It is business as usual in the Church of God a Worldwide Association at this time of year. The focus is still upon the physical with an emphasis upon the law. So in that vein, COGWA has an article up for young people on how to track down leavening this time of year.
The article is geared towards 'young people" in COGWA and is written by Karen Meeker.
Have you ever wondered exactly what is wrong with leavening? Why can we eat it all year long but not during the Days of Unleavened Bread?
Here’s the reason: Sometimes God uses normal, everyday things to remind us of things that are important to Him. If you read 1 Corinthians 5:6-8 you will see that leavening is used to picture negative characteristics like wickedness (doing bad things) and malice (wanting to hurt someone). During these seven days in the spring, leaven pictures breaking God’s laws—or sin. When we hunt for leavening and throw it out before the Days of Unleavened Bread, we picture our willingness and desire to search out and remove sin from our lives.
Tracking down leavening
To put sin out, we first have to know what it is and how to look for it. The same is true of leavening. This calls for expert detective work, and labels hold the key.
The main words to look for are:
Even more elusive to COGWA members and the ACOG as whole, is Jesus. He is just sooooo inconvenient at times!
- Baking soda or sodium bicarbonate.
- Baking powder.
These ingredients can be sneaky, hiding in things like biscuits, bread, cake, cookies, cereals, candy bars, ice cream cones, cornbread, crackers, breading on chicken nuggets, donuts, muffins, pretzels, some tortillas, pancakes and waffles. The more labels you check, the more leavening you will discover. It seems to be everywhere—just like sin.
- Yeast.
The youth and adults of COGWA are spending its time looking for leavening in their lives and totally missing the One they should be following. It is much more shocking to find a cookie in a pocket or under a car seat during Unleavened Bread time than it is to be at rest, with the assurance of forgiven sins, in the very One the church claims to follow.Round it up, eat it up or throw it out
Before the Days of Unleavened Bread begin, your family will probably try to eat up all the food containing leavening. But don’t be surprised if you’re sent out on a last-minute search party to look in spots around the house for leavening.A good leavening tracker is always on the lookout.
A good Christian is already safe and sound in the assurance of Jesus, not in the practice of removing leavening.
28 comments:
I have a long term friend from our industry who is Seventh Day Adventist. His branch does keep at least some of the OC holydays, and I was quite amazed to learn that in preparation for the DUB, his son-in-law would literally remove the seats from their cars and trucks to carefully vacuum all the hidden areas for crumbs containing leavening agents. Amazing!
BB
ATTENTION COG YOUTH! Satan is hiding in cookie crumbs under your sofa cushions. Look for him there, not in the Christ-denying actions of your church leaders!
The Jews make "the search for chametz (leavening)" kind of fun.
10 pieces of wrapped leavening are hidden around the house, and before the Passover, the children go about in a sort of scavenger hunt to find it. It is a joyous , laughter filled event.
Winners/finders get either candy or a gift etc.
Sounds like fun!
COGWA aren't perfect but at least their not trying to force their members, like control freaks, to observe the NTBMO with a hosted meal like other big COG groups. And if brethren don't comply their branded unhospitable.
When did GOD decree to observe NTBMO you had to do a hosted meal to please wannabe Herbert Armstrong's ??
Children, adult leaven is destroying the church. False, greedy, lying ministers and self deluded prophets are the leaven of the church. Just like Christ and the money changers, throw the bums out. Grab them by their hands and feet and heave ho. Most are too old to effectively resist you.
Gotta do the works (deleavening), before you get the grace (Passover).
It only makes sense. Doesn't it?
Again I want to ask anyone still in an acog, If sin is the transgression of the law, just how are you able to "remove sin from our lives." (quoted from Karen's article)
Once you've transgressed God's law, you've sinned, so how do YOU remove that sin?
Talk about removing Jesus from the entire process. Just this one historic tradition of the former WCG, being continued by many in the acogs, proves without a shadow of a doubt just how legalistic, self righteous, and without Jesus Christ the WCG was.
As I've said before for those of us who still keep the days, the crumbs in your toaster, in your couch, under the seats of your car, would symbolically (isn't that the whole point of the days, symbology?) picture past sins which are forgiven if you truly accepted Christ's sacrifice. Those crumbs are moot.
Even that loaf of bread doesn't symbolize sin during the seven days, not until you eat it. That loaf of bread, logically, would symbolically picture the sinful practices that we struggle with.
If we're an alcoholic, if we steal, if we watch porn, putting that loaf of bread out symbolically pictures fleeing from our weaknesses, fleeing from that bottle of beer, from that porn site.
