Please check out the article on the Painful Truth that delves further into the past racist teachings in the Church of God.
You can also listen to the complete sermon by Herbert Armstrong here: Interracial Marriage
The Painful Truth has this:
The Plain Truth magazine was trumpeting these teachings to hundreds of thousand...maybe millions of readers right during the 1960s Civil Rights Era. Herbert insisted he wasn't "taking sides" in the Race Question that was the greatest problem of the d...his magazine wouldn't be promoting the demands of the Negro, nor would it be endorsing the approach of the segregationists of the Deep South. It was, he insisted, just telling the "Plain Truth" about what God thinks of it all, about what the Bible says about it all, and about what the Bible predicts for the future. The reality, of course, was that Armstrong did, indeed, "take the side" of the white anti-integration southerners. Often using some of the same arguments, the same "scripture quotations" that showed up on their protest signs. "God hates race-mixing." "God is the author of segregation."-–Myth America by Pam Dewey
These quotes below and many more are on the Painful Truth site. Far too many in the COG today continue to claim the church was never racist, but the track record proves otherwise.
44 comments:
I wonder what HWA would have to say (and the fit that he would have had over it) over Prince Harry marrying a black lady!
In August of 1968, James Brown recorded “Say it Loud, I’m Black and I’m Proud”. It topped the R & B charts for about 6 weeks, and was considered to be the delineation point, the news, that Black people preferred to be called “black” rather than “colored” or “negro”. But white WCG members didn’t generally listen to funk, and missed the news. I was working in a record store at the time and recall a very pretty black lady with blue eye shadow coming in and asking me if we had the record. Unfortunately we didn’t. But the lady also introduced me to the music of Sly and the Family Stone, particularly “Everyday People”. Changes were afoot that the WCG was both reluctant and late to embrace. There is no way that anyone could say that the WCG was ahead of the curve on this.
I will never understand why, of all the Feast sites in the USA, black church members were deliberately sent to the one where segregation was practiced rather than inclusion and mutual respect. We were schooled to believe that “God’s Church” led the way in presenting better alternatives to a dying world, yet this was one example where that plainly was not the case. HWA and GTA never did march with Dr. King.
BB
This is how it was done back in the Sixties. When I first attended the Feast in Big Sandy, there were separate socials for Blacks and Latinos. I remember passing the Field House and seeing the Black social happening with Black performers on stage. Everyone seemed to be having a good time. They were just as much under mind control as the rest of us.
Blacks were also required to sit separately in the Field House. A Black buddy was sitting next to me in the White section back in about '68 and an Assistant Deacon came over and made him move to the Black section. Later I asked one of the ushers, may have been the same guy, about this and he said that "God's Church believes in segregation."
Several years later, Rod Meredith announced form the pulpit at the beginning of the Feast that Black brethren could sit anywhere they wanted to. Of course, they did not budge and stayed in their seating zones, as trained, so midway through the Feast, Meredith asked some Black members to move down front and center. He explained that the original policy was actually developed by a Black minister, Harold Jackson, who felt that there would be disenchantment in the local communities if Blacks and Whites mingled. It was also mandatory that all Black members attend the Feast in BS where camping was available. This was asserted to be because Black members could not get hotel rooms at other locations.
I am not sure that the RCM's statement was the entire truth. Herman Hoeh had already established in one of his articles on race that people of different races should not socialize with each other. They could attend church services together but could not attend purely social gatherings together. I have always felt that there was a theological basis to WCG racial policy. But Hoeh denied this in correspondence. This leaves without an answer what purpose his theological writings on race were intended for. And why did it so closely fit with WCG practice.
A possibility is that RCM's renunciation of the practice of segregation at the Feast, something that Dean Blackwell taught would extend through all of eternity, may have attracted the attention of Civil Rights organizations. Greg Doudna speculated that this is why AC was desegregated when it was.
