Saturday, May 27, 2017

Five Years Ago A Church of God Leader Lied To His Members

It has been five years since a self-appointed lying false prophet made a statement to his members that was regarded as fact.  This is nothing new to the Church of God though.  COG leaders have been lying to their members for decades with one false prophecy and teaching after another. Not once in the 80 some years of the current configuration of the COG has any leader or minister utter a single true prophecy.  From the King of the North to the King of the South, to invading Germans, rampaging Chinese and Muslims, concentration camps, Fatima and Mayan prophecies to the precise date Jesus is supposed to return.

It was five years ago that one of the COG's biggest liars (till Dave Pack and Bob Thiel hit the scene full throttle) made the prediction that on this day, May 27, 2012, Jesus was returning in all his glory.

Ron Weinland made the prediction that the creature he calls "christ" would return on May 27, 2012. When it failed to happen Ron had his excuses ready, just like all COG leaders have done for decades.

It just struck me today what day it is…………today’s the day the world was supposed to be changed forever five years ago, but it turned out to be the day when almost everyone in PKG had their lives turned upside-down. 
Yup—–May 27, 2012 was to be THE DAY that Ron claimed Jesus Christ would return, but instead it was a big “nothingburger” and a lot of us were looking up to the sky (at noon on May 26), and a HUGE letdown was to follow. I still remember a flurry of emails going back and forth, and one of them was from Johnny Harrell letting everyone know to calm down and Ron will be sure to have a sermon to explain what happened. 
Ron gave a very interesting sermon that day looking back, and I truly believe he had that sermon pre-written out. IIRC, late in the day Ron posted on his blog a lengthy “explanation” of what happened, and how “heavy of heart” he was. The very next day, he gave a lengthy sermon expounding on what he wrote the day before. 
I can’t believe he came up with all of that on the fly, and the more I think about it, Ron could have had that sermon written as far back as 2008 when he made the first “change” from 2011 to 2012. He knew that there’s no way it would happen despite believing it with “all his being”.
Just the same, life has certainly gone on for me, but this is one of those days I’ll never forget for as long as I’m walking the planet. I got to see firsthand all the damage that was done to people’s lives, and if nothing else it certainly was an eye opener into how deceptive people can be. It still would take me 2 and half years to finally wave goodbye to PKG and get on with the rest of my life.
I had a hard chuckle from a co-worker today (overtime) as I was telling her what had happened back then. She said, “You mean all this was supposed to happen? I wouldn’t have had to come into work today——–I hate when that happens!”
I got a good laugh, but five years ago it was no laughing matter! 
So here we are with 2017 about halfway over, and still no earth shaking events to make one stop and pause. 2018 will be on our doorstep before you know it, and Ron will be proven wrong YET AGAIN when 2019 comes and goes without so much as a whimper. 
And there will still be those that will swallow the “disclaimer” hook, line, and sinker. 
So sad…………… From Don't drink the flavor aid
Herbert Armstrong lied to the church when he said the Christ would be returning in 1975.  For his "christ" to return in 1975, the church needed to flee to Petra on January 7, 2012.   Who can forget that even prior to this Herbert started preparations for building his monument to himself, the Ambassador Auditorium, with groundbreaking in 1972.  Deep down he knew he was wrong, just like every single one of the COG leaders who lie today knows.

