Whoring For Money
Below is the "Personal" written by Gerald Weston in the Nov.-Dec. 2019 Tomorrow's World magazine. I reproduced it in its entirety so as not to be accused of cherry-picking to twist comments out of context. I did highlight a few items so as to address them after.
HOW CAN ALL OF THIS BE FREE?
There are two of our resources that you have not likely come across. Frankly, I do not think we have advertised them to the public or mentioned them in our magazine in years. Do you know what they are?
This column is titled “Personal” for a reason. As Editor in Chief, it gives me an opportunity to communicate with you about those things that are on my mind, and in this issue, I want to answer three questions that are asked of us: “Who is behind Tomorrow’s World?,” “Is it really free?,” and “How can you pay for so much television and give away all of your materials without asking for money?”
Let me answer the second question first. Yes, everything we advertise really is free of charge—no strings attached, and no emotional appeals.We do not sell magazines, booklets, DVDs, or CDs—and we never will. Our 24-lesson Bible Study Course is sent free of charge. We do not hawk shirts, mugs, prayer cloths, or any other such items as you have likely seen peddled [interesting word choice] by other ministries.
The answer to the first question, “Who is behind Tomorrow’s World?,” explains the answer to the third. The Tomorrow’s World magazine and telecast are sponsored by the Living Church of God, which is made up of dedicated members who seek to practice “the whole counsel of God,” as the Apostle Paul referred to it in Acts 20:27. That counsel includes the biblical law of tithing (or “tenth-ing”). Most of our members faithfully and voluntarily send in their tithes and offerings throughout the year. We don’t even take up offerings during our weekly Sabbath services!
Jesus gave us our mission in Matthew 28:19–20: “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” In Mark 16:15, He plainly commands, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.” Furthermore, He said that we will succeed in accomplishing this mission before His return: “And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come” (Matthew 24:14).
As you well know, we never request donations on the Tomorrow’s World telecast, in our magazine, or in any of our literature. Coworkers and members of the Living Church of God take seriously Jesus’ admonition, “Freely you have received, freely give” (Matthew 10:8). Or as Proverbs 23 tells us, “Buy the truth, and do not sell it” (v. 23).
A DIFFERENT APPROACH
Of the more than 290,000 current subscribers to Tomorrow’s World, only about 15 out of 100 ever contribute to this Work. Many of these do so only one or two times over a period of several years. We are grateful to all who contribute, no matter how often and no matter how much or how little. We also appreciate our subscribers who, for whatever reason, never contribute. We advertise that our literature is free, and truly it is. And this may surprise you: We are so serious about our literature being sent free of charge that we return money when the giver explicitly says he or she is sending it as “payment” for our materials.This is true for all our offices around the world. I can personally confirm this, as I was the Director of the Living Church of God and Tomorrow’s World in Canada for more than 13 years, and in the United Kingdom for a couple of years, before being transferred to our world headquarters here in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Each month, one of us—usually me—writes a letter to all our members and coworkers to express our appreciation for their support and update them on biblical prophecies and trends taking place in this world. We also give “behind the scenes” information on new developments in this Work to which they contribute.
The Living Church of God has more than 390 congregations scattered across North, Central, and South America, Australasia, the U.K. and Europe, and Africa. We, along with coworkers who have voluntarily chosen to be part of this Work, are a small but dedicated group who are willing to go against the course of this world (Ephesians 2:1–2), following the way of Jesus Christ and first-century Christianity. Our members reject pagan and heathen traditions that have infiltrated modern Christianity. We observe the days God instructs us to observe, and we follow the true doctrines found in the Bible.
At the beginning of this Personal, I referred to the two least-advertised and least-requested pieces of literature we provide. Do you know what they are? The first one is our booklet God’s People Tithe! We do not promote it frequently because we don’t want anyone thinking there is “a catch to all this free stuff.” Receiving any of our resources is not dependent in any way on donating to this Work. While this booklet is listed among our resources on the Internet and in Lesson 16 of our Bible Study Course, it is the second-least-advertised and requested booklet that we have. As I write this, very few of our subscribers even know of it. As far as I can recall, it has never been mentioned on our Tomorrow’s World telecast. [And there is a very very good reason why which will be explained below.]
And speaking of the Internet, we do have a link on our website for anyone who wants to donate. This is only because some people want to do so and want to know how. We do not “promote” it or position it prominently, as so many websites do with theirs. It is there strictly as a service for those who want to donate of their own free will, and there is no emotional appeal made for them to do so.
So, what resource could be advertised less than our tithing booklet? The one that almost none of our subscribers (and probably not all of our members) know of is our “Planned Giving” brochure. Some of our members, coworkers, and subscribers desire to include us in their wills or make other types of planned gifts. We make this resource on estate planning available upon request to help those who want to do so.
Now, I understand that I’ve taken a risk here of bringing out the cynical nature in some. They no doubt will think this is an appeal for money—and if they do, I understand. However, we have nothing to hide, and we receive these three questions on a regular basis. I believe it is best to be open with people and simply “tell it as it is.” Tomorrow’s World is backed by the Living Church of God and others who want to contribute to this Work—and yes, all of our materials really and truly are free.
TRUSTING GOD TO PROVIDE
And more importantly, all our resources will continue to be sent free of charge. No one will call to ask you to send money or buy something. You should never feel pressured to give to this Work. We are grateful to those who do, but that is a decision between you and your Creator. We will do as we have always done—trust God to provide. For us, faith that God will provide is real. He has taken care of us, and each issue you receive of Tomorrow’s World is tangible proof.
