Friday, January 21, 2022

LCG Claims They Are The Watchman And Are Prepared To Suffer The Consequences


Bob Thiel was seen whimpering in the corner of his homeopathy shop in the Five Cities area of CA today after the Living Church of God declared that THEY are the Watchman.

Doug Winnail states that it is not a pleasant job being a Watchman when they warn the world about being such degenerate sinners. Winnail claims that LCG is prepared to face the consequences for being so forceful. 

How can they expect to be persecuted when no one knows who they are? 

The Church as a Watchman: The Church of God today has the same job as the ancient biblical prophets—to proclaim the good news of a coming Kingdom of God and to warn of a coming time of judgment on the Israelite nations as well as the world (see Ezekiel 3 and 33; Matthew 24). In order to fulfill this mission, we need to watch world events and trends and proclaim a warning as we see ancient prophecies coming alive today (Matthew 24:42–44). Pointing out that there will be serious consequences for the sins being committed today will not be a pleasant job (Isaiah 58:1; Ezekiel 3:4–9). However, God says that He will provide an “open door” for His Church to fulfill its mission as we approach the end of the age. Along with the warning, we can share the exciting “good news” that Jesus Christ is coming back to save mankind from what will appear to be ultimate destruction. Let’s strive to be “effective watchmen” that God can use to fulfill this vital mission.
Have a profitable Sabbath, Douglas S. Winnail


Anonymous said...

LCG is using old, and tactically ineffective methods with wihch to get out this Watchman's message. They need to develop and popularize some sort of improbable and scary conspiracy theory on social media. Should be relatively easy to modify and tweak the basic ones upon which Armstrongism was founded. Doug needs to claim to be the one in the know, to rebrand himself as "W", and to begin cranking out a barrage of secret insider messages. Obviously, what flies right now is British Israel style white nationalism, but they need to carefully cloak all of that in innocuous sounding terminology which rapidly becomes a set of arcane dog whistles for the movement. LCG needs to swallow its pride, and to endorse and let in groups which have been considered subversive and undesirable by most civilized people who have lived in the free world over the past 5 decades. LCG must take up political positions and begin to actively resist ideas and methods which have until recently been considered to be a matter of common sense. Politicians must be brought in to endorse, support and live this blitz. Weston and Winnail need to tone down their message about the wrath of God descending on the entire nation, and to more vigorously target and attack the forces which they have always believed were bringing our national identity down, like the LGBTQ+ community, immigrants who choose not to assimilate, organizations which promote social justice, and those who insist that women actually have equal rights.

Oh, wait. Someone else has already beaten them to the punch!

Anonymous said...

I believe that the "good news" is principally the gospel of salvation. Why did Christ instruct His generation to "repent for the kingdom is at hand" if the kingdom is a two thousand years in the future government? If it's only government, repenting or not repenting makes no difference.
In His context, it can only mean salvation.

Anonymous said...

My Bible doesn't say that the job of the members of the body (the church) are "to warn of a coming time of judgment on the Israelite nations as well as the world". Notwithstanding the unbiblical definition of the "Israelite nations", the role of the members (the church) is to "Go into all the world and preach the gospel" (Mark 16:15) and "go and make disciples in all nations, baptizing them...Teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you (Matthew 28:19-20). Now the "gospel" message definition may be debated, but no where do we see the apostles, as a general mission, preach a warning message of the great tribulation...

Anonymous said...

Matthew 24 is about looking for the physical return of Jesus to usher in a new age.
LCG focuses on the signs - not what the signs point to.
The Jesus of LCG is far off and their body of work is not about bring people to understand Jesus - they hardly mention Jesus.
Therefore, LCG is a blind watchman preferring to live in the dark shadows, instead of beholding Jesus as the reality that was foreshadowed by the law (Colossians 2:17).
One Holy Scripture, among many, that LCG would never preach, would instruct their members and those they are trying to influence on preparing for the Kingdom is:
Romans 5:1
Peace and Hope
Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Anonymous said...