The WCG, to my knowledge, has no official policy of racial discrimination - only theological statements. I would imagine there are latter day members who would deny this just as there are such people who deny that the WCG advocated the extermination of Native Americans. (They did not witness it so it could not have been.) There is a very strange history here that will increase in deniability as more witnesses die off.
and once again you pass judgement on the people of history using the standards of today...definitely a form of self righteousness...
be aware that it will likely happen to you one day...
Connie
Harry's mother preferred talking to HWA instead of the boring Rothchildts the one time they met. Quite the giggle.
I dont know. HWA would say....I was married to a Cherokee once, quite the looker. He was also good friends with the daughter of najeeb halaby and doris carlquist. Or perhaps Arabs are not a race. I dont know.
Good thing the 2900 had fun. Those were perilious times. Martin L King was murdered the year before and the law for allowing black students in for instance New York had just passed.
And here was this "whitie church" hosting a party for black people.
A bit embarassing in retrospect but judging from the pocono feast videos black and white were talking and felloshipping freely albeit dancing would have been a problem I m sure.
I mean in our congregation we had black people from the caribean and nigeria square dancing at the feast........doceeeeeeeedoooo with your partner. That is so much wierder than the opportunity to have a mass gathering of black people in the middle of texas in peace. The largest gathering of black people there since the cowboys took the longhorn north.
Nck
You have to consider the times, of course the negros of the WCG in the 1960's had to have their on social gathering. I repeat, CONSIDER THE TIMES!
HWA wrote an article back when in the WWN about older people marrying. A fellow employee told me that there was a rumor that he was preparing to get married - hence, the article. The next thing I heard was that he had married a "dark woman" with an ominous sound to it.
There were the inevitable comparison's to Moses marrying an Ethiopian woman.
Then a minister at the Spokesman's Club in Gladewater said he was approached by some Black members and asked if he had married Rona Martin, a Black woman who had worked as a housekeeper for HWA. The minister laughed and said "They thought HWA had married a N----r!" I was appalled at his use of the N-word but it is indicative of the low estate that Blacks occupied in the WCG.
To my knowledge nobody has ever admitted that Ramona Martin was anything but 100% European. Anything else I heard came from people who wouldn't have any information source except gossip.
Calvinists believe that God created some people for no other purpose except to burn in Hell. That is why CAlvin said that Hell is copiously populated by infants not a cubit long. HWA, Hoeh and Blackwell believed that God condemned some people, notably Blacks, to be servants forever to a special collection of White people. At this point, the brutality of Calvinism and the brutality of Armstrongism become soulmates.
This, of course, had great appeal to many White people who wanted to believe that slavery was not bad, "Israel" had not done anything wrong, could be proud of their history, God was on the side of the Confederacy and Southern bigots are not really the trash you always thought they were. Some of these kind of people were present in BS in both the ministry and lay membership.
And are we to overlook the Holocaust because it is judging people of history by the standards of today.
WCG pretty much adhered to the times of the Southern states. There was a definite dichotomy.
BB
Not sure, but I think the point being made was that Brown v. Board of Education happened in 1954, while the Civil Rights Act of 1964 had occurred a few years earlier than those Feasts.
But if you notice, NEOs story happened in 1968. Clearly WCG wasn't exactly eager to let go of segregation yet. Hoeh's earlier quotes about segregation being "GOD'S WAY" have been cited before.
Remember that the Demiurge that HWA worshipped was a White Man and lived in the "sides of the north." It was originally thought that the Demiurge had made a mistake in the creation of men. He had created all men White - Adam was White - but a mutation occurred and things got out of hand. After all the Demiurge was not omnipotent an could not control the genome. The Demiurge, so to speak, inadvertently let people of color slip into the realm of men - much as Morgoth bred the Orcs. Later, Dean Blackwell claimed the the Demiurge intended for people of color to be created, albeit subservient to the people "Brit-Israel" who were most like the Demiurge in body and mind and were destined to rule for eternity over the lesser Orc-people.
