PCG on Disciplining Children in Church

Joel Hilliker is back again telling Philadelphia Church of God member show to discipline their children and train them to be submissive in church.

During Sabbath services in a congregation with children, life happens on two levels. One carries on at the adults’ eye level. But there is another world happening a few feet closer to the ground. 

If you’re not paying attention, this very active world is easy to overlook—until its sounds and possibly its fury rise to the level of breaking your and others’ concentration on the sermon or interrupting your fellowship. 

Every member of God’s Church should try to bridge the gap between these two worlds. Children need regular, positive interactions with adults who show interest in them and include them within God’s spiritual Family. 

But the ultimate responsibility for children at services lies squarely on those of us who produced these children. We must avoid becoming so engrossed in our adult world at services that we lose track of what our children are doing. 

Each parent must ensure that his or her child upholds God’s Philadelphia standards at Church services. This requires diligence, consistency and firmness, as well as some creativity and understanding.

Notice these are not Godly standards but PCG's expectations.  The word "firmness" is not something to dismiss, given the track record of child-rearing teachings of the Armstrongite COG movement.

Hilliker trots our Apostle Paul as the standard to measure up to:

What would the Apostle Paul say if he walked in on one of our Sabbath services? 

He wrote that members of God’s Church should know “how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God” (1 Timothy 3:15; Revised Standard Version). 

In those congregations blessed to have children, the behavior of those young ones can make all the difference in whether the services really represent the name Philadelphia Church of God. That is, whether they uphold the Philadelphian standard; whether they befit the very elect, called-out ones; and whether they honor the Being whose name we represent.

No fussy kids in church, no crying, no passing notes to friends, no laughing at stupid comments by the preacher. Nothing, other than sitting there and being submissively quiet. The key word is submission.  If a child is not submissive in church then the child is not being trained right at home.

Paul said a leader in the Church should be “one who rules his own house well, having his children in submission with all reverence” (verse 4; New King James Version). Every parent should be striving for this godly, loving discipline at home. Our children’s Sabbath behavior is an excellent indicator of how well we are living up to this biblical admonition. 

As usual, PCG kneels at the altar of Herbert Armstrong's writings as if God actually spoke them. They quote HWA and his abusive tactics of child-rearing enforced by his son Richard.

“[M]any of our brethren … may not fully realize the seriousness of strict training and vigilant enforcement of the behavior of children at Church services,” Herbert W. Armstrong wrote in the Good News magazine, May 1981. “God is holding every one of you parents responsible!” 

For his article, Mr. Armstrong reprinted a 1958 letter that his son Richard David wrote to Church members in one congregation where children were misbehaving at Sabbath services. “I do not think my son really wrote this letter, except as God’s instrument. The living Christ, I feel, actually authored it,” he explained. “But it contains a dynamic sermon on the responsibility of parents for the training and the behavior of their children at Church services.” 

What an endorsement from Mr. Armstrong, God’s end-time Elijah! This Christ-authored letter is instruction we parents must study closely.

Lest you forget, here are the words of Richard Armstrong and how he expected children to behave in church.  Its no wonder Garner Ted come up with his nonsense later on, he had two abusive teachers!

“[A]ll the children without exception have been too noisy, have been left to run free to themselves at services, and this must cease,” wrote Richard Armstrong. Reading these words makes me wonder just how bad those children were by our society’s loose standards. What would Mr. Armstrong think of the behavior of our children at services today? 

Emphasizing that the Sabbath commandment includes “thy son” and “thy daughter” (Exodus 20:10), Richard Armstrong wrote, “The Sabbath is holy time, sacred to God, and as such our children should not be allowed to run loose like so many wild animals. … Your children must be in church, and they must keep the Sabbath holy the same as you do.”
This is the overarching principle we must remember as we govern our children’s behavior on the Sabbath: This is holy time. Isaiah 58:13 commands that we all—including our children—refrain from doing our own pleasure to ensure the Sabbath is “holy of the Lord, honourable.” 

This means no running, throwing objects, noisily rolling cars around, or being overly loud. Boys are especially prone to such behavior. We must direct them toward appropriate alternatives. 