Not only did he lie then, he did it countless times previously:
"...the year 1936 will see the end of the Times of the Gentiles.... we may expect the present worldwide depression, time of trouble and fear of war to continue until the year 1936!... quickly after that time, we may expect to see the heavenly signs of the sun and moon becoming dark, the stars falling.... which shall be followed by the 'Day of the Lord." (The Plain Truth, June-July 1934, Herbert Armstrong, p. 5) 
"...Armageddon, we believe, must be at least three or four years away..." ("Democracy Doomed!" The Plain Truth, April-May 1940, Herbert W. Armstrong)
" a few years NONE OF US will be living in our present homes—EVERYTHING material we possess now will be swept away from will strike DURING THIS PRESENT GENERATION—it cannot now be more than A FEW YEARS... (Herbert W. Armstrong, Co-Worker letter, December 8, 1947) 
"Now HERE IS SOMETHING STARTLING! Herman Hoeh, in his eye-opening article you will read in the June number of The PLAIN TRUTH on the Times of the Gentiles shows that the Times of the Gentiles—if chronologies are correct—will come to their final end in the year 1982." .............
"Now if this chronology is correct, that means Christ shall return some very few years PRIOR to1982! NO MAN KNOWS THE DAY, HOUR, OR YEAR OF CHRIST'S RETURN. But we CAN know exact dates of one or two other events." ...........
"IF THE TIMES OF THE GENTILES END IN 1982, in October, as Mr. Hoeh has it figured, THE INVASION OF AMERICA AND THE GREAT TRIBULATION MUST BEGIN NOT LATER THAT MARCH-APRIL, 1972!" (Herbert W. Armstrong, Co-Worker letter, May 22, 1953)
"Indications of prophecy are that this drought ... will strike sooner than 1975— probably between 1965 and 1972!" ... "Yes, millions of lukewarm inactive professing Christians will suffer MARTYRDOM—and that before the anticipated push-button leisure-year of 1975 dawns upon us!" (1975 in Prophecy, 1956, pp. 10, 20, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"You're going to be shocked to read what goes on undercover in the United States. Five major vices threaten the total collapse of our country inside of 20 years. The handwriting is on the wall of America, now!" ("U.S.A. Riding to Total Collapse in 20 Short Years!" [subtitled: "Here are the naked FACTS that ought to astonish and shock you into immediate action.] (The Plain Truth, February 1956, Herbert W. Armstrong)
[After fostering many scare tactics in the article concerning how many in the U.S.A. are going to die of famine, pestilence and war "in less than 20 years," he goes on to say:]
"I've shown you from the very word of God what is next coming in prophesied events...It's prophesied for 15 to 20 years or less." ("U.S.A. Riding to Total Collapse in 20 Short Years!" (Ibid.)
"God prophecies that finally, within the next fifteen years, fully ONE THIRD of our whole population will die of disease and famine." (The Plain Truth, December 1957, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"We are just coming now to the grand smash climax of this whole age when there are far more prophecies--far more world shaking events--to happen in the next 15 or 20 yearsthan ever happened before in the history of the world!" (The Proof of the Bible, 1958, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"I say to YOU, now, that your money—your home—every material thing you have—will be taken from you SOON—probably in 12 to 13 years, certainly in 15 or less!" (Herbert W. Armstrong, August 13, 1959 Co-Worker letter)
"In 12 years or less the U.S.A. will suffer the worst depression ever suffered by any nation." (Herbert W. Armstrong, December 1960 Co-Worker letter)
"We may now have only eight or nine more years to FINISH His Work!" (Herbert W. Armstrong, October 27, 1963 Co-Worker letter)
"In eight years all of our ministers will be silenced!" (November 23, 1963 sermon, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"Somewhere along about seven to ten years from now the REVOLUTION IN THE WEATHER will become a national and international calamity. Drought, epidemic of disease, will reap a mountain harvest of death across North America--and in Britain." (The Plain Truth, January 1963, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"We may have an occasional good year in the weather, but the trend in general will continue until--probably by 1971-1972--it will become an acute disaster, especially to the United States, Canada, Britain and Australia." (The Plain Truth, January 1964, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"We are in the grand smash climax--only six more years left." (Co-Worker letter, December 13, 1965, Herbert W. Armstrong)
WE MAY HAVE ONLY ONE OR TWO MORE YEARS LEFT TO FINISH THE WORK THE LIVING CHRIST IS DOING THROUGH HIS CHURCH! Time is running out on us! It is now FAR later than you think! (Herbert W. Armstrong, Co-Worker letter, June 27, 1966)
"The God who is REAL says of OUR PEOPLES: 'Prophecy against the prophets of Israel . . . O Israel, thy prophets are like the foxes of the deserts. Ye have not gone up into the gaps, neither made up a hedge for the House of Israel TO STAND in the BATTLE IN THE DAY OF THE ETERNAL (Ezek. 13:1-5).' That is NOT a message to ancient Israel—but to OUR NATIONS TODAY. The 'DAY OF THE ETERNAL'—a time foretold in more than thirty prophecies—is going to strike between 5 and 10 years from now! You will know, then, how REAL it is. You will wish, then, you had heeded. I am not writing foolishly, but very soberly, ON AUTHORITY of the living CHRIST!" ("HOW the U.S. Can END the Vietnam WAR . . . NOW!" (The Plain Truth, Feb. 1967, p. 47, Herbert W. Armstrong)
"A STAGGERING TURN in world events is due to erupt in the next four to seven years. It will involve violently the United States, Britain, Western Europe, the Middle East." (The United States and British Commonwealth in Prophecy, Introduction, 1967, p. IX, Herbert W. Armstrong)3
"Now, other prophecies reveal, we are to have soon (probably in about four years) such drought, and famine, that disease epidemics will follow taking millions of lives ... Well, we have been getting foretastes of that! That condition is coming! And I do not mean in 400 years—nor in 40 years—but in the very next FOUR or FIVE!" (Ibid., p.184)
"You need to look at the prophecies of Jesus of Jeremiah, of Isaiah, and others, describing how much more INTENSE is to be the punishment God is going to lay on the British and American people in five to seven more years!" (Ibid., p. 185)
"If that unseen Hand does not exist, humanity will not survive on earth another 25 years, or less! I know whereof I speak, for no organization on earth has a more knowledgeable grasp and understanding of world conditions, trends, and causes, than ours. ..." (The Ambassador College Correspondence Course, Lesson 5, 1969, p. 15)
"There is very little time remaining. You now know only a minority of humanity will remain alive just a few years from now
"During this generation--within 60 to 90 years or less-from 1927--Christ will come again..." (Herbert W. Armstrong, Co-Worker letter, January 20, 1977) 
"The actual movement of world events as prophesied WARNS US that all this MAY now occur in the decade we entered day before yesterday--and, if delayed past 1990, most certainly during the decade of the 90s." (Herbert W. Armstrong, Co-Worker Letter, January 3, 1980)
"The Plain Truth brings you UNDERSTANDING of the very Word of God, the SOURCE of TRUTH--and of the PROPHECIES of events soon to occur, in the next two, five or 10 years!" (The Plain Truth, September 1984, Personal from Herbert W. Armstrong)
Right up to the end of his life Herbert Armstrong continued to make false predictions. Here is just one quote from his Mystery of the Ages
"And, secondly, to reveal—preserved in writing for us TODAY—what is to happen "in the latter days"—actually within the next two decades—THIS LAST HALF OF THE TWENTIETH CENTURY! (Mystery of the Ages, Herbert W. Armstrong, p. 298)   
From Exit and Support