Occasionally, we ask our subscribers to renew their free subscription—not to get them to contribute money, but to let us know that they are truly interested in receiving further issues of Tomorrow’s World. We believe this is a way to be good stewards—by not sending magazines to individuals who may no longer want them.
So, while other televangelists sell their wares with sentimental music, pictures of orphans, and teary-eyed appeals for money, we will never do that. Truly, this magazine and all our resources are free for the asking."
HOW and WHEN, my Friend
It is true that everything is free. LCG does not "peddle" materials produced to the masses. It is also true that there are never any emotional appeals. Frankly, I don't think they are capable of that. BUT all this is true as long as you never fall for the hook.
Tithing is a doctrine wholly dependent upon HOW it is framed and more importantly, WHEN it is introduced. When I first came across the teachings of HWA, one of the first things you are told is that everything the church offers is absolutely free. “Freely you have received, freely give” was Christ’s admonition to the 12 before He sent them out to preach the gospel. Most people would spend months, even years, consuming the free literature.
But all good ad men have a hook and call to action. You can’t just sit around studying our free literature the rest of your life. No, you have to call in to HQ and get a minister to come visit your house so he can invite you into the “body of Jesus Christ.” HWA perverted the ”freely you have received, freely give” principle by using a basic marketing tool where you offer someone something for free, knowing they will feel obligated to give you something in return. It was by offering free literature, he would then guilt and scare people into sending in offerings and eventually requiring 3 tithes on top of offerings as a “member in good standing.” It has been documented that as much as 25% of the annual income came from co-worker letters guilting and scaring non-members into paying up.
HWA created a cult of “Truth” that only he had. Even though he spent 11 years in the Church of God (Seventh Day) from 1927 to 1938 and learned 16 of the 18 truths he claimed to restore to the church after 1900 years. To keep you off the trail of competition, he labeled COG7D as “Sardis” from Revelation 3:1-6. COG7D was the “dead church” so you certainly don’t want to go snooping around there. No, truth exists only in “God’s Church” and God’s Church is the Worldwide Church of God, the one and only true church organized on the planet in existence that is Philadelphian (Revelation 3:7-13) and commissioned to finish the “Work!”
The purpose of the WCG was to proclaim the gospel to the world so that the end would come (Matthew 24:14) and Jesus would return to establish His kingdom on earth. WCG was the continuation of the apostolic church of 31 A.D. and was in the final end run as Jesus was going to return in 1975. If you are not in the WCG, you will not be counted worthy to escape all of the horrors promised to come upon a wicked world. If you want to save your own skin, you better start by joining the WCG who freely gave you all this knowledge of the Bible. Fear was the dominating factor that turned co-workers into members.
By the time you are ready to commit to attending the one true church on earth, it is because you have already studied and accepted many doctrines of the church. You have come to believe that you proved WCG is the only church and now as you start attending, there is a sense of exuberance and purpose and security and trust in the "true church."
Once inside is where the bait and switch occurred. Once inside, you were brought under the subjection of an authoritarian cult where elitist ministers controlled everything and what was once free, now came with a price tag of 20% of your income and in certain years, 30%. On top of this was the expected offerings to pour into HQ. Now, at this time, you obviously didn’t see that you were being locked into an authoritarian cult designed to milk you of your livelihood all for the grandeur of Herb.
It was only then, that you were introduced to the argument made by the church that tithing is a carry-over from the Old Covenant that still exists in the New Covenant by way of employing an ordained ministry and fulfilling Mathew 24:14 so we can hide safely for 3.5 years and take office in the Millenium. Tithing introduced to you at this point, in this way, after you have committed much of your time studying and being convinced you have found "the one and only true" church, made perfect sense. Any cognitive dissonance that arises in your mind at this point would be silenced by the time and effort already painstakingly invested.
Once you have gone this far down the rabbit-hole, cognitive dissonance kicks into over-drive. The term, “cognitive dissonance” is “the state of having inconsistent thoughts, beliefs, or attitudes, especially as relating to behavioral decisions and attitude change.”
Put another way, “Cognitive dissonance refers to a situation involving conflicting attitudes, beliefs or behaviors. This produces a feeling of mental discomfort leading to an alteration in one of the attitudes, beliefs or behaviors to reduce the discomfort and restore balance.” This was coined by Leon Festinger, a social psychologist, after studying a UFO religious cult. He predicted that after the leader of the cult prophesied a date that the people would be taken from earth and that date came and went, the people would not abandon the cult in droves. Instead, they would self-justify a way to stay and, in fact, double down their support. His claims are questionable but this is what he says happened: The leader proclaimed the world was spared by the E.T.’s because of their devotion and the response was one of doubling down their efforts to support the leader. The people did not leave because cognitive dissonance keeps us from owning up to mistakes and admitting when we are wrong or have been fooled. No one wants to believe they are stupid or foolish so we instead, double down on our foolishness. Our pride locks us in even more and explains why people will sometimes believe crazier and crazier things over time (Enter the likes of Dave Pack, Gerald Flurry and Bob Theil).
"For we are not, as so many, peddling the word of God..." -II Corinthians 2:17The Greek for “peddling” is KAPELEUO and Paul’s use of it can be most rightly translated to mean, “whoring for money.”
HWA was a business failure who turned his marketing skills on earning a living as a religious gnostic. He was an “information marketer” with a peculiar set of knowledge (gnosis) that, he claims, was kept hidden from humanity for 1900 years. The market on the “simplicity of Christ” was already saturated. HWA saw no niche in going up against the Billy Graham types. Instead, he developed a syncretistic core of teachings largely learned in the Church of God (Seventh Day) and to a lesser degree, other religious thinkers that fall out from mainstream Christianity. He used classic psychological tactics described today as the tools of a “cult guru” to control people with guilt and fear.
