Have you always known deep down in your inner most being that spanking your children is wrong?
Do you feel a connection to other Christian mothers who have said things like this concerning spanking their children?
* "I would just get an ache in my chest or a feeling" (Quotation - Lelia Schott)
* "It just felt wrong to me …"
* "I did not listen to my heart …"
* "but something just felt wrong … "
* "I have always felt an almost visceral reaction at the mention of spanking"
Have you been told: 'You are too sensitive!"
Have you felt uncomfortable in your own body based on what you know is the truth?
Have you been told never ever to listen to or trust you internal intuitive leadings?
Have you ever been told that there is something wrong with you because you feel it is wrong to hit your child?
Have you felt conflicted internally about what your inner most being is telling you compared to what you have learned from the Bible about spanking children?
If you have felt this tug of war of internal leadings compared to external information from the Bible, this new book may help answer some of the questions you may have about your internal inner most being and what is teaches you compared to the teachings of the Word of God.
What are Christian mothers saying about this book?
The reviews for this book are very humbling. Here are a few of the five star reviews from Amazon:
5.0 out of 5 stars Fascinating and difficult to put down!
Reviewed in the United States on December 13, 2020
Verified Purchase
I am not even completely through this book but it is a page turner for sure. I am about 3/4 of the way through it. I am a mother and was intrigued to read this as I've felt from a very young age that mothers were given intuition by God to lead, guide, and care for their young. What has me floored is how much scripture actually does point to this beautiful truth that I've known to be true. The author has done a wonderful job of bringing these verses to light!
Been blessed by Samuel Martins books!
Reviewed in the United States on December 6, 2020
Verified Purchase
Samuel Martin's first Thy Rod and thy Staff book was the first gentle parenting book I read and it was like a breath of fresh air. I've always felt like there was something wrong with so many Christians using scriptures to say that the Bible tells us to spank. When I came across that book everything made so much sense. Samuel Martin is very thorough and explains things from a biblical perspective in great detail. This book has been a huge blessing as well and it has made me feel more confident in following those God given instincts as a wife and mother. May God bless the Author and may God bless others with the teachings in this book!
Maternal wisdom comes from God
Reviewed in the United States on December 1, 2020
This book uses an in depth look at the Hebrew roots of scripture to reveal that God really did create our intuitions to guide us. The author shares examples from the experiences of real life mothers parenting
their children following God's leading in their hearts. He also debunks the idea that we should ignore our motherly desire to protect our children and use spanking to discipline anyway. God created those maternal instincts and declared them good! As a mother, it is validating to be seen and heard. Godly discipline without spanking is not only possible, it is beautiful and it is biblical. Thank you for writing this book!
If you want to learn more about this book, check it out on Amazon:
Thy Rod and Thy Staff They Comfort Me - Book III: A Biblical Study on Maternal Intuition and its link to the Issue of Spanking Children
Praying that it blesses you.
Samuel Martin
www.biblechild.com
22 comments:
However, Our "Rod" (Meredith) and his staff at HQ were anything but comforting! :)
Very timely, and I consider this to be a public service spot!
During most of the year, kids' exposure to their ACOG parents is limited in that most of the weekdays they are in school. This provides a sort of an escape valve, and relief from the incessant criticism and punishments administered by their parents. Had it not been for these precious hours away from home, I would not have survived my childhood.
During the Feast, the kids don't have that escape valve, because they are constantly with their parents who are profiling for the ministers and brethren, demonstrating their church approved parenting skills for all to see. This is a time of the year that can be brutal for kids, especially for teenagers who tend to slip up in their efforts to suppress their normal personalities. We all might want to be remembering these kids who are stuck in the ACOG cults, especially the really fascist splinters.
Dennis said:
However, Our "Rod" (Meredith) and his staff at HQ were anything but comforting! :)
So what?
As usual Dennis, your statements have lots of inferences, and innuendoes, but no facts. Thus, leaving the reader to concoct all the evil fantasies he/she can imagine. And, thus believes they know the facts, which aren’t.
Specify, give us some real, honest, not made up, facts, or implied facts, which are a dime a dozen.
It's a general statement based on personal ministerial experiences and countless sermons and classes and articles written. Actually a play on the words of the real topic of the post.
I an many others in the student body and ministry could fill in the blanks but that was not the intent of my comment.
Perhaps I should have simply repeated the fact that because of the "Child Rearing" advice by GTA and the Church, when my wife was 18 and heading out the door to AC she got her last spanking at home. She was also thought to have been a bit too haughty with her long blonde hair so that was cut off as well by her father to return her to a state of WCG humility as a young woman. This would be more to the point of the posting I admit.
It was a rare day that I or my siblings were not spanked and Dennis did nothing to help; rather he stood for the organization that insisted the spankings were required as godly parenting.
I believe in forgiving, regardless of whether an offender offers an apology.
However, I don't expect that to be true of all who endured childhood in a COG.
Many are still suffering.
Surely Dennis meant no harm in his comment - but that doesn't mean anything he could say on the subject is harmless; unless his comments are kept only to an apology for being an authority figure and enforcer for such an abusive cult.