Why do COG members sit there, year after year, listening to the lies of men like Dave Pack, Bob Thiel, Gerald Flurry, James Malm, Rod Meredith/Gerald Weston and others, as everything they have said consistently fails to happen?  Even with the blatant lies of Ron Weinland, there are still gullible members who send in money to him. Despite being liars, Malm, Thiel, Flurry, Pack and others still con their members into sending their heard earned money in.  Why?


I Knew Bob Thiel in LCG said...

The entire legacy of the Church of God has been based upon the lies of Herbert Armstrong. It is so rewarding to watch all of the present day liars be exposed. I particularly take great delight in watching Bob Thiel, James Malm and Dave Pack go down in steaming piles of bullshit.

Michael said...

Good listing of failed COG prophecies.

Such self-styled prophets rely on the infamous short-attention/memory span of their human followers.

Maybe the best strategy against these con men is, whenever such a prediction is blurted out, is to get them to put their money where their mouth is (in audio or writing) by countering like so: "Ok, I predict what you say is NOT going to happen in the time period you propose. And I'm willing to bet you on it. If it happens, I surrender my (XX) to you, if it doesn't happen, you surrender (XX) to me, not to mention apologize to your members."

Where (XX) is something of high value...

The fact that they will not take you up on the bet belies the reality that they don't really believe their own words.

nck said...

This is quite good research.
I have seldom to never seen the "1975" claim. And certainly the "1975" booklet is often distorted by interpreters to say what it does not say.

However this summary of quotes all lead to "the early seventies". Material certainly not available for people joining since the early seventies.



Byker Bob said...

It is good to be reminded that Herbert W. Armstrong's name is on so many of these lies and false prophecies. So many want to remember him as being pure as the driven snow, God's apostle, incapable of false prophecy or lies, the one who set the gold standard! Frankly, when he began to backpedal and spin in the early 1970s, one mantra he repeated over and over and over again was "Brethren, we never set dates." Many in the church accepted this lie, began their reprogramming and continue to this day.

What is shocking is that this scam continues to be credible and viable. In the past ten or more years, HWA's wannabe heirs have racked up numerous additional failures, revising HWA's math (as if that were the key), and pointing to the occasional downsides to natural and economic cycles. Gullibility does not offer a full explanation for the Armstrong prophecy problem. Most members have now lived through multiple prophecy failures, yet for some reason, remain loyal to the scam, and continue to contribute financially. It is downright perverse! One could understand if somehow it improved quality of life for believers and their families. But, it actually ruins lives and makes people miserable. My personal opinion is that the people who continue to buy into the Armstrong prophecy mold deserve whatever evil befalls them as a result.


