Holy milquetoast prophet, Batman! Banned has done it again! That Gary is such a BAD person! Stop picking on Bob, you agent of Satan!
Apparently, God's greatest gift to the Church of God popped his self-righteous cork big time over the video produced by a pro-Herbert Armstrong site that took the Great Bwana Bob and other self-appointed COG prophets to the woodshed and gave them all a royal Philadelphian spanking.
Several hours ago, I noticed the following headline from Gary Leonard at the anti-Church of God, Banned by HWA website:
Herbert Armstrong’s Own Words Make Mincemeat Of Bob Thiel And His Fake Prophet Status
Of course, the criteria for a prophet comes from the word of God, the Bible, and not statements from the late Pastor General of the old Radio/Worldwide Church of God, Herbert W. Armstrong.
It is always fun to watch self-appointed self-righteous COG ministers immediately dunk on HWA when he does not fit the interpretation that the false leaders expect us to believe. Both Bob Thiel and Gerald Flurry are really good at this. If they had their way they would delete everything HWA said about false prophets, because he damns every single one of these lying buffoons to the pits of hell where they belong.
The Great Bwana continues:
That said, let’s look at what he said, some of what the Bible teaches, as well as comments from leaders that Herbert W. Armstrong had ordained, on the matter of prophets.
Always the true prophets and ministers of God have stood almost alone and opposed by the overwhelming majority in Israel. That is Israel’s history of old. It is true today. (Armstrong HW. Why Russia Will Not Attack the United States, reprint 1980)
But the TRUE prophets of God have always put emphasis on the right CAUSE-on God’s WAY to the desired blessings.
Let me explain that. Let me make that PLAIN! This magazine deals with making truth PLAIN–understandable!
You may search the Bible from beginning to end. You’ll find the true prophets, apostles, ministers of God put first emphasis on the right CAUSE, not the effect. They proclaim THE WAY that leads to peace, happiness, security, and finally, eternal life. In Bible language, this means that God’s Word, and God’s true prophets and ministers put first emphasis on God’s LAW…God sends HIS prophets and ministers to proclaim the RIGHT WAY, to sh ow people that they are going the WRONG WAY, to cause them to turn around and get back on the RIGHT WAY through Jesus Christ by God’s free grace…
God’s true servants are not OF this world nor of its ways. (Armstrong HW. Personal from the Editor. Plain Truth, May 1966, pp. 2, 44-45)
HWA was in no way, shape, or manner talking about the self-appointed liars that were to arise after his death. Bwana Bob is NOT a true prophet, that is an absolute impossibility.
Notice how deceitfully deceptive the Great Bwana is in discrediting HWA:
Now, yes, Herbert W. Armstrong at least once declared that there were no prophets in WCG and no doctrinal need for them. Furthermore, here is what he said in a Bible Study on 1 Corinthians on July 18, 1980:
THE CHURCH IS FOUNDED ON THE APOSTLES AND THE PROPHETS
Paul is speaking to the Church. Now the Church of God was raised up primarily for two purposes: that God could call to lead the Church, apostles, the Church is founded on the foundation of the apostles and the prophets, the prophets of the Old Testament; because no prophet in the New Testament has anything to do with infusing doctrine into the Church or with an administrative position in the Work of the Church. No prophet had anything to do with any of that; so, the prophets mean, the prophets of the Old Testament. They did not preach to Israel. Israel rejected their writings, ancient Israel. The writings of the prophets, beginning with Isaiah and even other prophets – no you could say with Moses for that matter, and with David in the Psalms. All were for the New Testament Church, believe it or not, and yet today they want to say that we are a New Testament Church; and we don’t want anything to do with that Old Testament.
Let me tell you this is the book of God. Now the Old Testament Church couldn’t proclaim the gospel. The Old Testament Church did not have the Holy Spirit, that’s true; but the prophets did and they were writing for the doctrines of the Church and much of Church doctrine comes from the writings of the prophets; Christ being the chief cornerstone and the Head of the Church. Now just keep that in the background as we begin to read what Paul is writing to one of the Churches.
The bolded portion above is not biblically correct. The Apostle Paul was a prophet and so seemingly was the evangelist Timothy. So those prophets did have administrative as well as doctrinal responsibilities.
The Indian diploma mill graduate in theology knows better than HWA! Stupid old man! He had no idea there would arise in the perilous end times the Greatest Prophet the church would ever see!
Just to make sure he did not lose his high status as a prophet, he ran to Aaron Dean begging him to legitimize him as a true prophet.