Dangerous Doug has a pet theory that is officially part of LCG doctrine but is scarcely spoken of anymore.
Doug believes that during the tribulation, almost everyone on Earth will know of the LCG.
Doug bases that false prediction on his belief that LCG is the one true church and Matthew 24:9
“Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me."
Doug theorizes that to be hated by all nations, LCG must be known by everyone.
No one in LCG is presently being truly persecuted, much less put to death - and virtually no one among almost 8 billion Earthlings know about LCG.
Therefore, by Doug's requirement, the end is not yet nearly near.
However, what deceptive Doug is really hoping for is that LCG be quickly catapulted to worldwide fame.
Doug holds on to that hope instead of preaching hope in Jesus - that new birth into living hope is not of any interest to Doug, so he ignores it.
1 Peter 1:3
Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Anonymous said...

Doug wants to warn the world of the consequences of its sins, but he refuses to accept the consequences of his own violation of God's laws on marriage. LCG members need to understand that, if they take seriously their own teachings, their church will never be blessed while its ministry is led by, and its ministers tolerate and even praise, Doug's un-Biblical re-marriage to a woman who divorced him, then married and divorced another man, before crawling back to Doug.

Deuteronomy 24:4 is used by the ministry to forbid, and even to break up, members' marriages. But if you're Doug, it somehow doesn't apply.

Anonymous said...

If there not then who is?

Miller Jones/Lonnie C Hendrix said...

If one reads the twenty-fourth chapter of Matthew in context, we realize that much of what is recorded there was intended for those First Century Christians. In other words, only a portion of Christ's remarks actually referred to the end times (it was the disciples themselves who conflated Christ's predictions about the destruction of the temple with the events surrounding the tribulation and his second coming). Moreover, many have pointed out that watching involves being alert - NOT attempting to tie today's headlines to ancient prophecies! At any rate, I posted a piece about this watchman nonsense sometime back. For those who are interested, you may view it here:

Tonto said...

With historical significance, the warning of “One if by Land Two if by Sea” lantern warning WATCHMAN signal, by Paul Revere is legendary.

It was meant to warn patriots in Chalrestown, a borough across the river from Boston in case if the messenger himself could not make it there from Boston to start his ride.



Anonymous said...

6:04, that is easy to answer! A new group of which we are not yet aware! One that has not been "whored up" by its historic leaders, one which has not burned its own credibility through a litany of presumptuous false prophecies.

There could also be a future church which has been "left behind" and is suddenly drawn to repentance through the trib, and realizes its commission is to minister to all of the others who have been left behind. I can see that as happening to all of the splinter groups.

If indeed the Armstrong churches as they exist today are actually of God, it is a great mystery why they are floundering, not really growing, and whatever message they are preaching is not gaining any statistically noticeable traction. All members should be asking themselves what is wrong with their groups. What they were told about keeping the sabbath, holy days, eating clean meats, and paying their tithes is not inducing God to give them an accurate vision of prophecy. William Miller in the 1800s did not fare any better. He taught that the Laodicean era had already begun during his time.

Anonymous said...

6:04 asked, if they're not then who is?" Well, look around. There are Christian preachers everywhere on TV, radio and internet, not to mention the work of the two witnesses among this group. There are plenty of them who are preaching the Word faithfully even if they have less knowledge than us. The problem with us in the COGs is that even though we know the law we aren't keeping it, so Christ has split us apart for that reason and our other sins.

We may be the bride (the elect) but there are friends of the groom (Jn 3:29) who are doing the Work as well.

That is why it is possible for some inexperienced young woman to give an excellent testimony on Christian radio about suffering (Php 1:29) while a stupid COG minister teaches that we "haven't been called to suffer". Shame on you, stupid people.

With their support, and the work of the two witnesses, with the COG in the middle of it, millions will come to faith in Christ at the very end when the Kingdom of God officially takes over. (Rev 7:9,14)

Anonymous said...

9:45 wrote: "6:04, that is easy to answer! A new group of which we are not yet aware! One that has not been "whored up" by its historic leaders, one which has not burned its own credibility through a litany of presumptuous false prophecies."

This is one of the reasons that COG members, particularly LCG members refused to follow Bob Thiel. If there has been any man in these days who has literally whored himself out it has been Bob Thiel.

