Church of God News has this up about David Hulme.
Why has the Church of God created so many puffed up men who think they are something so superfantabulous that the world needs to hear what they have to say? COGNews is right in describing Hulme's church as one sliding "from obscurity into oblivion." It is a sad day on South Marengo in Pasadena when Hulme has to realize that Bob Thiel's little personality cult is doing far more than he is or has ever done!
David Hulme’s ‘Vision’
As the church that David Hulme founded slides slowly from obscurity into oblivion, he is seeking to use his accumulated knowledge and diplomatic expertise to bring peace to the world.
His vision is “to become a renowned diplomat to establish peace among international entities” [Crunchbase], because he is “the ultimate resource for all matters about foreign policy” [Twitter].
He spent 10 years studying International Relations at the University of Southern California, with an emphasis on the Middle East, in order to obtain a doctorate.With Hulme it has ALWAYS been about him. When he was working in Pasadena he thought he as the most magnificent man to ever walk the dichondra covered grounds of the campus. He was in his element when he was put over the Ambassador Foundation and got to hobnob with performers, celebrities and dignitaries. With his British accent, he was the slick and polished face of the Foundation.
What work experience has fitted him for this role?
David Hulme gained a BA degree from Ambassador College, Bricket Wood, and served as a minister in the Worldwide Church of God in the UK, South Africa, Canada and the USA.
He rose to prominence in 1986, when the WCG’s new pastor general, Joseph W. Tkach, ordained him as an evangelist, and appointed him, Richard Ames and David Albert as presenters of The World Tomorrow TV broadcasts.
In 1995 he was elected to be the first President of the United Church of God, the largest breakaway group from the WCG. In 1998 he was removed from this position by the UCG’s Council of Elders for unauthorized spending that had plunged the church into serious debt.
He then left United, drawing away around 3000 members to his new church, the Church of God, an International Community.
He launched a quarterly magazine, Vision, which was printed on very high quality paper. The magazine was almost entirely secular in content, with no mention that it was being sponsored by a church.
David Hulme claimed that the new church would be more active than UCG in preaching the gospel, but in 2013 several of his ministers had finally had enough, and left to form a new church, with probably close to 1000 people.
Stephen Elliott, wrote, in his resignation letter to David Hulme in December 2013: “Our membership has declined, not grown. After 15 years and an estimated expense for Vision of $3+ million dollars for salaries, advertising, publishing, design, shipping, PR, video, travel and whatever, there has been no fruit from Vision or the Vision website. The only new members, other than children of members, have come because of a personal relationship with a member – not because of Vision.”
In 2016 the magazine was reduced to a website version, which is actually just a collection of 5 or 6 articles.
Three early videos – Quest for the Real Paul, Cheating God out of Christianity and Message to the Seven Churches – were filmed on location in the Middle East. These are well produced and worth viewing, but very expensive to make. Latterly, his Insight videos are much shorter and filmed in a studio.
David Hulme promotes himself, but not his church, posting his personal profile on various websites dedicated to business professionals.
If you go to David Hulme’s page at LinkedIn (a social networking website), you find that he describes himself as the President of Vision Media, and clicking on the link to his ‘personal website’ takes you to Vision.org. It’s not a church website, as far as he is concerned.Like Herbert Armstrong, apparently presenting himself as a minister of God is a total embarrassment and a certain door slammer when he imagines himself as a future "diplomat."
“David Hulme is publisher of the quarterly online journal, Vision (vision.org), president of Vision Media Productions and chairman of Vision Foundation International.”Notice what COGNews says below as they point out how Hulme covers up his Church of God connections.
He lists his previous experience as:
• 1977-1979 Circulation Manager (Africa) of Quest Magazine
Although Quest was owned by the Worldwide Church of God, TIME magazine described it as: “nonetheless thoroughly secular. Armstrong gave editorial control to Robert Shnayerson, 55, a former TIME senior editor and Harper’s editor in chief, who dedicated the magazine to what he called ‘the pursuit of excellence’ in fields as diverse as mountain climbing and genetic research.” Herbert Armstrong closed down the publication when Shnayerson declined to modify his editorial policy.