And this is the reason why the Orc-people had to sit in a special segregated place at the FOT. And could not go to AC as students. And it made the White people, the Demiurge's special self-recreation, proud to be White.
What do you mean considere the times.. God was revealing knowledge directly to Herbert. Didn’t God consider His children of other races? Did WCG brag they had tomorrow’s news today. Our black brothers and sisters were treated like second class citizens by Herbert and those who kissed up to him. WCG should have been revealing the truth ahead of he time. But no, they waited until they were forced by our government to make changes. Then like always they claimed the Blacks were never treated unfairly. Typical WCG bull s.
Jim-AZ
i know i might blow my cover with this, but it reminds me of when my sisters went to a square dance in the 80s on the big sandy campus and were forced to dance in a segregated group with two other black teens...
the cogs have been their own worst enemy for decades, and have been profaning the Holy Name of Christ in a myriad of ways (even to this day), hence hindering the spreading of the gospel...
i do believe ultimately those what be responsible will ultimately be held accountable, but the mean time has been very taxing...
c f ben yochanan
they were still engaged in racially discriminatory behavior in the 1980s...
frankly, you have just demostrated why israel (anglo israel as defined by armstrongism) is destined for a fall; always with the excuses for sinful behavior...self righteous and unrepentent...
indeed since the time they went into canaan they have demonstrated a stiff neck, and this is the era that neck will be broke; and all because of a refusal to simply do right by their fellow man...
c f ben yochanan
OK, but that was 30 years ago. So what's going on now in the splinters? Is there segregation?
"Consider the times?"
It does not matter what "the times" are. If it wasn't for the Civil Rights Movement of the 1960s, none of what it was would have changed one bit. The church could not afford negative press, nor discriminatory lawsuits. The only reason why things changed was because of image and money. Nothing else.
The policies of segregation of the church at the time were inherently caused by the racist propeganda of British Israelism, and were blessed for decades by HWA and the senior staff of the church. These things only changed when it was when there was a threat to the bottom line, either in litigation, image, or scandal.
"Consider The Times" is simply being an apologist for racism. The church should have been a beacon for the words of Jesus, "nor Jew nor Gentile, all are one in Christ", and practicing such. They were not, instead, continuing and enabling racial division as practice and policy.
When confronted with proof of the horrid policies of Armstrongism, you can always count on the apologists to defend - no matter what. They aren't standing up for what is right - they're excusing the inexcusable, and defending the indefensible. Without knowing it, they show their true colors - pale green vomit.
"And are we to overlook the Holocaust because it is judging people of history by the standards of today."
ummm, it was wrong by the standards of that day as well...and Ike made sure as many as possible saw it so that it could never be denied.
"God was revealing knowledge directly to Herbert"
and people really believed that? I wonder if that is why he was/is worshiped/revered by the old timers...
"consider the times" could be interpreted as a conservative statement taken into the present, without having learned the lessons of said times.
consider the times should go accompanied with a true consideration of the times. and it is very difficult to recall feelings or anxieties or hopes and aspiration from yonder years.
I could cite thousands of articles like
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2017-12-31/1968-the-year-that-changed-america-forever#close-modal
The 1968 "housing acts" in the usa and the uk. The riots taking place in established institutions of learning. The footage of the Nixon inaugaration. (I didn't count 2900 black people in the footage.) Black Panther outrage at the Olympics.
However it is not my place to teach on the "general history of mankind". My fun derives from niche observations.
A couple of observations:
Someone stated that it was Mr Jackson who organized the gathering of the black brethren. I could cite entire bodies of literature on tragic figures who had to deal within a system without losing it like Don Quichotte. On the other hand. Who know. Perhaps he or the administrators were trying to be practical for people on perhaps limited budget, creating an opportunity (within doctrine) for young black people to meet and date, while perhaps the gangsters NEO had come to know sanctioned the entire practicality for personal racist reasons.