When WCG was in apostasy, Bob was out looking for the man/church that would support his weird exegesis of scriptures and who stroked him the most. Bob's ego is in so much need of stroking that he cannot survive without it. When Rod Meredith became his John, Bob found his place. Bob would do ANYTHING to gain the support of Meredith. That came to a crashing end when Meredith had enough of his overinflated ego and kicked his ass to the curb. Meredith's public rebuke of Bob brought the whorehouse down around him. Even as the COG's Chief Laodicean he will never face the truth when times get rough. If he did not dream it then no one should believe it.

Anonymous said...

When Rod Meredith became his John, Bob found his place.

In which sense of the word "John"?

Anonymous said...

10.40 AM
Are you sure that it's not the case of Meredith using Bob, then spitting him out.
Considering Meredith's reputation, it's most likely that it's Bob rather than Meredith who's the victim.
Most ACOG ministers are users of people.

Anonymous said...

Anon 9:48:00 AM PST

You are quite right. There are some fine ministries out there who do indeed preach the message of the gospel and it’s hope faithfully.
Beckett Cooke is one who comes to mind.

“not to mention the work of the two Witnesses among this group”.
Puzzled by this comment, are we missing something here. I always thought these two would be widely known and identifiable, preaching from Jerusalem.

“even if they have less knowledge than us”.
Fighting words indeed and classic Armstrongism at its worst. Definitely not the way to gain friends and influence people.

“even through we know the law we aren’t keeping it”.
And the requirement to keep the law is?
Acts15 comes to mind.
Galatians also.
Paul’s comments about he counted all things as lost to know Christ Jesus and His unsurpassable love.
And Paul was prefect in the law, blameless.
Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him as righteousness, and that before the law.
We all need the righteousness that comes from faith, belief in God and not from the law.
We are saved by grace and that through faith.
We have so much to be thankful for.

Anonymous said...

This is not DSW's theory- I have heard RCM talk about it a number of times. I suspect it goes back to HWA also...

Unknown said...

Anon 2 pm, re the requirement to keep the law, see Rom 3:31, a verse that people commonly overlook (that even Luther and WCG in apostasy overlooked), where Paul says that we do not render useless (make void) the law through faith but instead we establish it (or stand it up). Even the Lord said that He did not come to disintegrate or loosen (kataluo) the law but to fill it up (pleroo). (Mt 5:17) Then He cited 7 examples from the law and broke them down in the way that they should be kept under the NC. Thirdly, John wrote over and over again about the importance of keeping the commandments, and that sin is a transgression of the law, or "anomia", meaning a violation of the law. Even belief or faith is a commandment in the law brought forward from the OT (Deut 18:18) to the NT (1 Jn 3:23).

Abraham certainly had faith before he was circumcised (thus nullifying circum as a req't for today) but he also kept the commandments, statues and precepts of God passed down from the righteous line (Gen 26:5), the way of righteousness and justice (Gen 18:19). He kept those plus the command to believe.

As for Acts 15:24, this does NOT say that we throw the entire law out the door because first of all, that's utterly foolish and second of all, the council's resolutions upheld 4 laws given by Moses, two of which are dietary. Even the law pertaining to eating "image-sacrifices" was slightly modified later by the apostle when he wrote that under certain conditions it was permissible to eat them as long as no one took exception to it. (1 Cor 10:25-32) So what you eat bears some importance, as does sexual purity.

This subject is a big subject that has overthrown many from the faith. One has to be clear about what law he is talking about. As Jesus showed in Mt 5 some things in the law have been carried over but other things have not.

Many say that Paul taught against the law when that isn't true, as stated above. What he did do was present a dichotomy between justification by faith and justification by the law, to show that faith is critical and that it is the starting point to be justified by God. Therefore a Jew raised on the law only can never be saved until He receives faith to raise his obedience level above the Pharisee to what Christ described in Mt 5.

Of more points to consider, note that Paul says the law is good (1 Tim 1:8) and the commandment is holy, just and good (Rom 7:12). Does that sound like someone who is doing away with the law? Don't be misled by people who are trying to read into the Scriptures something that isn't there, like some ministers today who think that they can read a man's character.