Redfox712 said...

In regards to the 1985 quote from Mystery of the Ages I can well remember first learning about it from Exit and Support Network. I look through the book online from a COG source and indeed there it was. I never noticed it until it was pointed out to me.

Also I will state that HWA did teach that Christ would return in 1975 but he did not state why he taught that in his booklet, 1975 in Prophecy. The "reasoning" behind that claim is alluded to more explicitly in Herman Hoeh's booklet, A True History of the True Church and in HWA's co-worker letter of May 22, 1953. That idea took hold within the Radio Church of God leadership in 1953.

I wrote a post about this topic. The evidence is discussed at length there.

Redfox712 said...

The following is from Herman Hoeh's 1959 booklet, A True History of the True Church. This alludes to the false prophecy of 1972-5 and insists that his church had only thirty-eight years to preach to the world (1934-72). It is insisted that the Apostolic church only had thirty-eight years to preach to the world before fleeing to Pella (AD 31-69).

"God gave the Apostolic Church JUST TWO nineteen-year cycles to carry the gospel to the Old World. He opened a DOOR to the apostle Paul AT THE BEGINNING OF THE SECOND NINETEEN-YEAR CYCLE by which the gospel went to Europe (Acts 16:9; 11 Cor. 2:12-13).

"So now, just before the second coming of Jesus Christ, God has given His Church -- THIS CHURCH -- JUST TWO nineteen-year cycles in which to carry the gospel to the world!

"The first cycle PASSED. Then God suddenly opened the door for the second cycle in January 1953, and the gospel is now going to all the world!"

Lake of Fire Church of God said...

nck said, "I have seldom to never seen the "1975" claim. And certainly the "1975" booklet is often distorted by interpreters to say what it does not say".

MY COMMENT - Redfox712 at 2:17 AM publishes EXACTLY what the Church taught from the pulpit taken as fact in the years preceding 1972. I am a living witness as to what The Radio/Worldwide Church of God taught from its pulpits as an oral record by its Ambassador College credentialed ministers in the years 1968 to 1976. I recorded what I heard in my Sabbath Service notebooks.

As I have posted in other topics, the Church taught from the pulpits that Herbert Armstrong and the Philadelphia era began in the first week of January, 1934 on radio station KORE in Oregon. The Church taught from the pulpit that the second 19 year time in January 1953 was the World Tomorrow radio broadcast going to Europe. The Great Tribulation was to begin in the first week of January, 1972 with the German attack on America; the Philadelphia brethren (roughly 50% of the Church) was to be taken to the Petra Place of Safety during the 3 1/2 year Great Tribulation, and Jesus Christ was to return in the Fall of 1975 (speculated to be on the Feast of Trumpets, 1975).

I remember like it was yesterday looking out of my Laurel, Maryland room window at night during the first week of January, 1972 to see if the Germans were attacking in my neighborhood. I went to school during the day - the only person in my school to know - the Germans were going to attack at any moment.

As stated, I am a living witness to what the Radio/Worldwide Church of God ministers taught from their pulpits in the years preceding 1972. I affirm (because we don't swear as WCG members will remember) these statements are true, and my personal experience that I posted here was a result of what I heard preached from the WCG pulpits.


Anonymous said...

The auditorium was built in two years from 1972 to 1974. But Herbie must have been going over the architectural drawings for several years prior to this. So he must have known that 1975 was bull.
His 'but we don't set dates' is a deliberate deceitful ploy by him. The bible states 'you shall know them by their fruits' rather than 'you shall know them by their words'. My bible also tells me that God hates guile (crafty deception). Dave copied this ploy in one of his booklets (his original autobiography from memory) where he kept repeating that he doesn't answer his critics, while he answered every criticism.

The Jehovah witnesses had set the 1975 date as well, implying that Herb simply copied them. According to YouTube Jw dissident videos, jW headquarters became
'rich' by members selling their homes and giving the money to the church, just prior to 1975. Herb must have noticed this relationship with his previous false dates. So like the Pharisees, he robbed widows out of their homes with this deceitful ploy.

Another similarity is the jw teaching that Christ was crucified on a tree. The bible is not clear on this point, so a JW leader arbitrary (according to a internet article) pronounced that it's a tree. The Romans had been using the cross for a hundred years prior to Christ, so Christ was most likely crucified on a cross.
This is another example of Herb being a JW fan rather than a bible scholar.