I'm pointing this out as a service to Dennis to consider not commenting or only commenting by apologizing.
Denial of involvement by way a glib comment is in poor taste and can be painful to some.
The best quote I ever saw on here about Bob Thiel is that he is nothing more than a boil on satans butt.
Oh, Dennis, I wish you hadn't shared that information about your wife! The day before departing for AC, I had had about enough abuse, and refused to submit to my last spanking. I shot my mom the double bird and yelled "F*ck you, b#tch!" at her. We had a Mexican standoff, until she threatened to call the minister and get my acceptance cancelled. I realized that if I were ever to escape my prison, I would have to endure one more spanking. A year earlier, I had also suffered the indignity of a crew cut allegedly for my vanity. This was exactly the sort of crap we young church kids endured back in that era. And people wondered why I had as little to do with the parents as possible right up until the day they died. Never did develop any kind of relationship with them.
Part 2 (I'm on a roll!) A couple months earlier, in the middle of a forced fast (another sadistic punishment technique), my nose began spontaneously gushing blood during a confrontation with my dad. We were up on the roof cleaning storm gutters and he just kept picking at me. I ran to my room, and eventually he came up to continue the confrontation. I gave him an ultimatum that either they lighten up or I was going to join the US Marine Corps (which I could do because I was then 18.) They thought they were on a mission from God, and of course never did lighten up.
One of my brothers, when he purchased a stereo while at AC, was told by my parents that either he sell it, or they were going to get him expelled from college and he could go to Vietnam.
They never did learn! (like I said, mission from God). My dad also threw another brother through a plate glass window. There are more stories, and I'm certain that my siblings have more from after I left home.
Church leaders have been viscious brutes. I was raises by one. And i have raised numerous happy children to adults now. Save my oldest a bit as that was how I learned so much what not to do... Including overly harsh spanking.
Children need the balance of physical pain to offest their as yet uncontrolable body. I have found this lasts about to 5 years old. And a single hand swat to the rear or only extremely rarely two. And they gain reapect for parents and listen in time of crisis where danger can kill a child. And the only thing savjng them is their fear of their parents. Nothing more.
To remove this fear is to invite true disaster to a family.
I find the extreme used to justify the opposite extreme to be foolish and unwise.
Most church kids are homescholled anon 2:03. Oops.
If that is true, 2:03, it is not only indicative of ever deepening cultic behavior, it also means that these kids are being deprived of quality education, an opportunity to develop the social skills necessary for success later on in their lives, and it also removes the kids from the oversight of officials who are required under penalty of the law to report any evidence of child abuse.
I can understand members of the stricter splinters like PCG and RCG doing the home school thing, but do you know for a fact that LCG, UCG, COGWA, and the Teddy cults recommend home schooling?
There were a heck of a lot of people in the old WCG who, although sincere, suffered from terminal dumbness. I can't imagine very many of the parents in our local congregation having been even remotely capable of providing an adequate education for their children at home. Could you teach Algebra, Trigonometry, or a foreign language to your children?
When I was at AC, none of the Imperial students were able to proficiency out of what was generally called "bonehead" English. Most of the entering class except those from disadvantaged areas of the US had entrance test scores high enough that they were not required to take English. If the church's school system were deficient in this manner, how could church members at home do any better?
When we observe human behavior like the Prophet Bob rubbing his nose, we find it intriguing and speculate on what it means. Obviously, the action means something but we can only guess at its meaning. Likewise, it is intriguing to see DennisCDiehl be the first to comment on a post related to abuses he supported by cashing his paychecks. The deflection of blame onto Spanky Meredith is also intriguing. The legacy of the WCG is very sad for victims and for perpetrators. My guess is that DennisCDiehl has much work remaining to do in his personal healing - work better done privately and without his continuous preaching, as his public offerings are laden with tics and tells, as well as triggers for those who were abused.
I was raised by a church leader (a low-ranking minister). I was spanked on occasion. It was unpleasant of course (that's the point really) but, I mostly have no complaints because I thought it was just. They had clearly-explained rules, and I got in trouble only if I broke the clearly-explained rules. My parents were fairly thoughtful and careful, and showed mercy on several occasions that I remember. They didn't spank me just because they were mad. When we were behaving ourselves, we all had a good family life, the parents were terrific and fun and loved us and nurtured us.
If a parent doesn't spank, but shouts and rants instead, then I don't see that as much of an improvement. That is, poor parenting can still be emotionally abusive even in the absence of laying a finger on a child.
So based on my own childhood experiences, I reckon a spanking ban is misguided and misses the essential points of what builds a psychologically healthy person.
We just "counted coup" in our house growing up on the Rez.
For our family, it was modeled after one of the Native American traditional ways, which involves shaming by just the act of gently touching them, and, it is hoped, persuading him to admit defeat, without having to be spanked.
There is a theological underpinning for the Armstrongist view of corporeal punishment for children. It is founded on the misunderstanding Armstrongists have concerning the Law of Moses. Rod Meredith wrote an article titled "Is Obedience to God Required for Salvation," circa 1956. This article deals extensively with the Ministration of Death. I will quote from that article after this abbreviated passage from Deuteronomy:
"If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them: . . . And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
Meredith argues principles that would mean that the stoning has been abrogated. But one wonders about the punitive spirit of this law. In that regard, Meredith states:
"Remember, (Mat. 5:17-20) that even the least commandment is still very much in force!"