Gerald Weston is no HWA. In fact, all of these men who have come after are just managers of a dying cult. They are blinded and deceived by their own cognitive dissonance and continue to peddle the model of an unbiblical church structure. Facing their own cognitive dissonance would not only demand they recognize a lifetime wasted supporting and participating in an abusive cult but would require that they end their employ immediately and seek the forgiveness of thousands who they harmed as well as the one they thought they were serving all along, Jesus Christ.
They may not admit or even see how they are indeed, peddling, or whoring for money but the tactics they learned under HWA are not lost. All of the magnanimous talk up front of giving freely, refusing to take payment and never using emotional tactics is just setting the trap. But once the bait is taken, the fear and guilt trip begins. Demands on your family's livelihood are made in the name of God and if you refuse to comply (now that you are in-the-know) there will be dire consequences leading to physical suffering in this life culminating in the tribulation and ultimate spiritual, eternal destruction.
At the risk of this post being too long, I think it is worth the time to just see what the tithing booklet actually says. I recommend everyone who is in, but definitely people who are not in but considering joining LCG, to read the booklet. I am somewhat surprised that they would want the booklet on tithing on the radar of prospective members. It is counter-intuitive in how HWA used the process, not introducing the tithing doctrines until they are locked in as visiting members on a weekly basis. I think this will back-fire and I hope this post will help that to happen.
God's People Tithe!
Anyone familiar with WCG will know that many booklet titles were usually worded as a question. Even LCG has continued in that tradition since almost half the booklets are still titled with a question. So it really struck me that the booklet on tithing was the only one ever titled not only without a question mark but with an emphatic “!”
Now, that may seem like a minor and petty point to make. Perhaps, but actually makes sense from a cult’s perspective on protecting its livelihood and existence. It takes money to exist and stay relevant. A system that demands a steady income that the organization can budget from is also greatly helpful to the organization. I don’t think it is a coincidence that tithing is the only doctrine introduced to the people in a way that precludes even questioning it by its very title.
The booklet has a total of 28 pages so you would expect a lot of Scriptures to back up the church teaching that tithing is a New Testament Law. Oddly enough, there are only 4 places in Scripture to supposedly prove this “law” and they are all introduced in the first 7 pages. The booklet itself, could easily be parsed down to a 1 or 2 page article. [Disclaimer for my tithe troll: This is not a comprehensive post about tithing]
Twenty-one pages are filler used to shame, guilt and fear you into tithing. At the risk of being accused of cherry-picking and twisting quotes out of context, here are some of the quotes to prove it. I do recommend everyone read the booklet in it's entirety.
“How plain! If we are looking for an argument [against tithing] we will always find one. But if we are willing to “hunger and thirst” for righteousness…” -p.7
This implies that if you find arguments against tithing, it is because you do not hunger and thirst for righteousness. If you look for an argument against tithing, you will find one but only because your motives are wrong.
“Pay the Creator of heaven and earth the “tithes” you owe Him--plus generous offerings--and see Him become more “real” in your life as you truly serve and obey Him.” -p.17
This implies God is not real in your life and you are not truly serving and obeying Him if you don’t tithe.
“Others who may know that you are a tithe-payer can see you learning to love, fear, obey and serve your Creator.” -p.19
This implies you cannot learn to love, fear, obey and serve God if you do not pay tithes. And others won’t even be able to recognize you as a real Christian if you don’t tithe. This is one of the most absurd of the comments in the booklet.
"The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other people--robbers, evildoers, adulterers--or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.'" --Luke 18:11-12
“Another vitally important lesson tithing teaches is true humility and heartfelt obedience to our Creator.” -p.19
This implies you cannot learn true humility and heartfelt obedience if you do not tithe. I guess the Pharisee in Luke 18 was a godly example of humility after all.
“And by faithfully tithing, we learn another important lesson—faith.” -p.19
This implies you cannot learn faith if you do not tithe. Relying on God, does indeed build faith. Unfortunately, faith can be built by doing something in ignorance and not required.
“Tithing done in a good attitude will positively affect your life now in so many ways, but all the more powerfully for all eternity in tomorrow’s world!” -p.21
This implies a good life now and eternal life is only given to those who tithe.
“And most important for you personally, find that Work which shows how you can escape being destroyed during those same prophesied events.” -p.23
This is important for LCG to emphasize because of the competition that exists today. There are basically only 3 main groups but they are all roughly the same in membership and work size which is sad in both accounts. I would argue in the first 10 years, the GCG-LCG camp was doing more of a work than any others. But since then, it has reached a lifeless homeostasis with the rest of COGland. But it is important to point out once again, the use of fear, but not only in not tithing but to fatally tithe to the wrong ministerial retirement fund.
“We are not preaching a gospel of “prosperity and wealth”…Nevertheless, God does materially bless and prosper those who properly follow His laws of financial success. If we faithfully tithe and do our part, the great God whom we serve will never let us down!” -p.25
Wait. Maybe this is the most absurd. This implies we do teach a prosperity gospel and if you don’t tithe, God will let you down. Implies? No, this just says straight up that while we would never admit to teaching the health and wealth snake oil doctrine used so effectively today by Olsteen, Jakes and others who learned from their pioneer, Herb, we do in fact teach it and should actually be credited for it being used so effectively.