• 1986-1995 Vice-President of Ambassador Foundation(David Hulme formerly described AF on LinkedIn as a “Non-Profit Organization, Management industry”.)
Ambassador Foundation carried out some charitable works, but Ambassador Auditorium’s performing arts program was not one of them.
• There is no mention of being a presenter of the WCG’s TV program, The World Tomorrow, 1986-1994.
• There is no mention of being the President of the United Church of God, 1995-1998.
• President of Vision Media, 1998- (not President of a church).
There is a mention of the church on the Vision website (if you search for it):
“Vision.org is sponsored and funded by the Church of God, an International Community.
The Church does not intend this site to convert readers to its beliefs …”
As Stephen Elliott noted above, David Hulme succeeded in not converting readers – but surely that was not the wish of the church members?If David Hulme is so embarrassed by his connections to the Church of God then he needs to admit that to his few remaining followers, shut down his group and set them free to regain their lives unfettered by some of his draconian legalistic rules.
48 comments:
David had weird but effective way of first looking to the place he next planned to turn his head.
And too....I am embarr-assed that I ever was connected to WCG. Loved the church people. Detested, in hindsite, the untrained and looney pecking order RCM envisioned of "There is God the Father, Jesus CHRIST, Mr. Armstrong, Garner Ted Armstrong, MYSELF...and a FEW other leading Evangelists" (Unnameable) . He said that when I was 18 years old and I should have gone with the gut chuckle it provoked right then. And yes Brethren...I had shit for brains
Dennis - you are dissing number 5 in the universe - LOL
Some of our most renowned scientists showed humility by saying they were standing on the shoulders of giants when being praised for their insights and discoveries.
Considering humility is a virtue in the Bible, it seems we should have more of it from our (former) esteemed leaders.
David Hulme very low level cia informant ?
Maybe if Hulme could get a real job outside the ACOG world, he would repent, apologize, and fess up to the insider dirt that most of his fellow ministers insist is just the bitter imagination of ex-members?
As I humbly and honestly go about being one of the people who keeps the graphics art industry in my state humming along, I just can't fathom the level of either ego or insecurity that would compel people to take up the mantle of the large scale conman who had the greatest singular influence upon their lives. It reminds me of an old Michael Caine-Steve Martin movie, "Dirty Rotten Scoundrels". HWA wannabees come off like a sub-character Steve Martin created for the movie, Ruprecht the monkey man.
BB
For what it's worth....
The linked Twitter account is not the one he uses. It may even be a cloned account.
His real one is here: https://twitter.com/drdavidhulme?lang=en
Hulme will never fess up to anything. He is just as corrupt and manipulative as rest of the hierarchy was in Pasadena. He does it to this day over what employees and members he has left.
This Legend(in his own mind) is desperately seeking a Tkach-like $ix-Figure-$alary!
So the order is: God the Father, Christ, a incestuous person, a womanizer, then a wife beater. There you have it, the government of God, according to the WWCG.
I met him once and i wanted to punch him in the face.
Secularlaw protected him.
Tarzan
BB
In that move "Dirty Rotten Scoundrels," the con-artist woman stated that they had the policy of never robbing innocent people. That line stuck in my mind. A big difference to Armstrongism.
I remember when he lived for free on the Pasadena campus and had free gardeners and custodial help at the drop of a hat. It was no wonder he was able to afford a Jaguar that he LOVED to show off.
@ 3:29 PM, don't forget that the Holy Spirit, of infinite age, impregnated a teenage girl who was already betrothed to another man, then abandoned its parental responsibilities and left that cuckolded man to raise the child of another father. Lots of ethical questions there, too!
Good point, 3:34. In Armstrongism, they teach you to be honest (except with yourself), and then they rob you!
