment on these people like the Bible instructs me to. At this point I have their word and you answering my questions with questions! I don't like feeling like I'm on the defensive for asking a simple question so I will leave it at that and not bother you again.  They answered our questions openly and directly. It didn't seem like they had anything to hide. Your evasiveness makes it look like you are hiding something. I pray that you did try to help them because it is very serious indeed if you turned away a family of little ones without trying to work one-on-one with them first!

LCG Reply:
Thank you for completing the circle.

John Doe Reply:
I clearly won’t need to look in the direction of LCG in my search for a church with Godly character and Philadelphian love. This has been a surreal experience! I wish I knew who you were so that I could share your immaturity and flippant attitude with your superiors. Is this how Christ would have responded to a potential church member who was asking a genuine question in peace? I don't think so. If you do, you know a different Christ than I do! My opinion of LCG has been greatly molded by my correspondence with you Sir. Thank you.

LCG Reply:
Thank you.


Anonymous said...

Probably Gary Ehman, or some such figure in LCG.

Standard line: "You don't think like us, so you're wrong." Or some such nonsense.

Gotta love the "because of individuals not obeying God" line as a reason for disfellowshipment. Left unsaid: "We are the arbiters of such obedience."

It's all such silliness.

Anonymous said...

Wow, the LCG answers are pissy and arrogant.
If you question they automatically assume there is something wrong with you.
That has been C of G's bad attitude for years now.
The churches are not interested in seeking the lost, healing the wounded or restoring a brother.
It is very sad.

Anonymous said...

The ministers in Living and United are the same guys who disfellowshiped many of us from the WWCG because we 'held fast' to what we came into the church believing, ie, sabbath, holy days, etc.
There same guys are now the core of Living and United and never apologized for what they did to us at all.
They are all mostly hirelings who want a job and a pay check but have no idea of how to love in the way Christ does.

Byker Bob said...

The only thing that is important in an ACOG is authority. If you question authority, attempt to evaluate it, hold it accountable, or even prayerfully seek to better understand why they do the things they do, that very attitude is grounds for disfellowshipment. And, of course, that is practically the definition of the concept of the cult. If you buy into their particular brand of gnosticism, then you are automatically stuck with this inflexible authority!


Silence said...

Typical COG bullshit. If you challenge the ministry, clearly you've been influenced by divisive, evil forces, because there's otherwise never a reason to question the leadership.

Fucking cults.

Anonymous said...

No one should consider LCG. All you get is condescending sermons from a good old boy network. And don't forget the pervert at the top who must always include some type of sex act in every sermon. Or fondling Billy in the Bermuda grass back in Joplin.

Anonymous said...

What's funny is that if it were a millionaire being interacted with, behind the scenes the LCG ministers would be working overtime getting boners and coming up with strategies to "help" this person find the truth in a more easy way than regular members are.

Just as the WCG cult did it with Bobby Fischer, Scientology does it via their Celebrity Centre targeting high value converts.

Heck, there's even a sleazy Christian megachurch targeting Justin Bieber right now!

Anonymous said...

I wrote to the LCG concerning the doctrine of "soul sleep" and the passage in Rev. 6:9-11 where those who were killed during the Tribulation asked, "How long before You judge and avenge our blood." Obviously, there is consciousness after death. The writer from LCG responded by writing, "Their speaking had to be a characterization of their speaking. In other words, it was not real. It was imaginary speaking, not real speaking. The writers were characterizing what they felt they would be saying."
I wrote back and asked, "What rule of interpretation did you use to arrive at that understanding?" The writer was Randall Kobernat, a long time pastor and graduate of AC. When I told him who some of my favorite authors were (Norman Geisler, Rabbi Joseph Telushkin, etc.)I asked him who some of his favorite authors and books were. The only ones he mentioned were those produced by AC. He must have been well indoctrinated for many years and has too much invested in the system to either question it or drop out.

Anonymous said...

Dear ACoGs,

You have ignored me from the beginning. I have tried to work with you, but you are too arrogant for me to deal with. I really wish you would change your attitude and repent. Maybe then I could help you and even offer you redemption. As it is, sadly, you are going to go into the lake of fire.