Furthermore, I did discuss Herbert W. Armstrong’s “no prophet” position with his long time aide, Aaron Dean (who HWA also ordained). Aaron Dean basically told me that Herbert W. Armstrong was annoyed by various ones who contacted him claiming to be a prophet and he wanted people to stop doing that. However, Aaron Dean also said that Herbert W. Armstrong was not intending to teach that there would be no more prophets or that they would not have a role in the church as we got closer to the end.
The Great Bwana Bob NEEDS for HWA to be wrong:
Of course, since the Two Witnesses prophesy (Revelation 11:3), it should be clear that Herbert W. Armstrong was not teaching that the people who would be the two witnesses could not have been alive in 1972 (especially since he felt that they would possibly fulfill their calling during his lifetime). Plus, as editor in chief of the publications of the old Radio and Worldwide Church of God, he did have items about prophets in the history of the Church of God published. Items that contradicted a statement he wrote about prophets not having administrative roles as Timothy did as did Melito of Sardis as did those called Paulicians that he had information published about.
As a side note, everything about the 1971-1975 debacle was one blatant lie after another. When caught with their pants down when nothing happened, and quickly resorted to saying: "HWA never predicted such a thing." They also resorted to lying that HWA never called himself an apostle or prophet. Gaslighting COG history is a full-time business!
The Great One next writes:
In absence of a clear apostle, a prophet, particularly an evangelistic one, would be expected to lead the most faithful in the Church of God.
You can quickly see where this is headed. Without an apostle alive in the church today, it has to have a prophet, and the Great Bwana Bob fulfills that department.
The Great One believes that a prophet must arise in the end times before the two witless witnesses arrive (Ron and Laura Weinland). It is his duty to announce to the world who those two witless ones are.
So, Herbert W. Armstrong felt that there would be prophecy BEFORE the two witnesses were given power, hence the need for one or more prophets.
The New Testament (e.g. Acts 2, 1 Corinthians 14, Revelation 11) makes it clear that there would be prophets in the latter days.
Bwana Bob equates himself to Herbert Armstrong and the "persecution" he faced. Everybody picks on Bwana Bob just like they did HWA.
Notice something else from the late Herbert W. Armstrong:
PERSECUTORS HAVE CALLED me a “false prophet.” Now how would you KNOW whether the accusation IS true- or false?Actually, it probably is not very important to you to know whether my persecutors are right or wrong, when they call me dirty names, hurl epithets, resort to innuendo, impute sinister motives, strive to discredit, attempt character assassination. What is important to YOU is whether what you read in The PLAIN TRUTH really is the truth – whether what you hear over The WORLD TOMORROW broadcast is true- not whether I , as an individual, am true or false.I think our readers know by now that we always say: ” DON’ T believe what we say because you believe in us.” We say ” Listen with open mind, without prejudice, then CHECK UP in your own Bible-prove whether it is true, and BELIEVE what you find proved!” I don’t seek to induce people to believe in ME- I seek to lead them to believe in JESUS CHRIST! (Armstrong HW. Personal from the Editor. Plain Truth, May 1966, pp. 2)
I have never been a false prophet and urge all to check out what I have taught with the Bible.
Because I am an imperfect human being and one may not agree with all of my views does NOT make me a false prophet.
Yes, you are! That is a fact.
He then trots out Herb again to legitimize his self-appointment:
Notice further that Herbert W. Armstrong also stated:
Joel 2:28-29 And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: (29) And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.So there is a time coming when God will start pouring out His spirit on human beings. … Day of Pentecost, 3000 were baptized. Peter preached a sermon. They were pricked in their hearts. God began to draw them. God was now… Remember He said, “I will pour out of my spirit on all flesh.” All right, there’s a duality of that. (Armstrong HW. Building The Temple. Sermon, February 14, 1981)
Yes, there was a duality to what Peter preached in Acts 2–and that duality is for our current time.
More of the "duality" crap that Armstrongite leaders like to prooftext with to make them look better in their follower's eyes.
The Great Bwana likes to pretend that Gaylyn Bonjour double-blessed him so that he could start a new group as a prophet. This "so-called" double blessing became something that Bonjour regretted. He told many in LCG that he had no idea that Bob would use it to lie about being ordained or to start a new group. This has been one of Bwana Bob's foundational lies.
He also tries to pawn off on gullible believers that he is able to channel dreams straight from God's mind to his.