“’In the mind of any honest student of the Bible, there should be no question but that tithing to God and to His work is certainly “pleasing” in God’s sight!” p.27
This implies you cannot be an honest student of the Bible if you do not tithe. Nay, even to question it using logic, reason and research in the Scriptures makes you a liar to be heavily frowned upon by God.
“Those who try to get around tithing and who ignore this very plain warning are going to be shaken in the day of God’s wrath!” p.27
Using fear, you can expect pain, suffering and death if you even think of trying to get around tithing or ignoring it for being a doctrine of men.
“…it is very doubtful if He has much interest in the trick arguments of carnal men trying to get around His instruction to tithe.” -p.28
The implication is that if you can argue against tithing from the Bible, it is only because you are unconverted and carnal, using trick arguments. There is no way you can even begin an honest inquiry into questioning tithing without proving to be a carnal trickster.
It seems to me the only carnal trick arguments being used are spread throughout the last 21 pages of this booklet using fear-based and emotional mind control tactics to convince you to tithe without any Biblical proof other than that which was presented in the first 7 pages.
After 21 pages of brow-beating and fear-mongering, it is likely the 4 places in Scripture introduced at the beginning of the booklet are now made convincing enough to you (even when they are not) because this topic has not been introduced to you as a teaching of the church until you are already attending services and the cognitive dissonance is taking hold of your soul.
All churches of God collecting tithes as a N. T. law are whoring for money. The "work" these churches are producing all ad up to nothing in not only conversion but sheer lack of reach. They are all on pace to never fulfill Matthew 24:14, In fact, all Matthew 24:14 was ever expected to do was enable Herb to die a wealthy respected businessman among his peers. If left to the churches of God to fulfill Matthew 24:14, Christ will never return. The only "work" tithing is successfully accomplishing is funding the Ambassador College alumni retirement plan.
My recommendation to my brethren is to forget Matthew 24:14 because it is something a small select few of individuals actually called and used by God will accomplish someday without your income. It will be accomplished by individuals who will be able to say things like Paul did here:
For it seems to me that God has put us apostles on display at the end of the procession, like those condemned to die in the arena. We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe, to angels as well as to human beings. We are fools for Christ, but you are so wise in Christ! We are weak, but you are strong! You are honored, we are dishonored! To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty, we are in rags, we are brutally treated, we are homeless. We work hard with our own hands. When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; when we are slandered, we answer kindly. We have become the scum of the earth, the garbage of the world—right up to this moment.” --I Corinthians 4:9-13
Show me one minister in any church of God that lives on tithes that would not be laughed to scorn if they said something like this.
What we are all required to do if you want to be right with God is make the Sermon on the Mount the centerpiece of your Christianity and strive to be the sheep Jesus describes in Matthew 25:31-46. Be courageous and really examine yourself. Face your cognitive dissonance head-on and be prepared for a world of hurt. Then let the anger and sadness give way to reason and prepare yourself to be there for those still waiting to be set free.
by Stoned Stephen Society
41 comments:
it really struck me that the booklet on tithing was the only one ever titled not only without a question mark but with an emphatic “!”
What about LCG's Revelation: The Mystery Unveiled!
Why did it really strike you, when it is false? Either you're a sloppy researcher or you came into this with a pre-drawn conclusion, just like what we would expect from LCG. If you are going to criticize someone, it's helpful if you avoid making the same mistakes they make.
This reminds me of a former WCG member who said something like, “Never touch anything that says FREE. FREE cost be $60,000.00.”
It takes courage Stephen to go back through all the books and booklets of the church with a new perspective. I have myself been rereading many of them looking for purity and genuineness. Much of the time all I get are carnival games - under inflated thick rubber balloons that darts bounce off of, yellow ducks that no matter how many you pluck out of the water, never have the winning number, BB guns that are so inaccurate you can barely hit the side of a barn and unbalanced weighted bowling pins that seemingly can't be all knocked down no matter how you hit them.
For a young child or those young of mind, carnival games are the greatest thing that could happen on that particular day. For the adult who has to pay 10 or 20 times what it is worth to win something that could be purchased for very much less just down the road, the carnival game scene isn't as interesting.
Many of us were raised and taught to be "all in" no matter what endeavor we participated in. So, many of us were a perfect fit for what is supposed to be the greatest religious work ever. We also grew up in a time when everything was tangible and had to be purchased. So again, many are and were a perfect fit for the WCG.
In this digital age when almost anything can be bought or stolen or taken free with a keyboard, the dynamics have changed. Dave Pack has moaned and moaned how all the millennial's and Xers take his free literature and give back nothing in return (Yikes). What worked for the WCG in getting back more in money than whatever amount was given away free, does not work anymore.
Dave Pack in his constant demands for "Common" money from his membership, dropped the biggest statement ever when he said; "do you brethren think it is any different in God's church than in the world? If you want to play - you have to pay!"
Big words from a big man who wants to be a very big organization. The biblical equation of how to get to from point A to point B changed because God's work supposedly has a generational problem. The "true" work of God who wants to give away free what it got for free, is being seriously harmed by two generations who expect everything for free. I can't wait to read about this titanic clash in the extension of the book of Acts.
The carnival continues in earnest. In the end, many are left with just a very expensive stuffed animal.
Since tithing is NOT a New Covenant command, not one single LCG member should be sending a tithe to Gerald Weston. Deviate COG ministers still claim it is commanded in order to maintain their privileged lifestyles. I suggest they get off their asses and work! Get those effeminate hands dirty and grimy working with the homeless, prostitutes and run-away youth. Get out of those $1,000 suites and put on a pair of jeans and get on your knees, in humility, and be the hands of Jesus in a hurting world.