BB
4.12 PM
Since you brought it up, Gods ownership of all humans (ownership by 'production') gave Him the right to impregnate a teenager. He did not require a permission slip from her. The parents were informed and did not complain, but rather considered it a honor. The honor and fame will extend into eternity, a rich reward for their services.
I hope this answers your ethical questions.
“He [David Hulme] then left United, drawing away around 3000 members to his new church, the Church of God, an International Community.”
What a COMPLETE WASTE of his followers' time and money.
@ 5:33 PM, your post gave me chills, as it is exactly what HWA could have said to Dorothy...
“Although Quest was owned by the Worldwide Church of God, TIME magazine described it as: 'nonetheless thoroughly secular. Armstrong gave editorial control to Robert Shnayerson, 55, a former TIME senior editor and Harper’s editor in chief, who dedicated the magazine to what he called ‘the pursuit of excellence’ in fields as diverse as mountain climbing and genetic research.' Herbert Armstrong closed down the publication when Shnayerson declined to modify his editorial policy.”
Quest magazine was produced by utterly godless people. It appeared to be dedicated to the pursuit of depravity. It used WCG church funding to support the smut in it. The bums behind it tried to pass off bad behavior as the “pursuit of excellence.”
"... shut down his group and set them free to regain their lives unfettered by some of his draconian legalistic rules."
Legalism is better than Satanism (disobeying God).
Where is the proof (or even any evidence) that RCM was a wife beater?
“He [David Hulme] launched a quarterly magazine, Vision, which was printed on very high quality paper. The magazine was almost entirely secular in content, with no mention that it was being sponsored by a church.”
The spiritually blind liked to pretend that they could see something in David Hulme's Vision magazine.
Not to defend DH but he bought his Jag for $5000 at a charity auction. Facts are important.
7.09 PM
RCM has often been referred to as Spanky for his wife beating.
6.54 PM
I did read one issue of Quest. I recall no trace of smut or depravity. The articles were better than those typically found in church literature.
I don"t think rcm was a wife beater. He did preach and write favorably about the wide spread and accepted american practice and custom to spank irrational women into submission on the bottom.
The 1950's advertisements and statistics are very clear about that particular custom. And rcm was part of that generation. But a wife beater in my opinion hits in the face and torso. Making you a liar.
Nck
Quest was neither owned nor produced by WCG.
Although WCG was its main sponsor in the inception phase.
Shnayrson negotiated editorial independence or he would not have joined.
A conflict erupted when in infringement of that agreement HWA wanted an article published about the 3 faith center in the Sinai desert of which wcg would be a huge donor and hwa gave mubarak a first installment check of 100.000 dollars after the sadat assasination.
Shnayrson refused to publish the article and due to this and other reasons wcg withdrew sponsorship while the magazine was not yet able to sustain itself through advertising.
I do understand a little bit about the "depravity comments". Not because of Quest, which was excellent, but because of the publishing company (Stanley Raders) that also published articles and literature that would not hold against the mission and belief system of wcg at that time.
nck
Bible loving men would never spank their wives because we are to love them and use Christ as our example. Jesus is never recorded ever hitting His disciples - He always showed great patience. Since we are to cleave together it is the same as injuring yourself.
I wonder how many true Bible lovers there were?
I don’t know about them, but I was (and still am) very happy to have found such a wonderful woman who would agree to be my wife.
"Facts are important."
Not to some people.
"Bible loving men would never spank their wives because we are to love them and use Christ as our example."
True. The USA is/was crazy in many ways. Race relations, death penalty, school shootings, spanking wives up to the 1970"s.
I can see the point however of spanking women in societies of yonder years, where women were largely uneducated, illiterate, powerless, frustrated. probably hysterical at times. I guess an outdated method of disciplining could evolve to maintain order and the status quo for men.
One of HWA's good points was to recognize that education was the key to everything, especially for women. No need to comment on the contents of the education I know how you feel about that, still we are talking 19th century, victorian age person here.