Don't say I didn't warn you.


Anonymous said...


"It has been our experience that talking with disfellowshipped members will ALWAYS result in them stating they were unfairly and unjustly put out of the Church. [emphasis mine]"

Because we're clairvoyant and can judge matters before we hear them.

Proverbs 18:13 To answer before listening — that is folly and shame.

"We decided that they would be in jail if it was something that bad and they were at the Feast so they obviously weren't child molesters or killers."

Since when did crimes like murder or child molesting constitute grounds for disfellowshipment? I know of two such cases personally, and I don't think the church gave two hoots. (Hint: the founder was guilty of child molestation...)

Matthew 12:31 And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but [questioning the ministry] will not be forgiven.

Anonymous said...

The last John Doe reply was: "... I clearly won’t need to look in the direction of LCG in my search for a church with Godly character and Philadelphian love. This has been a surreal experience! I wish I knew who you were so that I could share your immaturity and flippant attitude with your superiors. Is this how Christ would have responded to a potential church member who was asking a genuine question in peace? I don't think so. If you do, you know a different Christ than I do! My opinion of LCG has been greatly molded by my correspondence with you Sir. Thank you..."

Good reply. This shows that John Doe, assuming he is part of the brethren and not a tare passing through, properly applied the following instruction:

“Now I beseech you, BRETHREN, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.” Romans 16:17

Brethren aren't all located in the Living group...they, part of an organism, are in a scattered


Anonymous said...

Folks, we know for a fact that the Bible is not the 'Word of God'.

It's sad that this and other churches keep trying to sell that notion in their efforts to manipulate people.

The LCG and many others have even less scruples than that of used car salesmen.

Anonymous said...

And there's a song for this....

Anonymous said...

You folks who have been disfellowshipped now have a unique opportunity to improve your life.

ISIS and Scientology are now recruiting.

Anonymous said...

I attend LCG and I know these people. It has been troublesome to watch. I've asked around and no one knows exactly why they were marked. They were friendly, generous and faithful to LCG since its formation. I ran into them at the movie theater one night and they told me that they don't know what happened. I asked if they were part of the Book of Enoch crowd and they said no. They were slandered in a video sermon which ended up being taken off the internet because of Meredith's fears of another Dorothy McNair suit. It was hard for a lot of us to listen to that sermon knowing that much of it wasn't true. Many of us continued our friendships with them despite being told not to. We know they are not bad people. There are quite a number of us disgusted by the pharisetical treatment of this family and by the direction LCG is going but there is nowhere else to go so we stay.

"The question we ask is why would you think that the ministry would not do all of those things? That is what ministering means."

Yes, that is what ministering means. It would be better to put that millstone around your neck and cast yourself into the sea than to do what you are doing.

Please spare me the hateful comments about being a member of a COG. I don't know where else to go.

NO2HWA said...

Thanks for sharing your comments about this sad situation. While we may be extremely negative towards the leaders in various COG's, we are not that way with the members...except maybe with Pack and Flurry's blind devotee's. I am more than willing to share stories like this from any group that takes advantage of members. Any submission can be anonymous.

NO2HWA said...

Notice: I will not post personal attacks towards members of LCG that may be participating in this conversation.

Anonymous said...

I can almost guarantee that this is Gary Ehman. This is exactly like the condescending shit he says in real life. My parents have had several run ins with this piece of shit. Meredith knows how abusive this guy is and does nothing!

Anonymous said...

When Living was still "Global" they had a minister on the east coast teaching that Jesus Christ was a black man and that he knew this because the peyos(side locks)he wore were really dreadlocks like Rastafarians.
Members told HQ about this weirdness but were ignored. The only time HQ acted was when members asked questions. Then all hell would break loose and long sermons about submission to authority were given.
It is very sad that this happens.
Many members are good people who love Christ and want to do what is right.

Anonymous said...

There are quite a number of us disgusted by the pharisetical treatment of this family and by the direction LCG is going but there is nowhere else to go so we stay.

Nowhere else to go? You give your tithes to LCG to fund this abuse of brethren, then wonder why there is nowhere else to go? If you were tithing to actual shepherds, you would find God giving you wonderful pastures. Instead, you give your tithes and offerings to support a "church" that is nothing more than a family business that uses and abuses people until they are no longer useful, then spits them out.