Well, yes and no! They are telling the truth in that they never charge for any of the collateral materials which you request. However, there is a huge, life-long financial and psychological price tag should you choose to embrace their philosophy. So, basically, they are using a time honored advertising trick and not disclosing the full truth. Which is tantamount to lying.
BB
The Libertarian Party has longed used the following slogan for many years.
It is the acronym “TANSTAAFL” For the uninitiated, “TANSTAAFL” stands for “There ain’t no such thing as a free lunch” essentially a caution that you can’t get something for nothing.
The economist Milton Friedman popularized it in the name of a 1975 book.
Frankly, selling church literature and putting a price tag on it is much more honest, cheaper in the long haul, and more forthright IMHO!
The Jehovah's Witnesses have a much more sound financial system that, like their Theology & Soteriology, is much closer to early Christianity than Stupid Herbert's Armstrongism!
The Jehovah's Witnesses, like early Christians, don't soak their working-class following to bankruptcy like cruel unscriptual Armstrongism!
One serious problem with giving money to the splinter groups is that there are now so many different splinter groups that each want your money. If you give your money to one splinter group that claims you will be stealing from God if you don't hand it over to them, then other splinter groups will say that they still did not get any money from you and that you have still stolen from God for not handing your money over to them.
Here are some considerations:
If you support GTA and his CGI or ICG rebel groups you will be a wicked rebel too, opposing HWA and the WCG.
If you support Dart you will be born to lose.
If you support the apostate Tkaches and GCI you will be an apostate too, opposing virtually everything that HWA had taught, except for tithing, of course.
If you support the UCG you will be supporting godlessness, old Tkach goons like Kubik, and newly credentialed fake ministers.
If you support David Hulme you obviously lack vision, and just waste good money on blind guides.
If you support RCM and his LCG you will be taking part in his competitive “doctrinal upgrades” against what HWA had taught.
If you support one of the major false prophets like Flurry or Pack you will be his accomplice and guilty of helping him to spread major doctrinal perversions and satanic abuse.
If you support one of the minor false prophets like Weinland or Thiel you will be his accomplice and guilty of helping him to spread mental problems.
If you support one of the individual, divisive, confused rebels like Edwards or Malm you will be an idiot.
Imagine the hundreds of millions of dollars that have been wasted on and by the splinter groups since HWA died in 1986 and since the Tkaches destroyed the WCG in 1995.
The splinter groups have gone through a lot of money over the years and about all they have to show for it is all sorts of doctrinal changes, and nice houses for the self-appointed big shots.
The WCG under HWA would have done something noticeable on the world scene with that much money. Magazines, radio programs, television programs, and Internet sites would be in everyone's face all around the world.
Good article SSS.
On one hand they say offerings are voluntary, and contributors are not pressured. It's only until you get into the inside that you begin to see what the true cost is toward adherance of the Armstrongism Standard. Not only is tithing absolutely commanded, seven holy day offerings as well, but it is strongly stated that non-tithing is rebellion and stealing, as it has been stated many times in many articles before the "Weston" Era in the WCG with the WN.
Once you become a "baptized", "Converted" "Member" of the Church, tithing becomes absolutely mandatory, and this should be stated right out. BB was absolutely correct about a life-long, psychological price tag that is in addition to the monetary price tag of weekly payments. And any of us who have been through the wringer know this as fact.
I would say to anyone questioning ANY Armstrong Splinter group that teaches the doctrines of Armstrong this simple truth: YES, there's a catch. IF you subscribe to an Armstrong Church of God, you WILL be expected to give up at the least a tenth up to a third of your total income in combined tithes, offerings, contributions, funding programs, local church activities, and other requests. You will be expected to toe the line, support the ministry and their lifestyles. In return, you will be expected to tithe, to pray, to shut up, and to obey. All of this stems from the doctrinal positions of their mother church and their late leader. Count the Cost. Use your head.
"If you support one of the major false prophets like Flurry or Pack you will be his accomplice and guilty of helping him to spread major doctrinal perversions and satanic abuse.
If you support one of the minor false prophets like Weinland or Thiel you will be his accomplice and guilty of helping him to spread mental problems."
Somewhat of a minor point --- Now, in the Church of God scene, we apparently have such a number of major and minor false prophets, and so many on the COG scene -- You could take their writings and make a "Anti-Book" with it all. It would go like
Old Books (Era)
1 Armstrong
2 Armstrong
3 Armstrong
Garner Ted
Meredith
Rice
1 McNair
2 McNair
1 Hoeh
2 Hoeh
3 Hoeh
1 Waterhouse
2 Waterhouse
3 Waterhouse
4 Waterhouse
5 Waterhouse
6 Waterhouse
7 Waterhouse
8 Waterhouse
9 Waterhouse
10 Waterhouse
Albert
Cole
Ames
New Books (Era)
1 Flurry
2 Flurry
1 Pack
2 Pack
3 Pack
1 Weinland
2 Weinland
Thiel
Malm
Weston
Hulme
I'm certain you could add others to the "book". But again, this shows how bad it has become.
@SHT
I attend a COG weekly and I don't tithe. Haven't for years and no one has said anything to me about it.
I think most people here have not actually been to a Sabbath service with a COG for many years.
A lot of stuff has changed. Flurry and Pack and a few others are just insane so I can't speak for them not would I recommend anyone ever visit them.
