Today Bob Thiel wrote on his blog under the News of the Living Church of God that he is surprised that Rod Meredith has concerns about his writings and books. Rod Meredith will be calling Bob this week to discuss this situation.
09/08/12 p.m. Attached to the Weekly Update from the Living Church of God, Charlotte (LCG), that is being read today in congregations throughout the world, was a letter from Dr. Meredith related to me, the Barack Obama, Prophecy, and the Destruction of the United States book, etc. FWIW, I was unaware of any LCG concerns about this book prior to seeing Dr. Roderick C. Meredith's letter, so this has come as somewhat a surprise.
In the past, the Charlotte-based evangelists such as Dr. Meredith, Richard Ames, and the late Dibar Apartian have always been supportive and encouraging regarding my writings and books. And while a couple of suggestions have been received in the past related to the books, no serious doctrinal concerns have ever been raised.
I am unaware if Dr. Meredith has yet had the time to read the book in its entirety and he is supposed to call me next week to discuss his concerns. A careful read of his letter shows that nowhere does he state that the book actually contains any error, but that it is not an official LCG document and that people need to check out what I write--"Prove all things" as the Apostle Paul wrote (1 Thessalonians 5:21, KJV)--and, of course, I completely concur with that.
From the beginning, it has been my intent to update the Barack Obama, Prophecy, and the Destruction of the United States book in November 2012 or January 2013 (I updated my previous book Fatima Shock! within a couple of months of its release), so I look forward to discussing details with Dr. Meredith.
Anyway, although I have served LCG in many capacities over the past 14 plus years, I have never been an employee, accepted any salary, etc. thus I have never been an official employee. And, of course, since LCG did not produce the Barack Obama, Prophecy, and the Destruction of the United States book, it should be clear to all that it is not an official LCG publication. In case there have been concerns about my non-official capacity or writings, the following information is at the www.cogwriter.com home page:
Important Notice
This is the personal home page of Bob Thiel, the Church of God writer AKA COGwriter. The opinions expressed are my own, based upon my understanding of history, various facts, and the Bible. This is not an official Living Church of God, United Church of God, Church of God (Seventh day), etc. site. This site is maintained by a genuine Church of God believer who is solely responsible for its content. The official website of the Living Church of God is http://www.lcg.org. The opinions and positions expressed within this page should not be taken to be the official position of the Global Church of God (which, for practical purposes, no longer exists), the Living Church of God, United Church of God, COGWA, etc.
The purpose of this web page is to promote biblical doctrines, help unify the remnant of the Philadelphia era of God's Church (so that those who are truly part of it may more effectively get the Gospel truth out as a witness per Matthew 24:14; Revelation 3:8), support the Ezekiel warning (Ezekiel 2 & 3), support Matthew 28:19-20 (etc.), and to alert true Philadelphian Christians so they can be kept "from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth" (Revelation 3:10). It is also hoped that those who are not Philadelphian will be able to benefit from its content, including those who had never previously received the witness of Christ's gospel of the kingdom.My intent is to continue to try to support Matthew 24:14, 28:19-20, and other aspects of the work. And I look forward to discussing those matters, including the final phase of the work, with Dr. Meredith.
26 comments:
Oh Gary...Thou art a stirrer of the pot...
M.T.Pagans
Mr. Meredith's letter was read to us today about Bob. I can say that many people are glad this has finally happened. LCG administration has basically given Bob free reign to do as he pleases all in the name of the LCG. Many suspect the reason behind this is that Bob contributes lots of money to the church. If one of us lower echelon member were to write this kind of stuff we would be out the door so fast we would know what happened.
What church members are sick of is his constant "We in the true church..." Who is the "we" he is talking about? Bob does not speak for us as members of the church! I would recommend to Bob to STOP saying such things and say "I believe" or “I understand this to mean…” Don't keep dragging the church, the Church of God's, or "true church" into these ridiculous speculations and nonsense that are being published.
Why does anyone in the church need to be concerned about quaint fairy tales of the Mayans or of Nostradamus? While these are all historical people and writings that have made history and do make a fascinating read, WHY give them so much credit?