The sabbath and feast days are the lesser matters of the law, if you keep the days of unleavened bread perfectly, but refuse to flee from that beer, or flee from that porn site the other 51 weeks of the year then you've missed the whole point. That one week in your life is pointless if you don't learn from it, or practice what you've learned.
The point is what do we do in our lives, the other 51 weeks? Do we live as the Father and Christ want us to live, or do we just live by the letter of the law? We should do the former and not leave the latter undone.
Kevin McMillen
Kevinmcmillen64@gmail.com
R.L. You can't be any more wrong!!!!!
We get the grace (Passover) so we can "do" the works (avoiding sin).
Eph 2:8 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 - Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 - For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Notice verse 8, we are saved by grace, now notice verse 10, we were created to do good works, works that we should walk in.
What you've done with your comment is to make grace something that we can work for.
If you truly believe that, and if you've been in the church for any length of time, that's really sad.
No wonder we who keep the Sabbath and Feasts get a bad rap, so many just don't understand.
The entire process of salvation is accomplished by God, there's absolutely nothing that we do for salvation. We don't choose to be called, we don't choose to be chosen. Faith is even something that we of ourselves can't "get". Faith is a gift of God too.
When it comes to salvation there is only one thing that we, ourselves, can """DO""", and that is reject it. We can refuse to obey God.
Kevin McMillen
Kevinmcmillen64@gmail.com
The whole point of putting out the leaven was to symbolize (foreshadow) what can be done now through the power of the Mind of Christ by the Spirit within you. Kevin makes an excellent comparison of what the Days symbolized compared to the reality of what can happen with Christ in You - the hope of Glory.
What the COG's are doing is focusing on the symbology instead of the reality. Instead of stopping the actual sin, they instead throw out a loaf of bread - which is just a symbol of the sin, not the actual sin. "We throw out leaven to picture the removal of sin". Alright, why not just focus on Christ who through Him you can do all things through He who lives within you? Sure - focus on going to the restaurant and avoiding eating a dinner roll, and you think you've got it all down when the whole time you're having lustful thoughts about whoever. Sure, clean out every crumb in the house, but lose your temper when you catch your son or daughter eating a Candy Bar after sunset. Sure, eat your Matzo, make your Unleavened Bread, go only from the Church of God Recipe Cookbook and make snacks, but refuse to acknowledge that it's Christ in You, the true Unleavened Bread, Who, through Him, can bring you to repentance and give you the gift of Eternal Life through Him who died for us, and lives IN us.
But go on then, focus on the symbology. Spend all the time throwing out a loaf of bread instead of focusing on Jesus who made it possible to actually remove the actual sin - not going back to a time when the only thing that represented what Jesus could do was leaven.
Sure, it's fine to remove the leaven if you choose to. Just don't lose sight of the reality of what is available with the Gift of the Holy Spirit, who through Him can bring about the remission of sins. Jesus is far more capable in helping you to remove sin then you are focusing on the past year of Wonder Bread lurking in your couch cushions.
Kevin
In Ep 2.8, the gift of God is grace, not faith. Faith (belief in Gods way) has to be acquired through personal effort. That so many so called Christians believe in bully morality is proof of this.
The curious thing about using leavening to picture sin is that I only recall one time when Jesus mentioned leavening and it was in a parable about how the Kingdom of God would permeate everything.
So much thought wasted on nonsense.
Mickey,
Mat 16:6 - Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
Kevin McMillen
Kevinmcmillen64@gmail.com
Anonymous Kevin McMillen,April 12, 2019 at 3:11 PM, said: "...Again I want to ask anyone still in an acog, If sin is the transgression of the law, just how are you able to "remove sin from our lives." (quoted from Karen's article)
Answer? You can't do it.
Kevin, continued with another question: "...Once you've transgressed God's law, you've sinned, so how do YOU remove that sin?..."
You don't; you pay those wages:death!
"For the wages of sin is death..." Roman 6:23
Why not? Death, at least once, has been appointed:
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die..." Heb 9:27
Incidentally, it would do all of us well to keep in mind the following words:
"He that committeth sin is of the devil..." I John 3:8 AND
"Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?" James 4:5
"For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope," Romans 8:20
Although the creation had no choice in that vanity, sin isn't as easy to get rid of as tossing out leavened items.
Kevin, further states: "...Talk about removing Jesus from the entire process. Just this one historic tradition of the former WCG, being continued by many in the acogs, proves without a shadow of a doubt just how legalistic, self righteous, and without Jesus Christ the WCG was..."