Anonymous said...

Anon 9:06:00 PM PST
Thank you for your comment about my previous post @ 2:00:00 PM PST.
A big subject indeed and one mired in much controversy.
You raise some very valid points.
Paul also writes in
Gal 3:24-25, ‘ Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith.
But after faith come, we are no longer under a tutor.’
I don’t doubt that this debate will be around for a long time yet within the Christian faith.

Anonymous said...

Hey Unknown at Jan 22, 9:06: I'm glad you are discussing justification - but, I encourage you to study it deeper.
You wrote: " ... to show that faith is critical and that it is the starting point to be justified by God."
Please look up all the verses on justification; being justified by the righteousness of Jesus is not just the starting point - it is everything.
No human can keep any law well enough to be righteous in God's sight.
That is why Jesus came to keep the law perfectly as our substitute and atonement.
By the holiness of Jesus, believers are completely righteous in God's sight.
You mentioned that Jesus spoke of the law - many who misunderstand the New Covenant also misunderstand that while Jesus walked the Earth as a human, to qualify to be our Savior, he had to be sinless - while the Old Testament law was enforce.
This means he could not encourage anyone to break any part of that law.
Jesus then, now, and always promotes obedience.
Also, you wrongly assumed that Martin Luther and the evolving WCG missed what Paul meant in Romans 3.
Luther as well as modern Christians believe that Christians must be obedient - however, our salvation only depends on Jesus.
Obedience to God is a sign of our salvation - not a condition for our salvation.
You stated that some things in Old Covenant law are no longer required under the New Covenant - but the entire Old Covenant law stands or falls together.
The New Covenant requirements are not based on Armstrongism's bizarre cherry-picking of Old Covenant law favorites.
Obedience to all of the ten commandments is so much deeper under the New Covenant - and just like under the Old Covenant, we are dependent on God's help to be obedient.
Ultimately, Christians are thankful for the righteousness of Jesus which is credited to us as our own righteousness - because we are painfully aware that our own righteousness is not nearly good enough.
Armstrongism, and those who preach the law instead of grace, are trying to buy salvation through their own efforts.
Sadly, that does not bring them to Jesus; instead, it brings them to failure, since their efforts will never be enough.
Hebrews 7:12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Anonymous said...

Right, 7:09, re Gal 3:25, we are no longer now being tutored by the law but by Christ, who shows us how to keep the law properly, as illustrated in Mt 5:22, 28,32,34,39,44. These are the changes in the law brought about by the NC Melchizedekian priesthood of Jesus Christ, as noted in Heb 7:12, which you quoted.

Who says you can't keep the law well enough? Then why does Christ say, "Be you perfect"? (Mt 5:48) If you have the righteousness of the faith to believe all things (not deceiving yourself or cherrypicking through the Word) then you should be able to do it.

You say that Christ in His time could not encourage anyone to break any part of the law? Then why did He abrogate the right to revenge in Mt 5:38 and the right to hate an enemy in Mt 5:43? That sounds to me like He is encouraging the breaking of the law.

Luther and WCG did indeed miss on Rom 3:31. WCG rendered useless and void (katargeo) the law of the Sabbath commandment through (its promotion of) faith, just as Luther made void the corrupt laws of the counterfeit church through (the promotion) of faith in the 16th century, God paying them back with a schism for causing a schism in the second century.

Obedience or works are not a condition for salvation? Wrong. James wrote that faith must go hand in hand with works. (Ja 2:14-26) Faith is like the body that depends on the pneuma to live. (v26) But like the body it is faith that comes first.

We are the future priests who will be teaching both the law and grace to the nations, the law to the lawless (1 Tim 1:9) and grace to the law-keepers, at which time God will justify the circumcised (the law-keepers) by (adding) faith and justify the uncircumcised through (the channel of) faith. (Rom 3:30)

I totally agree with you that our ministers have been guilty of over-emphasizing the law at the expense of grace, and why? Because they haven't known that grace and because we have to wait for it until it is brought to us at the disclosure of Jesus Christ, as Peter taught in 1 Pet 1:13. We didn't wait long enough 30 years ago when JWT was bringing it so we took a nosedive and fell from BOTH grace and the law by the wrath of Jesus Christ.