If I were a judge like the ones on the supreme court today judging the "gay cake refusal" incident, I would have to interview 100 or so of the participants to judge whether the gathering was recieved as "racist" within the context of the times. I mean the cake maker went free today. In absolute terms of course the "cake maker" should be in jail and the gathering was "segregation(al). I agree with 6::27
I have said that HWA's history from Quaker stock does somewhat push the scales toward favoring "the benefit of the doubt" on him personally. I must say the more NEO talks about that certain minister he had to deal with in the Midwest the more I dislike the views of that minister. I have been an instructor of the bow and arrow at church functions and would have dealt with a minister like that in no uncertain terms regarding the skill set of the native american. I am not sure if that would have involved the bow and arrow but for certain I would have taken a daughter of such minister on a date to a dance gathering of the native for sure if I rightly remember my way of dealing with ignorance at the time.
I admit not remembering when I first heard of Ramona's "Native Okie genetics", whether official of grapevine. I do recall at HWA's wedding, of the 50 attending, at least 3 armenian descent gathered, 3 ukrainian jews, 3 german descent, at least 4 mixed native american, and the rest I don't recall. I have been at more exclusive "Saxon" weddings in my life time.
nck 1
"ben yochanan" ......Your statement on your sisters doesn't make sense unless you would reveal that they were of philipino stock forced to dance segregated with other 'people of color". I can only say that in my best dance days I did my best to engage teenagers to "dance widely" with the "bible distance in between" as the only requirement of course.
Despite the "race dating' sermon every year at camp.
The biggest shock reverberating through the ranks of the Big Sandy SEP staff crowd however was caused by that all white girl from sweden who according to the ways and customs of her native land felt that swimming in a bikini was an acceptable practice at camp.
I loved the raw sexual tension of the Texans between "policy of all kind" and "desire for freedom". Freud has been mentioned.
I am not sure about NEO's calvinist remarks. I'm not a theologian. I do know that the protestant nations expressly forbade slavery on European soil, having black people immediately freed when landing on European soil and revert them to "employee status". Of course the companies of those nations had no reservations about offering transportation and "commodities of the human kind" to the "America's".
During Industrialization the life expectancy of an "American (made) slave" was higher than a British factory worker. So far the ethics of business and economics.
People talk about the last government bail out of the banks in the last 10 years. We tend to forget that the largest government bail out in history occured whith the abolishment of slavery and all the little (grocerie owners, pub tennants etc, middle class) stock owners of London needed to be compensated for their losses.
nck 2
the point was that some were claiming the discrimination was merely a product of the times when in actuality it was the result of a persistent evil spirit what spanned generations, residually in the cogs to this day, whether it manifests itself in subtle racial biases or one of the many other evils that this page has been shedding light on over the years...
the cogs claim to be led by the Holy Spirit, yet they are continually engaging in behavior that hinders the preaching of the gospel, as is evident in their totally ineffectual and impotent presence on the evangelical stage today...
if they had simply done the right thing in them days they would have laid an enduring foundation for a house united; they would have been a beacon on a hill and leaders among ecclesiastic and civil rights movements of the time, but instead they chose to be lukewarm when it came to the SIMPLE Christian concept of treating all members as brethren and equals: in other words the wwcg was built on a foundation of sand, a foundation lacking integrity and rife with hypocrisy, among others evils...
today the cogs should have been teeming with new members, young people down for the cause of justice and equality, drawn to the church for its true Christian values of peace, love, caring for the poor and disenfrancised, the immigrant, etc...
but instead young folks avoid us cuz they smell the rot of hypocrisy, white supremecy, closet bigotry, and individuals exalting themselves as preeminent, speaking vain words and calling it gospel, all while justifying taxes from poor laymen to support lavish lifestyles for friends and family...
c f ben yochanan
11.27 PM
God reveals knowledge directly to every Christian. That's the significant of the veil in the holy of holies splitting in two on Christ's death. Typically this has to do with personal issues, but sometimes theological. That's my experience. I've never heard a sermon or read a Herb church article on this. Ironically the tele Evangelicals do teach this.