And yes, we all had our part in that; it's just a matter of degree! Besides, all the world has been deceived, and wcg, and us, were not any exception to that.
Additionally, there is good reason we are told the following:
"Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of thy name: and deliver us, and purge away our sins, for thy name’s sake." Psalm 79:9
"The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." John 1:29
"Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:" I Cor 5:7
Finally, Kevin commented with: "...As I've said before for those of us who still keep the days, the crumbs in your toaster, in your couch, under the seats of your car, would symbolically (isn't that the whole point of the days, symbology?) picture past sins which are forgiven if you truly accepted Christ's sacrifice. Those crumbs are moot..."
Nobody is going to perfectly clean all of the leaven out of their homes, floor cracks, quarters, nickels and dimes! Sin isn't gotten rid of so easily, either, but God must do it by the power of His Spirit through His Son.
When leaven is found amongst us during those days of unleavened bread it is a reminder, but of what? Of how prevalent sin really is in all of our lives, of how difficult it is to get rid of and successfully remove, that if God does not remove sin, or purge it away, then who will? Well, we already had that answer in the verses cited above.
And yes, there are reasons as to why the 7 Days (not 6 or 8) of Unleavened Bread including 2 holy convocations (not just 1 holy convocation like for Feast of Tabernacles), and other annual Holy Days, have been established by God. They help explain God's true Plan of Salvation to eventually save all humanity and ultimately take and destroy the primary cause of sin: Satan and his angels.
Time will tell...
John
Kevin, I actually agree with you. My tongue was a bit in my cheek, with that comment.
And yet, sad to say, isn't that how COG's have taught it over the years to a great extent? Symbolized by weeks of leaven searching, before they spend 60-90 minutes at the Passover?
(One Passover I attended was 55 minutes from start to finish. The Elder moved through the Scriptures that quickly.)
Back in about 2003, a regular poster on another forum shared that Origen believed and taught that we humans are actually the demon spirits incarnated, being given a chance at redemption by a loving Father God, who is unwilling to lose any of His children.
I don’t know that I believe that. However, it does have a certain amount of merit when you consider the fact that we do not enter life tabula rasa. There are characteristics and traits, things that seem hard-wired into us, and not all of them good, from the time we first draw breath.
I have spent many hours in introspection over the years since leaving Armstrongism, pondering what damage and evils had come directly from the Armstrongism itself, and what had actually predated our family’s entry into the cult. I analyzed my first memories, often wracking my brain for them. There was quite a bit of preexisting “stuff” there, prior to the spiritual rape of Armstrongism. There were existing conditions that Armstrongism had made worse or at the very least was incapable of correcting, and there was plenty that Armstrongism had definitely caused. Just the implications of misusing “let the dead bury the dead” as an all purpose paradigm are staggering in and of itself!
Fortunately, I had the luxury of indulging in said process. I realize that this is something that people who were raised from birth in Armstrongism do not possess. They have no before and after basis for comparison and evaluation. Personally, I find it very enlightening in my struggle to trace the badness in my life, so that it can be dealt with. In some cases, it runs so deep that only God’s transformation of us will ever get rid of it completely. I liken it to a computer tech needing to uninstall a software program which has become corrupt, and to either reinstall it from the original source, or replace it with a newer version which has been created to eliminate the glitches. A computer does have self-diagnostics which can be run, making repairs to an extent, but there are some problems requiring an outside source, and some problems so deep that the hard drive must be wiped. No need to elaborate on that, because I’m certain that everyone “gets” the parallels.
BB
It's pretty clear that Paul taught Church to keep the feast of unleavened bread. There is a lesson to be learned from it. Multiple lessons actually, and one of them is that we cannot depend on ourselves to get rid of sin. It seems to me that people that turn everything inside out to get rid of what essentially is dirt are basically demonstrating that they rely on themselves.
Anonymous said...
Kevin
In Ep 2.8, the gift of God is grace, not faith. Faith (belief in Gods way) has to be acquired through personal effort. That so many so called Christians believe in bully morality is proof of this.
April 12, 2019 at 7:55 PM
**************************************
I actually responded to this over eight hours ago but my tablet is acting up so it must have gotten lost in cyber space. Let's try it again.
Anonymous seems to think that he got me, but let's see what the bible says.
1Co 12:1 - Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
1Co 12:9 - To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
Although anonymous 7:55 comes across as "knowing" that faith isn't a gift, the bible says otherwise.