I thought Tkach destroyed the Church, the more evidence surfaces it seems the seeds of destruction of the edifice were sown by RCM in the sixties. The power structure, the "manly" education. HWA was so much more sophisticated in his original ideas of AC in Switzerland for the edification of man.
nck
Hulme...Just another example of an unelected, unaccountable, communist (central control), dictator whose dreams of grandeur have ended in failure.
Nck
So hitting on the bottom is not wife beating, but hitting on face or torso is wife beating. Forever the lawyer. Just like your pal Bill Clinton who claimed that he smoked, but didn't inhale pot.
9:47
You're getting the hang of it. I'll be charging next time.
Nck
Anon 5.33 PM said:-
“Gods ownership of all humans (ownership by 'production') gave Him the right to impregnate a teenager. He did not require a permission slip from her.”
If you care to read the scriptures, you will find that Mary actually did give permission. (Luke chapter 1).
The angel told Mary God’s plans for her. She queried how this could happen, seeing she was a virgin. The angel explained what would happen, and also mentioned what was happening with her cousin Elizabeth, no doubt as additional evidence of God’s involvement.
It was at that point (Luke 1v38), that Mary gave her permission for what God planned. She then went off to visit Elizabeth, probably in part to confirm what the angel had said.
Had Mary not agreed to God’s plan, do you really think that God would have carried on regardless?
Who knows, maybe some other woman had been picked first, but turned down the opportunity? (Complete speculation, obviously, but the point is that God’s entire plan would not have relied on one particular human being. There would have been a number of other girls around who met the biblical requirements to be the mother of Jesus).
I grew up in the 1950s and ‘60s. I never heard of anyone “spanking” their wives during that time period. I knew of instances in which husbands and wives would hit or kick one another in the midst of horrible arguments, but spanking would have been too controlled a process to enter the general culture. It is something in which people who were authoritarian Christians might indulge, but in most cases guys in the gen pop were way too crude to restrict their rage to spanking. That’s ridiculous.
I don’t know why guys feel like they’ve got to hit their wives. I believe that would kill all the love in a marriage and remove all the passion normally involved in a sexual relationship. The woman would feel as if she were nothing more than a toilet for her husband’s bodily fluids.
BB
Well Desi said, he did Love Lucy.
Frontier Gal was just one of five movies released in 1945 where women were spanked.
Ads like "if your husband finds out" were part of every day life.
I wont bore anyone with stats. Just the "funnies".
Nck
"Who knows, maybe some other woman had been picked first, but turned down the opportunity?"
Yes, that was the mother of Brian.
nck
Just in:
French parliament decides that from now on it is forbidden to spank children on the bottom for any reason.
nck
"Hulme...Just another example of an unelected, unaccountable, communist (central control), dictator whose dreams of grandeur have ended in failure. "
hey Connie, how do you define success/failure?
"Detested, in hindsite, the untrained and looney pecking order RCM envisioned..."
being a "high ranking" minister does not mean said person is a member of The Church...
I suspect that Satan's ministers far outnumber God's....and the called out ones can tell the difference, maybe not right away, but it doesn't take too terribly long to spot the frauds.
that doesn't mean, however, that we can't learn from the fraudulent ones (though we don't necessarily learn what they think they are teaching us...lol)
and by the way, I'm passing no judgement on RCM, I never knew the man.
Posted at the Banned Blog:
From a book called The Truth Shall Make You Free by John Tuit
(pg 114) The importance of a secular publishing business owned by the Church could better be understood in light of a remark that Robert Kuhn, executive assistant to Garner Ted Armstrong and a Church vice-president, made at the 1978 ministerial conference. He said, “Quest was very important to the Church, as through the publishing contacts maintained by the Quest office, adverse publicity in the press could be controlled.” One must wonder that even if it were possible to influence the press in such a way, why would a Church want to do so. It would appear that the only influence a church would desire over the press would be one whereby its evangelistic message would be disseminated through the news media.