So the 'fake' churches teach the truth on this, but not the 'true' church.
Perspective. We white folk never had “colored” bathrooms, drinking fountains, or hotels and motels where I grew up and lived. So, R/WCG seemed behind the national curve in matters of race relations. Just as nck has documented post-empire European perspectives regarding Armstrongism as being a breath of fresh air, it is possible that members from some of the Southeast actually thought WCG was on the cutting edge when single people of color were belatedly admitted to AC and Imperial Schools, and the “#2” segregated churches were finally abolished sometime in the mid-70s. I remember being shocked that there was such a thing as “L.A. #2”, because it seemed that the customs of a different region had been arbitrarily imposed on California, where the so-called Jim Crow laws had been abandoned decades earlier.
Obviously, there were changes still ongoing even in late ‘60s secular California, as the Pasadena School District was under federal orders to impliment cross-town bussing to equalize all of the schools in the district. The housing and banking industry were also abolishing the redlining practices which had previously restricted peoples’ choices as to what neighborhoods they could live in. Through all of this, HWA was still thundering those hog jowls of his, insisting that segregation was God’s way, even though the Civil Rights movement had remarkably improved lives and opportunities for a large subset of his own church members.
BB
Among other things.
Anon 627 said:-
"Consider The Times" is simply being an apologist for racism. The church should have been a beacon for the words of Jesus…”
True – except the Church consists of people, all with their own baggage picked up in the society they lived in.
In Galatians you have the statement:-
“There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.”
You also have, in the preceding chapter:-
“But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.”
You could say about Peter “consider the times” or you could say “The Church (and Peter was one of the most prominent leaders) should have been a beacon for the words of Jesus”.
People in all ages are fallible, and are tainted by the society they live in. Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t change, but change takes time.
I recall that back in the mid-Seventies there was a major racial upheaval that occurred at AC/BS. A collection of Black male students started dating White female students. These were not marginal White female students but prime stock. I witnessed some of the activity and what I saw seemed pretty harmless - a Black guy and a White girl holding hands and giggling - that kind of stuff. But at the time, I was appalled. It eventually led to a proscription of this "movement". In the aftermath, a couple of the male Black students spent hours in the library compiling a statement about the topic of interracial marriage. The two Black students eventually dropped out of AC. I recall both had White girlfriends at one time.
I was not in the "inner circle" on this so I do not know the details. I think Ron Kelly dealt with it in some way. I do remember speaking with a White, female AC student (I think she was from Australia) and asked her about what was happening. She said that the Black men were regarded by some of the White female students as much warmer emotionally than the White male students. The White guys were cold and aloof - following the "WCG Ministry Model". This attitude, desirable in the context of ministerial grooming, apparently bit them in the shorts otherwise.
You can imagine how appalling this was at AC BS - in the heart of the South - right on the doorstep of God's Aryan stronghold. I don't recall any overt long term repercussions from this.
(Let me hasten to add that I am not an advocate of racial intermarriage. Nor do I believe it is a sin or something that "God hates". Marriage is a dicey proposition and seldom works well even under the best of circumstances. And the fewer the differences between husband and wife, the better the chances for success. This encompasses such potential points of difference as race, geography, culture, social class, political leanings, religion, food preferences, neatness and whether or not you like the Golden State Warriors or the Cleveland Cavaliers. My advice: Find someone as much like yourself as possible and put on your flak jacket. And disregard all the saccharine crappola that comes out of the Christian press.)
Look in fact black people are one segment of mankind.
Since we can only be engaged on limited topics I chose for the women's cause a long time ago of which 50 percent of mankind exists. What did the Church mean for the sufragettes. I guess they drew an equal line for man and woman alike. No voting for both sexes.