In fact God is the one that deals out that gift of faith.
Rom 12:3 - For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
When will posters learn to shut up until they have the facts?
Kevin McMillen
Kevinmcmillen64@gmail.com
Thanks Kevin McMillan. I should have done a quick search instead of just relying on my memory :)
Kevin
"Learn to shut up until they have the facts?" Spoken like a redneck. To those God calls, He opens up their minds to the truth. So a certain amount of this 'faith' is given free of charge. However, it's a Christians responsibility to increase this faith through bible study and living by the ten commandments. Christ's disciples asked Him to increase their faith. Did Christ just wave a magic wand? No! He said in effect, work hard. One sees this in services. There are many members and ministers who believe that bully morality is superior to the ten commandments morality.
There are some things God can't do, which is why there is Satan and his demons. God can't give people the conviction that the ten commandments 'work.' This 'faith' can only be acquired through personal effort.
BB,April 13, 2019 at 10:32 AM, said: "...There are characteristics and traits, things that seem hard-wired into us, and not all of them good, from the time we first draw breath.
I have spent many hours in introspection over the years since leaving Armstrongism, pondering what damage and evils had come...Personally, I find it very enlightening in my struggle to trace the badness in my life, so that it can be dealt with. In some cases, it runs so deep that only God’s transformation of us will ever get rid of it completely. I liken it to a computer tech needing to uninstall a software program which has become corrupt, and to either reinstall it from the original source, or replace it with a newer version which has been created to eliminate the glitches. A computer does have self-diagnostics which can be run, making repairs to an extent, but there are some problems requiring an outside source, and some problems so deep that the hard drive must be wiped. No need to elaborate on that, because I’m certain that everyone “gets” the parallels..."
BB, speaking about electronic things, I was reminded of a transcript of a sermon given on 9 August 1997, about 22 years ago. FWIIW, here's a portion of it:
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"...Satan was allowed to put – for lack of better words we’re going to use these two words – he was allowed to put a “program” or a “computer chip,” really his spirit into the mind of man. It works the same way as a computer chip. His spirit would absolutely control man’s thinking. You can’t think God’s way! You think the way they do in the world. That’s why you haven’t grown. It’s this program. You know; with a computer program, whatever is in that program, that’s where you can do all kinds of nifty things. But if you try to go beyond the bounds of the program, the computer says: “retry, abort, get out!” Satan was able to put this within us.
Now, God made human nature. God made human nature, and He said it was good. God put human nature in every human being. He made it, and it was perfect, and was good and it is still there today. Your human nature is good. It’s the way God made it, and there was nothing wrong with your human nature, but old Satan comes along and puts the computer chip (his spirit) within you. I’m not speaking of a “possession” here, but this computer chip, this program he has been allowed to put into every human being obviously rules humans. Look around you!
Satan has taught us that human nature was bad! He taught us that something God made was bad! He taught us this lie to cover up the Satanic nature that he put into us. He put the Satanic nature into us, and that’s what’s bad. That, brethren, unfortunately, will not depart from us until we die – and not by suicide, but by natural causes when you die. That’s when that happens. I don’t want someone thinking that they should run out and kill themselves, because that’s against God’s Law. That’s murder. We shouldn’t do that. Mistakes are made, but never are we supposed to do that.
Satan controls man and makes man do evil. Remember Paul? Paul talks about this in Romans 7:21. He says:
Romans 7:21 “I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.”
If Paul had the problem, don’t you think you have the same problem? Of course!
Romans 8:7, talks about the carnal mind:
Romans 8:7 “Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the Law of God, neither indeed can be.”
That’s not human nature! This is this carnal mind: this Satanic mind that has been placed within us. The carnal mind is hatred against God. When God made Adam and Eve, they were subject to Him. They did what He wanted. They loved it. All of a sudden Satan was there – BOOM – he put this in their minds. All of a sudden they had a hatred toward God..."
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John
No problem Mickey. By the way, you're so fine.
Betcha get tired of that. 😁
Kevin
John, I understand the enmity with God part described so eloquently by yourself and Paul. That is certainly part of what every human must deal with and need to be reminded of from time to time. However, what I was referring to primarily falls into the classification of borderline personality disorders.