Also tithing seems to becoming more common among other denominations these days. Its not just COGs anymore. Can't blame HWA for what Lutherans do.
Jews, who understand the OT pretty well, do not tithe today because there are no Levites to tithe to and no temple. But, they do urge their members to contribute (voluntary giving) to a good cause to, as they say, "heal the world." Tithing is never mentioned by Paul or other NT authors writing to the church. Giving is voluntary: tithing is required by law. Big difference.
3.27 PM
The JW has a history of discouraging college attendance. As a result, many of their members are destitute in their old age. You can find this accusation on the JWs dissident sites. Thousands of their members sold their houses and gave all their wealth to their organisation just prior to 1975. This made the Jehovah Witnesses headquarters rich, and unsurprisingly, again taught that the end was 2000, hoping for another financial windfall. Presumably they needed the money to pay for all the sexual abuse legal payouts. I suggest people have a look at their dissident sites before joining.
I honestly wonder what the landscape of ACOGs would be like today if HWA had come clean and repented of various sins and errors before he died in 1986.
If he would’ve:
* reconciled with his son GTA.
* revealed the truth re the incest allegations with his daughter Dorothy.
* extend hand of friendship with COG (7th day)
* admit the truth about his plagiarism of published material eg Allen’s book, COG literature, etc
* admit the sources of his doctrines and traditions Mormonism, JW, COG7thday, Catholicism, Adventism, BI, etc
* re-evaluate his teachings in light of the Scriptures
* forsake his prophetic speculation
* apologize to all who have been abused and their true potential arrested because of his teachings and his clergy
I’m thankful at least I’ve learned so much more via the net re the “plain truth” about HWA’s life and background, his WCG, and the origins of his teachings that I’ve been able to separate a lot over recent years what was in reality crap (tithing, HWA was Elijah, etc) and what really is and remains priceless Bible truth. Sadly though a lot of what HWA taught comes under the former ie crap while the things taught by those he excommunicated ironically come under the latter banner.
We at the XYZ-COG would NEVER ask the fish to pay for the lures that we use to reel them in.
“Freely you have received, freely give” you know...
Finding out and being alerted to the fact that joining WCG was going to be expensive was what was FREE and under no obligation, at that time, to "send it in". After that, it was all downhill.
The scripture read, "Freely have you received. Under obligation shall you give, pressed down and squooze out."
And too...even commenting on matters of giving and money, I realize carries the blowback to myself over being paid as "one of them", "Ivory Tower funded" and "Ministurd" but I was under obligation as well to tithe or else. I was not obligated as part of being in WCG ministry to pay 3t and HQ withheld 2t for Holydays sending parts of it only during Holyday times.
On my part personally, I gave away, or back I should say, 3T freely to those who were in need because the concept of "It's their money and they gave it" was ever in my mind. I got a number of memos along the way to back off but never penalized for doing so, nor did I back off.
I told anyone who confided that tithing was a burden and the "windows of heaven" were stuck evidently in their quest to prove Him now herewith, to just do the best they could in giving "as they were able" or saving 2T and we'd get them help when the time came for the Feast as well. I also gave away 2T that some generous members gave me personally which was unnecessary for the most part as we tended to stay close to home in where we went. I enjoyed giving it to those in need more than keeping it. I know some of you would not believe that but tis true. I stopped tithing totally about the time Tkach came along as did most of the members I knew personally. Transitions are messy.
It was not "easy" being in the ministry of WCG, at least for me and how I was a person, somewhat naïve even as an adult to all WCG was up to and far too often hoping for the best which never materialized in the organization. It's why the "you in your ivory tower whether you realize it or not" cracks are offensive to me but I recognize the fact that people often project their own ministerial experiences onto myself because it's convenient to do so being here on Banned openly, name, "rank" and serial number. One of the Four Agreements is "Never take anything personally. It is about them, not you." And this seems so but not always easy to be labeled by anonymous types whose affiliations and real names would be helpful to know, not that it ultimately matters to me anymore.
Dave Albert, a fairly close friend and confidant along the way apart from out age differences beginning as a student and then as pastor told me out of the blue one day that "I never felt you belonged in the ministry" He never explained it and it rather offended me because from a kid, I thought that is where I was supposed to be. I think he knew that based on what he knew about the Church and those over me in ministry, there was no good match. It's just that I did not know it.
Anyway, morning blather on a topic that usually brings me criticisms for being "one of them" but this is my experience and I don't care about reactions as perhaps I once did too much. It was hard for me to be in the church as well for many many reasons, some similar and many different because of being in the vocation.
I don't kid myself either on the slide into losing faith in faith. It would have happened had I gone to another denominational seminary I turned down for WCG back in the day. I know me...
Holding a fossil or meteorite in my hands and the wonder of it all has replaced holding the Bible in my hands when younger. It was inevitable.
And too, finding stone tools and axes in the bottom of the Willamette River before work was a high point in Portland than driving by Hinson Baptist Church where HWA was baptized or the house GTA was born in. Walking up the stone steps of the Portland Public Library, for me, was also completing the circle as I bypassed the floor where HWA probably sat doing "six months of intensive study", which is five and half more than the average WCG minister did it seems in hindsight. Intensive reading, yes. Study? No.
Off to work to rub people the right way for a change.... :)
I like how he says “ most of our members faithfully and voluntarily send in their tithes and offerings’’. I had one interaction with Gerald when l was doing the church thing. You guessed it, it was about money. It’s always about the money with Gerald. He calls it wise stewardship, but he doesn’t use that wise stewardship on anything else, like minister abuse, or stamping out the good old boy system.