In these videos, they mention that JW leaders teach that independent thinking is evil and of Satan. They teach that this was Adam and Eves sin in the garden of Eden. Notice how Herb copied this evil ploy in his many sermons, as well as putting it in his Mystery of the Ages book. He only differed from the JW, by strongly implying this point, rather than being explicit. Strongly implying a idea eg 1975 and 'God rules in His church', then using repetition to crash members mental barriers, was Herbs and the churches favourite deceitful ploy.

Unknown said...


One day for God = 1000 years for man.

Thus, if HWA said 15 years, he really meant 15x365 days = 5475 days

times 1000 years in God Time equals 5,475,000 years in human time.


Anonymous said...

But when one of those lying false prophets croaks make sure you show respect and don't threaten to protest at his funeral or you will be condemned on this as a Westboro Baptist type.

nck said...


I said that person came across as a Westboro type. True!

I guess there are more than two witnesses. I get it. I said that information was not readily available for those joining after 1972.

What I don't get is all the fuss about it. I mean. It was not a secret that the AC campus remodelling including the auditorium was being planned since 1974. Therefore HWA can not be called a schemer. It was all in the open, nothing was hidden about the 15 million dollar remodelling.


nck said...

HWA being a false prophet in the biblical sense is probably true and easily proven.

It does not escape my attention however that so far ALL of HWA's predictions have come true albeit in an extremely slow pace.

For instance today there was a historic and pivotal watershed moment between the EU and Britain and the US. Something I could not have fathomed even 15 years ago. For those still believing this is just a "remark" by the leadership of Europe I remind them that this has been in the planning for over 10 years when Germany and other European nations started shipping their Gold back from the New York vaults.

I am not rejoicing in this from a professional viewpoint.


Byker Bob said...

HWA and his "slow moving" (as you call it) prophecy mold are irrelevant, nck. He made his money from that, and now he's gone. We're now beyond the point of no return on global climate change, what with the Antarctic glaciers collapsing, yet certain "leaders" are still calling global warming "junk science". This represents an existential threat that nobody in the ACOGs wants to consider, because Herbie didn't forecast it, and most people who left Armstrongism have been so sick of being manipulated by a false apocalypse and all the dates that were set that they automatically deny that there could even be any sort of alternative end time.


Anonymous said...

Did the LCG memorialized wanky Spanky in his funeral today by listing and elaborating on his top three to seven prophesies that materialized within the time frame he specified in each prediction? With sixty-plus years of making very specific predictions, Spanky's funeral must have been loaded with praise over how God foretold the future to him and how he preached the "in your lifetime" predictions to the lost. Only the lost ever listened to him.

nck said...

That is interesting. Since most of the wind farm industry hails from the conservative "windy states".

If such comments are made by splinter leaders it indeed shows how much detached they have become from their "market share". Delving into irrelevancy. Perhaps they are more into solar worship.

Scalability not shalebility people.


nck said...

Next time, you're telling me a COG leader prophesies and endorses an 8 hour work week in the Kingdom. While 8 hours obviously is remnant legislation for the protection of manual laborers.


Anonymous said...

Question was asked: "...Why do COG members sit there, year after year, listening to the lies of men like Dave Pack, Bob Thiel, Gerald Flurry, James Malm, Rod Meredith/Gerald Weston and others, as everything they have said consistently fails to happen?..."

Well, it was probably for the same reason(s) most of us, while being ignorant and deceived, did the exact same thing for days, months, years, and for decades (in some cases)...yes, and me included! Most of us have been there, done that, seen that...whatever that phrase is!

I am married to a mate (with the United Ass.), who still believes in that Mickey Mouse Millennium (that Jesus Christ to soon reign on earth) to this day, and cannot be convinced otherwise. A deceived person does not know one is deceived. As an aside, that article by HWA warning people about NOT striving to convert friends/relatives? That was a very valuable article and worth paying attention to. It could prevent a lot of grief in one's life.

HWA taught: "Don't believe me; believe your Bible." More good advice: don't just believe HWA! Those who worship/idolize HWA didn't believe HWA and believed him and all of the Junk Food theories that were not backed by the Bible. Solution: go revise your theories!

When one comes out of that deception, one's vision seems to be close to 20:20.

So, today, people still believe things like:

Jesus Christ is coming soon to reign on earth.

The Tree of Life has something to do with God's Holy Spirit.

Spirit beings, like Satan, cannot be destroyed.

Assyria has a lot to do with Germany, which is going to be instrumental in putting USA into captivity.

Adam did not eat of the Tree of Life.

etc., this is 2017! And people still swallow that thinking, those theories!

And life goes on.

And time will tell...