"All power has been given to Me (to do such things)", says the Lord. (Mt 28:18)

Anonymous said...

Anonymous of January 23, 2022 at 1:21:00 PM: the words in your post demonstrate the potential to be breaking two great commands.
The first command your words disregard is to seek the kingdom first and HIS righteousness.
We are made righteous by Jesus righteousness - perfectly reconciled to God by Jesus' atonement.
There is nothing more our own efforts could do to add to that righteousness - because Jesus' righteousness is perfect/complete.
As I stated above, obedience is a result of our salvation not the cause of our salvation.
You mentioned St. James speaking of fruit; likewise, that fruit is a result of salvation, not the cause of it.
Romans 3:21
But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify.
The other command at risk is related to the first; that great command is have no other Gods.
Jesus is Savior.
You are not.
You can do nothing to save your self.
Under the law your sins deserve death.
You have nothing to pay that price.
No amount of good works you could do could pay that price.
Working works to earn salvation negates the perfect work of the Savior.
The COGs officially, and COGlodytes I know specifically, will not be pinned down to answer the salvation equation - based on COG doctrine - which is: How much is salvation due to Jesus and how much is due to the works of the individual.
The answer is: Salvation is completely/solely due to Jesus.
Those who insist that they must produce works of the law to become righteous and earn salvation are discounting Jesus and placing themselves on his throne.
Galatians 5:4
You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
The Good News is Jesus is the only Savior, sufficient to do all we need for salvation.
Jesus offers you that salvation as a free gift.
Just say, Hallelujah Jesus, thank you!

Anonymous said...

Brother Anon 4:03, nice of you to check back but why do you say that I may be breaking some commandments when I am the one who is supporting them and "standing (them) up"? (Rom 3:31) Rom 3:31 comes from the same apostle who taught that we are justified by faith. There is no disagreement here in regard to how we are saved or where our righteousness comes from.

The kingdom of God that you think I am disregarding is based on the law of God, a truism given by HWA btw a long time ago, and the righteousness that we are to seek is summed up by the commandments (which Jesus kept and not just for show), for "all thy commandments are righteousness" (Ps 119:172). They guide us (as the tutor) to the very righteousness of God which is in Christ (the aim). (Gal 3) Even Christ's commandments to us are based on the law yet, as Paul wrote, it is God's grace that must reign through that righteousness if we are to achieve that holiness He desires. (Rom 6:19)

You talk about commands and obedience but to what? Even the gospel is a command to obey (Christ) and believe (in faith) before you can get saved. Yes, we are saved by grace through faith but we are rewarded according to works, meaning works matter with respect to your position in the kingdom of God. (Mt 5:19) And I am distinguishing here good works (works of love toward God and neighbour), as described by the law, as opposed to circumcision (a sign of the OC) which is an attempt to be justified by the law. See the difference? Speaking of circumcision, why did Paul circumcise Timothy (Acts 16:3) if he taught that we are justified by faith and not by works? Was that just obedience on the heels of being saved by grace, as you wrote above? Would you have condemned Paul for that? And are you condemning me for supporting the law?

Do you call the works described in Ja 2 fruits? Nay, are they not works? Are you disagreeing with James who wrote that Abraham was justified by works? (2:21; even though he was accounted righteous well before that in Gen 15) That work proved how righteous he was. It wasn't a self-maunfactured self-righteous work of Abraham to sacrifice his son, an attempt to get saved or acquire righteousness, just as a faithful man today doesn't keep the law in order to "earn his way in", although you seem to be implying that.

Is there nothing in your post about John urging us to keep the commandments? (mentioned 7 times in 1 Jn) If we are saved by God from our sins (1 Jn 1:9), why keep reminding us about the commandments?

Anonymous said...