Bob has a problem. The book is apparently for the secular crowd that has nothing to do with the LCG.
He is taking those outside the church for a prophetic ride. The whole concept that Barack is mentioned in the bible is ludicrous.
The problem starts when his fan club, those in the COG's, start reading this book and find that it deviates from the prophetic uttering they hear or read in church material.
I will say that Bob's book is just a lot of bluster. Meaningless dribble that stands to make him a lot of money off ignorant people in and out of Armstrongism.
That's exactly right! Why do we give such credence to such "prophetic sources." It's all a guessing game and Bob Thiel is just one opinion amongst hundreds. Thank you for finally putting this man in his place and not making him more than he is in the LCG.
Who me????????? I am not stirring anything up! ;-) What ever in the world would give you that idea????????
These people always make the first move by posting some comment, article, book, etc. for all the world to see. They seem to think they are unaccountable for their actions any more. All they need to do is keep their mouths shut and there would be NOTHING to post. But nooooooooooooooo, they cannot do such a thing.
It's not like I am deliberately picking on any one person since this entire blog is nothing more than a diversion that has turned into a highly popular source for the latest craziness in the COG.
These people are just the tip of the iceberg in Armstrongism. There are far crazier people out there that never make the blog.
I am amazed that Bob Thiel did not pick up on Innuit prophecy about a black devil who would rule and destroy the earth. How could he miss that?
What kind of credibility can you have if you miss the prophecies of the Eskimo peoples who are the orignal people to North America?????
Bob also missed the "White Buffalo" in American Indian history. I would give more credence to native Americans than a non-existent empire in South America.
Zee bubble, eet ees about to burrrrrst...
Too bad Amazon doesn't show how many downloads his books are getting.
Like the Painful Truth said above, these books are not targeting current LCG members. They are a way for Bob Th(d)eil to make money off the ignorant masses who think the end of the world will happen in December 2012. The Barack Obama book is likewise a monetizing scheme to acquire dollars from right-wing nut jobs.
Bob is an ignoramus on most things but he appears to be a halfway decent businessman. Like his idol HWA, he knows just enough about advertising and business to be dangerous.
If Dr. Thiel is surprised by this letter, why did he get a personal visit from Dr. Winnail two weeks ago?
And if he's trying to distance himself from LCG by saying he's not on the payroll, why does his biography declare him an "adviser" to LCG leaders?
I fear that "double portion" of the Holy Spirit (mentioned at Otagosh about this book) may be getting to the Doctor's head.
Note that last Anon comment: "Finally, Mr. Meredith is doing something about this guy..."
The membership is usually out in front of the leadership, always has been. People aren't stupid, even if they get caught up in stupid group-think for a time.
Sooner or later, common sense tells people that the right these leaders claim, to behave in such arbitrary fashion in their self-alleged "God-given" role, is illegitimate.
Like I said, people don't care about these HQ decrees...and, yes, "more and more, PCG and RCG members, don't, either."
Doesn't matter if they're "required" to care, as Gerry and Davey might think. That ship continues to sail throughout the COG world.
History is a great teacher, and the COG history is readily available on the Internet, in increasing size and scope. And so what do guys like Gerry and Davey do? They try to tell their followers what sites they can and cannot, should and should not, visit. That's ridiculous.
It's like the old days, when HWA and company told people what kind of books and literature they should avoid. That was a little easier, because more effort was required to obtain things -- you had to buy books and magazines, or send away to request literature. Now, anybody with a computer and connection can instantly access the Internet. Attempting to monitor what they do is silly, and is therefore destined to fail.
Without total control, the dictators can't dictate. Things have changed, for the better.
This should be an interesting battle of egos. Someone is going to have to back down. It will either end in a love fest of cooperation and understanding as to who is who and what is what or it will end badly with a packing up of ones marbles and going to play somewhere else.
It will either end in a love fest of cooperation and understanding as to who is who and what is what
Does Meredith really understand "who is who" in Thiel's estimation? Read what Thiel himself has written.:
Since there are no properly ordained apostles currently in the genuine Church of God, those who truly accept proper church governance would accept the spiritual authority of any properly anointed Church of God prophets.