This family that was summarily disfellowshipped? If they are the family I think they are, they are the family that Meredith pressured to give literally millions of dollars by getting legal help to break the terms of a trust fund awarded as part of a legal settlement. Meredith fawned over this family when he thought they would give him literally millions of dollars. As soon as he found out the money wouldn't go to him, he started looking for ways to get rid of them.

Right now, LCG HQ has one employee who would have already been fired if he hadn't received a big inheritance from a deceased parent. This employee is in a tough position. If he doesn't give enough money, he will eventually be fired, but if he does give enough money so he no longer has much more to give, he will also be fired.

I know this may be hard to believe for people unfamiliar with LCG. But if you ask Charlotte church members, they will confirm it and more.

Why is Jim Meredith watching NCIS while his father tells members not to watch violent/sexual TV programs?

Why does LCG tolerate tobacco use among some ministers, but refuse to baptize new members who use tobacco?

Why does LCG tolerate drunken behavior by employees and big tithers, but disfellowship members whose prescribed medication leaves them woozy in public?

Why? Because, just as with Gerald Flurry and Dave Pack, enough LCG members identify with the tyrannical abusive leadership... until that leadership turns against them.

LCG is a social club run by bullies, with a group of "cool kids" as paying members who are trying to make the club into something it will never be for as long as these cool kids keep enabling the bullies.

Lake of Fire Church of God said...

Anonymous February 27, 2015 at 8:18 AM quoted LCG minister Randall Kobernat saying “The writers were characterizing what they felt they would be saying.” I wrote back and asked, "What rule of interpretation did you use to arrive at that understanding?" The writer was Randall Kobernat, a long time pastor and graduate of AC.

MY COMMENT – If the doctrine of "soul sleep" were true and literal (and Armstrongites love to make everything in the Bible literal), then the writer of the Book of Revelation, John, would not have written the characterization of what they felt they would be saying because it would be irrelevant - the dead know nothing or feel nothing according to "soul sleep". If it really is a characterization, then where does the Armstrongites draw the line between literal interpretation versus allegory or non-literal interpretation?

Wow! There is a name out of my 1960s WCG past. In the late 1960s, Randy Kobernat was a WCG preaching elder with a church circuit in North Carolina. Our Washington D.C./Baltimore, Md. Pastor was Ken Westby who was also a WCG Church District Superintendent that included the Carolinas. I have recollection of Randy Kobernat preaching in Washington, D.C. as a guest speaker on a couple occasions when there were district ministerial conferences held in Washington, D.C. I didn’t realize he was still around in Armstrongism let alone which of the 700 splinters he might have gone to. Like all WCG ministers and AC graduates from the 1960s and 1970s, these Armstrongite ministers are growing old and aging.


Anonymous said...

Richard said, "AC graduates are growing old and aging." Indeed we are. I graduated from AC in 73, left in 74. Those who do not agree with LCG and say because they don't know where else to go, I hope they are not still tithing. To do so is to be a co conspirator, financially supporting an abusive organization. They don't know where else to go? How about a small group of believers meeting in your homes like the NT church did? What to do with their money? How about James 1:27, help take care of those in need. I help support an orphanage in Tanzania and go there to teach theology each year. Didn't Jesus say that whatever you do to the least of these, you do to me?

Anonymous said...

LCG is exactly like Flury now. They tell the members who they can and cannot associate with and the members blindly follow without question. Even when they have known blacklisted people as good for years and have grown very close to them.

It is very un-Godly. God is about love, forgiveness and family not the kind of crap these dictators are pulling.

LCG preaches that, even if you disagree or "don't understand", you must submit to and obey the ministry. To do anything else or to question their (bad) decisions is "causing division". No one wants to be the next victim of McNair so they all sit there in silence and watch good people get squashed like bugs. Like deer in headlights.

Meredith knows not the way of peace, mercy and meekness. He only knows how to come out swinging until his opponent is on the ground (he used to be a golden gloves boxer in Joplin you know). He may keep the letter of the law, but it is plain to see that he doesn't keep the spirit of the law.