Dennis
Are you one "one of them?" yes. Did you live in a ivory tower? Again yes. You seem to think that like a Jedi Knight waving his hand, you can magically get others to agree with you. In fairness, this isn't restricted to ministers. I've heard the same things said of work bosses. I recall someone in my workplace saying that if people are given several promotions early in their career, "we lose them." I know managers who refuse to get an ordinary job after being let got. The "real world" where they are not treated like royalty, is repugnant to them.
156 said: " I know managers who refuse to get an ordinary job after being let got. The "real world" where they are not treated like royalty, is repugnant to them."
Well don't lay that charge on me. I have worked literally with my hands for 22 years and still work at it. I have had over 25,000 sessions with clients in that time all grateful for the therapeutic skills in helping them cope with everything from their headaches and physical pain to their managers to their ministers, life stress, injuries and the occasional death in the family or suicide.
I give not a shit if you agree with me on anything nor is "getting others to agree..." a life goal. I have a lot of experience to share, which I do freely and openly and a view of my part in WCG that I have every right to express whether you agree or not.
As an "anonymous" contributor, how about coming out of your own closet and share who you are, what is your affiliation and few a genuine insights you might wish to share along the way. I would like to think I have interesting things to share related whether the Bible is literally true, as we all were taught, or perhaps we have missed a few realities of the how and why scriptures came to be along the way. It took way to long for me to realize I was not only taught incorrectly but teaching incorrect things. That is not my goal in life. I love the sciences and share those insights as they relate, again, to previous beliefs that were mistaken. What you call the waving of my Jedi hand, I would call sharing topics of interest with those who understand my background and I theirs and taking a look at what perhaps we got wrong and opening up to new possibilities. What anyone thinks about what I share, agrees with or can't stand is not my problem to solve for them.
I'm sure if you shared something of substance I imagine I'd have a good go at agreeing with you or disagreeing and why. But no matter outcomes of sharing experiences and perspectives gained as a result of the WCG experience as minister or member, I believe in sharing it.
Unless someone takes a poll and I get booted of course :)
Was I one of them? Sure, just as you were one of them. Did I live in a ivory tower. Nope. I lived outside the castle walls doing what I felt I was supposed to do and believing what I thought I believed until I couldn't and didn't. Please don't project your ministerial observations and experiences on to me if you can help it. And that was 22 years ago now.
Dennis
You seem to get really angry and make long posts when people challenge you. You aren't humble instead you boast about how much good you do.
You are your worst defender and it seema you are still stuck needing to be the leader and telling everyone else they are wrong.
Try repenting of your sins. It will humble you some.
10:55 is making things way too complicated by "its" snarky short remarks. Luckily Dennis has the patience to answer. And yes he may perhaps be perceived more of a speaker (a "man of words" if he were a black man) than a writer, nonetheless he doesn't pretend to be able to discern sin as a godly prerogative as "10:55 humbler of man" seems to be able.
I have no patience for such attitude as Dennis kindly seems to have.
Perhaps I am mistaken and the Pope and the Dalai Lama are posting here anonymously to straighten Dennis out. In that case I apologize Francis and Dai.
Nck
Dennis. I appreciate your experience, your story and you as a person. I hope I have not offended you with my story. I don't want people to think that I am on a rampage against the ministers because I am not. I recognize that they are victims of a narcissist psychopath as well. The ministries' demons are different from the members but we are all in this together. Our best hope of change and reconciliation lies with the ministry in a hierarchical structure. If they refuse to step up, then sending the churches of God into the dust bin of history is the next best solution. Some of my closest friends are ministers and know where I stand. I am hopeful they will do the right thing. Time will tell.
Dennis tells us that he was never raised to Pastor rank in WCG. That means he was certainly never an insider. Furthermore, when I see the writers here who fault Dennis for his non-Christian beliefs, I am shocked that they don't recognize Dennis as far more honorable than the various agnostics and atheists who sit in the senior ranks of UCG, COGWA, LCG, and other groups, feigning belief in order to keep a steady paycheck.
As for continuity between his old career and his new one, I wonder whether Dennis would agree that the "therapeutic" value of massage is often a placebo effect or a means of addressing psychosomatic issues? Dr. Thiel believes that chiropractic treatment can cure all sorts of maladies that allopathic medicine cannot, even though serious science shows that aside from specific bone work the value of chiropractic is almost entirely a placebo effect. I wonder whether our Dr. Dennis feels compelled to make over-reaching claims for his massage work? Sure, a massage will leave most people feeling much better than a Gerald Waterhouse sermon, but by itself it won't cure the victim of the worst effects of a Gerald Waterhouse sermon. Using a massage as a substitute for real medicine is about as silly as using WCG theology as a substitute for rational thought, and I hope Dennis hasn't become one of those nuts who are just as "evangelistic" about massage as Dr. Bob is about naturopathy and Armstrongism.
Wishing to speak up on one's own behalf in the face of glittering generalities, projections and anonymous judgments seems a natural thing to do when appropriate.
Thanks Stephen and of course you or anyone else sTory offends. We all have a story. And we are not our story as a person. Stories can be different with the wave of s hand and turn in a dime.
Poops Stephen! I meant DOESN'T OFFEND. Sorry about that. On cell keyboard writing between clients.
636. No, woo woo is not my game. I am not into " energy work" or making claims that are not provable. Same with massage as theology. I taught a class in massage in the woo woo to avoid in massage for therapists such as ear handling and the ever stupid ionic foot soaks. Bad science. I stay in my scope of practice and beliefs. Some come for the physical work and some for both that and to share stuff and chat on like minded things. It fits me.