One, of course, even the top ecclesiastical authority, can lose their top position. This happened with Elijah, for example, even though he had been a faithful leader for a long time. Elijah, however, eventually lost the mental ability to properly lead (1 Kings 19:13-18). God later took him and replaced him with Elisha as the top ecclesiastical authority. Elisha then received a “double-portion” (two-portion literally) of the gift that God had given Elijah (2 Kings 2:9-13). Elisha picked up the mantle of Elijah (2 Kings 2:13) which Elijah dropped and God wanted him to have (1 Kings 19:16-19), as he replaced Elijah as God’s top ecclesiastical authority on earth (cf. 1 Kings 19:16). Yet, for several years after picked Elisha up the mantle that Elijah dropped, Elijah was still alive. While many outside of the genuine Church of God seem to doubt this, this is verified by 2 Chronicles 21:5, 12-15 (see also Elijah: Past and Prophesied).
Perhaps it should be mentioned that A.N. Dugger (of CG7) for a while was probably the top ecclesiastical authority. He also claimed to have had succession from the apostles to hold the top ecclesiastical authority (Dugger, A History of True Religion, pp. 306, 308; this was also confirmed by Robert Coulter in a telephone conversion on April 2, 2012 with B. Thiel where R. Coulter explained various writings he as the former CG7 president and CG7 historian had ran across in his research).
Yet, even though A.N. Dugger did not fall into severe apostasy, because he ignored certain truths (for example, A.N. Dugger saw truth in doctrine that Herbert Armstrong brought up as he admitted in writing on July 28, 1929; and when he had a chance with his new organization in 1933 to correct them, A.N. Dugger failed to do so), the mantle was passed to Herbert Armstrong in the 1930s (though Herbert Armstrong did not realize at the time, and probably in 1933 as HWA later wrote). However, A.N. Dugger continued for many more decades as a leader. But those of the Philadelphian era and its remnant do not believe that A.N. Dugger retained the top ecclesiastical authority after the 1930s.
Thiel proposes that the "final phase of the work" involves a mentally incapacitated leader being superseded (against his will) by a prophet who has a double-portion of God's Spirit. I wonder who Thiel has in mind?
Waking up to find your church has already had a letter read worldwide to all congregations is a statement of where the power lies and where it doesn't.
Of all the ways this could have been addressed, this most public and unannounced letter sends quite a message to Bob personally as to where he actually stands as an advisor to the Evangelists etc.
Of all the ways this could have been addressed, this most public and unannounced letter sends quite a message to Bob personally as to where he actually stands as an advisor to the Evangelists etc.
Good point - but it raises another question. Shouldn't RCM have "gone to his brother" FIRST with his concerns, as Matthew 18:15-20 advises? Instead of going to the entire - and in this case, I mean entire - church?
Or again, did Dr. Winnail already try to do that?
if i had to guess, the Winnail visit was the private one that may not have resolved much? It does seem rather drastic a first move to go around BT without a clue
or this blogger site posting Bob's being the official spokesman and writing this book we were commenting on may have been seen and it was a kneejerk reaction . That "official spokesman for LCG" while meant tongue in cheek on this site has probably taken on a life of its own outside this site
"Shouldn't RCM have "gone to his brother" FIRST with his concerns, as Matthew 18:15-20 advises? Instead of going to the entire - and in this case, I mean entire - church?"
Yes, but only if you figure these church tycoons ought to practice what they preach. Most people, so it seems, are content to give them a pass when it comes to bad behavior. Some tycoons even go so far as to OFFICIALLY preach that god gives them a pass too, which is really just a way of telling the sheeple that they are morally obligated to allow the tycoons to be total hypocrites. That ought to be a huge red flag to anyone with an ounce of common sense.
