It’s a story of growing up, a story of discovery, and a story of faith. Wade Fransson has a powerful story.
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A group I once belonged to was über-obedient. We kept many Torah Commandments, like the Sabbath, Holy days, and food laws. By having both the law and the testimony of Christ we believed we were closer to God than anyone else on earth. In some ways, maybe we were. We took God at His Word and organized every aspect of our life around obeying, following and worshiping Him.
And yet belief in proximity to God kept us from drawing any closer. My personal battle with this is described in painful personal detail across the pages of the first two books of my Trilogy. The People of the Sign describes my involvement with the Worldwide Church of God and its 1995 implosion. That devastating fail was underscored by many members blaming the other side instead of becoming introspective. Being a victim of divorce and kidnapping helped me understand the two sides.
18 comments:
Nice that Wade found a nice wife whether she's COG or not.
Think I'll try that myself.
Glad he never got too bummed out during rough childhood.
My conclusion after listening to this program is that it's not worth the time. He avoids spelling out his present beliefs, which to me is unreasonable considering the length of the interview.
The one thing that caught my attention was him stating that he knew that many ministers disagreed with the Tkach changes but taught them from the pulpit for the sake of their pay check. I disagree with his claim that "they had to." This is a big contrast to Daniel and his three associates. Hence many HWA ministers who were viewed as junior gods by their congregation, were followers of a paycheck rather than followers of Christ.
Wade has published three books on his journey in Armstrongism, out of it, and into the Bahai faith. It is a much more authentic journey than any of the crap published by Bob Thiel, Fluury, Pack, and other COG leaders about their exit from Worldwide.
I had a passing interest in the Bahai faith back during the first classic rock era. Seals and Crofts (Summer Breeze) and their wives were into that. Those guys were also in the Champs (Tequila) with Glen Campbell who was a born again Christian. The Bahai follow the teachings of Baha'u'llah, a messianic Babi from the mid 1800s. He is considered as the successor to Buddha, and is revered in the same way as are the other "ascended masters".
If Wade repeats what he did the last time I encountered him, he will ignore everything you said--won't even read it--and attack you for what he assumed you said but did not say.
What he assumes you said is about the opposite of what you did say.
He could have know that if he had actually read it.
After ignoring what you said, he lectures you on why you need to listen and actually read what he says. Well, I did. Very careully. Before I wrote anything. If had read what I said, he would have known that.
In short: Wade is hopeless. I have given up on him. He does not deserve one more minute of my busy schedule. Not ONE.
This. Is. Not. A. Joke.
There's an article on the web called "Why I left the Bahai faith."
"..it is a repressive, guilt-tripping religion with many laws most people are not interested in signing up to follow. I weaned myself off the Baha’i belief system. It took over ten years to recover from the brainwashing I’d been through."
It seems Wade left one cult to only join another. He did say that he liked the structure in his AC stay, Many find freedom a challenge.
The Baháʼí gardens in Haifa Israel and the gardens and building of The Baháʼí House of Worship, Wilmette, looks suspiciously similar to Dave Pack's compound. Dave didn't pull the look of his compound out of thin air.
When you study the Baháʼí religion closely you find out that it's not at all the freedom-loving religious paradise its Western propagandists claim it to be. For example, to be a Baháʼí you must believe:
- That women are not equal to men; only men can serve on the faith's top governing body, the Universal House of Justice. ACOG people might not object to this, but even within the Baháʼí faith this is a controversy.
- That not only Buddha but also Krishna and Zoroaster are Manifestations on the level of Jesus. Yes, although there is no historical evidence of Krishna as a real figure, divine or otherwise, he's a Manifestation you must accept as a Baháʼí. The Baháʼí are shameless in scooping up dissatisfied followers from other religions and bringing them into what turns out to be Islam-lite.
- That although Bahá’u’lláh proclaimed his status as a Manifestation just 19 years after his predecessor, the Báb, he proclaimed that there would be no other Manifestation for a thousand years. Convenient, huh? Or an obvious sign of a power grab and desire to hold on to power.
- That homosexuality is a sin worthy of death. For liberal Westerners encountering the faith, this is often a stumbling block, though it wouldn't be a problem for converts coming out of Armstrongism.