Anyone mentioned, today is 50 years ago Bobby Kennedy was shot by a PT reader in the "Ambassador Hotel" while BB was preparing his clandestine material for print or perhaps went surfing after immaculately cutting the grass of the grounds for photo ops sucking me in.
nck
“colored” bathrooms, drinking fountains, or hotels and motels where I grew up and lived."
Again interesting perspective BB.
As I related to you my perspective is from the WORLDWIDE church of God.
So far I hear no complaints from Kenya and Tanzania on this blog.
As I related to you "I" have the experience of being segregated. At the collapse of empire "we" were disowned, our companies nationalized and we were subsequently kicked out of respective newly independent nations.
I always kid about where the Tanzanian brethren are on discussions like this. Having no relation whatsoever to the situation in South Central LA or the race riots of 1968. My entire "cia"thesis centers around how the American empire filled the gap of the European empires in the struggle with expanding communism, especially in the newly independent nations. This is the flight path of the GII, where the local elites seemed eager to allign themselves with all things coming from the West.
Of course Sadat made a little mistake at Aswan with that Soviet Dam. But we brought him back to the western fold with the USA spending most foreign aid on Egypt. Surprise who claimed being good friends with Anwar and Jehan?
Of course this was the seventies when BB had already left the fold to pursue his interests in the Latin world. Perhaps he remembers how HWA's ties to Egypt's upper class ministers and Middle Eastern interests were already initiated in 1947 up to 1955 being rekindled in 1967.
So far on discriminination on black people, being good friends in joint cooperation with Jomo Kenyatta et all whose interest lied with the Western sphere.
nck
Old issue , Old Times. What will the COG now do with Interracial GAY and Lesbian Marriage, and what to do with Gay and Lesbian divorce and remarriage?? ;-)
I have the right to protect myself. The data show that blacks are too dangerous, so I avoid them. It's a form of voluntary separation, or "white flight".
Connie, the RCG/WCG did not hesitate to break up marriages that did not conform to the cult's idea of scriptural acceptability.
Consequently, any married gay couple that is stupid enough to join an ACOG can be sure to be told, "Break up your marriage or you can't be church members." Maybe they'll even help by pairing former lesbian couples with former gay couples, so they can all have proper marriages in the church.
The problem I have with the Church's concern about lesbians and gays is that its a maybe a small minority of the population. Its not like 50 percent of people have that lifestyle. I would get more upset over child molesters. How often is that ever spoken about?
when the truth about race reaches the masses, liberalism will self destruct
that Galatians reference is extremely important in that it points to the fact that this problem has existed in the cogs literally from the beginning, and that time has not effected change..
another important Scripture is Acts 6:1: it shows another major problem that has plagued the cogs and has contributed to the general failure of the spread of the gospel of the Sabbath keepers...
c f ben yochanan
I love the Monte Wolverton art in the update. Great stuff. It is in the bookstores in reprint.
I also enjoy how the Painful Truth site mostly comes up with source material debunking the anti-armstrongismsists.
For instance Painful Truth comes up with an entire article about the shredding of documents during the receivership. Then HWA gives the order to visiting evangelistst and Rader to just show the receiver the entire administration, since we have NOTHING to hide. This shows HWA had NOTHING to hide and he deeply felt so. Of course Stanley went on destroying the records that tell the entire truth of the organization since he had MANY things to hide.
THIS means that HWA did not know EVERYTHING.
As a matter of fact in this particular clip he screams about his ignorance, that he has never seen a case where a black lady wants to marry a white man. Now I call this "living the sheltered life", Indeed I have on occasion met men who have NEVER talked to anyone below managerial level since kindergarten, Ivy League educated. I feel a bit sorry for them for living this protected sheltered life, although it is quite handy too. Likewise I wonder why no one ever pointed out to HWA that cases he had never seen did exist. I am pretty sure he NEVER heard of such case in his lifetime sheltered as he decided to be.