I repeat Stephen.DOES NOT OFFEND"! LOL No ones does and I can't think why any would
Stephen... Home evenings after work. Call anytime if you wish to chat. 864 905 9506. If you sound Pakistani or Indian I might hang up so tell me quick it's you😱😝
636. And too..there is temporary benefit and I endeavor to educate client on long term solutions if they exist. Safe touch has it's benefits psychologically as for many touch in the past has been unwelcome and traumatic. Any way, too late for paleontologist and never an interest in keeping what I found to be mistaken going out of need to some splinter which would not serve me or anyone else very well.
Angie and I both are in massage therapy. She in her private practice and corporate clients and I in a clinical and later back setting. It is enough. I just ask her how her sessions went but not how much she made lol. Every one loves her and she loves me😊
12.13 AM
The ministers are 'victims of a narcissistic psychopath as well.'
HWA did not force any minister to lord it over his congregation via verbal brutality.
Taking on the role of victim is a cheap criminal ploy, and is offensive to all the victims of minister abuse.
'I was just following orders,' or the 'devil made me do it' will not be accepted by God on judgment day.
Stephen. "Poops" = "Oops"😇
6:36 said “Dr. Thiel believes that chiropractic treatment can cure all sorts of maladies that allopathic medicine cannot, even though serious science shows that aside from specific bone work the value of chiropractic is almost entirely a placebo effect.”
So just because Thiel believes it we must automatically discount it as of little or no value?
My own personal experience has validated it for me. I suffered from 24/7 pain in my thorax whenever I ate or drank for at least 2 hours after and the only treatment my doctors had were PPI drugs. I sought a drug-free option after experiencing severe side effects that caused further disease. So I went to a chiropractor who had been recommended to me and it is his treatment that has helped the most to the point I am pain free in my thorax! If I ever suffer a relapse of pain I return to him for an adjustment and I’m pain free again. This has been my experience over the last 5 years.
Another piece of anecdotal evidence is a man who came in the same time I went to see my chiropractor and he was walking slowly, stiffly and in pain with a walking stick. After he saw the chiropractor he came out as if a new man and threw his walking stick to his carer. It was remarkable!
Western allopathy might dismiss the value of chiropractors and other alternative health treatments, but it doesn’t mean such don’t work. Big Pharma only seeks to make a drug to make money off. It doesn’t care about scientific studies of drug free treatments and natural cures for disease. And its “science” will reflect that prejudice.
Hey Stephen I wonder if we ever met, I went to VA this year for the FOT Hey Dennis are you still in SC?
I just moved back to SC Mason, from Oregon
5.36 PM
Good to hear of your cure. Steve Jobs sought treatment for his cancer with alternate medicine. The delay resulted in the spread of the cancer and his death. Had he opted for an operation straight away, he would have lived. So careful with your broad condemnation of modern medicine.
8:15
I wasn’t referring to “life-saving surgery.”
Nor was I, with a broad brushstroke, condemning “modern medicine.”
6:36 specifically dismissed the value of chiropractic treatment and it was to this I was responding with my own positive experience.
We all make choices re our own health and those under our care. Irrespective of the advice we receive we each must make our own decisions in such matters and suffer the consequences be they good or bad. That’s life I’m afraid.
And thank you. I give the Creator thanks for His guiding me to my chiropractor and His sustenance through the hellish ordeal I’ve been through to now. It’s taught me when we’re surrounded by thick darkness and pain it’s all too easy to feel like giving up. But, beyond the dark lies the light and if only we hold on for another day and another and don’t give up the light will eventually break through to dispel the darkness and pain. Like the saying goes, “The only way out is through.” :-(
Anon 10:45 PM needs to drop the defensiveness or read more carefully. The comment at 6:36 didn't "dismiss the value of chiropractic treatment." It warned about the over-reach in which many chiropractors engage. If you have a bad back, a chiropractor will likely do more good, less invasively, than some guy with a knife and a bag of medicines. But I have seen chiropractors make ridiculous claims about their practice curing all sorts of diseases that have nothing to do with the bones' interaction with the rest of the body. This isn't surprising, as the whole discipline of chiropractic originated in the 19th century as an explicitly "occult" practice.
The Occult Origins of Chiropractic
4:46 I was very specific re which particular statement of 6:36's I took issue with--and their association fallacy--and gave a personal reason based on anecdotal experience why I disagreed with their opinion.
I was not "broad[ly] condemn[ing] modern medicine" as 8:15 alleged.
I was not debating on the dubious origins of modern treatments be they conventional or not.
And you opined 6:36 wasn't being dismissive of the value and benefit of chiropractic treatment for those of us whom it has worked. But, with respect I don't share that view.
What change do you want SSS ?
Anon 4:46,
While it is something I might consider very briefly, I am no longer moved by such things as "occult origins" of almost anything. If I am not practicing the occult I am fine without worrying whether for example some occult believed a spirit flows thru the body and seems to bring healing if helped along-- maybe they learned in fact how to help get the lymphatic system going by their teachings. If I'm focused on my lymphatic system and not thinking about a spirit flowing through me, I may in fact utilize similar techniques and be further from the occult than someone not utilizing these techniques.
If yoga poses and breathing seem to help someone and they aren't worshipping Gai or even thinking about it-- it is just helpful movements and breathing.
Not disagreeing with you about origins, just putting my two cents in about merely emphasizing the present day benefits and the actual mindset of the person using techniques rather than the origins which may well be moot.
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