Even now his health is failing. He has asked for prayers because he "feels weaker by the day". In some ways I feel sorry for him. He's been given so many chances to learn the character of Christ but yet he's still just a vengeful, self-absorbed, insecure, know-it-all. It's like he hasn't changed or grown spiritually at all in the past 65 years.

Number 3 in all the universe? I think not. He will have to make atonement for all the families he's destroyed and all the lies he has told. He would be lucky to wash the feet of the Kings and priests in the Kingdom!

Anonymous said...

Anytime friendship is conditional to membership in a group and NOT character... You might be in a the wrong church.

Anytime you are expected to give all your money, break trust funds, etc... You might be in the wrong church.

Anytime you are made to fear negative repercussions for daring to question authority when they aren't acting according to Biblical principles... You might be in the wrong church.

Anonymous said...

What's even more sad is that the family has been done this way but they still want back in

Anonymous said...

He may keep the letter of the law, but it is plain to see that he doesn't keep the spirit of the law.

He has hired caterers to come and serve at LCG events at their headquarters on the Sabbath. Even most of the ACOG leaders who say it's OK to go to restaurants make a distinction about paying food service workers to come into your home or workplace to serve you on the Sabbath. How is that keeping the letter but not the spirit of the law?

He has lied so often that people have lost count. One of his favorite tactics is to spread division between two people is by telling each one lies about the other. Of course, as soon as those two people compare notes, they find that Meredith has lied to them both, and his tactic fails. How is that keeping the letter but not the spirit of the law?

He plainly covets the assets of those with money. Because of this, he fawns over people he hopes will give him money, and he even tolerates their law-breaking, while casting out widows who are struggling. How is that keeping the letter but not the spirit of the law?

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. HWA was spot-on in 1980 in his letter assessing Meredith's lack of character. What a shame it is that Meredith has not grown in any noticeable way in the last 35 years.

Anonymous said...

When you think about it, the fact that these groups insist on being called "Church of God" is pretty amazing.

That's appropriating God's name. It's asserting that the organization is literally "of God," and therefore has God's direct endorsement.

Of course, they then go on to make mistake after mistake and teach error after error. They play politics, and play favorites, and repeatedly treat people with disregard and disdain.

Call yourself Cornerstone Church, or Community Church, or 12th Street Church, or whatever you want. There's nothing wrong with calling yourself a congregation, implying that you come together to worship and praise and do the best you can in that regard.

But calling yourself a church "of God" or "of Christ" or, even more presumptuously, "God's Church," not only sets an impossible standard, but also shows a total lack of respect for other groups who don't.

Signing letters " Jesus' name" doesn't do them any favors, either.

Byker Bob said...

Not knowing where to go, in some cases, simply means being uncomfortable anywhere else but in an ACOG splinter. It can be, but not always is, the result of believing 100% in the "proofs" or proof texting activities which have been presented in the system taught by Herbert W. Armstrong.

I was inspired by the poster who noticed that there do seem to be two distinct Biblical models for what happens to humans immediately following death. And, yet, Armstrongism ignores the model presented in Revelation, and teaches 100% soul sleep. Just noting this profound difference is a huge gateway, in so many ways, because it opens the mind to additional study in other areas, such as the accuracy of the "history of the true church", British Israelism, whether tithing was ever intended to be based upon money, or even the way the sabbath is calculated today by fixed calendar, as opposed to the ancient (pre-Hillel II) numbering of the days by the rabbis based strictly upon first sighting of the new moon.

I really hope that the vast number of ACOG members are continuing to study, to test, and to prove or disprove what has been taught to them. There really is no moral imperative to remain within a predatory group that oppresses people, that commandeers their entire financial picture, or that represses or restricts their informational intake, just based on the fact that the group's leader continues to uphold the Armstrong traditions. There is nothing wrong with being a "Lone Ranger" (independent) Christian!


Unknown said...

Your evasiveness makes it look like you are hiding something...

Exactly right! Typical devil ploy. Also making you question your own critical thinking skills, twisting the REAL truth...all of Satan. Leave them alone everyone. It will be for your own good and their final demise.