So apparently the law regarding the stubborn son is still intact - just the stoning has been abrogated. Under the NC the stubborn son can be pardoned if he repents. Meredith states further:
"God's laws — His commandments, statutes and judgments — are to be in our hearts — we are to live them by the power of God's Spirit."
In simple English, you can take draconian punitive action against your stubborn son - you just can't kill him. This is a good illustration of where a theological misunderstanding of the place of the Mosaic Law can take you. The Ministration of Death is gone because Mosaic Law is gone. There is no need to try to patch up the Mosaic Law and keep it. Christ established the NC in his blood.
I wonder how much "air time" Jesus is getting in the "camp of Israel" at the FoT this year? As many of you know, there was at one time a distinct OT flavor to the conduct of operations at the FoT. It was really all about Moses and not Jesus. It used to be about rules, regulations, enforcement, policing, deacons and racial segregation. I don't know - I suppose it could be different now.
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I knew a kid who never got spanked. He was the biggest brat you ever knew. So other kids beat him up.
This post has nothing to do with COVID and I will delete any posts tied into it.
My Dad said to me one time, Son, you know I don’t like your religion! But, I have to say, what you’ve done with your children I really respect. Why, I asked. He said, because they are not like the tantrum throwing brats your cousins have.
What made the difference? Very simple, proper discipline vs no discipline at home. (By the way, one of my cousin’s kids found the samurai sword my Dad got in Japan at the end of WWII, and used it to chop on a cinder block. A real treasure destroyed. Plus, no discipline after the fact, not even verbally. But, of course none of the critics here would care if it had been theirs, right?
Now, what was the “proper” discipline? Well, it came from what I was taught at AC about child training. But, first, let me mention this about my Dad. He was not a church goer, did not claim to be any specific denomination, but in his own way believed in “God.” Anyway, one day when I was old enough to notice, and remember things, I saw his shirtless back. Up and down his back was a row of about 1” stripes. There was about a dozen crisscrossing his back. I asked how he got them. From his Dad, he said. He beat my Dad with a rubber hose while a kid. My Dad never told me what he did that got him the beating.
So that’s the extreme to what I was taught at Ambassador. So, what was I taught? Here it is:
1. If a child is doing something wrong, tell them once to stop. Don’t keep repeating yourself with threats.
2. The second response is action.
3. Explain your response and why.
4. Administer the punishment properly, based on the child’s age.
5. Physical punishment must NEVER bruise the child, or leave marks.
6. The child must NEVER be smacked on the face.
7. If very young but old enough to understand, then “smack” the back of their hand just enough to sting a little. Once.
8. Older children should be swatted only on the “seat of learning.” And, only hard enough to sting a little. And, NEVER with your hand. Use a small paddle, NEVER a belt, switch, or anything that would cut the skin.
9. Afterwards ALWAYS immediately hug your child, and with love, explain to your child you love them, and why the “punishment” and what the correct action should be.
After reading the posts so far, nobody was following the college and church teachings on child rearing. They all just read the part that said children need discipline, and the parents jumped in to practice my grandfather’s method. That is WRONG.
Finally, my youngest daughter, now in her 40’s, said she used to laugh at me when she got spanked. She said I looked so serious but that it didn’t really hurt much. But, she got the message.
Now, I’m curious to see how many will try to tear apart the real teaching that the new ministers, without child rearing experience, didn’t pass on in their congregations! Maybe , like Dennis, etal?
I've witnessed an AC trained leader admit years later to NOT following WCG child rearing practice. Admitted to using the carrot instead of the stick. Went into detail about how he encouraged and rewarded his children's behaviour and doing well with holidays!
How many more from AC used the carrot instead of the stick ?
11.31 AM
But your "real teaching" was not the church culture. As you said, your above ideal approach to punishment wasn't taught by the ministers.
You ask us to look away from reality and exclusively look at some nice words spoken at AC, then accuse us of unjustly tearing apart your point of view since it's not the reality.
My bible tells me to know them by their fruits rather than some pretty words spoken at AC.
7:09, you missed my whole point. The main point was the ministers were NOT teaching what AC and the church taught. Thus, the mess we see today. So, instead of placing the blame where it should be, the atheists and other critics -promoting these websites, are here to help destroy the mess they created, telling everyone their mess was the college and churches’ fault.
The duty of the ministry was to pass on church teaching. They didn’t. Haven’t you ever asked why so many members and ministers became atheists so fast? Think about it. Use your mind.
Infiltration is a wonderful word. NT uses it in words like false brethren, in your midst, in your love feasts, etc. Why for example are atheists running sites for church people, why to accomplish their goal.
Nice point made. I gave very few spankings and received very few. I think they occasionally have their place and I can’t say any of the spankings hurt much…didn’t bring tears. But, good successful kids with better results than most those that completely refrained or those that were quite strict.
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