As a matter of fact if he had lived just a couple of years longer he would for sure have been able to meet Kofi Annan. It is just so sad that this 1892 born person died in 1985. I would have liked to see him shake hands with Kofi and his Swedish wife. It would have been interesting to have him meet Kofi and Obama and recognize after two generations had gone, their abilities in public (regardless of political affiliation).
It is a matter of "considering the times."
I am a hundred percent sure later generations will hate my, your and our guts for living and believing the way we do now, exploiting the earth, poluting the planet with plastic, destroying the icecaps, etc. I believe we as a present generation cannot fathom how much our generation will be despised, hated and frowned upon by the next, while at present we might believe, "we are just doing our best according to what we know, we are just raising kids, we have to pay the bills, we have to keep the little lady happy, I have to keep up with my friends. It is in our culture to have 2 percent inflation and growth is a necessity. While in reality the next generation, might just think WHAT WERE THEY THINKING, WERE THESE PEOPLE BRAINDEAD, ARE WE REALLY RELATED TO THOSE MORONS WHO let thousands of species die off, like the TIGER , the ELEPHANT and in the process pound 500,000 Iraqis in the sand. WHAT WERE THESE PEOPLE, NEANDERTHALS?
And now we have this wel known soundclip, as if it was a secret that WCG was rather conservative about or rather against interracial marriage with the argumentation to "preserve Gods original creation."
On occassion my wife enjoys watching "all black movies" like the one with queen latifa. I notice black momma's frowning now and then when their son brings a white lady home. The feeling is related that mamma feels "she" or "a black lady like her" is not "good enough."
Ok, she doesn't send the son to the lake of fire, but I do wonder about this phenomenon.
Rant over: praying for the next generation
nck
PS HWA had a fettish with purity and the best quality product ever. Unfortunately he was born too early to learn that his "breeding of animal lessening the quality" theory from the original 7 laws of succes was wrong. As it stands now modern technology seems to be able to improve the quality of life. And it was the mixing with the Neanderthal gene that made HWA able to survive in the colder regions early on in his life.
Last remark.
I do love variety in nature and love to see it preserved. I hate it to see the Nepalese, Indian and Spanish women dress in Jeans. it is so boring to all look the same.
nck out.
For those who are so sado masochistic to have listened to the clip.
Did you notice HWA is saying that he is a "servant to the black man." (and the white and yellow)
Whoa.......ever heared a convinced KKK person say he is a "servant to the black man?"
nck
"But the liberal deviseth liberal things; and by liberal things shall he stand." Isaiah 32:8
c f ben yochanan
We must consider that it was inevitable that the WCG would come up with some really bizarre racial attitudes. HWA worshipped The Great White Man in the Sky. Herman Hoeh developed a line of pseudo-history that, for instance, mistakenly identified the West Africans with the Canaanites and the curses placed on Canaan. And somehow God's Chosen People became White Europeans. All this seemed to be a great self-endorsement on the part of HWA - The Great White Man in the Sky was just like Herbert - God's Chosen People were the same people that Herbert came from. And all of this started in the library in Des Moines, Iowa.
Do the COGs still follow this line of illogic? I have never known them to renounce any of the racial attitudes and memes of the old WCG. In practice they may have loosened up or maybe they have just become neglectful of their fundamental articles of faith. Then again, if they formally announced racist policies this would constitute an admission that they at one time had racists policies - something they want to keep hidden in dark, creepy places like the Faculty Men's Locker Room at AC Big Sandy.
"when the truth about race reaches the masses, liberalism will self destruct"
And what is that truth? The truth engineered by Dean Blackwell that Blacks were made to be subservient agriculturalists? That Blacks are descended from the Nephilim and are inherently evil? That Nimrod, the Great Black Man who stood against the Great White Man, created modern godless society - the Armstrongist Yin and Yang?
(NOTE: The idea that Nimrod was Black is facetious. This would mean that haplogroup J would have to morph into haplogroup E in a couple of generations. Not only is the speed of mutation here impossible and demonstrably unscientific but haplogroup E is not a hierarchical descendant of haplogroup J. Nimrod looked like the other Middle Eastern people who surrounded him - like Adam. The ancient Black mystique is wholly a fabrication of Herman Hoeh.)
