Is the Doctrine of the Trinity Suspect?
In the commentary thread for my last post (Should the Feast Days Be Kept?), the issue of the Trinity was raised and offered as evidence that Christians should be observing the Feasts and Sabbaths of Torah. “WHAT?” some of you will ask. It was asserted that Jesus of Nazareth was the God of the Old Testament – that Christ was the one who gave the Law to Moses. Hence, for them, the Law of Moses = the Law of Christ. And, of course, everyone knows that Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and forever! Now, admittedly, in the realm of human reasoning there is a superficial kind of logic to this assertion. However, as usual, if we dig a little deeper, the logic falls apart (because it relies on the Armstrongist binitarianism). In other words, a heresy built on the foundation of yet another heresy!
In response to one of the comments, I wrote: “The fourteenth chapter of John is critical to understanding this phenomenon. We read there: "6 Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you had known me, you would have known my Father also. From now on you do know him and have seen him.' 8 Philip said to him, 'Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.' 9 Jesus said to him, 'Have I been with you so long, and you still do not know me, Philip? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works. 11 Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves.'" (John 14:6-11) Jesus had already told them that he and the Father were ONE (John 10:30).
Likewise, Christ alluded to another part of the Godhead in that same chapter (14) of the Gospel of John. He said: "15 If you love me, you will keep my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever, 17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while and the world will see me no more, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 In that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you. 21 Whoever has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me. And he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him.' 22 Judas (not Iscariot) said to him, 'Lord, how is it that you will manifest yourself to us, and not to the world?' 23 Jesus answered him, 'If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. 24 Whoever does not love me does not keep my words. And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me." (John 14:15-24) Did you get that? Jesus promised that all three parts (Father, Son, Helper/Holy Spirit) would make their home with true Christians - God with and in us!”
In response, the commentator who relied on binitarianism quoted the following passages:
1 Jn 2:1 But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate [parakleton] before the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. (BSB).
Jn 14:16) And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Advocate [parakleton] to be with you forever— (BSB).
Rom 8:9 if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you
Gal 4:4) God sent forth [exapostello] his Son
Gal 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth [exapostello] the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
Now, the commentator obviously believed that these passages supported his/her binitarianism; but if we take a closer look, we see Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in these passages, and they appear as ONE and a part of each other.
Likewise, the same commentator cited a number of other passages that he/she believed would support his/her binitarianism. As one example, the commentator quoted John 1:1 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.” He/she then asked: “Why isn’t <it> ‘and the Word was with God and the HS’?” He/she, however, fails to acknowledge that later (in this same chapter) we read: “32 Then John testified, “I saw the Holy Spirit descending like a dove from heaven and resting upon him. 33 I didn’t know he was the one, but when God sent me to baptize with water, he told me, ‘The one on whom you see the Spirit descend and rest is the one who will baptize with the Holy Spirit.’ 34 I saw this happen to Jesus, so I testify that he is the Chosen One of God.” (John 1:32-34)
In similar fashion, the commentator quoted: “1Jn 1:3b and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.” Then asked: “Why isn’t our fellowship with the Father, Jesus Christ and the HS?” As is usually the case with proof texting, the commentator completely ignored what followed. In the second chapter of this same epistle, we read: “20 But you are not like that, for the Holy One has given you his Spirit, and all of you know the truth. 21 So I am writing to you not because you don’t know the truth but because you know the difference between truth and lies. 22 And who is a liar? Anyone who says that Jesus is not the Christ. Anyone who denies the Father and the Son is an antichrist. 23 Anyone who denies the Son doesn’t have the Father, either. But anyone who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
24 So you must remain faithful to what you have been taught from the beginning. If you do, you will remain in fellowship with the Son and with the Father. 25 And in this fellowship we enjoy the eternal life he promised us. 26 I am writing these things to warn you about those who want to lead you astray. 27 But you have received the Holy Spirit, and he lives within you, so you don’t need anyone to teach you what is true. For the Spirit teaches you everything you need to know, and what he teaches is true—it is not a lie. So just as he has taught you, remain in fellowship with Christ.” (I John 2:20-27)
I don’t know about you, but that sure sounds to me like John believed that the Holy Spirit was essential to maintaining our fellowship with the Father and the Son!