Anonymous said...

As I figure it, they're doing everyone a favor with this. Now if only they would do the remaining membership the same favor...

Seriously, with every person they disfellowship, their organization draws ever closer to the "gates of hell." May they prevail against Armstrongism sooner rather than later.

Redfox712 said...

Good on this person for revealing LCG's attitude regarding disfellowshipping LCG members.

I do not have the slightest doubt that those disfellowshipped out of LCG must have viewed it as an ordeal.

These abuses of authority are not aberrations but are an integral part of how Armstrongite groups operate. This is also true with other high demand groups.

Alas there will be more shenanigans like this. I see no sign that LCG's leaders will change to stop these abuses of power. This will happen again.

Anonymous said...

As I understand it, in Jewish synagogues a rabbi has the ability to temporarily suspend someone immediately to take care of a situation on his/her sayso, but that the maximum suspension is 6 months and then there is review by the congregation, or representatives of the congregation, whichever it is, before any suspension can exceed 6 months or be made permanent. In this way there is some protection against injustices.
Courting wealthy donors and tithe-payers is an old story in the COGs, going back to the beginning. Remember the story about HWA's original church, the Oregon Conference of the Church of God, requiring HWA to teach clean and unclean meats to persons before they were converted before baptizing them? That was HWA's version--and how he refused, because he believed in letting people grow in the knowledge of the truth, etc and etc. so he was kicked out of the Oregon Conference ministry over that. Translate that: a well-off family invited HWA to dinner, and not knowing any better, served pork. HWA to be polite took and ate a small amount of what was served without saying anything. When HWA's lay-member controlled employer the Oregon Conference learned of this they expressed objection. But HWA had a "live one", a wealthy tithe-payer in those Depression days, and traded up from the meagre salary paid by the Oregon Conference. Tithing--that steady revenue stream--is what it was ALL about, underneath everything else, then and today for most of the COGs.

Anonymous said...

“Remember the story about HWA's original church, the Oregon Conference of the Church of God, requiring HWA to teach clean and unclean meats to persons before they were converted before baptizing them? That was HWA's version--and how he refused, because he believed in letting people grow in the knowledge of the truth, etc and etc.”

Frankly, I always thought that HWA was wrong in this case. Why not just show people things like Leviticus chapter 11. Why not tell people what your church teaches before they join it? Why sucker them in first and then hit them with all sorts of ideas that will be totally new and strange to them? This sort of behavior reminds me of one tricky, young, new car salesman who would not even tell me what the price of the car was unless I first agreed to buy it. It was a weird sales trick that was going around the dealerships at the time, but it was still outrageous, and I did not go along with it.

How times change! By the time of HWA's death in 1986, prospective WCG members were expected to read HWA's last book called Mystery Of The Ages before being baptized, even though his story about his proud refusal to obey the COG7 and tell people what that church taught before baptizing them was still in his Autobiography. Prospective WCG members were by that point also expected to believe that HWA was the one prophesied to come in the spirit and power of Elijah.

In David Pack's RCG prospective members who were previously in the WCG were expected to read more than 1,500 pages of material from DCP's so-called “Splinter Explanation Package” first. With DCP's recent major doctrinal changes, much of this will now have to be revised or deleted and rewritten. This is a great way for people to be ever learning but never coming to a knowledge of the real truth. After teaching for the past 14 years that HWA was Elijah, DCP suddenly decided in 2015 to promote HWA to being Moses so he could raise himself to the position of Elijah. So, even when some people do tell you what to believe before you join them, it can all still change in a moment at any moment.

Anonymous said...

I attended GCG/LCG for nearly twenty years. I would sayy that for the first 10 years or so of the organization's existence, there was a sense of love among the people and the leadership (aka ministry). However, early in the 2000's, things began to change. The organization as a whole began to adopt a very legalistic approach to "church government" - it was the topic of almost nearly every sermon in one way or another. The mantra began, "thou shalt obey thy minister" and essentially, "God will not allow you into the Kingdom unless you're loyal to his ministry." Anyone vying for a position made it clear from the pulpit that they were on board with the "government" message. It was as though they wrote "government" on a stick and started beating people over the head with it. It was disgusting. The politicking was beyond nauseating. There may still be some love among some of the people who are genuine, but it was clear, there was no, or very little, love for the people from the leadership. I eventually left the organization entirely.