I am not advocating immediate, forced racial harmony. We are all carrying the baggage of generations. I would not live in a Black neighborhood because of the statistically higher crime rate. Just like I would try to avoid a White neighborhood with a statistically higher crime rate. A great restoration must take place for ideal conditions to be established. But our current sociological swamp does not make me think that some races are inherently inferior or evil like Adolf did.
HWA and his minions developed a robust mythology about The Great White Man in the Sides of the North, and The Great Pyramid, the Two Magical Trees, the Black Orc-people and the Key of David. Someone needs to integrate all this mythology into a single account. It could not remotely compete with our best fantasy writers like George R.R. Martin but it be enlightening.
NEO
Your first and last paragraph can easily be debunked from the pages of the PT. It is not slighty wrong. It is a complete misrepresentation.
I give you one hint.
In Loma's middle eastern travel log, she jokes tongue in cheek that Mr Armstrong did not find anything special about the pyramids. In sermons on the internet HWA explicitly states that IF there are specialties connected with the pyramids, he certainly is not aware of them.
On one of the "anti" bloggers website someone is trying to link 1954 PT articles with 1975. One of the other articles by I believe Hermann talks about God being eternal. Nothing about the great white man in the skye. Although the bible says God is radiant and difficult to look at.
The library is wrong.
As a matter of fact all in 1st and last paragraph is wrong.
I hope I have been of some help.
I do like the black orc likeness though as led by SARUMAN THE WHITE. I enjoy movies too.
No thanks.
nck
NCK
Apparently you have followed nothing I have written.
NEO
Oh yes. it interesting what you say Demiurg's, Orcs, God as Santa Clause's neighbor in the Northern sky, Blackwells pet culturally distorted line of thinking. Then on anti blog someone posts PT's or sermons from yonder years and I see it presented differently.
As an example I gave HWAs explicit statements that he shure wasnt privy of any secret knowledge regarding the pyramids.
The BI thing is widely misunderstood. I will not explain it since I regard it as a theory that can be misapropriated to the detriment of many.
As part of a political ideology and agenda it was a tool in the hands of elites. The sacred bond between a people and their leader. Difficult to understand the culture of tribalism and new nationhood in a time of democracy and multiculti established nations.
Nck
On one hand, nck, it behooves us to know what happened in past generations so that we can avoid the mistakes of the past. On the other hand, if we become preoccupied with the past, it prevents us from living in the present, and enjoying and appreciating what we have now.
One of the great problems with Armstrong theology was that it ruined our present. They accomplished this by causing us to obsess on alleged paganism from the past (though nobody actually misused these commonisms for pagan worship in the present), and by painting an excessively bleak Kafkaesque future to scare us into ideological slavery. They further amplified this by teaching us to be obsessive-compulsive, and fanatical to a degree that fell way outside of proportion and balance.
I don’t even know where all of the types of people who were attracted to Armstrongism came from. Had I not been dragged into it by my parents, I certainly would bever have become involved. The people in the church were for the most part living proof, witness, and testimony that you did not get the Holy Spirit through the WCG or splinters.
BB
@11:50
Yes.
In my 12:15 middle paragraph I sketch an image of ourselves as seen by later generations a hundred years from now.
It is my opinion that all generations consider themselves doing "remarkably well". While later generations have only one option of looking stupified at the actions of previous generations.
My point is that both the black and white people probably had a good time at the time and thought things were quite swell. Now we can see what racism is, althought we are not nearly half way. My point is that all generations think they are great. Perhaps "hero's" are just war mongering fools, or from another perspective "fodder of the elites".
Or perhaps I walked into the trap of thinking there is such a thing as "mankind". As long as we are not able to save the tiger, or the elephant we are the lesser species in any generation.
nck
Segregation is good for both races.
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