The commentator then went on to list “Well-wishes with two divine sources.” In this instance, the commentator pointed to the greetings in several epistles (mostly Paul’s):
Rom 1:7b Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
1 Cor 1:3 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
2 Cor 1:2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
Gal 1:3 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
Eph 1:2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
Phil 1:2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
2 Thess 1:2 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
1 Tim 1:2b Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
2 Tim 1:2b Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
Titus 1:4b Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
Philemon 3 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ
2 Pet 1:2 May grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and Jesus our Lord
2 John 3 Grace, mercy and peace will be with us from God the Father and from Jesus Christ the Father’s Son, in truth and love
--David E. Aune, Revelation 1-5, WBC, p.27.
Then, he/she went on to quote from Bullinger’s commentary on Revelation: “Nowhere do we find the Holy Spirit associated with the Father and the Son in any salutation. Not even in the Pauline Epistles”
REALLY? Please notice the rest of Paul’s salutation in his epistle to the Romans:
Romans 1: 1 This letter is from Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus, chosen by God to be an apostle and sent out to preach his Good News. 2 God promised this Good News long ago through his prophets in the holy Scriptures. 3 The Good News is about his Son. In his earthly life he was born into King David’s family line, 4 and he was shown to be the Son of God when he was raised from the dead by the power of the Holy Spirit. He is Jesus Christ our Lord. 5 Through Christ, God has given us the privilege and authority as apostles to tell Gentiles everywhere what God has done for them, so that they will believe and obey him, bringing glory to his name. 6 And you are included among those Gentiles who have been called to belong to Jesus Christ. 7 I am writing to all of you in Rome who are loved by God and are called to be his own holy people.” (Romans 1:1-7a)
Likewise, in his first epistle to the saints at Corinth, we read:
“6 Yet when I am among mature believers, I do speak with words of wisdom, but not the kind of wisdom that belongs to this world or to the rulers of this world, who are soon forgotten. 7 No, the wisdom we speak of is the mystery of God—his plan that was previously hidden, even though he made it for our ultimate glory before the world began. 8 But the rulers of this world have not understood it; if they had, they would not have crucified our glorious Lord. 9 That is what the Scriptures mean when they say, ‘No eye has seen, no ear has heard, and no mind has imagined what God has prepared for those who love him.’ 10 But it was to us that God revealed these things by his Spirit. For his Spirit searches out everything and shows us God’s deep secrets. 11 No one can know a person’s thoughts except that person’s own spirit, and no one can know God’s thoughts except God’s own Spirit. 12 And we have received God’s Spirit (not the world’s spirit), so we can know the wonderful things God has freely given us.” (I Corinthians 2:6-12)
The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit may not be mentioned in all of the salutations; but this trio is woven into the very fabric of the New Testament (and the Hebrew Scriptures). Indeed, some of the very passages which Armstrongists use to disprove the Trinity actually demonstrate the unity of the Godhead! In the first chapter of Genesis, we read that “the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters.” While in the New Testament, we read that God created all things by Jesus Christ (Ephesians 3:9). So, who did the creating? Was it God, the Word, or the Holy Spirit? The answer is YES! In the Gospel of Matthew, we read that Mary “became pregnant through the power of the Holy Spirit.” Moreover, the angel told Joseph that “the child within her was conceived by the Holy Spirit.” (Matthew 1:18-20) Was the Holy Spirit involved or was the Father involved? Once again, the answer is YES! No, sorry folks, the Trinity is demonstrated in a few proof texts – it is in almost every page of the Greek New Testament!
Lonnie Hendrix/Miller Jones
8 comments:
"No one can know a person’s thoughts except that person’s own spirit, and no one can know God’s thoughts except God’s own Spirit."
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have a spirit. It is the nonphysical component of me. It enables me to think, and write this. It is not a person. I don't have a person in me.
Likewise God has a Spirit. It is not a person. It is God's power - Acts 1:8. By it God creates and so much more.
Can your spirit in you be the same spirit in your physical father?
Unless you’re insane the answer is no. So why is the Spirit of God called the Spirit of Christ also? If they are two separate gods then you are a polytheist.
Holy Spirit, Father and Son all coexist and are all the one true God. It may bother you but that’s what scripture says.
Since the cannon is suspect, ALL the doctrines in it are suspect. Especially the trinity, which even the authors in the "accepted" cannon cannot agree on.
Didn't Jones recently say the bible was riddled with contradictions?
Lonnie writes, "the Father, Son and HS may not be mentioned in all the salutations, but this trio is woven into the very fabric of the NT".
I think everyone will stipulate to that, but all that really proves is that the HS is mentioned in Scripture and has a connection with the Father and Son. You have not shown what that connection is , nor demonstrated what the official Trinitarian doctrine claims, that the HS is a person, coequal with the Father and Son.