At the same time, this verse in Isaiah shows that God wants the Sabbath to be a “delight” for the whole family, including our children. Twenty-four hours of being expected to be quiet, sit still and do nothing won’t be a delight to even the most mild-mannered child. We must train our children to uphold the standard—while we provide suitable activities and opportunities that fulfill the purpose of the Sabbath and that they will enjoy. 

Be sure to give your children appropriate ways to make this weekly holy time special and enjoyable for them, whatever their ages. Spend extra time with them. Read Bible stories and books about creation together. Talk with each other about God, His way of life, His laws, His creation, His plan for all mankind. Walk down the street or through a scenic place together. Make Sabbath meals special with foods and decorations you don’t usually have during the week. Have special quiet toys, dolls, books or activities that children get to enjoy only on the Sabbath. Make the ride to and from services enjoyable by discussing God’s creation. Present them with a nice backpack, handbag or briefcase for their supplies for services. 

Be sure they understand what is appropriate at the meeting hall and what isn’t. “Of course your children can play with the other children when services are over,” said the August 1965 Good News. “They should look forward to and enjoy the Sabbath when they see all their friends again. But this is not license to sail airplanes out of restroom windows, wrestle on the floor, or bang chairs around ….”

Can you imagine Jesus ever doing this when he gathered the little children around him as he had them set on his lap?  PCG has to have higher standards.  Members are to not be distracted by a gurgling baby or a happy child during those SERIOUS church services. Nothing can be more important that the words being spoken by the preacher! It is more important for members to listen to words that drive them to suicide than it is to be bothered by a happy child in services.

Teaching your children how to behave during the Sabbath service itself requires special effort and attention. And your expectations must fit your children’s ages and maturity levels.

When you have very young children, your first goal is to ensure that you and others around you can receive the instruction during services with as few interruptions as possible.
To that end, very young children must be blanket trained at home. Select a time and set the blanket on the floor. Tell the child that everything beyond the blanket is “no.” Train your child to play silently on the blanket without getting off. Discipline quickly when the child tests these boundaries. Establish a routine so the child can fall asleep by himself on the blanket even while someone is speaking. These habits simply cannot be taught at services.

They must be trained and enforced in your own home during the week.

After all, it is not about what would Jesus do, but what their law requires:

Rewards for Law-keeping

As is the case with behavior during services, the time to train our children how they should behave before and after services is during the week. Anticipate. Prepare. Establish firm rules. Tell them in advance the rewards for right and the punishments for wrong. Practice in whatever ways are possible. Do your work during those six days, and you will be able to rest on the Sabbath as your children behave appropriately.

While you are establishing these good habits, you might consider establishing a happy tradition—perhaps enjoying ice cream as a family after services—for when the children behaved themselves well in the household of God, the Church of the living God.

Let’s diligently work with our children to keep God’s Sabbath holy and honorable—and at the same time make it a delight. This will do much to bring us peace, build God’s Family, and strengthen the Church in the eyes of the world and of God. It will help life in our congregations meet God’s standard—both at eye level and at the level closer to the ground. And it will prepare our young people for a lifetime of joy-filled Sabbath-keeping!  

Of all the Churches of God out there the Philadelphia Church of God is the LAST group of people you should look to for child-rearing advice.

Do I Hate/Despise Bob Thiel?

Charlie says:

"Anonymous Charlie said...
I used to think Gary had a hatred for what Bob Thiel but it has become obvious it’s a hatred for not only what he says but a hatred for the man himself that seems to go way back and can do nothing but slam him in everything he says about him, name calling like a little child to other childish comments."
 

I have absolutely no hated towards Bob Thiel as a person.  He may be a wonderfully nice person, as some here have claimed. COG members who have been conditioned by church leaders to regard anyone who left the church as bitter or under the influence of Satan, so that is what people immediately assume.  Nothing could be further from the truth. These lies were only methods of control they used to keep church members in line and spouting the party line.  

If you read the horrific stories on Facebook groups of the vile actions of COG leaders and ministers in how they treated members, it is quite obvious God was never part of their lives or the church they represent. 