Byker Bob said...

Yes, 8:52, somehow Jewish people have historically derived a sense of justice and compassion from the Old Covenant, one that somehow didn't transfer into Armstrongism along with the sabbath, holy days, tithing, and clean meats.

Where in the ACOGs do we find the moral equivalent of farmers round cutting the corners of their fields deliberately to provide for unknown needy persons? That's some pretty heavy stuff!

If these people who were disfellowshipped had beat up and urinated on the minister who disfellowshipped them, perhaps we would see the wisdom in purging them from the congregation without any sort of due process. But, they don't do that. They feel hurt, and don't understand what has happened to them. They lost their friends, and are probably very much worried about the Tribulation and Lake of Fire. Fortunately, as perhaps they will discover, they need not worry about these two events. LCG is not the gatekeeper that they profess to be.


Anonymous said...

I too knew these people. They prepared meals for and visited the sick. They opened their home to travelers with abundant hospitality. They helped virtual strangers be able to attend the Feast. They helped widows.

Anonymous said...

Anon 7:27 you are spot on.

Meredith tolerates anything from a church member as long as they are funding his family business/ LCG with generous tithes and offerings.

I know of one LCG headquarters crony who is known world-wide for being a scam artist. It is well documented ( but since he makes a lot of money doing it and pays Meredith 10% plus, he can do just about anything and get away with it.

Christian character and integrity don't matter in that organization.

Money and blind obedience will earn you a free pass to behave as poorly as you like.

As far as the rudeness of the LCG replies in the original post, are people really that surprised? These men think they are rulers of the universe; incapable of err. They are so puffed up on themselves that nothing shocks me anymore from any of the groups.

Anonymous said...

Judging from the number of Charlotte, NC hits on the map every hour, LCG must be losing it over this shit!

I almost feel sorry for the even tighter crack down that Meredith's congregation will likely suffer as a result.

I'm sure they will say something to the effect that Satan is attacking them via this blog because they are the work of God and therefore under assault.

They lack the self awareness to ponder the fact that THEIR UNGODLY BEHAVIOR could possible be the root cause.

Anonymous said...

March 2, 2015 at 7:13 AM Anonymous posted about this person (

This guy is really something! His wife is the one who told the lies that got the people disfellowshipped. She was the whole instigator of it. She has always been jealous of them. And pretended to be her friend but always talked bad about her behind her back. Now she is still lying about them to cover up her lies. She wants to "Be Somebody" at LCG. The whole HQ has become a cesspool of backbiting, lies, and stabbing each other in the back so they can “Be Somebody.” The problem was they had more money than she did and always helped people and she was jealous of them.

Anonymous said...

Hello I will remain anonymous to protect those that may be involved indirectly. ...I witnessed a female in the LCG that was sowing discord with the brethren many times and would have outbursts of anger and accusations of her imagination....the ministry tried counseling with her and she would be okay for a while and start again blaming everything on not taking her meds...I know she was coddled and all trying to appease her trying to be careful of saying possibly the wrong thing that may set her off etc. That last outburst I recall was addressed by local and regional pastors and she was so obstinate with ministry so she was told that maybe she should set out of church and pray about the situation and study God's WORD an then when ready she could counsel again before she come back to services....her husband then was upset and said if they were kicking her out of the church then he would not come back either..she never wanted to counsel because she never contacted ministry back to counsel.  They were telling others that they were kicked out of church, but that was not a fact. They dis-fellow-shipped themselves...we all loved and cared about them very much and was saddened by them not wanting to be here with us....personally I felt that some were making excuses for the reason for her outbursts..and not holding her to be accountable for her own decisions to act and behave herself the way she did....I have witnessed her behavior being much better when she wanted to and I think they sincerely want to change and be God's servants but I think satan is heavy on them and does not want to loose them...I know I have prayed lots for them and wanted God to be more involved in their lives. When one feeds the wrong know what happens, But God's will be done...I wish the best for them all...