Perhaps the fall 1978 Everest House catalog with its list of twenty-two books would offer some insight to Rader’s true motives. Quest and Everest House, while subsidized directly by money from the Church, which had been collected from tithe paying members for the preaching of the Gospel, was quit obviously engaged in promoting a very unchristian message. Jack Martin and other Church employees were evidently placed in positions at Quest for a short period of time to appease those who objected the initial Quest issues. Now, in all of the turmoil over Garner Ted’s ouster, it was very easy to remove these people from Quest and it wouldn’t even be noticed. And to keep quiet they were kept on salary while they had no job to go to.
Looking through the Everest House catalog we find publications such as Dark Dimensions; A Celebration of the Occult. The description reads, “In this startling new exploration of the wonders of the occult world, the renowned author and one of the world’s greatest authorities on parapsychology, Colin Wilson brings together the extraordinary feats of nine masters of magic.” The book contains accounts of homosexuality, mutilation, and sex perversion. Another book entitles In Search of… glorifies the demonic talents of psychics such as Jeanne Dixon and explores the satanic practices of Kirlian photography. The LTR Money Book is not as sedate a financial advisory as the title would indicate. It contains advice for gay couples and instructions for homosexuals who wish to get married or divorced. And Zen Running is not a book on jogging, but rather a book that advises how one can let his mind go through the use of Zen. Certainly a strange list of books to be published by an organization that claims to serve Jesus Christ under the leadership of a man who claims to be God’s apostle.
From Ambassador Report
AR 5 August 21, 1978
Herbert, stung by Ted's penetrating logic, replied: "He [Ted] has spread the point blank lie that Mr. Rader is now actually heading the Church and Work. Brethren, I brand that as a Satan lie!... I have given the direct order to Mr. Rader to sell or dispose of the magazine Quest/78 as soon as possible."
The Fate of Quest/78 and Everest House
Nevertheless, Quest/78 is not going to be sold-at least not for six months or a year, if ever, according to Rader. Roger Lippross, a top WCG publishing official, commented at a July 12 meeting at Ambassador's press that Rader has put Quest under his personal control in the AICF. Guess that shows who's really the boss once and for all!
Not only does Rader have increased control over Quest, but now he has quietly placed the WCG's new publishing venture, Everest House, under the AICF. Almost nobody in the WCG, though, is aware of what the Everest House publishes and who founded it. Even its catalogue is kept out of church members' reach, lest they learn what it is publishing. Stan Rader gave birth to it and hired its present operating head, Lew Gillenson, in 1977. Everest House shares office space with Quest/78 in Pasadena and New York City. Informed sources stated that the New York office suite, located at 1133 Avenue of the Americas, costs $18,000 per month for rent alone and that additional office space has been acquired.
The fall 1978 Everest House catalogue offers 22 books for sale, a number of which run completely counter to the WCG's long-time teachings. (Keep in mind that the WCG is subsidizing Everest House with tithe money from its members.) For instance, Dark Dimensions-a Celebration of the Occult, advertised on page 1 of the catalogue, has accounts of homosexual acts, a brutal mutilation, sadism, sex perversion, and paints the occult in a very favorable light. Then there's the book Strange Seed, described as "a contemporary novel of unutterable terror," as well as the books How to Make Your Own Knives and Living Jewish, something you'd never suspect a Christian organization would subsidize. The LTR Money Book is billed as "the personal finance guide for every kind of living together relationship." It includes practical financial advice for heterosexual and gay couples and contains instructions' for gays who desire to marry or divorce. Zen Running, the last book listed, discusses how to let your mind go, through the use of Zen.
On July 12, Roger Lippross said that Everest House and Quest/78 are dismissing all their WCG employees and will accept no new ones because the church members get too emotionally involved and this causes problems and bad publicity. What he is really saying is this: Church members become disgusted and enraged when they see the trash and anti-church material Everest House and Quest/78 publish. So all the art work, layouts, jacket designs, copy editing, and typesetting previously done by WCG employees in Pasadena will soon be done undercover in New York-out of sight from the prying eyes of "emotional" church members whose tithes are helping to foot the bill.