But the sheeple already qualified themselves for many years as mental/emotional weaklings who NEED to be stabled and milked by a sheister with the right sort of "confidence." It is this neediness that binds them to their snake oil dealer, not unlike the way an addict is bound to his drug dealer. For those soulless and unscrupulous charlatans to whom all of this is blindingly obvious, they are more than happy to lend a "helping hand." How "christian" of them. Fear not stupid little flock.
RCM has always known upon which side his bread is buttered, which is why he's the tycoon. Just look at the whole Global/Living transition scandal. If anyone threatens his power, he will do ANYTHING to destroy the threat and maintain his grip on his stable of sheeple (revenue stream). He will not be hemmed in by feeling obligated to be "christian" about it either. That's the way all the Armstrongite leaders are. Not an upstanding one among them.
The PCG sheep never wander too far from home. Their web surfing and worldview, begins and ends with their theTrumpet.com homepage. Only the very elite, living within Flurry's gate, have the official list of who's who in the COG. The ones out in the field (CD-Land), only know they're surrounded by Laodicean idiots. There's not two witnesses among the unpaid flock, who could positively identify Weinerdude in a police lineup, let alone, this Bob Thiel clown. After all the years of wearing blinders, it's doubtful, they're even aware of RCM being alive, still able and hopefully willing to kick Bob's ass, finally.
The PCGers fancy their selves as well-informed, with great insights into global issues. But, their one-stop-source for all wisdom has maintained the cluelessness. With tyranny over the mind of sheep, comes a guilt complex, especially, if that mind wastefully spends time grazing on its own. So, you'll never catch a PCG sheep, browsing around a place like this, and enjoying the freedom to think.
This new book of Thiel's could be considered by LCG to be an independent and personal effort at evangelism. Such efforts have always been considered as a violation of church government in the past. What classic WCG member, or even minister would have even dared to publish a book on prophecy during the despotic reign of self-proclaimed "apostle" HWA?
COGwriter is no longer just an exercise in brown nosing! Either the site will soon be shut down or severely muzzled, or Bob will rise up and attempt to supplant his mentors. It was an interesting experiment while it lasted, but surely the senior management of LCG now recognizes that such efforts are counter to their own.
Thiel has always pointed out that the difference between LCG and most of the other ACOGs is method of governance, and it would appear that he is now about to experience that for himself.
BB
I am an LCG member and have been a fan of this sight for a long time. While this site may have called Thiel the "official spokesman" for the LCG, it is not without reason. Thiel sets himself as pillar of wisdom in the church constantly proclaiming that the LCG is the ONLY way. He constantly says, "WE in the Living Church of God understand or believe...." LCG members are getting tired of him claiming to represent us in all of his articles and musings. Many of us in LCG do not share the views and weirdness that seems to come from him. We don’t consider ourselves enlighted and better than the other members as Bob does.
On his site he says the following: “This site is maintained by a genuine Church of God believer…” Notice the “genuine” part. He seems to constantly set himself up as better and more intelligent that the rest of us in LCG. By constantly bragging about his enlightened status as a “true believer” he has alienated a lot of people. A little humility would do this guy a lot of good! Perhaps that time has come.
Someone mentioned above that Thiel is LCG’s version of Dankenbring. How true that is.
LCG member here too. All I can say is THANKS!!!!!!!
Just the fact that there are LCG members who not only visit here but are fans of this site is reason for hope.
"For the times they are a-changin'..."
SING IT, Bobby D!
I'd like to see a debate between "faux Ph.D" Thiel and RCM.
But would it be fair if Bob has 2x the Holy Spirit that Rod has?
And, who could moderate such a debate?
Norm
Who could moderate such a debate?
How about James Malm? No?
Okay, then, Bill Dankenbring? No again?
Don't nominate Ron Weinland; he's otherwise engaged.
Hey, I've got it! Draw lots among the UCG Council of Elders. Everyone in that group is so fair-minded that whoever the duty falls on is sure to treat the debaters evenhandedly.
Farence Quair
I heard that Mr. King from the COGSR group talked with Bob Thiel regarding a public talk but Mr. Thiel never responded. Of course, who wants to talk to a nut job who carries a Bible and a gun...it would be interesting to see all these groups go at it :)
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