Thank you for your question concerning visions or dreams. The Bible reveals that in times past servants of God were given visions and dreams for specific reasons and/or to convey special messages. … God has used this means of communication in the past and will do so again (Acts 2:17; Joel 2:28) (L052 Worldwide Church of God, 1989)
As the WCG did not publicly acknowledge any such dreams after that letter was sent, the interpretation must be that God would later use dreams (it should be mentioned that the original date of L052 was prior to 1986–hence it was not a change by the Tkach Administration).
This in no way was referring to Bob Thiel. These dreams are no more than delusions of a man who in an act of rebellion split off from the Living Church of God to start his own group. God was never part of this and certainly did NOT speak to him in dreams.
The all-knowing Great Bwana says again that Herb made mistakes about prophets. Bob is just like Flurry in that he either deletes or reinterprets HWA's writings to fit the self-imposed prophet status he unworthily claims.
In another attempt to yank our chains, he says this about HWA and the two witless witnesses. You can see why the Great Bwana bolded these words. He, in his delusional state of mind, thinks this is all about him:
Herbert W. Armstrong felt that the two witnesses, who will be prophets, were alive in 1984, and presumably, one or more was an adult by then.
Guess who was alive at that time? The Great Bwana Bob Mzungu Thiel! The bullshit is so deep he can never shovel it all away.
It also needs to be understood that prophets do not have to perform public miracles to be genuine. John the Baptist was a prophet according to Jesus (Matthew 11:7-10), but he is not recorded as performing any public miracles. Actually, the Bible records, “John did no miracle” (John 10:41, KJV). Jesus told the Pharisees that an adulterous generation sought signs, beyond prophetic accuracy (Matthew 12:38-40) and obedience to God (cf. Deuteronomy 13:1-4).
Let me add that both the Bible and writings published by the old Radio Church of God show that prophets can also have administrative roles (e.g. see previous quote from Meredith RC. How Church Government Really WORKS. Good News, March 1964, pp. 4-5).
The Great Bwana has another excuse when it comes to how his Indian diploma mill "degree" in theology that we discovered was actually worthless (Thanks to Gavin Rumney). Even taking a few classes here and there at Ambassador and Fuller did not grant him a degree. The only "training" he has had is a bunch of poorly researched booklets, sermons, and his place at the feet of Rod Meredith.
As long as the Great Bwana is "most" accurate then we are supposed to believe him.
It also should be noted that while the Apostle Paul considered himself to be a prophet, not all of his speculative predictions were accurate. He once claimed:
10 I perceive that this voyage will end with disaster and much loss, not only of the cargo and ship, but also our lives (Acts 27:10).
And while his speculation was mostly accurate, it was not completely accurate, as there was no loss of lives. His position became completely accurate when he claimed to speak as God led him as opposed to his perceptions:
It also should be noted that while the Apostle Paul considered himself to be a prophet, not all of his speculative predictions were accurate. He once claimed:
10 I perceive that this voyage will end with disaster and much loss, not only of the cargo and ship, but also our lives (Acts 27:10).
And while his speculation was mostly accurate, it was not completely accurate, as there was no loss of lives. His position became completely accurate when he claimed to speak as God led him as opposed to his perceptions:
21 Men, you should have listened to me, and not have sailed from Crete and incurred this disaster and loss. 22 And now I urge you to take heart, for there will be no loss of life among you, but only of the ship. 23 For there stood by me this night an angel of the God to whom I belong and whom I serve, 24 saying, ‘Do not be afraid, Paul; you must be brought before Caesar; and indeed God has granted you all those who sail with you.’ 25 Therefore take heart, men, for I believe God that it will be just as it was told me. (Acts 27:21-25)
So, delays and speculations do not make one a false prophet. Stumbling does not make a leader false either, as according to the Apostle James:
1 My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment. 2 For we all stumble in many things. If anyone does not stumble in word, he is a perfect man, able also to bridle the whole body. (James 3:1-2)
There is a difference between stumbling and being a false leader.
Bob is a false teacher. He teaches false doctrines, legalism, lying dreams, and denies the salvational work of the cross. He despises the cross and makes no bones about it.
Notice how he tap dances around the Bible verse about lying false prophets. It only takes one!
A leader is biblically and clearly a false prophet when one claims to speak on God’s behalf and gives a prophecy that does not happen:
21 And if you say in your heart, ‘How shall we know the word which the Lord has not spoken?’ — 22 when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the thing does not happen or come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him. (Deuteronomy 18:21)
(The above suggests that if God’s prophets make statements that they do not claim to be from the Lord, and are in error, perhaps like what they think someone will do, that God is saying that personal comments from prophets are not inspired and not the same as false statements from those while claiming to speak in the name of the Lord.)