The $profitable$ Douglas S. Winnail toots his horn about the Living group being "The Church as a Watchman," but is the Living group really as significant as Doug believes? Doug wrote that his organization of men lording it over men/woman has the same job/mission as: "...the ancient biblical prophets—to proclaim the good news of a coming Kingdom of God and to warn of a coming time of judgment on the Israelite nations as well as the world (see Ezekiel 3 and 33; Matthew 24) watch world events and trends and proclaim a warning...Along with the warning, we can share the exciting “good news” that Jesus Christ is coming back to save mankind from what will appear to be ultimate destruction. Let’s strive to be “effective watchmen” that God can use to fulfill this vital mission..."
Can Doug explain how God selected the Living group to fulfill such an impressive mission? Where's the proof?

Of course, Doug, former hireling of the former WCG, left his ministerial credentials along with the WCG mission behind, and Doug now encourages others to be effective watchmen, to look forward to "another Jesus" to return very soon to reign on earth for 1,000 years. That is the Mickey Mouse Millennium Doug, and so many other former WCG hirelings, still believe in. Doug also believes the Trumps and the Vials also have to happen before that 1,000 years begins. Why? "To save mankind from what will appear to be ultimate destruction," he wrote.

Doug, go read the details of the 7 Vials/Plagues, b/c ultimate destruction is scheduled for that time. Human beings survive the 7 Trumps, but not so the 7 Vials. When the angel says "It is done;" it's done! Ultimate destruction! Go read the details, but realize that those Vials don't occur until Satan exits the pit and successfully deceives the entire world again, enough to make one wonder: "Where was Jesus after the 1,000 years?"

Now, the ancient Biblical prophets were inspired by God's Spirit, but Doug thinks his group is similarly inspired too? How so? His group must be effective? How so?

Now, Doug is not Jesus' twin brother, so how effective is Doug? Think about it. We know Jesus Christ, not "another Jesus" Doug has in mind, of Himself said He could do nothing:

John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

So, Doug: exactly how will he/Doug and his "helpers" become effective? How does that work? Does God need the help of Doug, or Weston, or anyone, for that matter?

Again, Jesus was perfect. Doug is not. Will Doug do more than Jesus Christ? Yet, Doug continues to impose responsibilities and some mission on his followers, as if they were going to somehow be of assistance to God...if they are effective.

Will Doug, who apparently thinks he can do more than "nothing," strive to explain how he and his followers can "magically" be effective to do something to fulfill some mission he thinks God gave him and his group, and nobody else?

Time will tell...


Anonymous said...

Hello Anonymous of January 24, 2022 at 2:32:00 PM: I'm glad you know that you are saved by grace, not by works.
That's the most important part - by far.
Everything else is just interesting conversation.
However, you did write many confusing things - like being justified by Jesus is a starting point, and when I cited the command to seek first the kingdom and His righteousness, your reply implies you thought it was the kingdom part that I was commenting on, rather than the His righteousness part.
I'm also concerned about your focus on works for rewards.
That is human nature and sadly, part of the wayward prosperity gospel, of which Armstrongism has it's brand.
Those who've been redeemed are obedient/do good works not for a reward but for love of God.
Salvation, our reward, is being with God - anything else God may decide to give us is inconsequential in comparison.
Under the New Covenant, the commands you wrote of are so much broader than the ten commandments.
Don't murder includes don't hate and is paired with many commands to take care of those in need.
The Holy Spirit guides and convicts Christians on how they should respond to God and man.
Sometimes we obey, sometimes we disregard the instruction.
Growing in obedience is part of the sanctification process.
Justification, sanctification, and glorification are biblical concepts that are ignored in Armstrongism.

Anonymous said...

Greetings again, 3:58. Why are you so concerned about the "works for rewards" concept when it is biblically based? Haven't you read Rev 22:12 where Jesus said that "My pay (for you) is with Me to give to every man according to his work"? And in Mt 16:27 where Jesus again said that we are rewarded according to works? This is scripturally based and what HWA taught.

You call salvation a reward? I thought you said that it was a gift that we couldn't earn? (The wages/pay for sin is death but eternal life is a gift; Rom 6:23) Getting a reward from Christ for your good works is just a fact -- not a wayward prosperity gospel. That false gospel is taught by those who think that we're on this earth just to have a good time and enrich ourselves primarily.