For those who disapprove of the extreme nature of shunning found in groups like WCG that practice disfellowshipping and marking, the Baháʼí faith would be problematic, as their shunning of ex-members, whom they call "Covenant-breakers" is even more extreme than Gerald Flurry's "no contact" edict.
The Baháʼí have had their succession controversies and splits, too, like Armstrongism and so many other cults. There's a good argument to be made that the current leadership is not what Bahá’u’lláh intended; he envisioned a hereditary office of Guardian, but after two of those the cult fell into controversy and the Universal House of Justice became the "Guardian" instead. Imagine if the Council of Elders of PCG or LCG decided that they were the leadership body after Flurry and Weston die. In the Baháʼí faith today there isn't even a figure comparable to Rick Shabi functioning as the singular head of a group run by a council.
We all have a story. I was attracted to Armstrongism when I was seventeen. I was baptized and became a member of the WCG when I was twenty or twenty-one. When I encountered Armstrongism, I had very little religious experience. But I knew enough to recognize that the WCG was different. It was different because it was a Millerite cult. But I bought into the sales pitch and decided it was different because it was the one and only true church. Then ensued decades of struggle, shock and disenchantment.
What dismays me is that after a few years in the cult, I knew something was really wrong. But I continued faithfully to be a card-carrying member. I was young and now I am old and when I look back over the span of my life, I reflect on the early empirical experience I had with the WCG and ask myself "What did you think would happen?"
Scout
Scout,
That sounds like my story. I'm not yet free due to family and friends still in, but I'm striving to make it a smaller and smaller part of my life.
I think Franson was a lieutenant in the nascent David Hulme movement back in the beginning. The Hulme story is a curious one, as he was once ballyhooed and self promoted as being the "next great thing" back around 1995.
Hulme's thing never got off the ground, and after many years of futile nothing burgers, the group fell apart and divided. One thing Hulme has managed to do is to stay off the radar and remain very secretive. I wonder what the proverbial Paul Harvey "The rest of the story" has been for the failed Hulme experiment
Scout - my history mirrors yours.
I started attending when I was 17 and baptized a few years later.
I was a true believer until a few years ago.
The big problem with the WCG crackup was it was led by Joe Jr who was appointed leader because of nepotism alone. He was totally unqualified.
If his group had been honest, they would have brought in some decent theologians and merged WCG into a much better group.
WCG followed the original Christian model - Jesus was an apocalyptic, messianic preacher.
Then Paul came along and changed Christianity into the current mainstream model - where Gentiles did not have to keep the Torah. This proved far more popular with the Gentiles.
As part of my journey out of WCG, I have come to similar beliefs to Dennis - it is all hogwash.
Other religions have their versions of a magical afterlife. We all want to believe it does not end with our death.
And the nice thing is, we will never know we were wrong.
Looking back, what gets me is that the church leadership knew that their moral compromises such as "government is everything" (like the Pharasees 'the Sabbath is everything') is condemned in the bible. They knew that the NT church wasn't run as a cult. It was willful sinning on their part, yet they simultaneously railed against "rebellion." They deserve a special place in hell.
You eventually see through the lies, but you pay a price.
Well. At least Lord Krishna and Rama are in the Bible.... Nick
Baha'u'llah.
Interesting! The WCG got us into mocking other religions. I mean, I remember dozens of jabs, strawman, and ad hominem attacks launched from the pulpit, especially at the F/T. So, naturally, first thing I did when I heard of the Baha'u'llah was to invent a new name for him: Baja Louie!
Do any people commenting on this site realize the growth that’s happening out there amongst believers who are keeping many of the beliefs that some came across in WWCG? Many groups are beginning to see the Sabbath, appointed times, feast days, grace, faith … just by reading scripture. They didn’t need a COG to instruct them. It’s been inspiring to see it happening.
Gems of useful truth will pop up from wherever you see it, even in here
Just make sure it's not a William Tell arrow from Dave Pack's purply-curtain podium-Nickelodeon
This site is less of a pro-NRA gun rights lobby than the shock jock platforms some preachers use
Oh yes 8:17, true.
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