I have spent over 40 years here in Pasadena watching various men and women come and go as they set themselves up as prophets, apostles and church leaders.  Every single one of them have been inveterate liars and frauds.  I have watched as these liars have ripped churches, families, and marriages apart all for their own self-serving glory. God was no more a part of placing them in those positions than he was in doubly blessing and setting Thiel apart as a new splinter group leader.  

Rod Meredith was quite specific in ensuring that Thiel was NOT to be ordained.  He knew where Thiel’s heart ultimately lay. Rest assured, Meredith's character was not one with outstanding virtue either. We watched in Pasadena as he horrifically reigned as head of Church Administration and how he ripped marriages apart, destroyed families and humiliated ministers and members with outrageous lies and claims as he disfellowshipped people on a whim.  

There is not one single shred of evidence that God had anything to do with Theil's self-ordination or setting him apart as a leader of the end time church.  All of the dreams in the world by nice men and women do not make them God’s instruments. Sadly, the god of Armstrongism has been relegated to a position of sheer impotence as these men and women have designed him/it into what they imagine him/it to be. They have prostituted themselves out to the law while denying Jesus and anything he came to do. There have been a lot of graceless religious groups in the world over the years, but Armstrong’s hundreds of groups seem to consistently top the list.

Thiel writes about hundreds and hundreds of ultimately useless topics each week that he believes his followers need to know about. All this has done is prove he has no Godly focus other than his desire to be known as an authority on every esoteric point imaginable, EXCEPT  of course, for that inconvenient dude that embarrasses the hell out of him and most COG leaders.

The sad part is that he has conned over 3,800 African followers with his nonsense.  These are people who could care less about 99% of the silly topics he writes about every week. They face lives of struggling to feed themselves, keep roofs over their heads, and surviving tribal warfare from other groups or Muslims. Do they really care if the Boy Scouts may be headed to bankruptcy or whether the Swiss may be descended from Gad? Yellowstone geysers leading to Gog and Magog?  WTH!!!!  WHO CARES! Jesus doesn't!

Those that came into the presence of Jesus were overpowered by grace, they melted at his grace and mercy. Do you see any of that coming from Bob Thiel? Did Jesus spend his time being interviewed on conspiracy theory networks talking about useless crap? 

It is really no wonder that Thiel is only able to garner less than 200 people from COG groups in the United States, Canada, Europe and South Africa.  COG members have seen numerous other false COG leaders like him rise up over the decades and lead people astray.  It is hard enough dealing with the leaders of their own groups than to put up with the heretical nonsense of Bob Thiel.

So, no, I do not hate or despise Bob Thiel, but you can rest assured I and many others here will continue to call him out for his steaming pile of heretical crap and label it for what it truly is. 

Bullshit!

Elijah Lectures PCG On How They Have It All Wrong

The Philadelphia Church of God has an article up in its January 2019 Trumpet magazine; Four Signs the Second Coming Is Near, by Joel Hilliker.

In it he says:

Weapons of mass destruction. An end-time Elijah. The true gospel preached around the world. The true Church splitting apart. These are four signs of Jesus Christ’s return that God inspired to be recorded and miraculously preserved in the Bible for 2,000 years. Today, they have all been fulfilled! These four specific signs, along with many others, show for certain that Jesus Christ is not just going to return, but He is going to return soon.

Gerald Flurry and the PCG has always claimed that Herbert Armstrong was the end-time Elijah, which is an end-all statement that rubs the present day Elijah with some major butt-hurt.  By proclaiming Elijah has already arrived and completed his ministry leaves no room for the various COG self-appointed Elijah's and self-appointed prophets to anoint themselves and expect adoration. That is a major bone of contention for our favorite self-appointed, doubly anointed and almost arrested prophet to the COG and the world, Tinfoil Bob Thiel.

He writes:

Notice that the Elijah is to come just before the great and terrible day of the LORD, and if he did not come, utter destruction would occur.

Herbert W. Armstrong died in January 16, 1986.

Now let’s see what Herbert W. Armstrong actually wrote about the timing of the final Elijah: 

"Also Malachi 4:5-6 pictures the Elijah to come at the very end of the Church age     (Mystery of the Ages. 1985, p. 349). "

When did Herbert W. Armstrong write that the Church age was over? 