1 Cor 3:11-15 is a good example given by Paul that makes a distinction between salvation and works. One may be saved but if his works are burned up by fire he won't get much of a reward as someone who built with gold in this life.

Whatever honours we receive from the Lord will be well deserved and earned, and certainly not inconsequential as you say. This is made clear from the parable of the ten pounds in Luke 19. It shows whether you will get to rule over one city or several.

Re your last line, it is ignored because they don't understand these terms and weren't brought up on them. Still they are guilty of neglect (as the end draws near), which is why the trib is coming, to punish them for it.

Anonymous said...

Hello Anonymous of January 25, 2022 at 7:18:00 PM: Of course, I believe your problem - your doctrine - is in error because you write like you've been heavily influenced by Herbie who was a heretic when he was vertical, as is Doug Winnail today.

You asked, "Why are you so concerned about the "works for rewards" concept when it is biblically based?"

It's all about motivation.
If you are doing works for returns you've missed the magnified point of the first command - have no other gods before God.
As an example, I gave a donation to a friend who was raising money for a charity she supported (a very good cause).
I realized that I gave the cash because I wanted her to also donate to the cause I was fundraising for and wanted her support to be noted under my efforts, so that the charity I was supporting (another very good cause) would recognize I was enlisting a greater number of donors.
The act of giving the money was a good work - until my prideful motivation ruined it.
Vanity is related to the first command because the root of pride is elevating self to be in God's place.
Being motivated to do good to gain rewards is a selfish ambition.
God desires obedience out of love and respect for him - not to get rewards.

On January 24, 2022 at 2:32:00 PM, you wrote, "The kingdom of God that you think I am disregarding is based on the law of God, a truism given by HWA btw a long time ago, and the righteousness that we are to seek is summed up by the commandments ..."
I disagree with heretical Herbie - the Kingdom of God is not based on the law, it is based on the King.
Herbie and Doug also have preached very little King Jesus.
The have preached volumes about law.
The law foreshadowed the reality that is King Jesus - Colossians 2:17.
That is why the the command is to seek first the kingdom and HIS righteousness.
Herbie and Winnail have always preached that law keeping, in particular the laws they've selected, are a perquisite to entering the kingdom.
Regardless if they have an official statement somewhere that acknowledges that people are saved by grace, not works, they indoctrinated their people with their works doctrine.
They have not encouraged people to seek the righteousness offered by Jesus; they've taught nothing about justification.
That is why the GOGs are alienated and fallen from grace.
On January 23, 2022 at 1:21:00 PM, you wrote, "Who says you can't keep the law well enough? Then why does Christ say, "Be you perfect"? (Mt 5:48)"
Again, that thinking sounds like breaking the first commandment - we cannot be righteous enough for God, on our own, that's why we need Savior Jesus.
We can be perfect because of the righteousness of Jesus.
We cannot add anything to our own righteousness or perfection by any works - or we are saying Jesus' righteousness - that is given to us - is lacking - but mighty us made up for that lack.
I realize that I sound harsh - but I see you are tuff enough to take it (most can't).
I do admire some of your though processes and your commitment.
I hope you will keep studying - but from other sources, and will stay away from heretical COG doctrines and teachers.

Anonymous said...

Anon, 4:54 pm, what will you say when you see HWA in the kingdom of God and you are possibly left out? (Luke 13:28) You won't be weeping or gnashing your teeth at that decision, will you?

The kingdom of God is not based on the law of God but on Christ? For sure, He is the foundation but He is also the way, the truth and the life (Mt 5:17-19; 7:12; 23:23), all of which was foreshadowed by the law, and the fact remains that love toward God and neighbour is a fundamental precept in the law which is inherent in the kingdom's constitution.

Jesus said, "If you will enter into life, keep the commandments". (Mt 19:17)

You can't find the kingdom or receive His righteousness unless you go through Christ's stated principles above, which is the reason why the kingdom of God is broken on the earth today.