1 Corinthians 8:4-7 states, " there is none other God but one. For US, there is but one God, the Father, and one Lord Jesus Christ. However, not everyone has THAT KNOWLEDGE "!!
This tells me that the Godhead contains 2 named personages, who both are spirit, and function by and through the spirit. Both God and Christ are spirit. The HS is their personality, essence, power, and extension of their very being, and not a separate personage.
The HS is the spirit of both the Father and the Son dwelling in us, 2 Cor.6:16-18, John 14:23. 2 Cor 3:17 says, " the Lord IS THAT SPIRIT, and where the spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty ".
Notice that Scripture uses plural possessive nouns and pronouns when describing the spirit, such as the spirit OF the Lord, the spirit of HIM, Romans 8:11, the spirit of HIS Son, Gal.4:6, the spirit of Christ, Romans 8:9, God's spirit, my spirit, His spirit. Doesn't sound to me like a separate person.
Scripture also tells us that the Father sends Christ and Christ sends the HS, showing that they are NOT co equal.
The title of this post asks, Is the Doctrine of the Trinity Suspect? The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia certainly thinks so! It confirms that the Trinity doctrine is not just controversial, but " ambitious, difficult, and very thin on evidence". (1986, vol.4, page 914-17, article Trinity). Scout has also said on another post that "there is not a strong Trinitarian foundation in Scripture". Interesting!
The ISBE concludes by saying, " the spirit in the NT is personally less distinct than the Father and Son, and His divinity less clearly stated. One properly concludes that the NT is overally CLEARLY BINITARIAN in its data, and (probably??) Trinitarian (page 917). Of course they have to have a disclaimer don't they?
I guess because ARMSTRONG taught binitarianism, it is automatically heresy and we must reject the data that is clearly scriptural? On this site that's considered good scholarship!
Serious mainstream Christians were still arguing about the Trinity for several hundred years after Christ's resurrection. It took several church councils to root out the disagreements, or more accurately to root out those who disagreed. The "trinity" was an early understanding of the Godhead, but it was not a majority understanding until the majority of Christians were no longer former Jews, and it was not universally treated as the one valid understanding for a couple hundred years after that.
Miller Jones wrote an effective analysis of this issue.
There is a collateral issue that I will bring up. There is much more to the anti-Trinitarian view of Armstrongists than simply rejecting the Deity of the Holy Spirit. Armstrongists believe in Subordinationism. This means that they do not believe that Jesus is co-equal with God the Father either in role or in ontology. For this reason, Armstrongists are not truly Binitarian. They are, rather, Bi-theistic. The difference is stark. Binitarianism is like Trinitarianism only the person count is two instead of three. Bi-theism is polytheism where the count of gods is two. It is the pantheon approach of the pagans. In Bi-theism there is no perichoresis or co-inherence but two separate beings. Much of the Divine Unity language in the latter part of the Gospel of John does not apply to polytheism.
Robert Coulter, past president of the General Conference of the Church of God (Seventh Day) identifies the CG7 as Binitarian but says their Binitarianism differs from that of HWA. I could not find information on how CG7 formulates this doctrine. So, the CG7 may be Bi-theistic like Armstrongism. All of this stems from a past history of Arianism. Coulter stated in an interview in 2008:
“When I grew up in the church, it was Arian. It taught the preexistence of Christ, but Christ was not God. I remember the first time I read the phrase "God the Son" and it made me mad. This was 50 years ago, and I didn't immediately get involved in a study.”
I think it would be surprising to many Armstrongists that when HWA fellowshipped with the CG7, they did not believe Jesus was God. Hence, they were Unitarian rather than Binitarian. Arianism was quite widespread in the Ekklesia before the Nicene Council.
So, Armstrongists not only question the status of the Holy Spirit, they question the status of Jesus. While they believe that Jesus is God, they regard him as a kind of subordinate God.
Scout
Thank you for your post Lonnie/Millar.
The Zohar, a book of Rabbinical mysticism explores the nature of God and the cosmos. The Zohar is associated with the Kabbalah, a mystical tradition that emerged in around the 12th century.
Haraz de Shlosha-The Mystery of the Three within the Zohar, talks about the nature of God, One God with three dimensions. Hear oh Israel, The Lord our God, the Lord is One; the Zohar refers to God as of three heads, three spirits, three names, three appearances to describe the Divine nature. And now the Lord God has sent Me and His Spirit, Isaiah 48. Three in One, but One God. This is not an unfamiliar theme within Judaism. And acknowledged by many Rabbinical scholars. A subject up for much debate in the foreseeable future I am sure.
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