3.33 PM
If you care to read the scriptures Luke 1:31, God did not ask for permission from Mary. Luke 1:31 reads "you will conceive and give birth to a son." Mary replied "may your word to me be fulfilled." I don't believe the word "permission" correctly describes Marys reply, as it implies a legal right to say no. God would not have chosen Mary if He knew that she would reject the opportunity. In that sense, He didn't force Himself on Mary. But God does have rights. Legally speaking, He did not need Marys permission.
"Legally speaking, He did not need Marys permission."
This is about the most stupidest comment I ever saw on this blog.
Already in Genesis yhwh introduces the concept of free moral agency and the concept of choice.
Of course it was clever of him to choose an illiterate 15 year old girl raised in a delusional household of faith instead of one of Herods courtiers with a full education in Roman Law and a huge inheritance by daddy the local governor. They would have kicked his ass for even implying the thought.
nck
Nck
Unlike Nck, God believes He owns everything. For instance Psalms 24.1 "The Earth is the Lords, and all it contains, the world and those who live in it."
Ezekiel 18.4 " Behold all souls are mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is mine, the soul who sins will die."
God owns everything because He made everything. Which is the same moral criteria used by most people, except the commies and with their ownership by need, and bullies with their ownership by desire.
So in a legalist sense, God owns people and can hence punish and even kill them if they do evil or become very corrupt. It also gives Him the moral right to throw people into the lake of fire, if they deserve it.
Non of this violates peoples free moral agency. There is not one example in the bible of God making a decision for another person. Rather, on occasion, like a work boss, God gives a order to a person, which is His right. Which is what happened with Mary.
This should all be self evident. Perhaps another example of the church and its members not grasping rights.
11:16
You are free to sharpen the iron of my iron. I am no religious scholar so I will not debate you on the issue.
I only have quick thoughts. Examples. I do not believe you have the moral right to "own" your children and for example decide who they are to marry even if you "made them".
It seems ezechiel was adressing the crowd from babylon complaining about the actions of their fathers whose actions brought THEM, the children, in a desperate situation.
Ezechiel says "stop it you are your own man" stop the stupid shallow sayings and their plattitudes.
Also there are the "christian pharisees" implying "personal relationships with god through miracles and other wonders", freaking out others who never experience that.
God says in the next verse. "Dont worry, you are mine too, I have seen you."
Very reassuring God as compared to a God who assumingly goes around claiming his rights of "prima nocte" to impregnate his virgin possessions at will, since he produced them. Hariet Beecher Stowe would smack your head for such biblical interpretation I feel.
On the other hand, what do I know as a 5 minute scholar.
Thank for the effort to explain your view. Mine is largely based on basic Roman Law as the NT writers would have been familiar with. (for instance the patres ruling the house accepting many children " in the spirit of adoption". Like most Roman emperors and nobility had heirs that were not their blood but fell under the family name like the Julii. If the bible was written now it might have contained some modern concepts aswell.
Nck
10.09 AM
I am not arguing about God’s ‘legal rights’. You could indeed say God could ‘legally’ do anything with His creation.
However that doesn’t mean that in reality He will just trample people underfoot.
God announced what His plan was for Mary. Luke 1v38 shows that Mary was willingly agreeing to it.
Suppose she hadn’t agreed? Are you suggesting that God would ignore this, impose His ‘legal rights’, and in effect rape her to produce the saviour of the world?
Not exactly the best start in life for Jesus or His family.
The idea that God ‘could’ do anything, doesn’t mean that God ‘will’ do anything.
Scripture shows there are things that God ‘cannot do’, simply because He is a God of love.
Saw Hulme once in person during his visit to Tucson in 80's - he reacted harshly to Carl McNair's service announcement ribbing calling him a "lobsterback". Pretty much summed up his arrogance, was not impressed.
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