Notice: 

At the end of the Church age and 6,000 years from Adam, Christ would return to earth as King of kings and Lord of Lords, ruling all nations, with the saints, for one millennium. (Armstrong HW. What If Adam Had Taken of the Tree of Life? Plan Truth, March 1983)

The “very end” of the Church age was not over nearly 33 years ago! The 6000 years has NOT yet been fulfilled. Since the “very end of the Church age” has not happened, and Herbert W. Armstrong died decades ago, his writings support that there must be another Elijah. And he was referring to an individual in the Mystery of the Ages. 

Then, as usual, Tinfoil Bob trots our Dibar Apartain as if the man was a legitimate validation for end time events.  Given how the COG ministry has been abysmal failures in prophecy, using Apartian as a source shows poor judgment. Apartian was as theologically bankrupt as Meredith and Thiel both are. Plus, Tinfoil Bob has made lots of claims about conversations and statements Apartain supposedly said to him, none of which can ever be verified as true.  Given how every single COG leader has lied to get himself in positions of authority, why should we believe any less of Theil?

That being said, sometimes Herbert W. Armstrong did think that he may have fulfilled the Elijah role, but he told the late Dibar Apartian (who told me) that he was NOT the Elijah. Furthermore, essentially on his deathbed, Herbert W. Armstrong admitted to his closest aide, Aaron Dean (who told me this multiple times) that there could be an Elijah to come after he died. 

This combined with what Herbert W. Armstrong wrote in The Mystery of the Ages and the length of time since his death demonstrates that Herbert W. Armstrong could not biblically be the final prophesied Elijah.

Next, our prophet wanna-be throws out some more scripture to PROVE he is the end time Elijah that was prophecied to come.

Since the Bible does teach that there will be an ‘Elijah’ who is alive right before Jesus returns (Malachi 4:5-6), it is not possible that Herbert W. Armstrong was the prophesied final Elijah.

Now, presuming Jesus will return within the next couple of decades, then that ‘Elijah’ would need to be alive now. And he would be part of the church that places the highest priority on the truth. 

Yet, most Christians seemingly refuse to accept that.

We in the Continuing Church of God are regularly restoring more truth about church history, doctrine, and prophecy. And we have done this more, by far, than any other group in the 21st century (COG or otherwise for that matter).

Woe to be to those in the Church of God community and the world at large that reject this end-time Elijah and his church message!  Woe brethren!  Woe!

Sadly, just as many would not hear Elijah’s nor John the Baptist’s messages, relatively few will pay much attention to the end time Elijah as well.

That is not a surprise as most Christians in the end times were to be Laodicean, and Jesus warned the Laodiceans since they would not ‘get with the program,’ that they would be punished (Revelation 3:14-18).
Of course, if you are willing to believe the truth and do what the Bible teaches, that does not have to include you.

Was that supposed to happen?

Yes.

Notice something that Daniel wrote:

4 “But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.” (Daniel 12:4)

The end has not yet come. 

Therefore, Herbert W. Armstrong could not have possibly been the final Elijah and Matthew 24:14 has not yet been fulfilled. 

That being said, we in the Continuing Church of God are regularly restoring more truth, while we are reaching people around the world and preparing for the short-work (Romans 9:28), because Jesus will be coming relatively soon. 

It is just that on at least two points in Joel Hilliker’s article, the so titled Philadelphia Church of God is wrong.

Those poor deceived people in the Philadelphia Church of God just do not get it! Truth only lies in the improperly named "continuing" Church of God and NOWHERE ELSE!!!   The problem lies in the fact that if they join up with Thiel they are just jumping from one spiritual despot to another.  God has nothing to do with Gerald Flurry and the Philadelphia Church of God anymore than he does with the improperly named "continuing" Church of God.  God never appointed Bob Thiel, just as he never appointed Gerald Flurry as a COG leader.  That is a fact that cannot be refuted.

Any deluded fool can claim his dreams are god inspired and then turn them into mythological status as Thiel has done. God did no such thing with Thiel and he cannot prove that He did.

So essentially we have one deluded man lecturing another deluded man on what he thinks is right.