Let’s take paranoia as an example. From my earliest recollections, I was irrationally paranoid about fire. When I would hear fire sirens, I would freak out and run to my nearest parent. On one occasion, I ran to my mother who was ironing, accidentally knocked the iron from her hand, it landed on my arm and burned me. I had to be taken to the doctor. No scars. I was also constantly in fear of the house burning down. Eventually, those irrational fears ran their course. Unfortunately, about that time, the Radio Church of God came along, and as you might imagine I became paranoid about the Germans. Proving beyond shadow of doubt that Germans are not Assyrians, observing German people for decades, and realizing that the primary dna of Americans is German and not Anglo made those fears go away. Armstrongism did not cause or help me with paranoia, but they exploited it and made it worse. I still deal with irrational fears even today, and although they can be stressful and cause high blood pressure, they are manageable and I lead a successful life, even sometimes being prevented by my paranoia from making some serious mistakes.
Lets discuss patterns involved in dealing with people. For twenty years, while in Armstrongism, my natural empathy for others was programmed away by HWA’s misapplication of “Let the dead bury the dead.” We were taught that the people outside of the church were of no concern to us, whether they might be colleagues at school or work, or even family. They were going to be tortured and die either by nuclear bombs, pestilence, or at the hands of the Germans and would come up in the second rez. This problem was two-pronged, because the people inside the church ratted on one another to the ministry, beat the crap out of their kids, became indifferent to unnecessary death through the avoidance of the medical profession, and were programmed to believe that Satan’s attacks on us always came from unconverted people whom he used. It has taken years to repair that damage, but even so, deep feelings of natural empathy were destroyed by our former church. I’ve been able to become an empath through logic and the knowledge of what is right, but it’s not the same as doing it from the innate feelings which were destroyed by bad religious programming. Fortunately, in my post-Armstrong years, I’ve been surrounded mostly by exemplary good people who always act from the best intention. These are folks who inspire empathy.
So there you have it. Two examples of undesirable hard-wiring, two different sources, two types of remedial action required to combat. Both must be fought, and both will ultimately require God’s healing or transformation before they completely go away.
There are certainly other undesirable areas known to infect or affect human consciousness, such as all the filthy words we’ve heard throughout out lifetime that occasionally pop into our minds, fetishes, and irrational anger that was either there when we were born or was provoked at some point by the ways in which we were handled. There are dozens of these areas that all introspective people note as being undesirable, and strive to correct or elliminate. I don’t believe Satan deserves 100% of the blame. Armstrongism is most certainly culpable, as is the surrounding world, and the things that we do to ourselves. It’s important to know the source so that we can pursue the correct actions to eliminate all of the badness that we can.
At one time, I believed in massive retaliation. I had traced this back to infancy. Someone who had been sent into my life, and whom I valued very much, persuaded me that our best course is to break, not perpetuate, bad cycles.
BB
BB, have you ever been tested for the MTHFR gene muatation?
I've always known that my anxiety and hypertension were in the genes but just got it confirmed last week. I tested positive for the MTHFR Heterozygous c677t mutation. With that my body only methylates about 60% of the folate, causing hyperhomocysteine levels.
Here's an interesting link: https://mthfrexperts.com
First thing one must do if they have this is quit taking any vitamins with folic acid and take methylated folate instead.
You can find a good methylated B complex for cheap on Amazon if needed.
Kevin
I haven’t been to the doctor in probably 25 years, Kev, except for the dentist, of course. But, I did recently quit drinking coffee. The way I always brewed it, it was probably just about as strong as pure speed, anyway.
Most the time, I purge the anxiety through vigorous exercise, weight training, or jamming on my guitar. Works for me.
BB
Sounds good, but if you do take a multivitamin I'd suggest switching to a methylated multi.
I've found it nearly impossible to lose weight but since starting the methylated b complex 4 days ago I've lost four pounds and hopefully soon I'll notice big changes in anxiety.
Kevin
BB wrote: "...Lets discuss patterns involved in dealing with people. For twenty years, while in Armstrongism, my natural empathy for others was programmed away by HWA’s misapplication of “Let the dead bury the dead.” We were taught that the people outside of the church were of no concern to us, whether they might be colleagues at school or work, or even family. They were going to be tortured and die either by nuclear bombs, pestilence, or at the hands of the Germans and would come up in the second rez..."
I appreciated your comments and I can see you had “borderline personality disorders” in mind, while I was thinking about some verses that deal with man’s mind via the spirit of Satan and a particular “spirit in man,” most do not consider. I will share some additional thoughts with you along this line and, yes, it would be helpful to keep in mind that God created good and evil (Isaiah 45:7) for His purpose.
"Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that NOW WORKETH IN the children of disobedience:" Eph 2:2
"...The spirit that dwelleth IN US lusteth to envy..." James 4:5
"And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are TAKEN CAPTIVE by him at HIS WILL." 2 Tim 2:26
"He that committeth sin is OF the devil..." I John 3:8
And a couple of OT verses:
Isa 19:14 The LORD hath mingled a perverse spirit IN the midst thereof: and they have CAUSED Egypt to ERR in every work thereof, as a drunken man staggereth in his vomit.
Hos 4:12 My people ask counsel at their stocks, and their staff declareth unto them: for the spirit of whoredoms hath CAUSED them to ERR, and they have gone a whoring from under their God.
There is an ultimate solution (e.g. Jeremiah 32:37-42) only God can really achieve in His time and in His way as part of His Plan of Salvation for humanity:
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit WITHIN you, and CAUSE you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
But, putting those verses aside, and thinking about the dead burying the dead via HWA's misapplication. Well, what's new? Most of prophecy was misapplied then also...and still is misapplied to this day, but who knew? It is like spiritual Junk Food: not nourishing, but we all ate it.
I've learned some good things (Milk and lots of Junk Food) from HWA, as well as from JWTSenior, but amongst the learning there was a mixture of good and evil. Why not? The unrevealed “man of sin” has been allowed to be active while sitting in the temple of God for approximately 2,000 years now…
But, back to that burying the dead and some context:
Matthew 8:21 And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father.
:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.
Jesus was the first of the Firstfruits (FFs) to come along and be sealed by God, and more were going to follow. Christ knew nobody would come to Him unless His Father "drew," meaning "drags," one. Christ knew this particular disciple wasn't going to follow, so just let the dead bury their dead, or "like virtually most of this world, leave and go do your own thing for now; God will pick you up later (time of that second rez)!"
One is either going to be part of the 1st resurrection as sealed FFs (no choice on their part, but "dragged" by the Father to Christ like reeling a fish into a boat (Of course, the fish doesn't want to get in the boat...hence the need for dragging). Who really wants to follow God (e.g. Jer 10:23; Rom 8:7) in anything, anyway?
And "the rest?" They, as you said: "...would come up in the second rez..."; AND there is no 3rd rez! As you/we now know, Matthew 8 had nothing to do with Germans and/or Fear Religion, but the misapplication, as with so many Bible verses, was allowed.
To be continued…
John
Continuing…
This entire creation was made (Romans 8:20) subject to vanity...and not by our choice.
The verses cited above show that all human beings are going to encounter in our lives the following:
1. Sin...Satan's existence and impact in our lives (e.g. Rom 7:17, 20)
2. Wages of sin...it's been appointed: to die once.
3. Learn to hate evil...to one degree or another we will all experience it (Rom 7:21), and eventually come to hate it.
Job looked at life this way: "When I looked for good, then evil came unto me: and when I waited for light, there came darkness." Job 30:26
Paul has a similar way of saying that in Gal 5:17 "For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would."
HWA, JWTSenior, all of us were/are all caught up in this to one degree or another.
But, have you lost out on salvation yet? No, and you won’t! I guess I should perhaps say, like some old TV show: “Believe it or not!”
We all suffer to one degree or another. Different strokes for different folks, apparently, but are we coming to discern between good and evil and leaning to hate evil? Even Christ learned obedience through suffering. Will be any different for us?
Joseph reminded his brothers: "But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive." Genesis 50:20
God worked that all out…for good, and it is a hint of what God has in store for all humanity before all is said and done.
God’s Plan of Salvation is very long range. For example, in conclusion, God will yet fulfill the following verses regarding Israel:
Jeremiah 32:37 Behold, I will GATHER them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them AGAIN unto this place, and I will CAUSE them to dwell safely:
:38 And they shall be MY people, and I will be their God:
:39 And I will GIVE them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
:40 And I will MAKE an everlasting covenant with them, that I will NOT turn away from them, to do them good; but I will PUT my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.
:41 Yea, I will REJOICE over them to do them good, and I will PLANT them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.
:42 For thus saith the LORD; Like as I have brought all this great EVIL upon this people, so will I bring upon them all the GOOD that I HAVE PROMISED them.
Of course, if those verses are true, they won’t be fulfilled until AFTER Satan is loosed from the pit for a short/little time/season and then killed, which means those verses won’t be fulfilled until the time of the Great Last Day, aka the Eighth Day, when the second resurrection occurs. The Mickey Mouse Millennium, is a myth, although with Satan in the pit there will be somewhat of a human utopia established for that 1,000 years, but then that utopia will fail when Satan exits that pit for a season, causing deception and war..
But, time will tell…
John
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