Most important of all, at least for us who deny him, it really frosts his butt that we do not acknowledge him as a prophet. Poor little guy!
Truly, most people, even in the COGs, will not listen to a true prophet of God in this age. And, even when God grants power to His two witnesses, most in the world will not only not listen to them, they will be deceived enough to support an army that will fight against the returning Jesus Christ (Revelation 16:13-14; 19:11-19)!
I imagine if a REAL prophet arose many would follow him (or her). But, you Bob are NOT a true prophet. Never have been and never will be. Even the Living Church of God rejected you en masse! You are not even worthy of being one of the two witnesses,
He desperately continues:
A true prophet is one called of God (which you were not), teaches the same gospel that Jesus taught (which you do not), keeps the commandments of God (which you do not, he Bbile says you do not), AND has predictions that come to pass (of which you have not had happen and will never have happen). Jesus (Mark 1:14) and Paul (Acts 28:30-31) taught the gospel of the kingdom of God. Even if one appears to be “an angel from heaven,” unless the true gospel is being taught, Paul says that such a one should be “accursed” (Galatians 1:9).
He attempts to make Rod Meredith out to talk about his prophet status, which Meredith never did and best of all publicly rebuked Bob for his deceitful craftiness.
HWA never had all the truth and only partially revealed some of it. It is up to the Great Bwana Bob to complete that knowledge. The Great Bwana even knows more than Rod Meredith.
Unlike Herbert W. Armstrong who restored truths to the Philadelphia era, and Bob Thiel who added more details to those truths, etc. Dr. Meredith did not do that. Nor did he fulfill the prophetic office. Nor has anyone currently in LCG done so.
Anyway, no, HWA’s word do not make mincemeat of my prophetic role. Herbert W. Armstrong believed that there would be future prophets, Aaron Dean confirmed that, Roderick C. Meredith said that I might be one, and that had the concurrence of Richard Ames (who HWA ordained) and Dr. Douglas Winnail (who had some type of ordination when HWA was alive).
If Aaron Dean and Rod Meredith both confirmed that the Great Bwana truly was a prophet, then they are as mentally disturbed as Bob is.
Despite improper accusations from various ones on the internet that I am some type of a false prophet, to the best of my knowledge I have never once posted a false prediction (and I do try to indicate when something is speculation), nor do those critics actually post any “false” predictions that I supposedly made and provide proof that even one was false. Thus, those who love the truth will not listen to their false dismissals.
Oh, and he is God-ordained! What a crock of steaming doodoo! God no more ordained Bwana Bob than the so-called double blessing of Gaylyn Bonjour did. It was meant for a one-time moment, not to raise up one of the most pathetic COG group ever.
Furthermore, I did not anoint myself– LCG minister Gaylyn Bonjour anointed me with oil and prayed I would receive a double-portion of God’s Spirit (which he said was reminiscent of the passing of the mantle)–hence I am not self-ordained, but am God-ordained. Yet sadly, some so misunderstand the role of prophets in the New Testament that they would rather believe the lies about me than face the truth that the actual facts reveal. Elisha then received a “double-portion” (“two-portion” literally) of the gift that God had given Elijah (2 Kings 2:9-13). Elisha picked up the mantle of Elijah (2 Kings 2:13) which Elijah dropped and God wanted him to have (1 Kings 19:16-19), as he replaced Elijah as God’s top ecclesiastical authority on earth (cf. 1 Kings 19:16). Yet, for several years after picked Elisha up the mantle that Elijah dropped, Elijah was still alive. While many outside of the genuine Church of God seem to doubt this, this is verified by 2 Chronicles 21:5, 12-15.
Do not let pride or preconceived ideas get in the way of you accepting biblical truth. That, according to Jesus, is actually the biggest problem for most Christians in the end time per Revelation 3:14-22–most Christians refuse to fully “hear what the Spirit says to the churches” (Revelation 3:22).
Will you truly hear and take the proper steps related to matters such as prophets?
Pride has nothing to do with rejecting one of the greatest false teachers and prophets of the COG today. Wisdom for decades of being the COG and watching one liar after another set themselves up as the one true church leader with each and every one of them denying Christ as they bow down at the altar of Moses.
Bob Thiel is a false teacher and a false prophet.
